In short
Money stress and budgeting tips, then a special “Budget Rehab” where hosts Sean Piles and Elizabeth Ayola review each other’s budgets using a 50-30-20 framework. They discuss survey findings (51% of Americans feel regular money stress; women 56% vs men 45%; Gen Z 63%) and practical steps: track spending weekly/monthly, use a needs/wants plan, build an emergency fund, and pay down debt (snowball vs avalanche).
Notable examples
cream cheese price/inflation stress; Sean’s $1,000/month partner mortgage contribution; Elizabeth’s $2,200 pet insurance surprise; annual credit card fees (e.g., $500–$700 shocks); Sean’s Roscoe’s sushi/Cajun tots/bar spending; Elizabeth’s Kava and thrifting.
Guests
Anna Helhosky (NerdWallet money news colleague; presents money-stress survey). Main “guests” are the hosts themselves (Sean Piles and Elizabeth Ayola) rehabbing each other’s budgets.
Written by AI. May contain mistakes. Listen to the episode to check what was said.
Chapters
Tap a time to open that second in VOMoney News Roundup
0:34 to 0:56
Overview of current financial news and its relation to money stress.
“It can help you with practically anything on the web, like restoring a vintage motorcycle from a 50-page restoration block, or finally break down that long article you've had open for weeks.”
Money News Roundup
1:41 to 2:16
Overview of current financial news and its relation to money stress.
“But first, our weekly money news roundup, where we break down the latest in the world of finance to help you be smarter with your money.”
Understanding Money Stress
2:16 to 3:36
Discussion on money stress statistics and its impact on different demographics.
“But today we're going to talk about money stress.”
Managing Financial Stress
3:36 to 6:10
Strategies for managing financial stress through budgeting and awareness.
“The key is to just figure out how to manage it one step at a time.”
Emergency Funds and Savings
6:10 to 7:04
Importance of emergency funds and suggestions for building them.
“but it's a good general framework to help you find balance to your money.”
Housing and Money Stress
7:04 to 8:49
Exploration of how housing impacts financial stress and ownership benefits.
“time I had to get all of my tires replaced on my car that I wasn't expecting.”
The Importance of Financial Literacy
8:49 to 10:55
Discussion on financial knowledge and its role in improving confidence.
“situation and what your personal goals are, not what you think you should be doing with your money.”
Listener Engagement and Questions
10:55 to 12:24
Invitation for listeners to share their money questions and concerns.
“And I can say from personal experience, knowledge can definitely boost your confidence.”
Listener Engagement and Questions
13:15 to 14:18
Invitation for listeners to share their money questions and concerns.
“The best summer pieces are the ones that you keep ending up wearing on repeat.”
Budget Rehab: Host Money Discussions
14:36 to 28:04
Hosts Elizabeth and Sean analyze each other's budgets and spending habits.
“This episode, we're doing another round of our budget rehab series, but we're doing it a little bit differently.”
Show all 15 chapters
Lessons in Value from a Child's Request
28:04 to 28:39
Learn how budgeting conversations with children can instill financial awareness.
“Every time we go to the store, he's like, mom, can I get this drone?”
Sean's Budgeting Journey
28:42 to 29:59
Discover Sean's path to budgeting and understanding personal finance.
“So, Sean, we've been talking about all this, but I want us to go back a little in your history of budgeting.”
Elizabeth's Parenting Financial Awakening
30:00 to 31:08
Explore how becoming a parent prompted Elizabeth to take budgeting seriously.
“How much time do I want to spend thinking about where my money is going?”
Navigating Unexpected Expenses
31:09 to 34:18
Understand the challenges of managing unexpected costs and budgeting techniques.
“But when I joined NerdWallet, of course, I learned a lot more about it and started putting my money into different buckets, if that makes sense.”
The Importance of Financial Goals
34:19 to 36:54
Learn how setting financial goals can enhance budgeting effectiveness.
“Thank you—are going to help me think through or talk through whether all of those cards are worth it and the fees are worth it.”
Transcript
Automatic transcript. May contain errors.0:00Elizabeth Ayoola:This episode is brought to you by Accenture. When your advertising operations fall out of sync, everything else follows. Spotify and Accenture are working together to reinvent the rhythm of ad sales, using automation, analytics, and smarter workflows to simplify campaign delivery and access better data across the business. The result? Less time spent on operations, more time connecting brands with the moments and fandoms that matter most. Learn more at Accenture.com slash Spotify. This episode is brought to you by Google Chrome. You think you know a browser, but Gemini and Chrome, that's new. It can help you with practically anything on the web, like restoring a vintage motorcycle from a 50-page restoration block, or finally break down that long article you've had open for weeks.
0:45Elizabeth Ayoola:Gemini and Chrome is here for it. Ready to make anything online make sense? There's no place like Chrome. Check responses set up required, compatibility and availability varies 18+.
0:56Sean Pyles:Those of you who've been following the show lately know we have a new segment where we rehab a listener's budget, soup to nuts, and how much they're paying for that soup and those nuts. Today, we're doing a very special edition of Budget Rehab with some unexpected guests.
1:13Sean Pyles:Welcome to NerdWallet's Smart Money Podcast, where you send us your money questions and we answer them with the help of our genius nerds. I'm Sean Piles.
1:21Elizabeth Ayoola:And I'm Elizabeth Ayola. Later this episode, Sean and I are going to help two listeners with a new budget rehab. Guess who? It's us.
1:31Sean Pyles:But Elizabeth, we are not listeners.
1:33Elizabeth Ayoola:Yeah, I know we're not, but it sounded good. We're going to go through our budgets and let you all in on the nitty gritty of what your favorite podcast hosts spend their money on.
1:40Sean Pyles:Oh boy. But first, our weekly money news roundup, where we break down the latest in the world of finance to help you be smarter with your money. For those who are looking for a rundown of what the government shutdown means for your finances, we did an entire segment on it last Thursday. So that's available for you to go back and listen to. Our news colleague, Anna Helhosky, is with us for this segment that honestly goes really well with the budget rehab because it's all about money stress. Yeah. Now, everyone take a deep breath. Both of you. Take a deep breath. Yes, do it. We're all breathing.
2:10Are your shoulders tight? Is your jaw clenched? You might be stressed.
2:14Sean Pyles:Yes. Right. So there are probably a lot of contributing factors there. But today we're going to talk about money stress. Now, a new survey from Nervald shows that roughly half of Americans, that's about 51%, feel regular stress about money. And that stress doesn't really hit everyone equally either. Here are some of the findings that I want to point out. First off, women report more frequent money stress than men, 56 % versus 45%. And by age, Gen Z is most likely to feel money stress, 63 % compared to millennials at 59 % and Gen Xers at 54%. Baby boomers, those in their 60s and and 70s are less likely to feel this kind of stress compared to younger generations.
2:55Now, that's not really all that surprising. Unless you're born into wealth or you're striking it rich at a young age, younger people are bound to be less financially secure. And right now, there's a lot to be stressed about. Would you both agree?
3:07Sean Pyles:Yeah, absolutely. I mean, I feel like every time I go to the grocery store, my beloved cream cheese costs a dollar more. I paid$6 for a thing of cream cheese, and I'm still not giving up my lox bagels, but it hurts every time I have to pay for it. Yeah, I don't blame you. inflation, uncertainty over economic policy, high housing costs, etc. Those are all going to be causing some stress. And on top of that, money carries a stigma. So if you're struggling, you might also feel pressure to hide that struggle. And that can make your stress worse. But here's the thing that everybody should remember.
3:38Money stress is incredibly common. The key is to just figure out how to manage it one step at a time.
3:44Sean Pyles:Right. And one of the best ways to lower money stress is to take back control where you can amid a situation that can feel kind of out of control. So let's talk through some of these steps so people can feel a little bit more empowered with their money.
3:56Elizabeth Ayoola:Yeah, so I'll kick it off. And something I have grown to love is keeping tabs on where my money is going. Now, I know just saying that out loud might sound stressful, but it can be even more stressful to actually ignore where your money is going. So assess your spending so you can understand what your needs versus your wants are. And you might even find that you have recurring subscription expenses. Last year, I found I had two Amazon subscriptions with two different email accounts. I know, just by looking through my statements. Exactly. And what you can do is track your expenses for at least a month.
4:30Elizabeth Ayoola:And I would advise just to make this like a non-judgmental activity. Don't judge yourself. Just observe where your money is going. And you're probably going to see some patterns and then where you can make improvements. I'm old school, so I do like to use spreadsheets, but there are apps, budgeting apps, going to plug the NerdWallet app if you like that, you know, and different kind of tools you can use to track your spending. Yeah.
4:51Sean Pyles:What I find really helpful is to do this on a weekly basis. I set aside probably 10 to 15 minutes each Sunday when I'm just bored sitting on my sofa and I want to see exactly what I spent my money on over the past week. Does it align with where I want my money to go? What feels good about my spending? What do I want to maybe change over the coming week? And are all of these expenses things that I actually spent my money on. This can also help you find fraud if something does happen to your credit card. So just making sure you have a regular habit of some sort so that you know what your money is doing.
5:18Sean Pyles:That's one of the healthiest ways to stay in control of your finances. You're better than me, Sean. I do it on pretty much like a monthly basis. So at the end of the month, right before my rent is due, I just want to check and say, what did I actually spend money on this month? And I go back through my accounts and through my various credit cards and just take a look and sometimes I'm like didn't do so bad and then other times I'm just pretty embarrassed. Who did that? Not me. Who did that? That's fine. Monthly or weekly is okay as long as you have some system. I like weekly because I used to have a problem with overspending so this kind of helps me rein in my spending a little bit.
5:51Yeah.
5:52Sean Pyles:Another tip that we like to recommend is really creating a plan for the money that you have and that's basically what a budget is. It's just a plan for your money. So at NerdWallet we recommend the 50-30-20 budget where half of your after-tax income is going to needs, 30 % goes to wants, and 20 % goes towards debt payments and savings. And we realize that a lot of people live in expensive places where this is not realistic, but it's a good general framework to help you find balance to your money. That's what the entire framework was originated around, is having some sort of balanced way for allocating your finances, knowing where it's all falling.
6:25And part of that 20 % for savings includes an emergency fund. Now, having three to six months of needs expenses that are actually saved or put away, you can tap them when you need to, it gives you a buffer, something to fall back on if things go sideways. But that might not be realistic for everybody. Three to six months is quite a lot. But starting small, setting aside something every single time that you get paid, it'll give you a little bit more peace of mind than if you didn't put any away. And a high yield savings account is always a nice place to park that.
6:56Sean Pyles:Yeah, even having$1 ,000 set aside, which again, takes a while to build up for some people can help you whether most financial shocks. I remember one time I had to get all of my tires replaced on my car that I wasn't expecting. And guess what, my emergency fund helped me weather that without having to sell any of my investments. Yeah, I just spent$1 ,200 I wasn't expecting to on some dental work earlier this week. So yeah I have to tap that but uh I wouldn't say it in blank but it just didn't make me feel as like upset about it like okay well the money is for exactly and it's a total need my teeth are very important to me they are I'm gonna co-sign that speaking of emergency funds another helpful tip
7:38Elizabeth Ayoola:is to reduce your debt sometimes when you don't have that emergency fund you may end up having to charge that expense onto a credit card that has high interest and then it can snowball from there So you want to look at unsecured debt. Credit card debt especially is tied to higher stress. Now, two methods that you can use to pay down what you owe is one, the debt snowball. This can be good for people who like instant gratification and just want to see one of those balances gone. So you pay off the smallest debt so that you can gain some momentum and hopefully get to the end of your debt road. Now, the second thing you can do is a debt avalanche, and that's when you focus on debts with the highest interest rates first.
8:14Sean Pyles:Another area to explore as you're considering your own personal financial stress is where your housing falls. We saw a NerdWallet survey that homeowners are less likely to report feeling money stress than renters. It was 46 % versus 62%. But of course, we have a housing shortage in this country, and that's led to widespread housing unaffordability. But owning often locks in your housing costs and provides some stability. If buying is a long-term goal, you should explore whether there are loan programs, incentives, or lower down payments to make it more accessible. That said, homeownership isn't right for everyone, so just make sure it fits your financial situation and what your personal goals are, not what you think you should be doing with your money.
8:53Elizabeth Ayoola:Yeah, and I don't think that I should be buying a house, so I am actually renting and enjoying renting. Same here. Sometimes an unpopular opinion, but I actually like to rent. gives me a lot more freedom to move if I need to or if my life changes. I am currently living in a condo building and that building has a ton of problems. Pipes need to be replaced. There are problems with heating and air conditioning. There's mold behind my shower that I inherited. Yeah. And one of the board members who happens to be a retired detective and he's amazing, has been looking into everything. He said to me, if you can hang in there, it's such a great building to live with, I'm not an owner.
9:32So I don't have to hang tight through a bad situation. And in fact, I am moving next week. So in addition to that, thank you. Thank you. In addition to that $1 ,200 for dental work, I also get to pay for moving. I don't see renting as throwing money away either. I'm paying for the roof over my head and I wouldn't be able to afford to buy in my neighborhood. So there's that. Yeah. Yeah.
9:53Sean Pyles:I think that sometimes when you're a property owner, either in a building, like you're describing on it, or even just like a single family home, There's a certain amount of Stockholm syndrome that comes with it where you're like, I'm just going to put up with this house because it's great. Oh, this mold isn't so bad because I made it myself through living in this house. And that's not so good. Yeah. But, you know, you live in a really expensive city. So renting is just often the much more affordable option. I have enjoyed being a homeowner so far over the past four years or so. It's especially done some really great things to my net worth that I love.
10:26Sean Pyles:But I'm admittedly not super handy and I really hate doing home maintenance. The good news for me now is that since I'm renting out my house, my property management company deals with all of that for me. So it's great. Best of both worlds, kind of. The bottom line here is that financial literacy and education matter. The Newr Wallet survey found that about 27 % of Americans aren't confident about their financial knowledge. And that was a little bit surprising to me. Yeah, knowledge is power.
10:53Elizabeth Ayoola:And that's why we have this podcast here.
10:55Sean Pyles:Exactly. That's right.
10:57Elizabeth Ayoola:Spreading the good news. And I can say from personal experience, knowledge can definitely boost your confidence. The more you know, the more tools you have to plan. And the more tools you have to plan, the more you can make decisions about what you're going to do with your finances.
11:10Sean Pyles:And if people aren't feeling confident, I think it's smart to just do one small thing that can make them feel a little bit more empowered. Maybe it is tracking their spending for a month or finding a new savings account that helps you get a better yield on what you're tucking away each month. something that is really tangible, but you don't have to do everything all at once and realize that improving your finances, feeling more confident is a really gradual long-term process that everyone is doing. Right. Revisiting that every month and then adjusting your plan to life changes makes a lot of sense too.
11:38Thank you, Ana.
11:39Elizabeth Ayoola:I can definitely say I'm feeling much better now, which is good because next up it's budget confession time. And if we hadn't gone through all this, I would still
11:47Sean Pyles:be much more stressed me too but do stay tuned because you're going to hear much more about elizabeth and mine's personal money management than you ever thought possible or even asked for
11:56Elizabeth Ayoola:but before we get into that a reminder to send us your money questions maybe you're feeling financial stress and you need help working through one of the specific stressors leave us a voicemail or text us on the nerd hotline at 901-730-6373 that's 901-730-nerd we love emails so please send up to us at podcast at nerdwallet.com.
12:19Sean Pyles:In a moment, this episode's money question. Stay with us. Today's episode is sponsored by Shopify. If you've been sitting on a business idea, Shopify makes it easy to make it happen. Everything you need to start selling is included and ready from day one.
12:34Elizabeth Ayoola:Including the moment your first customer is ready to pay. Shopify checkout helps more of them finish their purchase. And when they come back, their details are already saved, and one tap and they're done.
12:45Sean Pyles:Because Shopify handles the setup and checkout, you have more time to focus on growing your business and the tools to do it.
12:52Elizabeth Ayoola:Shopify powers millions of businesses worldwide, from household names like Mattel and Gymshark to small businesses just getting started.
Read the full transcript
12:59Sean Pyles:With Shopify, nothing stands between your idea and a real business. So go make it one.
13:04Elizabeth Ayoola:Start your free trial at shopify.com slash smart money.
13:08Sean Pyles:That's shopify.com slash smart money.
13:12Elizabeth Ayoola:Today's episode is sponsored by Quince.
13:15Sean Pyles:The best summer pieces are the ones that you keep ending up wearing on repeat. Comfortable, versatile, and somehow right for almost every occasion.
13:22Elizabeth Ayoola:And that's exactly why I love Quince. They make elevated essentials and they use premium materials like European linen, organic cotton, and washable silk without the traditional retail markup.
13:33Sean Pyles:Quince's 100 % European linen pants, dresses, and tops are the pieces that you'll reach for all summer long. They're lightweight, effortless to style, and start at just$32.
13:42Elizabeth Ayoola:And if you like denim, their denim is soft and comfortable, and their organic cotton sweaters are perfect for layering when evenings start to cool down.
13:50Sean Pyles:I recently got some European linen sheets for my bedroom, and they are so cozy, and they really do get softer every time I wash them.
13:56Elizabeth Ayoola:It's summertime. Of course, it has been blazing hot, so I've been spending time by the pool, and I have been rocking the bathing suit that I got from Quince. It is so washable, the fabric is so light, and it feels like such good quality.
14:07Sean Pyles:With Quince, it's not just the apparel. Quince also offers elevated essentials for your home, from bedding, like I mentioned, and bath, to kitchen essentials and furniture.
14:15Elizabeth Ayoola:Make your summer wardrobe feel easier. Go to quince.com slash smartmoney for free shipping on your order and 365-day returns. It's now available in Canada, too.
14:26Sean Pyles:That's quince.com slash smartmoney for free shipping and 365-day returns. Quince.com slash smartmoney. We're back and answering your money questions to help you make smarter financial decisions. This episode, we're doing another round of our budget rehab series, but we're doing it a little bit differently. Elizabeth and I are going to rehab each other's budgets and get a little bit nosy about what we spend our money on and what kind of money we have coming in. We're doing this IRL in person at the Scottsdale, Arizona HQ of NerdWallet. So if you hear people running around in the background, that's just a bunch of nerds making things great for you.
15:03So with that, let's do it, Elizabeth.
15:06Sean Pyles:Should we look at your budget first or mine?
15:10Elizabeth Ayoola:Yours. This was very vulnerable because even though Sean and I are co-hosts, we don't know each other's business like that. So now I know more about how Sean spends his money and he knows more about how I spend my money. So let's start with your budget, Sean.
15:23Sean Pyles:So I made a little 50-30-20 spreadsheet that we use for this segment. And I modeled it after Elizabeth Warren's book where she lays out the 50-30-20 budget. So it was my fun little project putting this together for myself. So looking at my after-tax income, this includes my NerdWallet income and my rental income for my property in Washington. I'm making just under$10 ,000 a month,$9 ,988. And I'm spending that on all sorts of things. If we look at my 50-30-20 breakdown, my must-haves, my needs are a little over 35 % of my income. My savings score, the amount I'm putting away, is around 35.44 % specifically.
16:08Sean Pyles:And my want score is 30%. So instead of doing 50-30-20, I'm kind of doing 30-30-30-ish.
16:14Elizabeth Ayoola:Isn't that, I feel like that's so reflective of your personality. It feels so organized and even. Very balanced. And balanced. when I looked at your budget, one of the things that surprised me is how much you're saving. So I know the saving rate, depending on your age and stuff, is usually maybe advice to be around 15%, right? A year? Yeah.
16:32Sean Pyles:General advice to put away between 10 % and 15 % of your income for retirement. But I'm able to save a lot more largely because my needs expenses are pretty low. So right now I have my place in Washington and pay my mortgage on that. The rental income basically covers that. I throw a thousand bucks a month to my partner for part of his mortgage. And I'm not really paying utilities right now. I give my mom 50 bucks a month for the cell phone bill. But beyond that, I'm not paying a water bill. I'm not paying electricity. And I am paying for homeowner's insurance, but that's part of my mortgage, which is like just under$1 ,300.
17:06Sean Pyles:So I'm really fortunate that I have pretty low expenses. I paid off my car earlier this year. That was a big difference. Yeah, that's saving me 350 bucks a month. My car insurance is like 180 a month. I hate to see how high that is, but that's actually pretty normal for my car. And I'm spending like 100 bucks a month on gas because I work from home. So yeah, I can save so much because I don't have a lot of needs pulling out my money. I don't have kids like you do. So it makes it easier for me to do these things.
17:35Elizabeth Ayoola:I was curious about your health care or rather your health care expenses. So there was nothing there. So tell me about that.
17:41Sean Pyles:Yeah, I mean, I have a high deductible health care plan and I put money into my HSA each month and I don't spend a lot on health care, which is why I have an HGHP and an HSA, because it's a smart if you an HSA is often a good idea. If you either are very low health care expenses or really high health care expenses and you're going to hit that deductible, I'm knock on wood. And the former category where I just don't spend a lot on my health care, I'm hoping that doesn't change, but it makes it so that my income is pretty stable. Yeah.
18:10Elizabeth Ayoola:So tell me, have you always had that high savings rate? And actually, I'm going to ask you a follow up question about your expenses after that. Tell me that first.
18:18Sean Pyles:I would say no. I think when I was paying off my car, I had, you know, like a lot more. I actually want to play with my spreadsheet and see what my savings rate would be if I had that$350 a month payment in there. So now my must-haves are like 38%. So like a 3 % difference, that changes things a little bit. And that impacted the amount that I could tuck away. So now the amount that I was putting toward my car payment, I'm actually putting that into a car fund. Because as much as I love my car and I want to drive it into the ground, it only has like 70-something thousand miles on it. I know eventually I will need a new car.
18:51Sean Pyles:So I would love to use the hopefully 10 years that I have before that happens to be able to tuck aside a bunch of cash.
18:57Elizabeth Ayoola:So organized. Nice. And honestly, I'm about to pay off my car loan next year. Oh, wow. Congratulations. I have not started thinking about planning for a new car. So you're making me feel embarrassed here. So that's definitely something to do. But Sean, your budget is beautifully vanilla. So I want to know, since I can't see it in your budget, what do you spend your disposable income on? And don't tell me all the responsible things that you spend your disposable income on.
19:22Sean Pyles:I spend most of my disposable income on going out to eat, going to bars, and slightly overpriced clothes.
19:29Elizabeth Ayoola:Oh, okay.
19:30Sean Pyles:So that's my indulgence is like I will buy some nice clothes like once or twice a quarter.
19:35Elizabeth Ayoola:So if I were to look at your bank statement, where do you go out to eat the most?
19:38Sean Pyles:There's a bar in my neighborhood called Roscoe's that I love. They serve the neighboring joints sushi because they share a kitchen and you can get beer from Roscoe's tap list. And they also they have Cajun food, which like frankly is just so so, but they have really good Cajun tots. So you can get a bunch of sushi rolls and then you can get your Cajun tots and you can get your beer and it's the best. So that's where I eat probably most often. There's also an amazing Thai place in my neighborhood called Yawarat. It's one of the top Thai restaurants in the country and it is expensive. My partner and I go there like maybe once every six weeks and it feels indulgent, but it's 100 % worth it because life is short.
20:14Sean Pyles:You got to treat yourself.
20:15Elizabeth Ayoola:It is. And money is there to be spent as well, not just saved, right? Yeah. And of course, I have to ask you, where are you buying these slightly expensive clothes from? What are your top stores?
20:25Sean Pyles:I would love if they would sponsor this podcast and give me free clothes, but I'm a huge fan of Alex Mill. It's a boutique and the guy there used to work at J.Crew. And they just make really nice basics that I can wear with pretty much anything. You can dress them up or down and they'll last forever. So, yeah.
20:40Elizabeth Ayoola:Love it. That's my indulgence. And I want to know if you could change one thing about your budget, if anything. I don't see nothing that you really need to change. but what would you change?
20:50Sean Pyles:I would like to save even more. So maybe find a way to trim like my car insurance. I don't really see a great way to do that. I have a really good price right now. Eventually I'll have my student loan paid off and paying$221.50 a month for that. I would love to not have that, but it's going to be a few years. So then I would just put that amount of money toward my brokerage account, which I consider a form of savings and investing that money. It is. But now I want to hear about your budget, Elizabeth, because we've gotten into some of my details. So let's pop this little spreadsheet open here.
21:24Sean Pyles:What do you have?
21:25Elizabeth Ayoola:Okay. So in terms of my after-tax income, it's about$9 ,183, roughly somewhere around there. So that includes my NerdWall income and then my freelance income as well.
21:36Sean Pyles:And your freelance income is mostly from you writing articles? Yeah, that's all I do.
21:40Elizabeth Ayoola:And a tip for that is I have contracts with these people. So I know basically how much I'm going to make each month with each of the applications I work for.
21:47Sean Pyles:That's nice because the contract work, there's often such irregularity to it, right? Exactly.
21:51Elizabeth Ayoola:I have my housing costs. I pay rent, happy renter. And I pay$2 ,375 in rent.
21:57Sean Pyles:Is that good for your area? I have no idea what the Houston rental market is like.
22:01Elizabeth Ayoola:That's amazing. Living in Florida, I was paying that amount for a two-bedroom apartment. I pay this for a four-bedroom house with a lush garden. So to me, definitely value. utilities are boring but I pay around$200 for that that's not bad no it's not internet and phone I'm proud of myself because I think at the beginning of this year or last year I cut that bill down to about 60 bucks so my phone how'd you do that well I switch my phone don't ask me the company right now I should know but I don't off the top of my head but I pay about $25 exactly I pay about$25 for my phone bill and the reception is fine just fine$25 yes you have
22:39Sean Pyles:unlimited internet and it works where you want it to.
22:41Elizabeth Ayoola:And Hotspot too. And I was paying around$70 before.
22:45Sean Pyles:You heard it here, folks. Exactly. Cut your cell phone bill.
22:49Elizabeth Ayoola:And you know what? It was actually a nerd. Shout out to Tommy who recommended that to me because he has an article, Tommy Tindall, on how to basically get cheaper phone plans. We'll link to that in the show notes. There we go. Medical care, I only pay$47 a month. That's also not bad. No, it's not. So like you, I have a high deductible health care plan and an HSA. I also don't go to the doctor often, so I don't spend much on that. Noting on good for you. I know. I know. Let me see. What else I got in here? I still do have a car payment, and I pay about$350 a month for that. I'm about to up that to$400 so I could pay it off at the end of next year.
23:25Sean Pyles:Show me how your money maps out in terms of like the 50-30-20. Oh, yeah, sure.
23:30Elizabeth Ayoola:Okay. So in terms of the 50-30-20, 41 % is spent on must-haves, monthly savings. I have about a 46 % savings rate and a 12 % want score.
23:42Sean Pyles:That's really good. I mean, I will say your wants seem a little unbalanced. Are you going out to eat? Are you having fun?
23:48Elizabeth Ayoola:I absolutely am. And I'm a shameless going out to eat. I order Kava, Kava, however you say it, maybe like once or twice a week. So I do eat out quite often. And like I said, I do like to shop. So thrifting is my guilty pleasure. for clothes.
24:01Sean Pyles:Is that where most of your budget's going toward the Cava?
24:03Elizabeth Ayoola:Food, yeah. Food and clothes, I would say. And then sometimes, so what I don't do, so you didn't ask me this yet, if I had to improve something about my budget, because I have such a relatively high savings rate, sometimes I don't plan for like unexpected expenses and I'll just pull it out of my savings bucket.
24:18Sean Pyles:But one time a year something pops up. Yeah, I just had that with my pet's health insurance and it was a nice like$2 ,200 surprise. And so I did the same thing. There is this kind of rebalancing of, all right, I guess I pulled some money from my home improvement fund because my pets are part of my house is how I justified it. That was a little girl mad there. But it's really easy to forget those expenses, right?
24:39Elizabeth Ayoola:It is. And speaking of which, my credit card annual fees always surprise me and they need to stop surprising me. So I go, oh my God, five hundred. Four? So I'll go, oh my God,$500. Oh my God,$700. So luckily I have it in savings, but I should plan better for it by putting aside a reminder. Exactly. $100 extra in my savings a month or whatever.
25:02Sean Pyles:So another savings bucket just for your annual fees.
25:05Elizabeth Ayoola:Who knows, Sean? I might end up with 10 savings accounts just like you. Exactly. I might. I might.
25:10Sean Pyles:Okay. And so what would you say was surprising going through this exercise? Because had you mapped out your finances in this way before?
25:18Elizabeth Ayoola:No. So I haven't actually. And guys, don't again, don't stone me. but I haven't actually put my budget in a 50, 30, 20 budget. So it was interesting to see how high my savings rate is and also settling for me because I'm hard on myself and I feel like I should be saving more. But it's like, girl, you're almost saving half of your income.
25:36Sean Pyles:If I'm looking at the spreadsheet correctly, you're maxing out your 401k.
25:40Elizabeth Ayoola:I am, yeah. And I'm aiming to max out my HSA. Thank you, thank you.
25:45Sean Pyles:And you're putting$500 a month into a taxable brokerage account?
25:48Elizabeth Ayoola:You know, I want to retire early. That's so good.
25:50Sean Pyles:And yeah, I'm putting in$300 a month in mine. And I just actually upped that because I was doing like$150. And I figured like I can do that. I also want to ask too, what feels gratifying about how you spend your money?
26:01Elizabeth Ayoola:The first thing that comes to mind is going on adventures with my son. I think that's priceless. So whenever I spend money on our little adventures, I'm always happy. And just knowing that I'm saving towards retirement, that's not something many people in my family have done. So it just feels like I'm doing something different. And also I'm showing my son what's possible in terms of if you're diligent and consistent and you save. So it's nice seeing my income go up in terms of my savings. Yeah.
26:29Sean Pyles:For me, one thing that I've been trying to invest more in is donating to causes that I really like. So I care a lot about hunger. And so I donate to food banks in this small town in Washington where I have my house in Oregon. And I just started donating to World Central Kitchen because they provide meals for people in Palestine. So it's important to put your money where your values are. We talk a lot about values on the show. So yeah, I've been just trying to think about that, too, because I we are so fortunate to have our needs not be 50 percent or 60 percent of our income like it is for so many people.
27:00Sean Pyles:So where can we put our money to make it more effective, to make a better world?
27:05Elizabeth Ayoola:I agree. I do donate to a few charities, but you're reminding me that I could definitely donate more.
27:09Sean Pyles:So one thing I'm wondering about, too, is where your son fits in. Is he part of that 12 percent of your wants, like in terms of his extracurriculars? Or is he under that 46 percent of your 41 percent of your needs?
27:23Elizabeth Ayoola:Yeah, he's in both. So he's definitely in the wants. So going out to eat, he's muddled somewhere in there, too. I'm not a huge toy buying mom, so I do not buy him a lot of toys. He barely plays with the ones that he has. So honestly, I'm more of an experienced mom. So I'll spend money on this. You guys just want ziplining. Exactly.
27:38Sean Pyles:That was so cute. I saw the videos of that. It was so fun.
27:41Elizabeth Ayoola:And it was probably spent with food because we went out to eat after. That probably was like$150 trip, right?
27:46Sean Pyles:And after you did that, if you spent that money on the experience, did you discuss, okay, I allocated this amount of money for us to go out and have this time together. And I'm putting my money into this versus buying you some other piece of plastic.
27:58Elizabeth Ayoola:Absolutely. So I have started trying to help him weigh out like the value of what something is. So for example, he's been wanting to buy a drone. Every time we go to the store, he's like, mom, can I get this drone? How much does the drone cost? Well, we were at Walmart the other day and he saw one for$60. And I'm like, okay, that's great. But we have to do, you know, price comparison. So this might not be the best one for the best value. So let's look at some other stores and see if we can find one at a good price that's also good value. And then he had a pause and he's like, oh, right? The light bulb went on.
28:27Elizabeth Ayoola:The what? The light bulb went on. So we kind of do have all these money conversations every time we do an activity. And maybe he asked for something else. And he's like, I didn't get anything today. And it's like, well, no, we just paid for ziplining and food, right? Right.
28:38Sean Pyles:You don't need a treat every day. Not every day. As nice as that would be.
28:41Elizabeth Ayoola:Exactly. Exactly. So, Sean, we've been talking about all this, but I want us to go back a little in your history of budgeting. And I want you to tell me when you actually started budgeting and why. So how did you start budgeting?
28:51Sean Pyles:I can honestly say I didn't really start budgeting in a sincere, thoughtful way until I started working at NerdWallet, which was like nine years ago at this point. And it wasn't because I had loads of money to throw around. In fact, I didn't really have much at all, but I just put my head in the sand and just hoped that I had enough. and oftentimes I didn't. There were times in my early 20s where I would try to buy groceries and my debit card would get declined because I didn't have a credit card. And that was, you would think it would be a wake-up call for me. And it just wasn't because I was so avoidant with all of it.
29:22Sean Pyles:And then once I started working at NerdWallet and I realized that there were different ways to approach budgeting, I understood that, look, I like to know where my money is going. That's why I have all like 10 savings buckets and I have my money generally mapped out. But I'm not a super granular budgeter. I'm not doing zero based budgeting where I know where every single penny goes because I'm more of like a big picture kind of guy, if you will. So that's what's worked for me because I set up the system of having my direct deposits into various accounts. And it's it's been fine. You know, as we can see in my numbers here, I have my finances pretty well organized.
29:54Sean Pyles:But it was a process of discovery around like what would I want to do with my my budget on a regular basis? How much time do I want to spend thinking about where my money is going? I'm one of those people that thinks that we should all be trying to get to a place where we don't have to think about our money too much. And budgeting with the system that I have allows me to do that.
30:12Elizabeth Ayoola:Yeah.
30:12Sean Pyles:And what about you, Elizabeth?
30:14Elizabeth Ayoola:Well, for me, to be honest, it's when I found out I was pregnant with my son. So before then, I was kind of just YOLOing it, you know? A bit of a wake-up call.
30:23Sean Pyles:A bit of a wake-up call.
30:24Elizabeth Ayoola:So I was just like, well, I guess my expenses are about to double. And I guess I got to figure out how to pay, you know, for another human. And I just remember I started saving aggressively and lowering my expenses, but I didn't really have a formal way of doing it. That's just what I was doing, saving.
30:40Sean Pyles:What were you doing in your life at this time? You weren't working at NerdWallet. No. This was seven years ago, right? Oh, my gosh. I was writing.
30:45Elizabeth Ayoola:Yep. I was writing. And I was freelancing. And I was in a content mill. And I was writing about 10 articles a day. And they were paying me$8 per article. That sounds miserable. Yeah. You weren't making quite as much as you were making now?
30:59Sean Pyles:No.
31:00Elizabeth Ayoola:So it's been a journey for sure. But even with that, I was, yeah, the motivation was I have to take care of a child. So, yeah, so that's basically when I started budgeting. And as I started learning more about money, I guess would refine my budget and realize, okay, aside from putting money in a savings account, I didn't know anything about retirement back then. But when I joined NerdWallet, of course, I learned a lot more about it and started putting my money into different buckets, if that makes sense.
31:24Sean Pyles:So how do you approach it now? You're also not like a zero-based budgeter, right?
31:28Elizabeth Ayoola:Well, you know, we are twins, you know, hey twin. So no, I am not a zero base budgeter, but I will say sometime last year when my budget got a little out of whack, I did do zero base budgeting for a couple of months just to see where all my money was going.
31:43Sean Pyles:What do you mean?
31:44Elizabeth Ayoola:Oh, overspending. So I just found I kept overspending. So I was still saving a lot. Well, it was around the time I moved. So I had just huge expenses. I think I had almost like$20 ,000 saved for my move. And don't ask me how I blew through that. buying new furniture um deposit so expensive yeah deposits that'll really do it but my son in private school so just all these big expenses came up you had to move the fish for listeners
32:08Sean Pyles:elizabeth moved fish from florida to texas in the trunk of a car u-haul and in the u-haul and what two out of three survived one out of two survived okay okay well i guess 50 success rate isn't maybe the best well well the fact that a single fish could make it that far i mean you're putting your money in an important place. Exactly. Keeping that fish alive.
32:28Elizabeth Ayoola:Exactly. And not to throw my son's godfather under the bus. But the second might... I am. Hey, if you're listening. The second might have survived if he listened to me and didn't put both of the fish in the back of the U-Haul where it was so hot.
32:40Sean Pyles:Oh, no. So the one that survived
32:42Elizabeth Ayoola:was such a fighter because it survived all those hours in the back of the U-Haul.
32:45Sean Pyles:Is it still alive?
32:46Elizabeth Ayoola:Yeah. It's still in there.
32:47Sean Pyles:What's his name?
32:48Elizabeth Ayoola:Oh, he doesn't have one. Maybe we... Or she. Or they.
32:51Sean Pyles:They deserve a name.
32:52Elizabeth Ayoola:You're right. Me and I are... So much. We're going to work on that when we get home. We're going to choose a name.
32:56Sean Pyles:And how much are you paying a month for this fish?
32:58Elizabeth Ayoola:Oh, they're so low maintenance. I love them for that. There you go. I buy fish food and it's about, I don't know, 15 bucks, maybe every three or four months.
33:05Sean Pyles:And that's under your needs.
33:06Elizabeth Ayoola:Yeah, that's under my needs, exactly.
33:08Sean Pyles:But low needs. Yeah. One thing I want to ask you about, too, is what would you change about your budget if you could?
33:15Elizabeth Ayoola:What I would change, I know I'm a little chaotic, right? so I'm not perfect with my budget, is that I do not really plan for those maybe one-time annual expenses.
33:24Sean Pyles:Yeah, the credit card annual fees. Yeah. Exactly. Okay. Also, how do you justify all those expenses? Because I have a really hard time paying credit card annual fees. I just got my second credit card with an annual fee. I'm now at around$600 a year total in fees. And I'm thinking I might nix my older card that has a fee because is it worth it for me? Sometimes no.
33:44Elizabeth Ayoola:So what's interesting is I more recently got, I guess, two of my higher fee cards within the past year or year and a half. So I'm in the process of testing out whether it's worth it. I am most likely going to cancel my Chase Sapphire Reserve since they increased that price because so far I can't justify.
34:05Sean Pyles:It's so expensive and you have to work really hard to make it break even. And for me, I'm a lazy credit card person, so I'm not about that game. But you are still kind of trying out different products, and that's how you make it worth it for your budget.
34:17Elizabeth Ayoola:Exactly. And luckily, the travel gals on the travel podcast at NerdWallet— Yes, Smart Travel. Thank you—are going to help me think through or talk through whether all of those cards are worth it and the fees are worth it. But if not, I guess I'll just chalk it up to my wants bucket.
34:31Sean Pyles:Okay. Well, maybe we can both commit, because we mentioned that we both struggle with these one-off annual expenses, to putting aside a pot of money to cover that expense. No. First of all, we need to know exactly how much we have coming up. Because I have the same thing. I have a magazine subscription that hits every spring, and it's like$250.
34:51Elizabeth Ayoola:What magazine are you paying$254, Sean?
34:52Sean Pyles:It's the New Yorker. It's probably not$250. It might even be more. Who knows by the time this goes live, the price is raised every year, but it's worth it for the journalism that I'm getting. However, it's always a shock and I hate that kind of unexpected expense. So that plus my pet's insurance and that's what's harder to account for when you are doing like kind of loosey-goosey budgeting sometimes.
35:10Elizabeth Ayoola:Exactly. So I think maybe you have convinced me to open another account because why not savings account for those expenses so I can just pull from there and it doesn't feel so awful.
35:20Sean Pyles:Before long, you'll have 10 savings accounts just like me.
35:21Elizabeth Ayoola:Oh my gosh, probably not. You know, I'm all over the place. I probably won't be able to manage all at once, but another one won't hurt.
35:27Sean Pyles:Okay. So I love how you share your financial journey with your son. If there is one thing about how you have gone through your budgeting journey that you would like him to learn the easy way through you, not the hard way by going through it himself, what would that be?
35:42Elizabeth Ayoola:I know everyone's probably sick of hearing this, but I think a huge part of budgeting really is needs versus wants. And also not just that, having a financial goal. Because I think when I started having financial goals like FIRE and early retirement, or just even incremental goals like wanting to get my savings from$0 to$50 ,000 in my 401k, it helps me to say no to some needs that I might want to do in the moment because I'm working towards a goal. So I think teaching him to have goals that motivate him, that align with his values and also fit him with his lifestyle would be the foundation of him choosing whatever budget and system works for him.
36:17Elizabeth Ayoola:Oh, I love that. Yeah.
36:18Sean Pyles:Yeah. I find for a lot of people, they don't know their numbers. And that's something that I encounter talking with clients from my firm where I try to get a grip on where their budget is first and foremost. And it's such a journey of self-discovery. And a lot of folks don't realize that they are spending so much on discretionary expenses. And look, we all have to live. there's no guarantee of tomorrow. I'm not saying just live in a hole in the dark or anything, but you have to know what you're working with so you can make those changes so you can have those goals and put away the money so that you can achieve what you want in life.
36:48Elizabeth Ayoola:And it's empowering. You know, I think it's really empowering to look at your numbers, even though it might feel scary at first. Yeah.
36:55Sean Pyles:Well, this has been so informative. I don't think we rehabbed anything about our finances, but we did commit to one change, which is going to be getting a grip on our once a year unexpected expenses. But I'm proud of us for being so vulnerable and open with each other. So thank you for sharing that.
37:09Elizabeth Ayoola:Thank you for sharing too, Sean. We're having a kumbaya moment.
37:12Sean Pyles:That's all we have for this episode. Remember, listener, that we're here to answer your money questions. So send them our way. You can call or text us on the nerd hotline at 901-730-6373. That's 901-730-NERD. Or email us at podcast at nerdwallet.com.
37:27Elizabeth Ayoola:And of course, we want you to join us next time to hear about when it's better to trade in your car then fix it up. Follow Smart Money on your favorite podcast app that includes Spotify, Apple Podcasts, and iHeartRadio to automatically download new episodes.
37:40Sean Pyles:Here's our brief disclaimer. We are not your financial or investment advisors. This nerdy info is provided for general educational and entertainment purposes and may not apply to your specific circumstances.
37:50Elizabeth Ayoola:This episode is produced by Tess Vigeland and Anna Helhosky, Hilary Georgie, helped with editing, and Nick Kursamy mixed our audio. We want to give a huge thank you to NerdWallet's editors for all the ways they help us.
38:02Sean Pyles:And with that said, until next time, turn to the nerds.
From the publisher
In this special video episode, Sean and Elizabeth give each other a “budget rehab,” revealing their own budgets to help you fix yours.
How can you feel more in control of your spending? How can you plan for irregular expenses like credit card annual fees or surprise bills? In this video episode, hosts Sean Pyles and Elizabeth Ayoola give each other a “budget rehab” to reveal how they really manage their money — and how you can apply the same strategies to your own finances. But first, they’re joined by NerdWallet senior writer Anna Helhoski to discuss new NerdWallet survey findings about money stress and what steps you can take to alleviate it. They discuss why money stress hits some groups harder than others and share practical tips for easing the pressure.
Then, Sean and Elizabeth present a personal “Budget Rehab” segment where they analyze each other’s real numbers while sitting eye to eye at NerdWallet HQ. Sean shares how he balances rental income, savings, and splurges, while Elizabeth maps her freelance income, high savings rate, and family priorities. Together, they highlight the pros and cons of tactics like setting up multiple savings buckets, trimming recurring costs, maxing out tax-advantaged accounts, and planning ahead for annual fees and surprise expenses.
Smart Money is a finalist for TWO Signal Awards! Please take a moment to vote for us here:
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Want the cheapest prepaid phone plan that still fits your phone service needs? Read NerdWallet’s article on the best cheap cell phone plans: https://www.nerdwallet.com/p/best/finance/cheap-cell-phone-plans
Want us to review your budget? Fill out this form — completely anonymously if you want — and we might feature your budget in a future segment! https://docs.google.com/forms/d/e/1FAIpQLScK53yAufsc4v5UpghhVfxtk2MoyooHzlSIRBnRxUPl3hKBig/viewform?usp=header
In their conversation, the Nerds discuss: money anxiety, reduce financial stress, generational money differences, Gen Z money habits, Millennial money habits, Gen X finances, Baby Boomer finances, grocery inflation, high food prices, emergency savings, build emergency cushion, debt payoff strategies, debt snowball vs avalanche, credit card debt payoff, homeownership vs renting, housing costs, mortgage vs rent, rental affordability, HSA benefits, high-deductible health plan, maxing out 401k, brokerage account investing, saving for car replacement, sinking fund examples, subscription audit tips, lower utility bills, cheaper phone plan, cutting cell phone costs, donating to charity, values-based spending, overspending triggers, budget burnout, financial literacy gaps, improve financial confidence, setting financial goals, FIRE movement, early retirement savings, family budgeting, and teaching kids about money.
To send the Nerds your money questions, call or text the Nerd hotline at 901-730-6373 or email podcast@nerdwallet.com.
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