Mostly Wise: Matt McCusker, Andrew Huberman & Tom Segura - #1102

20:45Andrew Huberman:Well, there's also this interesting memory. Like, Tim Dillon made me laugh so hard one time at the comedy store with the I am your mother thing. Like, before I saw it online, I saw him do that whole bit. Is that what you call it? Yeah. And now when I see Tim Dillon, I start laughing. Like, I'm kind of at the edge of laughter. And I'm not expecting him to make a joke. It's just somewhere in my unconscious mind. Like, that's cute up. Just associated him with funny. That's cute up. And I'm just like, this is going to be so good. He taps into something. Yeah. so it's it's just he's really fucking good oh fuck man especially when he's ranting like he's ranting show it's like it's impossible i've never seen anyone better actually as ed and tim he's alone it's one of the hardest things because when podcasting start like started big in comedy it was probably like oh nine 2010 is when people started to like really and when i would see the guys who could sit alone and do the hour alone and and make it interesting and funny i had tried it one time and i fucking died i feel crazy i feel you felt crazy myself yeah just having a conversation with myself because like where'd you go bill did it really well her notes help yeah if you at least type out some thoughts it can help but just go pretend conversation with yourself yeah i do talk to myself a lot but if you're trying to like sell it it's that's tough because it usually doesn't make sense.

22:03Yeah. You're just talking about what your face is doing the whole time. Do you do it alone a lot? I've done it a couple times. It freaks me out. It feels good. When you do it, it goes well. You feel really good. But when you lose the thread, you're like, I'm a Russian. But you've got to have some place to go to start. It helps. Alex Jones. Yeah. Alex Jones, the OG. The OG. Legend. Another level. For doing what? Just being able to solo fucking, like he was the original yapper. Yeah. Right? Three hours a day. Dude, that's wild.

22:28Andrew Huberman:Isn't that like the Rush Limbaugh kind of thing? Yeah. kind of built off that that's true yeah yeah I feel like Alex Jones kind of built off Rush Limbaugh but with Rush Limbaugh like coked up yeah like coked up yeah and then a bunch of very costly to him false statements a couple about school school shootings one with particular he was fed misinformation he wasn't he fed himself misinformation nah that was I don't want to get involved in the lawsuit I don't know what happened to him but you know I'm going with the original news story on that one. They got them. The onion now own InfoWars. Yeah, they own InfoWars.

23:05That's so insane. Yeah. They bought, I don't know whether it's - And is there a more onion thing to do? I know. It's too perfect. The first video they did was an impression of Alex Jones drinking the blood of Christ and it was red wine. And he's like, it's available at the InfoWars store. If they'd released their own red wine under that brand, like InfoWars red wine, blood of Christ wine. Doesn't he owe like a billion dollars? It's like a hundred. It's like a hundred. Really? Jared, ask Chad. I thought it's like hundreds of millions of dollars.

23:32Andrew Huberman:At least a billion. But everything around him, even though he's apparently a comedian and a bunch of other things woven in there too, gets real, real, real fucking quick because someone got shot and killed on his team here in Austin, right? He's talking about school shooting murders, this kind of thing. There's something he likes to, I don't think he wanted that thing to happen to his staffer, obviously, but stuff just runs really into reality very fast with him. He goes there and it comes back to him. Like, not good boundaries. Yeah, it'll happen. No, no, no. What is Alex Jones' – The fine. What's he being sued for?

24:08Yeah. What's his fine? I mean, he got absolutely buried. That's for the Newton thing. What's the settlement? The settlement. $1.5 billion. $1.5 billion. Holy shit. $1.5 billion.

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25:34Andrew Huberman:I'm still wondering if Chris's experience on reality TV made him a better actor or better at reality. Ooh. Fuck, dude. I mean, I was, oh my God. That was 11 years ago. What show is it? You'll never, season one. Oh, you were the first person through the doors of Love Island. What? Love Island. Brit hotties all together on a island? Yeah, yeah, yeah. Me, I was the hottie. Yeah. Yeah, that's right. Yeah. Yeah, dude. That was a - That's awesome. It was kind of like Navy SEAL Hell Week, but for reality TV, because you don't get to leave. Like, locked in this villa. No phone, no internet. But to his point - With a bunch of hot women.

26:09Andrew Huberman:Yeah, sounds a lot like hell. Let me call up some of my friends or a team, guys. How many hot women were there? Similar to your situation, right? Yeah, right. Just horny to get on TV. You're not getting a lot of sympathy. Yeah. Do you find yourself in a reality show, there is like a bit of posturing and like there's cameras. So you have awareness. Literally everywhere. So do you find yourself kind of like putting on, you know what I mean? To a degree. It's really weird because they work super hard to try and hide the cameras. So let's say that we were talking here, there'd be like a plant in the middle.

26:37And the plant would have one of those little CCTV things that they could just spin around. So you're not like aware. You're never really thinking about it. And there's the huge, big, almost like sports TV bazooka things. And they're over the far side, right? So this would be a bigger room. Whoa. And there'd be shit over the far side and they'd be zoomed in. And then the villa producer would come over because they want to poke the storyline. They can't take three weeks for you to ask this girl if you can kiss her. It's like, it needs to happen fucking today. Yeah. So I'll come over and I go, Matt, how do you feel about Chris asking Andrew out?

27:05Well, you know, I thought we were friends. And it really turns like we're not. And he felt a bit betrayed by him. He go, what I think you should do. why don't you ask him to go and have a chat over by the fire pit and you go over to the fire pit and there's a fucking army of different photographer videographer people all around there but they're all outside the bounds and you're not allowed to talk to them you can't talk to them and this is the fucking maddest thing you never knew what time it was and they feed you booze too right i was in their booze they put a limit on after my season okay strategically right uh but even the the camera guys and the drivers if you ever needed to go off site to go and do a date or something.

27:42They all changed the time on the car radio. They changed the time on their watches or took their watches off. It was insane. You never knew what time you went to bed or what time you woke up. I think it's so they could control our sleep and wake pattern. Whoa. It was really kind of weird. It's very cultish. Yeah. But I think it was just so that they could lock you into whatever you need. The first night we were there, everyone was super excited. We stayed up until what must have been two in the morning, three in the morning. And then someone got up. And there's half as many beds as there are people.

28:09so you're always sleeping with a girl each night oh and then i know hell week hell week yeah it's fucking butt school thank you sure man and you say butt school or butt school

28:22and then we woke up the next morning and they came over the tannoy and they were like hello islanders you've been asleep for three and a half hours can everyone please get back to bed because no one knew that we'd only been asleep for a little bit of time one person's up and I mean, like, well, I guess we must have been awake for a while, whatever the fuck. So it was wild.

28:40Andrew Huberman:Not to inject some science, but because you said they're telling you how long you were asleep and you don't know how long you were actually asleep. There's some really cool data that show within limits. If you see a great sleep score, cognitively and physically, you perform better the next day, even if your sleep wasn't that great. Really? And the reverse is also true. If you see a lousy sleep score and you actually slept great, your cognitive and physical performance takes a dive. Are you saying that the best wearable, like the best thing that Whoop could do would just be to always lie to you and tell you that you're feeling great?

29:10Andrew Huberman:Technically, yes, within limits. So if you sleep three hours, right, and it says, oh, you had a spectacular night's sleep, you're not going to compensate for that lack of sleep, right? So it's when you're down or up about an hour or two of sleep. So the real solution to this, sorry to make it so serious, let's go back to Love Island. No, no, no. Butts or buds or whichever one it happens to be. Booty school. the best thing to do would be to check your sleep score against your subjective like you write down you wake up in the morning like feel like I slept great and then at the end of the week you compare your score to what you how you actually felt so maybe check in like every four or five days as opposed to got a 90 I'm good ruined today yeah or more importantly if you get a lousy sleep score you don't necessarily want to let that you know worm in your brain It brings me down.

29:56Andrew Huberman:But this is like a real effect on real cognitive and real physical performance. It wasn't some like corny in-lab test. I mean, this stuff can make a big difference, especially if you're operating at the level that you guys are and you're getting out there and like, you know, I need to get this just right. So anyway, sorry to inject that, but since they did it to you, you know. So did you fall in love on Love Island? I was only there for 20 days. I don't think that's long. Dude, I've fallen in love many times in 20 days. I think I read about that. 20 times in one day. I think I read about that.

30:26Andrew Huberman:That was something entirely different. That wasn't love.

30:32Andrew Huberman:That happens. Now I fall in love 20 times a day with one person. There you go. She's so rad. That's cute. That's sweet. Are you threatened by the retard maxing movement? Have you heard about this? That's a great question. That's a great question. That's a good question. You look right at me. Yes. Let me answer that the way I think you intended it. Yes, I am personally offended. Threatened. Wait, did you wake up and are you like, I'm retard maxing today? Is that what you think? What is retard maxing? All right. It's awesome. No, I actually. What is this? I heard of look maxing. There's looks maxing.

31:09Andrew Huberman:Then there's a guy who does what's called retard maxing, which was popularized by, of all people, Mark Andreessen, who's easily one of the smartest people I've ever met. Know Mark real well. He's a big fan of retard maxing. retard maxing is this guy on the internet who what you want to explain oh i'm loving yeah so you know with all the stuff about get up in the morning and you know do this and do that and you know don't be retarded when you have a problem or all the kind of stuff that that you know chris covers you know like about emerging dynamics of male-female relationships and self-perception and philosophy and he interviews like you know real thinkers and they have british accents and that kind of thing.

31:48Andrew Huberman:This guy sits in his backyard. It's basically a farm. And he has this thing that he calls retard maxing, which is where you basically just don't think about shit at all. You just do what needs to be done. If something bothers you, you just ignore it. Wait, is this the CEO that is like, I don't sell for flight? But that was Andreessen. So Mark Andreessen came on the David Center. Yeah, so Mark Andreessen started Netscape. Right. And now he has A16Z, which is one of the biggest investment firms in the Bay Area and all over the world, frankly. and he came on the David Senra podcast, which is the guy who also does the Founders podcast.

32:24Andrew Huberman:David Senra podcast, incidentally, put out by SciComm. We loved the Founders podcast. So we brought Senra over and he brought Mark Andreessen on. And Mark Andreessen said, he used the words, these are not my words. He said, great men of history did not sit around thinking about their thoughts and introspecting, you know, like introspection is not what we need to be doing. We need more action, less introspection. Actually, Dana White kind of doubled down on this recently. saying that he's not, he, he, um, is not a fan of people, men talking about their emotional challenges publicly, you know, that it's like, get up, go to war, make money for your family, sort of the old school kind of stoicism thing.

33:02Andrew Huberman:So the, the Mark Andreessen thing mobilized a big discussion online on X in particular, one sort of angle of attack that he opened was, all right, here's a billionaire who doesn't like introspection and, you know, and I know Mark very well. He's not a sociopath. He's not, he's a very, very kind person. I know his family. He's an incredible human being at many levels. I'm going to catch a lot of shit for saying that, but that's the truth. If you actually know him. All right. And now he's retarded. Now, no, no. He then made a plug for retard maxing. He was like, hey, there's this guy on the internet who basically doesn't say shit at all.

33:35Andrew Huberman:He just says, just handle your business, do what you need to do and stop thinking about things so much. Don't ruminate so much. And he said he was a big fan of this retard max. So building off looks maxing. And then that caught some momentum. And so now the big thing is introspection. Like, should we introspect? Should we think about and reflect on who we are and what's challenging us? And Dana was basically saying, hey, listen, I think the point Dana was trying to make was that men's mental health, while critical, right? Suicide rates are way up. We all acknowledge that. He made a very good point, which is oftentimes getting into action and doing things as opposed to being online and thinking about your problems And rumination is a very dangerous place to be.

34:16Andrew Huberman:Yeah, I think so. He said, get up and work and provide for your family. But when he and Mark said these things, it came across as a little bit dismissive of the idea that emotions are relevant. And I do think, you know, they have a point in the sense that I think we need to balance out some of what we've been hearing a lot of over the last few years. Sure. Which is that we need to think about every aspect of self, every aspect, you know, like, oh, too much therapy is not good. Yeah. If you spend your time just like thinking and not doing, because it feels like that's kind of the note behind the note, right?

34:50Is like if you just sit and introspect and think and you just sit in like, I feel this way and you never actually take action, then you're just literally not doing anything. but I think there's kind of levels to like, I think it's good to, to be introspective to a degree, check in with yourself, you know, express how you feel, but don't just sit there and say, this is how I feel and then don't do anything.

35:13Andrew Huberman:Yeah. I mean, there's a, there's a kind of a larger, perhaps deeper discussion around like to what, and Mark interesting has said this as well, like people who've tended to accomplish a lot of great things oftentimes have some pretty rough edges. Yeah. I grew up in the town where Steve Jobs was around. and he used to come in and get rollerblade wheels at the skateboard shop where I worked. And like, he was kind of a rough edged guy. And he didn't wear shoes. And he wanted what he wanted. Then he was known for yelling at people. He would drive 95 miles, but like you, this guy. Yeah, likes to drive fast.

35:42Andrew Huberman:You know, he got, you know, and so there was this site, there was this time up until phones with cameras. Thank you, Steve Jobs. There was this time up until phones with cameras where people were kind of celebrated for being big personalities with some rough edges. but for the great things that they did. Now it's, there's a movement largely from the left of like, hey, you know, everything needs to be rather tempered, right? You can't be a big personality unless you're perfect in every dimension. And if you look, I mean, historically, you look at any public figure now, like you're gonna find, as you said, there's that dark and light.

36:19Andrew Huberman:Those, and Mark's whole thing is those things go hand in hand. Like great CEOs oftentimes have some strong disagreeableness. They rate highly on disagreeableness. They're conscientious, right? But they also are kind of high friction people. But some of the, like, you know, Mark, and you're like, this is a good, but some really high achievers, historically, even now, men, let's say, that are really high achievers, they get a lot of things done and have accomplished a lot, are also, like, from many people's accounts, like, terrible people, you know? I guess the question is, how close are those people to the actual person, you know?

36:55Andrew Huberman:that are saying that? Yeah, I mean, I think right now there's a lot of hatred of billionaires. Sure, yeah. And look, I was born and raised in Silicon Valley. So going big is like a thing. Like even my friends had gotten into skateboarding in the Bay Area. Like they weren't thinking about becoming billionaires, but like the Embarcadero Plaza in the early 90s, those guys like started big companies. They went big. Rob Dyrdek, he's from, you know, Midwest, but then came out, he shows, and then he's like ridiculous. I mean, I have no beef with it whatsoever. Going big is a theme in tech, right? Yeah, yeah.

37:25Andrew Huberman:and everyone uses these platforms and everyone hates these people but i don't know i'm i know some of these people i'm not like super close with them yeah i i like mark i trust mark i like the other mark i trust that mark too um i know you know various folks at who run these big companies and do i think they're perfect no no of course um but i could listen if i were talking about noble prize winners past and present man the men and the women very complicated people sure like you want to do a deep dive on the complications of science funding? Like look up Jonas Salk and who he married and getting money.

37:59Andrew Huberman:And then the work that he was able to do by virtue of his marital relations and things. I'm not saying he used his wife to make money for funding. Many, there's many examples of this in science, you know, money fuels science. You can do more science with it. So there's a lot of interesting and it's not sorted. It's just sort of, it's, they're still humans. Yeah. You know, so anyway. But if you've got constant CCTV, because there's a phone camera within two yards of you everywhere on the planet, those rough edges look a bit more harsh when they're scrutinized. Is that what you're saying? Yeah. I mean, I have this whole opinion, this purely opinion now about what cameras have done to sort of what we need in order to really make a strong assumption about somebody.

38:45Andrew Huberman:So in the, like in the past, you could just say, Hey, this person, like, I don't like them based on one thing they said. And you're entitled to do that. But I think two things have happened in the last couple of years that have completely transformed, like what our expectation is about how rumor matches up with reality, at least for me. One would be, and this is an unfortunate, it's a bad incident, right? Would be the, you know, there was all this speculation about Diddy and these Diddy parties, right? And everyone expected like at some point there's going to be a video. Guess what? There was never actually a video aired, right?

39:15Andrew Huberman:But there was a video of him beating up this woman. That sort of raised the threshold for what people need to see in order to be like, okay, that actually happened. Okay. The other one was this Coldplay concert thing. like that Coldplay concert where the couple got caught cheating or whatever like whatever the context of their backdrop of the relationship was totally uninteresting to me but you could not have created this was like opera right they're at a concert they're cheating the guy goes oh look at these two lovers right the guy is not just any guy from one of you right yeah there's this moment where they're in the like oh that's us then there's this moment where they're like oh shit yeah so it It went from kind of like delight to shock.

39:58Andrew Huberman:In an instant. To shame. And then, so we got to witness the whole arc. Now, I wasn't interested in that, but the whole world jumped on that because it's like the human drama playing out in real time. So now when somebody goes, oh, I heard that this woman had a kid with this guy. I don't even know their names. You guys probably do. You know, and she named her kid after this guy. And like, oh, it has this kind of low level, like whatever, what happened between Justin Baldoni and Blake Lively and this and that. And it's sort of like, yeah, where's the video? Show me the video. People don't, people, and so the press can go back and forth and back and forth and people kind of pick their camps.

40:33Andrew Huberman:But I think real things being captured on real video has set the standard, like not standard, low standard, high threshold. And so I think that's changed. So now if somebody goes, oh yeah, these guys are, you know, sociopaths, you go, show me the data for sociopathic. People actually now need to see data. It's not sufficient that somebody write some little thing about one little thing. They need to see the video. The video is what actually shifts people's minds. So if people are saying, hey, this billionaire founder, this billionaire founder, this billionaire, these guys are terrible people. Right, right, right.

41:06Andrew Huberman:How are they terrible people? Yeah. Show me them being terrible people. I don't want to see it, but I just don't see evidence of it. So I think it's just turning to chatter and I think it's just going to turn to fog and then I think it's going to just go away. Well, yeah. I think a lot of it differs though. It depends who it is. There's different billionaires doing different stuff. But I agree. If someone just has a billion bucks, I wouldn't hate them just because it's like, you shouldn't have that much. When you're busy and you're doing well, I think it's very easy to get upset with other people because it's a lot easier than getting up and doing something.

41:33Andrew Huberman:Retard maxing is hard. It is hard. That's 100 % true. Also, good news, I think the couple, the guy who did Squeeze Boobs at the Coldplay concert, I think he's back with his wife now. Wait, Squeeze Boobs? I thought that was Al Frank. No, he did over the shirt second base on the Jumbo crowd. That's what he was caught doing. He was hugging from behind. He was honking from behind. But he was a boss. He was, yeah. And he was married. And she was HR, which nobody touches HR TV. That's wild. That's crazy. And she was married. Behind Honk on HR. Honk, yeah. She was the HR lady. He was the boss. It's like the most forbidden thing possible.

42:03Andrew Huberman:She did this whole thing. Like New York Times ran this thing about how hard it was for her afterwards. They tried to do this kind of rescue tour. Yeah, she's a promotional speaker about getting, you know. Getting her tits squeezed. Yeah. It's like that doesn't define me, basically. Yeah, yeah. I have more than that. And the real question is, what were the rules for HR at that company? She can never get hired again. You can never be HR again. You get harmed once, you're done. Yeah, you can. Yeah. Yeah. Only fans. That's your only job. I do think. You can email yourself about the fact that I was molested in anyone.

42:34You just want to be like, have you got any evidence?

42:36Andrew Huberman:Let me put it in your arena. With comedy. If I watch comedy, like in the Tonight Show in the 1950s, it's very ho-hum, right? Yeah. For now. Yeah. But some of the stuff that was on game shows in the 70s was kind of edgy, right? You know, you'd like kiss the guy's wife. Oh, you know. And then now we've, there's just so much that's been out there. Yes. That your threshold, just like eating very, very flavorful food with a bunch of crap thrown in it. Like it raises your threshold for what you consider sweet or salty. Yeah. So there's just sort of like emotional recalibration that needs to happen, but we're still on this.

43:11Andrew Huberman:I don't like that word ascension because it comes from that. Like, look back, same thing. Shit, all the words are taken, right? That's true. All the words are taken. Yeah. Yeah, all the fun ones. But in any case, sorry, you were going to make a point. I was just saying that I also just think it's super lame that everybody just goes, I hate so-and-so because they're basically successful. That's a big thing in society now is, eat the rich, hate the, punish them. It's like, sure, I understand sometimes when they go, this is like a legacy thing where this person just inherited. But when people start a company and do well and then you just hate them because they did well, it's a it's really it's interesting the taglines eat the rich or tax the rich not help the poor right yeah punish them not encourage people that are supposed to be it's the first step right which is we don't like those people so we do like these people and we think that they should be helped also everyone uses these products i mean i mean like you know if you really truly hate somebody so much yet you're willing to you know defect from their their product line but everyone uses them.

44:18Andrew Huberman:So obviously they don't hate them that much. Have you seen - What if you put a bumper sticker on your Tesla that says anti-Elon? I bought this before. I drive a Forerunner, but I've heard these new Teslas that drive themselves are awesome. They're everyone. Those RoboTaxis. It's just so funny to buy a car and be like, by the way, I don't like it. I don't like it. Just drive the car. Or just sell it. Sell it, fuckface. Like you hate it so much. Just sell it. What are you driving nowadays? This guy's like, are you a car fanatic? No, I haven't. I haven't seen you. No, not really. I appreciate his car.

44:45It's all Porsches for you. I like Porsches. Yeah. Yeah. It's fun. I like, I still love my, I honestly love my GT4 the most. It's my favorite one. It's not even like the craziest car that I have, but it's the, you, I think when you get into cars, you're always like, oh, level up and the next crazy thing. And then you find that like, oh, that's the, what you actually are looking for is the fun of driving. Sometimes the fun isn't in the craziest thing out there or the fastest thing. It's something that the feel, the experience of driving is the thrill. And for me, it's still that car. It's like relationships.

45:19Yeah, exactly. Yeah. Same thrill. Have you guys seen...

45:26Still the one.

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46:05and best of all, Momentus offers a 30-day money-back guarantee. So you can buy it, try it every single day for 29 days. And if you don't love it, they will just give you your money back. Plus they ship internationally. Right now, you can get up to 35 % off your first subscription and that 30-day money-back guarantee by going to the link in the description below or heading to livemomentus.com slash modernwisdom and using the code modernwisdom at checkout. There's people making AI versions of their exes. Have you seen this? What?

46:33Andrew Huberman:What are you? Oh man, I could have fun with that. Unbelievable. Pull it up. You load in all of the previous chats that you've had with your ex-girlfriend, your ex-boyfriend. This is so good. And all of the photos. And then you train the AI to create an exact replica of them. And they know where you've been on holiday and your little in-jokes and the cute names that you call each other and all of your memories. And then basically, it's like you're still in a relationship with them. Like you never broke up. That seems like a healthy thing to do. Sorry, you're saying, to indulge in this. Oh, I thought you meant to put it out to the internet.

47:08Andrew Huberman:Oh, that you could date my ex? To attack the internet. Date my ex. This was my experience. You can see how this went. I would just fight with it all. Yeah. Hey, look, I know that you think that I might have been in the wrong here, but you can interact with my ex for five minutes. Who's the asshole, me or Melissa? Look at the gaslighting. Yeah. Oh, I wonder if you could just feed it all in, like who was right. Well, this is, this was on OpenAI. I played around with OpenAI's playground. Are we in Reddit? We're really down in the gutter. Create your own chatbot and plugged in scripts of text messages.

47:40And basically, like, she's saying it's a way of coping to mitigate some damage done to other people or even my ex. Because I direct any desire of reaching back out or having to rebound to chatting with the AI. I don't have a sex drive except for wanting my ex to touch me again. So there's the other issue. This has been satisfying my emotional needs. She does go a little bit further down. She's like, I have been training it to be a little bit more like him. I'm like, this just feels like you're trapped in purgatory with this relationship. This could really be a disaster. It could be a fucking nightmare.

48:11But the other thing is, like, is this a little... Do you own your own likeness over text message? Is this a little bit like, I don't know. I guess you can replay the nudes that your ex sent you. There are definite laws about what, I mean, she can put certain things out there perhaps,

48:27Andrew Huberman:but I don't think you can... She's not making it public, right? It's just like, it's just privately funded. Yeah. But I feel like this is ultimate. Like she says - It says, I love being your little spoon. I love being your little spoon. X. And then it goes, X. That's my favorite cuddling position too. I love being able to wrap my arms around the world. There's no way that's healthy. No way. I get the part where the line of like, this is going to help me from reaching out when I shouldn't. Yep. But ultimately - I love that. No, it's not. No, it's not a favorite. It's not good. It's for sure it's not going to - Wait, wait, wait, wait, wait, wait, wait.

48:55Andrew Huberman:Hold on a second. We're in the data now. Me. I always love being your little spoon. Okay, I could imagine a woman saying that. I'm assuming that's a woman. And then him, X, assuming it's a him. That's my favorite cuddling position too. I love being, Chris, did you really write this? I didn't write this. Why'd you blame me? Is this because of the retard? You're still bitter about the retard? No, a little bit, a little bit. That's an ex-girlfriend building almost like a nuclear weapon text against you to be like, I figured a lot of things out with you and I figured out how I can fix you. Read what this version of you does and do this.

49:28yeah yeah oh my god that's terrible it's a training data wait do you ever think about you know you're talking about cameras everywhere do you think that with the amount of cameras out today that's why we don't have serial killers really anymore like you know i mean because like

49:44Andrew Huberman:now they just do mass shootings yeah yeah yeah they get all they all get is like very economical they should get it all done at once yeah forensics but also cameras are everywhere Dude, Ring Doorbells, we got one not long ago, and it's crystal clear audio. So I'll get in a fight with my wife, walk outside, and be like, fuck this. And I'll be like, oh shit, I'm right on camera. I mean, like, you're fucked up, man. She's going to build that into the script. Just watch out. Yeah, I need to grow up. Fuck you. That's when you feed the Ring Doorbell camera into your XAI. No, they're everywhere. They're on every street.

50:18I think there's more cameras in America than China, if you include private ring doorbells and all that stuff. Because I watch these crime things all the time, and it's like somebody commits a crime, and they're always just like either ring or like at a, you know, like when you go through a toll, and it's like somebody gets like, they always get caught so much quicker with technology. So you don't have like all the, you know, growing up you had like all these crazy killer BTK and Bundy and all these guys, and like I feel like you don't, there's never those stories anymore. Like those stories. But they get caught so quick.

50:50That's what I'm saying. Because the communication as well. So I was watching Worst Ex Ever on Netflix. And there was that Wade Wilson, the Deadpool killer. This dude that was in a relationship with like four or five women at once. Tight. He - Do not recommend.

51:13What? he um he killed he killed one of them and then just went on a spree like killed one and got a woman for off the street that was walking to after dropping her kids off at school asked her for something locked her in the car strangled her to death jesus then left her in a field and then was like just ready to go and do it again and again and again but like you you just go on a run and then you get caught and then it's done right yeah like there's no do it like 10 years 20 years you can't find somebody you know like yeah oh you can just be able to move and like your family couldn't find you yeah you just go to another state but it sounds like you've you thought of it i'm no you just be able to do that the fuel station the petrol station i will say i before i got married i tried that where i was doing online dating so you're like we're just dating it's casual there's like something weird about online dating then i was dating like four or five women and i remember being like just be honest man i would like tell them the deal and they'd be like fuck you get out of here and i'd be like oh fuck i'm never telling you this again i'll keep this myself for now do you mean tell them the deal what do you mean well like you're going on online dates and it's just like very fluid and you're like you were not like boyfriend girlfriend we're just on dates and you know it's like they can't really tell you not to date other people and then i'd be i remember like so but then you come up with this like web of like relationships that's like not really that deep but it's like like by the minute gets deeper and deeper and as soon as you're like hey here's i'm actually dating other people they're like what the fuck and you're like I don't even know you like this.

52:37How long would you be into it before you would? A month. A month? A month maybe, I don't know. You'd gone out several times. Yeah, I start feeling myself. I'm like, here's the deal, babe. And they're like, get out of my house. And I'm like, all right. I tried the Dan Bilzerian approach for dating. It failed. It doesn't work. Yeah, to be honest. Watch this. This is some type of gas station, and the awning or some type of structure completely collapses. shoddy construction work it's not quite infrastructure but look who springs into action yes a black man loitering outside the uh gas station this is big come up hustles over to get himself tucked under to pretend he was caught in the wreckage for a settlement that's pretty two cartons of newports and a thousand i'll be out of here i'm not mad at that guy dude that's it's also the american dream it's hilarious that is the american dream right there i i was thinking about this the other day falling is like a billion dollar industry falling just falling if you fall there's billions of dollars to get paid out every year in america for gravity is free this is the biggest life hack of our time why is no one arbitraging gravity that's my favorite thing i've heard all day do you know uh the comedian russell peters yeah so he's like a very famous uh indian canadian comedian and his brother clayton is his manager and he told me he was at the CBS lot in LA for a meeting and it had rained and he slipped and fell.

54:07And he said, the people at CBS were like, ah, what do you want to do? And he was like, what? And he's like, like, like he'd hit someone's child with his car. Yeah. No, they were like, we don't know how to make this up to you. He's like, I fucking fell. Like I slipped and I fell. And they're like, so what should like, we will, we'll hire like the orthopedic surgeon. We'll, you know, we'll get like, do you want to like call your lawyer? He's like, I'm Canadian. We don't do that. So he's like, I fell and I have a bruise now and I'll be okay. But like the, the people on the lot were like, are you going to sue us for falling?

54:47Terrified.

54:47Andrew Huberman:Yeah. Terrified. Well, this is the merge of this plus cameras. When you get into an Uber now, there's like cameras going out, cameras going in. Like you can bet every conversation you have is, you know, recorded. That's the advantage of a Waymo. The advantage of a Waymo. That's recording everything. That's definitely recorded. Yeah, where? Who's it going to? Huh? Who's it going to? Indian data center? China. Dude, there's a guy I got in. This isn't great, but I got in a Waymo with my wife and kids and we let the kids sit on our lap because we weren't like going far at all. And they called us right away and we're like, yo, what's up with those kids?

55:17And I was like, what do you mean? And they're like, how old are they? I was like, nine. My daughter was like, I'm six. I was like, shut up. The guy laughed. Oh, that was even your kids? The dude laughed and was just like, you get in the front, put your seatbelts on, here we go. We were just in our neighborhood going to a pond. Have you ever touched anything in a Waymo? So I've been in the front seat and the windscreen - No. Sorry. The windscreen was dirty. And I was like, I'm going to help. I'm going to help. So I'm going to press the thing because it was on my side. And I had the windscreen wiper thing like that.

55:52Immediately, the car starts flashing. says, like, do not touch any of the controls. We're pulling over. Pulled the car over to the side of the road. And then this, like, school teacher comes on and says, what are you doing? Like, why are you touching the fucking windscreen stalk? The windscreen thing was dirty. And I thought I was, I started to get panicked. I was like, I feel like I'm in trouble. I feel like I'm being told off by a teacher in school. And they said, okay, we've put a mark on your account. and if this happens again, then your account will be removed from the Waymo. The interesting thing was it was my housemate's account and he was sat behind me.

56:28So I got him a strike on fucking Waymo by trying to clean the, but yeah, they do not want you touching. Don't touch the thing.

56:34Andrew Huberman:Yeah, I took one in San Francisco. It was wild because I got in and I was like, this is really odd. And then it was going up through the Pacific Heights and I forgot there was no driver. Like, obviously there's no driver. You're in the back seat, but it's just wild. Like it drives so well. can they go on motorways yet i don't know no i think it's all back roads i don't know is that yeah i think just the speed yeah yeah whatever the fast big ones yeah yeah they'll be on soon but i think it's just back roads now i do the same thing i forget there's not a driver i'll get out i'm like thanks yeah it's weird what's that tell us about drivers I don't know.

57:09Usually they kind of yap. I usually get the yappy driver. Do you talk to your Uber drivers? Oh yeah, big time. I love it, honestly. You love the conversation? Yeah, I'm the one of the only people I love chatting with the driver. What are you asking? Whatever. I usually let them kind of do the thing. I'll let them start the combo. Or I might start if I'm kind of bored in the back. I'll be like, how's it going? Is it busy? It depends. And then they'll just start going. They love to talk. Man, I got in one in an Uber and the guy was like, where are you from? And I go, Austin. And he goes, I was just in Dallas.

57:37He's like, the CIA fucking killed JFK. And I was like, what? Oh, no. And he's like, I did the whole tour. I can set you up. I go, I don't want to go on the fucking tour. And he just starts going off. He was like, it was a 12-man job, I'm telling you. I was like, okay. Was that Alex Jones? I mean, it was definitely a listener. This is crazy.

57:57Andrew Huberman:I have otherwise completely rational friends who do not believe that the Challenger explosion was real. That's like their new thing. Yes. The number of conspiracies that actually hook now with otherwise basically reasonable people is staggering. Have you ever looked at any, and I mean any post from NASA on Instagram and gone to the comments? No. Can we do this? Any fucking image they're like, you know, like they'll be like, there's people on the space station right now. Look at this image. And everyone's like, fake AI. You guys are trying to fucking ruin. like you're tricking us this is bullshit who's buying this shit like thousands of comments for anything they post the word on the street is that NASA was founded by like a Satanist that's what someone said there was like a this is what I'm talking about that's all I'm saying that could be true though that could be true well as a I was like you're a logical science based person yeah I believe in science and engineering look at that this is nice yeah but that's that's Mother's Day do sort by newest that little error here we go more propaganda yeah nice yeah Yeah, fighting Earth is, I mean, that could be a flat Earth.

59:05Don't pick, all right, but hold on. Yeah, I mean, I could see them getting kind of crushed, especially if it was the moon, they'd be getting attacked. Oh, they have moon stuff. Earth is undeniable, that's tough. They have moon stuff for sure, man. Jesus Christ, brief us about, go back up to that essay. It's actually pretty supportive, I'm saying. Brief us about the reason.

59:22Andrew Huberman:I don't think people were wondering if the recent mission was fake. I think it's about the classic missions. and there are some like just basic questions i wish nasa would just answer directly yeah like rogan's always bringing up some very reasonable questions like how come the phone call was so clear and like from it just explain how was it that the phone call was made from from the white house from you know um cape canaveral like just explain them the the engineering behind it yeah you know you have to do it in detail you feel like look that is a bullshit it smells like bullshit Yeah, exactly.

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1:01:05Do you feel like any of the, let's say, big ones of the top 10 are legitimate to, are interesting to you? We need a category. Yeah, what do we need? Because there's so many, right?

1:01:17Andrew Huberman:I mean, there's like the Pizzagate thing. There's the Adrenochrome thing. It's a huge one. The moon landing thing seems pretty easy for NASA to resolve if they actually care enough to resolve it, right? You know, I don't doubt that the photos were, you know, there were some exposure adjustments perhaps done to those photos, but that's not what people are claiming, right? People are claiming this was fabricated. It was a set. So it should be pretty straightforward, right? I mean, I'm always agnostic about it because it's like, yeah, it could totally be real 100%, but if we were politically pressured to beat Russia, they could totally do a set and be like, yeah we did it you know i feel like the day that elon claims that the moon landing was fake true i might get on board that hypothesis because he knows a lot about this whole space thing and he's not afraid to say whatever yeah and yeah no one's thinking he's not spending his let's put this way he's not spending his time going on it to go back there he's got a different target yeah and i would think that he would raise his voice but i don't know elon that's not one of the people I was referring to earlier.

1:02:18Andrew Huberman:I've never met him. We've been in the same physical space with other people at a gathering, but I've never actually spoken to him. So there's definitely something that happens with conspiracies. If you're sat around a table, especially with people that spend a good bit of time thinking about conspiracy theories, which I don't, I love listening to people talk about them. And there's kind of like this race to the bottom of the iceberg where people go, Oh, what you think that Epstein killed himself? Well, really what happened? Oh, you think that Epstein didn't kill himself? Well, actually he transcended to a third, a fifth dimension and it all it's like this weird one-upmanship game of who's got the most intense deep 4chan rabbit hole yeah he didn't know they've gone down guys he didn't kill himself i mean come on there was a suicide note there was a suicide note that was written like his roommate have you seen what his roommate did his roommate's like an ex-cop right who's i do i think doing four life sentences oh the cellmate that was the murder yeah like i'm gonna trust that guy you know yeah the guards were chilling there's somebody going up the stairs like also he was a narcissist everyone agrees on that like they don't tend to kill themselves yeah there's something just i mean who knows maybe maybe he was serious i saw that note the other day online and maybe he was like okay this is no fun i'm out but like does not seem consistent with everything else there's things that lend itself to i mean he also basically changed his will uh what two or three days before where he passed everything to his brother, which you could interpret as somebody getting ready to check out the hyoid bone that snapped.

1:03:51If you talk to certain forensic pathologists, they say it's more consistent with a homicide than a suicide, the way the force with which it was broken. Right. So that lends itself to murder, not suicide. But yeah, it just kind of depends on. I retard Max from conspiracy theories. I go, maybe, I don't know. Literally, I don't know. That way everyone, you're just perfectly in the middle. I genuinely have no idea. Okay, you don't know. I have no, I genuinely, if I'm - You're agnostic. Yeah, I have no idea. Like it's plausible that it was all a giant government cover up. Also, I don't know. Like I have no idea.

1:04:24People I know that have worked - Literally just like -

1:04:26Andrew Huberman:In the government doing, you know, like spooky shit, like online spooky shit and that kind of thing will tell you that the government is pretty inefficient, even at the highest levels, that it would be very hard to do clandestine things within the most effective organizations, their sub-organizations. So if somebody wanted to run countercurrent to like everyone around them and be the, you know, that's tough. You could get a small collection of people, but then it's hard to keep a secret, right? As we know, human beings. I don't know. The Epstein thing was wild. I have to say that that blew a hole in the internet for a while.

1:04:59Andrew Huberman:Oh yeah, it's huge. You had people from the right who were on that list and in the emails on the left. What was so interesting to me is that kind of like the video theory that I had earlier, you know, which is just a thought and a theory, really. The files were interesting, even though they were incomplete because they were real-time correspondence. It wasn't like, I heard someone say this and then they said that. It wasn't a deposition, right? These were the real emails at the time. You could have fed it into a chatbot and had a conversation with you. Have you seen this thing? There's this like Gmail where they turned all the conversations.

1:05:30Andrew Huberman:And then they have another one, which is a plot where you can put anyone's name in and it shows the number of conversations they had with him over time. Like, it's wild. Yeah. Yeah. And, you know, he sat at the nexus of a lot of different people, organizations, and it transcended. Again, right, left. It transcended academia. I mean, he was connected. He was so connected. And what's wild is the people who were approaching him and wanting his time, many of them had tons of money, tons of public accolades or private accolades. Like, they didn't, like, I don't understand how it is that people just continue to seek him out.

1:06:07Andrew Huberman:It was wild. Yeah. Wild. It was really interesting. It was crazy that somebody was that connected to so many different facets of people in life. And they overlooked the fact that he had already been convicted of. Yeah, that was the wild one where it was just kind of like, if you didn't know that, whatever. But, like, when people are like, yeah, this is public record, you're like, eh. Like, Bill Gates met up with him. So, like, not a conspiracy theory. And you can look this up. there's a guy i know because he was kind of peripheral to the science community i never met him he was actually kind of a lousy failed scientist named al seckle this great big fat guy who uh study visual illusions right and but he his data were always kind of anyway he ended up marrying gillaine maxwell's sister he was in charge with a small group of other people of basically trying to bury uh epstein's sex offender status after he you know was convicted the first Was he the one that helped to get all of the headlines out?

1:07:00Yeah, so they created like Jeff Epstein, whatever, sports or whatever.

1:07:03Andrew Huberman:And so it kept putting this stuff out. Yeah, yeah. What happened to him? He was found dead at the bottom of a cliff in like 2015 or something. The French government won't comment on cause of death. Like there are a lot of dead people around this. There's another conspiracy that I was like, oh, I didn't know what happened. It felt like, you know, when you go like, you pick up on stories, but you don't really follow it, which was the Butler assassination attempt of - Of Epsi? No, no, Trump. Oh. Where you're like, oh, this guy was a shooter, and then it just kind of - You mean the recent thing? Not the - First one.

1:07:40The first one. The one where he was campaigning. There's fucking three now. Fuck. Okay, so hold on. Hold on. The Gulf Coast one.

1:07:45Andrew Huberman:There's the one in Pennsylvania. That's what I'm talking about. The outdoor one. That's what I'm talking about. The ear. The ear. The ear. That's what I'm talking about. Okay, you're talking about that one. Have we ever seen a photo of that guy? Well, the thing is, the investigation was just shut down. They just go, this is what happened, and then there's no further investigation. Trump's got him living in a box behind his desk. Yes. It's a weird... With a fall gag. I mean, it's what... He's like, I'll handle the punishment. Why don't we have more of this story? It's just kind of a fucking modern-day assassination attempt with a rifle of a former president who's campaigning.

1:08:22Do we even know the name of that? The person who's supposed to be? I have no idea who it is. I don't remember who it is. That's kind of wild, right? That's crazy. That is crazy. It fully evaporated. Yeah, it's called the memory hole. And then, I don't know if this is true. They said that, like, that as he was being helped up, that the flag was being lowered for the photo. I don't buy that. I mean. I don't buy that. Look it up.

1:08:43Andrew Huberman:But if we were to, if we were to. I'm retard. I'm retard, Max. If we were to Google. That's good. If we were to Google, what is the first and last name? Or put into AI. Now we don't Google. we put into AI or chat GPT, right? Yeah. If you were to put into chat GPT, what is the first and last name of the person who attempted to assassinate President Trump, but grazed his ear with a bullet instead? Does anything come up? Are you guys like afraid to do this? No, it definitely comes up for sure. His name comes up. Yeah. But any history on the guy who he is? Are we too afraid to do it? That thing was shut down.

1:09:13Can we do that? I would like to see it actually. Nobody, we're just like, that's what happened. It's going to be like Peter Brown. It was such a quick news cycle that even the public forgot about it. And this is what people say about the Iran thing, that the Epstein files were getting too spicy, so we're going to invade Iran. And if you do the Google trend data, looking at search volume for Epstein and then search volume for Iran, they just fucking cross over. Matthew Crooks.

1:09:36Andrew Huberman:All right, so - Thomas Matthew Crooks. And what do we know about Thomas Matthew Crooks? Yeah. Fucking sweet fuck all. Like, where'd he go to high school? What's his, you know, what does he do? Well, can you - Yeah, it's kind of weird. Was that investigation shut down? Like, was the further - Because there really is no... If any of you guys disappear in the next 48 hours, I know we're completely effed. Oh, wow. Okay. Concluded. Okay. He acted alone. No evidence of coaxing spirit is a broader plot. Officials said they never established a clear motive. I think the motive... I guess it's nothing else to investigate.

1:10:06Andrew Huberman:The motive was to kill the president. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Duh. So the FBI criminal case was effectively closed. Is there a photo if you just said image of this Thomas Matthew Crooks? Because somebody went to school with him. Somebody knows him. Someone's chat GPTing because she's his ex. I mean, come on. Yeah, it's funny because the last assassination attempt, I remember being like boring. It was just, it wasn't even fun. Weird. So they just kind of let it just wah-wah. Yeah, it was just strange. It seems strange. Thomas Crooks. Retard maxing. Yeah. Definitely not look maxing. He's going to get out of jail and kill you.

1:10:42Andrew Huberman:That's not the young version of the looks maxing guy? Jesus. Fuck. He was 20 years old. so young to do. That's wild, man. Taken too soon. Man. Face caved in too soon. Also, how do you know where the, like exactly where the president's gonna be? That whole thing was so fucking weird, man. That's, you never. You have like the Secret Service snipers everywhere and a guy's just like, I'll climb up on that roof. Yeah. At this thing and people are like, there's a guy up, you can see people going like, there's a guy up there right now. There's a lot of, well, he didn't have as much Secret Service then, right?

1:11:14Andrew Huberman:Because he was running and there was, you know, Secret Service working for a different administration but I don't know what the rules are. They all blamed it on that girl Secret Service. That was the worst part. They're like, is that a fucking girl? When I... That's what happened. Everyone was like, oh, obviously. I had a next door neighbor. I don't want to mention who it was on camera. He lived next door. And so the Secret Service were parked out in front as long as one of his close relatives was president. And so I would talk to those guys and gals. They're really nice people. And I asked them, I'm like, you know, how do you deal with your political affiliation versus who you're pretending?

1:11:46Andrew Huberman:And they're just like, it's a job. Just like military, we talk about it. Like we just, we take orders. They had a good post. This was, you know, in Southern California. So they liked that post. And they'd rotate in, rotate out. And, you know, some of them will be a little open about it. But it was interesting. Secret Service was started as an attempt, as a unit within the government against counterfeiting. Yeah, counterfeiting. That's how it started. What? Yeah, that's how they started. If you counterfeit bills, Secret Service gets it. They still visit you today if you have counterfeit bills. Yeah, they handle counterfeiting.

1:12:14Did George Floyd get popped? Was he not using counterfeit money? No, at a local level, it's like you got to be counterfeiting a lot. So at a local level, they can just turn you out. But if you have, if you're like actually producing. You're the guy that George Floyd bought from. Yeah. If you're doing it on a scale that's causing like even like a, you know, a larger economic. Dent in the economy. They use it a lot in drug, like drug sales. It's like you use counterfeit bills. It's like you can't tell the cops like somebody gave me counterfeits. Wow. Originally created in 1865 to fight counterfeit currency, not to protect the president.

1:12:45I know a guy who did counterfeit bills in high school. Was he any good? They were terrible. Yeah. What does that mean? Well, I mean, his versions of like, he was trying to make 20s at the house. Yeah. Fucking crayon. You know which one? You can bleach. You can bleach. He got Secret Service visit though. Yeah.

1:13:04Andrew Huberman:I got to be careful with this because I don't want to reactivate any old web searches. I don't have anything to do with this, but I went to high school with a couple of really smart kids who had some really smart parents who got really smart about making fake IDs. And there's a big business for that in college. Right. Cause a lot of kids go off to college. Like I was 17 when I first went off to college. Right. And so turned 18 my first year. So you're not buying alcohol. You got to get someone to buy it for you. And so they were selling fake IDs out of their dorm. It was in the early nineties and they did time like real time.

1:13:36Andrew Huberman:And these were, you know, not hardened criminal kids before going in. It turns out that, you know, someone got, and this is wild. They had this going for a long time. It was great money for them. And someone got pulled over and accidentally handed over a fake ID. Cop ran it, you know, ran it through the system. That laddered up. And eventually it was an FBI sting. And this kid and his like cohort, they did real time. They rounded up the pole like you do with the drug dealer. So like the fake ID thing is no joke. Yeah. Because it's counterfeiting. Yeah. I got pulled over at 16 and I had a fake, like a good fake for the time and that moment where i was like reaching into the wallet and i know that's my fake and you and my reel was here i had to reach behind and give the and like that moment you're like yeah is that super legal to give legal super illegal to hand over i think if you if it's like a whatever it is falsifying documents yeah you're getting a lot of trouble well so people go and buy alcohol and then get into a car accident there's all this liability This is like the parents who like buy their kids booze.

1:14:40Andrew Huberman:They're like, well, I don't want them. You know, I'm going to, I'd rather have them drinking at home and they'll give, you know, like booze to their kid and their friends. And then a kid drives home and gets into an accident. Like parents have done real time. Actually, there's, we're really going down the trench, but you know, there are a number of instances that are. Have more Yobamate. It's good. What's that? Have more Yobamate. It's good. I'm going to keep you fucking ripping. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. My filter just goes, my GABA level drops at 5. PM. Anyway, people who know me like after 5. I'll say whatever.

1:15:09Andrew Huberman:All right. Exactly. We record podcasts early in the day, too. I'm on two hours back. I'm still California time. I'm not full Texan. Oh. You guys are going to have to teach me. You know the Texan thing? There's a whole thing, man. Really? Take you out to a ranch. There's an indoctrination. Yeah. Yeah. We're going to go to - Is it more about dropping the California stuff or you add in the Texan stuff? I think you got to add some Texas. Yeah. Okay. Yeah. I mean, you guys look serious. Where were you before? Were you California before? I was LA in 19 years, yeah. Okay. So you can teach him the transition.

1:15:34oh man yeah i got a fucking nine millimeter i'm gonna give you when get out of here yeah get your concealed carry going i mean i don't mind guns but i'm not into guns yeah yeah they do kind of scare me i used to i like i used to just have my brother's gun for a while and i would like look at it and be like it's scary i would be like high in my house increase the

1:15:55Andrew Huberman:probability somebody gets shot significantly yeah exactly i would just be stoned and i would like would just be a there was like a gun on my table and i was like fuck that's crazy i like never touched it's a device for killing yeah yeah or things exactly it's yeah no i believe in the the right to bear arms but um where were we you were saying about the parents who feed the kids alcohol and get yeah i mean there's a lot of stuff now about parents doing stuff to you know give their kids access to something and then a kid doing something really stupid and parents doing real time yeah you know it's um it it's a whole different landscape now in terms of uh like when i was growing up like every kid in high school like he'd end up like drinking on a weekend or something a little bit here or there and back then it was the mothers against drunk driving it was all the drunk driving thing now that does apparently there there's a lot less death due to drunk driving because of uber yeah right kids don't drink as much either that's good yeah it's great i'm not a big fan of alcohol well yeah and it's also crazy if you're like you got to think about if you if you like i like drank in high school college but if someone had a camera on me at 18 when i was drunk that's that's like you can just ruin your whole life for what you say anything yeah what you say anything yeah so it's like if you're a kid now you're like yeah i gotta kind of keep it a little tight but then like the thc stuff is way up right that's what i read that the consumption of yeah edibles or like especially the beverages that have them are also some people can do it and look my whole thing is like people think i'm like anti-cannabis or anti-alcohol like You can have a couple of drinks a week and be fine if you do a bunch of other things correctly.

1:17:24Andrew Huberman:We're talking about adults, right? With kids and with adults, the cannabis thing is tricky because some people can do it and they're all right. Other people who have a predisposition to psychosis, like they can end up with some permanent psychosis. People are predispositioned to bipolar. I mean, it's a real thing. And it got very political for a while. Like I got attacked for saying this when being pro-cannabis was associated with one political party. Then when the pendulum, it's interesting that the Trump administration was, I am totally apolitical. Like I'll just come out. I'm a double hater.

1:18:00Andrew Huberman:I don't like anything I see. That's a great term. I'm like, I grew up punk rocker. Like, fuck them all. Like, honestly, like I see. That's a more activated version of you with conspiracy theories. Yeah. Double hater. Like, I don't know about either of them. I'm a double hater. because I see certain things I like in certain people and what they're doing. And then I see something and I go, you got to be kidding me. And I see that on both sides. So it's very hard for me to reconcile that, right? And it's not like music. I can't just be like, all right, well - Not for me. Kanye, you know, amazing musician, you know?

1:18:28Andrew Huberman:But these other things are a little bit like, I don't know, you know, maybe look into that. But there's the, you know, but the cannabis thing has gone from, it was a very left associated thing to now the Trump administration has been making some serious efforts to, you know, legalize psychedelics like Ibogaine, which is not a recreational psychedelic. You know, a lot of liberty around substances. And then the left will sort of, the news will, the left-leaning news will kind of print against cannabis. Then they'll go back and forth, which just tells me one thing, right? Because the right side does this too, which is that they have no heart.

1:19:06Andrew Huberman:They have no stance, right? It's all just algorithmic ping pong. Blow with the wind. Yeah, so the reality, is some people should use cannabis if they want to, no problem. But I hear from lots of, in particular, moms of guys who are in their 20s who, including some people who were doing very well in life and now their kids are like in full-blown psychotic episodes that won't reverse. And it's very hard to know who that's going to be, right? But certainly there are people who can use cannabis, no problem. Well, even if it's not, oh, it's caused some long-term psychosis problem for me, it's not exactly a performance enhancer, right?

1:19:39Like this happened, I think, in the 1700s or the 1600s when coffee houses first started in oh yeah uh in britain yeah and because people used to go and drink ale all day and they're just fucking drunk and wasted you're not gonna get anything done when you're wasted yeah and then coffee comes along and people what's all of this fucking productivity i've got in front of me and it's kind of the same you're well cannabis no one's died from overdosing on thc apart from i don't know you get into a car you

1:20:05Andrew Huberman:fall down some set there's no road rage from cap well i mean there's road rage from caffeine but no one's coming home and like beating up their spouse because they drank too much coffee I could be the first. Dude, I got to show you this video. You seem pretty mellow. I get mean. No, if I have enough, if I have enough, my wife's back. Have you ever seen the video of when you're definitely drinking coffee? Drink driving ban. Drink driving got introduced in the U.S. Just no drinks at all? Yeah, so watch this. That's bullshit, bro. Get out of here. Watch this. Oh, yeah. I love this. To restrict drinking and driving here is viewed by some as downright undemocratic.

1:20:36It's kind of getting common. It's when a fellow can't put in a hard day's work, put in 11, 12 hours a day, and then get in your truck and at least run one or two beers. They're making it laws where you can't drink when you want to. Baby in the passenger seat. You have to wear a seatbelt when you're driving. Pretty soon we're going to be calm in this country. Hell yeah. Unreal. Just at the fucking best. I will say, if you had worked outside all day for 11 hours, you can drink one beer on your way home. That's fair. One ice cold beer anywhere. Dude, you could get that passed here now. Yeah, you could.

1:21:09One ice cold beer. One road dog. Excuse me, sir. That looks like an ambient beer. In the 80s, we would be in a station wagon in the very back. No seatbelt, just all my siblings. Yeah, like five of us. And then a semi would come up to here. And our parents were never like, this is dangerous. That was just normal. My parents, when we were little, they would go, everyone have their seatbelts on and we'd all go ha ha we'd laugh because they were like i'm not wearing a fucking seat of course everyone my whole family held it down like wearing a seatbelt was like weak it's like you know what are you scared what are you scared why are you wearing a seatbelt

1:21:50Andrew Huberman:yes yeah what do you what do you i now i wear that how old are you uh 40 38 i'm 50 you're 47 i know full of shit you're 47 we think it was 55 yeah it's 47 man I thought you were my again I'm the senior in the house he laughed that's fucked I don't know why man you look great you fucking dick when I shave I look 46 dude I'm just getting you back because that one fucking family gathering you sold me out what happened no no no yes no nope nope Nope. No. I'll walk out. I'm like, legit, I'll walk out of here. I'll walk out of here. I've been pretty open today. I like to think I've been pretty loose, a little open.

1:22:44Andrew Huberman:I'm only on my first mate. It's actually my seventh mate. Seventh? That's why you're so spicy right now. Yeah, man. That's fair. Okay. Jared, you ever considered that you might have a drinking problem? I don't consider all that, Chris. Well, you drank an entire case of Athletic Brewing Coke last night. But they're non-alcoholic. And that's not a problem? Sorry, man. I just kept chugging, waiting for the regret to creep in. Never happened. See, most people, like Jared, don't want to change what they drink. They just don't want the next day to be a complete write-off. And that is why I'm such a huge fan of Athletic Brewing Coke.

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1:24:01did you lift today huh did you lift today no i lifted yesterday yeah that's why okay yeah he's usually a little more chill if he fucking this is true yeah i know yeah jocko jocko was moody with me the first time that i did an episode with him and someone tweeted about it a couple of weeks after and was like hey you seemed like a little bit off and he's like yeah i didn't get the lift in at four in the morning it's like i have to say you know there are a number of people

1:24:22Andrew Huberman:on the internet that I don't know. And I don't know how they present is actually who they are. Like how Jocko shows up online is exactly who he is. No, that's not true. We spent what? Four days, four days with him and three days with him December. And on the way back, the final plane ride that we had home, there was a little bit of, a little bit more looseness. It was like five or 10 % more. But he's just an aggro dude. True. Yeah. He's got a lot of energy. So my question is this whole, thing about obsession with the nineties, like these posts of like, Oh, this is what it was like then. And no one's got phones.

1:24:58Andrew Huberman:And I have to say, even though I was born in 75 and loved the nineties, grateful that I was a teen in the nineties, I have to say the whole thing irritates me a lot because I never want to be a part of that generation of people that's talking about how great it would be for, and these poor kids, like we're like 15 and 16. Your kids are younger than that. Right. I don't know how young your kids are. You don't even know who your kids are. speak for yourself they're still on Love Island right he abandoned them you turned your life into Love Island listen they contacted me no no I'm kidding so these kids now they have to hear about like oh how great it was then it's gotta be annoying as shit of course it's gotta be annoying as shit we should just cut it out it can be the truth right it could also be the truth like we're gonna revert to that I understand right so speaking as a Brit who's moved I moved four years ago right to America.

1:25:50When I think about golden era America, and I, you know, when I think about this most, when I'm driving down the highway and I see some huge industrial estate, some massive fucking factory that probably makes like pipes or something. And there is a American flag and a Texan flag that would cover a small house, right? Just, just for the sake of it. And I'm like, fuck yeah. Like that's fucking sick. And then that immediately makes me think about Limp Bizkit and WWF and like the Stone Cold Stunner and like Transformers movie I'm aware that we're bleeding into the thousand but like 90s shit like cool fucking like technically you're a

1:26:30Andrew Huberman:millennial right is that right technically yeah okay I mean you can just you can it can be that like hey the 90s was a fucking decade and still just not be the person who's like you don't get it you guys are doing everything wrong also there were things that genuinely sucked that genuinely sucked like you didn't have access to things like all the health stuff now like you had to work so hard to find like creatine it was like you know you could find cocaine more easily than you could find like cool healthy stuff right used to they would cut cocaine with creatine really it's a cut yeah no swear to god really yeah oh that's if you're buying cocaine well i never did if you're selling or distributing yeah got it got it but if i bought creatine it wasn't cut with cocaine no no no wow that would be a deal that'd be a deal exactly these gains but you know like if you want The information you had to like wire somebody money and then do a phone call and then do all, it was, it was tough.

1:27:21Andrew Huberman:Like it was like things took more work and it took, you know, and things, people don't realize it's like, okay, maybe housing costs were lower, but things were also very stratified back then. You know, it was like lifestyles are rich and famous. There was, there was a big gap then too. there was just a lot of cool stuff happening at the kind of lower end where you felt like things were really created the whole indie indie music indie movies etc you could do cool shit for not a lot of money and people were building and consuming cool stuff for not a lot of money yeah but i don't believe that it was you know like it was it was great for what it was but like now's now like i i feel bad for these teens are like oh my god what am i supposed to do like ditch my phone 24 they're not gonna do that goes like to like entertain like because entertainment what comes out decade to decade like the 70s was great music and film the 80s was trash movies like most like shit movies compared to ghostbusters well you can you can find good but like if you compare decade to decade 90s much better decade for for entertainment so some of that is like you know you can find the thing that you are like i miss that right i miss like the what was being put out music and entertainment, I think for the 90s was like pretty incredible.

1:28:33Like great. It was a great decade. It was easy to rewatch, right? Which quality of life isn't in the same way. And then you, but I mean, you can associate, you can be like the 90s and what you're really thinking is like, I loved like the music I was listening to, the vibe of the decade, but it doesn't mean that like everything was fucking amazing. Do you think that in 20 years time, people will look back at 2026 and go, dude, fucking golden era. Yes. Somebody will. Somebody will. Yes, Absolutely.

1:28:59Andrew Huberman:Absolutely. Because it's happened in every generation before. Yeah. I mean, we'll be, you know, hopefully not senile, but we'll be old. You'll be very old. Or dead. Yeah. I mean, we're dead. I do miss though, like. Yeah, you'll be a little less old. I know. I know. I'll be in my 70s. You'll be fucking 80. Yeah, show us your fake ID cigarette. I will. He's walking around with fake IDs 47. Yeah, I'm 47. I do miss, like, I remember before smartphones when, like, if I had, like, nothing to do, my brain would just go into, like, I would just daydream. And now I'm, like, if I stop doing anything, I'm, like, pop it right away.

1:29:35I'm, like, there's a thing I need to look at. It kind of bothers me a little bit.

1:29:38Andrew Huberman:Easy to numb out and get pulled into drama. Yeah. Online. That's, like, the two. I think of it, like, I literally have to have this visual. I actually drew this picture for myself because that's how I, like, consolidate things I want to do and not do. is like, I think I get up in the morning and there's like this narrow path. And on either side, it's just like, down to no productivity, nothing useful in life. And one side is drama, other people's drama. Yeah. And the other side is just numbing out. Yeah. And you gotta stay on the path. You gotta walk this really narrow path. And then it's interesting because the algorithms are very, very good.

1:30:14Andrew Huberman:And so you go, all right, well, I've been good. I'll just like get on for a second. And it'll be like fight video on X. That's just insane. and then you're like, I don't want to see this. And it'll be like, cute video. And it'll find your button. It'll just find it. It'll find it. Yeah. It's like a borderline girlfriend, man. She'll figure it out. And the next thing you know, it's like three hours later and you're like, what happened? It's a cycle. You get on the cycle. Do you notice, by the way, because I think it's especially for going to hotels, right? We stay in hundreds of hotels. It started like a few years ago where I realized one day I was like, oh, I've been in, you know, 200 hotels this year and I never turned on the TV once.

1:30:54Never. And it used to be, right? You'd get into the hotel and boom, like you'd see what's on. Also, I was like, man, like a year went by and I'm like, I've been in so many and I've never, because you would just pick up your phone and you're just, it's just like an ornament now. Like it just sits there. If I do a hotel, if I stay in hotels for a weekend and don't look at porn, I feel like I'm a saint. I leave. I'm like, they should literally just like canonize it. Can you do the one that you pay for? No, just on your phone, I'm saying. Because it's like you're just isolated in this bunker. You get off stage, you're like, I'm wired.

1:31:27You're like, I need to go to bed. I know exactly how I can fall asleep right now. Yeah, yeah. And you go like, no, I'm not going to. I'll do it like 4 % of the time. And I'm just like, man, they're going to canonize me after. It's impossible.

1:31:41Andrew Huberman:It sounds like you're open about this with your wife. Otherwise, she just knows about it now. I've talked to her about it. And now I'm off it. I'm off. I'm off the porn. But I always ask for her help. How was that? How was the transition off the porn? Dude, it's way better. Because, you know, now I'm 40. I swear to God, once you're 40, it's like 20s. You can have like infinite boners. You can be watching porn. Now, like, I need to be ready. If I'm fapped out. Yeah. And I get the big call from, I'm like, no. So now I'm just always, I stay ready at all times. I'm like, just let me know. Five bigs to dollar bill.

1:32:10No, I'm just kidding. That's it, dude. I'm just kidding. I'm just kidding. No, I'm going to try that as well. Is that one of the life hacks that comedians know that the health experts haven't cottoned on to, that if you've just done a high stimulation activity that just a fat before bed is... That's universal knowledge. It's got to be universal knowledge. I haven't heard that on the Cuban Man Lab podcast. Fat before sleep? It's called a fat nap. Never heard of a fat nap? I've never heard of it. We've been doing this for generations. My daddy was a fat napper and his daddy before him. Well, the thing is like every, every comic, probably every performer like music or otherwise, but certainly for comedian, like the adrenaline spike, you're getting off stage.

1:32:54Like usually like somebody, different people get into something. Like there's the guys that go just drink their faces off or do drugs or like eating or go out all night or jerk off. Like somebody like you have this, this rush after. And it's like, the night's over. Like, you're just like, go back.

1:33:11Andrew Huberman:No girlfriends or wives on tour. I mean, girlfriend or wife on tour. No, I mean. You are really Freudian slipping your way through this podcast. I have one girlfriend. She's awesome, like I said. I'm addressing, yeah, I'm addressing the audience. Can you, uh. But I'm not a live, I'm also not a live show guy. When I finish a podcast, like a solo episode of my podcast, I want to collapse, man. Can you explain what's happening neurologically, biochemically, when the, being on stage, high stimulus, a lot of focus, a lot of adrenaline, positive feedback. And then what is that? What's going on? I mean, in a word, arousal, right?

1:33:45Andrew Huberman:I mean, the catecholamines, dopamine, norepinephrine and epinephrine. The catecholamines, this little kit of chemicals that are made in our brain and body, right? Different ones, different places, et cetera. We don't have to get into that. But that cocktail is what's released under, you know, high arousal situations. Some are scary situations, some are exciting, but when you're a performer and you gain that feedback, then yeah, you got a lot of dopamine, norepinephrine and epinephrine. So you're alert, you're focused. So broadly speaking, right? The science crowd is getting a little pissed at me for this, but broadly speaking, the dopamine thing is going to want you having like more of whatever you're experiencing, right?

1:34:21Andrew Huberman:Higher, higher threshold, higher threshold. Okay. Epinephrine, which is adrenaline, makes your body alert and norepinephrine and released in the brain. And, you know, and this is again generalizations increases focus for the thing that you're you know that you're pursuing right so you get off stage and those things are cranked to level 11 and i mean you could do some long exhale breathing you do a sauna but obviously you're out on tour yeah you want to bring it down a notch and you got to get on the bus or the plane the next day and go and so yeah and you know it can be hard to sleep in look evolution you know hardwired circuits so that the desire to you know ride this roller coaster up to this peak and then crash down again you know and and make sex you know ideally with somebody else you know but if you apparently alone you know you're trying to find a way to do that right so you know that's it's that brings you into a so-called lower lower arousal parasympathetic state right and as dopamine goes up testosterone goes up in women and men okay and then after orgasm dopamine goes down and and a hormone which is basically a hormone prolactin goes up and that sets the refractory period during which time you need a higher stimulus thing to get you aroused coolidge effect yeah the coolidge effect like in roosters this whole thing if you trade out the hens then they can continue to copy over and over again And it's to some extent is true in humans, but you know, they're also, I sort of joked about the Tadalphil and it was indeed a joke, but there's some interesting things.

1:35:57Andrew Huberman:Like if you want to play this game, you can, although I'm not sure I want to encourage your porn habit. No, no, no. I'm not a porn guy, but when you were saying like - Trying to turn me on. Like the refractory period, the refractory period can be shortened. Yeah. Right? By blunting the prolactin response that can be done with taking something like P5P, which is, it's related to vitamin B6 and it blunts prolactin somewhat. um you know there are drugs which i don't recommend people take but these prescription drugs like cabergoline and things like that which um inhibit prolactin and you know there are communities like like in in the um like in the gay community like there's a big use of some of these drugs to have sort of kind of marathon sex type thing they'll use stimulants like meth right i have a friend who's a former meth addict he happens to be gay and i was like well i don't understand i've never done meth but i'm like what's the deal with meth and he's like oh the The idea is, you know, marathon sex, right?

1:36:46Andrew Huberman:And then when people get sober from meth, hopefully, they lose their sex drive for a long, long time. These systems need to be recalibrated. We're talking about extremes with drugs, right? One reason why I'm not one of these, like, all porn is bad, but one reason why I personally am just not a fan of porn is I think you can dial in pretty much a higher and higher threshold thing without really having to do the work of going out and finding a relationship. And I think a lot of younger guys who aren't married, who don't have a relationship, they don't know how to use it kind of judiciously. Right.

1:37:19Andrew Huberman:And there's no and and it never says no to them either. So a lot of issues with porn in the younger younger crowd. I mean, that's like for as comedians, I feel like your 20s into your 30s is probably the the time of the most consumption. It is like you're alone of porn, like you're alone. You're a loser. You're you're a loser. You're you're also in a strange place. you know what I mean you have this like this isn't my environment right and then you throw in the performing and getting bumped up from that and just being like looking for something. No one wanting to fuck you. No. Yeah. No we're comedians.

1:37:58I don't know. Call the boys and do the crystal meth. Are you kidding me? Don't give me that horse shit. Are you kidding me? I didn't hear what you said. I was picking up what Andrew's putting down. You call the boys and fire up the meth pipe man. Yeah fuck yeah. Yeah. Let's go. So you're saying if you take the stuff that suppresses prolactin that you can -

1:38:14Andrew Huberman:The refractory period is shortened. Yeah. I want the refractory. That's the thing. I want the refractory. You're looking for some peace and ease. You're trying to optimize the refractory. You're looking for some peace and ease, you know? I want to pass out. I want to - Yeah. So, I mean, I don't know. I mean, I think we're - This seems like an age-old method, I'm guessing, you know, of calming down. Hey, listen, better that than taking like a barbiturate, right? True. You know, we talk about the 80s, right? In the 70s and 80s, if you look back, I just completed this frigging book finally. Congratulations, man.

1:38:45Andrew Huberman:Thank you. It's like 700 pages. I apologize in advance. But it's like an encyclopedia to be able to look up, like, if you want more focus, what stimulants could you consider? What are you willing to take? So you fully took the fucking rails off with this. It was like not just stuff that's white market available. I was like, have lawyers read it for whatever concerns you have. I'm like, put the disclaimers you need. But like, I didn't cover peptides and hormones because that's stuff I'm still exploring. but everything I know to be true, I put in there. I just like, I left it all on the map. That's pretty cool.

1:39:14Andrew Huberman:That's cool. I just put it all in there. And even the introduction, like I get brutally honest and I, no, not bad names, like there's some people that I want to credit and things like that, that I've been kind of quiet about. And I just, it's all there. Wait, can I ask you this? Cause we're talking about like, as guys that like we go on the road, we perform and we're like, shit, you know, getting to sleep is a thing. Yeah. what's the most like non-prescription drug like best way is there something to consume to consume or do to do or maybe both i mean look if you behaviors first let's just say that i'm not saying this to like protect myself like i've been around long enough attacked enough for every little thing that like you know i don't tap dance anymore i would say okay you get back to your room it would be give yourself a hot shower dude that was hot the hot shower right paradoxically is going to lower your core body temperature you need your body temperature start dropping to get to sleep okay which is we can talk about why that happens but you heat up the outside of your body then there's this compensatory drop it's like you have a thermostat in your brain it goes oh i'm outside my body's heating up so then core body temperature starts to drop when you get out tell off then i would it seems silly but when you deliberately exhale you slow your heart rate down you want your heart rate pretty low before bed but you don't have to have it like really low it's just in the morning you want your heart rate and your cortisol spiked and get into the day caffeine exercise and all that stuff look at your phone if you need to get your sunlight do all that stuff but in the last hour of your day whenever that happens to fall some long deliberate exhales normally we don't we normally we passively exhale but when you deliberately exhale you slow your heart rate down it activates a descending branch of your vagus nerve which goes to your heart it activates something called respiratory sinus arrhythmia which sounds bad arrhythmia but it's actually good it's like the break on your heart rate it's the basis of heart rate variability so just some like just bringing that down if you wanted to take something you know nowadays there's so many different sleep supplements but you know something with magnesium saffron some apigenin which is chamomile extract and that would be the supplement version you know okay so like it sounds like a plug but like the agz supplement kind of combines all those things that's what i'll drink like half a packet of that there are and i get in trouble for this nowadays but i'm kind of having fun these days because like I don't really care anymore.

1:41:29Andrew Huberman:So now you just get the real me. I mean, it was always the real me minus the stuff I was like afraid to say, but there's a peptide called pineal on, which is spectacularly good at increasing REM sleep. Okay. I would not take it every night. You got to make sure you're getting real pineal on you. I recommend you work with an MD who gets it from a compounding pharmacy, not buying it off the, you know, they say Chinese peptides, but they're from all over the world. It's a little unfair to the Chinese, by the way, you know, they make it sound like they make other stuff too. They make other stuff And for all we know, there's some great Chinese peptides.

1:41:59Andrew Huberman:But I recommend getting your peptides from a reliable source. But pineal on, taking like three nights a week, you'll notice that your REM sleep is spectacularly good. Okay. If you aren't getting enough deep sleep, which is at the beginning of the night, it is wise to not have eaten for about two hours before you go to sleep. Dude, I get like 20 minutes of deep. I give so much REM, but I get like 30 minutes of deep sleep every night. This is interesting. So there's always a trade-off. So if you take something to increase the amount of slow-wave deep sleep that you get, let's say, and I'm not recommending this because these growth hormone secretagogues increase growth hormone, but things like testimurelin, cermurelin, you'll get a bigger growth hormone surge and you'll get more deep sleep, but you'll get less REM.

1:42:38Andrew Huberman:Cannabis smokers get almost no REM, like almost no REM. And then when they come off cannabis, their dreams are wild. So that's a well-known kind of rebound effect. So the pinealine would be a more advanced trick. And on and on and on. But, you know, and then some people, like I'm not a Xanax guy, right? but at some level, you know, if you are doing all the right behaviors, you're not drinking caffeine too close to sleep, you're doing a shower, the long exhale breathing, maybe the supplements either stack together, you take them independently and figure out what you want and what works for you or you decide to do pineal on every once in a while, you know, I think you're doing pretty much everything you can do.

1:43:17Andrew Huberman:Yeah, yeah. And at that point, you know, hopefully eight sleep will make a portable version because, you know, it's a great thing to cool your bed and all that really does help. problem is it's there isn't really a good portable version of it so i keep hoping they'll do that and keep it dark you know eye mask earplugs i sleep with the eye mask every day yeah and then you're pretty much there you know what do you think about trazodone trazodone um supposedly keeps the architecture of sleep right but i mean these serotonin agonists i mean the problem with tweaking serotonin is you can end up with other effects right i mean it's an anti i think it was originally designed as antidepressant, right?

1:43:50Andrew Huberman:Higher doses. Yeah. Yeah. So, um, I mean, not my go-to there's a prescription drug called Quivivic, which is in a classic drug called the Doras, which works on the hypocretinorexin system. Yeah. It's very expensive, but that seems to improve, uh, REM sleep. Quivivic? Quivivic. Very expensive, like$30 a pill or$50 a pill. Dude, I took a, I took a Balsamra last year and it felt like someone had hit me in the back of the head i don't know what that is i so i want to be careful same thing it's in the it's in the same category yeah fuck me it was like someone had come in and just hit me with a hammer i stopped taking melatonin because you said it shrinks your balls i mean melatonin that scared me off but years ago i used to work on these little cyperian dwarf hamsters and they're seasonal breeders and if they if you give melatonin like their balls shrink to the size of a grain of rice um can't deal with a tiny tiny bit of fast-acting melatonin every once in a while like when i say tiny amount I mean like 300 micrograms.

1:44:46Andrew Huberman:Normally people are taking like one to 10 milligrams. And here's the thing, I say this, and then some people who are alleged sleep scientists say, they are sleep scientists, but they are like, oh no, 10 milligrams is the dose that was used in these studies. Like I've run a lot of studies. When you're going for an effect, you oftentimes will be like control group, five milligrams, 10 milligrams, right? Because some graduate student's life is on the line. There's very few dose response curves of these things done under the same condition. So tiny, tiny, tiny amount of melatonin if you're going to do that.

1:45:18Andrew Huberman:Gotcha. So it's not, and that's not a problem for occasional use, but a lot of people are giving too much of it to their kids. Yeah, I've seen that. And then when kids are in the, melatonin helps keep puberty at bay. And then there's a switch in the patterns of melatonin secretion that it's not the only thing, but it correlates with puberty. So by the way, your kids probably are going to start having hormones, in which case you're effed because your kids are already like in your face. They're fucking wild. Yeah, they're wild. How so? I mean, they're just, they're, they're amazing kids, but they have just, you know, my oldest is like very competitive.

1:45:51How old? He's 10. But I mean, he's.

1:45:53Andrew Huberman:He's like, I'm 10. I'm taking over. No, for real. He's a fourth now. Fourth grader. He's, you know, he does cross country, does jujitsu. He was in the state finals for cross country. But you see this thing like when you realize with kids, you're like, oh, this is just like who you are. You know what I mean? Yeah. So like this kid, he always is like wants to compete at everything, at everything. It doesn't matter if it's like we're reading something. I'm going to read this faster than you. It's the Michael Jordan thing. He just wants to come. It's the Michael Jordan thing. He's also super emotional.

1:46:30You know what happened to his dad. Yeah. I know. It doesn't happen to me. Jesus Christ. But the little guy, the little guy is like, has a comedian's personality. A hundred percent. He's a complainer. Like comedians complain. Things aggravate. You hang around comics. They're not indifferent to things. They have. So he's always just like, what's this fucking table doing here, man? And you're like, what? He's like, it takes up the whole room. I keep running into it. Like it's a smaller shit, you know? And like, I'm like. He says that? Yeah. And he curses like that. I'm like, yo, like, you can't be talking.

1:47:07He's like, you fucking say shit all the time. Okay. Like he's fired up and then they're boys. And so they just like, they love to break shit, you know, like everything nice that I just have. I just go, I'm just going to take this somewhere else. Take us to the office. Cause they just break things, you know, and they're just, they're just fired up to do that. And so, yeah, no, we're still right before puberty. You know that like the 10 year old is close. Like he's getting on the line. Yeah. They did. The funny thing is I like, you know, obviously like you tease your kids. So like when I have people over for dinner, cause I know it bothers them.

1:47:43I'll be like, do you have a girlfriend? And because they're both, that's that thing where they're like, they don't like girls. Yeah. So like the 10 year old go, what kind of question is that? He goes, I go, what? He goes, what kind of question? I'm 10. I'm not going to date a girl for years. It's a crazy question, man. And I'm like, okay. And then I'll turn to the seven year old. I go, do you have a girlfriend? He'll go, fuck you. and I'm like, yo, he goes, fuck you, man, okay? I don't have a fucking girlfriend. I'm like, okay. What does your wife think about all this? I mean, she laughs. I don't think, she doesn't try to provoke them as much as I do because I think it's more of a dad thing.

1:48:19Andrew Huberman:Who's more like who or is that a thing? Oh, 100%. I mean, the 10-year-old is her twin, and the seven-year-old is like my duplicate. I mean, he's just exactly the same. We react to this, like, we'll be watching something and like, you know, like a van will like hit a guy on the side of the road and, you know, like in a movie or something. And the seven year old will be like, and then she'll be like, he's you, you know, he's you. And I'm like, yeah, I'm like, Jesus Christ. That's what I was laughing at. Yeah. It's crazy. They're exactly like them. Do you find it easier to discipline the one that's more like you?

1:48:57Like easy to understand or is it throwing your sort of patterns back at yourself do you get more triggered by the one that's more like you oh a hundred percent and also like because if i if i start getting loud he'll just he'll he was like we were throwing the ball and he threw the ball poorly you know like to me i go dude throw it to me he goes you got knees bend down pick it up okay and i'm like jesus christ and then and i'm like he i'm like yeah i can you know like but the the 10 year old and he's been like this since he was like five which is so spooky to me that like if i if he does something like you know he knocked paint over and i go come the fuck on man like what the what are you doing he'll be like i'm a kid and you can just speak to me and i'm like they're becoming self-aware and then you're like i'm a piece of shit like like immediately you're like i cannot believe because he's right he's outfoxed you yeah oh 100 do they have phone uh you have smartphones no no they don't have phones they don't have phones yeah we're not planning on doing that anytime soon yeah yeah no personality differences are crazy it's crazy you're like uh you go that's all kids three and six three and six yeah and you're like all right that's this is where our kids will be like you have another one you're like what the fuck what happened to you what is this and it's just completely it's funny mine are the opposite my oldest is like me they both they share characteristics my oldest is like pretty introverted and like low-key and the other one's just like her mom or she'll like we had a little like it was like they called it a daddy daughter dinner we go out and play music and i'm like all right you know i gotta like this is my moment i dance with my kids and my youngest was like bro i'm dancing my friends get away from me and she just all night she's three years old dance with her friends they just just like life of the party my oldest was kind of like i'm gonna chill out this is a little much it was really funny but yeah they're polar opposite so it's so weird do you watch your swearing around them like tom watches they'll get on me for it they'll go like that's a bad word dad and then now the youngest one will throw them back at me a little bit yeah don't let them hang out with tom's kids sounds like it sounds like they'll pick up some choice language they hate if they if we say hate they're like that's a bad word and i'm like where did you get this from she's like i think it was from like their early school my youngest curses more like the older one yeah will curse less same that's how my younger one will curse more the youngest my my wife told the uh the two kids like get your asses upstairs and the youngest was like adults get your asses upstairs she's three and we're like whoa yeah i was kind

1:51:22Andrew Huberman:of impressed i was actually pretty good sometimes there's a big difference between swearing and swearing at someone yeah right yeah for sure you're banging me on something you're allowed to say fuck dude my fundamentally different my i dropped a thing and one of my kids was like i like dropped it was like she was like you can say shit dad i was like thanks man it really does feel like your kids are parenting you more than you're parenting them dude they probably are smarter now I swear to God, I think kids are way smarter now. You look back and you were like, I was retard maxing from birth. I was 100%.

1:51:51I didn't talk to people at all. My kids are like, hi, how are you? They'll like congratulate people when they have a baby. My three-year-old will be like, congratulations. You're so random. I swear to God, she'll go. We never told her to do this. She'll go up and be like, congratulations. And they're like, thanks. That's good.

1:52:05Andrew Huberman:At least she doesn't say, I'm sorry. Fuck. It's wild, dude. It's so. Oh, man. The fact that they become self-aware and they know I'm a kid. it's like oh no no no no no no you're not supposed to be able to watch the rules of the game you're supposed to be in the matrix yeah exactly not supposed to be observing the hyper aware yeah i try to really catch myself on that like this is what i suppose if i'm going back and forth like do this right now and they're like no i'll i'll want to be like just do what i say then they'll come up with a reason i'll be like that's actually a fair point you're good go ahead that's just you know it's crazy like the emotional intelligence thing also is always like so like that the 10 year old we were in a setting where someone was like who do you love the most and he was like my mom and i was like yeah and then later on he came back he goes hey i just wanted you to know that when i said i love mom the most he goes i love you just as much i just spend more time with her so i feel like that's and i was like i was like no it's okay man he was like i just didn't want you to feel like i didn't love you as much and i was like it's cool you're 10 like yeah Yeah.

1:53:08Fuck me. Yeah. That's rad. Yeah. But I'm an only child, so I was essentially autistic. I had like autism until age like 20 when I went to university. I'd been in university for two years. And I was like, oh, okay. I was like integrated with society in this way. I don't know any only children that are normally adapted. Not. You just don't have the same amount of social exposure.

1:53:27Andrew Huberman:But you guys can, I was going to say, you guys can play with yourselves. You know, but, you know, no, but you can, you know, but. it's true like they that kids who grew up alone know how to like integrate with adults in the family and then they go to their room and they do their thing i suppose nowadays they have ipads definitely comfortable in solitude and stuff but yeah fuck i do i i remember when i went to uni i was 18 and i didn't know that you were supposed to knock on someone's bedroom door before you went in because i never had to knock on anyone's bedroom door like mom and dad always went to bed after me or whatever and it was like i was never gonna fucking like there's just no reason to do and no brothers or sisters so i was like i had to learn shit just not the yeah they don't burst into your fucking housemates in the uni halls of residence that makes sense though you just didn't have you it's never been patented but meanwhile your 10 year old's like giving you counseling advice he's bringing your emotions back into land after maybe making you feel uncomfortable i know it's so it's it's so unexpected you're like who taught you this you know like he wasn't taught he just a kid's getting smarter is that a thing i don't know i I mean, I know that the language learning data show that, you know, kids can literally say words they've never heard before that are accurate to the meaning of the word.

1:54:43Andrew Huberman:They'll construct sentences in novel ways they haven't heard. You know, I mean, there's some fundamental units of language in the brain that, you know, different, you know, place all over the world, you know, kind of hijack the same machinery to construct language. So there's a template for it. Right. And so maybe if they're getting more, there's a guess here, it's conjecture, pure conjecture that they're, you know, able to access lots of more movies and television shows and your kids aren't online, but you know, they're hearing many more different dialects and things from different people that they're able to come up with novel combinations that we weren't able to access.

1:55:18My three-year-old, she had like the car, like the door, like the unlock thing, the key or whatever. And I can't even talk, but she was like, I was like, here, I'll show you how to do it. And she goes, three-year-old, she was like, I'm an expert. I was like, where the fuck did you hear expert from? It was bizarre. And she actually did know how to unlock it properly. And I was like, all right, man, I'm done. You can just have my money when I die. But this is good, right? Because this is a generation that's going to take care of everybody. I think so, man. She'll be four in a couple of weeks. But she was like, I'm an expert.

1:55:45And I was like, where'd you hear that from? I swear they're smarter. Yeah. I really think so. The language thing is spooky. Like they start constructing sentences with vocabulary and correctly. You know, like you hear it all the time and you go like, did you hear that in a show or something?

1:56:02Andrew Huberman:I mean, I don't know if these data ever held up. You might have covered this on your podcast in terms of like sibling order and only children and et cetera. But wasn't it the case that only children in terms of just successful life outcomes, you know, by the sort of like standard metrics that they tend to do better on average? I think so. But that I don't know whether it's on average, but you're certainly going to get more outliers. It's just weirder inputs. right you're going to get more variability and in what happens and for some of those it's going to end up with extreme success and for others it's just going to end up with like fucking trying to shoot the president or whatever oh yeah it's a fine line but there used to be these theories like you know you date someone who's an only child and like they need a lot more attention or something but then you could also say well no but they grew up being able to spend more time alone so like i don't think this stuff really holds i don't know i i ask in seriousness not just because you're an only child but because um you cover some of this on your the guy that's done 1 ,100 podcast episodes need some attention.

1:56:58Andrew Huberman:No. Maybe. No, the guy who's done 1 ,100 podcast episodes and a significant fraction have centered around human dynamics and biology and psychology. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. I'm actually a fan of your podcast. Thank you. Just FYI. Good. That's why I make that statement. We're all fans of each other. I got to show you this. I learned this thing about this 21-year-old college student in Austin who has made$43 ,000 running an AI-only fans account. dude i i just heard that i had this meeting where they were talking about how oh he's doing like oh no wow wait so that's the dude and that's the that's the guy and she's the ai version that he's selling yep um okay what is this it's a 22 year old this is like her avatar right?

1:57:45So he's using Claude Code and Flux and 11 Labs. And basically she can chat 24 hours a day with all of her subscribers and her top fans paid nearly$2 ,000 in messages, average revenue per fan $34. And she doesn't sleep. There's nothing to film. No one's typing. Claude Code writes every message. Flux generates every photo and 11 Labs generates her voice. What's the added context? Is it? OnlyFans requires verification that includes individuals, ID addresses, in numerous forms, there is no camera, no girls, and no OnlyFans, except for a lot farming Twitter revenue with a made-up story. Well, it's a good story.

1:58:21Well, there's something that is happening. Because you know with AI, what Hollywood is embracing right now is sets. So in other words, they'll bring in the actors for real right now and they'll say, okay, you guys are acting, we'll put a table in the room, but this is going to be in, you know, whatever. It's outdoors, like the table is in Siberia. So the set is AI, right? But what some apparently OnlyFans performers have been approached is for a payout where they already have a following, like the OnlyFans person has a following. A company goes, we'll pay you X amount of dollars to have your OnlyFans account for like six months.

1:59:07and then the a what they're doing is putting the the only fans person into an ai situation having them do wilder things than they actually do generating a whole crazy amount of revenue and now that only fans performer is like yeah but i didn't do this stuff you know so they're like and then you're obliged when you get your account back you're like hey but do you remember what you're doing with your feet for the last six months yeah you were drinking and now you're just like posing again yeah so they're exploiting the hell out of them with it i mean that's a level of self-exploitation to actual exploitation yeah exactly right wow yeah that's crazy but i mean you can obviously like that was that's nuts well the video still exists regardless of whether or not the guy set up the system to do the thing like that dude is making that work by masking a hot girl over the top of him wearing her pants do you think we're close to the point where like you can

2:00:00Andrew Huberman:go on vacation and then just have ai you know this this pipeline generate a podcast and no one will know so like notebook lm kind of does this already i've had a couple of conversations with different platforms that are thinking about doing it too that makes me a bit uncomfortable but the fucking thing that i'm going through at the moment which is wild is 11 labs their go-to british voice so 11 labs is like the big ai uh text to speech company matthew mcconaughey is an investor and it's made tons of money it's absolutely fucking ripped their go-to ai british voice is me that makes sense 1000 being trained on me it's awesome until people use it as voice overs for products that i don't endorse that's when you sue my friend dude we emailed them we emailed 11 labs that's not soon a year ago and said hey like this is fucking chris like you used chris's voice and they said oh we've done a a roshman heisman test and it's come back at 0.3 similarity and it needs to be above 0.65 in order to i'm like dude it doesn't matter 11 labs poached you or these other people poached no 11 labs used their archer they must have trained this voice on you like pull up that uh essay the the video essay the m14 i got someone i'm gonna connect you I got a friend who's like perhaps the world's best scientist on the neuroscience of speech and language.

2:01:27Is he going to be able to say, yeah, that's fucking Chris's voice. Give him some money. Yeah, because I don't know what criteria they're using. Do you own your own fucking voice?

2:01:34Andrew Huberman:I don't know what criteria they're using. Yes, you do. Your name, face, and likeness, and that's your likeness. I don't know what criteria they're using, but there's a way where you look at the envelope of the frequency. The reason it sounds like you is because they're capturing some overall essence. Now it's true with certain music, like certain songs, right? If you change a couple of chords, then you, you escape the copyright. So this is essentially what they're doing. Right. But, um, yeah, there's, there's ways to address this with them where I'm not saying get legally aggressive. It costs you a lot of money.

2:02:05Andrew Huberman:It costs a lot of time, but, but you own your voice. Just like I can't take a picture of you and just like, like tweak something just a little bit and then make a video and have you sell something. You know, I tried that. I got caught. It's the only thing. So, yeah, but you do have a velvet voice, you know? Look at this. Look at this video essay. It's been over 12 years since the disappearance of flight MH370. I'm playing this. Three massive searches, more than$200 million spent. And on March 8th, 2026, Ocean Infinity officially called off that last search. Their CEO, Oliver Plunkett, essentially admitted what no one in the official investigation wanted to say.

2:02:48Maybe the plane simply isn't where we've been looking. But one man wasn't surprised. Yeah, this is you. It's me. Is this not supposed to be you? No, it's not me. This is Archer from Eleven Labs. People think... This is you. Okay, people think that this is my secret second channel where I do video essays. Oh, no.

2:03:07Andrew Huberman:Yeah, but if it was, you would be saying this right now. It's not my secret second... Aviation Files. Like, this video's good. I watched it. I really enjoyed it. That's fucked up. And there's people doing like Shilajit company ads. Yeah. The fucking weird one. Raises FSH just a little bit, but it does. You should be doing more voiceover work though anyway. Your voiceover is great. Thank you. It's a shame. You should be, you can be planet earth for sure. Infinitely scalable with that. I want to hear you on the Simpsons. Dude, it's very, well, it's, that one's strange, but then there's another one where people are using it for is ads.

2:03:37So they're putting my voice as the voiceover for ads. And originally it was just like VO with subtitles. If it's getting into ads, it is worth doing some at least legal kind of experimentation here.

2:03:50Andrew Huberman:There are a couple of people I can put you in contact with who are absolutely world class at suing the pants out of these companies. This is the advantage of being friends with you. Getting real money and bankrupting the shit out of them. Now, I don't want to bankrupt Eleven Labs. In fact, I think they're actually - It's impossible. I think we actually have a relationship to Eleven Labs. Dude, look at this. Look at this. Look at this one. This is fucking insane. Watch this.

2:04:15Thank you.

2:04:24And why don't they just change us? But you're the first comment. Yeah. Does Chris well know that you've stolen his voice and then tagged my manager? Yeah. Whoa. So, but that's over an AI guy that isn't me. And that feels even more fucking pernicious. Yeah. Yeah. So, yeah, I mean, I'm getting. Yeah.

2:04:41Andrew Huberman:When there's a voice. No, I hear you. Like we, years ago, there was this Jawserciser ad. I remember that one. With me talking. Yes, I remember about that. And it was all AI, right? So, and people, you know, I get enough crap anyway, but people were like, oh, the jaws are size. I'm like, I'm not, this was all AI. You do have a big neck. That sucks. I train my, you got to train your neck, guys. You got to train your neck. Do you iron neck it? No, I have a four-way neck machine. You know where I do some, like a plate wrapped in a towel and, you know, that kind of thing. It's your upper spine. It's important.

2:05:10Andrew Huberman:I don't have the best posture, but I don't have the worst posture. Doesn't that mess with your sleeve? No. Alex Jones said you make DMT. Alex Jones said you make DMT. It stabilizes the whole shoulder, girl. A lot of guys have shoulder issues. What do you mean you don't want a thick, thick neck? You don't want a thick neck. You have like a fucking, like, carpenter's thumb for a neck. You don't want a neck so big that it restricts your breathing. Yeah, well, Alex Jones says if your neck gets big enough, you produce DMT in your sleep, which is why he's in connection with interdimensional entities, and that's where he gets a lot of information.

2:05:38So I was just checking. Science behind that. It might be related to the fact that he owes nearly a billion dollars.

2:05:44Andrew Huberman:But hey, listen, That's not true. The last person I want to get into the mix with is Alex Jones. I don't know him. I've seen some things here or there. His employees get shot walking up to their house. Seems like a dude to avoid for the most part. But anyway, love and light, as they say in Los Angeles. Fair enough. I don't know. Is there a level of neck thickness you can get to where you just start producing drugs? DMT in his sleep. Unbelievable. He claims his neck's so thick he produces DMT. That cannot be real. It's so funny. It's so funny, though. That is funny. To just brag about a thing, you're like, okay, yeah, sure.

2:06:14Andrew Huberman:He's like random node connector. There's this thing in psychosis called Klang associations where people who are psychotic start to associate the sound of a word, like the phonetics of it with the meaning. So they'll be like, I was out for a walk, talk. We should talk. And then they kind of go down these, the brain is broken in some sense. And so they're following these nodes that are not of reality at some level or they're pseudo random or hyper random. um and so clang associations often show up in like the health and wellness thing where these are hard to think about where someone will say yeah you know i um where people do it visually they'll be like oh yeah you know walnuts are really high in this particular fatty acid it's good for your brain and it looks like a brain yeah and that's why it's good for your brain and you go that's a visual clang association oh right that's psychotic it's like numerology now it's true that the fatty acid and walnuts like it might have some brain benefits but it's not like But it's not because it's not in the shape of a brain because of that.

2:07:13Andrew Huberman:So humans love to do these things. There's something called parodelia, which is like people look at clouds and be like, oh, my God, it looks like a puppy dog or something. But some people take that into the world, right? They can be great artists, but they always can be effing crazy. How do they take that into the world? Well, some people will take that into the world and they'll, you know, they'll see something and they'll go, oh, you know, that window is like a matrix that matches something I had before. And there's like a, this is like a portal to that other thing. And you can't really argue with their logic because they can usually do the simple math of it, but it doesn't square with like a functional life.

2:07:45Andrew Huberman:And if you hop on their thing, like you're effed, like you're not getting anything done that day, right? Even in psychedelic journeys, like this is what's interesting, I think about some of the real psychedelics like psilocybin and LSD. there is this weird thing about them which is it's not really psychosis there seems to be some some real structure about the unconscious mind revealed in those under those drugs and you know that's why people always use the thing the guy who developed polymerase chain reaction which you can use to amplify dna which is used for everything from you know forensics to you know genealogy all sorts of things, you know, evaluating embryos, you know, seeing if kids are going to be healthy, all that stuff that supposedly that guy came to the logic of that on an LSD trip.

2:08:35Andrew Huberman:Now he also did a lot of really hardcore science. He knew his math, like he really, he understood, but there does seem to be some like real core structure of the way that thing that the world is, is built and the way that the mind is built that can be revealed, you know, with proper support in, in psychedelics but people were just walking around like making these you know clang associations you find them at a low you see a lot you hear a lot of this in la like within the health and wellness thing and people would be like they sort of associate in the shape of things with how good they are for you or they'll they'll some verbal like a little like pun they'll think is real it's a bunch of horse shit it's like it's it's not quite psychosis but it's kind of like veering have you experimented and so alex jones i'm not calling him psychotic i know it's like let's take two things, DMT and neck size.

2:09:23Andrew Huberman:And you go like, like, it sounds so awesome. I would be the first person open to it. I would be totally open to it. If there was any kind of high circuit, you know, we've dissected a lot of human bodies over the years, like the medical and science community. Like, so if there's a basis for it, like I would be totally interested. I think the chakras are really interesting as like convergent centers for, you know, uh, for nerves and vessels that might have some real basis. So I don't think it's totally cuckoo, but, um, he seems to be really good at like merging themes to create interesting stories and here we are talking about it yeah have you ever seen the website for spurious correlations no but that's what this sounds like unbelievable so this is basically mapping two things onto a graph that seems like they're correlated but can't be i swear the number of films that nicholas cage was in and the number of people that die by eating cheese per year is the same okay right that's awesome annual u.s household spending on alcoholic beverages correlates with the number of septic tank services and sewer pipe cleaners in new hampshire this yeah exactly go down go down the popularity of the call me maybe meme and the kerosene use in panama like almost one-to-one whoa right like google google searches for that is sus and a stock price for this fucking random company but the question is were these pulled together um at random or did they or did they you know They search for common curve trajectories.

2:10:48This guy, this Tyler Vigen guy, he literally tries to find things that are just correlated. And this website is filled. There's thousands of them. How nerdy Tom Scott's YouTube titles are and the number of movies that Mila Kunis appeared in. Damn. It's fucking sick. Chipotle Mexican girls. So good. So good. Ticket sales for the Houston Astro Games. If you showed this to somebody that was psychotic, they would be fucking flipping out. Well, this is all the sort of stuff that conspiracy theories Google searches for why do I have green poop and solar power generated in Bulgaria.

2:11:24Motor vehicle. Johnny Depp. Yeah, number of movies Johnny Depp appeared in.

2:11:28Andrew Huberman:I heard there's another Pirates of the Caribbean coming out. Or Caribbean. With Johnny Depp? I believe so. Nice. I might have heard that from a very reputable source. Was it Johnny? No. Are you friends with Johnny? No, never met him. Oh. It's going to be a fat check for Johnny, dude. I think his comeback. People are eagerly awaiting. Wilder bag. Yeah. I mean. What do you reckon he got paid? I think he has. For the movie? For the new Pirates. Yeah. It's going to be, it's going to be a sizable guarantee and he's going to have a massive piece of the back end because it's not makeable. You can't do it without him.

2:12:04Yeah, yeah. So the piece of the back end is going to be stupid. What's piece of the back end? Well, at points, he's going to have a percentage probably from maybe if he has the best deal, is going to be like dollar one gross percentage, which is like the moment somebody buys a ticket, he gets a piece of that. And that could be a billion dollar box office thing. So he could be getting, I mean, if it's as big as we would anticipate, nine figures for doing a movie. That's like the Jordan deal, right? Yeah, it's a wild. It's a comeback.

2:12:31Andrew Huberman:I wonder if he'll compensate for what he lost, got from the trial, and then gets from this, whether or not, you know, if you looked - Financially, in terms of fucking sanity. Yeah, well, emotionally. Well, he's also famously, a loose spender, you know? Oh, really? Oh, you never read that article? No. It was fucking amazing, dude. About his spending habits? Yeah, yeah. It was a Rolling Stone article that it was like a 20-page thing about like how he spends. And it was, I mean, it's just like fascinating because he was spent, like he obviously can, at the time, you know, generate crazy income, but he would spend wild.

2:13:08So like if he liked a car, he would be like, I like this car and I have eight houses so I want one of each of these cars at the eight houses he was spending like 30 or 40 grand a month on wine like every month it was it was just multiples of everything and I think I heard about the wine in the trial yeah called it a mega pint yeah and then like I don't know there was a thing with the business manager he was like they're like you're behind on taxes and and payments to us but then he would like do a movie so then revenue would come in and then, you know, but it was - It was like Floyd Mayweather.

2:13:40It was massive spending. It was the money team. That's crazy. It was a crazy article. Almost all of Depp's reported$650 million fortune is gone, according to Rolling Stone. It's like Mike Tyson levels of accrual and loss. Yeah. That's fucking serious. There is something nice about that, of just getting to spend all$650 million. Well, what's interesting is - Hang on, hang on. Depp reportedly spent$75 million on more than a dozen residences,$3 million to shoot the ashes of his friend hunter s thompson into the air from a cannon that's pretty gangster seven thousand dollars to buy his daughter a couch from the set of keeping up with the kardashian okay that's that's i don't know that's fucking insane yeah holy shit i love it i mean it's a it's a love it it's a fun he's living life yeah also he's been famous since such a young age it's

2:14:25Andrew Huberman:amazing he's he's as sane as he is you know and i don't know him and i'm assuming he's sane but you know earlier we were talking about you know sort of like how different it is now like can you imagine growing up where you see yourself on a screen and on the internet like you know i didn't see myself on a screen until i was like 45 years old your brain's mostly developed right for better or worse but like as a kid oh yeah like and then you're making money for it and then you're just out there it's wild you know and he was like that as like 19 you know yeah they claim that's kind of what killed Elvis.

2:14:58He was like one of the first people ever to have his image projected pretty much all across the world on like television.

2:15:04Andrew Huberman:What got to be a mind-backed? Elvis, they claim that like the, he was one of the first people to have like a massively popular visual, like a doppelgagger basically. And you have to like watch yourself and millions of people are watching you. They said that kind of just like - Derranging. Yeah. When I saw that movie, I forget what the movie was called about his manager and the whole thing. I swear, you know, if there wasn't a better case for circadian health than that film, because he knows like the darkness of the hotel and he's in there all day. And like he went wacko. If you want to make someone, there's this thing called ICU psychosis where people come into the intensive care unit and they're being woken up in the middle of the night and they've got lights on, you know, there's like hospital life, right?

2:15:42Andrew Huberman:And they start to become genuinely psychotic. They go home, the psychosis lifts. This is a well-known phenomenon because their circadian rhythm is so out of whack. You have enough fractured sleep like that for enough time, like you will lose your mind. What's the, what's the longest someone's ever stayed awake? Do you know? Oh, I forget that someone's like some radio DJ did this in the seventies or something. It was like a fundraiser. Of course. And it was like, and when we looked this up, but I think six days or seven days, I mean, eventually you die. Right. Because there's so much inflammation.

2:16:12Andrew Huberman:Now we know it would be kind of catastrophic levels of inflammation. I mean, during sleep, you're the whole reset of the body is like tamping down inflammation, coordinating the different organs of your body, like getting them back in check. Like, oh, like your, you know, your liver and your stomach, they're working on different timescales, but they need to be like kind of nudged into place like an orchestra. I don't know. So, yeah, things really fall apart here. Randy Gardner. Here we go. 11 days and 25. Wow. The record is set by Randy Gardner, a 17-year-old high school student in California as part of a science fair experiment.

2:16:48Researchers monitored him throughout, and it was 11 days, 25 minutes, which is 264 hours. Interestingly, after finally sleeping, he recovered surprisingly well with no obvious long-term damage reported at the time. Well, he was young. It definitely helps when you're young. Yeah. What's the longest that you guys have ever stayed awake? I mean, several days. Really? Yeah, several days. Yeah, I can't - Any stimulants besides caffeine? No, no. This is a safe space. Yeah, no, no, no. Was it at a meth party? No, I just - There was also travel involved. Yeah, yeah. you know, and yeah, stayed up and no naps.

2:17:26Like a real just - Real pushing through. That's great. Yeah, a push through a few times. I had this thing in college where I just started being like, one day a week, I'll just stay up all night and work at night. I was going to deliver like insomnia cookies. I'll stay up 24 hours, go to school, then work the other 12. If I stay up all night, one night a week, I'll be fine. It just shattered me in like a week and a half. And I was like, all right, I can't do this. Even three hours of sleep. Yeah, it's brutal.

2:17:49Andrew Huberman:It really, these days, I'm so much more sensitive to it though. Yeah, as you get older, you need the regularity. You also get the experience of how much better it feels when you're actually getting sleep. Oh my God, yeah. Why is it that you're less tolerant to fucking with your sleep when you're 45 than when you were 25? Just global levels of inflammation. As you get older, just inflammation increases. Yeah. You know, sort of the amplitude of inflammation on the circadian cycle. Like if it looks like this, when you're young, it starts to look like this. And then you sleep deprivation. I'm making many of those.

2:18:16Andrew Huberman:But like as a sort of like top contour plot, you'd be like, it's really amplified. And then you're like inflammation. kind of like cortisol right you meant to have this big cortisol peak in the morning and that subsides that's super healthy that's the healthy pattern but if you start staying awake it starts getting jagged line you know and well how long have you stayed awake day and a half probably is the most uh i've struggled to sleep on planes and when i was always fly like go to bali and stuff like that be like overnight and then you arrive there and you're all excited like yeah it's the middle of the afternoon fuck it i'm gonna start drinking i'll go have a party with meet friends, do stuff, probably about a day and a half, I guess.

2:18:54Yeah, same. But like, fuck.

2:18:55Andrew Huberman:Maybe two, maybe two. Yeah. There's no way I've done 48 hours. There's no way. Yeah, I can do one night. Because you wouldn't ever do 48 unless you change time zones a lot. Right. You would only ever do 36, right? Keeping busy health. Or whatever the fucking next one is. Doing it on a plane is tough. I mean, like when you talk to the guys that do buds and stuff, they will tell you like they get the opportunity at one point to take like a 30-minute nap and some of them just opt out because it's harder than if you just keep moving. I don't know if that's true. Have you seen Backyard Ultras? have you seen this oh yeah so this is standing yes standing races so nick baird does yeah yeah bpn here that guy chad um former seal guy long red beard chad wright did he win i think he does these last man standing okay have you seen these no he's a legit badass that guy will do he'll run your ass to death basically 4.1 miles every hour you have to complete i think it's four miles and there's a loop.

2:19:49And by the time that the bell rings for the beginning of the next hour, you have to have completed the loop. And if not, you're out. And they just go until everyone quits, right? So just how far, like, sorry. Yeah, there it is, 4.17 miles or 6.7K. Until you drop. What's the winner? How many does the winner do? Dude, the guy just did that bare one. It was like two days. Yeah. He was running for two days. It was, wasn't it like a hundred and some, like some crazy amount of mile like i think it was 200 200 miles yeah more than more than 200 but these guys just fucking they just keep going and then they're grabbing short bits of sleep and obviously it's a trade-off right if you run fast you get more tired yeah you have a break you have like a you can take a little nap you go if you if you completed it in let's say 30 minutes you have 30 minutes to spend how you want right but then you've just done four miles in 30 minutes which is more tiring than four miles in 45 minutes.

2:20:42I think most people, it seems like, do like 45 minutes-ish of movement and then 15 minutes of recovery and then go again. It seems like the recent Backyard Ultra, Phil Gore ran 114 laps of the Backyard Ultra format, 475 miles over nearly five straight days. And he went to 496? He nearly did 500 miles. That's crazy. I don't know. Yeah, that's some Forrest Gump shit right there.

2:21:10Andrew Huberman:I would do one and then eat and then stop. I know. That's a good workout. Yeah, that'd be nice. I've never run a marathon. I'm sort of tempted, but not really. Are you? You're not built for a marathon, dude. I ran cross country in high school. I was a lot lighter. A lot lighter. You were half the size. I was probably 100 pounds lighter. No, no, no, no. I was about 75 pounds lighter. Yeah. I'm like 225. You do some running now. Thanks. How old are you? You're fucking old. We already did this. You're saying I'm going to do a marathon. On Sunday, I do a long, slow run. Which is how far? Like in, you know, I'll maybe do like six miles.

2:21:45Andrew Huberman:So I used to do, I used to go further, like eight or 10 when I was lighter, right? I'll do a long run. Then midweek, I do a 30 minute run at a faster clip. And then one day a week, I either get on the Airdyne bike and, you know, do some sprint intervals or I'll do some running sprint intervals. And then I lift three days a week. But you're actually like thinking about doing a marathon. Yeah. You know, every once in a while, someone will be like, hey, there's a half marathon. in uh like outside of aspen which is beautiful and you can like crest into the town and we could you know and i'm like that sounds kind of cool 13 miles seems you know like doable uh like mark bell he's a big dude yeah i mean mark bell is denser than dark matter yeah you know i'm not talking about your brain mark he's a smart guy um but he has like the highest muscle density ever it's insane when he moves it's like everything twitches like one of those belgian blue bulls Totally.

2:22:34Yeah.

2:22:35Andrew Huberman:Yeah. And so he's run marathons. Yeah, yeah. He's constantly - Well, what's crazy is he used to be like highly competitive powerlifter and was like 320 pounds. And then now he's just shrunk all the way down, but he's still like that muscle. It's just crazy. I think he's bench pressed a thousand pounds. I'm not kidding. Is that possible? I don't think the bench record - He squatted a thousand pounds. Squatted a thousand. I don't know. Can we look at Mark Bell's best bench record? I mean, he was genuinely fat too. Yeah. But - Huge. Very, very fat boy. Maybe it was 700 pounds. I don't know. In any case - It's nuts.

2:23:04Andrew Huberman:He was also doing the snake diet recently. He was really like - What the fuck is that? Do you know about this? Yeah. Where you just do sugar all day long, low protein. So there's this weird thing, right? And there are all these crazy theories. I want to just disclaimer, I don't necessarily believe the mechanism. Sure. But there's this idea that when you are low protein, high sugar, you generate this fibroblast growth factor, one of these FGFs, that then converts into a bunch of energy. And this is why like kids have tons of, the theory is this is why kids have tons of energy. And so he was doing this diet of just like fruit and candy and low protein carbs all day and then like a chicken breast at night and he claimed he got like super shredded on this at tons of energy i tried it for like half a morning and i'm like i want my eggs i want my protein drink i'm not doing he was he not carnivore for a while sorry 854 pounds i apologize i misspoke not a thousand pounds but not that far but he's at 2000 at 2000 pound total and he's a thousand pound squat which is fucking gosh he's a thousand pounds that makes sense nobody nobody's pressing a thousand hang on hang on hang on hang on was he not the fucking carnivore guy for a long time yeah and he and his brother is now the sugar maxing guy basically but he also got shredded on both diets yeah he likes to experiment with he like he loves to experiment yeah yeah that's great guy that's crazy he and nasima are like a really important corner of the health and fitness world in my opinion because i do genuinely believe that nasima is natural like i he just has like wild genetics he trains really really hard and he's black does that have anything to do with it he definitely has the build of a guy that could not be white and natural like do you know anyone that's white and natural that's built like that yeah i mean nasima is not white i agree with you on that i'm not trying to be politically correct um i don't know i don't know um it hadn't occurred to me that it was that it was related to i think think that's an enhancer when you get to that level of performance all right we have to get in a scene on here i'm not trying to dance i don't know but he's a he's yeah amazing but mark is always doing these experiments like he's into like the the david weck rope flow and he like takes it to the extreme he does it like every day he talks about it non-stop then he does the snake diet which is the sugar thing and he's doing competitive kettlebell swinging i love it because he's willing to do this stuff and he he's checked off the boxes of like he's really good at the stuff that he puts his mind to big neck as well i bet he's got a little dnt and he's also not selling you a damn thing yeah you know and so he's just like you know we need guys like him you know and he's very open about his steroid use he has been for a long time hang on i thought you said he was natural oh no nasima right right right right right bell is definitely martin bell hasn't been natural since it was whatever yeah yeah fourth grade what's what's the truth about the marshmallow test because i keep on seeing this being debunked and rebunked and then you tweeted about it yeah so this was done at stanford right everyone's heard about it put kids in front of a marshmallow if they can wait they get a second marshmallow the kids that could wait um the original data said that correlated with better life outcomes better sat scores better schools better income you know that kids who couldn't wait more incarcerations that was the idea yeah those data propagated widely and those conclusions propagated widely i should be not the data the conclusions propagate widely then there was the criticism who did the original study was it right So it was at Bing, I think it was at Bing Nursery School at Stanford or somewhere in Escondido Village.

2:26:28Andrew Huberman:Same place that the drawing incentive, extrinsic motivation stuff was done. In any case, then there was the critique of that, which said, well, whether or not these kids waited or not, depending on how much they trusted the experimenter, which is also true. If the experimenter was someone that they knew and trusted, then they would go, well, they probably will bring the second marshal. So here's what they, so I just had a guest on my podcast, which is a guy from Ohio state. He studies self-control motivation and he knows this literature better than anybody. And he studies it in his own lab. Dr.

2:26:57Andrew Huberman:Kentaro Fujita, Fujita, he told me is the correct pronunciation. Excuse me, Japanese listeners. So turns out the way the experiment was done is every kid got a marshmallow in front of them. A timer was set for 15 minutes. Every kid ate the marshmallow. Nobody talks about this. no kid waited for the second marshmallow but they were able to see how long they were able to wait before they got the second marshmallow so some kids were like and the videos are really cute because sometimes the kids would like they have these tags where they're like like they're like looking at her they'd be like you know they're like they're like thinking about but every kid ate no kid made it 15 minutes which is interesting we never hear that if you look at the data that way it turns out that even if you factor in the critique and you look at the repetition of that study it turns out that this self-control delayed gratification thing does seem to hold up over time you can but you can build it out you can develop how old were these kids you i forget maybe were they're like five six i don't know we can we look at how good are your kids at fucking not eating a marshmallow that's in front of them for 15 minutes one could definitely do it the competitive one a hundred percent yeah a hundred percent right he has incredible like self-discipline and restraint You tell him some other kid weighed two days, he's waiting three.

2:28:11Oh, dude. Yeah, for real. And the other one would be like, oh, just immediately. He'd be like, it's just gone. I don't know where it went. I did it with my oldest kid. I actually did the marshmallow experiment. You're kidding. But I was like, don't eat that. Because I was like, if you eat that, you're fucked. Just please don't eat that marshmallow. She was like, all right. You scared the shit out of her. Do not disappoint me. It's hilarious. The rest of your life hinges on how long it takes you to eat this marshmallow. You have no idea what's at stake.

2:28:35Andrew Huberman:I mean, I feel like now more than ever, child or adult, so much of life is basically what you decide not to do. Like, just don't stay on social media too long. Like, go there and use it, but don't stay on there too long. Don't watch too much porn, in your case. I mean, we know that's a common problem. I feel like you got it in a good place. I did. I swear you got it finally, finally, after years. It was a problem? Yeah, for me, it was like, it was never like a massive problem, but it just, like, there's like an intuitive feeling afterwards where I'd just be like, it's not what I want to be doing.

2:29:08And then it's like, just come on, man, you can do this. And then finally, I'm like, all right, I don't want this anymore. It just feels bad. It's like the people making them, there's no way you're telling me the majority or even close to the majority of the women making porn are having like a nice life. You're like, I think you're feeding off like a really sinister thing.

2:29:25Andrew Huberman:So for you, it was guilt and shame around how other people are exploited for your pleasure, ultimately. And squishy 40-year-old boners after the fact. It all congealed, and I was like, there we go. But yes, that was part of it. You want to hear something really embarrassing? So I'm not an actor. I've never been in any kind of thing like that. I tried to play when I was a kid, and I ended up doing crew, like the curtain and stuff like that. but recently someone wrote to me and they were like hey you're in episode a one and two of season two of beef and we signed the release form for that yeah so you're in it too no because it's we fucking signed the release i'm in beef right now but so i go to it okay cool and they give me the time stamp and i go to it i thought i thought i got punked because in both cases it's a dude jerking off to porn then cleaning up his computer and his hands and then And he goes out for a run listening to my podcast.

2:30:22Andrew Huberman:Oh, nice. So this is about dopamine. So this is how this guy gets over the guilt of masturbation listening to my voice. So I was like, you know, I was all excited. I was going to like send it to my mom. I was going to send it to my sister. And I see this thing and I was like, all right. And then I asked my team, I'm like, did we approve this? And they're like, yeah, we approved it. I'm like, yeah, you approved it. Yeah. Yeah. But anyway, it was interesting. One of the clips is from our episode. Awesome. So Rob, your manager, Rob, and us were like, yeah, sure. will sign it off and you didn't know about it.

2:30:52And this is why you have male friends. Exactly. Way to go. Shit. But yeah, that's it. It's just kind of you finish and you're like, this isn't what I need to be doing. Especially once you have kids. Then you're like, dude, I really can't do this in my house. If you get busted by a kid, it's over. You don't really want them knowing. Oh, God.

2:31:09Andrew Huberman:And it can happen. And you don't want them knowing you did this. So it's great that you're talking about this on the internet. Hey, man. I've never even thought about this. The fact that all of your fear as a kid was being walked in on by your mom or dad, but all of your fear as a parent is being walked in on by your kid? A thousand percent. Oh my God. Way worse. Interesting point. The trauma gets so much deeper. Way worse. Yeah, it'd be horrible. So that was the one I was like, that's a good insight. No more. You're going to make a great parent. Yeah. You will make a great parent. I can't wait to be a dad.

2:31:37You'll make a great parent. What about, okay. The other thing that I've kept on thinking about that I've never asked you, sunscreen. Is it killing us or not?

2:31:47Andrew Huberman:No, it's not killing us. Is it bad for us? Should we, is it, am I better? We'll go in layers again, right? A couple of things to know. Settle in. Yeah, I won't do the whole podcast. This rabbit hole's fucking, this is like Alex Jones shit. You need sunlight, not just for vitamin D. You want sunlight on your skin as much as possible in terms of days of your life that you can get it. That doesn't mean as much sunlight as possible. Why? UV light, right? Short wavelength light can damage the DNA in your skin cells. Yes, it can cause problems. You need a lot of it. So in order for that to happen, here's the interesting thing.

2:32:21Andrew Huberman:The UV index is low when the sun is low in the sky. Very easy to remember. So early day and later day, UV index is low. How do you know it's low? Well, you can look on an app, you can Google it or whatever, chat GPT it. But if you can look at the sun and it's not painful to look at, typically that's because the sun is lower in the sky. There's something called Rayleigh scattering and a lot of the UV gets filtered out. Okay. So getting some sunlight in your eyes, as everyone's heard me say a million times before, but also on your skin in the early part of the day. And if you can in the later part of the day, great.

2:32:51Andrew Huberman:In the middle of the day, the UV index is very high. So if you have pale skin that can burn easily, you want to be careful how much exposure you get at that time. Now, sunscreen. Okay, excuse me. Shielding from the sun can be accomplished by physical barrier, right? But there's stuff in the sun that's not sure what wavelength light, which is the reds and the ultraviolet and the near-infrared stuff. Excuse me. Cut that. there's also wavelengths of light this is my area so we don't you know keep it in fuck it you know we make mistakes sometimes i've made mistakes before god forbid i would misspeak all right there are longer wavelengths of light in the sun so the or the yellows the oranges the reds the near infrared and the infrared which you can't see that's the heat from the sun and that stuff is really important for the mitochondria of your cells and it actually can go through your body.

2:33:44Andrew Huberman:This was demonstrated by my friend Glenn Jeffrey from University College London. Even if you have a t-shirt, that's the good stuff. Think of this like the high quality protein of sunlight. So you want that long wavelength light. It's not present in LEDs. Okay. It's present in some incandescent bulbs. It's present in candlelight and firelight. It's present in sunlight. So you want that stuff. So you don't want to completely shield yourself from the sun, but if you're wearing a light t-shirt like that or like that or like that, some of that's going to get through and into your body. But if, you know, if it's appropriate for where you're at, you take off your shirt and get some more of your skin.

2:34:16Andrew Huberman:That's, that's great to do as long as you don't burn. Sunscreen typically blocks the UV. Okay. And there's sunscreen and sunblock and it gets kind of nuanced. But if you are worried about the endocrine disruptors or you're worried about the coral reefs, right. And the disruption to the oceans that are caused by sunscreens. If you're swimming in the ocean, it's very simple. Just use a mineral based sunscreen, mineral only. So zinc oxide only. Now, a lot of people in particular, women don't like it because it doesn't tend to rub in as well, but there's some versions that do. And that works just fine.

2:34:48Andrew Huberman:But this idea that you need to completely shield from the sun all the time, except for people who have like genetic abnormalities that require that, it's complete bullshit. What about the endocrine disruptors? Well, those are mostly in the chemical based sunscreens, right? That's what everyone's using. The spray ones, the benzene based ones, those are very problematic. Now, could you use them once in a while and it's not a problem? Sure, but if your kids are at the pool all day and you're getting this stuff on, I mean, kids' skin, young skin, is also much more absorbent than older skin. So the simple takeaway is try not to get burned.

2:35:18Andrew Huberman:Get some sunlight on your skin as much as you can each day. It doesn't mean you have to get completely naked. You know, thin clothing can do it. But that longer wavelength light is the best red light therapy in the world. And then ultimately, it's the balance between the longer wavelengths and the shorter wavelengths. And that gets into a discussion about, like, are LED lights bad? Well, they're not really bad, but they're really blue shifted and they're really short wavelength shifted. And it's not just about disrupting your circadian rhythm. If you're gonna be indoors a lot, you wanna try and get more of that long wavelength light.

2:35:49Andrew Huberman:You could get it from red light therapy. You could get it from using incandescent bulbs and you can, best thing would be get sunlight on you. And that whole thing around LEDs may be causing problems for mitochondria, which is what the short wavelength light can do, independent of the effects on sleep, was considered kind of crazy quack science until glenn jeffrey's lab started looking at this and nature magazine which is a legitimate scientific publication they've been around more than you know a hundred and something years and the serious science only although there's some you know there's some horseshit papers are published there but usually gets corrected over time they they published a review recently which said yeah like yeah you can see what you want is that balanced spectrum of long wavelength medium wavelength and short wavelength light but not getting burned.

2:36:34Andrew Huberman:And the best source of that is this thing that we call the sun. So, and if you really want to enhance the effect, you get outside where there's a lot of greenery because some of that infrared light actually reflects off the greenery. So this whole thing of spending time outside and in nature, great. And even on overcast days, some of that comes through. So forgive the long kind of thing. And, and yes, I said UV on the long way. It's a short wavelength light. And you know, you want to, you want to hear a cool sun fact. I just, I just researched the sun the other day i did i had shane left so i had to do a podcast like i'll just do outer space and i just talked about outer space that the so the hydrogen fusion whatever that happens in the sun's core that release that releases gamma rays which if they went through they'll just like literally sever your dna they'll kill you they bounce around in the sun's core that original light that's you know originated in that reaction bounces around the core for like 17 000 to 100 000 years in the core then it gets to the surface and shoots out in like eight seconds if that and no one knows like what's going on in there.

2:37:32But if it didn't do it, we would just die. We'd just get drowned in gamma rays and just be dead.

2:37:37Andrew Huberman:If you ever want to - It's amazing. If you ever want to just trip out, you just look at wavelengths of electromagnetic radiation and sources and damage. Like x-rays are damaging. We know this, right? You don't want too many of them. Microwaves, right? You know, heat things up from the inside, basically. So, and it's really cool to just kind of think about this. And then people go, oh, like, you know, is Bluetooth bad? I actually use corded headphones because I lose the stupid AirPods. yeah um but microwaves question do you stand in front of the microwave when it's going down yeah interesting we're completely relying on the on the the the shield yeah the literal see-through piece of yeah yeah we have a lot of trust the other thing that we completely trust i always trip out on this stuff is like when the when the elevator door is closing yeah and it's going to go up or down and that door is like huge yeah people go to let somebody on think about it it didn't stop.

2:38:26Andrew Huberman:I know. And you're just like ripped in half. But we trust it. We trust it. We just trust it. I always get kind of like I always had kind of like spooked out with the microwave going. Like, you know what I mean? Like even like I just always stand off to the side. I'll scoot out to one side. Have you ever seen people that have got fears of escalators trying to get on? Oh, yeah. The videos of that? Yeah. Yeah. And they're like just terrified of the fact that it's and it's moving it, you know. Some people get really scared. Two or three miles an hour. No, even one that's going up. like a travelator, you know, at the airport.

2:38:58And they're like holding on to the side. Sometimes it's an entire family. It's an entire family. And there's like a queue of people behind them like to fucking escalate. I was at the airport and there was like a mom and she was there and she had like a little kid that was like three or four. And the mom got on with all of her luggage. It was this big, you know, tall, steep escalator. And she started going down. She turned around. Her kid was like, yeah, right. I'm not going down. And I just looked at her and I was like, you want me to just put this kid on here? And she was just like, yeah, she didn't speak English.

2:39:24I mean, just give it up. Just grabbed the kid and was like, come on, man, get on there. Just sent him down to his mom. But yeah, it was, she was like, oh no, how am I going to get back up there? When she need to run up and escalate if it's going down.

2:39:37Andrew Huberman:She had two big suitcases. She couldn't, she wouldn't have been able to do it. It's like fucking American Gladiator. Yeah. My travel days are like rucking days. I got this big bag that I carry with all my supplements, you know, like weighed down. And then if there's a big staircase, I swear I'm the only person ever on the staircase. Take the staircase. You feel powerful on it. I just like getting the work and I don't like arriving in, you know, sweaty, but you know, it's, you know, there's sometimes they have showers. That is the workload equivalent of you not fapping over a weekend when you're in a hotel.

2:39:59You're like, I did the hard thing. I did the hard version of this. I'll do the steps too. I'll grab my suitcase and be like, pfft, pussies. I'm going out. Get the steps real hard.

2:40:06Andrew Huberman:Yeah, but then you're in your room jagging off 10 minutes later. I've got places to be, yeah. I'm high tea. I'm just kidding, man. I'm not giving you a hard time. No, dude, I'm fine. I appreciate your vulnerability and your openness about this, you know? Thank you, man. Yeah, yeah, man. Boys, I appreciate you all. Thank you for joining me. Tom, your thing - Oh, that's a fine word. Yes, your thing came out yesterday. Yeah, what was it? Yes, Bad Thoughts Season 2 is on Netflix. Yes, it's on Netflix. It was a - Is there a lot of poop in this one too? No, there's no poop. Oh, thank goodness. Did you have a problem with the poop?

2:40:36Andrew Huberman:I'm not so comfortable with the poop. It was a bold choice. It was the first episode of the season to go with poop. But, you know, we learned, we changed. There's a whole bunch of different stories. They're all super fucked up again. But, yeah. Does Garth Brooks show up in this one too? No, we're done with him. and we have new targets and new fucked up stories. But yeah, it was a blast to make. And yeah, I'm super excited about it. It's streaming on Netflix. Please check it out. It's out now. Out now. Out now. Are you on tour? Yeah, I have my, actually this weekend, I don't know when this is coming out, but I'll be in Toronto Friday and the 15th and then 16th, I'll be in Chicago.

2:41:15Unreal. And then you've got a book that comes out.

2:41:16Andrew Huberman:A book, Protocols, user manual for the human brain and body and it's out for pre-sale. It comes out in September, finally. And yeah, you know, I always say if nothing cures insomnia, you know, this book will do it. I'm going to go rub one out right now. Yeah. Unreal. Thanks for hosting us, Chris. See you, everybody. See you next time. Some follow the noise. Bloomberg follows the money. Because behind every headline is a bottom line. Whether it's the funds fueling AI or crypto's trillion dollar swings, there's a money side to every story. And when you see the money side, you understand what others miss.

2:41:56Get the money side of the story. Subscribe now at Bloomberg.com.