Ashley James on Breaking the Rules of Modern Motherhood | No Parental Guidance

0:00Ashley James:Coming up, please welcome the incredible Ashley James. Woo! Welcome! I remember even like being heavily pregnant, being like, when am I supposed to start liking kids? I was like bloated to the point where I looked like I constantly needed to. That's the baby, darling. Why are mum boards seen as like disgusting? But then meanwhile, there's articles like praising Leonardo DiCaprio for his dad board. The guy doesn't even have kids. That was like my first sense of like, I'm an angry feminist. and everything feels unfair that there's all these double standards that are put on us and not put on men.

0:34Ashley James:Amen, sister.

0:43Hi, Louise. Hi. Hiya. So excited. You're looking gorgeous. I'm in my snake era. Do you know what happened, right? About two and a half years ago when I was pregnant with Annabelle, there was a lady on Instagram and she looked amazing in this outfit. But obviously this was like the Timu version of what this lady had on. And this is the first time I've worn it today because it's not my usual style, Louise. Well, you look gorgeous. So you bought that two years ago when you were pregnant? Two and a half years ago. Wow. Yeah. Talking of pregnancy, our producer's pregnant. She is. She is. Congratulations.

1:16She's talking about her pregnancy symptoms. And you kind of forget, but it's a lot. Did you have any crazy symptoms? I was like bloated to the point where I looked like I constantly needed to s***. That's the baby, darling. Yeah. It was like, you know, when you're probably like three, four months and you kind of some people you haven't told or you try and hide it. I feel like the more pregnancies I've had, the more I've tried to hide it and just think, I wonder if I could get to four months without anyone knowing. Should I not tell? So I didn't announce it to like 20 weeks. Really? Yeah. I couldn't wait to announce it.

1:49I just constantly looked like I needed to fart all the time. just like gassy. Yeah. And people are like, oh, look at the baby. And you're like, it's not, it's just wind. I had the other way around. Mine was the baby, but my mum was like, oh, you've got a lot of wind. I'm like, it's the baby. There's something growing inside there. Oh, you can't be showing that much by now. I'm like, well, I am. So there you go. And you do like the more pregnancies you have, it's like, oh my God, are you like seven months? It's like, no, I'm four actually. I hate that. Oh, you've got twins in there. Oh, there might be triplets.

2:21No, I'm just a greedy bitch, Michelle. Just leave me alone. Leave me be. I'm hungry and gassy. I want to know if you were told this because I was and it's fake information. Okay. I was told that if you breastfeed, that's a natural contraceptive. I was told that. Yeah. And it's not true. Okay. It is not a natural contraceptive at all. That's why you see women that are pregnant again when their baby's six months old. Maybe they wanted it that way. But a lot of them have been like, I was breastfeeding. I was told it was a natural contraceptive. Turns out it's not. Well, it's the whole thing of having sex after you've given birth.

2:57You know, like I kept telling my husband that the midwife was like, you're not ready. You're not ready. And Andy's like, it's been a year. The poor lad is about to explode, literally. But I put that off for ages. But some of my friends like get back on it straight away. Straight away. Like literally in the hospital straight away. I find that very, very strange. Is it in, yeah? I was lactating.

3:24literally that it's strange like throughout my 20s 30s or before i got my mother like my breasts were a weapon yeah to get things get things basically it was it got out parking tickets got men whatever like they were the girls yeah they went from the girls to the canteen very quickly yeah and just It's amazing how they can go from like a sexual object to the complete opposite of like, this keeps my child alive. Yeah. Do not come near them. And it's... And now they're somewhere like... My mind f***ed off. Like Mother Nature took everything. I don't know. My hairline, my t***s have gone. Hairline?

4:10Yeah. Like, you know the... Oh, yeah, the fluff. Yeah. Like, honestly, I receded like Dracula. Louise, I'm not even joking. it was like my hairline went back to here I had like a vampire's peak really even my hairdresser was like but it's growing back it's like it's like fluff if I do that Louise and it's just fluffier now like look at that that's so my hairline and then my hair went frizzy at the back not the front just the back wow it was like but your hair changes like I severely receded you'd never know and you don't look like you're receding at all that's because i've if you see me do this oh my god it's not it's yeah it's it's a thing wow um but my fail um is to do with my eldest son at secondary school his school is brilliant yeah um my son got a detention because his pen ran out what are you talking about like a the old traditional like pens where you have to suck the ink in no no no it was a white it's a whiteboard marker fantastic so it was one of those pens and it ran out and he got detention and I just thought no yeah you know I'm sorry not today he's a good kid he's a good kid his parent give him another one how long was he in your detention for for that well I emailed the school yeah and I sent them quite the email and then I realized as I was reading their reply and I scrolled down to see what I wrote again because I was like yeah that was a good email yeah put them in their place and then I realized that um the beginning of my email had the beginning bit of chat gbt of course I can write this in a more firm motherhood way so I had put my how embarrassing what did it actually say at the top then yeah oh it said like uh you know how you put to chat gbt yeah i want to write this make it sound like i really mean what i'm saying and i have a point to prove so i basically copy and pasted the entire thing and it said of course we can write this in a more argumentative mother yeah wow that is yeah yeah but my but my my son that's did not get issued a detention it's like when you it's like when you send a WhatsApp, I was caught out with that recently into the wrong thread.

6:31And it's like there is such a fine line, you know, with a mum, like the school WhatsApp chats. And if anybody has got any brilliant examples, please, please send them in of WhatsApp messages that you should not have sent into the group. Like, I don't know if you know, if you screenshot anything on Snapchat, it comes up saying this has been screenshotted. So you know. Oh, really? Yeah. You think how many chats get screenshotted on whatsapp wouldn't it be fascinating i mean it would be dangerous dangerous it would be dangerous but we've all got stories we've we've all got stories of things that we've put in the wrong chat or oh and it's a school and then you have to then cover like oh i'm just kidding yeah or like quickly change the narrative of why you've like sent that message in like oh my god i wasn't taking the piss out of you yeah i'm just kidding what i was meaning yeah and then he sent loads of messages after to try and push that message.

7:25Those laughing emojis. That's so funny.

7:31Today's guest is someone who is not afraid to be outspoken and says exactly how it is. She's a TV presenter, an author, a DJ, mum of two and a fierce advocate for women's rights and body positivity. We love her. Please welcome the incredible Ashley James. Welcome.

7:48Ashley James:Don't you wish that you could have an intro like that every time you walked into a room. We can make that happen for you, babes. Just when you wake up every morning, if somebody said that on a tannoy, you are f***ing brilliant. You'll be like, today is a day to excel. Maybe we should do that. It should be a thing. Do you know what I still find weird? When people are like, mum of two, and I'm like, me? I know. And you are, babes. It's so weird, isn't it? Because you're like, that sounds really grown up. Do you ever look at your kids and you're like, oh my God, I'm responsible for two of you. You're looking at me for answers and I can't even look after myself.

8:15How are you, Ashley? How is life?

8:17Ashley James:of house motherhood everything i feel like juggling at the moment but it's good i feel like i'm in a real sweet spot with a almost three and a five-year-old so you're kind of out the nappy stages well we were out of the nappy stages alf on his fifth birthday i'm very much like with alf let him do it all in his own time you know nice so to have um he's been out of nappies in the day for ages but just not a night time and also things are so hard sometimes i'm like as long as he's not on nappies at 17 like who really cares he won't be so on his fifth birthday he decided okay i'm five i don't wear nappies in one night great it was going really well i went away on a work trip and um he wet the bed every night so i don't quite know if it was because it's probably because you told me he didn't put him on the loo before bed or because i was away exactly but i just got home and i said to him do you want to put them back on for a bit and you can see how you feel and he was like yeah i like that approach it's very chilled especially for your first it's really good yeah because i was so tight as a mom like we need to do this milestone by then and then the health visit comes around to like six months old why are you still breastfeeding six months in a day they should be on solids and you're like oh my god it's so overwhelming but it's really nice about the decline of our nhs is that i didn't have a health visitor so there was no one to put pressure on me with that okay one of the great things about being a lockdown mom yeah that's a good point actually yeah because you were you were in lockdown yeah am I right in saying you met you it was quite early on in your relationship with Tommy that you realized you were pregnant or moved in together so we had been together about four months when Boris announced the first national lockdown and I actually sent him home because I was like oh my god we don't know how long this is going to go on for and he was like well that's kind of why I thought I'd stay and it's like I wasn't even trying to be rude but it was such a like new relationship and I'd always said I didn't really want to live with a guy still don't and I just couldn't imagine him in my little pink and leopard print flat so I sent him back home and then I could just tell he was really gutted so just before midnight like all modern day Disney movies um I said okay you fine you can come back as long as I said fine as long as I don't care what the rules are if I need you to leave you will have to leave um then I got pregnant and then I said a great time how did you meet each other hinge hinge good old hinge yeah what was your criteria what were you looking for um I can't remember the specifics of my dating profile but I feel like it was very much a like I like there was no question in my mind that I was like I don't want to waste time with anyone who doesn't want something so I almost like made myself the how to lose a guy in 10 gay 10 day girl because you made yourself that person yeah because like deliberately yeah because even in my relationship with Tommy on I think like two weeks into the dating I was like by the way you're my boyfriend now and he was like no I'm not and I was like well that's really awkward because if you spoke to anyone else I wouldn't date you anymore so you're my boyfriend it's up to you if you don't want me to be a girlfriend and he but he says now in retrospect he kind of like liked it I think that's cool because he kind of knew where he was and he really what he was really looking for a relationship so even though he said it was like slightly terrifying he also kind of like respected it yeah and I think I was just so fed up of I feel like because of like the dating rules or whatever you want to call it like so many women go into relationships and young girls and more importantly And they're so worried about being like the crazy one or the psycho or that they almost like don't insert their boundaries.

12:07And I'd feel like I would be like, oh, well, I hope they're not sleeping with anyone else.

12:11Ashley James:But I don't want to be crazy and actually ask them. Yeah, don't want to be too deep. So I was just like, you know, I'm done with that. I'd actually rather be a psycho than a pushover. Absolutely. Oh, I love that. That should be a T-shirt. They should be. Like, are you so are you a ball buster with your partner? because you've given us that version of like you're actually quite relaxed as a mum in terms of milestones and and stuff but with what your opinion because they're children literally off camera this is all we talk about i'm like andy for god's sake he didn't do this he didn't do that i have to do everything people might say nag or ball buster i would say trying to make another adult accountable for their own life and yeah amen i love love oh my god amen the amount of times I have to repeat myself and and you don't want to have to do it all yourself either that's I think that's sometimes the whole point like that mental load I don't want it all on my shoulders like I'm not asking you to babysit your children it's like you know times have shifted so much like we have careers like we are out working and and contributing like 50 50 and sometimes if like partners I'm not referring just to my partner but if their parents have had a very traditional marriage and their grandparents did it is those habits are and perceptions are fed on to them um it's like it's 2026 now it's interesting though like even the term ball buster because i've just written my book bimbo yes i was just about to mention it let's get let's get this bad boy it is all about those labels that i feel like i love that look at that look at that beautiful book um it is all about the labels that women have put on them and something like a nag or a ball buster or like gold diggers all of these phrases I feel like it makes us kind of like want to behave in these boxes because we're so worried about being a nag but actually if you just saw it and did it it's just that apprehension like an uncertainty we think I don't want him to think that because we have such insecurities of like how we're perceived and last time I spoke to you said something that really resonated with me and because I've got a daughter like two boys and then a girl when you said it you were like you know as a as a girl you're either like frigid or if you're not frigid you're a slut it's almost like where's he in between middle ground and I've never thought about it until you said it where it's like oh my god my language because that's how I you're either frigid or you're a slut yeah like everyone knew the girl at school that was like easy and it's like well was she easy or was I frigid or was I not like and all of a sudden I think I'm gonna have to be so careful with obviously I wouldn't use frigid and slut with my daughter but actually the frigid yeah stop being so bloody frigid be a slug like your mother like that i just want to read something in the introduction which um you read this to us recently so it starts with bossy drama queen attention seeker diva cow prude frumpy frigid bridezilla trophy wife wag nag ball buster ball and chain mumsy milf homewrecker cougar battle axe mutton witch hag matron biddy bint crone i've been called a few of those over the over my years same I think we all have yeah and isn't that just when you see that in black and white you realize how many names that we have and what do we call men I mean I could name a few I mean my husband would be stuck here like okay I mean apart from like the obvious like rude what you want me to write a book as well here we go it's all like a gender put down really isn't it like and I always think of it because I noticed it I've got um Alfie who's five and Ada who's two and when Alfie was born it was like oh he's going to be a heartbreaker in my head I was like well I hope not really and then with Ada it's like we're gonna have to lock her up and I'm like sorry we're already talking about locking her up why I mean I also really don't like just as a side note how we almost like assume from the moment that children are born that they're going to be like heterosexual so when they're like oh is that her boyfriend but I'm like it is also weird that we joke about like it's that her boyfriend no she literally just hangs out with the opposite sex sometimes as a child like doesn't have to be sexual and that's okay and before you before you um had like literally became a mother and Tommy became a father did you know that Tommy was going to be everything you wanted him to be as a father or did you feel like you had to kind of give him a heads up on a few things no well um I didn't want children and he really wanted children so actually one of our really early conversations I said oh don't know about children never really wanted them so if that's a deal breaker for you I might not be the right person for you so interestingly he was always the one who was I'm going to say like more into children or more paternal and I remember even like being heavily pregnant being like when am I supposed to start liking kids

17:01Ashley James:um so I think in a way I went into motherhood almost naively because I was like he's going to be the one that's more on it with the kids I always called them the negative nancies and the just you waits and where people were like just you wait oh enjoy getting your nails done now just you wait until you get your sleep now because you're not going to sleep and I sort of thought well no that could never be me because Tommy's the one who wants kids so he he of course he's going to be like doing like equal but if not more than equal and I think it was um when he went back to work after two weeks which is obviously like the time that he had to go back to work regardless of what whether he wanted to or not I suddenly felt so resentful because I was like how dare you you wanted this and you it was lockdown so we were locked away but I was still working because obviously as we know if we took maternity leave there'd be no career to come back to just cobwebs oh where's my career yeah help me i remember my dad saying to me he actually is so lucky he's amazing isn't he and i was like who and he was like tommy like he's so good he's like changing nappies and by the way i caveat this saying i do understand that for my parents generation it was much more uncommon for men to parent but I said to dad yeah he's lucky as well I changed loads of nappies too like my mum will say oh is Jesse babysitting if I'm working out no he's parenting yeah I'm gonna give him a fiver when I get home yeah you don't it's not have a pizza out the fridge if you want to I'll give you a fiver like they're actually no long distance calls please yeah it's funny because my brother um he hasn't got a partner but he finds because he hasn't got kids like he finds my conversations fascinating because he's like so when like when do you get downtime if your kids are waking up in the night and you wake up three or four times when do you get a nap in the day I'm like oh you don't you don't get a nap in the day and then it's like but you look after the kids all the time take them to all these clubs these groups you go to work then you've got kids parties and you talk about these whatsapp groups and I feel like my brother watches my Instagram and he's like is this your life like this is petrifying he was like this is why I'll never have children when I was single because when I was single for six years that had a whole load of other like pressures and timelines of like oh don't be too picky what sorry why are we not meant to be picky about who we go to bed with that pressure on you but like people in general even well-meaning people being like don't leave it too late or I had that I remember my dad asking me if I was a lesbian I didn't have a boyfriend I was single for I think about four years I had the best time I loved being single it was brilliant um but yeah my dad was like are you gay you're a lesbian I was like no I just yeah you should see how many people I've been shagging this week dad you know so I get it I too felt that the and I wasn't invited to dinner parties because I wasn't with a partner and I was like guess what guys I can still have a conversation I can still eat food but I was never invited.

20:02Or you'd be invited and then they'd be like

20:04Ashley James:someone's creepy mate that had just become single and then you're like, oh, great. Like two for a two. But you guys would get on. Oh, look, this is Stevie's single. You'd be like, oh, f*** off, Steve. I don't want to get with you. But then with motherhood and I try to be like unflinchingly honest in the book, when I became a mum, it was almost, it like radicalised me even more because I think even in like my single era and I was a really proud feminist, I didn't realise how much internalized misogyny I had against mums because I think at the time I felt like well I'm choosing to be child free and I'm going against the grain of what's expected of us so it was almost like well they've chosen that traditional path and I'm not like that I'm not like mums I would never give up my career and funny enough I get it quite a lot where I talk to um people who are child free and they'll be like oh yeah no I'm really focusing on my career and I'm like oh yeah because once we become moms we don't give a about our career do you know but people say it all the time and they don't realize whereas dads would never no man would ever be like yeah i'm focusing on my career right now um so i tried to like talk about the fact that when i became a mom not only did i of course love my kids but i had all these like experiences of regret where i was like whoa like i kind of went into it thinking well everyone always said i'd regret not having them so how bad can it be and then I was suddenly like oh my god really bad what the hell have I done and like this is really permanent and it's not to say I don't love my kids of course I do otherwise they'd have been put in the bin a long time ago because like that's the only thing that really what gets you through all the hard moments is the fact that you love them yeah there was one time where I was doing these finger puppets to Alf remember it was lockdown so we didn't there wasn't anywhere to go there was no people to chat to and I remember like at the time I didn't know any lullabies know loads of them now but I had like a couple of things in my repertoire which was either like Disney or Mambo No.

21:55Ashley James:5 great tune and I remember doing like uh Siglena like doing the Lion King with a finger puppet thinking like oh my god like six months ago I was being booked for really cool music festivals as a DJ yeah and now I'm like doing this like finger puppet and I remember almost like looking at myself from outside being like I'm such a loser and you're sat at home like balls deep in nappies yeah thinking you know this is boring like are we going to watch another episode of bing like i remember them feeling guilty because you're like oh i shouldn't be putting bing on i should be doing like sensory yeah how would you say your parenting style maybe slightly differs or is the same as as how your upbringing was um oh well i'm actually affectionate to my children because you went to boarding school didn't you from from quite a young I went from the age of nine and no one in my family had gone to boarding school until my brother went.

22:49Ashley James:My mum is actually staying at the moment and, you know, she always says herself, like, she's just not emotional. And she finds all my, like, my southern friends, like, you know, they're trying to hug her and kiss her and she, like, tenses up. There is such a difference between northerners and southerners. Is there really? Oh, my God. Yeah. Hugging. When I first went to uni and all my southern friends would be like, how are you doing? And I'd be like that. I'm such a hugger. I feel like there are very huggy northerners. have you met the Thomas brothers before I feel like Ryan Thomas like they're like a real huggers but yeah my they're like Manchester way and you're like because I'm from up from where your family are from like north so you're not made in Chelsea no this is what I was so confused about when we're talking it's all in the book guys but um yeah so when I do you know and actually even being on a show like made in Chelsea it really played with a lot of the same insecurities I grappled with growing up because I always was very aware that I didn't feel normal in either environment because I was always being taught at school what one version of normal was like and from a perspective of like this is what me as a child was like was forcing me to shrink and not feel confident anymore um because I'd you know at school I was always being told like people from where you're from might behave like that but where we're from but then I'd go home and then my mum and dad would like do you think that's normal why are you doing that I was taught school to call all men sir not the women all men sir and um women you just ignore them like so I remember going to the co-op in my parents like small town and being like hello sir and my dad's like you're being weird like stop being weird man oh I actually call them I want to talk to you about body image because um I love that you're a huge advocate for body positivity and I want to I remember you because we used to kind of like vaguely worked together years gone by when I was behind the desk and I remember one of the first times I met you and this has got to be going back it must be maybe in your maiden Chelsea days yeah um 2014 2013 yes exactly and I feel like my image of you then is very different to now like I think back then you were more into like the perfect body um paranoid if you know you you had a bit of cellulite or something.

25:04Whereas now you've just blossomed and bloomed into this most magnificent body positive advocate.

25:12Ashley James:Like obviously when I was on Maiden Charleston, it was, I felt like I was having to almost like pretend to fit into that version of normal. And even my mum was like, would you not be better on Geordie Shore, Ashley? And I was like, I think if you'd have watched Geordie Shore, you'd be so grateful that I'm in this one. But I very much felt, I always felt my whole life that I had to be someone else to be likable and to be light. So when I started modeling, and bear in mind I was broke as well. I was like living in my overdraft, cosplaying as like a posh person. And modeling almost was like, okay, well, maybe this can be the thing that can make me money.

25:45Ashley James:And so I was like, in my mind, like, you're not good enough because you're not getting booked. Therefore, if you were smaller, if you were this or that. So I was like, it's like almost like chasing this perfectionism because I had like so much pressure on myself that I felt like if I was perfect then people on the outside would like me but also then I'd get booked for jobs and I remember I think it was like 2015 a real turning point was that I got adult acne I think just from like the stress that I was putting myself under and I'd never had bad skin before and if anything people would be like oh your skin's amazing so I really felt it that suddenly I like you know I'd feel really insecure going out because I felt like everyone was looking at my skin I was so unhappy with my body I was spending ages on I don't know if it was called facetune back then but you know like making sure my teeth were white making sure my eyeballs were white making sure my skin was so soft that I look two-dimensional and then if I ever did get a modeling job which wasn't very often I'd get the images back and be like oh they've made me smaller and so then I'd be like oh well I need to get myself smaller and it got to a point where I was like oh my god I I don't recognize myself anymore but I'm not happy the more I'm focusing on all of this stuff the more unhappy it's making me feel and the more scared it's making me of like interacting with human beings because I was like oh my god they're not going to know that I don't look like the way I look on my Instagram and it was one day after the Victoria's Secret show I remember I went online and everyone was like well I hate myself well I'm not eating again well and it was just like oh my god we all hate ourselves so I did this thing which felt very outlandish at the time but like looking back I'm a bit like lol but you know it's like my little skin roll this is me guys but it did feel like brave at the time and I remember saying to the modeling agency like I don't want I don't want anyone to um photoshop my images anymore and I was warned that it could cost me work and I was like but I just can't take hating myself anymore and ironically that was like the thing I think that so it was a Victoria's Secret show after looking at that made you go actually I am who I am and looking at everyone around me it was like all these women like regardless of like who they were what size they were what color they were like I was like we are all being made to hate ourselves and it's like we deserve better and so I think you know when I became a mum I was always was already a decade into self-love if that's what you want to call it so I remember seeing on my fridge when I was younger my mum used to go to like a slimming group or two different slimming groups and on my fridge would say little pickers wear bigger knickers a moment on the lips a lifetime on the hips yeah one of the things that the slimming group told my mum to do and all the women then my mum used to have these amazing sweets and that she'd buy from this slimming group and essentially it was laxatives in a suite so I remember once I ate a whole packet of them I couldn't go to school the next day because I was just my a**hole oh my gosh and I was like what is in that and my mum was like oh there's like a laxative in it and what really annoys me is why are mum bods seen as like disgusting and like oh you're gonna lose the weight you're gonna lose weight don't let yourself go like there's all this like messaging and pressure but then meanwhile there's articles like praising leon leonardo dicaprio for his dad bod the guy doesn't even have kids yeah let's talk about parenting fails do you have any that you can share parenting fails I I mean I feel like we fail all the time yeah do you know what I mean daily what I will say is I refuse to feel mum guilt until there is a collective term for dad guilt and people talk all the time about dad guilt I refuse to feel mum guilt and I would say like parenting fail that's part of the experience isn't it the really bad one was this weekend And Ada asked to go down the slide with me.

29:37Ashley James:And so I went down once with her. And she's like, yeah. And then she asked to go down again, holding my hand. And she started to go. So I went. And then she tried to stop. But I was already halfway down. So she's got like a mark on her face. But you know the worst thing about when you do something, you obviously already feel bad. And then Tommy was like, why did you do that? I was like, go away. I already feel bad. So I feel like there's little parenting fails all the time. But I don't think the perfect parent exists. and I think that's part of like mum guilt yeah and what's your house like you know in a morning getting ready say if you're working on this morning and the kids like are they kicking off trying to get them to nursery school like is it just chaos or is it quite calm I think because I'm quite calm it depends if Tommy's there Tommy's much more like I always call him like the Mr.

30:24Ashley James:Von Trapp you know the whistle yeah yeah so because he likes to get to the gym before work so he has to get them out by a certain time if it's just me I'd say it's quite chilled as long as I know that I can get them out on time or that I've got it's only on this morning days actually that I can't take them to school and nursery so they actually hate it when I'm on tv and I'm like one day you might think it's really cool but not the moment um but yeah no like my biggest thing at the moment which is chaos is that Ada has such a strong idea about what she wants to wear today she's in her like gorgeous little monsoon sequin tutu dress which is definitely a party or a wedding dress and um her christmas rudolph jumper love it very specific and her sparkly shoes not appropriate for forest school but do you know what like so you think that you just get to the point where you're like yeah last night annabelle wanted to sleep in a tutu like a big a full-on dress tutu that i actually bought her for her first birthday so it's a bit tight on her she's two and a half and she wanted to wear that for bed so it was just like okay wear it for bed I'm not arguing with you if you want to wear a tutu wear what you want yeah what do you enjoy most about parenting um when they go to bed that feeling where you send them off to school and you have a coffee it is just having just having a piece in peace and a coffee it's like oh I've won it the day I feel like I always call Monday the parents weekend I feel like you just don't appreciate what you've got yeah i've got some friends and they're self-employed and as a couple they both take mondays off do they and they drop the kids off together at school and they go home get back into bed get a takeaway at lunchtime and watch netflix and i'm like do you know what that's great because they just connect yeah because they're like weekends are chaos so they work slightly longer days tuesday wednesday thursday friday and a bit of saturday and they take Mondays off together.

32:21I love that. That's a really good idea. That's a win right there. Ashley James, thank you so much. Thank you so much. Thank you. James, everyone. Good luck with the book. Thank you. If you've enjoyed this chat as much as we did, please give us a like and subscribe to the channel. It really helps other parents find us. Also, drop a comment below and let us know your favourite takeaway from today. We'll see you next week. Bye.