How to turn uncertainty into pipeline (Guest appearance)

0:00Uncertainty is a weird thing in sales. You know, we've been in this, you know, 2020 happened and there was definitely some uncertainty there, right? For everyone, right? For three, six months, depending on what industry you're in, it may have impacted you differently, but there was a period of time where as a buyer, especially, it was very uncertain on what the right move is and what to do. And then as a sales leader, it was very uncertain on what is the proper way to run my team right now. Right. There was all kinds of work from home stuff that was going on. How do we talk to our buyer? Should we still ask for time?

0:38All of that stuff. And then certainly as a rep that left you in a position that was extremely hard because you might get conflicting thoughts and opinions from your buyers versus your leadership. And then what you personally feel like you should or shouldn't be doing, etc. Well, 2022 rolls around and if you're in software, we've sort of been since 2022 in this period of uncertainty. I don't know about you, I've been checking the news a lot, you know, just looking at the stock market in the last couple of years, just like, hey, when are we going to have like a bust? When's that going to happen?

1:16And that uncertainty can be really powerful in many ways for certain companies and certain products and services and you as a rep or leader, if you're listening to this as well, where you can really take that uncertainty and use it as an opportunity to really stand out and lead. right you can be that category leader as a company you can be that leader that steps up and gives your team direction right you can be that rep that stands up and is a true trusted advisor for your buyers so that's what today's episode is all about is turning uncertainty into pipeline before we get to that my name is jason bay i'm ceo at outbound squad our firm helps b2b software and professional services teams turn strangers into paying customers so that's that's the only thing that we do is focus on outbound so if you have you know teams of salespeople that you want to be more proactive about filling their pipeline you know creating better pipeline coverage if you want them to be more strategic break into some of those key named accounts you're definitely in the right place and if you're a rep looking for some of those tactics, you're in the right place as well.

2:26We've done some really awesome work for, you know, companies as large as Shopify, Zoom, Rippling and Gong, and then all the way down to your startups, building out your first sales development teams and, and everywhere in between. So today's episode is a guest episode, a podcast where I was interviewed on the Ask for Change podcast with Meredith Elliott Powell. We have not talked since I think 2020 we did. for any of you OG fans out there, we did something called flip the script. Actually, it wasn't flip the script. That was Beck Holland's thing that she was doing. Then it was called, God, what was it called?

3:05Think outside the script. So I did a summer long virtual tour because people couldn't really go out and do things like that. For a month, I had 40 people. We did like three of them, uh, three webinars per week over three months. So the entire summer, so it worked out to like 36 episodes or whatever it was, but that was how I met Meredith and a lot of other folks in 2020. That was the last time we talked. So that was great catching up with her. The really, what we talked about is, you know, state of outbound. What's it like being a buyer right now? We talked about a lot of the things that make it very hard to do outbound.

3:38We talked about our reason to meet framework that we apply with outbound that we've had a lot of success with our clients with. And this is just a super fun episode. So before you check it out, do me a quick favor. If you enjoy the Outbound Squad podcast or you've been a listener for a while, it would really help us if you left an honest rating on Spotify, Apple Podcasts, iHeartMedia, wherever you're listening to the podcast so that more people exactly like you could check it out. All right. Without further ado, let's get to the interview.

4:18Let's turn uncertainty into your greatest competitive advantage. Welcome to Ask for Change. I'm your host, Meredith Elliott Powell, and I got to tell you, my guest today is a powerhouse. He has built his entire career around the part of sales most people dread the most, and that's prospecting. Jason Bay is the co-founder and chief revenue officer of Blissful Prospecting. Don't you just love the name? I mean, he helps people like us, B2B sales reps and teams build predictable pipelines. And I got to tell you in the face of uncertainty, that is probably one of the most difficult things to do right now because you take the stress, the guesswork, and even the fear out of the cold call.

5:02And you've been at this since 2008. You personally closed millions in revenue. I want you to welcome Jason Bay to Ask for Change. Welcome, Jason. What's going on? We've actually changed our business name. It's Outbound Squad. now is the name of our company um but uh it's been years merida since we caught up i think it's been like four years actually so it's good to good to see you you still have like the awesome like background too i never you know everybody went everybody went um uh to virtual backgrounds and all these types of things and i got so many comments on this log cabin that i that i've just kept it oh it's so cool like it's very in line with my um very in line with my brand.

5:47So let's kind of dive in. First of all, I'm really curious. It's been a while since we've talked. What's changed? What have you been up to besides changing the name of the company since then? Yeah. A couple of things. One of the really big things that I have been thinking about a lot since last time we talked, one, I was a one-man show back then. And so I was doing all of the delivery. We had started out as a business that would do... Essentially, we were an outsourced SDR. We would do appointment setting. My wife and I started the business. We had a bunch of virtual assistants. We would do LinkedIn campaigns, email campaigns.

6:25And this was back in 2016, where you could do a mass email campaign and book a ton of meetings for someone. And in 2020, we started to shift more towards training companies. So instead of doing this for them, let's work with... Our first big client that we worked with was Zoom. And their account executives, they wanted them to self-source for a pipeline and rely less on marketing and BDR and SDR support. So we really started to gravitate and move more into training. So since then, the biggest thing we've been focused on is how do we make this as simple as possible for a rep to execute on. The big thing that's happened in the last year and a half is the advent of AI.

7:09So it's been both a pro and a con. I think that for Outbound, it's actually been really bad. I think it's done more bad than it's done good. Anyone with a click of a button and a cloud account or whatever AI solution that you're using can send out thousands of decently personalized emails Are they great? No, but they're better than what most reps send. And noise is noise, right? It doesn't matter if a buyer has a thousand emails that you would send to them. It doesn't matter. It's volume. It's noise. So it's made it incredibly hard to get the attention in the inbox. The average reply rate is about 1%.

7:51People are not picking up their phones as much. That's a statistic that has gone down and down every single year. The average pickup rate is around 3.5%. And then you have LinkedIn and people doing all the stuff that they do on LinkedIn. So it's made it very hard to capture the attention of the digital platforms. And I've seen a really big resurgence of in-person drop-bys, thinking about events, dinners, things that you can do where you can rub shoulders in person with your buyers. But you just got to be a lot better these days to make up and work. I'm curious from your perspective. I think building pipeline, it's always a challenge, but then you hit places like we're in right now.

8:33And I've been around a long time. So I remember when we used to have to have, you know, four to five times the pipeline in it. Most of my career, I've run two to three times my pipeline what I needed to close a month. As long as I had two to three in. Right now, I'm probably at about five to six in my pipeline in order to close what I need, you know, in order to close what I need to close. What are you seeing with the biggest challenges that people are having with building pipeline? And what are your suggestions to help them build better pipelines in today's marketplace? Yeah. So I think one of the biggest things, and this is what we've spent a lot of time on in the last, honestly, year or so, is there's all of these sales methodologies out there, right?

9:18There's everything from like Sandler and Challenger. There's like the qualification frameworks like Medic, MedPick. There's value selling. There's all of these things, right? And organizations, CRO on down, are willing to engage in deals and do deal reviews and pipeline reviews. Yet when you look at PipeGen, what do they do about PipeGen? They say, Meredith, here's a talk track, a script, and here's a sequence that we set up for you. Good luck. Go ham. There's no strategy really at all outside of that. So that's a really big problem. The way that we suggest tackling this... So we have a three-part methodology.

9:59It's called Too Good to Ignore. So the whole thesis behind this is that we've analyzed actually a lot of the data with Gong around cold calling and emailing. And what we found that the short of that is that a top 25 % performer, a rep, will book about four and a half times the amount of meetings of an average performer. So it's really like, what are they doing? And there's 3 pillars. It's disqualify, offer, and provoke. So the disqualify pillar, what these top reps do, and we've worked with about 250 sales teams, 20 ,000 plus reps in the last 6 years. And the top performers, the way that they think about their time is more like the owner of a business.

10:42So that disqualify pillar, what you really need to do is a really tight, ideal client profile analysis of where are we winning right now? Where are the sales cycles the shortest? Where do we win the biggest deals? Which ones are the easiest to close, etc.? And there's industries and sub-niches of those industries typically that are really big. You can look at triggers and things going on in those companies. But with AI, it makes this stuff really easy. You don't need a revenue ops team to spend weeks analyzing this. You can literally figure this out in 30 minutes. You need to be able to give your sales team guidance on where they should not be spending time.

11:21And there's an 80 % of companies in their book of business they shouldn't be doing outbound with. So that's step number one. Do you want me to just kind of go high level across those three, or do you want to dig into each of them? Let's dig in. Let's dig into each of them. Because I think that that is, I think it is one of the biggest challenges people face is understanding that the moment that you say yes to a prospect, you just said no to another prospect. And I think it's innate in, I think it's innate in salespeople. Sometimes we get so turned on the more difficult or more impossible it is to close, right?

11:57The more we'll ever close, but really the more, the more interesting. So I'm curious in like your three-step methodology, is that the foundation? Is that like the first step you need to take? Yeah, that's the very first thing is there's this thing that the list is the strategy. so like the way that you tackle your book of business and how you sort it and all of that stuff like that is the strategy that's the very first thing that you have to do um as an organization you should be providing this guidance to your reps and as a rep if you're listening to this you should be thinking about not what is my ideal client profile in terms of like the industries that are listed on my website but like really when we do a closed one and closed lost analysis even for you and your personal book of business like where do you win the most yeah and then how can i just apply that lookalike filtering and criteria and allow my past successes to inform my future efforts like that's that's step number one yeah it makes makes up makes a whole lot of sense okay step number two so step number two is the author so there's a there's a bunch of really interesting data if you think about like the buying environment right now i'll just kind of list out a few things that are pretty interesting.

13:10I mean, one of them that's pretty compelling, there's two of them. 53 % of B2B buyers experience buyers remorse. This is a stat from Gartner. So in other words, at the end of a 12-month contract, they pulled these B2B executives and over half of them said, dude, we shouldn't have bought that. That did not produce the ROI. McKinsey's got a stat that 7 out of 10 change management initiatives fail. um and really where i'm kind of going with this is like the buyer has already been jaded before they've already bought something like yours and it has not worked out before and what that's created is a like an extreme reluctance especially with the macroeconomic conditions just being like this it's created this extreme reluctance around like taking meetings with like new solutions and checking out new vendors and things like that um the other step that's that's really important to You know, Gong did a study of B2B executives and 91 % of them said that the people that sold to them, they feel like just didn't really understand them, their role, their business, etc.

14:10So where I'm going with this is that the whole, let me send an email to someone and say, can I get 15 minutes of your time or in software land, can I show you a demo? It just doesn't work anymore. People are not in buying mode right now. And you're not giving anything of value to that buyer. um so you really got to think about the acid test is like what would this buyer learn from this initial 30-minute meeting with me uh that would be value valuable to them even if they decided not to buy our products or services those three types of offers and i'll give you guys some really concrete examples of them okay great um so i just like a good better best kind of thing so a good offer is what i call selling the blind date so selling the blind date is let's say i'm I'm an appointment center.

14:58In tech, they have a lot of sales development reps. They have these SDR teams whose only job is to make calls, send emails, and set appointments for someone to close them. So if you were my account executive, Meredith, I could say, hey, and I want to put you in touch with Meredith. She has decades of experience working with other manufacturers like X, Y, and Z. And she can talk you through the welder shortage that's going on with them right now. And it also hopefully identifies some parts that you might be trying to weld right now that are really hard to automate. So you're going to get a ton of value from that goal.

15:29So I'm selling the blind date. This person I'm talking to has not met you before. And I want to really pitch your experience. You can do that for yourself also. Oh, hey, by the way, I've been working with a lot of great customers like X, Y, and Z. And I really want to make sure to share some of the insights around selling HR solution, around how they're reducing time to hire, making sure that the retention sticks and how they thought about their international hiring strategy like you guys are for the first time. So that's the first type of offer. Anyone listening to this can do that immediately.

15:59Just pitch the expertise of the person they're going to be meeting with. The second and third ones are very similar. So the better and best, this has to do with a packaged insight. One of them is a one-to-many insight. So you can repurpose the same insight and sell it. And when I say sell that insight, sell them hopping on a call with to dig into it. Another example is I worked with a company that sells to e-com businesses and their marketing department, what they did is they mystery shopped 300 e-com businesses. And they found out how long it would take for them to respond. Did they have channels via text, email, phone, social, etc.

16:38where customers can interact? And what they would do on these cold calls is they would say, Hey, Meredith, it's Jason with so-and-so. I was on the Patagonia site. We actually Mystery Shop You and North Face in Columbia, we found that your response time is actually the slowest of those three. Do you got a minute for me to share the reason for my call and why I was reaching out to you? And I'd listen to these recall recordings of these. And every single prospect was like, they're almost angry, honestly. They're like, what? What are you talking about? Oh, hey, our marketing team, Mystery Shop, a bunch of these companies, we actually did a full comprehensive analysis.

17:12I'd like to walk you through it. So you can see where some of your gaps might be and where you could create and competitive differentiation. It's like, the way I think of the offer is like, how can you make the buyer feel you're responsible for not taking a meeting with you? Yeah. Great way. Such a great phrase. Yeah. So last but not least is a custom offer. So if we're doing good, better, best, this is the best. Not everyone can do this. But if you have something that you can do to show the buyer the problem, let's say that you're a marketing agency or an SEO agency, you can literally record a video of you going through and analyzing their shopping cart experience, their web experience, where they show up compared to their competitors.

17:55You can do these little short things that are actually extremely high value to the person you're reaching out to. So if you're willing to do this stuff, and I think it makes the most sense for someone that's selling a mid-market or higher solution, if you're selling something that costs more than$20 ,000, bucks, it makes sense for you to do this type of offer. The last thing I'll say on this is if you really think about this, if your solution is down here, the features and functions of what your solution does, if you go a layer up into the business value that it creates, so that's impact on revenue, profit, risk reduction, efficiency, etc.

18:38If you can really bridge the gap between those two with the insight. So like, in other words, the insight is not like anything involving your solution. It's really like, if you can show them how to think a little bit differently about the problems that might be having that are getting in the way of those business outcomes, like that is the thing that you want to show them. Yeah, that is the thing that you want to share with them. You know, and I even think like you could you could definitely do that even on an offer that even on a product and service that isn't very, isn't even very expensive.

19:07Like, I love what you're saying, because I think it's important for all of us to think about why would somebody give you their time? I mean, people think that I just I just read that somebody had in their email, they said, don't ghost people, it's bad for humanity. And I just thought, people don't ghost you because they're rude, they ghost you because they're just so freaking busy. And it's like, if I had all the time in the world, I would call Jason back, but I don't have that kind of time. And I'm, you know, I've it's I'm going to be lucky to get the things done I need to get done today. So you have to think about the fact that I always say a sales call is a privilege and you need to think about something very precious and that is somebody's time.

19:47Why would they invest it in you? Yes. Yeah. One quick comment on that is like, I'm a really big fan of Jack O 'Williams extreme ownership. Dude, take some freaking ownership. Really? You're going to blame it on the buyer for ghosting you? You got to look internal and say, what am I doing that is making people feel like it's not worth their time just to spend it with me. Right, right. Exactly. Exactly. All right. So the last one, and I think the most tantalizing is provoke. Yeah. So provoke is like, Hey, I know who I want to reach out to because I've disqualified. I have a great offer. The provoke is like the message, like how am I going to talk to them?

20:21This is the thing that we've spent a lot of time on. We used to teach like a phone framework, like, Hey, if you're going to call someone, here's the framework that you would use. And then we would teach an email framework and then a sequencing framework and then a social selling framework. And it was like, too many frameworks to memorize. So what we're trying to do is think about like, well, what are the core components of a great outbound message? And what we landed on is what we call the 3 Ts. It's trigger, tension, trust. Every message needs to have a trigger, which answers the why now question.

20:55So why should I engage with you right now? So what's going on in your business? If I sell HR, it might be I saw that they're hiring internationally for the first time in the race in the US. Tension. That is the problem I think that you might be having. Hey, not sure if you're running into this, but oftentimes when hiring internationally for the first time, the teams get so overburdened with admin work that it actually interrupts the hiring plan and they're not able to hire fast enough. Trust. That's the third T. This is the social proof. We recently helped another staffing firm in Seattle with this and helped reduce their time to hire by 30 % or whatever, or cut it in hand.

21:33So trigger, tension, trust. The reason why this stuff is so important is like when we have a trigger, it will, according to Gong and firsthand with clients, it will up to 5x your reply rate. Tension, problems, when we look at cold calls and all of the analysis on that, using problem-based language will have three times the effectiveness of booking a meeting than solution-based or feature-focused language. We look at trust and social proof. Emails have a 41 % high reply rate in the study that we did with Gong when we introduced social proof and talk about a similar company that we've helped. So that's the framework, right?

22:08That's how I would do the cold call. That's the same structure for the email, trigger, attention, trust. It's the same thing that I would leave a voicemail with. It's the same thing I would use on a LinkedIn message. There's all kinds of ways across those channels to really tailor based on that channel or pick certain parts of this that you might use. But that's the provoke piece. So let me ask you this. Where, if anywhere, when you're working with people and they're building a prospect list, where, if anywhere, does it fit about building reputation in the marketplace? And does that matter? Is there any piece of that that you're trying to aim at?

22:46Yeah. I think one of the most overlooked things is when you're iHeartMedia, for example. like a rep calling and saying i'm so and so from iheartmedia versus i'm so and so from some company you've never heard of before it carries a ton of weight yeah so so i think like the marketing and reputation building like it starts at the company level right like that's that's really big and as a rep or a leader i'm being conscious of that like what game do i want to play it's it's okay if i want to work for a company someone's like that heard of before and i'm like a startup and like on building up that reputation, but just know what you're in for.

23:23You got to be way better. You got to be way better. Reputation building on the rep side of things. I was just talking to a company that sells a retail point of sales solution that's in a lot of restaurants. And one of the things that their initiatives is they tell every rep, you should be the mayor of the towns that you sell into. So the idea there is that like, hey, you should make like... you should network and stuff with the banks and you should show up to these local events and all this kind of stuff. So that when a point of sale solution is needed, or when someone comes in for a loan for a restaurant, they're opening, like they refer you.

23:59Yeah. Right. So I think like the reputation it's, that's a very nuanced question. If you sell, if you do field sales and you were out working in a specific geographical territory where you show up in person, it is so important, but you should be rubbing shoulders with people in the community. You should be looking for networking events. You should be doing all of that kind of stuff. We've also had reps that sell these graph database solutions. This rep, Matt, shout out, Matt. When he was opening up his... When he was a first-time account executive building his book of business, he lives in Texas and he was selling on the East Coast.

24:34He didn't know anything about any of these places. And one of the towns... I think it was in Baltimore or Atlanta, one of those cities. He just looked within his accounts like, where are the events where these people might be going to for these CIOs and these AI people. They just sponsored a networking event. They would go there. They would rub shoulders. He brought his VP of sales with them. So for him, it wasn't like the town necessarily getting known, but in the spaces and the communities. Yeah. You have to absolutely do this. Every great enterprise rep does this extremely well. But yes, your reputation.

25:11Doing outbound, your offer could be inviting people to a dinner that you're organizing. to an event. I mean, like that is the best way to do outbound when you have something tangible to give. Yeah, I would agree. Something tangible to give that really adds, yeah, that really adds value for them. And then when you think about building pipeline, and I love this topic because we tend to think about it as salespeople. But the truth is, I really go into organizations and I say, if you're going to succeed today, everybody's got to be in sales. Everybody has to have that mindset it is so hard to get a customer this day these days when you get everybody a everybody needs to be looking for one and b everybody needs to have the mindset to hold on to one but are you an advocate of using all the channels um uh you know to to to outbound yes absolutely i mean the the data will show you that your your likelihood of getting in touch with someone is like literally three times higher if you use phone plus email plus social and you leave voice bills um so um the other component is like if you can do in-person stuff i would do that too so if you sell something that is like retail oriented and you can drop by and like go into a restaurant or a retail location or whatever like you should be doing that also yeah meeting meeting and connecting really meeting and connecting yes people and i do and it is just that um i guess it's that old thing like people tend to if you leave a voicemail you send an email they you know you get invited to an event they see you on social media it's just that the more you're in front of people the more they seem to be comfortable with you that eventually if you have the right you know offer in front of them they'll eventually respond yeah 100 and then i think like with with outbound pipe gen i think of it like a continuum too on one side of the continuum is the coldest stuff you could possibly do.

27:02Reach out to someone who doesn't know you and doesn't know your company. The very warmest stuff you can do is working your network and referrals. And there's all of this stuff in between that. So you can use these channels and this outbound and you can focus on the warmer stuff too. I mean, referrals is something that we've done a tremendous job with in the last 6-12 months of building a system around it. We have a list of 6500 people that we've identified as high-value folks that have participated in our trainings and then also participated in a sales cycle with me, whether closed win or closed loss.

27:37And then we have a tool that will go through and help us scrape their first-degree connections that are ICP-fit. So then I can go to them and say, Hey, Meredith, I saw you're connected to so-and-so and so-and-so. Can I go write a message for you to send over to them? So don't forget to work your customers and folks like that for referrals. And a lot of this is not rocket science. It's asking and like waiting for emotional peaks to ask. We just onboarded. They just got a really positive result. We just renewed. Like any of those things, they want to leave a testimonial. Like any of those moments, like you gotta ask for a referral.

28:14Definitely. Yeah. I used to, and we used to say the best time to ask for a referral is right. When somebody signed a loan deal, because they're thrilled. Yeah. They're like, yeah, You just helped him buy a house. You helped him buy a car. You helped him send a kid to college. You did something. It's the best time to really put that into place. You know, Jason, it's hard to believe, but we are at the end of this podcast. And I always like to end with two questions. You can answer them in either order. You know, when you think about uncertainty, when you think about the marketplace and what this show is about, what my brand is about, I really believe that uncertainty has an upside.

28:51It always has an upside and always say to salespeople, an uncertain marketplace is the best time to grow your business. And it's the best time to grow your business because your competitors fade away. They're afraid to bother people because people are indecisive. And the second is customers need you more when the marketplace is uncertain and they need you when times are good. So when you think about people out there struggling to build pipeline, and I swear everybody's struggling to build pipeline right now, what's your greatest piece of advice for them? If they're going to walk away from this show and do one thing, what would that be?

29:21And the second question, again, you can answer it in any order. How do people find out about you? How do they find out about the outbound squad? And I got to tell you, if you are struggling with sales at all, even if you're not, even if you just want to take it, even if you're an elite sales team who wants to go next level, you really need to call Jason and his team. They're phenomenal. So go with either one of those in either order. So the thing that you need to do right now is I would think about that disqualify pillars is the easiest place, the most simple, straightforward place to take action on.

29:51I would think about your current clients, who just loves your stuff, renews, all of that kind of stuff. How can you invest in those relationships more? One of the big things I've made a big point of, and Meredith, you've probably been doing this for a long time. I just didn't spend a lot of time in person with clients. Yeah. Because I don't get... Our business is not me going and speaking out and doing stuff. It's a lot of virtual engagements with remote teams. So this year, I've spent a lot of time... I'll go spend a week in New York. I spent a week in Dallas. I spent a week in Austin. I spent a week in Chicago last week.

30:27I was in London for a week prior to that. I want to rub shoulders and meet with my clients in person. And that's how I've been able to get more access to some of the more senior folks too. So really look at who are your big clients? Who do you really want more clients exactly like them? Make it a point to spend time in person with them. That's where the relationship will accelerate so much. You should be on a texting basis with them. This is people you can ask for referrals to. These are people that you can say, I'm about to reach out to some people and send somebody's emails. What do you think of this?

30:59Would you respond to this? You can get that kind of feedback. And then I would look at that. You're a client base there, the people that just really love your stuff. That is the exact filtering criteria I'm going to use against my book of business for the new clients I'm trying to acquire. but you got to spend an equal amount of time it depends on what you sell to but most of you are probably selling something where there are major expansion opportunities within your client base too and you've got to be thinking about like you do outbound into your own client also there's probably multiple business segments and leaders and all kinds of people that you can meet so start with your current business and then apply that same criteria to your net new companies that you're looking to get into as well.

31:46That would be my immediate action that I would take. I love that. I love that. All right. How do people find out about you? How do they find out about your training? All the amazing work that you're doing. Even just read the information that you put out there online, which is so incredibly valuable. Yeah. Thank you. So two things. One of them is free. I spent six hours in a professional studio and came out with about two and a half hours of our best content, all of our frameworks, methodologies, all of that kind of stuff, it's free. outboundsquad.com slash masterclass. So you can grab that. It's got a cool workbook and all kinds of stuff there.

32:22You can see me and my bald head for two and a half hours straight. So go grab that. And then if you listen to this and you're a sales leader, you're like, you know what? It'd be cool to have them come out and help us with pipe gen. outboundsquad.com. Just go to the website, see if what we have there resonates and then fill out the contact page. you'll get to meet with me. And really where we're helping is a couple of different places. If you have an organization where you've traditionally relied on inbound and marketing, and there's like a major culture shift that needs to get created, that's exactly what we assist with.

32:56We will build the playbooks and process. We'll train your reps on it. We'll train your leaders on it, etc. And we've done that for some really cool companies like iHeartMedia, Shopify, Zoom, like some cool companies. and that if you have like a sales development team and SDR team that's doing a bunch of outbound and they're not booking enough meetings, like that's another area that we help with quite a bit. So if you need more meetings in Pipeline, like I would love to chat with you. I love this, Jason. I really think you are the master here in the age of uncertainty. I mean, sales has gone through a major shift and I think the biggest challenge is that people are still doing it the same way they've always done it.

33:32And just in listening to the whole conversation you've had, you've evolved your methodology as the marketplace has changed. And I think everybody needs to go get that masterclass. And if you've got a team that could use some help, don't be afraid to reach out to Jason. Be real worth your time. So thank you for joining us. Thank you for helping our listeners today. And thank all of you for joining us for another episode of Ask for Change. Remember, together we're gonna turn all of this uncertainty into your greatest competitive advantage. We'll see you next week.

34:07We'll see you next time.