292 - Best of 2025! "Eat What You Kill": Why Raising Venture Capital is the Worst Way to Solve Your Startup's Problems with Erik Kaiser

26:42And it just blows my mind that that's what they're throwing money at. You effectively have figured out, all right, I think I can understand the distribution. I know how to design things. Let's have an incubator because I've got some secret sauce or secret sauce might be too strong, but you have a competitive advantage in the ability to get stuff to market and a distribution channel to sell it through. Yeah. But you still end up, unless you have a product that sells itself and is in such high demand, you still need to use ads. You know, for this Tyco brand, we tried some ads, we didn't get much traction.

27:16We went to Amazon and now we're going to do it completely differently. And I really think this is important. It's so easy to throw money at ads and people do, and some people are successful. Some, most people aren't really not, but when you do that, you do constrain yourself to then just ads. And we've had this Tyco brand and we're sitting on inventory. The inventory expires at the end of this year. So now we've tried different ads we've tried amazon we've we've tried some stuff now it's like no now you have to be more creative you're like now let's find another avenue like i don't give up on anything there's no there's not like oh well fuck it just shelve it and you know whatever like that that's not me i'm like i will because each of these like how much do you have sitting in inventory oh it's like fifty thousand dollars worth of profit it's like i don't know like twelve thousand or fifteen thousand units of stuff it's you're not talking about anything crazy but i'm not willing to just let it die in the vine for 50 grand i'm like no it's not right i spent 30 000 on the domain itself okay so what i'm trying to get it is you have to continually think about more creative ways to access channels create channels find a way to to move it you know so now i have another idea i'm like okay hotels airbnb like i'm constantly and one of those keys will unlock a door that we would never have thought of earlier if you know we were just doing like a row as 2.3 on meta and just like clicking by and then like something more spectacular will happen as a result of of these constraints right and so so that's where i'm at so i'm like i'm super energized about this brand because it's done really not much i mean like not much that 10 10 000 or something i mean we're talking just not a lot and no one's focused on it because we have all these other jobs so yeah that's that's something else, resource, you know, resource attribution.

29:12Okay. So there's, there's two sayings that come to mind for me and they're both venture sayings. The first one is first time founders focus on product and second time founders focus on distribution. I think you focus on both, but it's obvious you have, you're very concerned with the distribution piece. The second saying is hardware is hard. So I want to know this crushed the memory. It's an amazing idea, but walk me through. Okay. First of all, what is it? Where did the idea come from? And if hardware is hard, why did you decide to make a hardware product? Well, I didn't know hardware was hard.

29:48So I'm ignorant. No, I'm just telling you, I'm an ignorant person. I'm very naive. I'm not, I'm not interested in, you know, I just do stuff like going to China. I just moved to China. Like, like, I didn't, I didn't know it was hard or it's just a challenge. Like you just, I just, that's just what I do. I see what I want and I go get it. So I hear hardware is hard and yeah, it is, it is hard if you're just some dude, you know, but here I am, you know, I'm living in China. I'm building products that I've never built before that I find are much easier than building a building because it's only a certain number of parts.

30:31You get your hands around products, you get some experience and then you start understanding. And all of a sudden, if you keep looking at something long enough and you keep having a conversation like, oh, that's what it is. Oh, interesting. Okay, cool. And then you start developing it. And I can just give you an anecdote and then answer your question more directly, which is when I first started working in China back in 2010, I would visit factories and they would make electronics. When I used to see these assembly lines for the electronics, they would blow my mind. They're so complex and so technical and so beyond my understanding at the time and i was amazed i was like i was like wow that is like that's cool stuff guess what you know i have one of those those assembly lines now and it just you know time after time more visits more factories asking a question like what does this machine do you're like oh that's what it does oh it's a feeder oh okay that's what that is what does this do oh it does that and then you see how it all goes together and over time all longer it's not a mystery all of a sudden it's like oh well, we can just get our own.

31:33Like, why don't we do that? We just need to hire the right operator. And so you do. And so now I've got a very technical SMT line that assembles. What's SMT? A surface mount technology. So when you get a electronic, it has a circuit board in it. That's called a PCB printed circuit board. And you, all those components have to go on the circuit board. That's done with a very high speed, technical, expensive machine and a line that takes it and puts a solder mask on and drops components and picks the components super fast and then puts it through a reflow of and it just like all that stuff was foreign language to me now it's just it's what we do it's my favorite process and i own so getting familiar with something makes it easier and then you see that oh i can do that so when people say hardware is hard yeah like when i first got into china hardware was hard i had to rely on all these people processes i didn't understand and kind of like go with it like yeah that sounds fine to me making decisions about so this isn't the first hardware that you've that you've developed okay Not at all.

32:30Not even close. As a matter of fact, one of the easier ones. Where did the idea come from? From speaking to an individual about... So for those who don't... Sorry, sorry. For those who don't know, Crush the Memory is... It's an AI recording device. And you just literally press a button, speak into it, press it again. And that audio file will go from your device through Wi-Fi into a backend server, secure, encrypted, transcribe, and give you a note in our Crush app on the phone. And that note is actionable. That can be searched with AI. It can be put into folders. It's a phenomenal piece of software.

33:11But the hardware itself is there to capture ideas and thoughts and conversations when they occur. It's not for most people. It is what I've learned is it is for effectively the C-suite and independents who are running businesses and depend on their thoughts and ideas in order to advance their lives and careers. It's not for an Amazon driver who's watching, looking to clock out and get a 12-pack and chill out. I've got an amazing vertical for you to sell into that I'm excited to talk to you about, but I'm going to let you, how did the, how did the idea come about in the first place? So I was talking to somebody who was writing and I said, what are you writing?

33:54And they said, well, I have to write down everything or else I forget. And then it just developed into a conversation about where you get ideas. And this person, this individual is chock full of ideas like me. And we were joking about how that, you know, you get so many in the shower and we were laughing about that. I'm like, you know what? I think I'm going to go on Amazon and go buy something to that's commercially available. That's has, you know, is a solution to this problem. and put it in my shower because I get tons of ideas in the shower. And like, it's always a place. And I'm always like, Hey Siri, you must first unlock your phone.

34:24You're like, you're like, what that thing? Like you can't, you can't do anything really. It's, it's a wildly inconvenient place. And then through some discovery, you learned that not only were there, was there no actual solution? There's no, there was no solution in the market to be able to just capture thought really quickly. People have attempted, but it didn't exist. And so I said, hmm, I said, I need this. I'm going to develop it and I'm going to make it commercial. I'm going to commercialize it because I'm not the only person who needs this. And there are dementia patients who purchase from us.

34:58We have mostly C-suiters. That's really our biggest audience and independent individuals, you know, who are either running companies or they are, they're, they're solopreneurs. They're people who are completely dependent on oneself in order to advance. So what was the timeline between having the idea, oh, this would be really cool, to product in hand of consumer? The hardware was done first. The hardware was like, yeah, we knew exactly what to do. We looked at different chipsets. We're like, okay, what about this? Let's get some SDKs. Let's put this together. Let's program it. All right, we have to figure out the programming.

35:32We used a chipset that required us to learn new programming, so that slowed us down a bit. But the hardware was there, and then we're like, all right, I did the UI. I'm like, let me design this app. I'm a person who's very focused on organization, So I'm really good at organizing, like exceptionally good at organizing. So I'm like, this is where I can shine. I'm like, I can create an app that is so simple on purpose, very complex when you look behind, but it's very simple, it's very familiar, has great organization tools that anybody can use. I'm like, that's the challenge. So let me dive into that.

36:04So I did that. I created the UI. We started coding and the understanding of how this can be used continued to evolve and change and conversations with people and we pivoted and we got to a point where we we had to rewrite from scratch and completely just scrap it so the timeline was october 21 i got the idea and started doing research and discovery by the end of december i had a ui we had a conceptual piece of hardware designed on paper and we didn't launch we didn't ship until just say october of 24. Think about that. Oh my gosh. Three years. The challenges were awesome. Let me just say, because here we are, we're really good at hardware.

36:57We can do lots of hardware stuff, but now there's this entire new backend that we had to go and learn. And we, you know, I know how to code, but I don't code anymore. And I started doing some, was it the software layer or was it The software layer was a major challenge for us, major. And for other people, it's not. You know, some people are like, oh, the software, you can do this, that, and the other. The problem with the analysis is that we know software too, like we understand, except that what is the, into what will this evolve? What we're going to spend money on now, will we get a return out of it later?

37:33Will we need to pivot? it. We had a developer who, who didn't understand ultimately that this was, they thought this was just like a DIY kind of project and completely misled us. And what the best way to go about it was had to scrap that rewrite. And then we got smarter and smarter and smarter along the way to the point. Now we're like, so smart with this stuff. After three years, I had a brilliant engineer, by the way, his name is Josh. And he and I, you know, lead this team. And we learned over the course of years and trial and error what the right model is for this. And we now understand why other people failed at this.

38:11We learned along the way that somebody else had tried almost exactly the same. I mean, it was crazy. We were shocked when we saw it. It was a patent search and it was expired, but we never saw it ever. And it was like, it was uncanny. They completely failed. We totally understand why they even documented like we have to start over and we need money to start over. I'm like, oh, I get that. We did that three times. I'm like, I understand why these companies fail. I understand why some of these other big people who are doing this are not even in the market yet. You had to start over three times. In 2021, I mean, AI was known at the time, but it was not, I want to say ChatTPT came out in 2023, right?

38:49So it's like, this was early for AI and it's now like you're now positioning it as an AI device. Was that the thought at the time or has it evolved because AI came out? Totally evolved. Oh my God. Nick, we're just now sunsetting the existing architecture that we have. We're about to launch next month. A whole new architecture. We know where we're going now. It's so clear. You know, we rewrote again. We saved a lot of the code base, but we've moved databases. We were like, now we know what the future looks like. Before it was like, to where you were and they're like oh we can integrate the the you know ai into it now and like oh it's expensive the price we now we've got this unlocked now i'm like oh i'm extremely clear on where we're going i'm extremely clear on what we're doing i know exactly how to do it now it's the real opportunity right the ai is taking us there when you started how much did you think it was going to cost you to go to market and how much has it actually cost you to get to this point like what are you invested into the company in the beginning like 250 grand and we'll get us into the market.

39:56We'll start making money. No problem. I know it's over a million dollars now. I don't know how far over. I stopped counting. But if I run a report, NetSuite is probably going to be like a million 250 or a million three. And so we've gotten some revenue. Of course, we did our Kickstarter campaign. We have sales coming in. Do you think if you would have raised VC money, you would have been able to get to this point? Yes, I would have. Absolutely. Okay. From the perspective of when you're in control of your own destiny, you can fail a couple of times and you can continue to fund it. But when you've got investors backing you, when you failed that first or second time, even they're like, are you the guy?

40:30Are you able to figure this out? Oh, I don't know about this. Right. And so they stop writing the checks. That's more why I asked the question. I think if you, if you put it into that framing, I would say 70 % of the people would have bought the balance of the story. By the way, take this all the way back to the very beginning of our conversation when you and I were talking, maybe even before, you know, we started rolling is that this is why I like to fund my own jobs because I can get them off the ground. I have to make decisions. I have to make the right decisions and I have to eat it. It doesn't work.

41:02It's mine. I own it. You know, I can't complain to anybody else. So it forces you to be very clear on exactly what you're doing. You must figure it out. You have to make the right decision. If you don't, you pay for it. You got to go make the next right decision. There's a process. Some VCs I know understand that process. I could always show something for my work. There was nothing, it wasn't like, it doesn't work. It does work. It's just that to really make it scalable. And I say scalable in the true term of it, meaning bring a million users on from zero and not having it break. You need to do something better.

41:38I have this AI product right now. So my background is healthcare. In fact, it's one of the things I wanted to talk about with question memory with you and exited a few companies and decided to fund this AI healthcare startup where we help, the long and short of it is we help skilled nursing facilities identify diagnoses upfront because they get faxed hundreds of pages of documents and the nurses, they literally cannot read through all those documents. And so AI is really good at that. They can read it, synthesize it, make recommendations. It's great. But over a year and a half span, two years span, I put$100 ,000 into it.

42:12And like I had to write the check. And it was getting to the point where I'm like, is this worth it? Are you the guy? Like, can you figure this out? Well, we had an operator who was working on it. And he has now turned the corner and it's going well. And it's being, stuff's really good. But, you know, I know that from personal experience where you're looking at something that you're funding and thinking, should I keep going with this? It's just a hard place to be. I know how difficult it is to make money as a VC. it's hard to know that it's difficult to make money and have to keep footing a bill for changes, you know, especially when it changes completely, you know, the original, the company that I started Glamcore was, was supposed to be a makeup company.

42:52It's not, it turned quickly into a lighting company. Like, you know, who would have never let me pivot. Right. Exactly. You know, so however, crush i've broken off crush and crush is going to go out for a raise after i launched the next iteration where we where we're ready to like feature add and we start adding the new features this was going to be my question i've always viewed kickstarter as somebody who puts the product on there that's like hey i don't have the money to produce this let's kickstart this project right and then people fund it and they go and do it did you need the money to go on like Why did you go on Kickstarter?

43:29So I'm a product developer and a successful one. And I had never launched a Kickstarter campaign ever. And I was always curious about it. And I was like, hmm, and I know it's a great marketing platform, if anything. I'm like, I want to learn it. And so I decided along the way that I saw some other, like Plod was on there and there are some other recording devices. I'm like, you know, look, there's an audience here. clearly. Let me at least learn Kickstarter. And I have no downside to putting it onto Kickstarter. And all I need to do is learn it. So I hired an agency to help me understand how to do this and how to launch on Kickstarter properly.

44:13It was like 9 ,800 bucks or something. Best 9 ,800 bucks I spent. I completely understand how to launch on Kickstarter. Everything. We've launched three campaigns now on Kickstarter of Crush being one of them with all that. Do you like Kickstarter because of the ability to validate your product? I think I like Kickstarter because I'm not at risk of not being able to deliver. Interesting. Yeah. For me, it was like, and I put in my copy, I guaranteed to deliver because I had the product. I didn't need to go make a mold. I mean, I've got tooling I already have. I'm done, right? I'm just like, just make it.

44:51so yeah it's almost like another marketing channel that's what it is it to me it's a marketing channel and it helped with social proof and it helps kickstart the brand you know effectively and so you know using that is helpful in getting people to take a look right and that's what i definitely take a look so how many units have you sold of crushed memory like what does that look like roughly about 2 000 more than 2 000 it's really okay it's not units that matters It's really customers because, you know, one customer could buy 10, right? You know, I have three, you know, so units really isn't the important metric.

45:30Why do you have three? I have one in my shower, one with me, and then I have another one floating around. As a backup. You know, it just floats around and you'd be surprised. Like I used it this morning. Why it's being charged? I used it this morning because I got up at 3.30 in the morning and I went to the bathroom. I didn't have my crush. it was on the bedside and i was like oh yeah right like this one would happen to be in the bathroom not in the shower like you know so like there's one that floats around does your wife does your wife ever find it around the house and just say like remember to stop by the post office and pick up the kids the kids the kids with so many three kids they they're the kid and i saved them i saved the audio and i saved her i put them in the file oh it's adorable it's adorable yeah that's so fun We got our kids Apple watches for Christmas, the two older boys, and they've started sending me text messages and voice notes.

46:22Oh, it's so funny just to hear what they're saying and the conversations they're having. Okay, so 2 ,000-ish units. How much do they cost per unit? $149, effectively. Okay. Yeah, so that's what it really is. What is that? $300 ,000,$400-ish thousand dollars of top-line revenue since launch? Yeah. Wow. And when did you launch? This hasn't been that long. I want to say it's only been maybe six months. We put it on Kickstarter in July and it closed in August. We have been selling it since. We're not doing any marketing. I have to also make sure you understand the strategy here. We're doing some paid ads, little stuff.

46:58We're poking around, seeing what kind of resonates with people and effectively driving resonates with people. I'm we're going to start turning on marketing after we launch the new app because there are features in there that make marketing a lot easier and so we also want to get to the point we're making sales every day we don't have a problem making sales but they're or they're fully organic sales they are like people find will listen to a podcast or they'll see it with somebody and go order it or finally you know i i send out dms on x to our uh followers of crush the memory and engage with them and then they'll be like oh listen thank you and they'll you know they'll buy i'm really focused right now on understanding customer use cases making sure we're fully debugged we're mostly debugged like we were mostly debugged in december there's some edge cases that we're continuing to work on.

47:57But now that we're a hundred percent stable, we have use cases, we've spoken to enough customers. We're going to go get testimonials now, build some new content, and then we're going to start marketing it, you know, pretty significantly. And that's where you'd raise money, right? Like that's where it's like, yeah, we want money to throw on the ads, the paid ad side and expand our product offering. Cause now you know what you're doing. Now we know what we're doing and I can, I can prove it, meaning I'm not going out saying, hey, listen, let's just speak in terms of real dollars for a snooking. Effectively, we're turning this into a social network.

48:30And I know it's going to be hard to connect, like, how do you get from this to a social network? And the way you can kind of think of it is that our customer base, now that we know who they are, because there was a question about who they actually were. We did a 10 ,000 person user study that led us to believe it was construction people last year. At the end of the day, it's C-suite. That's effectively who they are. And for the most part, independents who are responsible for their own growth. Now that we know who they are, we don't know what they're collecting, but we know that they're using it to create information and to make decisions.

49:05That's a universe of knowledge that's not available to people. You're not going to find it on X. You're not going to find it on Google or anywhere else with which it is to make a note is so high. There's no friction that they tend, like you look at our chart of how many people are making notes. It keeps going up and up and up because people are getting used to using it now. Now they're, they're crushing everything. And so when they choose to make some of that, they're crushing everything. Is that the verb? Is that the verb now? Yes. That's right. Hey, did you crush that idea earlier? Oh yeah, I crushed it.

49:39Yeah, that's part of a - I love it. Yeah, yeah. That's right. That's correct. It's an adjective. So when people are crushing their ideas and they make them eventually public, they can say like, everything in this folder, I'm going to make public. This is going to be my public crush profile. Then it's become searchable through the AI in Crush. That starts connecting people. We have a chat feature, so now you can talk to other people. And now it's like a pre-X social platform of a body of knowledge that's available nowhere else that is very compelling and to make that fly the money needs to be spent on getting high levels of adoption at the sea level man eric fascinating there's like a million more things i want to talk about okay a question for you why is this not in healthcare it's it's starting to be in healthcare we have i think it's the yeah i think it's the perfect use.

50:36So home health and hospice is my background and experience. Eight years ago, we had clinicians who would dictate into their phone, their notes, send them over to the Philippines. We'd have some scribes enter them into the EMR and they were done. This is effectively eliminating the need for a scribe. You could, you could through AI sort of have these automations set up, but no clinician wants to sit down and just type out their note. They want to dictate it either bedside right after the visit or encounter whatever. I would think this would be perfect for the healthcare setting. It sounds like you do have some adoption there.

51:09Yeah, we do. So in terms of the cohorts, healthcare for certain doctors, we already have a, there's a Polish, since this works in every language, mostly we have a user base in Poland and they want to run it through their hospital because they realized the value of it. Wealth managers, lawyers. Yeah. Lawyers. That makes sense. And then a small one, this is going to be really interesting the clergy priests because they're content creators they have to remember their oh that's true yeah information for sermons so this is how some of them are capturing that yeah really interesting yeah very interesting i thought i thought it was a fluke i'm like like you know occasionally you go and spot check and earlier on i would look at lots of different people like who are they because you need data you're like who are these people who's buying you're like okay where where do you pivot like like what's the conversation what are people thinking like how do i discuss this and i kept finding priests i'm like priests i'm like okay we're next priest on priest and then all of a sudden i'm like i connected i'm like oh i get it i completely get it they're con they're they're content creators yeah that makes total sense yeah that makes total sense how big do you think or what's your goal with crush?

52:21Where do you want it to be? This is a very massive expectation of mine. This is like billion dollar expectation because this is not just a recording device. This is a tool and it's going to matter to only some people, but the people to whom it matters are the decision makers. And what's already happening and why, what we see is that decision makers are getting this. There's some of them around X talking about it. Then they're requiring their staff to use the software because they can dictate into this and it can route directly into a folder and they can get that info their staff can get the information without them having to go type or do anything extra yeah so i can just i can do that right now i can and i can have a note sent to my dev team just on this call it's almost like sending a text like hey i have an executive assistant kelly hey kelly make sure to follow up with xyz that is exactly how it gets used so all of a sudden the points are so low you're not slacking somebody you just you can just say he's like you know folder assistant you know give me a cup of coffee and done and then your coffee shows up like you know and i know that's a little bit low res but you can think about it and and so now it's starting to be built for be used for teams so now all of our so why we're relaunching everything next month is that we have now the ability for teams to use it you can chat you can work on tasks together like all of a sudden we're we're we're going to replace slack at our company with crush this year and we're replacing a project management software that we have called Wrike.

53:52By August, we'll have that completely replaced. Interesting. And then you can create external facing website profile. We're going to link this into different other software like Notion and others. And then eventually use, wherever people are using this for Notion, we will eventually adopt and create Notion lookalike features. And then we'll cut off at some point later, you know some sort of access to it unless you pay for it this is a very interesting backdoor into the decision-making community do you think crush becomes your only thing pretty quickly here or will you continue to do like different projects and ideas it's my 95 well it just sounds like there's so much within crush that you could do that's why it's so exciting you can see how amplified i get when i talk yeah yeah i'm i'm that's how much i clearly see what's going on All I have to do is play out what's going on right now and stay ahead.

54:48That's why everyone's like, Oh, there's a recording device. I don't care about recording devices. Hardware quality will all reach parity in the next 10 months. Like we're building a next version. It's not this. This is just to get from here out. It's not this. It's the software and no one's focused on the software. Everyone's focused on hardware, hardware. like everyone i i mean i literally am like driving around the crowd i'm like i'll see you guys at the front of the line everyone everyone's like oh we can use chat gpt and use whisper and transcribe it and you can get your notes and then you can have a mind map that no one uses like no one cares people really need collaboration tools that's what they want they need the ability yeah you and me to connect our brains through this software and be like wait a second you learned about this guy how did you learn about this oh it's i use i'm on this crush well how do i get to learn about that guy well, you have to go crushed.

55:39That's the only place he has it. Effectively makes team communication easier. That's the goal of this is to make communication easier as opposed to, you know, your mental models or, or, you know, having your proprietary way that you think about things necessarily. I think that totally makes sense and resonates with me. Do you remember, I think this was like two years ago. Remember when clubhouse came out? Very much. Okay. And it was like, oh, this, the audio version, and it's going to be really, and it, you know, there was some pop to it, et cetera. But I started hearing around that time that audio was going to be sort of replacing this text-based communication that we typically, that we have right now.

56:14And this seems like that iteration, right? It's like audio is now, because we have the technology to be able to transcribe it and send it and dictate it, and then create the software on the back end that allows for the organization. Now you can use the audio in order to more effectively communicate. It doesn't have to be from an email. It doesn't have to be from your phone necessarily. It can be through these devices. That's correct. Yeah, you're absolutely correct. Clubhouse was a very interesting launch. And something that I remember, and I remember all the time now, is Google Glass. There's a comparison there.

56:51And Google Glass in a presentation for VC money, let's just say, would be wildly interesting. Right? Oh, my God, this is going to take over. Like Segway was going to take over. Oh, gosh. Right? Yeah, yeah, yeah. And, you know, what you end up realizing is that people don't want to be recorded when you're talking to them. People value their own personal, independent, where they are privacy. You know, in public, you have a different kind of situation. But in a private setting, like if you and I go out to dinner, we have some steaks and we're smoking a cigar on the back deck and we're having a, you know, a shoot the crap conversation.

57:26You don't want me recording. Like we're free thinking and we don't want to be documenting what we're thinking. and it's why google glass you know failed it's why so many people are thinking that you know oh this wearables in the future no i actually don't think i think your watch is the max wearable you're ever going to get i don't think people want to compromise who they are or their ability to think as a function of technology recording their every move so we haven't gone into this like 24 hour recording or record everybody and everything it's like think about what happens behind closed doors and no one wants anything like that recorded ever.

58:04Look, you're the product guy. And you've thought about this way more than I have. I could see this going in the direction of what Meta has done with Ray-Ban. Have you seen those glasses that they have? Where it's like, or, or AirPods, right? Where it's like, Hey, you and I are talking or I'm by myself and I have glasses and I just tap here. And it's like, Hey, remind Kelly that I need to talk to so-and-so tomorrow at three o 'clock. So it's like a click on click off type of thing. I could see that being a wearable. I can't see the AirPods being a wearable all the time. It's just because it's such a signal that I'm not available.

58:38I'm wearing glasses. It doesn't signal to the other person that I'm unapproachable or I'm unavailable AirPods. It's like, Oh, he's listening to something. I don't want to disturb him or, Oh, you know, it's just a, it's just a different notification than, than having glasses on. So wise observation. Yeah. Very good. So anyways, Eric has been fantastic. Is there anything I didn't ask that you wish I would have asked how old am I how old are you 54 54 why did you want me to ask that because everybody thinks I'm like 40 you know I I don't say that jokingly it's like true it's like because you see all of these these younger people who claim to have all this wisdom who are like 29 years old and you're like wait a second you're 29 years old like how much wisdom could you possibly have it's Like I, I know what I know because of my age and I'm not, people look at me like friends of mine.

59:27They're like, dude, how do you, do you age? You look like, you know, so you and Brian Johnson, apparently. Vampire Johnson. Yeah, I know. Yeah. But it's like, you know, I'm not, I don't have gray hair or anything. So it's misleading sometimes. And so it's important for people to know the context that I'm not, I'm not, I didn't just start out. I've been doing this, you know, for all my life.