Life in Charms with Rachael Blackmore

0:01I'm Anushka Dukas and I've been designing jewell for 30 years and collecting charms for as long as I can remember. In this podcast, I will be asking a series of extraordinary women to tell me their life story in charms. Welcome to my life in charms. My guest today is the most famous jump jockey in the world, and that is no exaggeration. Not only has she ridden an extraordinary 575 winners, she's smashed through barrier after barrier, redefining what's possible for a female rider in one of the toughest and most physical sports there is. She became the first woman to win the Grand National, a moment that didn't just make headlines, it changed history.

0:44She's one of the most loved and respected figures in racing, known for her humility, her grit and the quiet determination that has inspired so many. In 2021, she was crowned BBC World Sports Star of the Year and she holds an honorary MBE for her contribution to British sport. and now she's bringing her story to a whole new audience with her first children's book Granny National published earlier this year. She is Rachel Blackmore. Rachel welcome to my life in charm. Thank you so much for having me it's all a good to be here. Oh it's so exciting I've got so much I literally have got so much I want to talk to you about because actually I know a bit about a little bit about racing.

1:28Yeah. A little bit. My mother used to train, she had 40 point-to-pointer. So I know a bit about it and my son did, you know, he was a point-to-pointer. Anyway, so they're all, my husband and myself really annoyed that they're not here. I was like, just leave my mate. Anyway. They've got to start making gorgeous jewelry to get me here. Yeah, exactly. so the first charm I love doing this actually because you told me that your pony your first pony is called bubbles so I was like but the first thing that came to my mind was that we should do one of those kind of bubble blowers that we used to all have as kids and this bit is the kind of bit that's inside the pot that holds the fairy liquid or whatever it is um so it's the it's the wand i think that's probably the best way it's one so i've made it in yellow gold um exactly as a wand would be uh yellow gold um with a diamond handle and kind of on the on the bit where the but where you actually bow the bubbles from that's got texture on it so that the washing because it does always have that the washing up liquid is yeah and then on the other side of the handle i've just engraved bubbles because oh that's so nice um but look so this is your first pony yeah i love this charm by the way because it's really it doesn't say what exactly what it is you know you wouldn't look at that and think oh that represents her first pony you know it's not a it's not a pony's head uh so i kind of talking yeah i love how it's kind of unusual and like I still would if I was going to my friend's house and they had a little kid like get the little bubbles in the shop like bubbles are great like everyone loves them and yeah bubbles was my first pony uh so my brother so I grew up on a farm in Tipperary and uh my brother was three years older than me and he would have had bubbles before I did um so yeah she was she was just such a fantastic pony and she was probably one that I wasn't really able to hold she was too she would always be going too fast I wasn't really able to hold her um but I think that actually gave me a bit of a feeling for what it was like to go fast and I kind of liked it and enjoyed it so she was fantastic she was really good to jump um she was a really forward going pony so I actually think I learned an awful lot from riding her as a kid uh so yeah she has I've got lots of fond memories of riding her so because most most uh parents don't want to give their pony that's just unstoppable i mean i didn't want you to stop up i know yeah so what were your parents doing yeah i know i must i must ask them although i can't really give out to them now so my life turned out but uh uh no i think um i think she was she was definitely unstoppable but she was very intelligent and she was extremely good to jump so if she was going too fast she was extremely good to jump whatever was in front of her and you know she was a very honest pony um and so on and maybe part of me wasn't trying overly hard to slurge her stuffer yeah yeah that was the neat so how old were you when you started i'd say i would have been yeah so like i would have had yeah i would have been kind of nine or ten when i was kind of properly riding her on my own and stuff i would have had one or two ponies before that obviously yeah um well you're Irish so you presume everyone had yeah like oftentimes people ask me when did I start riding and I can't remember you know it was like I was in such a privileged position that I I never had to ask for a pony you know I was so lucky that that there was one there when when I was growing up and um you know we grew up on a farm surrounded by animals and I loved I loved I loved that so um yeah I had a fantastic childhood hang on what color was she she was bay with a little bit of a white star um she was a 12 too um yeah she was she was amazing she was amazing anyway so that was the beginning that for you that was the beginning i think it must have it must have had an effect on on my life and on realizing that you know when i subsequently then at the age of 10 or 11 you know was watching the grand national for the first time and you know my first memories of racing was watching the grand national um on tv on tv yeah yeah at home like actually went over to a friend's house we do sweepstakes and you know just that excitement of of watching the grand national like that's the first memory i might have even been probably a little bit younger maybe i was seven or eight but that's my first memory of racing in my childhood um and then i would have gone out to ride my pony bubbles after after watching that and you know like i remember the silage was cut uh when the silage would get caught and like I'd be trying to get her to jump the the silage and stuff and she might have done the first one or two and then she'd stop doing it and then I realized I'd probably get in a lot of trouble if I kept just galloping over it all so uh but um so did you do pony racing on her?

6:35No no I didn't do pony racing on her I I rode in two or three pony races on a pony club games pony I had when I was 14 when I was a teenager yeah yeah yeah a pony called Tommy who's actually in his 30s now and he's actually we have him at home oh and yeah he's he's he's amazing and he when when we were finished with him he went to lots of other fantastic families and he's just come back to us now and uh yeah he he's another brilliant pony i have a lot to thank all these wonderful ponies in my life did your brother uh because you're one of three aren't you yeah i have an older brother and a younger sister and they both would have ridden um through their childhoods and and enjoyed it but you know they kind of stopped they stopped yeah yeah they're uh they're living much different lives now to my brother lives in new york my sister is here in london so yeah they're uh okay so they pulled away from the the horses but out of interest did your were your parents did they were they in the kind of horse world or were they just yeah like i i grew up in an equine family but just just not a racing family you know um but my granddad would have had thoroughbreds in the past and you know my dad would have bred the odd few as well and you know we would have always had you know horses at home and stuff yeah yeah it does it's really part of the Irish culture yeah so much yeah yeah no I think so I think that's you know there has to be something in the you know Irish people are so good at it and you know there's something in that in the past.

8:12But rolling forward quite a few years actually so you described to me this car that you've also subsequently described as having a bit not quite as perfect as it was. So you said it was a green golf and so we're going to talk about why in a minute but I just want to describe this green gulf because actually I really love charms that work and they move so you've got to imagine this as a kind of really miniature it's probably about a centimeter big and it's got green teal sapphires so teal sapphires are just such a pretty color and they kind of will vary a little bit in color so that so in the light it'll look different it's got ruby backlights when you break hopefully maybe it didn't break and it's got diamond um headlights uh clear quartz uh windows um four doors the two front doors open because it's tricky to make them all open but they they do open they actually open and when you open it you'll see the little steering wheel and the seat and most importantly uh the spinning wheels and um and so you'll literally be able to run up and that's very cool um but um now tell me why why the car yeah so i suppose it it represents for me um my time in college so i finished school and you know i always wanted to be a jockey but being an amateur jockey was was the road that it was going to be you know i never envisaged what actually happened So point-to-pointing.

9:58Yeah, I was point-to-pointing and so on. But, you know, going to college was kind of always the plan as well. But I found that having a car allowed me to kind of juggle both. So I was able to go to college, but I was also able to go right out in the mornings on any mornings I could. So my car was just an essential, it was an essential tool. Yeah, yeah, yeah, for me to have back then. So I was in college in Dublin for two years. Hang on, and were you suddenly equine? Yeah, I did science in UCD for the first two years. UCD is? Is in Dublin, sorry, yeah. So college in Dublin for the first two years, and I would have gone riding out for Arthur Moore during the weekdays then.

10:41And you'd get up at the crack of it, because some people don't know. I mean, actually riding. Yeah, yeah, yeah. I would have went out maybe once or twice a week. I didn't drink, so I was able to still actually go out and enjoy college life, but I wouldn't drink so that I'd still be able to get up the next morning and drive and ride out but I ended up I failed plenty of exams up there mainly maths I couldn't pass so then I had to reroute down to University of Limerick where I studied equine science so there was no maths in that course yeah so then I studied equine science down there and I was riding out for the likes of Sam Curling, Pat Doyle when I was down there and that's when I got linked up with Shark Handling and that's when I rode my first winner.

11:23So I was... Hold on, hold on. I'm rabbiting for it here. Yeah, because I want to know... I kind of want to... Well, I want to know lots of things, actually. Okay. So kind of studying... What was it called? Equine science. Equine science. So out of interest, did that... Do you think that that changed or informed the way you ride? I don't. You don't? I'm just interested that it's like... Yeah, I don't. Okay, nothing to do with it. It was a safety net to have some kind of college under your belt. It wasn't, you know, I wasn't good enough to just not, to just give all my time to riding. And, you know, it wasn't, I was always going to try and do something in college, you know.

12:11Okay, so that's, and presumably your parents quite wanted you to do that? Yeah, they did. like my parents were very supportive really and nothing I ever said um but my mum is a teacher so I'm sure she was definitely but I never didn't want to go to college to be honest because uh I can't ever remember thinking like oh no I'm gonna gonna be a jockey you know like that was never even thought I it's never on the cards yeah so um yeah so let's just so look because you you you mentioned um john uh shark yes sorry yeah no i'm kind of interested so it's so interesting that it wasn't on the cards and yet here you are the most well-known one you know like it was it was i try and explain it to some people i'm sorry i don't try and explain uh i'll start the answer again um i try and think of it somehow as my life has been a dream that i never even imagined in my dreams like my subconscious mind could never even fathom what's after happening like it was it was too outrageous as a dream like I would have dreamt of riding in Cheltenham like when I took out a jockey's license I would have thought I'd love to ride in the Fox Hunter someday you know the amateur race in Cheltenham and every kid wants to ride in the Grand National like I never would have dreamt I'd end up riding winners in Cheltenham or the winner of the Grand National like it's just it's so so far removed from what I could even dream uh so like when I was in college I was riding as an amateur through all those times trying to trying to juggle both but like part of me always hoping that it just might just might it just might click and the racing might improve and get better but like you know it it took a very long time for that to happen um so I was you know I was riding away through my college years and, you know, riding the odd winner here and there.

14:10But, you know, it didn't really escalate till I finished. Till you finished. I know. Hang on, there's lots to go between them. No, no, no. But there's so much to talk about between when you started and when you finished. So how did you end up riding for Shark in the first place? So there was a lady race. And why is he called Shark? Is that stuff? It's some, I think he got the nickname when he was playing John Hanlon, when he was playing Hurling as a pager. But it wasn't your name. No, no, no, it's not. And it really is a name that stuck with him. Stuck with him. So how did you get on that? So there was a ladies race.

14:49So there was a ladies amateur race. So it's a race confined just to lady riders. So that would have been a race where I would have had a good opportunity of getting a chance to ride. you know and was it his horses you were riding out in the morning uh no i hadn't i had never met the man before before this so it was my first time riding for him in a race in thurlus um and uh the horse is called stowaway pearl and he ended up winning and that begun the connection with with shark from then on around the same time um john hanlon shark came to me and said if you turn your license from amateur to professional i'll be able to give you a lot more opportunities uh so you know it's not like other sports where it's a real natural progression that you know if you're an amateur you go professional you have to be good good yeah you know so many of the you know patrick mullins jamie codd darick o 'connor you know none of them turned professional because of their weight you know because of their size so that comes into it as well yeah so my weight was very good i was very light so i was going to be able to avail of a lot more opportunities and mainly also because I had the backing of a yard who was going to have runners and be able to give me opportunities so I had nothing to lose um in doing that what's it take to go from amateur to professional what do you do you have to pass that what do you actually yeah so for me it was because the um governing body knew I was able to ride I was riding as an amateur yeah I don't think I had I didn't have to do another riding exam you know I might have just had to do an interview or something okay um but it was just paperwork to change my license over because i had i had a plan they could see i had plenty of experience so that's what it is it's not yeah no no so so you turn professional and then so so shark gave you a lot more rides as a result of that yeah so when i turned professional he started giving me more rides now it still took me six months to ride a winner so i'm sure a lot of people you know when i did turn a lot of people were probably saying like what's your one doing like you know this that's a bit mad but when I did turn I got a lot more rides which meant I got a lot more practice which meant I got to improve like I had people were scratching their heads because I wasn't good enough but but when I started to get more practice I did start to improve and then other people and other trainers start to notice you and start to use you and then the ball started kind of rolling and then things just kind of rolled on from there okay and then and then you you got linked up with henry de brom yeah so that that just massively changed the the level i was at i suppose you know you had a lot of have you had a lot of winners by the time yeah i had been champion conditional um so that's that mean in my life yeah i know so that's the so i was explaining earlier you have the the fully fledged professionals like the rubies and the davies who do no claim yeah um and then if you haven't ridden 60 winners you're allowed ride with a with an allowance so i was the i was the winning most rider that year of everyone who'd be gone with less than 60 winners so it's kind of like the the novice yeah champion but i i happened to be like 27 or 6 or 7 when i won it so i was actually very old usually it's won by someone who's 18 or 19 and he's you know like yeah so I was kind of old so I definitely will hold the record for being the oldest jambeak additional now I think ever but um but yeah so like I had I had um got lots of really good opportunities ridden winners and you know punch town festival and so on and but just linking up with Henry then brought my career to a completely new level again so there you are go on in this very male world yeah very male i presume particularly in ireland i don't i could be wrong it's the same yeah it's the same yeah so are you ever thinking you know is that were you kind of floored by that or did you not even think about you know that you're a girl in the man's world yeah so not at all um so i think for me a massive thing was having nina carberry and katie walsh so they were both amateurs but they were both uh they rode to an extremely high level they rode chetland winners irish national winners um you know they were like the amateurs i was speaking about earlier you know they didn't turn professional but they were both 10 times good enough to if they wanted to um so i when i started riding they were in the weigh room so they had kind of any lingering stigma that was there i think they had gotten rid of that um and they were extremely well respected and And, you know, I never found the way room to be a daunting place in that sense at all.

19:39Yeah. Are there kind of female changing rooms? Or do you just all got to get your kit off together? No, thankfully. Thankfully, there's female changing rooms. Yeah. They're often a lot smaller and a lot dingier than the male ones, but they are there. And they've always been there. They've always been there. Yeah. Like, you know, back when I started point-a-pointing, you know, you've been to point-a-point before. So you'll have seen your son go into the marquee to get changed. And, you know, oftentimes there'd be a horse box with ladies on the front of it for us to get changed. And, you know, so there's different, you know, once you're changed, then you're good to go.

20:17So what's it like when you come out, you've got changed and you're then all together, presumably all the jockeys just, you know, waiting for the last race to finish or whatever's going on. So is there a lot of chit-chat? Is there a quiet... Depends on the race. It depends on the race. So let's just talk about an average race. If it's like an average race, no, there's chit-chat. There's someone slagging someone else because of what happened in the last race. Someone else is talking about something they watched on Netflix. Someone else is really getting in the zone and not really talking to anyone because they're feeling the pressure.

20:54yeah um you know everyone and everyone approaches a race in a different way you know some people are are better staying quiet in it zoned in some people are better to be distracted and chatting about something else um you know what about what's your i always liked to so i i would be obviously getting changed in my own room but i'd always like them to go in and sit in the in the male changing area just a couple of minutes before we go out because i never liked to be fully on my own and I also found it helpful if you were there to be able to you know you hear different things you hear people say comments about ground or you know you just you just feel more included in in everything you know you're if I was to stay completely separate on my own I think that would have been a hindrance to me nearly you know um so but but like you know it's for instance Cheltenham versus the start of the Aintry Grand National is very different before the Gold Cup there's not much chat, no one's chatting no one's having the crack it's all very this is so important this is the biggest race the Aintry Grand National which is just as big a race it's a completely different vibe because there's so many variables nobody feels much pressure even if you're on the favourite for the National yeah it just it's a different it's a different type of thing altogether okay hang on hang on because i'm amazed by that i'm like wow i'm because if you if you don't know anything about racing yeah one would assume that the national i guess probably because it's more worldwide it's a more famous race yeah so in my world i'm like i'm assuming that the national is the one where there's no talking and everybody's you know that the whole world's watching yeah yeah um it's just a completely different kind of race like there's so many variables in the national there's you know it's it's uh so much can happen that's out of your control you need a lot of luck in the national um and it's just a different it's a different atmosphere i think a lot of people are are kind of edgy excited you know what i mean it's you get a buzz out of getting around in the grand national that you don't get in any other race you know if you if you complete a gold cup yeah it's great you complete it but you know you know whatever but not whatever no but sorry okay not whatever but you know you complete the you complete the gold cup uh you're you're probably imagined finishing first finishing the first four or you know what i mean or didn't win if you had a chance to win it's just you don't get any major buzz off that but if you complete the grand national you do get a kick off it you know it's it's uh it's an achievement and and it's it's a it's a really fun race to ride in so they're just they're just so different than the two races so um you the year you won the national i want you to really tell me about this so you you 2021 yeah so i guess very very different world because there were no spectators yeah that must have been quite quite annoying actually uh yeah but like i i'd so weird i don't know any different when it comes like i've yeah i didn't ride another one after it so i don't know what it's like to ride it with a crowd had you had you ridden i'd ridden in nationals yeah you did know i did grand national or other other ones because they're grand national yeah i'd ridden i'd had a couple of rides in the grand national and finished completely yeah i'd gotten to complete um i think i was 10th maybe the year before um but yeah i'd experienced what it what it was like to get around anyway which is which is great but uh it was the grand national was so special in its own way because because there was no there was no spectators there so you really if somebody you know everyone who was there even the people there who are working um you know opening and closing gates or you know doing different jobs they're all congratulating you and clapping you and you feel so much like I was just on such a buzz it didn't matter if there was no one there you know what I mean there was just I was just so happy that i can't imagine it being any different so so let's just go back before you won okay so a little bit before you won so your build-ups of grand national is you're a week away whatever's going on just talk me through if you can remember but just talk me through whether that particular race because as you said that's the one that gives you the bars is you know nervous not nervous just I was really excited for it.

25:34So I was just after going through Chetlam and I had a really good Chetlam. So like I was still kind of half buzzing off that. Yeah. And just really looking forward to Aintree. Like I was, I had plenty of good rides over there and Manila Times in the National. Manila Times at Henry's Horse. Henry's Horse in the National for JP McManus. I was just really excited to ride him. He's a fantastic jumper. um I knew he was a he had a really really good chance as well so I think I was just really excited and looking forward to it but the night before do you you're just really excited yeah because I mean I in my head I'm like oh my god there must be like it's kind of the equivalent to going to the Olympics really yeah yeah no it is yeah yeah yeah like I feel like Cheltenham has the Olympic feeling where if you're going to get those real real nerves it's Cheltenham and that's the pinnacle of national yeah chetlam is the olympics of the week um and it's chetlam is before aintree so you you know you get chetlam out of the way and you've kind of used up all your stressness for that week and everyone's a bit more relaxed in aintree the trainers are a bit more relaxed everyone's just a bit more relaxed um because chetlam has just been done and it's out of the way uh but yeah i just i never struggled with sleeping the night before a race thankfully and like regardless I was always good to sleep the night before the night after if things went wrong you might struggle to sleep or you might sleep and wake up and not be able to get back to sleep and equally if if you had a really good day you might be half buzzing and not be able to sleep but thankfully I was always able to sleep beforehand and also I guess you're very lucky you didn't you weren't having to be in the in the sauna so long you've never had to do that never had to do that yeah actually i rode i rode in the irish derby one year i had to sweat a little bit for that and i rode in a race in saudi arabia back in my amateur days i had to sweat a little bit for that but no i i'm so lucky like it's yeah that makes a big jockeys go through so much when they have to to do all that i mean do they not have to do that all the time some of them it depends yeah some of them do like some of them wake up every day they have like weight to lose and uh it's a tough it's a tough station you know um like i was so lucky i could have my breakfast i could fuel up for the day i could stay hydrated um you know and there's people you're riding against who who don't have that luxury yeah but but like from what i from what they've told me anyway it's just it's amazing what adrenaline can can kick in um and you know their bodies have become used to this now and yeah it's but it is hard so i really rich i really want to know are you are you kind of fearless i'm like you've got to be pretty fearless but are you would you say you're fearless yeah when it comes to riding a horse in a race yeah i think so but i think if a jockey if a jockey has any bit of fear when it comes to riding it's just the wrong thing for them that's when it becomes dangerous for me you know it'd be like sometimes i'd explain as overtaking a car on the road so if you go to overtake and then you kind of start half hesitating and you see something coming and like that's when it gets messy so like it's like when you're riding if you're if you're only if you're not 100 going down to a jump like a horse will sense that will feel it it's never going to be full commitment so yeah yeah i'm not fearless in all areas of life but I think when it comes to riding horses yeah you have to be a jockey so that's how jockeys are because it's so competitive being a jockey so you need you know if you're gone away for too long somebody else will it's the same as any sport you know if you're kicking on the rugby team and you're injured someone else is there shining and you know it's the same and is there a is there is there a mental switch for you rachel the person and rachel as you as you get your leg up to get on the horse does it is there a kind of switch i don't think so yeah oh just don't know yeah yeah i don't know i i like you know we ride and we race but you're so relaxed i mean like you know and you've always appeared you know i don't know what happens in the changes yeah yeah to get to the paddock and you know but I'm like oh my god what I used to be watching myself yeah yeah this is a nice well that's I think that's different my mum would have been the same watching me but your poor mum yeah I think um I think you have to like if you're too edgy a horse will pick up on that as well so if I'm and I was plenty nervous getting the leg up in Cheltenham but the minute you get legged up it seems to disappear and you're just there now you're doing your job you're in focus you you kind of forget to be nervous because you're you have to ride this animal in a race and that's all taking up your your your mind you know so you're if you're still really nervous it's just gonna it's not gonna end well I don't think yeah so presumably I was gonna ask you what makes a good jockey but I think that's that's total focus is it yeah like you have to be focused you have to be willing you have to be able to adapt to different situations um you know it's there's a lot more to being a jockey than riding will say you know you have to be very good at that but you know there's a lot of other elements yeah there's a lot of stuff that goes into it as well yeah yeah i imagine that because when you get boxed in on the rails and you didn't expect to get boxed exactly yeah are you are you shouting at your person next door are you i probably wouldn't have shouted that much i i've definitely shouted the odd time somebody has cut you up or done something but yeah i did they're like do they all do other people do that yeah some people are really vocal some people aren't some jockeys won't ever open their mouth some jockeys will some jockeys won't stop shouting or you know what i mean you know everyone's a person everyone has a different way of personality you know oh so oh god sorry because honestly when i'm watching the national or chelton or whatever i'm like oh my god this is out i don't even know the guys you know what i think it would be harder it's harder to watch sometimes like if i'm watching if i'm not riding in a race and i'm watching some of my friends riding uh and i really want them to win like it's hard to watch them you know because you're really willing them to win it's easier nearly it's easier for me to ride in the race than it was for Henry to watch it yeah you know because like his work is done he's given me the reins on something that he's put so much work and all his team have put so much work into producing and it's up to me now you know so yeah uh but but in that moment I don't have time to be nervous you know you gotta you just gotta stay yeah yeah yeah but like it's weird you don't have to force yourself to be it's you're just naturally zoned in then you know um and and if you're so just going back to the national because i'm completely did you know you were going to win at what point did you think right i've got this um because you were on manella manella time yeah yeah so uh as we were saying earlier the covid there was no crowd um so we jumped the last and as you know you kind of elbow back up onto the proper race course and i remember halfway between the elbow and the last kind of i was like i'm gonna win and then another part of my brain was like no you're not like something's gonna come and get you you know but i i did feel like i was still going really well were you miles ahead no i wasn't no i wasn't miles ahead but i was i was just starting to to creep there um and then when I got back onto the the the main race course I could hear the commentator say that I was a few lines in front and then I kind of knew I just could feel there was no one coming and my little times was still going forward and I kind of thought this could this could happen uh you know is this going to happen but you won't let yourself believe it and literally until you cross the line because like we've all seen those races where someone just comes out of nowhere so I didn't really believe it until that moment I crossed the line and as I was saying earlier the differences in Cheltenham when you cross the line you've got relief that hits you you know because you're under you know if you're winning on a on a favorite in a race in Cheltenham you know it's it's meant to win and you're kind of relieved straight away but in the national you don't feel that pressure so there's no relief it's just sheer joy and elation straight away so like I don't know I don't have the words to tell you like I felt like I was going to burst like it was just I feel like I'm just listening to you I think I mean I don't know but I mean I read National Velvet when I was whatever age so for me I'm like you must have read it when you were tight yeah like it's just um I don't know and every time I see it back or even talk about it like it's and like I can you know you have the little memories in your head um but it's just like god like it actually happened you know what I mean it's just crazy so what you've got over the line you felt like did was your first thing I've won the race was your first thing I'm the first woman ever to win this race so what was it so I I feel so um so my initial feeling was i've just won this race this is unbelievable i've won it the female thing didn't come into my head at all right and i think that's because of all the incredible work that went in all those years you know the women weren't allowed riding the national you know that all the work that incredible women did before me put me in a position that when i won the race I just thought I I'm so happy I've won this as a jockey you know what I mean I deserve it yeah and that that that's because of all their incredible work um and then when you got home well because I guess the difference is you would have heard this massive roar if it hadn't been 2021 um but there's there's so so from that perspective did that as you said you you didn't know any different yeah like i was just i just remember different people coming up and congratulating me and were your parents there no my parents weren't there yeah yeah um but boyfriend was he there yeah he was there he was he was riding in the race so oh my god i remember i remember looking up uh so you know you cross the line and you know not everyone finishes we'll say um but i remember looking up to you know i hadn't seen him really throughout the race or your boyfriend brian hayes Yeah, yeah, yeah.

36:41He's a jockey as well. Yeah. So I remember I looked up to see to see where he was or, you know, you're you know, you're making sure that they got around or whatever. Yeah. And I remember I saw his colours. He had his saddle in his hand and he's walking back in with the saddle. So he was fine or whatever. But I remember he just kind of he gave a kind of a smile and a kind of a like I don't know if he throws eyes to heaven, but he was just like, you know, he could do no wrong. Yeah, he often says that when he was crossing the line, he was a bit further back, but he could hear the commentator say, history in the national.

37:21And he was like, oh, she's not after winning this as well. You know what I mean? I'd say he was like, oh God, she's going to be so painful now. But I was after having a brilliant Cheltenham. Had you won the Gold Cup? No, I was second in the Gold Cup. That was the next year. But I had six winners in Cheltenham. so it was it was unbelievable and then to get to go and do that in the Grand National like so it was uh it just was yeah the ball bounced for me that year yeah your next charm um I guess I guess we talked about it a little bit but I mean we had to do this your your next charm is is a is a racing helmet um and I've actually done this in blue and white um sapphires so I've used blue pavé sapphires and the white spots of mother of pearl um and the the harness is yellow gold and it's exactly as as a miniature little racing helmet should be i mean i've done it in these colors but racing car you've ridden for so many people that actually i could have chosen a myriad of different colors but i just this is very very pleasing but um shall we shall we talk a bit about I think one of your favourite horses are Plutarch yeah he was amazing see you later he was phenomenal he gave me my first winner in Cheltenham who did he belong to he was Cheebly Park the Thompson family so it was fantastic to get to ride I had great success in Cheltenham for them and yeah they're such famous colours to wear as well So it was, yeah, so he was my first winner.

39:09So that was a massive thing, you know, having your first winner at the Cheltenham Festival. And, you know, Henry would have given me a lot of, you know, that was in 2019. So I would have gone over with a lot of very good rides for Henry. So to be able to ride him that day and win was just, yeah. Hang on. For those people that are not as familiar with racing, I think it's quite important to explain what Cheltenham is because it's it's the kind of pinnacle of national hunt isn't it yeah it is so uh cheltenham is like our olympics we just get we just get it every year so you know there's racing all throughout the winter um and but it's a lot of the chat is building up to cheltenham you know that's where the very best horses will be that's where the the highest competition is you know it's that's where it's at i mean whenever i've been to jettman it just seems to be ireland versus england it doesn't seem to be like that but it's a it's a just it's just a fantastic week it's you know it's the pinnacle week of our sport and um you know everyone brings their best foot forward and uh yeah you know by the sounds of my friends who have made the trip over they all have a fantastic week socializing as well as well they've managed to do that i'm always fascinated do they managed to well sorry no not not my jockey friends oh right okay not your jockey friends surely your jockey friends are having like early on on on uh unway room colleagues yeah yeah yeah the other friends but they yeah they all have a brilliant week over there as well and love it so was that uh your first major win um it was you've had so many so it's when you're looking the research is really hard to work out where was the really that yeah i think it was definitely yeah because it was a it was a winner in cheltenham and that's it doesn't get much better than that yeah yeah yeah and and you had a full crowd that day yeah it was uh god you're mad about the crowd because i know as the crowd you're in the crowd i'm in the crowd so i know what the crowd like the crowd the crowd are what make it as in you know like i know i said earlier i didn't have the crowd in 2021 but like i just i can't imagine it in any other way of experiencing a national with the crowd so i i don't feel sad for myself but i would change it but yeah but the crowd in cheltenham like i have just like it is just such a feeling like when you're when you get to circle around the top there after writing a winner and you're interviewed and people are saying well done it's great and then you get to walk all the way back down the chute and up under the walkway thing and back into the like ampute theatre that that is the winner's enclosure like it doesn't get any better in anything in life yeah and you've done that twice I've done that uh twice that year twice that year I mean that year yeah oh my god yeah yeah so um yeah I've been very lucky in Cheltenham I've gotten to ride uh you know winners every year there since 2019 so I've I've been very very lucky absolutely uh i mean it's just extraordinary how many how many races are how many um jumps are there is it vary per per race so it depends on on the distance of a race yeah yeah yeah so depending on on the distance will depend on how many jumps and how many circuits you go and that kind of thing but yeah that that day on apple tower was just unbelievable and then um that was in 2019 and then in 2022 he ended up winning the gold cup which is the the pinnacle of uh jumps racing so I finished second on the year before um so to get to then go and win it on the year after was just unreal and when you uh in the lead up to that race are you thinking could I do it again could he do it again are you kind of yeah like thinking that or like the disappointment of the year before and plenty of people were saying to me oh like you'll win it on him next year and you know he'll do it next year and I was kind of thinking like oh my god like next year is so far away and he has to get there I have to get there everything has to work out and like it did work out um but yeah like I knew going into it I had a really really good chance of of doing it but you know it's it's jumps racing it's racing it's sport a lot of things have to fall into place yeah and do you do you kind of count down the jumps when you're in a race or do you just know where the finish is uh yeah you know like you know from you know from if you've never ridden a track before you'll know from watching videos and that kind of thing but yeah you know you know where you are in Cheltenham you know yeah yeah yeah you're not thinking right that's the water jump done on uh yeah well you know you you know what you know every different fences on different parts of the track you might be riding a bit differently you might want to keep in here keep out here yeah that kind of thing so yeah yeah you know where you are your next job this one made me smile actually so this is a pizza yeah it's a slice of pizza i've done it as a slice of pizza because i thought just a pizza tom might be like really um so i've um i've literally i've done it as a slice of pizza um and i've um i've done it in yellow gold which will kind of represents the crust uh the crust of the pizza and then i've got diamonds which are kind of yellow diamonds and um yellow sapphires and diamonds actually uh to represent the cheese and then i've got rubies as the pepperoni on the pizza i've no idea whether you like pepperoni expensive slice pizza i say expensive pizza but um talk me through um you know the that what pizza yeah so it just it just um it reminds me of the tuesday of chetlam uh so um we usually rent a house um so you know we're in there and just every night since 2019 we've ordered uh pizza to the house in Shetlam and I've been so lucky I've had uh really good Tuesdays in Shetlam and you know you're I just feel like it's such a it's just such a nostalgic memory it's usually a a domino is actually that's that's what's close to our house in Shetlam yeah probably yeah yeah and I'd be like getting the cookies and the whole lot and uh like like horrendous really like that as a diet to have but it just it just kind of it just seemed to work for us i thought it was reassuring that jockeys are eating pizza anyway what about brian does he does he struggle with his yeah he might have had a slice okay so he does he so he has to watch the weight yeah like and uh you know uh patrick mullins would have been in the house as well and he definitely might have had half a slice yeah so uh but uh yeah you know some years there'd be some other friends over as well and um yeah i just i remember in the 2019 in particular i remember you know there was a good crew of us and there was it was just just a good memory yeah are you always when you take the house you're all jockeys no not all jockeys so the last kind of few years we've just taken the house with through the three of us jockeys and but a few years previous there's been a few other people as well yeah yeah so it depends but so um if you're sharing a house with two men uh are you sharing the cooking um fascinated by what goes on in a three jockey house yeah patrick mullins has moved out uh in the last kind of two years so we're finally kind of all growing up a bit uh but uh yeah when we were all sharing he definitely was stayed well away from the kitchen um yeah he he's his cooking skills were uh not his uh not his strength not his strength yeah yeah washing up hopefully was more of a strength yeah yeah no he was good he was good to do those things but yeah not the cooking and uh yeah brian brian would have been able to do a spaghetti bolognese and yeah okay definitely definitely okay so you're doing that you're yeah yeah yeah oh god um so um rich your next your next charm i mean is a honeysuckle can't imagine where that is but um it's actually really difficult to do a honeysuckle beautifully because it they're they're quite kind of detailed yeah yeah um so i mean i've done it as the head of the the you know the actual flower um and i really like it when when even on this little daisy the little petals move oh wow okay move a little bit yeah so i'd really want this to kind of have movement have a little little bit of movement so um so i i mean i've done it in um i mean i love yellow gold so i've done all of these charms in yellow gold um but actually honeysuckles come in lots of different colors so I kind of thought it'd be nice to do a bit of light pink sapphires on the petals so each individually on the petals slightly graded and towards the middle we put I put some yellow sapphires because actually when you look at honeysuckle it can be kind of yellow to pink and then diamonds diamonds on the on the on the edges of of the of each petal and on the back it's very polished and beautiful very stunning like that um but um right so honeysuckle talk me through it because obviously honeysuckle got a very special place in your heart yeah honeysuckle was an incredible mare um she was phenomenal she won two champion hurdles um she 12 grade ones like she was just every jockey dreams of getting linked up with something like that in their careers and and she was that for me she was just unbelievable and she came to henry's yard soon enough after i was there so our careers kind of grew together and like i was always so grateful like that injury i mentioned earlier like you fell off her no i didn't fall off her but i didn't miss riding her so every injury i had i was always back for her i was never suspended when she ran like i was able to ride her every time she ran so yeah we just had uh she was just very very special to me and i think she's got a really cool name as well like a lot of kids if I ever get letters in the post they'd always ask about honeysuckle and ask how she was and uh she was just that kind of special mare to to me and to so many people oh my goodness well that I mean the kids the fact that all these kids I mean you are you must be such a role model to so many people not just kids but you have just written this book uh when I say just written yeah you have just written this book haven't you yeah well I so it's called Granny National so it started the process started after the Grand National in 2021 and it's actually only got finished at the start of the summer so it took a lot longer than I thought it was going to take but yeah it's it's wonderful now to have it finished and to see it it's really cool actually to see it in a bookshop and actually speaking of those letters kids write um you know you often get them you often get a bundle of them when and you can tell it's like in the school curriculum it's right to a sports person on the school curriculum you know because you get a bundle together but the other day i got one and it was from a girl and she said uh we were asked to write to our favorite author i was like oh my god like i'm someone's favorite author like that's very cool like little did i think when i was failing exams in college i didn't you know someone's favorite yeah I know it's mad but uh yeah what um kind of age have we when you're kind of yeah it's kind of uh eight to ten you know eight to twelve even yeah so do you think you are if you look back at it now you're looking back and thinking I'm kind of talking to me when I was eight to ten I think so yeah like it's a it's an adventure so I was never a massive reader when I was younger my sister was a bookworm galore so um I loved I loved Harry Potter actually I but I used to listen to the audiobooks uh so granny national is on audiobook as well for the kids that don't like actually having having to read on their own so are you reading it uh no i'm not reading it no it didn't didn't go down that road yeah so i was still racing when that all had to be done so i couldn't quite get the time to do that but uh yeah i kind of wanted to make a book that was just an adventure story you know it's not it's not just for pony kids so it's just it's a kind of a an outdoor adventures book and like I I would love if people from all different parts of you know the world would not the world that's just a stretch but you know town town people from the town or people from the city or people from the country all those kids kind of enjoy it you know oh well I haven't read it yet but I'm gonna read it or just or just audiobook it you know but it's a really lovely when you read it yourself actually when yeah yeah yeah no it is it is yeah it is um but yeah it's too much of a stretch to do that but and and actually like yeah the the professionals can put on cool accents and stuff for the different characters so i think that's good um so kind of finally what what made you call it quits what was it i'm calling it quits is actually such the wrong way no but that's what i did i called it no no you didn't you just called time yeah so at what point did you a kind of plan that yeah there was kind of so Cheltenham this year was the first year I kind of thought leaving Cheltenham I was like will I be back here next year and I'd never gotten that had never entered my head before but I still wasn't 100 % sure and I said I'd think about it in the summer and then I was just going racing one day to Cork and I just thought you know what this could be the right time so um I kind of had said to myself you know if this one wins in Cork I think I think that'll be it then but I still hadn't told anyone like my parents my family my friends no nobody nobody knew no trainers no no one knew because I wanted to I wanted to be sure myself I didn't want anyone to to think that that was in my head at all you know um so i didn't want anyone to know so i just knew then when i pulled up that um yeah i think that was it now so yeah oh my god was that the weirdest feeling it was weird yeah because like it was a just a normal as you said earlier it was a normal race an average race in in cork and uh yeah i think paul tannin was in the race and he just said as jockeys do when you pull up you know he said well done and I said thanks and you know one or two lads said well done we're all chatting back in and I just remember thinking I was like that's the last time this ever that anyone's ever going to say well done after a race you know like it was it was weird like I honestly made me cry it must have been so weird yeah it was strange it was strange and yeah I remember there was some friends there and I was like oh let's get a picture and you know I was like because I wanted to get I I knew that I hadn't told them I kind of didn't tell anyone until the following day right uh no Brian didn't know um but I remember getting him out of the way room his his family was there his sisters were there and I remember saying to him oh will you come out for a picture just with your sisters and he was like I don't need to get I got a picture with them earlier like I don't in my head I was like just come out for a picture and now like I love that picture because that was my last day and you know uh it's just lovely to have have that memory but uh and um when you told henry you told you know all the people that yeah you know had been such an important part of your life how were their reactions um henry definitely seemed like a bit shocked when i told him i suppose it was a bit i were it was a bit he wasn't expecting it um but yeah everyone was so uh supportive and happy and yeah and have you ever regretted it since have you ever thought i mean it hasn't been very long no yeah it's just been once yeah may so i tried in may uh so the real you know the real kind of winter jumps racing is kind of starting now um and yeah like i'd be lying if i said i wasn't watching some of the races thinking i'd love to just be back on board there like I do miss riding I miss I miss racing I miss that feeling I miss winning um I miss the purpose of that um as your job and it's just an incredible it was an incredible job to have like I was so lucky that I got to do something I loved every day but but you just thought that's it it wasn't it wasn't about eight because I mean you were at top of your game yeah top of your game I mean I can say were only because I've been reading yeah but you are absolutely top of your game I kind of always said to myself that I uh if I got the chance um you know jockeys don't always get to decide when they retire you know that that's that's a you're lucky if you get to do that injury different things retire jockeys so I always said if I was able to decide myself I didn't want to I wanted to do it when I was still going well and when I still had horses to leave behind and I was still you know not that I was where I was in 2021 but I was still relatively going okay you know what I mean so I wanted to finish when that was the case and not when I was going on yeah coming off the top coming off the top um and now what's what's the plan um trying to figure life out now yeah yeah but uh for example I definitely have more time to do lovely trips like this and come and see you in London and uh you know I I'm able to do things like that now and uh which is great and I'm I'm really busy like I'm you know you'd be surprised how much you have to catch up on in life and you know I'm I'm very lucky in the in the sponsors and so on I had when I was racing like they're all kind of still with me and I'm doing more work for them and surrounded by lots of really good really good people and you know like I've recently started working with the jockey club and um a bit of commentating do you think not quite commentating uh no but uh no I I recently started working with the jockey club as as head of um ladies day for the Shetland festival next March so um it's lovely to be to be back involved in racing and um you trying to encourage women of all ages to come and enjoy what is a fantastic day out at the races.

58:32It is a fantastic day out. Rachel, it's been such a pleasure and honour to chat to you. I couldn't actually end up with so many questions. And for my beautiful terms, they're absolutely stunning. So I'm going to make you one to say thank you. So I'm interested, I'm really interested actually, which one is going to be. I know, well what do you think it's going to be? I'm not going to tell you, I don't know. I actually I'm like I really don't know but I do you have one you would like to make more this is for you I know what it's really important like weirdly so I'm torn between two uh it's between bubbles and the honeysuckle charm but weirdly I just like the bubbles charm I just think it's so different uh so yeah I'd like to make that because I think charms are talking point yeah yeah exactly what you said at the beginning it's like your people say what what is that what are you wearing yeah I just think it's really unusual and really cool and it's uh yeah it's it's very I think it's very wearable yeah yeah yeah anyway I will thank you so much get cracking yeah thank you for joining us on my life in charms if today's conversation has inspired you to reflect on your own story begin your life in charms journey at anushka.com or email bespoke at anushka.com.

59:49And don't forget to follow or subscribe to hear more extraordinary stories told in jewels.