#703 - Patrick Bet-David - Why Does No One Trust The Media Anymore?

25:47And maybe internally you don't want to compete. You want to dominate. Maybe internally you want to show everybody. No, I'm going to be number one. Let's just say within and because professionally, wanna do this. Totally cool. But there's a lot of other competitors out there that have good podcasts and they're doing a good job. It's just a different mindset when you have that enemy. By the way, very rarely will those guys ever, truly again, reveal their top driver and the top enemy. Why? Yeah. Because it's an element of insecurity. Yeah. It's a signal of love status. It is. It's, and it's also, I don't want to give the other person credit.

26:31Power. Yeah. I don't want to give that other person more power than the person thinks they have. You don't have power. Oh, because somebody may be like, oh, I'm your enemy. I control you. Exactly. Well, when it's a part of the come -up story, it's romantic, right? it's grassroots. It's what's keeping you going, look, look, how I was mistreated by my first high school coach. They didn't see the time. I'm going to prove it to them. That's a beautiful origin story, age 20. Age 45, that just sounds like someone who can't get the chip off his shoulder. So yeah, I think it's interesting how the tools that got you here aren't the ones that would get you there and how the strategy, this is again one of the reasons why continuing to rely on resentment and bitterness and the chip on your shoulder and enemies for too long becomes a very toxic fuel.

27:25And it's also importantly, optics are very, very important to single of those status. Okay. You brought, I don't disagree. Will you brought up a story of Churchill, right? Okay. The world is weeks away from all speaking in German. Okay, if we lose the war, the guy wins. No problem. Chamberlain cannot hold it together. And the story about how the only way Churchill said he was going to come back is for Chamberlain to come and begot. The only way, does it sound like something Churchill would do, by the way? Absolutely. Yeah. Churchill said there and said, okay, he has to come and ask me, because Chamberlain sent other people, he said, no, no, no, no, no, only one person has to come look at me face to face and say, you can do a job I can't do.

28:15Come back and help us. Think about, think about that now. Visualize that scene. We can see in a movie or we can read in a book. And by the way, say 50 % of it is true. The other 50 % is true. The other 50 % is a lie and it's like build up mythical over generations, right? I believe that Churchill would want to hear it from a chamberlain. Have you heard of Churchill's ministry of ungentlemanly warfare? No. So this is a phenomenal book that everybody can go and read. Before the Second World War, it was considered ungentlemanly to use guerrilla style tactics. And in fact, one of the British politicians said something to the effect of, if this is what it takes to win the war, I am prepared to lose.

29:02They were the Brits saw anything shy of gentlemanly conduct in war as a loss, even if it resulted in a win. And Churchill came in and changed that. He was the one that changed that culture. So he puts together this crack squad of eccentric weirdos. One guy invents the limpid mine, right, which you can descend to depths and then it'll attach using magnets and it'll blow things up. Another group developed what is the predecessor to the SAS. Another group are working on disguises and guerrilla tactics to disrupt infrastructure as the German advance is trying to move forward. So yeah, Churchill was prepared to play dirty.

29:40But you look at the tactics that we used. They only came about because of one mountain who legitimated it. And he said, we will do whatever it takes to win. Now, here's the thing. When you hear a story like that, somebody may say, Well, you know what a what a what a cold blooded bastard. Oh my God. No wonder people hate them No wonder he is who he is where many president moved the bust of Churchill and the White House of Winds that take this out So I don't super represent what he represents. Everybody acts all hard, right? We can hate a Churchill during peacetime But during wartime you you beg for a Churchill to rise up wartime leaders like Churchill, you only appreciate during wartime.

30:27There's a really interesting insight from evolutionary psychology here. There's two types of leadership. One is from dominance and the other is from prestige. One is more authoritarian, it's tyrannical, it's very aggressive. The other is more altruistic.

30:44The rise to power is denoted, it's spread through the group, everybody chooses together that this is someone who we all believe has the skills and the dominance is not the same. And there are specific times when you want dominance and when you want prestige. And in terms of conflict, you want dominance. Sure. Sure. You could say, in business, it's start up versus when it's more established. Right. But here's also the thing, like the part where you got to give a lot of credit to Steve Jobs. Steve Jobs had a startup mentality. and then he took that to the company and then he hires, you know, his scully that comes in from Pepsi and he says, you want to sell sugar, can you know, water for the rest of your life or you want to change the world?

31:28He brings him in. Then he ends up being the reason to fire jobs, jobs leave, schools, builds Pixar, sells it to Disney. Most of his wealth is tied to Disney, not at Apple. Then he comes back and he realizes is that style of leading is not going to work to take the company to the next level when he comes back to Apple. The first phone call he says he says, the idea of thinking Microsoft as the enemy is behind us. We can't think like that anymore. This is what Steve Jobs says. And he goes to Microsoft and he gets $300 million from Microsoft to invest into Apple. And these guys hated each other. Microsoft came out in 76.

32:02Apple came out in 77, a year apart. And everybody was always comparing it to together. Bill gets ended up being much richer than Steve Jobs, but Steve Jobs was admired. way more than Bill Gates. So what does this mean? The individual has to evolve. Like you have to also recreate yourself as you're going through this. The same enemy that drives you when you're 22 years old should not be driving you at 32 years old or else you haven't matured. You should also out matured that enemy. And then 32 something else should be driving you then 42 then 58 then 63 then 75. But you are going to have those love affair with those enemies.

32:41That's a love affair. You had an affair with this enemy over an eight -year span, over a 13 -year span, over a six -year span, over a six -month span. But, you know, there is truth in the idea of you still being driven by that enemy, 18 years after you beat that enemy. 13 years after you beat that enemy. Someone who I think is particularly good at creating enemies from modern pop culture and our industry is Ben Shapiro. Okay. What do you think about what he's doing at daily wire from an enemy perspective and generally you time I recently with his feud with Tucker Carlson or period generally everything overall I Think Tucker's a true believer.

33:16I think Tucker is not somebody that if he's doing it intentionally to get under your skin Let's say that's 20 % let's say it's 10 % because he's witty and he's smart and he's sharp I'm sorry, Ben Shapiro, so you're talking about right? Let's say Ben is doing that 10 or 20 % intentionally to get under your skin, okay? But this guy at a young age wanted to be Supreme Court just, you know, he's been wanting to be that for a long time. This is not a regular guy. I think at 12 or 13 years old, he performed in front of a couple thousand people. His level of intelligence of how early on he got a degree went to college, 15, 16 years old, did all the stuff that he did.

33:55So he's a 100 % true believer. Does he have an element that he can talk to somebody and say, I can murder you in a debate right now. If you really want to go there, yes, he has that element as well. Does he have a side of him that's a maybe a bully type a little bit? Sure. Well, don't forget during school, he was very heavily bullied himself. Very heavily bullied. But that's what happens typically to people I can. But that may be the number one driver that he's continuing because he wants for the rest of his life for those bullies to talk about that Ben Shapiro used to be a classmate. What makes him go out to pace that he goes?

34:31You think it's just all these other guys that we see? There's no way. You think he would ever tell us? You think his own family knows that. Highly doubted. It's to himself, many of these people that he has in his life. Anybody that goes at that pace, like Tucker Carlson today, I don't know if you saw the approval, he got, I think they got $150 million today from some organization. Who did? Tucker's organization. Yeah, so finally today the word is out that he raised money. It's a big amount of money that he finally raised today. Hey, who's this enemy? He's got a very easy enemy. He's got Fox News, former employer as an enemy.

35:01He's got a lot of political people as an enemy. People with Silasam as an enemy. You know how many enemies Tucker has got? You think Tucker needs another 300 million dollars that he has in a bank account? I highly doubt so. He's doing it for a complete different reason because he wants to give the middle finger to five, 10, 15 different people in his life. You just sense it with Tucker and by the way, you know what's wild right now? Ben Shapiro went after Tucker this week. What happened? Because of Israel, Tucker's position where he says we should focus on 100 ,000 people in America that are dying from fentanyl, not focused on what's going on in Israel and Gaza.

35:34And Ben Shapiro says, you know, we can chew gum and walk at the same time, specifically from the moral standpoint. We can handle two different moral issues, but, you know, they're going back and forth. Whether it's a seasonal thing or not, that's a completely different, you know, competition that we're talking about. I suppose, how would you say, enemies of convenience are sometimes good for optics. What have we just seen? Dylan, Danis, Logan Paul, KSI, Tommy Fury, Jake Paul, Tommy Fury, Logan Paul, Jake Paul and who's the Jiu -Jitsu guy, Stockton Slaps? Dears. Thank you. Nadea. I love that guy.

36:12Enemies of convenience. Yeah. You know, like nothing gets people's tongues wagging more than you creating a little bit of a feud on the internet. Do you see they announced yesterday, speaking of feuds and speaking of Disney, that the daily wire are going to do that own version of Snow White with Brett Cooper starring in Snow White. I saw that. I saw that. I mean, that to me is, you know, largely a declarative statement of culture war on what's happening with children with children's movies. you know, it's synthesizing down all of the little tangential issues that have been included. Is there anything to do with the push toward the sort of books that are in school?

36:50Is it us, you know, denying this Rachel's sigla, Zagler throwing snow white under the bus? Like, she doesn't have a prince charming. She has a stalker. We don't need that. What do you think about that? I think that it is a very dangerous lesson to teach young girls that boys that show interest in them are dangerous and to be avoided. I think it makes for a generation of fragile, narcissistic, fearful young girls that I wouldn't want as a daughter and that I don't want as a mother. You know what a perfect example that is? The movement of feminism is the ultimate example of not choosing your enemies wisely.

37:28You chose men as being the enemy. 40 years later, 50 years later, you're 65 years old, single, not married, no kids. You're living in an apartment or condo with a dog or a cat that that's all you ever talk about and You're lonely and you're sitting there saying I was wrong men or not the enemy, but guess what that Movement stole 50 years of your life. You know how painful that is What she's doing right now with the messaging she's given and then getting out there and saying well I don't want to be able to have to do this. No, you know what? It's not necessarily going to be that way nowadays. You know, women don't need that anymore.

38:07It's a completely different era right now we're talking about. And to do this at a hundred year anniversary of Disney, really with what Walt and many of us, I remember living in Iran watching Disney cartoons translated in Farsi, literally in Farsi. It's very weird when you watch it in Farsi because a language is a rough language. You know, you get your watch Pinocchio in Farsi. It's not as appealing, right? But we grew up with this stuff. You know, we grew up with watching these cartoons to see that taking place. If you ask me, it's absolutely pathetic, but you're seeing how many back -to -back -to -back Flops Disney has right now.

38:42Yeah. And it's not a good look. By the way, the buyers who want to buy Disney, they're loving this. Apple's one of the most qualified buyers. They hope Disney makes five more Flops. Apple's sitting there saying, make five more Flops. Iager, please. By the way, have you read The Right of a Lifetime by Bob Aiger? Okay, another interesting guy what he did with a 38 career at ABC obviously he's been there a lot longer But when you read the book to first 38 run To be one of the best power brokers Then to finish your career up the way you're doing right now very Very bad way of finishing it up. He's not an idiot, right?

39:18You don't have the excuse of not knowing. He is for what a point you just made He is 100 % not an idiot. This guy was about to run for president Bob Iker was gonna he was one the guys that everybody was trying to get to run for president him and Oprah They were supposed to be this literally this was the conversation So he also ended up choosing the wrong enemies and The wrong allies not realizing your best allies are parents. You're losing parents who have been watching this for years You're losing the people that this is a legacy product It's another example of a complete screw -up that's gonna come out of discount for somebody else like Apple You bet.

39:57I mean, look, to go back to Ben and what Jeremy are doing over the daily wire, Hershey's do a campaign that they don't like. Within five days, they release their own chocolate bar. That shaving company does something they don't like within 24 hours maybe, they filmed a video with a McLaren for Jeremy's razors. They don't like the way that's - Fantastic, commercial by the way. Well done. Jeremy's got skills. I listened to him and Shapiro talking about the fact that originally Jeremy was the talent. and Ben was the money man and the data guy behind the scenes. Do you know Zach Levi? I think his name is Zach Levi.

40:33The actor who played the, what is the movie? The super hero for kid movies. What is the guy's name? Ben 10. What is it? Ben 10. No, no, it's a race. You're the one with like four kids. Yeah, trust me, I've seen this movie a couple times. He played Kurt Warner. A recent movie that came out, the American underdog. He played Kurt Warner. him and Jeremy used to have a production company apparently 10, 15 years ago. And Zach and that are being a big time actor in Hollywood doing very good for himself. And by the way, Jeremy is another great example of a guy that's got enemies. Just look at his eyes.

41:09When you talk, when you hear Jeremy speak, you see the fire. He's got enemies and he wants to take those enemies out. But that's why I thought the Daily Y was an illustrative example because they are, as far as I can see, largely a company built on identifying enemies. You know, they're very much in opposition to ideas that they don't like to movements, they don't like to people that they don't like. And yeah, man, I mean, you have to be built for that. You really, really do need to be built for it. And it certainly seems to me that what Ben and what Jeremy are doing over there is purpose built to be the anti this, the anti that, and a lot of the time it's new movements that they don't just, they don't agree with.

41:52The market's gonna prove if the concept is gonna work or not and if it can sustain it, because if it's a built -to -sol concept, they're gonna succeed. But can somebody else come and pick up that concept and continue with that with the same level of fire? It's gonna take a couple decades to figure that part out. But it's interesting to think, from our side, when you see those Rachel Ziggler interviews and she's saying, courting is stalking, A girl doesn't need to be saved by a prince. You know, she's busy thinking about how she can fulfill her own dreams and becoming the woman that she always knew that she could turn it so forth.

42:26You think a lot of people are, is that really the highest manifestation? Is that real self -actualization for young women nowadays? That's the question they ask. And you're totally right. Look, ultimately, the market will choose. There's no question about it. The market will choose. The market is brutal. You know, you know what's a great thing about it. It's always right. It's always right. You know, you can you can say well, let me tell you I'm the best bodybuilder in the world Yeah, okay look at your calves. Yeah, good luck. You go put those a little skimpy, you know Shorts on and see what your legs look like now.

43:00You're not as good as you think you are you're full of it Yeah, market is brutal Podcast business concepts investments drinks You know alcohol books you write when we first wrote when I first wrote your next five moves and we launched it August of 2020. It's during the peak of COVID. My publisher Simon and Schusser asked and said, so how do you think the book's going to do? How are you going to judge the book? Me and Greg think in our talk and I said, if the book is doing well three years from now, it was a good book. You can have a great marketing campaign. The book does well the first 30, 16, 90 days.

43:32But is the book selling three years later? If it is, that's a great book. Because the market will tell you that. Yeah, very interesting to think about how optics and there are ways to game the system. And I think people are very, they're hyper aware of this. They understand that there are people who have managed to use tactics and hacks to get themselves into a position that they maybe didn't quite deserve, that the legitimacy of the product, the book or whatever it is. The person who maybe when Meghan Markle's autobiography comes out, perhaps people would accuse her of doing something like this, right?

44:11It's not to do with the actual product, it's to do with the positioning. And sometimes that does work. But ultimately, form is temporary and class is permanent. Navarra's got this great quote where he says, karma is just people repeating their beliefs, actions and behaviors until they finally get what they deserve. You just roll the dice. You keep rolling the dice. Every single time, every single thing you do, the way that you interact with the Uber driver, the way that you pay or don't pay the bill or invoice that you've got every tiny little thing each time is an opportunity for your true nature to come in.

44:46And people just keep on rolling the dice. Keep on rolling the dice. And then every so often someone hits double one and you go, oh, there we go. But it's temporary. You can do permanently. Megan Merkel, whether her motives are really because she loves the prince and it's like Harry, she's in love with them or she's using the power to bully and get what she wants out of it. The market is brutal. Look what happened to Amber heard. For how many years did everybody think, Johnny Depp was a bad guy? For how many years, oh Johnny Depp was an abusive relationship, all this stuff and then they start showing the clips, the videos and Johnny's comfortable would it be in public?

45:26and all of a sudden 180, the world is like what an asshole she is. Not him. I love Johnny. The next thing you know, the love affair was like how many more men are going through like Johnny is. And then how many women said she ruined it for women who were actually abused. So yeah, for longest time, oh my god, crying is such a difficult time. What he was so many hit me. we fell for it, but we will only fall for it temporarily, not permanently. The market will reveal eventually. Hopefully. Yeah, again, man, for Miss Tempory, class is permanent and people will ultimately get what they deserve. When it comes to the courting is stalking culture that we have at the moment.

46:12You've got a daughter, you've got young sons, you also spend some time undervalutainment talking about intersectional dynamics and what's going on between the sexes. What do you of the current dating scene for men and women and why do you think it's being demonized in some ways? From what perspective? From I think that there is an anti -dating culture at the moment. Okay. I think that men and women are being encouraged to be treated as equals. Sorry, as adversary is not as equals. Right. Right. I think it's transactional today. I think it's easy today. I think the swipe right community is, it's Friday night, 11 o 'clock, let me swipe right.

46:50I'm going to use 20 someone's going to get back to me if they swipe right and they so typically I would go after an 8 .5 9 but it's Friday night. I'm going to go do a 6 .5 7. No one's going to know. I'm going to buy her back to my place. She notes if she's on Tinder. I'm not on bumble whatever these dating apps are. And so it's transactional. Strategic. No one's going to know. And literally not a lot of people are going to know you can really run through 20 40 50 100 nowadays and it's not a big deal. Okay. So what does that do? Whatever is too easy to come, you devalue it. You don't value it that highly.

47:23You know, my era, you had to court. You had to prospect. You had to have scripts. You had to build a relationship. You had to follow up. We didn't have these types of things to do. We had my space. The last time I was single, there was my space. Okay. I DMed my wife on my space. My wife and I knew each other for five and a half years. Eventually, we were in Palm Springs for the first time. she's single, I'm single ever. For five and a half years, we're both single. And you know, we go on a date, first date, P .F. Changs, December 29 of 2007, used discipline, P .F. Chang used to be good when they had their, their, their noodles soup.

48:01They don't have it anymore. Used to be, they took that away, phenomenal item on the menu. I'm convinced they, they fell apart after that. So anyways, we go to P .F. Changs, by the way, if you're watching, bring it back. It was actually very good item on the menu. So we go on a date, there's magic, she's smiling. I'm smiling. You know the smile that's kind of like I'm happy to see you. And then it's midnight with the last people left at P .F. Chanks. You know, waiter comes up to me and he says, what's going on? I said, you know, my wife wants to follow the horse. She doesn't want to be with me anymore.

48:31So your wife, why? Yeah, I come from a different religious background and her family's convinced we got to split up. And he has no clue. We're not married. We're just on our first date. He sits down for 15 minutes It's convincing her to stay with me. If you love him, stay with him. It was a beautiful scene that we have. We go in the car, she goes home the next day I take her, we go do stairs in Santa Monica, we go to church, we go to Earth Cafe in Santa Monica, then we go to borders. I buy her book on our second date called 101 Questions to Ask Before You Get Engaged on our second date by Norman Wright.

49:02She's like, what's this? I said, I'm not looking for a girlfriend, I'm looking for a wife. I'm 20 at the time. I said, I know exactly what I want. I've already done the sexers out with three other girls. If you want to go through it great, you need to answer the questions. Let's meet up when you're ready and let's go through it. Weak later, six hours at her place, one by one by one each question we go through. I said, this is somebody I can date. And by the way, it's ugly because you got to talk about everything in a book. So today, that's not it anymore. Today it's too risky. Today it's you don't have access to that anymore.

49:36Today percentages are coming out where marriages from dating sites have the least chance of working out versus marriages where you meet somebody through a referral where you say, Pat, I've known Mary for seven years. I think you and her should talk now. I don't know what's going to happen. Let me set you guys up. Let's take our girls and do a double day cool. Hey, I kind of like her. This is good. But you're telling me seven years. I've only seen her be with one guy Larry, five years. He was an asshole. Then she's been with us other guy two years, but she's single now. Now I have some kind of a history I'm dealing with, right?

50:02So it is a different climate. Now with kids it's a different story on how you raise them. My 10 -year -old son he's he's been he's had a girlfriend since he was five years old literally at a birthday party at five years old he's making out with this other girl at this David Buster's I'm like babe what is gonna mom is asking me you know our kids are kissing I said well I got a son you got a daughter you may want to stop your daughter but I'm not gonna stop my son so she's like well guys guys no stop stop they don't even though it's going on. So you need to have the conversation with kids early today.

50:37I remember having a conversation with my boys when they were six and five in the shower and I said, okay, we need to have this conversation together. What's that? Okay, stand up. That's your dangling. That says dangling. This is my dangling. Only you get to play with your dangling. One day you're gonna find a girl that's gonna play with your dangling. Till then, God gave you that dangling for only you to play with your dangling. Now you gotta see how they're looking to be by the way. They're looking at me like this and my wife leaves quickly. She's like, this is on Casa baby, you can leave. So we have that conversation.

51:07I think you need to have the conversation today because most parents are on Middle Eastern. They don't have those types of conversations. No one's talking about sex and condoms and all this kind of stuff. You need to start early, but the dating scene today very, very different than what it was when I was single. If I wanted to go day to day and find a wife, my approach would be very different than what most people are doing today. Very different. We'll get back to talking to Patrick in one minute, but first I need to tell you about Shopify. Shopify is the e -commerce platform revolutionising businesses all over the world.

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52:12If you are someone who is looking to start a business online, Shopify is the only place to go. They are a one -stop shop to create your business. So if you're looking to take your business to the next level, you can sign up for a $1 per month trial period right now by going to the link in the description below or heading to shopify .com slash modern wisdom in all lower case that shopify .com slash modern wisdom. You say to be impressed by the right things and you just suggested it that as well. What are the right things? What should people be impressed by? In what area? In relationship? No, in life.

52:47In life. What is it that people are miscellaneously being impressed by? Okay. So your guy, Chase, right? Wherever Chase is. Okay. Right there. And then your, where is Dean? Dean, where's Dean? Dean is in the back. Okay, you're telling me about Dean and what Dean does. He's been with you two years, three years, four years. Six to 2 ,500 episodes. And how many? 700 episodes, two and a half thousand videos. 2 ,500 videos, 700 episodes. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Okay, what does that say about you? A lot. Okay, with somebody worse with you for six years, what are they going to learn about you? Your temper, your expectation.

53:22Hey, boys, are we ready? This is all standard and expectation that you have. That is a reflection of he likes working with you. Why does he like working with you? I don't know, but you do something right from to want to work with you. And then you tell me what you're doing with them, structure, that's private stuff that you told me. So you watch people, you watch values, principles, you watch how they treat people, you watch how people treat them, you watch how people respond to them, you watch how they are with powerful people. you watch how they are with regular average day -to -day people. You look for that.

53:57Today it's not the cars, the lambo, the ferraris, the houses, all that stuff. By the way, I'm a capitalist and I love all that stuff but I like that stuff because different reasons. I enjoy the game. I'm a kid. I'm turning 45 tomorrow. I'm 44 today for the last day. Tomorrow I'll be 45. But there's an element of childlike stuff that brings out the 14 -year -old kid when I look at a baseball card, I'm a kid when I look at a baseball card. The average person is like, who cares about baseball cards? That's a different element. But the relationships, the way they treat people, values and principles, what they value, you look for those types of things.

54:38And eventually enough will be revealed, the more you pay attention. That's one of the byproducts I think that is dangerous sometimes of people who play the game, that they get captured by the game and they forget that it is a game and they see the game as reality They don't realize that there is something which is supposed to be deep But which is hidden below the surface so I did Rogan's show last year And I listened back to the episode he said something on it that I really wanted to dig into and he listened back I listened back and and pulled this this really really powerful insight for me It was one of the most powerful things I learned last year and he said just because something is hard to obtain does not mean that it is valuable.

55:18Just because something is hard to obtain doesn't mean it's valuable. Correct. Yeah, just because it's difficult to get doesn't mean that it's valuable. Look at the car he's driving, look at the watch he's wearing, look at the girl he's with. These things were hard to obtain, so you presume that they were valuable, but you didn't realize that what's genuinely valuable are friendships and relationships and comfort and a confidence in yourself and peace of mind and insanity and being able to positively impact the people around you. So it got me thinking, I've been really sort of reflecting on this over the last year, and I did some research into the history of the Pineapple.

55:52So 1492 Christopher Columbus lands on the island of Guadalupe, and for the first time ever a Westerner sees a pineapple, and you look at it and it's kind of a royal fruit. It's got this stupid crown on its head, and he writes in his journal, he describes the taste of a pineapple. If you've never had a pineapple before, blow your head off. You know, if you haven't got process I remember the first time I had a final. Sweet. It's insane. Of course. Anyway, they take a shipload, literally, back to the Prince of Spain, Prince Aragon II. Take this entire shipload back. One of them makes it that isn't rotten, and the prince is allowed to eat it.

56:29And again, it almost gets this sort of mythical quality to the pineapple. Very quickly, the British, quite rightly so, they start to see it as this symbol of opulence, right? They see it as this symbol of wealth. So they would parade pineapples around at dinner on a platter and they would use them over and over and over again. You could rent a pineapple right for the evening. This is the sort of house in which you might be able to see a pineapple, right? Castles had pineapple statues on the top of them. There would be fountains with pineapples at the front of someone's estate. And all of this occurred because of the scarcity of a pineapple.

57:07It was 8 ,000 pounds to get one pineapple. Wow. Right. That was the equivalent back then. 8 ,000 pounds. It was a symbol of privilege and opulence and wealth. And what it meant was that people really looked up to this one object. Then the French, a couple of hundred years later, they invent greenhouses. And that allows us to grow tropical fruits at higher climates, higher latitude. price drops. And guess what? No one starts parading the pineapple around anymore. The scarcity of it was largely determining the value of it. And that story and what I called Rogan's value difficulty conflation just because something is hard to obtain does not mean that it is valuable.

57:53Now I would argue that a pineapple is valuable no matter how hard it is. It's like a dialed fruit no matter how difficult it is to get a hold of. But I really love that insight because I think that it shows how non -valuable but difficult to obtain things get slipped into our desires. I see that particular expensive possession that intrinsically I don't actually care about. Maybe I've never been a watch guy. Maybe I've never been a shoes guy. Maybe I've never been a car guy. But I want it. I want it because it's hard to get. Okay, well what if there is a quicker route toward fulfillment? What if there is a more direct path?

58:29Because there are some Some people out there for whom keeping up with the Joneses and materialism is an inbuilt part of their life. But I can say as someone that doesn't have that bone in my body particularly, that for me material possessions, they don't make a massive difference to my quality of life. I like nice things. I like to fly business. I like a nice house and blah, blah, blah. But there's people who are tuned into that, right? Maybe it's their upbringing, their genetic predisposition, whatever, whatever, whatever. But I think that people should be very cautious. Why is it that I'm chasing this thing?

58:56Am I chasing this thing because it's something which is valuable? Am I chasing it simply because it's something that's difficult to get? Yeah, that's a, by the way, very good story. And a great quote, I remember in Iran, pineapple is on anus. That's how we say it. We say on anus. And anybody in Iran who had pineapple, you were rich. Two things, pineapple and banana, and Iran. Only rich people have pineapple and banana. Two good fruits. Yeah, two good fruits. And then I go to Germany and bananas are everywhere. But the first time I had pineapple, I had it in the States. I couldn't believe we were having pineapple.

59:27I thought we were rich when we had pineapple. I said mom are we finally ready? We made it. We made it. We retired on a pineapple. We retired. Yeah. Yeah. I was on an awesome. I remember I was in ninth grade. First time ever we went and ate at Sizzlers. I thought we had made it. I'm like guys you will not believe what restaurant I don't know if you know Sizzlers, but Sizzlers in US is not a fancy restaurant. I thought we made it because we ate at Sizzlers. Yeah, you know, it's a I used to think And you know, this whole concept of people who are too much about fancy things. It's kind of like, well, look at this guy.

1:00:01All he cares about is money. All he cares about is fancy things. All he cares about is these cars and life with the rich and famous and all this other stuff. Eventually, I realized not everybody is driven by the same thing. All I care about that's something that drives you. Okay, my old son could care less. You know what he wants for a car? His favorite car? A Jeep. That's his dream car. My daughter says I want a white Ferrari, okay? And I said, who do you think is gonna buy that for you? Well daddy, you're gonna buy, I said, I'm not buying you a white Ferrari, you're gonna buy yourself a white Ferrari.

1:00:30Dylan wants a complete different car. My oldest son, you know what is absolutely a great day for him? Outside, in the dirt, plain with lizards, catching animals, plain with dogs and cats, that's an incredible day. By the way, he's been like that since eight months, nine months. My youngest son, 10 years old, first time I take him to my barber to get a haircut, and one of the girls at this place, they give massages at the end when he get the haircut. My oldest son says, don't touch my back. Don't touch me. He would go like this. He's like, gonna, that, I don't tell her to not to touch me, right?

1:01:05But my 10 -year -old son, it was five at the time. She's like, can you also massage me over here? Oh, he likes to find the things in life. He likes to find her things in life, right? My oldest son loves dogs. He loves animals. My youngest son, don't get on my bed. Get off my bed. My oldest someone's a dog right next to him. The youngest son doesn't want any of the dogs next to him. And his dad loves dogs. I love animals, right? So I'm not, I'm not, you know, I think Joe specializes in doing the hard. If there's anybody that specializes in doing the hard as Joe, you kid me like Joe's enamored by doing the hard, but also Joe's learned to be so self -aware of himself, to know what he likes.

1:01:45I said, Joe, what do you think about sports? Is I know nothing about sports? I don't mind sports. The only thing I watch is UFC. Joe, now that you're getting all these eyeballs, what's your vision? What if we can do this pat? The only thing I want to do is I just want to do podcasts. Yeah. I want to go hunt. I want to be my family. I want to do UFC. This is all I want to do. The level of clarity he has of where he's at props to him. Now, Dana White, slightly different. Dana's not worth a few hundred. Say he's worth to have a billion honors today. Why is he still driving? Why is he still pushing?

1:02:17Why is he still competing? Why is he still wanting to be number one? Who's his enemy? He drives running nice cars, likes to go to the casino, likes to be around with people, haven't found late night. Two different dynamics, two different personalities. Look at the organization they built with you. I mean, thinking of someone who chooses their enemies, tactically, Dana is not someone who shy of a fight. He loves it. You know, if you were to think of a C -sweet level fighter, Dana White is pretty well. I mean, the crop. Yeah, you've spent a good bit of time sort of orbiting that whole crew of people.

1:02:48What have you learned from your insights about the UFC and sort of what that says about Dana? Oh, listen, what I'm about to say about Dana is some people are not going to like it, but I'm going to say it anyways. UFC is what UFC is because of Dana White. You can sit there and talk about all these fighters and yeah, but you know if it wasn't for this guy If it wasn't for that guy if it wasn't for what this person did and that but totally get it listen different players come and go right totally understand Dana has made it about the sport he never made it about the fight He never made it about one fighter.

1:03:29He is very Quick to call out anybody. It doesn't matter if it's the number one guy in the leaky'll call him out John Jones He'll call a conner if he screws up, but he'll back him up to the highest level. He'll say that was some stupid shit He did he'll sit there straight up tell you what he likes what he doesn't like But everybody learned during COVID he was the number one commissioner in all of sports every commissioner in America caved MBA caved NFL caved MLB caved every Commissioner caved except for one guy who had brass balls called Dana White who said I don't give a shit, we're going to find a place to do the fight.

1:04:09So during COVID, you know what's the only sport the world watched? We watched UFC. No one's watching a freaking football game with no fans out there in cardboards. What am I going to do with cardboards? Oh no, we're going to watch. Hey, you can buy this seat for your face to be on the basketball game. Who gives a shit? It was the most boring finals, Lakers, whatever. There shouldn't even deserve to have won that final. There was no audience, nobody, boon against you. But everybody realized, here's Dana as a commissioner, then as everybody else. You're not at his level. He's a wartime leader as well as a peace time leader.

1:04:40He's learned how to balance and boost each moving together. He said something in an interview, it says, listen man, maybe it's just a fact that I'm getting old and I'm getting soft, but I have a hard time seeing what's going on with some of these guys. And you know, in the way his personal life, when he went through that crisis and the way he put it, he says, you want me to be embarrassed? How much more embarrassed do you want me to be? You know how embarrassing it is to talk to my wife and my kids? You know how embarrassing that is? This is nothing compared to how embarrassing to have to face my kids.

1:05:06You respect that. You love that. There's a degree of clarity, especially to Dana that is very rare. And I think that one of the things that UFC's done is make boxing particularly feel so antiquated and pedestrian. And the fact that KSI almost speed time if you're, you know how bad that would have been for boxing? That's not good. That's not good. But KSI does not represent UFC either. He doesn't, but what would have happened if a YouTuber would have beaten a professional boxer with a last name of Fury, it's humiliating. Correct. And many people would have said he could have won on the points, but what was it that you said you made some comparison about jockeys and horses to do with Dana White?

1:05:52Yes, I made the analysis with Elon Musk, where you either bet that on the, oh, this thing goes with Dana White as well. Yeah, yeah. So you got the Jackie and the horse, okay? You got Dana White is the Jackie, the horse is UFC. Elon Musk is the Jackie. Tesla is the horse, okay? So if tomorrow Elon Musk resigned from Tesla, Tony do Twitter, what happens to Tesla? It's gonna be disturbing for a lot of investors because a lot of people bought Tesla because it's Elon Musk. A lot of people are selling Tesla and getting rid of their cars like AOC. It's Elon Musk ever since about Twitter. Double -edged sword.

1:06:34Yeah, it's a double -edged sword. But to me, in a perfect world is if you can have both. I think you have seen a great product, phenomenal product, a dicting product, a viral product. But Dana White is an incredible jockey. Do you remember someone brought up? I think it was Israel and the Sanya had been using the N word and it's at the press conference. I mean, it must be fun for the press, you know, to sit down and Dana sits down and goes, all right, guys, what's going on? The gate tonight was, we broke this, he would fight at the night and then he just looks up and someone asks him a question and he just says what he thinks.

1:07:11You know, he doesn't say something that the media team has prepped him on. Although I'm sure he's got training and he understands the boundaries, but nothing feels prescribed, manufactured, conceited, nothing contrived, nothing feels like that. It just feels like this is what the guy thinks. Someone I saw this on the internet, someone had talked about many organizations and YouTubers at the moment are trying to speed run authenticity, right? They're trying to growth hack relatability. How can I make myself seem more authentic and relatable than I actually am? Obviously, it's kind of a self -defeating prophecy, which is that the only way to be authentic is to be authentic.

1:07:55And there's a degree of trust. I mean, Dana, dude, the start of this year was rough for him. Him and his misses got into a scuffle and it got videoed and it was maybe like New Year's Eve or something like, oh, January 1st. Guess I was starting 2020 before the worst way possible. And he comes out and you have faith that you go, yeah, this guy meant what he said. I don't think that there's any demons lurking in the closet because I may regret saying that at some point in future, but I don't think that I'm going to need to because I just have faith that I'm not a Dana Whitech. I don't have stock in Dana White.

1:08:28I just am a good judge of character and I see in him someone that seems to tell the truth more often than not and seems to be very open and honest and own his mistakes and people love that. People really, really like that. So yeah, it makes him incredibly likeable. made authenticity at the highest level. That brand is a very authentic brand. He's had his enemies. He's had the people that have challenged him and given him a hard time, but Dana in a past life could have been a gangster. Maybe he was, but he could have been a gangster. He could have ran a family. That's how Dana is. He could have been, Dana is almost not a mob boss of a Gambino family or Genevise or Colombo, Dana's more the guy that ran the commission like Ilucciano.

1:09:16That's Dana. And to be that guy, there is no book you can read to be that. You can read 40 lots of power a hundred times. You can't be that guy. You either are that guy, you're not that guy. Big boss energy. Dana is that guy. Dana's that guy. One of your quotes is when you're winning, you're not as good as you think you are. When you're losing, you're not as bad as you think you are. What does that mean to you? both of them lie. You know, both of them exaggerated. You know, both of them are when you're winning, everybody is telling you how amazing you are. Oh my God, let me tell you, you know what?

1:09:52You're the best. You're amazing. You know, you're just better than that guy and you're better than this guy. And it always takes me back to that quote of Marcus Aurelius who had a slave that would sit behind them and always whisper to them, hey, you're just a man. You're just a man. You're just a man. That's right. 40 laws of power, right? You're just a man. You're just a man. You're just a man. And then he would get up and he became the best emperor, what? 62 AD to 69, whatever the time is. And he becomes, so he becomes. And we read about him now. You pick up the book, meditations. You're like, this is like mandatory reading for anybody.

1:10:30What is this all about? Right? You know simple book not that big you can read the public consumption No, it's not it's not and you're going through it saying what was this about then you Google what did he mean by this? Wow, I don't think about it that way so and when you're losing Everybody tells you I told you shouldn't have done that. I knew you were not gonna make it Yeah, I told you it wasn't for you. You weren't that guy and you believe that as well So both of them are are lying for me politically politically, I'm a capitalist, hardcore capitalist. I fully am a capitalist to the core. I think the free market will create solutions to problems.

1:11:11I think the free market is going to filter out all the fakers in pharma, in finance, in podcasting, in sports, in real estate, in insurance. It takes two decades, but it will filter people out. It's not, it's got zero sympathy for you. It doesn't care to befriend, you can give capitalism as many compliments as you want. He doesn't feel it. He has no emotions. You can't flatter capitalism. All he's interested in is results. Are you good enough? Can you ask any recreators of great? But when it comes on to politics, I want to hear both sides. Okay, I'm a Christian, but I held a podcast four weeks ago.

1:11:49I brought two Muslims and I brought two Christians. And I had them go at it for two hours discussion because my conversation was more about, okay, We agree on seven different things. We disagree on seven different things. But you agree on 23 different things. Can we figure out a way to make this work? Why do you feel the way you do? Why do you feel the way you do? And they go back and forth, and your sinners say, okay, interesting. Today, Israel, Palestine, with what's going on with Hamas, complicated, lots of issues. You know, on one end, the question is where pro -Israel, where folks are going back and forth, you know, I'm a pro -Israel guy.

1:12:27I'm from Iran. When I lived in Iran for 10 years, Iran was safer when Res up Alavi was there because they were strong and that allies with everybody. And Israel was safe. The Middle East was safe. You could go and say, you know what Patrick, next week, you know where I'm going? Where are you going? I'm going to Tehran Iran because Frank Sinatra is performing there. I want to do a podcast with Frank Sinatra. I said, you're doing a podcast with Frank Sinatra and Tehran Iran is sick. You would have been able to say that in 76 and 75. So the Middle East was fairly peaceful, not perfect, but it was peaceful.

1:13:02But at the same time, you know, you got to ask the question, how did Israel with the best intelligence, Masad, not know that for one year Hamas was training for this? How did you not know that they wouldn't build a city similar to the one that you have entrained on how to break into homes and take hostages? You didn't know that? you really didn't know that. And intelligence gave you a report from here, from Egypt, but you didn't know that. It's a fair question to ask, but when he asked that question, guess what people say? What kind of a question is that? This is not the time to ask that question.

1:13:37Do you realize what they're doing to kids? I don't support it. I'm not supporting any of that stuff. Then I got another question, because Palestinians said, that's exactly right. This was intentional by Israel. They know what I asked Palestinians, and they also don't know this question. Here's a question. If you're so peaceful, who knows more about Palestinians? Us, who live in America, or UK, or your neighbor? If you live in a condo, or if you live in a house, and you've been living in this house for five years, or 10 years, you have a neighbor on this side, you have a neighbor on this side. You know, when they do barbecues, you know, how much they drink, you know, who in which end -laws comes in, you know, the sun when he sneaks in the girlfriend, I want a clock in the morning, You know the daughter when she sneaks out and changes her skirt and gets into a car with that bad boy and goes out And that's what she does and she comes back at four o 'clock.

1:14:25You know your neighbors. You see all their mess, Kai If if Palestine And Gaza's filled with so many peaceful people. Why is Egypt not taking them as refugees to go to Egypt? Egypt knows a lot about you. Why is it only 800 people? Why are they not letting a million people come to you? So somebody might say, what a shameful question for you to ask. How dare you ask the question? I think both questions need to be asked. What you do with it is up to you, okay? So for me, this whole concept of, when you're winning, don't believe the hype, when you're losing, don't believe the hype. Whatever story even your own side is saying, why don't you be skeptical, a little bit of question for yourself and see if you can entertain both ideas?

1:15:09I want to find ways to entertain both ideas as much as possible because I find myself have become sharper when I do that, and I eliminate blind spots. Anytime I'm 100 % one -side, I have way too many blind spots. Well, get back to talking to Patrick in one minute, but first I need to tell you about fountain life. Here's a crazy statistic. Nearly 70 % of heart attacks occur without any prior symptoms. Simply put, the human body is really good at hiding disease, and this is where fountain life comes in. They provide top of the line health snapshots, vetted therapeutics, and a team of longevity physicians so that you can live a longer, healthier, and more vital life.

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1:16:29The silence is violence, crowd. Your silence is deafening. Why haven't you come out in support or against this group or that group? Is it an obligation for us all to have a take on everything? If the background has to do anything with you, I think you are obligated to talk about it. Meaning if you're Jew, I think you have to. If you're Palestinian, you have to. If you're a Muslim, I think you have to because it's your community, it's your pride, it's your background. If you're a political show and you've spoken about Ukraine and Russia, and you've touched that topic, why are you not touching this topic?

1:17:05Now, I don't know if you have. If you're honest, no, no, no to all of the above. Then guess what that means. Then you're consistent. So no, you don't have to. If you've been consistent with all of it, you don't have to talk about it. That's not what the show is about. You could simply say, you want to hear that show? Go to Ben Shapiro. Well, what people are saying, they're not saying why haven't you commented? Specifically what they're saying is what they want. What they're saying is why haven't you said the thing that supports the stance that I want each time for each of them? No, why haven't I commented on it at all?

1:17:36I mean, listen, there's a lot of events in the world that if you want to have to comment on all of them, we don't have a life. You would have to do 12 -hour podcasts to cover everything on a daily basis. No. But this is a once in 50 -years type of crisis that could lead to a World War III. Numbers came yesterday where Ray Dalio, I don't know if you've sat down with Ray Dalio. Okay, so you know who Ray Dalio is, he's a 20 -billion -dollar man, built an incredible company. I had them on as well. Ray Dalio, yesterday said, the chance of World War III is officially at 50%. And Jamie Diamond, yesterday said, these are the most dangerous times we're living in decades.

1:18:15Okay. So one may say, well, you get tens of millions of eyeballs. You're no longer somebody that gets back in the days. Your first show when you did were 220 people watch it, a mom and dad didn't watch it, your siblings didn't watch it, best friends didn't watch it. No, now you're getting. Well, that's the interesting question, right? Whether somebody with a sufficiently large platform is obligated to comment on things simply because they have a large platform. And you ask why, whether I have and why I haven't, if I haven't, I found out about the incidents that we're going on in the Middle East on Twitter two days after they happened, and I wondered why hammers was trending.

1:18:55and I thought, what the fuck's hammers? Oh, fuck, that's Hamas. That was two days after everything had happened. By this time, I'd already had texts from people saying, dude, like, you're gonna do an episode on this and I was like, bro, the requisite amount of understanding for me to be able to add an educated opinion to this topic is not one that I have time to do. I mentioned to you, early wrong, we've been traveling, we were in LA, we were there for two days, all I did, all I've done for the last week is travel, sleep, research and record. and I've researched very specific guests. I haven't been researching stuff about the Middle East.

1:19:27So that's all I've had time to do. Is it not the precise problem that people who do not know what they're talking about have given cod psychology insights way outside of their domain of expertise and just added to the noise rather than adding to the signal? And yet there is a group of people on the internet that would say, no, but this is so important to me that it's something that should move aside the other things that you're doing in life. And I think a final element of this is people who are chronically online cannot understand what it's like to not be chronically online. I am chronically online for periods and then I am chronically traveling around and researching and recording and going from hotel to hotel, coming out to Florida.

1:20:13This is one of those periods during which there's a lot of reading that needs to be done to make a comment, to contribute to something that lots of people who are better educated than me can do. It's the same reason I didn't comment on COVID. COVID was something that was happening. We did a couple of episodes explaining how we felt people could better work from home, some mental health tools that we thought that they could use, some strategies that they could do to improve their time blocking and some stuff like that. Here's how we would design your homework station. I'm like, if you want me to comment and just throw horseshit at the wind.

1:20:49I can do it, but I don't think that it's gonna benefit anything. So yeah, there's this compulsion, this obligation, I think, that certain groups on the internet feel anybody that comments on things should get themselves involved with. And it's just... Are you surprised? No, no, no, no. Because what they want, but again, they don't want you to comment. They want you to support that side. No, that's a different story. That's a different story. There's a difference between commenting and supporting, right? I'm not, if I comment, I'm giving you my thoughts and I'm going to share with you my, you know, opinion, thoughts on my life experience, on what I think is going on.

1:21:34And then from there, agree or disagree. For the people who are asking you to contribute, if your thoughts and your life experience led you to implicate one side rather than the other. Sound like you were being more generous to one side rather than the other. They would very quickly say, I wanted you to comment, but I didn't want you to say that. They would very quickly have an issue. Is that your brand, though? Is your brand of 700 episodes, 2500 clips, is your brand given opinion on current events? Have you done that in the past? Because here's what happened. So in the market, you know how in Hollywood, they say this guy's a triple threat.

1:22:13What's a triple threat? Act, sing, dance. Okay. In podcasting, there's also triple threats. Okay. What's a triple threat? A great interviewer, which you are, but that's one of three. Two is perspective and opinion, which Joe Rogan is. People want to hear what Joe has to say about this. And then three is entertain. Can you entertain me while you're giving me your perspective or asking questions where I'm kind of like, ah, ah, ah, ah, ah, ah, man, I was funny as hell. So Joe, the reason why Joe is number one is because Joe's great host, we want to hear his perspective or agree or disagree. He has the conviction and the confidence to give a sight and be willing to change.

1:23:00Hey, one minute you're voting for Bernie Sanders. four years later you're saying to save America, you got a vote for Trump and Republican. What? What are you talking about, right? So then three is he entertains you, he makes you laugh. Your brand, you have to take the risk whether you want to go to two. I don't think you need to comment on absolutely everything. If Joe was to be asked what do you think of Aaron Rodgers most recent Achilles rupture? As you said earlier, that's not a, but there's a different story with that. You asked about consistency earlier on you train Russia didn't comment on Covid didn't comment on that's your brand then but by the way what you just said is Your perspective absolutely, but it's a meta perspective on what's going on?

1:23:46You're not gonna piece everybody to look I'm Armenian and a Syrian okay, so now I was born in Iran So here's where I'm screwed. I'm a half Armenian half a Syrian born in Iran and I'm an American okay So when enforcement of the apocalypse? Oh my god So whenever something happens with our median genocide, I have to within a second comment on it. Okay, and I do but now within a second because I don't have intel. So when you're talking about your days What it looks like research all that stuff? You're telling the truth But I'm running nine companies and I got a wife and I got four kids and I'm Transitioning with another company and I'm doing research on a podcast and I'm doing the interviews And I'm running a tech startup and I'm running a consulting firm with clients that are traveling worldwide to come to us And I'm doing our best to kind of see what's going on with stories.

1:24:30Yeah, there's going to be days you just don't have time. And the audience can't understand it, cannot understand it, right? That's the decision they got to make. So, Assyrians, hey, did you see what happened at that theater? When are you going to come and at this wedding that just took place? And 100 people were dead and a place caught on fire and these people... Okay, great. Let me get some intel in and I'll comment on it. And then I did, you know, or Iran or, you know, but the natural part where I would take it as a compliment is the audience is leaning on you to see how you would assess this issue and they trust the way you reason.

1:25:06And nowadays there's not enough people who are able to reason to give a different perspective because they simply don't trust mainstream media. But then the next step is do you want to take the risk of going in that side if your brand is not on COVID, not on Ukraine, not on this, then you're staying consistent. I think largely the main lesson I learned, I learned this from Douglas Murray, is that there are a lot of people in the online space who do not have expertise within a particular domain and have it in another one. They have expertise within psychology or climate change or whatever it might be.

1:25:38And then they start thinking to themselves, well, why shouldn't my thoughts on the Ukraine be important to people? Why everybody thinks that my insights about climate change are absolutely wonderful. and they start to get out over the skis outside of their domain of competence. If you want to talk about my domains of competence, I'll comment on it. For me, there are people out there who are capable, prepared to do the work, have the time, and have the expertise. I don't think that the internet needs more noise. I think it needs more signal, and I would be contributing nothing short of noise if I did that.

1:26:12I'm also just not passionate about learning about this topic, And I understand that in order for me to give the For me to meet the bar of evidence and insight that I would want to to feel proud about my opinion I need to be passionate about it. Right. I need to be compelled to learn about life Of course, Sam Would you like to live 200 years old? Yes, okay So do many of your listeners because the feedback you give Has to do with living a great life because people are watching the life you're living The only thing I would encourage you to consider from the audience side is this is a different crisis.

1:26:52This crisis, if reasonable people like you can find a way to lower the overreaction that people are having with everything that's out there, I would say you would actually contribute to lowering the overreaction community. So I'm simply complimenting you to consider the fact that people are looking to see how a reasonable person like you that can give a logical perspective because that's what's missing today. And when a Ray Dalio, when a Jamie Diamond, when many of these guys are saying 50 % and you with your millions of people who listen to you can, and it's not a niche audience where it's in one country or two countries.

1:27:36Your audience is worldwide, 100 plus countries, you got people listen to you. I think maybe from that level, the feedback from the audience could be, this is not a regular issue. We'd like to hear your thoughts. And then whether you choose to do it or not, it's your prerogative and we move on. Yeah, you've got a... You mentioned there about this sort of loss of faith in our institutions, right? The previous gatekeepers, the people that we would have relied on to tell us what, what in the world. What do you think about this rising skepticism? There is also a degree of conspiratorial thinking, heterodox cynicism around what we're being told.

1:28:16Is this leaving a vacuum where people's uncertainty is making their lives worse? What is going to happen from a sense -making? How do people make sense of the world when we can't trust the information communicators. Well, that's the that's why they want to hear from you. So what you're saying is is validating their point. So in America today, we are at the lowest levels we've ever been for Americans trusting mainstream media and trusting the government, not one or the other, the lowest in both. We don't trust the government, we don't trust mainstream media. The last time the people trusted mainstream media and the government, the highest, was right before Kennedy died.

1:28:55After that, that was at 72%. It's gone from 72, 65, 60 down to today, 27%. People simply don't trust the mainstream media to give feedback on what's really taking place. There's a reason why Rogan gets more eyeballs on his show than all these guys combined. And people are watching to see what he has to say. There's a reason why Shapiro gets the eyeballs, he gets. There's a reason why you get the eyeballs. There's a reason Why all these other guys get the eyeballs is because they won't hear a different perspective. You know, we're going back to the story where you know, this quote's been criticized many times.

1:29:32It's not really true. You know, Amateurs built, you know, professionals built a Titanic. Amateurs built the arc, you know, this whole story that they go back and forth. Professionals run mainstream media. Amateurs run podcasting. But the world is trusting amateurs running podcasting more than the people that build the Titanic. Because a lot of people think mainstream media is about to sink like the Titanic dick. Now, whether it did or not, who knows? But people want to talk to somebody just a regular guy. Says, what's your story? What do you think about this? What are your thoughts on this? Do you really agree?

1:30:04Do I, does anybody else feel, I kind of feel that way? Is well, I'm a little bit skeptical. I'm a little bit worried about this. What's going on? Is it really as big as they make it out to be? Should I trust these guys? Should I'm not surprised as it's taking place? By the way, you know what's the only thing that's keeping mainstream media in business. It's only a couple of things that keep a mainstream media in business. Number one is 75 year olds, 70 75 year olds are keeping mainstream media in business. Okay. So that's another 10 to 15 years before that generation is no longer here. That audience has gone.

1:30:35Number two is big pharma. If two countries in a world that allow big pharma companies to advertise, it's US and New Zealand. Every only two countries in the world where pharmaceutical companies like Pfizer that can advertise is US and New Zealand. Everywhere else, there is no commercials on TV. Do you realize what would happen if a president did an executive order, got Congress everybody in it to say moving forward, big pharma can no longer advertise on mainstream media. You know what happens the next day? Every one of them goes out of business and all these talented guys at ESPN or at CNN or Fox or ABC that are getting the 5, 10, 15, 20 million dollar contract.

1:31:19Gone. 80 % of revenue's gone. And a lot of these guys and they have to go and try to make it in the world that you're making it. And this is all what you're doing is hard. There's not a teleprompter behind me. There's nobody whispering in your ears what to say. Follow up with this question. This is all you doing it, right? To them, hey, ask him this. Follow up with this. We just found data. 63%. He's lying. Follow up with this. Did you watch any of the late night hosts when they tried to do a podcast between them? Yes. What did you think from a professional perspective? A amateur professional perspective.

1:31:51There's a reason why they can't do anything without writers. You know, they, I mean, don't get me wrong. To me, Fallon is a very talented guy, a very talented guy. And you're not going to get to that job without having talent. These guys got a lot of talent. They're workers. But the moment writers are done, you mean to tell me for May 12th, you guys can't do an episode until what? October, which they just started with two weeks ago, you realize writers control this world. Now the writers are worried that Chad GBT can write the jokes of what's going on and what if AI can pop out these, you know, jokes and what could take place.

1:32:24No, this game is a very, very hard game. This is not an easy game. Think about what Spotify did. What other president in the last 20 years has been as popular as Obama?

1:32:39And let me Kingston start a podcast and Spotify drops on what? Who else has been more popular in the last 20 years on television than Kim Kardashian with 300 million followers on Instagram? Spotify signs a podcast with their Dende Dropper? What? Who else has been more on TV and every magazine newspaper than Harry and Megan? but Spotify dropped their podcast and hasn't fully, it's like we're not renewing the contract. And then they give Rogan a few hundred. Wait, what? So let me get to straight, just be in famous, doesn't help to have a podcast. No, wow. I thought it was just about fame. No, this is hard.

1:33:22This is an art. This is very difficult to do. It's not easy to do. So if mainstream media sinks like the Titanic, 90 % of that talent is going to disappear and they're not going to know what to do. 90 % of them. It's not any again. Does this mean, does this contribute to complicity or those commentators and all of the other people whose wages ultimately are paid for by those adverts? Does this create a perverse incentive for them? In what way? that they may be prepared to compromise something they truly think to not jeopardize the people that ultimately pay their wages, that there is a risk to them saying something out of turn which may...

1:34:12I mean, are you really asking that question or you know the answer to that question? You already know the answer, you're smart guy. Yeah. Now of course, they have to, they don't have a choice to take that position, right? I'll give you an idea. Chris Cuomo was on CNN for God knows how many years, and it was a number one guy for two or three years. What does CNN do to Chris? Firet, his brother, Andrew Cuomo governor, fired, and then he's got $125 million pending lawsuit against CNN, and now CNN folks can't talk to Chris, I had him on the podcast, and for the longest time Cuomo was hated by a lot of people on the right, absolutely hated, because of the stuff you would say, where is Jesus?

1:34:50Is Jesus going to come and save you with COVID? What's Jesus going to do for you? and all this stuff he would say, right? Well, he came on a podcast, and I'm with one of my partners in Dallas, he's a billionaire himself in the insurance, but he's the number one power player in insurance, where at his office, corner office in the time, when the sickest office you'll see in your life, like 68 floors, overlooking all of Dallas, Brian, and he says, you know, it's kind of weird watching Cuomo on your podcast. That's why. He says, he sounded different. You know, those moments where I kind of liked them when I was watching this.

1:35:26And this is not a guy I can say something like that with. You know how many people said that? What happened to him? He's now a free agent. He's got a shirt he sells that's called free agent. He's got a podcast that says, you know, what's something quomo project that he's got a podcast. And how does he dress like you? We're with them a couple weeks going in what he called it in Sag Harbor in up in that entire area whatever that area is I forget the name Sagaponic, Sag Harbor all that stuff and We'll go to his house my kids are running on the back. He's a Pat somebody wants to talk to you So who's that face time?

1:36:06It was like this like oh shit. What's up Robert Downey Jr. How you doing? So I'm having a conversation with him But forget about talking to Robert Downey Jr., I wanted to see my kids reaction, especially my two boys, because my boys, when he died, my kids were devastated when he dies. Ironman dies in, you know, in the... Do you know what today is in the Marvel Cinematic Universe? Today is the canonical death day of Tony Stark when he clicks his fingers. Today is the day, the date. Get out of here. Today is the date. I did not know that. What is the chance of me bringing up the sword? I don't even know that story So I say Dylan Tico come here.

1:36:47So daddy will run around with the dogs. I said trust me come here and Chris turns the camera around he goes like this my son was oh My god I know you and the other son Tico his reaction Dylan's reaction You know you love Robert Downey's one of those guys that you absolutely love when you go back to his journey I was talking to about the movie that my dad and I watched 30 years ago only you and And the only movie I've ever watched, four hours, two hours and two back to back in a row was judge, despite Robert Downey Jr. What's the moral of the story? The moment Chris Koma was free, and he didn't give a shit, he just kind of told you what he was going to go on through.

1:37:28Would you like it or not? You may not agree with everything, but he's finally free. A lot of these guys working on mainstream media, they're not free. I mean, now see, Tucker's transition. And guess what? He's killing it. Okay. I love a more hatom when Tucker puts on a show. Everybody's watching what this guy's got to see. So I found out from the guys that light and tech, all of this stuff that we're doing here who understand very, very, very closely what's going on. But was it anamorphic lenses? Is that what they shot Tucker's first thing in his garage with? Yeah, so anamorphic lenses, a very particular type of lens, very particular type of shooting, very short, wide.

1:38:08So it has the image of, maybe it was his garage or something like that, or a living room with the background behind him, make no mistake. That is lit and shot in cinema quality, right, with the facade of it being a sort of low budget thing, right? So it's this beautiful... Yeah, it's beautiful. It's on an iPhone. Yeah, precisely. It's this beautiful blending of both. Yeah. And that's exciting. I think it's exciting to see what these guys do. And also, you know, I love this about, given that we spend so much time talking and people have this concern about whether or not someone's gaming the system, are they trying to growth hack relatability, right?

1:38:47Or authenticity? Seeing, I would be lying if I said that I didn't take an amount of pleasure to see late night hosts that have got massive platforms, struggle to hold a conversation together for an hour over Zoom. Because that is ultimately the battle place of ideas, right? It's not how well can you read a script from a teleprompter. I mean, there is skill, absolutely skill in being able to do that, and I couldn't. I couldn't do the writing, I couldn't do the performance, I couldn't do the bits and the blah, blah, the music. But largely, you are a marionette, right, that's being ventriloquized by a handful of writers and execs.

1:39:26Ultimately, seeing what you can do when the gloves are off is more interesting to me. This is very hard. This is very hard because how long is your average podcast? Hour and a half. Okay. So an hour and a half of keeping people's interest with no breaks and nobody talking to you and touching up the makeup, to them, what are you talking about? That is absolutely insane to do something like that. No, this is very hard and the market is proven that this isn't for everybody. The market is proven You cannot keep my attention for that long. This is very very difficult when when people started saying I remember I hired a Marketing expert, you know 13 years ago 14 years ago he came in and so well studies have shown You're making one of the mistakes you're making on YouTube your videos are about 12 minutes long And the only videos that do well is 12 minutes after 12 minutes that I said nah man I'm doing 42 minutes, 28 minutes, hour and 20 minutes.

1:40:22That's a mistake. Number one thing we have to do is no video can go past 13 minutes. Like do it. Okay, and maybe discuss the expertise, hold this company for a couple million. You know what happened? The day we fired him, 60 days later, our first video goes viral and gets 40 million views. Today it's got a half a billion views. Okay, for the life of an entrepreneur, 90 seconds, takes off, right? And we start making other clips and other videos and other stuff. And EC Joe takes it to a whole different level. Three hours and you got Lex Friedman takes a toll different level four hours three hours and 48 minutes, you know, yeah, well Lex does he did seven hours with Bellagy Glutton for punishment Yeah, you you tweeted something that I thought was quite interesting you said why do so many people who come to the America from other countries with little to no money at all With in ten years outpace the average person who was born here What is going on where Americans who have all of the, I'm an immigrant to this country, right?

1:41:26Many people who are given from the very beginning all of the benefits of being from this country. Why is it that they are outpaced by people who weren't born here? So six, seven months ago, I'm sitting with my state planner and one of the fears I have for the last 10 years is what I'm going to do with my kids with the wealth, with money, am I raising them in a way that they're not going to turn out being the, you know, the snobby, arrogant kid that, you know, I mean, I cannot, I never liked those kids in school. Those are the kids I got into fights, but I never liked those kids. So I don't want to raise those types of kids.

1:42:00And then you go and read these books about which families generationally created a wealth that state, like Vanderbilt raised a bunch of snops. So, Vanderbilt's money only lasted one generation. Generation later, there's no money left. So, when you read the story about that Anderson Cooper's of Vanderbilt, but his mother said, even though we are Vanderbilt, don't expect any kind of trust fund, baby, you ain't got no money here. Nothing's coming over, you got to make your money. You know, and but you look at the Medici family, and what they did, five, six, seven generation. What did they do differently?

1:42:31You look at Rockefeller still has the money. You look at some of these other families that kept the money within the family. What did they do? what the day structure and there's a state plan that we can go do, you know, 10, 15, 20, 50 ,000 dollars, then there's high guys you can hire that's $100 ,000, quarter million, a million dollars. But those estate planters want you hire. You know what they do? They interview your kids. So they go sit down with your kids and after they talk to you and they'll say, how do you want to set the stuff for the money with your kids? Who gets money? What do they need to do?

1:43:03What's the criteria? Are your kids to get this? What kind of cars do you not want them to buy to waste the money? Who do you want it to work for? What happens with this business? Can they lose all the money? Are you given equally? Here's what this family and they give you all these suggestions on how to properly set it up. Once you and your wife agree on what you want to do with that wealth, these guys have meetings with all your kids without you there. And they'll record it so you can see how the meeting went, but they're setting it up with them. So they'll say, okay, kids, this is on behalf of your parents.

1:43:35Here's a few things you need to know. Number one, the good news is your parents are very prepared on what they've done with you. And here's what you can get. Your parents have worked very hard and they have made a lot of money. And if you do it right, some of that can be passed over to you. But if you don't, you're not going to get it either. Let me go through some of these criteria. Ta -da -da -da. These three things you do, you're not going to get anything. These two things you do, blah, blah, blah, blah. If you do this, here's what's gonna happen. This is what they want us to use the money with.

1:44:03And then they kind of break it down to them. Now, you know how many families actually do that? Very few. Those conversations, most people don't have. Most people are so much about go, go, go, go, go, go, and then you die unexpectedly. Oh, we didn't set up the state planning. Let her on the detail of the state planning. No, okay, now your kids are spoiled, rot and doing what they're doing. I've had this conversation with a number of friends. Ben Francis, who was the CEO of Jim Shark, his net worth is triple Drake's. This is the start of a guy by the way. He's a serial student. I don't want the podcast couple of years ago.

1:44:31Start. Serious to. Yeah. I was talking to him and I think that it's the same with you. One of the things that you value the most in your upbringing have been the hard times, the spit and sawdust, lessons and rules, the school of hard knocks, right? It's given you the work rate that has permitted you to be able to achieve the success that you have and reverse, locally reverse entropy, right? so you've been able to wrangle your reality in a way that you wanted to. And yet, you have worked so hard to be able to give your kids opportunities that you never had. And yet, you know that they need to go through the hardships and that those are where the lessons are learned are going to be.

1:45:13This to me seems like a very interesting tension. Right. I want to give my kids opportunities with that I've worked so hard for. If I don't, what the fuck was the point in working so hard? And yet they need to go through the difficulty, they need to do how have you found this tension between the two? Well, that's a great question, but I want to finalize by making a point when you ask the question about why is it that so many people come to America within 10 years they have more money than the people that were born in America? Because unfortunately, the way we've ran America, if the American born kids are kids of these families, they're the kids of the families that spoiled them in America.

1:45:58There's no more earning things in America. Just handed out to them. We're printing money left and right. We're given away income to people left and right. We're making life easier. We're incentivizing the wrong things. Do you know in 1940 in America what percentage of kids were born to single mothers? In 1940, in America, what percentage of kids were born to a single mother who's not married would know father and the household. 4 % is the number. Did you know the number or no? It's 4%. You know what that number is today? Of a 50. It's over 40%. Shia 50%. You're right there at the number. You mean to tell me we went from 1944 % to today, so what happened there?

1:46:37First of all, policies by FDR, Social Security and the incentives of taking care of single mothers, then Lyndon Johnson in 1965 took it to hold there from level. Mothers are sitting there saying, the more kids I have, the more entitled programs I get. Great. Why would I get married? If I get married, I lose those benefits. The incentive programs America set up Totally screwed everything up. It incentivized the bad behaviors like tell on a kid Can you imagine if you're in the state planning you say for every kid you have not married? I'll pay you $700 Whose fault is that parents fault? Bad policies have consequences.

1:47:14Yeah, you create a bad policies What person in the right state of mind When they have their wealth, America's a family. It's a corporation. What person in the right mind would incentivize? What parents would incentivize kids to say, I'm gonna have more kids, and I'm gonna give you money out of the living trust. Nobody in the right mind would do that, but America did. So what happened to us? Now we got all this crime. Now we're paying the price for it because all these years there's no father in there to put them in their place, to challenge them, to straighten them up. That's not in place. You know, so that is a missing piece that these kids don't have in America.

1:47:48So to me, if we looked at America as a family, as a corporation, a state planning matters, you know, living trust matters, the right policies matters. Listen, I even think to the point where, you know how in America voting starts at 18 years old, I would much rather, this is a very strange policy I'm going to share with you. When I posted said this on YouTube. A lot of people very upset with me. I would much rather have somebody who's 14 and a half years old, who's had a job and paid a thousand dollars in taxes, vote, then a 28 year old kid who's never had a job, never paid taxes. I don't want that guy to vote.

1:48:32Why? Because he contributed to society, the 14 and a half year old kid, the 15 year old kid contributed to society and realize how hard it is to pay the taxes into whatever they're spending money on. You want to spend $100 billion to Ukraine, we could have built 20 walls. We could have built 20 walls with that money that was sent. You're not saying Ukraine I'm saying it. So you're safe. Don't worry. They're not going to come after you. They're going to come after me. So, all of these things that you look at were going away from earning. When an immigrant comes here, all they're looking at, say, wait a minute, I can go work this and do this and do this.

1:49:07and I'm going to earn this, yes. I'm going to town all day. I'm good with this. Many Americans don't have that mindset because bad policies have consequences and we're suffering the negative impact of that. But you asked the follow up question, right, with kids. And your question is how to balance it with challenge and them, yet still having the opportunity. What was the question you were asking? Yeah, the tension between you affording your kids, the benefits that all of your hard workers allowed them to do. And some greed. I'm very greedy. And here's what I mean by very greedy. I want my kids as close to me for the rest of my life.

1:49:43We have a family that lives in our community, messages about a house right next to our house, and he just moved into the community, he calls a lot of mayhem. It's all over the place, cops are coming in every week. We have, you know, what he call it, paparazzi craziness that's going on, but one of the families that lives in our community, they run a medical company with six, 7 ,000 employees. So the founders, the mom and dad, their houses here, right next door to the house. They have two sons. The other son lives here who's the chief marketing officer. They're all the sons houses here. Each son has four kids.

1:50:17Each son has four kids. Both sons are doctors. Both sons married someone who's a doctor and they each have four kids. They have a structure on what they do Monday nights. Every Tuesday night they have dinner together and they talk about God. Everyone's there's a system to everything they do. He'll call me and say, hey, we went fishing this morning. I got a bunch of fish. Can I drop it off to you? I am enamored by how those parents created that kind of a structure where their kids are respectful, their grandkids are respectful. We're going to Halloween. We're walking in Halloween, doing trickle -treating.

1:50:49And the sun comes by, 17 year old sun comes by. And he says, yeah, he doesn't have his iPhone with him. I said, how does he know it? Not have his iPhone with him. He says, in our family standards very easy. You want your phone? You got to have straight A's. He's got to be. I said, well, let me get to straight. Your 17 year old son doesn't have a phone because he doesn't have one because he has one B's is yeah, it's our standard. I said, what are you talking about? So it's very simple. You just got to make sure you got straight A's. You get a phone. You get the car. You get this. Now, somebody's going to listen to this and say, what?

1:51:21What a freaking extreme set of standards. That's tyranny. That's tyranny. That's exactly the topic is that end up becoming And that, no problem. It's called standards and expectations. And for a family who has the ability to use money and waste it and do whatever they want to keep that kind of standards, I respect that even more. And guess what? The son loves his father, loves his mother, loves their grandparents, respectful kids. So it's not easy to do. But if it matters to you eventually in my life when I say I'm greedy, I would love to create a proposition for my kids. We're 20 years from now.

1:51:54They want to run one of the companies. So I want to be with the company. They want to work with one of the companies. And I like them to look close to me. Will it happen? It's going to take us 30 years to find out because. Dude, pan generational housing. I'm seeing in Austin, right? Commun or ranch where someone's buying a pattern of land. And then there's another one of those puppies down there. If you want to, they're buying a pattern of land. And we're going to not just have us. We're going to have somebody else come and live with us as well. We're going to have grandma and grandpa. And they're going to be that this is the way that it was.

1:52:23This is the way that it was. And here's another thing to consider, right? Would you rather have? You're drinking too, gonna do anything to me or no. You're gonna survive. You're gonna be dialed in. You're gonna survive, I promise. Whatever the internet throws at you, you'll survive. So what is the, yeah, so we've got, that's citrus, that one's orange juice. It's some rice, yeah. Yeah, wild citrus. So one of the interesting questions that you have here would be,

1:52:53Would you rather have a parent who pities you more than they believe in you? You didn't do well. It's okay. That teacher doesn't understand. Let me pat you on the back. Come here, little Timmy. We'll take you for ice cream. Or would you rather have a parent who says, I believe in you more than I pity you? I mean, look, I'll tell you my dad. Very annoying man. Okay. Because never sympathize, never never felt sorry for anything. Never. It was always stanz than expectation, but he always loved me. So when I was six years old and my teacher asked me, what do you want to be when you grow up? I said, I want to be a father.

1:53:32Why? That's because I want to be like my dad. I had a very good dad. My dad still with us. He was in a hospital this week, but he's out. He's doing good. He's at the house. Kids love him. Everybody loves him. My kids all have a relationship with him. He's 81 years old. It took a lot to please my dad. My dad was an impressed by anything. think. He wouldn't be there and say, oh my gosh. And by the way, he's a Middle Eastern father, which means I've never played catch with the guy. We've never thrown a football. We never played anything. No sports. He just, he was a worker. Since eight grade, he dropped out in Iran and he started working to take care of his mom and dad.

1:54:05Their family was very, very close. You know, but again, remember how early you're on when we're talking about, you know, choosing your enemies wisely. We talked about how the top performers have a person that gave him unconditional love and one that brought a lot of pain and then they chose their enemies wisely. I think the role of a person that is gentle and another one that nothing's ever good enough is a great combination. I think if both parents are gentle, that's a problem. And I also think if both parents are nothing's ever good enough is also a problem. I think you need a little bit there's a reason why the creator, God, created the dynamics that he created.

1:54:53You know, I have one of our guys who are spending our photographers with us and he's holding his daughter while we're doing a photo shoot this Saturday and she keeps asking for mom. She keeps asking, she said, that is girl. Oh, it's all mommy. I said, when does she want you? Whenever she's scared, she comes to me. So the kid runs to daddy when she's scared, but goes to mommy when she's hurt. That's an interesting dynamic, how it is. She feels safer by dad when there's a risk, but feels safer by mom when she's hurt because she's going to be pampered and taken care of. I think that's very healthy combination.

1:55:33There was a quarterback, a bread far many years ago. I don't know if you know, bread far is a famous texture. That's an inside joke if you know who he is. But he has his quarterback. He has his coach so tough on him. So tough on him. Nothing was ever good with this quarterback. Kicking his ass, talking shit to him in the sideline. How could you throw that interception? What was that all about? What was that all about? And he's afraid of the coach and he's always escaping the coach. But there was a guy that was, I think his name was Mary Yuchi, Steve Mary Yuchi. And he would always put his arm around and listen, he believes in you.

1:56:07Want you prove him right deep down as that he believes in you go through the past that you know he knows he can throw Show him exactly what we got. Let's go in this game form. Let's get it So that dynamic worked incredibly well for Brett far as well as many other players out there So I think you know one without the others a problem if you got both it's a great combination Yeah, there's a lot of problems with Fathillistness in homes Melissa Connie just wrote a new book called the two parent advantage two parent privilege, sorry, and dude it's terrifying. Just the raw data, the raw outcomes that you get.

1:56:43Did your mom and dad stay together? Yes. Okay. Very till today. Yep. Only child. Only child. So do you have that only child syndrome? Yes. What do you mean the guy that's the center of all of these lights and stuff? In some regards. Okay. In some regards, yes, but I think I had quite a stern upbringing, who's held to incredibly high standards. It was very non rebellious as a kid. It's very non rebellious. Very non rebellious. Very, very non rebellious. You know, wasn't going out, wasn't sneaking out. I don't think I ever got grounded once. The God play a role or no. Standards and expectation was a tough standard.

1:57:17High. Very high. What did your mom and dad do? Dad is an engineer. Mom stopped working for probably 10 to 12 years to raise me while dad was out working. But this isn't, you know, dad was on the working class of most working class. We live in a city in the UK that was famous only for having the highest teen pregnancy rating in the UK. And then it lost that. So it didn't even have that as a title anymore. At least you could brag about it. Now we've got nothing to talk about. Yeah, exactly. We haven't even got that. So, but it was very formative and I'm just thinking more and more about this tension between success making people soft.

1:57:52I spoke to David Goggins about it on the podcast. You know, he's got this guy who can command millions of dollars for speaking gigs and he's choosing to go smoke jumping. Have you seen this thing that he's doing? So smoke jumping is when there's a wildfire in the middle of nowhere and they need to air drop in the firefighters. So they parachute in with a pack around the waist with all this stuff on and they also put water, huge water bucket, the things that they'll attach their hoses to separately, parachute them in and they just live in the fire until they put it out sometimes throughout that for a week.

1:58:28Pretty sure he makes it's either seven or twelve dollars an hour that he makes for doing this smoke jumping as it's called. It's in Canada for the most part. Instead of going and doing this speaking to it and I asked him about success making you soft and he says I see it way too much and that's why I don't like it. I'm not about the flash. I'm not about any of them. When the best books in business was written by a legendary CEO in Silicon Valley who ran Intel, I think he's the only guy that for a decade straight, he grew the company 100 % every year. Unheard of what this guy did. And he grew. Hungarian guy.

1:59:04Okay. You know what the book title is? Only the paranoid survive. Only the paranoid. I heard you say that before. So I had a question to you around only the paranoid survive. I don't disagree that paranoia is an unbelievable competitive advantage. It's a very useful performance enhancer, right? You are paying more attention, you are more detailed oriented, you're more fearful, all the rest of it. Ultimately, is it worth it? Do you think is paranoia worth it as a life strategy? You are protected by those who take that seriously. Okay, you know, burden is not something that say sexy sell. You know, there's a lot of things that you and I can sell that's very sexy.

1:59:48Okay, work from home, very sexy. Yet the loneliness epidemic in America right now is record breaking numbers we've never seen before, right? On what people are doing, how lonely they are, numbers on depression is off the charts right now compared to what it was just 10 years ago. So yeah, you can sell work from home, you can sell three and a half day work week, you can sell laptop, entrepreneur, you can sell, oh, these are all sexy things to sell, right? You can sell, set up a funnel and make 20 grand a month and don't have to do anything. These are all very interesting, easy things to sell. Try selling burden.

2:00:27Go ahead and sell burden. Oh, it's incredible honor of having burden of the responsibility of a nation or state or a military or a freedom, I thought, try selling it. It's not an easy sale, it's a hard sale. Responsibility isn't sexy. So why are so many great leaders turned on by that burden? Why? Because someone's got to do it. So it all depends, you know, in the book, your next five moves, I talk about how the most important question you got to answer in life is, who do you want to be? what type of life do you want to live? That's simple. Okay, so what does this mean? Do you want to be a founder?

2:01:06Yeah, you sure? Yeah, positive. I think so. It's kind of cool. Right? Want to be a founder entrepreneur? You sure you want to be a founder? You sure you want to be the number one guy. Tom Ellsworth, who was my business partner, said one of the best things to me. This guy was at the talk about the legendary interview of all time. It's the last interview of Steve Jobs and Bill Gates and Silicon Valley. Okay, wherever it was 300 people were invited at this meeting. Tom was one of them sitting on it. You got to see it by the way sick. It's the red share. When you see the red share, you're watching right one.

2:01:36Steve Jobs is super skinny. Tom Mills where tells me, Suspada, took me 50 years to realize I don't make a lot of money when I'm the number one guy. The most money I ever made is when I was number two to the number six. Think about saying that. I think about taking 52 years to realize 50 years to realize the most money you ever made was when you were the number two guy or number six guy because there's burden with number one. Number one is got to sell the dream. Number one is got to sell the vision. Number one is got to seem like even though we're about to go out of business, they're at peace, they're calm, they carry the burden sleepless nights, your finances, you can reveal to people if you're about to run out of money, we're going to make the expenses, we're going to make salaries, we're going to pay payroll.

2:02:20That's the number one who wants that burden, nobody wants that burden. So no, if the idea is to sell that, no, it is not an easy sale. But if you want to know why you right now are here and we are able to do this podcast at a pretty unstable time in the world today, it's probably because around 500 people have the burden of making sure nobody messes with you and I where we are right now. And those 500 people have a thousand people underneath them or 500 people underneath them Why you and I are able to sit here. So it's not the most sexy attractive thing like in in Smithsonian I don't know if you've been to the Smithsonian in DC There's a part where you go and it shows You walk this way.

2:03:06It shows how Lincoln aged over It's an incredible thing to see and there's a quote they buy by Lincoln about burden Okay, the being a president is the greatest burden a person can ever have, right? Some, some quote like that. I'm paraphrasing. So it's not for everybody. And it's not a sale. The book shows us to do it. Obama before and after his eight years, right? He still looks good though. He's still got swagger, but I mean, that was 20 years and eight years. That's right. So this is something I wanted to talk about. You have spent a lot of time reading about and researching and speaking to powerful people.

2:03:44Who do you think really runs the world? You're gonna go there with the question. Who do I think runs the world? Shies to ask the question. I said who's got the most power in America? Is it Congress? Is it president? Is it the CEO's of virtual governments? We're talking Google Twitter Facebook? You know those guys Amazon, you know, or is it billionaires? Okay, you know the most richest band in the world who's got the most power and you'd be amazed how few people are president? Because they come and go, you know, the famous quote would Putin that he says, you know, American presidents, you don't have to worry about it.

2:04:20They're going to be there four to eight years. Some suits are run at, you know, and run the country behind closed doors. And he's got a very good point when he says something like that, Putin. But to me, there are a lot of alliances being built. So if you and I were to think about aspirational type of people, okay, you know how they say, you know, well, Michael Jackson eventually got to a point where he got so many different girls that he started trying with this and he started trying with this and a lot of these people in Hollywood have so much sex with so many different people that they become creative and they do dumb things, right?

2:04:53Okay. Tiger Woods, the reason why he got these girls because what do you know what it is to be the greatest girlfriend in the world and then everybody throws their panties at you. You want to judge a guy like that? Why don't you go be the greatest girlfriend and see what it feels like to be one out of eight billion? You don't know what it's like. So they're kind of trying and experimenting with all this stuff, right? It's almost like I'm so much in a prison jail. Everybody's watching what I'm doing. I'm going to break the rules a little bit to see what I'm capable of doing. So let's go process and dissect some of these guys that make all the money in the world.

2:05:19Okay. You become a billionaire and you're still dangerously ambitious. Not from a good place, but more selfish place. Okay. You took over an industry. Now you work five billion dollars. Now you work ten. If you're a billionaire, you're the best at what you do in your space. for the most part or you help build the best in that space for the most part. Okay. Cool. So maybe your marriage didn't work out. Maybe you're not the best father in the world. And you're like, well, I want more control. I want more power. I can't be a president. I don't want to be a president because if I run for president, they're going to reveal the things that I've done in my life and God forbid if that gets all the light, I don't want that.

2:06:06That's embarrassing. But you know what I'm going to do? What if I can take over the world? Are there other people like me that are driven by wanting to take over the world? What if we could make the world one place and we make all the decisions for everybody because I'm probably one the smartest people in the world. And you know, that conversation's taken place. Again, you really start having that God -like figure like I don't know if you're familiar with George Soros, you know, in one of the interviews he gave to L .A. Times. He says, I always fancied myself with being a God. Fancyed myself with being a God.

2:06:43This is an L .A. Times interview 20 plus years ago. If you type in George Soros, L .A. Times God, it's the most disturbing interview to read about this guy. A lot of people are very skeptical about him, right? He's like the boogie man of a number of conspiracies. How many how many people have you heard say, I always fancied myself would be in a God, he says, but what's great about where I'm at right now is it's no longer a dream to become a reality. I have a friend who has spent a lot of time with super, super powerful people and he told me about a meeting that he had with one individual in particular who spoke about being an apex predator.

2:07:22He said that apex predators don't care about prey. And even though the prey that he was referring to was still his own species, it was really haunting the story the way that that was told to me because you had someone who not only had the motivation to be able to go and enact whatever nefarious delicious plan, but also had the actual resources to be able to go and do it. Right, those two things together are, they're scary and that was something that really opened my eyes. I'm very non -conspiratorial in the way that I think I always lean toward, you know, do not attribute to malice that which can be explained by stupidity, do not attribute to coordination that which can be explained by coincidence.

2:08:07And yet the more that I read and the more that I learn about things, the more there, there seems to be there, right? Yeah, you know, people are offended by different things.

2:08:23Some people being offended in their deepest insecurities, they're willing to use their ambitions to go to certain levels that at that point, they're not thinking about the consequences of ruining a lot of people's lives. That's not something they're thinking about at that level. So Hitler was offended. When you read my comb for you study what Hitler did, he was simply offended. Somebody offended him. So his entire life was about doing what he did just because he was offended. Now most people who are offended, they do what? They forget about it. And they move on. Some of these guys want control.

2:09:03Some of these guys want to make decisions for you. Some of these guys on the money side, at least they go and make money to get power. Some people don't go make money to get power. Some people call out, they're like, no, I'm not going to go make money to get power. I'm going to get power by creating laws and thinking, I know what's best for you. So there's a lot of different people that you can put in these steps of organization. You just have to think like if you were to think about the commission of the mob, always go back to a lucky Luciano created a commission with a five families. He was the one that ran the commission right up the five families.

2:09:33Okay. When you think about what meetings in the world happens where all the powerful people show up, You got the G20, you got the UN, you got the world economy, you got Davos, you got all these guys that come together, you got NATO, you got... So NATO could be like, well, NATO is original when the 12 or 14 countries were part of NATO, what was it really all about? To fight USSR, there is no USSR, why are we still funding it? What's the outcome now? Are we still fighting communism? them. So what a lot of people might say is that those organizations are so obvious that they can't be the ones where the real shit's happening, right?

2:10:10That's just the smoke screen. The real shit is the shit that's behind it and the shit that's behind that and so on and so forth. In your opinion, do you think that NATO, WIF, WHO, those people, there's no further up set of strings that are playing the then triliquized game behind those ones. Do you I don't know. What I will say, listen to you, is with the questions you're asking, I think there's a reason why the audience wants to hear what you think about what's going on right now, because you're asking some heavy questions right now, which means you're curious. And if I'm the audience, I would like to know what you can come up with if you took a deeper dive and really wanted to get into these types of, you know, information.

2:10:53But, you know, think about what things people are most addicted to. Okay, addicted personalities, video games, porn, sex, cocaine, ecstasy, weed, steroids, party in, all of that stuff. But what's one of the most addicted things that many of those guys can't get? power. Are you kidding me? Power is like power porn. The porn of having a lot of power and getting the look and people that look at you that are afraid of you. Some people love that. Some people love that. You know, the quote, like if you really want to test someone's character given power, I mean, some people really love having power.

2:11:44Take a company and see some of the guys that they hire. They hire the wrong person at the top. The guy was all driven by power. What happens? take a president that becomes a president and he realizes he can use the justice system against his opponent what happens They got that power. It's a lot of power to give to somebody right Yeah, so you know those people I believe are out there some of them are 100 % money people because money talks and you can have a lot of them need funds to do anything right you do It's it's gonna be the money people But there's also the other power players behind closed doors that, you know, in the movie Moneyball, Jonah Hill plays, I don't know if I'm saying his name correctly, he plays the role of the guy that Brad Pitt is sitting there saying, why is this GM of Cleveland Indians keeping looking at that guy?

2:12:34It doesn't gotten based. Who the hell are you? Right? John Maxwell or Dale Carnegie wrote about the Center book saying the love E .F. Huttin. EF Hutton was in the room that every time the guy was making a decision, he would have made a decision until he asked about EF Hutton. So here's what we're going to do. So, well, you know, we're proposing, okay, great. Hey, EF Hutton, what do you think about it? Okay, we're not going to be doing it. Great. The world is filled with E like Henry Kissinger. I don't know how much you know about Henry Kissinger. Not guys in EF Hutton If there ever was one, there's a lot of those guys that are the brains behind the faces that we see.

2:13:15And most of the times the best EF Hutton's, no one ever finds out who they were. No one ever finds out who those guys are. One of the other tensions that I've felt when learning about you and also when watching your content, you've spoken about this specifically to do with Kobe, but I think it also probably plays a role in almost everybody's life is this tension between self -love and high standards. It's the desire to maximize everything you can and to not leave more on the table than you need to, and also the ability to enjoy the moment and to be able to actually take some pleasure in that. And there was something that came up from a friend that I wrote about this week, so I wanted to explain this to you.

2:13:54He did a psilocybin journey in Australia, and a question came to him and the question was, do people love you for who you are or for what you do? This is uncomfortable to consider. People loving us for who we are feels more real, genuine, caring, empathetic and robust. It feels like we're less fickle and more difficult to lose. On the other hand, people loving us for what we do feels transactional and transient. The love that we receive becomes contingent on what achievements and successes we can offer in return. And the obvious fear is that if a point came where we no longer had anything to offer in return, would our love be taken away?

2:14:30So here's an even more uncomfortable question. Do you love you for who you are or for what you do? This highlights our hypocrisy. You see, we want the world to love us for who we are, a balanced caring view of our true value independent of our accomplishments. Meanwhile, our own self -love is largely determined by what we do. If we fall short, even though we know we tried our best, we still castigate ourselves for being insufficient unworthy creatures. So we want the world to show up for us in a way that we are often not prepared to show up for ourselves. You demand more than this, demanded of yourself.

2:15:05Powerful. Do you see that resonating this tension in high performers? Desire for more requirement for self -love? Yes, but for me, there's a part of it that's also honest. Because, Because again, the relationship between a man and a prostitute, what is that relationship? Each side is getting something in return. The prostitute is getting what? Money. What's the man getting? Pleasure, okay? And they walk away. It's done. It's a very honest relationship, right? There's no depth in that relationship. It's straight up, it's honest, done, we move on, okay.

2:15:48working at a company. Say you work with a company and he helps the YouTube channel go to the next level doing all the work behind closed doors all this stuff. Would he do that job for free or would he do it because you're offering something back to them? How many my employees would be with me if it was working for free? That nonprofit would be kind of weird. Guys, what we're doing is very important, but I need you to work for free. What do you mean? Are you gonna make money? I am, but I want you to work for free. It's kind of weird, right? There needs to be an exchange. Again, it's honest. Exchange.

2:16:26Okay. If I go above and beyond everybody else and I work, should I deserve the right to get paid more? Yes. Okay. Is it beneficial for me to work with somebody like you? Of course. Why? Because you're driven. So should I hang on to your hotel because if I go with you big things are going to happen in my life? Absolutely. Is that a selfish decision? Yes, but it's also a wise decision. Do you know that? You know that. Do they know that? They know that. Do they also know that you have options because now you're at a point that a lot of people would love to be working for you? Of course they know that.

2:17:00They're not dummies, right? They know that. Okay, but you still choose to stay with them and they still choose choose to stay with you. Is there benefit of somebody hiring your person that's helping with your podcast and paying twice as you pay to go? go with them, there is. If he chooses to take that just for the money, that's his loss. If you're doing your part, he was never in it for, believe it or knew, it was only about the money part. So these are all, and the reason why this is so interesting, what you're reading about, self -love and all these other things, is when you look at some of the people that make it at the highest of the highest of the highest level, they typically have been backstabbed so much that in the back of their mind, sometimes they're just waiting to see who's going to backstab next.

2:17:45So the desire to have a straight -up relationship is no longer the same. Okay, there's a difference between you dating somebody who falls in love with you when you're making 22 bucks an hour working at Bally's and she loves you and she stays with you. There's a difference between you getting married when you're making $300 ,000 a year and then there's a difference between you making marrying somebody when you're worth half a billion dollars. How do you know the girl that marries you at the end of his word, you know, is with you because she loves you versus she loves what you offer them, right?

2:18:14And is that a sin? If she makes a mistake, you know, I think in an ideal world, I am very comfortable knowing that other people are also there in your life to get what they can out of you. I'm very comfortable with that because there's a chapter in the book here where I talk about choosing running mates and I put a clear criteria on how to choose a running mate. You know what they bring to the table. Their level of trust with you, all these ways of scoring people in your life to see, hey, is this a person because the whole concept would choose a new enemies wise, they also need to choose your allies wisely.

2:18:53So somebody like you, you need true believers in your life. You can't have 50 true believers. That's just naive to think that. You can't have 10 true believers. Can you have two to five true believers? Yes. how valuable is that a lot? So no, the more and more I moved up, the more I realized almost everybody, like, and I'm talking 99 % of people, listen to the radio show, WiIFM, what's in it for me. And a part in this book that we dissected your question, which is fascinating question, is in the company, I've been running a sales organization for 20 -something years, and when I started the insurance company in on -line we grew it from 66 agents today we have 50 ,000 agents we've licensed nationwide we have a few hundred officers nationwide but my idea of looking at who's got the biggest upside to contribute to the company is also changed it used to be manakai so selfish All that guy cares about money.

2:19:53I mean this guy's the nicest guy in the world and then I realized the nicest guy in the world who had no selfish desires was happy making $5 ,000 a month. And so then I created a scoring system. What percentage of you is selfish and selfless and was the good balance? If you are 100 % only you and everybody else zero, well guess what? You're still a bigger net positive to society than the person at the bottom, that's what? Zero percent selfish and 100 % selfless. If a person is 100 % selfless, they probably don't eat well. They probably add a shave. They're probably not healthy. They're probably going to have to go to the hospital.

2:20:33It's going to cost you money in taxes. They probably smell because they don't take a shower. They spend their money on everybody else. So then you'll see the profile. Good people to give you a council are around a 50 -50 range. You can always trust them to give you a council. Drivers of a company or somebody like you doing what they do 70 -30 is a good split. Okay. 80 -20 is a little bit problematic. Because 80, 20 sometimes will compromise to beat everybody. So you want the 65, 70, so you're asking a technical question. And I've just come to a conclusion that, you know, both parties, if they want to selfishly be pleased, if we can please each other and one of us takes the lead and we're getting mutual love and benefits out of the relationship, you're in a good situation.

2:21:21Every once in a while you'll find somebody that's going to be your right or die, they're going to see Chris, dude, no matter what she do, I'm with you till the day you die. And you think they're telling the truth. Your goes by, they're still there, even more. Five years go by, they got married. Like, when he gets married and ask, it's going to change. Still there. Ten years later, still there, and you're like, it's really a true believer. Wow. But it's not going to be that many people. That's a very short list of people. Patrick Battevid, ladies and gentlemen, Patrick, I appreciate the hell out of you.

2:21:49I appreciate how much you pay attention. very detailed oriented and I love that. I really, really do. Thank you for today, man. It's been a long time coming. So where should people go? They want to keep up to date with everything you're doing? Oh, I mean, you can go to Amazon and search, choose your enemies wisely, or you can find our podcast, PBRD podcast, or value -taming. We're all over the place. You'll find us. Thank you, man. But this has been a blast from talking to you. I've been watching you for a long time, and it's very obvious why you're climbing the way you are. I appreciate you. Anytime.

2:22:17Thank you.