Female Psychopath Explains How She Manipulates Men - Kanika Batra - #1142

35:04And this is because she said some mean words to you and was making racist comments and stuff. That's it, yeah. You managed to set the entire country of Venezuela on this person. Yeah. Okay. Have you been to jail? No, sir. certainly some things you've done that could have got you to go absolutely absolutely but people wouldn't believe it like people don't look at me like would you think that i do anything that i do that you wouldn't and i'm generally quite smart like i tested 138 and i'm never testing again in case it's lower than that because i couldn't live with that shame it seems like with a few of the things that you've brought up um i am 40 kilos i promise uh my iq is 138 like i don't attest again in case it goes back um some sensitivity around people saying what's happening with your age whatever it feels like uh status and um renown competence reputation it feels like that that that's a core it is it is part of what it is that you desire is that right Absolutely.

36:16I think that is what comes from the narcissism, whereas the ASPD or the psychopathy is more the machine in my brain that tells me to slow down and do it in a way that doesn't blow back at me. That's an interesting way to look at it, that one is an engine and the other is a brake pedal. Exactly. That's how I see it. I hate the narcissism. I'm not going to lie. I wish I I could just be just not worry about other people saying like thinking that they're better than me. Like I wish I could say that. I wish I could actually be in a position where I don't care so much about looks, intelligence, worth, status.

36:56But I feel like those are objective metrics that have been proven. Like if you're in a beauty pageant, there's a certain level of beauty that you've attained. if you do extremely well on your year 12 exams which I did then you have intelligence if you have a an actual quantifiable number of your IQ that shows that you're not dumb so when someone says that those things aren't true or they'll accuse me of having a fake nose because it's small or breast implants it's like that's my genetic superiority and you're trying to say that I'm a normal person who had to go pay for it and it pisses me off so much and that's why my psychiatrist was like we need to detach you from these things because it's gonna be really really bad when you do age like when and like my parents look really good because it's coming yeah it will be coming but my parents how old are you i am 30 cool have you ever wanted to kill anything yes what people okay yeah how'd that go um not so well yet because i have a lot of people around me who would stop it from happening but i would plan it over a long period of time there are some people like in that snark group for example the reddit thing yeah i would absolutely just skin them if i could like physically myself like katherine knight who's that uh she's an australian woman the first woman to get um life in prison without parole because she ended up so she killed her boyfriend because he didn't want to get married and she stabbed him like a hundred and something times then she skinned him like a full skin suit and hung him up by the door and then she cut off his head and sorry um it was on the stove and she cut off his like meaty parts and cooked them and so she was going to serve them to his children.

38:57That weren't her children presumably? Yeah. Right. And so that was – and then she took some benzos and fell asleep and tried to act like she had an overdose. But I feel like that's what they deserve, some of these people, for the hell that they put me through, especially because I was dying in the Maldives. Like I hadn't had a blood transfusion. My hemoglobin was so low and my oxygen saturation was like – I was like on the edge of dying. And these bitches had the audacity to be planning this, writing an open letter to Kanika Batra. If you don't do this and this and this and this, we're going to destroy your life.

39:34We're going to go into every part of your comment section, which they do. We're going to like send you horrific emails. We're going to try and give you bad reviews on your book, even though I know it's good, even though most people, I think I haven't gotten a single person saying it's bad. and so it's like if you have that capacity to treat me that way you don't deserve to be on this planet this episode is brought to you by whoop most people treat recovery like it's optional but unlike politicians data doesn't lie how you recover is literally going to determine how good your next day is going to be and whoop tracks all of it sleep strain heart rate recovery it's like dog the bounty hunter but instead of criminals it's tracking down your bad habits all of this the brand new Whoop 5.0.

40:217 % smaller. It's got two weeks of battery life. Shows you how fast you're actually aging. It comes with hormonal insights for women managing their cycle or pregnancy or men hiding from it. Once you see the patterns, you start making better decisions. It's that simple. Best of all, you can join for free, pay nothing for your Whoop 5.0 strap. Plus you get your first month for free and there's a 30-day money back guarantee. So you can buy it for free, try it for free. If you don't like it after 29 days, they just give you your money back. Right now, you can get the brand new Whoop 5.0 and that 30-day free trial by going to the link in the description below or heading to join.whoop.com slash modernwisdom.

40:56That's join.whoop.com slash modernwisdom. it's so interesting i'm noticing inside of me as you're talking the balance between the emotion of wanting to give you sympathy for going through that because that sounds horrendous being on the edge of dying in the maldives and also like absolutely knowing that you didn't feel much other than the rage and the resentment and the bitterness it's very strange obviously it's because you're explaining there's so much uh exposition going on i'm like

41:33why is feeling sympathy for somebody who doesn't feel guilt very interesting uh calculation equation to try and do in my head like i like that's that's mean and horrible for anybody to go through but also this person doesn't respond in the normal way to that it's very interesting and i'm noticing that coming up inside of me it's cool um okay so you would kill somebody if you could get away with it you think yes okay i've heard you talk about freedom like not wanting to risk your freedom as a big part of this is that the main sort of utilitarian i would say so reason that forensics the likelihood so if you had the skill to do it yeah i mean if i had the privilege of being able to do it like ted bundy I actually relate a lot to Ted Money not for the killing stuff not at all but he had the same sort of like I listened to the hours and hours of him talking and he has a lot of like word salads but when he actually talks about his experiences like when he he didn't know how to talk to people and he didn't know how people would associate with each other so he used to listen to talk back radio so he could understand how actual conversations work and how they should be happening because because obviously it wasn't happening naturally for him.

42:52And then he would talk about this same kind of depression that I have, where it's not profound sadness at any point. It's just this feeling of like, I can't do anything. And it's like, you're just laying there. Flat. Flat, just flat. There's nothing that can like lift you out of it. And so that's something I really related to. It's like depression without the sadness. Yeah, literally, literally. It's depression without sadness. so what was it like when you first started listening to tad bundy talk it was that was the first thing and then how he struggled to make friends because he couldn't understand why people found it off-putting by the things that he was doing like he would set like cages oh he'd set up a trap in the forest so he'd have a trap door and then there'd be like sticks and stuff holding it back and so people would fall in and they'd hurt themselves because there'd be a bear trap and he couldn't understand why that was bad and why people hated him for it and I couldn't understand why people hated me for what I did because like I it wasn't something that I'd planned or anything it was just something that happened and then also the way his family would treat him like they would call him evil when he was just a child I don't think any child is inherently evil so when like that really hit home the fact that he had this white girlfriend and Diane Edwards, as she's known now, how she dumped him.

44:18And he was just so angry about it, because he had, like, he built himself up to be this person who's at university, who, you know, has achieved a fair bit. And the revenge that he had after that, like leading her on for a whole year and then planning a wedding and then he just stopped writing to her completely he stopped he stopped communicating she was frantic and she called him she's like why are you doing this and he's like I don't know what you're talking about and hung up on her and she never heard from him again so I I like the idea of that as revenge but also like how he would flip-flop at university so he'd do different degrees like I've done that um he never really held a stable job I've held stable jobs, but it's just like I get bored within a month or two and then I'll be gone.

45:10It's different if I had my own show and if I'm in conservative media. For that, I've always been interested. And he went straight into politics. I went straight into politics. On my 16th birthday, I joined my conservative party, which is the liberal party in Australia. I joined at 16. I was VP by 19. and so he was there to rub elbows with like more I guess wealthy people whereas I just did it because I have a lot of rage and I have a lot of like ability to scheme and plan things and so in politics you're rewarded for that you're rewarded for any sort of brevity you have like I had a friend who backstabbed his mother I won't go into it but he backstabbed his own mother to be in the faction so it's like where you thrive your sadism can thrive without you actually going to prison and so he utilized that as well you wrote a book that had ted in right yes yes that's it was a fiction novel thing it was and a female serial killer at the same time it certainly seems like there are some analogies between the female protagonist and yourself Yeah, people keep saying that.

46:20I'm like, no, she's way better than me. You mean more proficient at what she does? More proficient, more attractive, like richer. Would that not be the dream? Ideal version of me. Yeah, yeah. No, because there's a lot of things that she does that I can't do. It's like the promiscuity. Promiscuity really disgusts me. Like it gives me a visceral reaction. I don't know why, but it's hard to see someone as a person if they're doing really vulgar things. I guess because I grew up in such a conservative home that that stuff is seen as very generous. I've got a video that I want you to react to. Sure.

47:02Let's get this up, Mark. Rodney Alcala! Don't say it like that. It may be the creepiest episode ever on The Dating Game. because this bachelor looking for love back in 1978 is actually a serial killer. I'm called the banana and I look really good. No one had any idea that Rodney Alcala had already launched his killing spree when he appeared on the popular dating show. He was a real creepy guy, a real idiot. Jed Mills was bachelor number two and nearly 40 years later, he's still haunted by their encounter. This creep comes up and he puts his face practically in my face and he says I always get the girl.

47:44When I think about what he said I always get my girl he kills him. That's what he's talking about. What's your best time? The best time is at night, nighttime. Despite Alcala's weird behavior on the dating game, The Bachelorette chose him but never went on the date because she reportedly found him creepy and lucky for her because alcala would later be found guilty of seven murders investigators believe he may have actually killed up to 130 victims based on photos found on his property why did you respond that way when you saw him uh he's just someone i find really fascinating because um i was actually watching a documentary on him probably about a year ago and it was actually crazy how much she managed to get away with also his eyes are so demonic like you can just see in them there's nothing behind there there's no soul in that at all and you can see his contempt towards women and if you'll notice there's no duchenne smile like what's that so when it's a genuine smile you'll see it up here as well like there'll be crinkles they'll like his stays entirely here and so he's not being genuine at all like if you look at his eyes oh wow yeah there's nothing there And if you actually muted the video and played it, you can see the micro expressions on his face that he's getting like that delight from duping somebody.

49:11That's interesting. So your ability to convince somebody of something that you're not, that is itself rewarding? I would say so, yeah. What's your dating history like? Always a serial monogamist. so I don't get into like I don't think that sexual activity or anything of that sort should be outside of a serious relationship ideally marriage but serious relationship will do in this society um and so because of that I primarily date because I am bisexual but I would sort of have a number of different people that I would go on dates with and I would selectively cut them off like basically I would trim it down until I had the person I wanted okay and then with them like you know it's it's fantastic to have somebody but I could never really lift the mask for any of them because like I couldn't be fully myself and it's very tiring when you have to wear this mask constantly and you know that there's going to be consequences if you don't what does not wearing the mask look like in a relationship?

50:25It can get pretty ugly. I do still get a lot of rage. And while I'm better at handling it, I get very, very frustrated at people around me for like, not doing the right thing and backing me up immediately or doing things like that. I can't tell them honestly about things that I've done because it's just, it's too much to fathom like there's this um there's an article that i mention a lot the hidden suffering of the psychopath and it shows how lonely psychopaths get even if they're dating multiple people like that like even say ted that's that's why they believe that you know they believe that psychopaths can feel grief and love and whatnot and so the problem is is that loneliness and that wedge between you and other people can turn you into someone who commits violence and for me that wasn't what I what turned me but I knew I couldn't really like show people how I am outside of like the social things that they experience me at like they don't um like everyone's always like you don't seem like a psychopath and you don't seem like you have this and this and this and it's like well if I told you what I actually thought you'd probably think differently so that's sort of the issue I have and also like I get very very tired of people like if they're too high maintenance and I like they're constantly texting constantly calling it's like why don't you get another job because if you were like you have so much time on your hands and you want to chat on the phone all day like I have things to do so it's like the the clinginess I can't deal with but then again nonchalant I can't really deal with either it kind of has to be this happy balance and trust me it was very hard to find that.

52:14I've heard that you say you have pure contempt for most partners after three months. Yes. What was happening there? I think I would start to see them as the real person that they were instead of the fantasy that I projected onto them. And like, I tend to put people on a pedestal sometimes. And I also actually really love giving gifts and I love love bombing. I do it naturally. It's not necessarily planned. So I love doing all of that. and then they get hooked on it and then they start getting really, really obsessive. They'll be like, oh, okay, why aren't you calling me more? Oh, are you seeing other people?

52:47You must be seeing other people. And so there's this contempt like I have to handle this creature. I have to care about it and do good things for it. And it just becomes like pros versus cons. But you want to do it on your terms because you want to love bomb them when you want to love bomb them. Exactly, exactly. But you don't want to do it when they want it. No, no. That's partially I would say it, but also I would say that it's just overwhelming because my internal system is flat. It's completely flat, whereas people spikes and it drops and it's like I don't have time for that. I don't want to deal with that.

53:27That's also why I would never actually date or truly be friends with someone with borderline personality disorder because they're a pen and many shoes or something severe. like I had one who would text me literally like five times an hour who because I wasn't responding or my tone seemed wrong and it's just like like I have important things to do like she was threatening suicide every weekend so I had to be on the on the phone with emergency services telling them that she'd cut hers at wrists in a shallow manner and it was so frustrating she'd have all of these tears constantly and I was like I can't deal with this it's not my problem I just I get fed up.

54:11It kind of is your problem if you're in a relationship with someone right because you want them to be there for you when you need them your friend who stayed up until four in the morning you have an awful lot of respect and gratitude for her for doing that but if your partner was either attempting to or threatening to take her own life that felt like that was burdensome to you? Well, she did it every weekend. That's the problem. Like if she did it once in six months, okay. But there was a lot of other things. She had a drinking problem. She expected me to pay for everything. And it's like, I don't want to do that.

54:45If you're going to spend an hour in the gym, you might as well look hot and feel comfortable while you're doing it. And honestly, who wants to be in the background of a TikTokers highlight reel dressed like a chump? Gymshark makes some of the best men's and women's training gear on the planet. And something that I realized a few years ago is that when you actually like what you're wearing in the gym, you show up differently. You train harder, you stay longer and get way more high fives. The hybrid shorts are my go-to. They are the perfect length, super lightweight, easy to wash and dry. And they're sleeveless t-shirts that I've trained in every day for basically the last decade.

55:15They're the ideal fit. They're breathable. They hold their shape perfectly. No more looking like Adam Sandler's your stylist. Basically everything they make is unbelievably well-designed. You already know about them, they're high quality, you get 30 days of free returns globally with global shipping and a 10 % discount site-wide. So get that 10 % discount by going to the link in the description below or heading to gym.sh slash modernwisdom and using the code modernwisdom10 at checkout. That's gym.sh slash modernwisdom and modernwisdom10 at checkout. Given the, I find it hard to not feel straight contempt for somebody after three months, slightly non-typical approach when it comes to scrutinizing partners and dating multiple people, at least in the beginning at once.

56:02Given that, why have you gotten into dating advice? Because other people need to learn science and manipulation. Especially I got started when it was like the Red Pill podcast and everyone was like trying to degrade women and make women humble women. Tell them that they're not special. Tell them that like there was the advice was literally on par with the infographs on domestic violence. So the isolating, the gaslighting, like the triangulation, making her feel crazy. Like I know how that works because I've done that before. So I figured like, you know, I have all of these women who all of a sudden like me and they are having so many problems.

56:42They like email me every single day and say, oh, I have this happening. I have this happening. Please help me. No one else can help me. And so I guess because I come across as like ruthless sometimes or very friendly at other times, they get the impression that I will care about what they're dealing with. So - Do you? Only once, I think. Only once. Like, it was a bad situation. It's interesting because you're obviously passionate about this topic, but you still don't really care about the people that are going through it. It's like you seem to care about the sort of symbolic injustice. Yes. But not the human side.

57:20Exactly. Also, I'm noticing throughout the conversation a lot of male power over women is a big bugbear for you, especially manipulative male power over women, that that's something that shouldn't happen, perhaps history, abuse, assault, also maybe seeing dad with mom. Have you tried to sort of reverse engineer where this evangelism for not having men manipulate women comes from? I mean, everybody should be able to agree that that's bad, but for you, it has a different flavor to it. Absolutely. So obviously with Indian culture, it's very patriarchal. And so men have the final say in everything.

58:03And when I was 13, my mom told me that it was time for me to learn how to cook. I said, sure, is my brother learning too? And she's like, no, you're a girl, you do it. And I was like, fuck that. I'm not going to do this. So I was just like, no, I'm not going to play into this. And then obviously I've seen the dynamic online I've been on the receiving end like I absolutely would annihilate anyone who wouldn't egg me like yeah so that would happen a lot like at a casino at one point a guy was like yeah you're hot but you're not that hot like you're not like I wouldn't go for someone like you normally I was like listen you're five foot six and fat no one wants you especially not me um but yeah I do feel that I I have had a mental soft spot for women going through abuse but but everyone except the one man who raped me every other person who's ever been good to me has been a man and every person who's caused me stress or caused me any kind of struggle in life is always women.

59:11Women were in that group. Women are in my comment section policing my tone. Women are the ones spreading rumors. Women are the problem. Isn't it interesting that most of your protection is of women against men, but at least in your experience, most of your good treatment has been from men and not from women? Literally. Men have always helped me. Men have been, my dads loved me forever. Men on the street helped me parallel path. So what do you think is going on there? square that circle you know what's really odd is okay so i had this initially i didn't think men had feelings like i literally thought men don't have emotions so seeing someone have emotions it was like okay maybe they they do um but realizing that they're the ones who have assisted me since like day one and they're the ones who have supported me and been like loyal apart from my two female friends it's just I don't know why I had the advocacy for women and I don't know like I actually have quite a contempt for some of my audience because they're very leftist sort of feminists and they want me to be like on their terms about like gender and shit and I don't believe in that okay what are the best pieces of dating advice you've got for women so never sleep with them until you're in a serious relationship because your body wasn't meant to be used by multiple people regularly and also your heart wasn't designed to break for so many people.

1:00:45I would always make sure that you are actually safe. You don't have like any concerns about red flags so you should like I put out some advice in terms of red flags like if he's pushing too soon in terms of he's flooding you with attention he's giving you everything you want he's so he's basically everything that you think of all through the day that's a bad thing that's really really bad you don't you don't want to you don't want a guy who is making you feel like that because he's depriving you of contact from other people who will pull you back into reality also um I tend to tell women not to say people's names under their actual name and to use a mildly insulting term to keep them there like to for their contact name and then also turn hang on why let me get to it okay also turn off notifications on instagram and on uh any other platforms and also turn off your activity status so I do this because one dopamine comes in real quick from attention from this person so you don't want to have the the life sucked out of you because you've slowly been developing this level of respect for this person like let me put it this way if I have a guy saved on my phone as hepatitis b how sad would I be if hepatitis b didn't text me back on time so women get really obsessed like with the instagram status because they'll be like okay this guy was active nine minutes ago i sent him a message 10 hours ago so they start to feel like there's something wrong with them but if you have your notifications and your status off you don't know when he was online he doesn't know when you were online you're mysterious um so it's it's like it's a it's a place where you don't feel the hurt if you don't get a text from him so you're you're priming your body to be neutral instead of like emotionally connecting onto someone who you don't really know very well and also i would say don't text all the time because that's creating more intimacy than is actually capable and real at the at the moment like the false intimacy that comes from texting for like weeks and weeks before meeting is ridiculous.

1:03:14I understand maybe in early dating, not falling too fast for someone that you don't trust is perhaps not hepatitis B, but it's not a bad solution generally. But eventually, do you advise women to completely remove their mask as well? Yes. So I would say to women, until you are engaged, you're single and you should maintain pain your body. You shouldn't be out sleeping with people. Don't date five people and sleep with them. That's not where we're at. And so, that's kind of where I go to tell women. So, another thing with the Orthodox Church, it tells you that marriage is when you become a martyr for each other.

1:03:59And I think if there's no investment in you first, you don't need to be a martyr for anybody like but you were also concerned about somebody investing in you too much first well yeah because that's love bombing but you just said that you'd like to love bomb people early on in a relationship i know you do i do yeah but so it's okay for you to do it but it's worrying if somebody it's a red flag if a guy does it for a girl it's worrying both ways because there's plenty of female psychopaths just don't really hear about them so you would be saying to if you were advising the guys that you were dating if there was two of you yeah and you saw you behaving the way that you do with guys what do you think you would advise the guys so basically an antidote to someone like me what would you say would you be that's a red flag I'd be worried about this I would tell them which red flags are there and I do have men that I coach because like I've yeah another thing that I want to say about how I discovered how much men help like I went to a party with my husband and it was all his like youthful friends and I was they were talking about their girlfriends and whatnot and then they said that they would be devastated if they cheated on them and i thought men are naturally like they don't have that emotion and like they wouldn't care about cheating on someone and saying the guy saying he couldn't live with himself if he'd done it yeah if he'd done it and it's like okay man maybe they're not so bad and then i went to europe by myself and every single time it was a european man who would help me get my bag who would get it off the um the the conveyor belt um and they would get me like free meals and stuff and i know the intention behind some of that but some of it was genuinely just helping all the gentlemen or whatever yeah like and even like russian guys like russia there was like a lot of these airports that have like the stairs going up and down for the tarmac and so i had to lug my suitcases up there and it was so annoying and this russian guy he just grabbed my suitcase took it down went across the tarmac went up the stairs to the plane put it over my head and just walked away and I was like gentlemen what's the story about you and your husband okay so we met when I was doing Miss Universe New Zealand and I went on a date with him which was meant to be a double date with my friend and that guy bailed so it was just like him with two Miss universe girls and he got really really nervous beforehand but we just hit it off so fast so we were talking about politics like we have the same belief system I don't have to lie and say I was like a leftist for a leftist person so I was he was a genuine conservative I'm a genuine conservative he was like he was consistent with his effort and he was such a cheapskate at that time so if he went out of his way to go buy new clothes to see me and I appreciate that I appreciate putting in like putting in time and effort for somebody because that's also what I will do if I truly find interest in somebody I will dress how they like I will be you know make sure I'm in their corner always but he was fantastic um we had a couple of dates before I had to go back to Australia and then I flew him to Australia with my money and he never left so we kind of moved in together he moved into my parents' house which was pretty taboo at the time but I mean they weren't too angry because they they saw that he was genuine and after three months I didn't feel contempt I felt happy like I felt open like I can actually talk about things what was the difference I think because he's so calm like he's this anchor that I've never really had outside of my father and he is one of the best men I've ever known like he doesn't even eat if I haven't eaten and he is like he's known as floor guy because when I go to transfusions he sleeps on the floor with me while I'm getting transfused and like there's not a lot of people who would go to those lengths like like the way he sponsored my Europe trip like he was working so hard and he does so much for me.

1:08:06He does so much for our fur babies and he has the values that I've always really appreciated. Is this the first time? Are you in love? Yes. Right. Is this the first time you felt that? I don't know. There was one before, but it wasn't the same. This is something that can endure. I didn't think that one could endure, the first one. Is it difficult being in a relationship? you mentioned if somebody says something, gets on my nerves, annoys me, agitates me, if they're doing something wrong, if they make me feel a certain way, negative, too much pushback, if I kind of don't get what I want. But in relationships, it's really important to have that push and pull because you don't always know what's right for you.

1:08:53And if it's somebody off the street or someone you have no loyalty with, that kind of doesn't matter. But if it's your partner, it's really important for them to push you into place to show you the blind spots a lot of those blind spots are going to be uncomfortable yeah like if you do something say hey you're being you're being an asshole and that's what he says but why is is that not are you is there a tension inside of you now you've got this this person you've got the loyalty thing but you've also got this very fundamental physics inside of your system that you've had for far longer than him yes do those two things clash they do clash a lot um the thing is with him is that i see everything that he does for me and i also give him grace because around him i don't have to wear a mask so i can't like of course he he causes agitation once in france i i was like you you like when he was sleeping i was like you snore like a fucking chainsaw and it was pissing me off and then i was trying to learn French on Duolingo and he kept like being annoyed when the bell went off when I got something correct and so I got really angry at him but um the way I sort of handled the relationship with him is that we keep things pretty fresh we change things around a lot because I don't like monotony so what does that look like so we like travel to different places we were involved with like um with just like going through the Epstein files like we were onto that well before it was like being talked by the DOJ and so we went there we were we met up with Jeffrey's brother Mark who was nothing like Jeffrey he's a great guy great amazing guy um and so we get into like weird places like together we've been a force to be reckoned with alone I can be sort of a like an explosive that can go off at certain times or it could be like an ice block that melts over time But with him, he kind of will rein me in and he can also do it in a way that I don't find disrespectful.

1:10:57And I've had my fights with him. I mean, there was one time at the pool I went with my friend Marie, who had an Asian background. And this white lady was like, oh, you two can't swim properly. And I was like, I've been swimming here every single day for like two years. So you can shut the fuck up. And so my husband, he didn't stand up for me there because he's not a confrontational person. And so I threatened to break up because I was like, I can't deal with someone who won't stand up for me. Because I'm a very confrontational person. If someone has a problem with me and they talk shit about me, I'll go directly to them.

1:11:30So that was sort of a problem we had at the start. And he was a little bit worried about like, you know, what psychopathy is and all of that. I imagine he might have had a few questions. Yes, yes. Yeah, that's fair. In other news, have you ever noticed how some websites make it ridiculously easy to buy while some feel infinitely harder? Back in my day, I had to walk 10 miles to the local store. Aren't you younger than me? Yeah, but my dad got a DUI. Anyway, the reality is most businesses just get the website wrong. And if your setup is messy, you lose a ton of sales, which is why I'm such a massive fan of Shopify.

1:12:07They power 10 % of all e-commerce in the United States, including brands like Gymshark, Skims, Allo, and Nutonic. Because when it comes to converting browsers into buyers, they are best in class. Their checkout's 36 % better on average compared to other platforms. And with ShopPay, it can boost conversions by 50%. So upgrade your business and get the exact same checkout that we use at Nutonic with Shopify. You can sign up for a free trial period by going to the link in the description below or heading to shopify.com slash modern wisdom. That's shopify.com slash modern wisdom. In 2021, you said that you were scared of becoming an abuser.

1:12:43Yes. Today, your slogan on your website is stop being the victim, start being the villain. See, I don't - What happened to the woman who was frightened of becoming abusive? Well, I don't want to be abusive to people I know. I don't know what other shit people have done. Like if you're dealing with a guy who's like ruined your life, why shouldn't you be abusive in return? but I also must say that he runs my website so it's it's not it's his copy not yours yeah it's not mine interesting yeah I think you know looking at a lot of the dating advice that's in your book some of the stuff that's on the website it does feel quite manipulative is that fair to say I think it is fair yeah right do you think that teaching women manipulative dating tactics could cause them to introduce toxic games into actually healthy relationships?

1:13:35I try to avoid that, especially with my coaching clients. I tell them where ruthlessness should begin and where it should end. And it should definitely end when you're in a secure relationship. You don't want to damage that in any way, shape or form. So I value people's relationships if they are good for them. But if some guy is making you feel like shit, saying that he's got better options than you and he's treating you like you're nothing, like you're a speck of dust, then it's more than fair for me to tell them, like, if you want to get revenge or if you want to feel in power again, like, if you want to be in power again, then you can use these methods.

1:14:17So you can have the benefits of psychopathy without all the negatives of psychopathy. What are some of the methods? So the methods of... getting revenge on somebody or of regaining power, especially early in a relationship, I suppose. So basically I've had a lot of women who like, they, I don't know, slept with a guy for a while and they don't know how to make him commit and they don't want to give him up. And so they'll book coaching calls with me, not take my advice because they're weak. Women are weak. And so it pisses me off, but I still tell them like, this is what you need to do in terms of methods like if he thinks he's better than you show him your other options like not directly because men aren't stupid men you know when things are happening so don't rub it in his face just let him know about it just let him know you've got options you're gonna put up with the shit um i also tell them to have the shit tests right the shit tests are important because you need to see what he will do under different circumstances before you commit to him um and i think men should be able to do that as well i just don't like the advice that say fresh and fit give of like making a woman feel like she's garbage so that she's like lowered her self-esteem to be with you so that's not really what i tell people to do at all that sounds like some of the some of the bits of advice that i've seen from you get perilously close to that you know the push and pole, that you're supposed to love bomb him and then withdraw it, that you should find out what makes him anxious and vulnerable, and then know how to push those buttons in order to make him need you a lot.

1:16:02That to me feels just like an inversion of some of the worst bits of dating advice that have come from the other side of the fence. Okay, so I feel like women can't do as much damage as men most of the time there are some exceptions to that of course and i also know that women are very moderate so they're going to pull back what i say and they're going to not do that because they just can't like i have proven time and time again that they can't they want to live vicariously through me but they cannot carry that out but if they can carry it out to a point where they don't feel unstable that's where you need to be so i know their limitations i know that if I put him here to a certain extent and they they obviously you know will not go to that level they will not go to that line they will be well before that line it's kind of like when in your in drama school when they they're like bring out all your energy and then draw it back in so there's are there going to be a couple of women who become genuinely abusive potentially but I am not giving them any materials myself like if they choose to harm someone that's not might fold.

1:17:07They can choose to take the advice in a book in general, or they could not. If Andrew Tate published your book with the pronouns reversed, how do you think you'd describe it? Pretty much his, like, it would be his ticket to fame, except without sex trafficking. When it comes to dating advice, though, a lot of what's being put across, It seems like you really stand in opposition to men that are manipulating women, to men that are trying to use dopamine and psychology in an attempt to create a need that maybe isn't there, create a power differential, create a degree of dependency. You're saying that men don't feel the impact of that in the same way that women do, and that women can't deploy the power of that in the same way that men can.

1:18:03Exactly. maybe. I would say women are interpersonally much more deft than men are and much more effective. Women are better lying detectors. They're also better liars. They are better at venting and gossip. That's why the movie Mean Girls was made about it wasn't mean boys, it was mean girls. i understand what you mean that empathy may be a little bit higher in women on average but something tells me that those aren't the sorts of women that are going to be seeking out your content so i wonder whether or not we're um putting a performance enhancing drug on top of women who already maybe have this disposition and you've identified yourself there's wow i didn't know that men would feel guilt if they cheated on their partner wow i didn't know that men would feel you know there might be another wow i didn't know that men actually might be able to feel pain of being ghosted or do they men feeling the pain of being ghosted absolutely i would say so yeah i think if a guy is look there's certainly men who understand that applying an awful lot of romantic pressure early in a relationship can get a woman to fall for them but what they're doing is trying to emulate the realness of that.

1:19:29Yes. There have to be men that are just doing the realness thing, right? Not everybody is trying to play the game or else the signal wouldn't work, right? The thing is, men are far more likely to be Machiavellian, far more likely. It's like 1 in 20 for men. It's like 1 in 100 for women. Okay, so you're talking about 5 % versus 95%. that's true that's a fair point you know you're right that the men that are the the sociosexual few at the top now it's interesting it's actually the sociosexual few men with the sociosexual few women doesn't tend to be the guys that are like the 80 20 thing doesn't seem to really be that true anymore i understand what you mean i understand why why it's important for people to understand how manipulation works i think what's dangerous is when you start to teach people to do it in reverse.

1:20:19That's where you, what you do is you create the incentive to damage people who are trying to do things legitimately. So the romance, the love bombing, the care, the attention, the affection, it might just be a guy who's like, I found my fucking woman. I found my woman and I can't stop thinking about her. I'm gonna do the flowers thing. I'm gonna send her the messages. you know the disney princess romance movie thing the exact rom-com stuff that i think a lot of women want and what i worry is that those women become skeptical of the motivations of guys doing things with all of the legitimacy that they wanted and everything is seen through well that's love bombing you know if he's texting you three times in an hour that's that's that's too much or if you get flowers after the first because it's if you don't ring a girl that would be bad but if you got flowers the next day that would be too much it's like well i don't know maybe he's just like oh my god that was the greatest night of my life i found my wife he's telling all of his friends or maybe he's a fuck boy that you're just on the roster you're in the whatsapp broadcast list and working out the difference between those two i worry that there might be some women who basically lose the person who was doing the thing they really wanted because they're seeing it as a tactic as opposed to an emotion does that make sense that's the purpose of shit tests so you ask them to go slightly inconveniently out of their way to help you in some way so I'm not saying you have to help move her house or something if she's moving house you have to go handle all that but it's like do you mind picking this up on your way here do you mind meeting me here even though it's a little bit further from you do you mind it's the utility stuff because a man who loves you or cares about you or wants to genuinely be with this woman and he's like oh my god I love her so much this is fantastic I've met my woman they're not gonna have a problem with that so you're looking for effort exactly yeah there's a words mean nothing there's a line from Matthew Hussey which is invest in people based on how much they invest in you exactly and that is for him especially softly softly Matthew Hussey like quasi sociopathic right because it's to do with the transactions to do with the as long as you show up for me I look I I don't disagree with also realistically how many men are going to actually take you to Paris later that night?

1:22:45They promise you in the morning and coffee. How many are they going to actually take you to Paris that evening? I guess it depends how good the sex is. Tell me in the past how you've dealt with breakups.

1:23:02Okay. So I broke up with – I tend to accidentally break up with guys on their birthdays. So one guy, I broke up with him and he was like, he drove to my house and he was sitting outside and he was crying and he was texting me constantly, please come out, please come out, please come out. On his birthday? On his birthday. I didn't know because I didn't ask. So I was like, I'm not coming out. I'm not interested. I'm done. Please leave. And if you don't leave, like, I'm not going to come out regardless. It's late at night. So I just, I was watching him cry in the car. How did you feel when you were watching him cry?

1:23:38I think I laughed a little bit and then eventually got really pathetic so I just closed the blinds other people I tend to be as gentle as I can or I tend to just move very slowly away so I'll start to draw back like there'll be less communication there'll be less effort from me there'll be less prioritization like not clean cut you don't just say sometimes I do sometimes I'm just like okay we have we're incompatible in this and this and this and these are things that we cannot overcome so we just need to handle it and so I've dealt with all kinds of like breakups with people so I think the most effective is generally fading away the most effective way to break up with somebody yeah because the ones that I tell them that we can't work out they're always like oh no I can do this and I can do that and I can do this and we can make it work it's like, I don't want you to.

1:24:39And they don't take that as a final answer. Even I don't want you to isn't taken as a final answer. Yeah. That's happened to me plenty of times. Rather than giving justifications, in the past, did you try saying, I don't want to be in this relationship anymore and not give a justification? Well, once I called a guy that told him he was getting fat. That's still a justification. I don't want to be in this relationship anymore No, I would not do that Why? I don't know I've just not been a person like that I wonder whether there's something about that utilitarian thing coming through again Well, there needs to be a ledger of some kind I have to have a justification for this But that's actually, needing to have a justification for it is actually quite a human thing Yeah, so it's like letting them know that something exists not necessarily them actually doing it so if like so i'll set up an arbitrary boundary of like don't text me before this time and then they start doing it regularly and i'm like okay like i've given you this and like my actual motivation would be completely different to how i presented you just don't want to be in the relationship but you made this rule interesting let's say that you had neurotypical children Yes.

1:25:55Would you encourage them to date a sociopath? Yes. Why? Because if you earn a real sociopath, real psychopath, if they are genuinely on your team, you have someone who is willing to harm people for you. They are ride or die for you. They're in your corner. They're choosing to love you every single day. They're not a slave to their emotions and the brain chemicals. They are making an effort to be there for you. And Dr. K, he's from Healthy Gamer GG, he even spoke on this. He said people who are capable of these heinous things have chosen to be on your side and they will carry out the instrumental damage to other people for you and they will be your shield.

1:26:41So I think there's absolutely, like, first you vet the crap out of them. Vet them, vet them, vet them. Even sociopaths, psychopaths, the mask slips. regardless if you if i hung out with you for a week it would slip fully you would see it no matter how hard i try it will slip how long because you know you can hold together a two-hour podcast relatively well what when does it begin to get difficult a couple of days in a weekend a couple of weeks a week a week you'll start seeing what does that look like what to start seeing you start seeing like less enthusiastic responses you'd see like less courteousness although more callous more callous definitely more callous like it's less me trying to appease or you know trying to cater to somebody it would be you know the true self coming out do you think some men get turned on at the idea of being manipulated yeah they do they come into my dms regularly they're like asking me if i can manipulate them they'll give me money for it and it was like pay pig stuff but manipulative pig stuff yeah yeah yeah pay pigs and then there's like submissive men especially they'll come up to me and they'll be like oh I find you so attractive or I love that you could like make me do anything and you say the most vile things and still are so hot and so I get that a lot and I find it really repulsive because I don't anything that's linked I guess to sexual gratification is something I find really dirty.

1:28:17Casually. Yeah, casually. And that's exactly what they're wanting. I mean, they're getting off on it. I'm like, it does nothing for me. Interesting that I had a friend in university who was doing financial, FINDOM, financial dominatrixing. and this guy would send her, I didn't realize how it worked. It's fucking gnarly. This guy would send her his pay packet at the start of every week or at the start of every month and she would drip feed him 50p, one pound, one pound 50 daily and he would have to beg and she would have this, all of these videos and stuff and it was a consensual, unconsensual relationship because the whole premise was i need you to send me more no i won't but then at the start of each month she would get his entire pay packet and there was a time when the car was out of gas and he was married with kids the car was out of gas and he needed to drive to work and she just sent him 50p and said get the bus instead he said that can't even get me there and she said we'll just walk and you go okay at what point does this weird kind of self mistreatment kind of like financial self-harm that you're legitimating somebody else doing on your behalf yeah ethically i still have no idea that was it's like self-fifteen fucking years ago and i still don't know how i feel about it yeah um but it's strange that some people can get off sexually with that and what your distaste is around is the fact that they're feeling sexually even if you don't feel it yeah i don't know that's very interesting i don't like them other feeling of them thinking they can i guess sexually have power steal pleasure in a way yeah exactly i think it's interesting that you're you're sort of stopping you've got this disconcerting sensation around And men wanting to be manipulated by you, I feel like part of the status issue as well is it's such a lowering of them in comparison to you.

1:30:31It seems like pity is a little bit of an element in here as well. Is that fair? So I've had a lot of guys come up to me on Tinder or whatever and say, you're too good for me. And there's something really disgusting in that for me. It's like either he's trying to get me to like compliment him to the point where he's at the status where he believes me to be or he wants me to abandon my own self and, you know. It's a game or it's low self-worth. Exactly. Exactly. And so when they say that, like when they said it before, I used to be like, okay, let me just respond with something nice. And then I realized most of them are really terrible people.

1:31:11and if you're automatically disqualifying yourself then like i have no reason to show any interest in you and i don't find it attractive that you don't have any self-respect it's just it's something that's icky i don't like weakness and i don't like um pathetic sort of situations like that what are some of the things that you don't understand about yourself Why I have so many hypocritical positions on things. Why I've cultivated an audience that isn't anything like me. Like I'm a conservative. I want a conservative base. I want to be able to talk about politics. I want to be able to talk about things that I care about.

1:31:55and my audience is just capturing me in this place where I have to pretend to care about their ridiculous and quite often degrading and degenerate behavior like I've cultivated this and it pisses me off and then anything with psychopathy it brings more women more crazy women in my inbox and it's like it's great if they're buying my book okay it's great if they're booking coaching sessions but I hate them so it's like this there's this like duality of it and it's like you either provide me use or you don't and that's kind of a position I have I also don't know why I support women in general when women have caused me the most harm out of everyone uh i also feel like how i expect empathy and stuff from other people even though i can't reciprocate um the weirdest thing about me is like i would say oh the weirdest go on yeah the weirdest thing about me is that um i get really confused when people don't like me like i will like i'm saying people i don't even know and they're in relationships with other people who are not me like it makes no sense it's like i i know logically they don't know i exist right but it's like how can someone be in a relationship with someone who is not me is that the grandiosity i think it is i think that's narcissism narcissism but yeah like a really solid example of what a psychopath or alleged psychopath is is kandis alans so over time she drip feeds her audience like little bits of, oh, here's more information about Charlie's death, even though it's got nothing to do with Charlie and she's just trying to get views.

1:33:44That's a psychopath's play. How can someone detect if another person's a sociopath or a psychopath? First the eyes, then you could do a simple test, the yawn test, smile test. We don't yawn when you yawn. We don't smile. Laughing isn't contagious for us. It will generally mirror what your positions are. Tilted head means more like we're looking like we're actually trying to understand everything you're saying, remembering your name, all of those things that are very, very specific. Compliments on obscure things. I like people's noses. And so I think you have a nice nose. And I think there's like Rob Lowe is my ideal because he's got like the perfect, most tiny little nose.

1:34:29So things like that, like there's the peculiarities of psychopaths. And another thing that you would notice is, so we have weird justifications in our head for things. And so, you know BTK, Dennis Rader? No, who's that? He was a serial killer. Bind, torture, kill. Okay. Yeah. He wouldn't rape the women that he killed because he said they'll be cheating on his wife. And what's it? Ed Kemper was like, yeah, I killed her, but I never hit her. So it's like there's this weird little things that you'll notice that are off. And you'll tell that if you can study people's faces, there'll be little microaggressions.

1:35:12Like usually when you lie and get away with it, there's like a little bit of a smile coming up. And like I don't know what the direct term for it is, but that's really, really something you'll see. And also with actions you'll see. Psychopaths will help you only when it's useful for them generally. But if they are helping you in times that you are offering nothing in return, then you've made it into sort of a successful relationship with a psychopath. Who do you think some of the most famous sociopaths in the world out there at the moment are? Candace Owens.

1:35:48Justin Trudeau. Gavin Newsom. J.D. Vance. Who else? JD but not Trump not Trump Trump's a narc he's a narcissist okay yeah who else is

1:36:09there are so many Kevin Spacey please don't kill me Kevin Spacey they all seem to go I think you're the wrong gender for Kevin true true who else Angelina Jolie you think Angelina's a yeah yeah sociopath I think the front of being an ambassador for charities and not speaking out for the Jews and not actually acknowledging that women were raped and tortured on the 7th of October in 2023. That's really hypocritical. She loves stealing other people's men. She literally breaks up relationships on a regular basis. She seems to use people a lot for what they have and nothing that she does seems like it.

1:36:53It is genuine affection. But also Mark Zuckerberg, he's like a lizard. You can see he doesn't blink. That's something you should probably look at. So the Mark Zuckerberg thing, that was before he had his sartorial revamp. Yes. As soon as he started wearing chains, all of that stuff went away. Yeah. Look, I've spent time with Mark and I was like, okay, I'm going to fucking lock in. I'm going to lock in on this guy and I'm going to check, like is there a second set of eyelids or whatever? I'm not here to fucking shill for matter or Zuck at all but like he is

1:37:31outstandingly normal like outstandingly normal uh I watched him and Jocker Willink roll BJJ together I don't know I I looked I looked real close I'm like you really didn't notice anything I'm pretty good at reading people really yeah yeah I'm pretty good at reading people and I really I didn't see anything at all a nice guy around his family nice guy around his kids but you don't know him behind closed doors it's true but I you know it was like two or three days watching him interact with staff watching him interact with definitely you know a real sort of high thinking airy distracted sort of kind of guy but like who the fuck has managed to build businesses like that and doesn't have that skill I don't know I'm hey I'm not the I'm not the sociopath whisperer here um ariana grande is a prolific homewrecker oh yes i was going to say ariana as well but do you think can someone be a homewrecker without being a sociopath yeah they can but the way that she does it is in the most malicious way possible like that's her goal is to break up the relationship it's not that she's just madly in love with this why would that be why would that be something useful or interesting the breaking up what's there's joy in watching the pain like that's i guess a side of sad is in that but you haven't talked about that We haven't talked about the sadism thing.

1:38:47You've talked about wanting to get revenge on people that some girl says something that's mean and then you do something. The sadism side seems to have fallen away a little bit. Well, I haven't really gone into detail. Well, let's go into detail. Tell me about the sadism part of it. so I purpose there's a lot of people that I purposely like I tell them that I like them and whatnot I like show them vulnerability so that they'll show me theirs and then I actually enjoy watching them suffer I'll give them incorrect advice so that I know that they are not not my clients but literally I will lead them astray I know exactly how to turn them I know exactly how their mind works I can make them or I can break them and seeing someone begging you to see them and like being a fully grown man crying, there's a satisfaction in that.

1:39:39There's a lot of satisfaction. What's the sensation? It's a thrill. It's like a thrill. It's like adrenaline. It's like, oh my God, look at what he's willing to do for me. Like power. Power, yeah. Someone submitting, I guess. And that's something I like outside of, I guess, sexual relationships or romantic relationships. I don't really like submissive men. I think they're disgusting. but I'm saying in terms of like seeing emotional pain that is something that I enjoy like I write the most like I think funny insults and I'm like I'm like you have less integrity than Reinhard Heydrich so let's not get into that um but there's a certain sort of suffering like where you leave an emotional gap for them that they desperately need closure from you and so they'll like run like run in circles trying to please you trying to get that out of you and I will never give that person closure because I know then I'll have control over them for the rest of their lives people try to get over it but I've had people from nine years ago tell me they're having dreams about me and so I feel like to a level it's working and there's also with the physical say of the physical sadism was more something in childhood like I would enjoy watching them get injured I would enjoy watching them like bleed I guess I would enjoy pushing her off the stool because every single day she had a new bruise um I used to but now I think because I guess there's an element of being charged as an adult for crimes like that or like for fraud if I start stealing credit cards again or if I see people like for example when I stole a credit card from a girl's wallet at university I went and I was comforting her where she was like someone went on a shopping spree with my card and I was like that is so awful people are despicable people are really bad I was like hugging her meanwhile I was spending all her money so there was that kind of delight in like watching her do that and then you know the girl that I ruined the pageant one there was so much like joy in seeing her like go into a level of depression that seemed unbearable because her depression is not like my depression as that i don't think it is um so seeing that struggle and that one felt righteous though it's righteous i feel it feels like those it's i did the girl with the credit card do anything no she canceled the card i mean did she do anything to justify the stealing of the card.

1:42:13No, I just wanted to. So I can see, this is where for me, the real discomfort comes in, which is if you do something to someone and you get an outsized piece of revenge, horrible, very painful, but at least in the equation of normal human psychology, you can understand it. It's when it's senseless, there's no justifiable reason. There's no understandable explanation for why this thing happened that to me is where i go holy fuck because i think the reason it feels that way is there's no control that if you decide to poke the bear too many one too many times and it hits you okay at least if i don't poke a bear i'm not going to get hit whereas if i'm just some girl who didn't do anything didn't try to say something mean to you at Miss Universe and then the country of Venezuela comes after me.

1:43:09I was just some girl that had a handbag and there was a card there and now it's gone. And then I'm being manipulated into thinking that I've got a friend and the friend's actually spending all my money. That feels a bit different. Yes. Yes. And that's why I don't do that anymore. But maybe there's something in the subconscious level that I didn't know what, I had a reason for it, but nothing comes to mind. Could have been jealous of her. Could have been something else. anything really do you ever wish that you could feel normal emotions and care for people like a typical human i feel like i already do that for people who are worthy of it like i don't do it for like what am i going to get out of being kind to someone who's not going to like support me she's not going to be in my corner when i need them it's very um it's just time consuming to care for many many people and sometimes do i wish i could be not be behind a glass wall sure it's lonely sometimes it is and people don't realize that people don't realize how like hard it is to actually deal with this this disorder and people try to fake it and they want it and it's like it's actual hell like you never actually feel like a full you know functioning person i feel like i didn't really grow up either like I talked to friends that I've you know I haven't talked to them in years and they will have like children and they're doing all this and I'm still in the same mindset and it's like it's really frustrating even though I've achieved quite a lot since then like I like you know I was on my dream uh show the other day on Sean Hannity because I used to watch him with my dad when I was little and so that was like amazing and I do all of that stuff and I've been at the trials of Ghislaine Maxwell.

1:44:54I've done all of this stuff. I was literally in her bathtub to get a photo. Consensually? Well, she wasn't there. She was in prison. So her house was up for sale. So it was like the perfect time to go in and get evidence. You treated it like a museum. Yeah, exactly. Interesting. Yeah. I was just trying to see the logistics of that bathtub and how many people it could fit because Virginia Dufresne was saying that Prince Andrew had ripped her in that bathtub. And so I was just trying to see if that, like, you know, panned out. What did you discover? I could barely fit. I'm five foot. As far as I know, Prince Andrew is six foot and Virginia was five eight.

1:45:40So if I struggled in there, I'd... That feels like a flimsy bathtub for somebody that's got a lot of money. her house did you judge her yeah her house is trash but it's in kensington so it's like expensive post yeah exactly so i understand about i think i've got normal emotions i think i do have emotions for the people that i care about do you know the difference between uh local maxima and global maxima yes cool so you can only optimize the things that you know exactly stuff that you don't know you can't optimize for and sometimes you're stuck inside of a local maxima there might be a higher high or more returns that you can get by trying a different approach.

1:46:20But if you don't know the approach, you're constrained by what you know. I'm wondering, I'm trying to give you a very utilitarian justification for perhaps broadening that. I like that. That it does make sense to do things for people, even if you were looking at it totally sterilely, apart from the fact it's good and pro-social and rah, rah, rah. it makes sense to do things for people that you can't see a direct return from especially if they're different on new things because you don't know what you don't know and you don't fully understand how that repercussion could come back around many times you talked about somebody from nine years ago that you've forgotten about is still being affected by you you might not have known nine years ago that that would be the case so you had a local maxima there and there's a global maxima that's higher by doing something you didn't know about the same thing can happen in the positive way too.

1:47:10You go, I'm just going to do this thing for a friend and maybe they pay me back, maybe they don't. And then something happens. The return that comes back around from this, even if you couldn't have done the calculus, ends up being unbelievably positive for you in your life. So I wonder whether you're going to slowly accumulate more of these algorithms where you go, huh, that's an attribute. Because what you're doing basically is a very slow walk of pro-social human evolution just inside of one person. Like you're having to learn it step by step by step, as opposed to being bootloaded with the source code that most of us have got.

1:47:48And what I'm interested in is, first off, if you make it to the end of life without getting into some like real real trouble but secondly how far along that you get it's like how many human normal human behaviors are you going to learn psychologically through deliberate practice and because you said before you had uh physical um and like criminal tendencies more so they became a little bit more domesticated okay now i've got friends okay now i've got a partner okay now i've got now i've got responsibilities exactly yeah and you go okay how far along are you going to get through life i think that's kind of that's actually a great question so i think that like the christianity really helped and charlie kirk really helped get me there it was the fact that you know he he would say like do one good thing every day for somebody and the thing is i am i love showering people with gifts and i love like taking care of them even if i know that i Like they could pay me back maybe, but there's just like, I just like that.

1:48:54So sometimes like with the love bombing, sometimes it's like I'm genuinely excited because I'm so flat that things will sort of, I need things to happen to actually feel anything. But in terms of actually developing pro-social behaviors and learning from other people, I feel like I'm doing that. I feel like I'm doing that on a regular basis. I feel like the traditions and the authority of the Orthodox Church is helping me like being because I actually love hierarchies I love hierarchies I love presumably if you're quite high up them um but the thing is it's like there's this discipline that it teaches you that I don't have and I want to learn it so you have to stand for yeah you have to stand for two hours for the service there's no you don't sit down there's no pews um you have to fast wednesdays and fridays that's a that's a way to reduce gluttony um and that that the church is a hospital so if you're sick or if you've committed sins like what i have they don't treat you like a criminal they treat you like a person who needs help at a hospital um and the priest they don't judge you like so it seems it seems to me that the forgiveness element is a big part of that but how is it that you're learning the value of forgiveness for you but not applying that to other people.

1:50:14If this is now the new thing, which is one of the biggest life changes that you've gone through, I would assume, okay. I'm trying. Receive, give. I am trying to be more forgiving to people. How's that going? It's hard. Because my priest says, if you can't pray for them, just pray for yourself. And you harbor less hatred for them until you are at a point where you can pray for them. and I just feel really connected to them because like I love the advice that they give I love that it's like a spiritual father so I have my natural father I've got a spiritual father who I can run decisions by if they're like you know something that would be harmful to other people like I like having that as a sort of restriction and I like the stability of the church it hasn't changed in 2 ,000 years so there's like there's this sense of traditional circumstances traditional like values that I had in my home um I don't think that that necessarily I can do everything a normal human can do like we love in our own way we have care for people in our own way it's just a lot of people don't make the cut, unfortunately.

1:51:32And I'm trying to get to that stage where I'm able to do far more good than bad. And I feel like I'm well on my way to that. I've heard that you're some special type of soprano as well. The coloratura. Can I hear what that sounds like?

1:51:59I can't do that. No, nobody can. Kanika Batra, ladies and gentlemen. What's coming up next for you? Like what do you want out of the next couple of - I want to write another book. I want to be a commentator politically for the conservative movement because it's got a big rift in it at the moment. And I would like to ideally be on the way to having a family and be baptized into the Orthodox Church. I'll be watching with interest. I appreciate you very much. Where should people go to check out everything you do? Everything's on my Instagram. My website is kanikarose.com. It has my book on it. It has the Concilium where I teach you how to avoid manipulation and how to get your freedom back from the cage that is your brain.

1:52:49Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Hey, it's Ryan Reynolds here from Mint Mobile. Well, now, I was looking for fun ways to tell you that Mint's offer of unlimited premium wireless for$15 a month is back. So I thought it would be fun if we made$15 bills. But it turns out that's very illegal. So there goes my big idea for the commercial. Give it a try at mintmobile.com slash switch. Upfront payment of$45 for three months,$90 for six months, or$180 for 12-month plan required. $15 per month equivalent. Taxes and fees extra. Initial plan term only. Greater than 50 gigabytes may slow when network is busy.

1:53:21See terms.