Jess Wright Discusses the Reality of Postnatal Depression & Maternal Wellbeing

0:00Coming up, please welcome Jess Wright. All right!

0:04Jess Wright:I went back to the gym after about seven weeks. Seven weeks? That's early. Yeah, it was quite early to be fair. But I think I've kind of accepted now that my body will never be what it was before. It didn't even dawn on me that I'd get postnatal depression. I didn't even think about it. But for some reason I had the biggest black cloud over me. It hit me like a ton of bricks. I just felt huge depression suddenly. We lost everything at one point. We had nothing. There's been certain things that have been said and whatever else, no one knows the truth.

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2:06That's O-L-L-Y dot com. Hi Louise! Good morning! How are you? I'm alright. You just managed to film me do a yawn that sounded like a donkey. or a whale giving birth. I thought, you know, I'm going to get a lovely video of the studio. And you're like... I'm so tired. I'm so tired. But you've literally just got back from your holiday, haven't you? I did. I'm very jet lagged. But, you know, boo-hoo. You know, jet lag from a lovely holiday. So it's fine. You were travelling with kids. How did that go? Do you know what? They were really good. They were really good. They are at an age where they're happy just to sit and watch the screen and watch movies and I did say to them, like, this is when you need to sleep so you're not jet lagged.

2:53Two out of three listened so that, you know, that's not bad. Yeah. There is a fail. There's always a fail. Of course there is. There's always a fail. Traveling with kids, there is always a fail. But this fail actually happened before we even went on holiday. Oh. So we were at home and trying to get everything ready for the holiday, finishing up emails, finishing up work, packing, kind of clearing out the fridge like all the things that you need to do stressful isn't it so many things to do and um there was uh my son who's 10 and loves football was just a jump this feels really bad I feel really bad about it um I do feel bad about it in hindsight it was wrong okay what did you do um and please don't come for me people listening watching because yeah you know this is the safe space um hopefully we all make mistakes yeah we all make yeah we live and learn as we live um so my 10 year old had a ball like one of these plastic footballs that you can play volleyball in in the pool you know we were going to take it with us on holiday and he was playing with the ball inside the house and I kept saying over and over like no balls in the house go outside because amount of times he's done it in the house and things have broken or you know and the sound of the constant bouncing on the ball it started to really grate on me and then his sister piped up and they had an argument so it was the arguing and the ball was bouncing and I'm trying to do all this stuff and I just got really angry because no one was listening um I got angry and I grabbed and I did say many times you know last warning go outside take the ball outside um so i grabbed the ball um and i stabbed it with what what a carving knife you stabbed the ball with a carving knife in front of your children is that really bad that's really bad are you okay hon no clearly not what did you like i was so angry and i just couldn't bear it anymore so i just grabbed the ball whilst it was like flying in the air grabbed it and stabbed it how many times did you stab it just once just once okay i just got visions of this psychotic episode like that overstimulated mother hanging on by a thread stimulated i was just really angry no i was listening and i was trying to do all these things but then as soon as i stabbed it and then kind of the whole ball just went like deflated i just felt really bad what did the kids do well they're just like staring at me as to say like are you all right mum um I mean you owe me four pounds so yeah that was my fail um wasn't proud of that one but actually from you saying that makes me feel a little bit better oh thank god just because uh I came home yesterday so I finished the last gig of my the first leg of my tour and the kids behavior I was like in my head I had this idea like oh I finished the the first leg of my tour I want to go home we'll go for a walk this afternoon go for an ice cream cuddle up and watch a film it's never going to happen I get home the house is an absolute tip and the kids have put the toys everywhere they were eating easter eggs rubbish messing about not listening and then I'm like is it me and this is where I go back to what you've just said sometimes I feel like they never listen to me totally agree as soon as you leave nursery the kids start kicking off and they turn into absolute twats.

6:33And you're like, why? Why are you saving this for me? It's because we are their safe space, which in a way is quite lovely. And I remember when I had a very traumatic labor with my second and I was holding it all together when I was with the midwives and you know even around Jessie as soon as my mum arrived to hospital I sobbed like a child really she was my safe space yeah so I get it you know I get it I had I experienced that so yeah kids do it too yeah and they just did delight oh but it's just adorable what's your fail so my fail has been I filmed a reel in the garden and it was like a competitive sports mum reel so um the concept was like this mum that's like yeah honestly it's just about participation just have fun but if you don't can win you're not having any dinner tonight you're not having any screen time what was that performance so I write a script out on my notes section on my phone yeah go into the garden and then I'll film it and I was like I had a whistle and I was like right kids um you know if you don't win this race we're going to practice for sports day I'm not having anyone beat you at school you give little oscar a wedgie if anyone hurts you i'm going to kick the out of their mom and i was saying all this stuff and then i heard like a little scurrit like a scutter next door and i was like oh my god and i realized a lady next door in the garden was there and she 100 would have heard everything i said right so i didn't want to say and because we're renting this house oh when we don't really know you they don't know me and they're a little bit older and when we first moved in they came around and brought this little hamper and they were like oh hello like nice to meet and I was like oh we're actually only going to be here for about a year and it was always like a oh and they immediately realized well what's the point and I was like getting to know you because you're leaving in a year yeah so I know that she's then they don't really speak but like she heard me say all this stuff and I was thinking should I go around and say my kids weren't there what happens is I make these really weird reels online and I was like no don't do that So then when I came back yesterday and my kids were like messing about and Logan started to do a wee in a bush and then he soon realised he needed a poo as well.

8:54So he flipped himself round and then I heard the same noise at the other side of the fence. And I was like, oh God, she must have your mental. This woman is going to think I have no control over my kids. I'm an absolute psycho. If Logan needs to poo in the garden, Andy, let him poo. She was an original Towie icon who basically shaped the era of Essex glamour. But these days she's traded the sugar hut for school runs and is navigating a whole new chapter as a mum. From reality TV to reality of parenting, please welcome Jess Wright. All right. Rowdy's in the house. How are you doing, Alan?

9:33Jess Wright:I'm good. How are you? I'm all right. You're looking gorgeous. We've had like an hour's chat before we started this. This happens all the time. We should just press record as soon as a guest sits down because we've been through everything already. Pat lunches, we've been talking about. Britney. Yeah, kids. Let's go straight. Let's talk about your mother to Presley. Yes. Who's four. He's nearly four, yeah. And how is motherhood? How has it gone? How do you feel like going from reality star, glamour, glamour, glamour, now a mum? Was it a bit of a transition for you? I mean, a bit of a transition is an understatement.

10:09Jess Wright:It's just a bit. Mental. No, do you know what? It's such a huge, huge journey, isn't it? Because you look back at like 10 years ago, I was 30. I didn't know what I was doing. I was like, I think I'd just left Howie and I was single and I was just navigating this dating world. I had my own place. You know, I was here, there and everywhere. I was doing campaigns. I think I wrote books at the time, whatever it might have been. and then cue 10 years later and I'm like mum to this little boy who's nearly four and the trials and tribulations that come with it it's just crazy right it's a totally different world I don't think anyone really ever prepares anyone for being a mum like no one really knows until you're in it yourself it's crazy and now having come out the beginning part the beginning part for me was the hardest um we're at a really nice stage now he's nearly four he's he's he's such a character he's so clever and you know he's really bright and we have fun together like going out with him on a day out now to like I don't know the farm whatever I actually love and enjoy it yeah yeah whereas you know there was phases where you're like they they can't communicate they they're having tantrums you don't know if you're coming or going they need a nap oh yeah because it's that time they won't eat this they won't eat that so we're at a really nice phase um however when I look back to the beginning we had quite a lot of issues with him as well health-wise I like see new parents now and I'm probably so annoying to them because they're like, I can see in their eyes they're drained.

11:31Jess Wright:It's the beginning. They're not sleeping. They're terrified of every move they make because this new little creature is like taken over the whole world and the love you have is inexplainable and I'm like, talk to me, what's the problem? Right, it could be reflux. It could be this. It could be that. Oh, no, no, no. Maybe you change this. You don't say to them to sleep when the baby sleeps or any of that, do you? Definitely not. Someone's hungry, look. I'm hungry, cry. No, but I do listen to myself and I'm like, Jess, stop, you sound like one of those annoying people right at the beginning of when you had Presley and they were saying to you, it could be this, could be that.

12:01I think what really annoys me, though, is when you have your baby and the baby smiles and it was always like, but my mum going, that's not a smile, that's wind. I'm like, no, it's a smile. Yeah. I'm taking it. And then actually, apparently, when one is in those early years, especially like to the toddlers when it's really hard, tantrums, you know, all of that, you know, it's very normal. To actually not enjoy being around your kids sometimes. But like, oh, for God's sake. I so hear that as well.

12:32Jess Wright:There's times when you're like preparing for a long journey or a flight when they're at a certain age and you're like the anxiety around it. And I've always been so brutally honest about parenting because there's people that sugarcoat it. And, you know, it's like, oh, no, it's the best thing that's ever happened. Of course, it's the best thing that's ever happened to you. But the problem that comes with that is how much you love them. And that's what hurts because it's like every move you make, it's dependent on whether you're being a good mom. If they're getting what they need, are they going to be OK?

13:00Jess Wright:So to be honest and say, it's so tough at times. I had postnatal depression for about a month. Oh, wow. Yeah. But after that, I was fine. It just lifted. Did it? And what was that with a postnatal depression? How did you know that you had it? Like, how did you feel for that month? I came home from the hospital and we were in the hospital for about five days in total because of this infection that they thought we had. had to finish the course of antibiotics um and when I which is also bizarre to me because now if going back I the fact that he was on antibiotics the day he was born just fills me with dread but anyway I um I came through the house and my mum and sister had set up all these balloons the sun was shining in but for some reason I had the biggest black cloud over me yeah and I don't know if it was like going out of my house with like who I was and then coming back as a new person or this whole my hormones were just all over the place and I just it hit me like a ton of bricks I just felt huge depression suddenly and it wasn't like I was obsessed with him the baby I was like I just didn't want to let him go it was just more this feeling of depression and I had it for about a month and it was hell absolute hell did you have take anything for it or did you literally just lift as you said um well I was on antidepressants anyway I have been for 15 years now um and I lowered the dose when I was pregnant right I went really low on my dose and then I started to wean my back myself back onto them even though you didn't need to wean yourself I thought I did so I could have just started on the higher dose again but I didn't but yeah I mean a month so it could have been that yeah I don't know I think I think if you're if you if you're prone to anxiety or depression I think post-data depression can sometimes come hand in hand slash maybe not.

14:46Jess Wright:You know, there's not any evidence as to either. And were you kind of mindful of that, knowing you'd been on antidepressants? No, it didn't even dawn on me that I'd get postnatal depression. I didn't even think about it. I don't even think throughout my whole pregnancy I thought I was going to get that. Yeah. So it came out of nowhere, really, for me.

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16:55Jess Wright:Yeah. I don't know what the difference would be between feeling this anxiety and depression. Maybe it's all joined together, but I remember just feeling, yeah, just really anxious and thinking I was doing everything wrong. I think that surely that's like, because I had that as well. And I've messaged my friends who have got kids, two of them, especially two of them. And I was like, there's bubbles in the bottle. What do I do? I don't know what to do. And like now, if I hadn't second, I'd just be like, yeah, exactly. I can't remember, whatever. Literally wouldn't fade me. In that moment, as a new mum.

17:30Jess Wright:In that moment, it was the end of the world. Yeah. If I got one thing wrong with that baby. Yeah, yeah. And he didn't poo either for like 10 days when we got home. It was a nightmare, the whole thing. But in terms of like the reflux, the dairy allergy and that, he had constipation. She knew from early on about the dairy allergy. Well, I didn't until about five weeks later when I went to a doctor and I was just like, help me. He's just like screaming every single day and he's not pooed for like however long. So I think new parenting, post-sale depression, and then he had reflux and the dairy allergy and constipation and tongue tie all at once.

18:01I feel anxiety. literally like constipation it's a lot an allergy for a baby yeah nobody would ever have said to you before you had your first baby they might have an allergy they might have didn't know any of this what's the tongue tie no you didn't tell me about tongue what does that even mean you see the whole oxygen levels you know and having to go into you know like all of it there's so much yeah sorry i literally sound like a walking depressant but i actually like not at

18:29Jess Wright:this is i just want to spread the word because it can happen and it's happening more frequently now i don't know if that's because of you know the change in the world and things like that but we yeah like i want to spread the word and be like you are not alone because so many people did reach out to me when i finally spoke out about it i just wish i'd spoken out about it from day one because i could have got more advice stigma around it to go oh actually i really struggled and i had this you know you say a black cloud i'm sure there's so many women listening and going yeah yeah I felt like when you were saying I was like yeah because it's a blessing to have a baby I was so lucky to have him obviously so lucky to have him and I'd never say that I'd take any of it back and actually do you know what I wouldn't even take back any of the stuff that he had wrong with him because I learned so much I now pass that information to anyone and everyone and please god if I had another one it would be the complete opposite wouldn't have any of those issues but you just don't know and do you think like would you love to have another baby is that something that you think about i would like to have another one um i'm just as you can probably understand a little bit terrified because of what happened first time around but i do you know i wouldn't again like i always say it is what it is it's taught me so much and you know you learn you you grow and whatever but i i would like to have one more especially a sibling for presley yeah he's he literally said to me yesterday it was so sad we were with our my nephews and they were going one way we were going out for some some food and um and i was like we're gonna have to say goodbye now because we're going for it he was like I just want a friend mummy what was it like growing up um in your family was it like big egos was it was it quite competitive because you're all very talented in terms of like yeah I mean Mark and Josh played football so that was their thing yeah and I danced and and did singing acting all that kind of thing so I'd do the shows every other month and the boys would have a football game every Saturday that was just it we were busy there was three of us and then Natalia came along when I was 15 so there's a huge gap um josh was 11 my mum just decided to have another baby oh i quite like that like 10 11 years babysitters on tap yeah exactly that's quite so we all just brought her up with my mom um and we i mean when it was a girl i was so relieved my dad called me from the hospital and he was like it's a lovely baby girl and i was like thank the lord because i have two brothers so i was like yeah of course i was playing cricket and football in the garden growing up and then your sister-in-law michelle keegan yeah oh is she lovely yeah she's yeah and you guys get on well and everything we all get on well we get on we get on great and we're actually really close to michelle's family so lovely it's just one big family which is lovely it's her family based in manchester yes but they come down a lot and stay with that's lovely michelle and how nice for her or you know their little girl to grow up seeing both sets of grandparents yes like being close we're very lucky with both of our parents get on and there's a lot of families that don't absolutely and it's like it makes it so much easier my other sister-in-law as well Holly who's married to Josh we're really really close to her family as well because my family grew up with her family so it's extremely we're all kind of you actually have the village it was actually all parts of the family together so when you're with Presley and you go to like a family gathering it must be that really nice feeling and it sounds ridiculous but when you know that he can go off and play but there's like loads of adults that care about him because they're all family.

21:45So you could just sit down and be like, oh, he's safe, he's running around. And you could just sit down for 10 minutes and think, I can decompress now. Yeah, it's nice when we get all the kids together

21:53Jess Wright:because they love each other. But the boys are so, we call them the ferals because there's just three boys so close in age. Josh and Presley are three months apart and then Dustin's 11 months younger than Josh. Oh, brilliant. He was really premature and she got pregnant really quickly. So they're so close. I think, are they Irish twins? Yeah. So yeah, they love each other to bits. but of course there's the odd like because they're so close. They're at that age as well where they're like, I want that toy. I want that toy. It's like, oh my God. And then you've got Palma Blesser who's just a little adorable angel and the first girl.

22:26Jess Wright:How old is she? She has just turned one in March. Right, wow. Into everything. That age where they start like learning to walk, climbing everything. Opening everything. Yeah. Yeah. She's a really good girl whereas the boys have been very, very, very energetic. So let's talk about your Towie days because you were on the show for about five years. Yeah, five years. And you're like the original. Yeah, so I started on it in 2000 and, oh, I don't know. 10. 2010. I heard that, yeah. Started in 2010, left it 2015. Yeah, wild. I was 25 when I started. So it's a real big transitional part of my life. I think 25 to 30 as a woman as well.

23:04Jess Wright:I think so, definitely. It's really quite pinnacle, isn't it? And obviously I had relationships on there and things like that. So it was quite a whirlwind. I can't even look at clips now. Can you not? No. I cannot clip a glimpse. Oh, my God. It just, oh, I don't even recognize myself. I'm like, who are you? Like, I was a young girl. I was a bit broken from a toxic relationship before, I think. I don't know. I just, you know, toxic relationships growing up. I was still a young girl. Like, now I'm a completely different person, obviously. And did you feel a bit forced to be a certain character on that or not?

23:36No, not really. Not really. I just think I didn't really know who I was. So I was just going with the flow. And isn't it a lovely thing about getting older is that we definitely grow into who we are. We know who we are. Like I definitely feel I am much more comfortable with myself now than I ever was in my 20s. Definitely. I wasn't on TV how you were in my 20s, but I'm pretty sure if I was, I don't know if I could look at those clips either.

24:00Jess Wright:No, I cannot. I just can't watch them. And also like you've got to remember as well, it was an edited show. So, you know, they edited it how they wanted to. And the scenes we were in, a lot of them, you know, in real life, we wouldn't have been in those scenes. but because we're on that show you are. So there's, you know, you're in things that you wouldn't necessarily be in and you're having chats you wouldn't necessarily have. So yeah, you just kind of, yeah, I can't watch them. You're like the Kardashians of Essex. Oh, I don't know about that. But you are the original, like I used to watch it when you were on it and it was like, because I'm from up north, and we used to be like, bloody hell, are all the women down south that glamorous?

24:35No, I don't. Because we're all like, we're in our wax jackets and Wellington boots up north and we were seeing everyone with the eyelashes there.

24:41Jess Wright:I'm in scruffs and Wellington boots and hardly a scrap of makeup all weekend now. Whereas back then, yeah, it was all the eyelashes. But is it like that in Essex still? Is it a thing? I don't know. The glamour? It's definitely calmed down for sure. No, yeah, it's definitely calmed down for sure. But then maybe that's because I'm looking at women my age now. Yeah, maybe. But then again, 25-year-olds, Gen Z, they're clean living. They're not in the clubs coming in at three in the morning. It's true, yeah. throwing out five times a week like I was at one point like yeah they're not those were the days there's no evidence well there isn't for me anyways no evidence of mine yeah oh just disposable cameras were like lingering around and then you'd have to wait a week to get them developed and like spend and then you'd be like oh my god it's like oh amazing that we didn't put the flash on no but it was just like bright orange faces and massive eyelashes it was just but then that's all everyone knew then no one knew about contouring no concealer was just used for spots now everyone it's under the ice like it's just mental or lipstick yeah with gloss on top yeah yeah if you'd had too much Lamborghini you'd be like oh shit I'll put my concealer on my lips and you'd be like give a shit off you go so uh how did you feel after giving birth or during pregnancy seeing your body change and just embracing your new body I kind of just went with it I wasn't too hard on myself um I think I went back to the gym after about seven weeks um slowly seven weeks that's early yeah it was quite early to be fair but I didn't do anything strenuous it was just more like just to be at the gym probably headspace isn't it yeah away yeah um and then I think I've kind of accepted now that my body will never be what it was before I had Presley my weight might be at some point but I don't think my body is I don't think I've got that tightness that you have before but I don't know I think everyone's different I see the other women and they're like some of them are better yeah how how i think it's genetics there as well isn't it like you can like i know my body i could you know if i wanted to i could work out solidly and i don't think i'd ever get that kind of like really like ripped and it's age as well like if i was a 25 year old mum i don't i'd probably my body would probably be slightly different i'm 40 yeah so it is what it is you know you have to roll with the punches and at our age it just is but that's a nice way to look at it because otherwise you could think, oh, I really want to look the way I did.

27:05And now it's like when you've had a child and you think, actually, like, it doesn't really matter. Like, I've grown that and I'm okay with it. Yeah, it's miraculous, isn't it? And then a couple more kids down the line, I just think, do you know what, fuck it. I'm at that stage now where it's like, I'm not chasing who I was. No.

27:18Jess Wright:I don't want to be who I was when I was 30. Like, I'm quite happy to be 40. Yeah. Oh my God, stop. My husband, he's like, every time I put on a pair of like mum jeans or like balloon or parachute, whatever, he's like what are they because he doesn't understand like he's not into fashion he doesn't know that these are now into fat in fashion whereas you know skinny jeans aren't really on trend anymore even though you know i wear whatever i want anyway but i just it makes me laugh because yeah 10 years ago it was all tight stuff yeah and yeah yeah but most of my jeans like mum jeans yeah baggy or balloon parachute whatever and he's just always like he's quite funny and he's always taking the piss he's like are they slim fits and i'm like get with the times i'm not You want to walk out in a Britney-esque tight pair of jeans and a crop top.

28:01Jess Wright:That's just not what's cool anymore. The good old days though when we did. She's back in rehab, isn't she? Is she? I'm actually really pleased that she is. No, she was under that conservatorship. Is she like that because of the conservatorship? Yeah. Or was she like that so they did the conservatorship? Yeah, is that why your dad was like, listen, I need to step in and protect you? I can't help but think that she's messed up because of all that conservatorship. Could you imagine what she went through? Imagine if she like headlined Coachella in a few years because she got herself back. I really, really hope there's a happy ending here.

28:34I never forget seeing the first Baby One More Time video at home. And I was just like, whoa. For me, it was the slave for you. Snake. Yeah. I mean, she was the one that taught me to wear really low cut jeans. And a chunky belt. Yeah. Those were the days. Those were the days. She always had the best stomach. yes the best stomach talking about thongs can we talk about the yes the whole thong scenario yeah it's just crazy yeah oh how long ago did it happen i think it was about a month ago now we always say to each other after we have a podcast we're like we call it the three p's which is the post podcast panic you're like oh god yeah something i shouldn't have said should i've said that or i always get that when i leave a podcast that i've done for someone else because i always think to myself oh my god did I say one because as well because when they take out the clips

29:28Jess Wright:yeah everything can be taken out of context well our first clip that went out on this podcast the first first clip that came out I said something about my son throwing up at a kids club and I knew that he faked it so I didn't go and pick him up and if you listened to the entire podcast you'd realize that actually the story wasn't as bad as it was but it really really upset me so I I can imagine that you've been through something similar. And yeah, it's hard. It's hard. Yeah. No one wants to be, you know, demonized or judged or whatever. But I think, yeah. But we always do, though. I damned if we do, damned if we don't.

30:05Yeah, I know. What do you think is one of the biggest misconceptions people think of you when they see you in TOWIE compared to now? I don't think anyone knows the real me, really. I don't think anyone knows the real me. I'm so much more than just that character yeah um would you do it again like if you could go back would you have done it again absolutely it's given me the best you know I've had such an amazing

30:28Jess Wright:fruitful time in this industry I have been like amongst the most wonderful company I have been to the most beautiful places because of that show and ultimately you know we we did have a huge huge We've got a huge following. So, yeah, no, I wouldn't change it for the world. It was the first of its kind. It was an absolute wow because no one had ever seen anything like it before. Yeah, it was. It was one of the first, wasn't it? Yeah, it was. Yeah. So, yeah, I think there was Jersey Shore in the US and then it was TOWIE. And then after that, everything else come along. So it was quite, you know, mad that it was out there.

31:05Would you do, like, another reality series? I don't know. It would depend, really. I see you on something like Strictly. Oh, yeah. just strictly would be amazing I love dancing yeah I know your brother was on it yeah I totally I totally see you on it oh one day get you on there I mean like your whole family is like mental in terms of how successful everybody is like but seriously though and like we're all of your family yeah like beautiful amazing oh bless you I've done about that so well but genuinely I think

31:38Jess Wright:one of the misconceptions for us all is that you know there's been certain things that have been said and whatever else no one knows the truth yeah and actually like we are just a family that have had a really mixed bag of um wealth and success in our past we lost everything at one point we had nothing we we earned it back we did this we did that we are just a normal believe it or not like when those doors are closed we're just a normal family like we really really are and we're not and you're very tight you're very tight aren't you like you will get on and you're yeah but we're also equally like so welcoming of others like we we really are we've got a lot of friends that we you know we have a lot of close friends ones we've had our whole lives we we love to we just like to be nice and I think sometimes when you're in the industry you can easily get torn down and people have misconceptions and they might have judgments and whatever else but ultimately like no one really knows us like we're just normal and how often do you see all your family you like sunday dinner get everybody around kind of thing all the kids we were all together yesterday um most sundays we do not every sunday there'll always be some that aren't there but we we're a very close-knit family we've never had any crosswords thank god really like at all not even with your sister oh no we might have the odd quarrel but not really god when i was growing up with my sister Oh, no, don't get me wrong.

33:01Jess Wright:Me and my siblings have had their house growing up. Absolutely. But in terms of like now, and we're all adults and stuff, we've never, you know, we don't fall out. Yeah. I fell out with my sister the other day. Did you? She took my bottle of wine. Love that. I'm not asking. I was just like, what are you doing? I was thinking my sister would never take mine. She's a Gen Z. I've got to convince her to have a glass. I'm like, just have a glass. You just presume like, oh, God, you know, and you say, if my kids do what I did when I was 15, then you think, they're probably not going to. No, they wouldn't.