The Matthew Ryle Round

0:01Tom Kerridge: Hello, welcome to the Proper Tasty Pub Quiz brought to you with M &S Food. I'm Tom Kerridge. And I'm Chris Stark and we're here in Marlow today at Tom's private dining space. It's called The Shed. It's lovely. I love it when we get in here. It's a little bit tight and it's a bit packed. The one thing I would say is just as a build, just as FYI, and it's more an indictment on myself and my lack of fitness at the moment. It was quite hard getting in the chair. Yeah, we have them fixed. I've always been moving. And then they're worried about someone robbing the chairs. No, they just get, because it's quite a tight space, waiting staff have to get past and around people, and if they clunk it all out, and then it will send service out.

0:40Tom Kerridge: It's a bit like the coach at the front, like all the seats don't move. Oh, so it's quite clever. So it's done in a way so that you're not disturbing people saying, can you move your chair? Exactly. Also, it means once they're in, they can't get out. Yeah. You think of everything, don't you, Tom? But look, welcome along. If this is your first time listening to the podcast, this is how it works. Yeah, each week Chris, myself and our guests are pitted against each other and we'll keep track of the scores as we go and we announce the winner at the end. Right, let's do this. Okay, our guest for this week's edition of the Proper Tasty Pub Quiz Podcast is chef, author, all-round like French gastronomy legend, Matthew Royal.

1:15Yeah.

1:16Tom Kerridge: Hey, Matthew. Or Matt. We got Matthew written on the front of the book. Yeah. But it's Matt. Matt, yeah, when I did TV, I'm Matthew as well, but podcasting, I'm Matt. When you're at home, what are you at home? Matt. Then it's Matt. Unless I'm getting told off. But yeah, Matt's good. We don't have a sort of French alter ego that comes out as a slightly more French name for yourself. Mathieu. Mathieu. Maybe needs something like that, maybe. But you're the man. It's crazy how massive you and your videos and just generally everything you're doing has got. How's it been for you? uh it's been good yeah i mean you didn't need to call me a legend tom i was very good yeah but i mean anyone far from legend status yeah well over two million followers on instagram watching your i think and they're beautiful videos i mean i'm i'm a follower i love them i love watching them and as a chef that's grown up learning i mean i'm a chef of the 90s i'm twice your age you're in that point and i was learning i learned as a young commie chef all about french cuisine so to revisit it through a younger chef's eyes as well and to see your passion and love for it the same that it was like it was it was drilled into me as a young chef i think it's amazing to watch and it's it's great to then think that so much of the foundations of brilliant cookery in this country is so much so much of it is deeply rooted in french cuisine because of chefs my age then there's generations that have gone you know underneath us and grown and then you've got great chefs like matt here is then inspiring another you know another kind of generation of 18 19 year old commie chefs that are coming into kitchens going this is amazing i'm making you feel that do you feel a kind of responsibility or i don't feel it but i do definitely feel that there's like training and chefs and everything like that is it's very important to give back and it's very important to try and you know leave it a little bit better than we found it because a lot of the chefs at the moment i mean i'm sure you know tom don't have the best training and maybe have like worked their way through the hierarchy a little bit too quickly and um it's nice to kind of like slow people down in the restaurants and remind them that there is you know a base of classics that they need to learn and there's techniques and yeah it's not just a rush to get to the pass and calling out checks all right this is gonna be a real foodie one today yes it is i thought we're all gonna learn something and it is a pub quiz as well matt so look let's explain to you how this works.

3:42So we're going to have three rounds, which we all host. Mine's always kind of loosely linked to it, to our guest. Then Tom is a bit more foodie and based around an ingredient. And then the final round is on a specialist subject of your choice, my friend.

3:54Tom Kerridge: We each host our own round. We ask a question and then we all write down our answer on a score sheet and each correct answer gets a single point. Okay. Easy as that. So this week, my round is going to be all about French food, obviously. I'm not sure I'm going to do as well as you at this one, Matt, and you, Tom. but look play along wherever you're enjoying this podcast we need to kick this off with team names have you got a team name Matt? I do I've literally just come up with it in the car because I had a terrible name before which I won't share okay but I was listening to an album definitely maybe and I think it's basically you know how confident I'll be with all of my answers today it's kind of definitely maybe right fellow Oasis fan then yeah have you got tickets?

4:37Tom Kerridge: no you ask every guest? I'm sorry if I got my spare no luckily one of my mates his brother's best friends with Gene who's Liam's kid so I'm hoping I can kind of weasel my way into one of the yeah you'll find a way yeah yeah we'll try you'll find a way I'm thinking the same that you'll find a way I'll find a way I mean there is a way and it's actually like remortgaging your house and buying something I mean that is a way right what team as always I go for pubs or restaurants with kind of like funny names or something that needs a shout out So this week, my pub name is The Butt and Oyster, and it's in Pin Mill over near Ipswich.

5:16Tom Kerridge: Just thought I'd like to say the word butt and oyster in the same sentence and get away with it. Totally understandable. So yeah, big shout out to The Butt and Oyster. Hopefully still going strong. Do let us know. Send a picture. Why not?

5:33All right, so I've gone down the French theme in your honour, Matt. and my initial suggestion actually it came from from our wonderful team who make this podcast uh was grower pierre love it you see what we've done there um but then i was inspired i was thinking what chefs could we have a little sort of take on john quiz stuff novelli legend

5:57Tom Kerridge: absolutely yeah brilliant brilliant i mean that's probably i think that is your best quiz name you've come up with thank you very much all right guys before we get into the questions we've actually got some bits from M &S. We're going to be eating throughout this podcast. It's all going to be quite French themed. That's the plan for today. I love that. So we're going to kick things off. We've actually got a bit of wine to start. We have an M &S La Balcon Organic Provence Rosé, which I've heard, don't quote me on it. You know, I'm going to whisper it to you. Keep it a secret. I'm hearing it. It's a little bit better than Whispering Angel.

6:30That's a big shout.

6:31Tom Kerridge: That's the Chris Stark claim there. I love that. It's a big shout. You'll have to let me know because I am on the Elderfrauer Presse, which for me is beautiful. It's sparkly and it's a nice little alternative. Makes me feel very summery. And then we've got a little starter, haven't we, Tom? Yeah, we've got M &S Collection Corses Pâté de Campagne and we've got some sourdough baguette. So this lovely little proper farmhouse style looking Corses Pâté, which for me, honestly, I love. I'm just going to get straight in there because I love pâté like this. And it's even better. I like it from the fridge, but also there's something about it when it comes to room temperature and it spreads really nicely.

7:08Tom Kerridge: That thick, coarse pork liver and the meat that's in it, the little flecks of fat and just that little bit of where it's baked on the top just give it a bit of crust. Are you a big pate fan, Matt? A huge pate fan. I love a pate de compagne. We do one at the restaurant. It's so delicious, isn't it? Is pate a date food? I don't know what circumstance I'm expected to eat pate. Sort of a Christmas time it kind of emerges. No, this is just in the free place. Do you have it any time? Yeah. Is that what it is? Yeah. Fair enough. And the beautiful thing about a pate like this, which is very meaty rather than very livery, it doesn't feel very awfully, it doesn't feel like it's just like, it's like the most beautiful, delicious meat paste.

7:52Tom Kerridge: It's fantastic. It's almost like a big sausage. Like cooked big sausage. There's a good way of describing it, I think. yeah spot on yeah very nice wine's good as well lovely i would agree with your whisper do you reckon god they'll love that okay all of this and we haven't even started the quiz apologies everyone i feel bad for anyone i think it's a balance between enjoying us eating the food and maybe learning about some of the things that are available to go and get and go and experience but i think there's a small amount of people who might listen to this podcast with the food, which I really like because it's kind of an immersive way of doing it.

8:30And then I feel for people that are in the car or something on the way and they're having to just hear us say that we're eating this lovely food.

8:37Tom Kerridge: Yeah, but if they're in the car, they could just go to M &S and get it, couldn't they? True, go on, treat yourself. You know you want to. Okay, question number one. What kind of cheese is traditionally used in French onion soup? I'm assuming it's a French... Well, it is going to be a French cheese, isn't it? I've gone for Gruyere. I've gone Gruyere as well. Yeah. so I've written Gruyere or Comte because Gruyere isn't strictly French no so I mean I think it might it might be Gruyere in my book and in my restaurant it's Gruyere if it helps because it melts really nicely and it's got an amazing amazing flavour yeah but I've also put stroke Comte because Comte would work very well also and it's French Gruyere the answer is it's Gruyere well done guys yeah Well done if you got that right.

9:25Matt, can we dig down into this passion for French food? Where did it begin? What kind of inspired you? Is there any memories that you have from being really young and just knowing this was your food? When I was young, I was kind of like unknowingly kind of falling in love with it. So whether it was kind of like a cheap supermarket creme caramel, or, you know, when you're on holiday, a croque madame, croque mâcheur, like all of those things were like slowly being indoctrinated into me. But it wasn't until I went to cookery school that I like properly fell in love with it. And my lecturer was just the most passionate, knowledgeable, incredible teacher.

10:00and he literally taught us about every region of France and, you know, why they cook with dairy in the north and, you know, why in Normandy they don't have wine. They grow apples and they cook their mussels with apples and in the south they use olive oil. Like, he really made us understand France and why it was the way it is and why it was. So as part of that then, so when you're doing the cookery school, I don't obviously know how this works, are you just dealing with French cooking or is it that you're learning different countries and then it was French food that resonated more than the others.

10:34This one, it was French-focused. So, you know, you started with how to cut certain shapes and brunoise and julienne and make stocks and you sort of moved from technique onto different regions and then cooked the specialities from the region. It was an apprenticeship course. So you did three months in Bournemouth and then you went for a year in training up in London and you went back and forth for about three and a half years. So I was at the Dorchester, that's where I got placed with Straker who I know you had on recently he was telling us about a similar experience of going to the Dorchester the first time there yeah yeah so we had literally I mean my lecturer told me you turn up in a suit and you get there 15 minutes early so I was another one of the guys stood in the lobby in a suit I'm here for my chef I actually turned up 15 minutes early for being 15 minutes early and they sent me away they said go away there's no one here yet come back in half an hour so did you go to the same park bench the stragglers yeah i was in the winter unfortunately there was no uh no sunbeds out for me um yeah so then they move around the dorchester you do six months in pastry six months here six months into cass um and yeah that whole training process it really like sets you off on a great great sort of trajectory is it hard to get the respect of representing french food when you're not french yourself yeah the instagram thing obviously that started about a year and a half ago and that was born out of watching people cooking a lot of the same things on instagram and no one was really representing not just french food but just like technique and chef technique and good recipes and i just thought i'd have a pun have a go and it just went incredibly well and like in the space of three months i had a million followers do you know who put me onto

12:19Tom Kerridge: following you you'll love this so one of my closest and best friends is claude bozzi right so obviously claude who has got two two mission style restaurants and now two of the best french bistros arguably yeah no they're great yeah yeah josephine that are phenomenal but he was like chief you've got to look at this guy he's cooking amazing french so that's someone who is like deep rooted in classic french cookery and he's had the so we're on a group right so me claire Smith, Sat Baines, Daniel Clifford, Paul Ainsworth. We're on a little group chat. A hell of a group chat. A hell of a group chat.

12:56That's a great chat.

12:57Tom Kerridge: Claude was on it. Chiefs, you've got to look at this. Have a look at this. He spelt it all wrong, by the way, but it doesn't matter. So we're all following you. We're all learning. No pressure. I can retire now. So I'm right in that you were at 15. You told your mum you wanted to be a chef. yeah and she did this is class from your mum she took you to a restaurant right took it there was one michelin star restaurant in like the whole area and my mum said right i'm going to take you to a restaurant later she didn't tell me where we were going and we sat in the car park and i was like mum is this restaurant even any good like where are we and she was like matt it's got a michelin star i was like what and then she took me in met the chef he gave me a book signed it and he was like look mate if it was it was alan murchison at the time yeah yeah uh in lauterland and he said look if you ever want to come in and work on the weekends be my guest and i went back that saturday and then i went back the following six months every saturday and worked in the kitchen and and that that for me was like when it became real because it was like walking into one of those kitchens and like it was a small kitchen and you know all the stocks are cooking and everyone because it's small everyone's got their place and i've got ocd at the best of times like everything was so pristine everything and ordered yeah i just i just felt felt at home in that great i would i think that would be so inspiring to to so many people um next question here we go at what part of a meal would you eat a charlotte is that how it's pronounced yeah yeah yeah well i don't know what's going on at what part of a meal would you eat a charlotte i mean i don't know what I'm imagining here.

14:37I don't know what's going on. I can't say I've encountered this. It's a potato, is it? Or what? There might be a Charlotte potato. Probably is. I'm going to have to do that. So I'm going to go mains. Nice.

14:53Tom Kerridge: Good shout. That's one in three, isn't it? Sorry, I've just shown you my workings. Yeah, yeah, yeah. I don't suppose you're going to cheat from me. All right. You got answers? I've gone pud. Yeah. I've gone dessert. Is it puds? It's a dessert, yeah. It is a dessert, you're right. Tell me, what's that about? What's going on there? It's kind of like a mousse-like dessert, a charlotte. Is it? Nice. Very, very nice, yeah. Yeah, similar to a bavois, but normally more fruity. But there are charlotte potatoes. So on a technicality, I was kind of right. Yeah, well, I think you could probably get half a point for that.

15:31I doubt it. Sophie's not going to give me that. She might. oh great go on talk to us about opening restaurants as well so you've got a place in borough market yeah so we opened recently opened september last year cafe francois which is sister restaurant to maison which we opened about five years ago um both big french brasseries cafe is a little bit more approachable and affordable and like a bit more kind of casual yeah we've got like some great sandwiches on down there a big rotisserie oven and then you've got Maison which is a bit more of a sort of traditional brasserie and you've got the bea tartare trolleys and pudding trolleys and real classic French menu you've got your passé on croutes and au fond gelée and yeah Maison is your real sort of traditional French brasserie and then cafe is a little bit more experimental fun young brasserie.

16:23Okay question number three true or false there is a French bread decree that legally states what is classified as French bread, I don't know on this one because I think there's all sorts of reasons why... See, I don't know either.

16:38Tom Kerridge: Knowing them as a nation... Sounds very French. It sounds very French. Oh, really? Yeah, I don't know. But if you think of them, you go, there's got to be a thing that goes, if you're going to call it French bread, it must have or must be... Certain properties. Yeah, there must be something that you're allowed... Then you're allowed to call it French bread. Okay, cool. I've gone for true, yeah, Yeah, just on that exactly the same. Yeah, I have no idea, but I'm just going just from a nation that loves a bit of red tape. Okay. I'm going for yes, that it is true. All right. Well, I actually went false.

17:10I can tell you it is true. The bread decree came into place in 1993. I can tell you a little bit more about it. So officially known as Le Decree Pan, obviously with a slightly more French accent, it mandates that bread sold under the label Tradition Francaise, traditional French bread, be made on site from a specific recipe and must not include any pre-made dough. That's incredible. The law also stipulates that the baguette must be produced with only flour, water, salt, and either baker's yeast or sourdough leaven.

17:43Tom Kerridge: Yeah, that's a sourdough starter. You know everyone talks about a starter that's leavened. That's what that is. And cannot be frozen at any point in production. This would be for a traditional baker's shop where they're selling a French baguette, traditional French baguette. It's made on site. there and then nothing frozen but I think that's a peak experience you know when you go to France and you can wander down to a to a baker's and it's always just slightly it's just different it's a totally different game that it's unbelievable we go skiing in the winter and up in the Alps like you get up it's dark you walk down to the baker's get a couple of croissants and a baguette that baguette is like incredible like go back slice a bit of ham cheese and you put it in your bag and we're at the top of the mountain like you cannot beat that baguette we're going to talk about your book in a bit as well and it is just a it's a master class it's one of the most beautiful things i've ever seen um not just like visually with the pictures but going through the recipes are incredible and it feels like such a representation of of sort of french cuisine do you think it's everything's moved on from sort of stereotypes that we might have grown up with where french food is frog's legs and snails and it's literally judged on that I don't know what your opinions are on frog's legs or snails, by the way.

18:57Delicious. Yeah? Yeah, yeah. I don't mind a frog's leg or a snail. Yeah, I don't know where I'm at. I just don't really encounter them very often. I wouldn't order them. I've got to be honest. There's other things on the menu that I'd go above a snail. Yeah, but when in Rome, it's like when you're in France, you feel if it's on there, you should order them.

19:15Tom Kerridge: No, you haven't, mate. You've got steak tartare. You haven't got all the snails if you don't want to. It doesn't make you super French just because you've eaten a snail. do you genuinely like it or do you have to like it would be for me it's more of those when in rome things yeah like if i go to a french brasserie and we're sharing five or six starters we might as well chuck a plate of snails on because i can dip the baguette in the garlic butter yeah i mean that's essentially why you order snails i think i think it is yeah i do think it must be it must be unless look please correct correct us if you're wrong but yeah it's always an interesting one and I think frog's legs as well.

19:49That was always a weird one for me growing up. But I think my experience of them was quite nice.

19:55Tom Kerridge: Genuinely, ever since I was a young chef, I have so many questions about frog's legs. Go on. Well, everyone says it tastes like a bit like fishy chicken, and it does a bit, right? But my question is, right, it's a bit like the black pudding question, right? Who came up with that, right? Which is fine. Yeah. I get it. You go, we've got leftover, like pig's blood. What should we do with it? Let's see what happens. Oh, it thickens, and let's make something. and I get the black pudding thing. At what part have they gone, time's bad, should we eat a frog? Like, at what part have they gone, yeah, but I don't think I could eat a whole one, just the legs.

20:29Tom Kerridge: Like, at what part? Specifically, the legs look like. Yeah, yeah, and what's the rest of it? Like, what are they doing? But considering the legs are so tiny as well, you are. Yeah, it's just, it's a strong shout, isn't it? I mean, you are so desperate for protein, aren't you? Like, I think if the only thing that's left is a frog or vegetables, I'm all about vegan food here. Listen, we've got a bit more food here. I think one of my core memories going on holiday to France was the first time I encountered a bucket of mussels. And as someone who loves their food, I just thought the quantity that you get with mussels was phenomenal.

21:06Yeah, you can't beat a bucket of mussels, honestly. It's one of those things, and talking about stereotypes, like french food i think had that stereotype of being like difficult to do hard to do and that was again around the instagram thing showing people that a bowl of mussels is actually like so incredibly easy and quick to cook at home and like no one ever thinks about doing it it's like that's a restaurant plate of food for so many people it was only ever for me you'd go to a restaurant to do it yeah i think you're right i think there is a real sort of lack of knowledge about how easy it is to have the most incredible.

21:43I think a bowl of mussels, it's quite easy to make taste amazing. Sunny day, glass of wine, and a big bowl of mussels in the garden. And it literally takes three minutes to do it if you've got something. Yeah, it's great.

21:53Tom Kerridge: Absolutely no time. They're dead easy to cook. They're sustainable. They're actually, you know, British mussels are fantastic. You know, it's really, really easy, quick to cook. And it's not one of those fish dishes that actually people worry about cooking fish at home because it makes their house smell. actually it's just all about steamy wine isn't it you know it's just they're very very simple to do right well look we've got some mussels here to try from m &s they've sent us some lovely mussels so please feel free to dig in so you two have got some more and some frites over there some mussels and french fries and i've got some beef bourguignon from the gastropub range and a classic potato gratin dauphinoise i wonder if they're maybe charlotte potatoes yeah maybe Matt I was interested to see how you went about attacking the muscles you'd like it good teckers considering we only had forks you get a little bit of that juice as well I grew up, you're sort of using it almost like a little cup it's nice it's good to see how the experts do it now you see it always blew my mind again a cool memory learning that you can use one muscle as a little pincer and then you get the muscle out you've got some skills mate that's a good one would you be tempted to employ me Matt?

23:09yeah

23:11Tom Kerridge: how old were you when you first ate your first muscle? do you know I always remember we went to a campsite in France in Brittany and I remember we went to this little restaurant that was just outside the campsite and my mum loved it my mum was a French teacher I always used to cringe about it quite a lot but she would go to cafes and shops and she would speak French and I would always I don't know why I found that, whereas actually she was doing the right thing, which is, you know, using the right language. And having a go. Yeah, and having a good go. And we went to this place, and I always remember getting the mussels and having this massive, it was just the quantity of them that I loved.

23:50It felt like such a treat to have so much food.

23:54Tom Kerridge: The great thing about mussels, you're right, because it looks like a massive amount. But actually, by the time you pick through them, there's a joyous people sat around eating them it looks like a huge amount but by the time you pick them out you've enjoyed it it's it's not it's not a massive amount and there's a real sense of occasion about something that's actually very pocket friendly super tasty it's an amazing little thing to be cooking i'm one of those people that's uber paranoid though with muscles you have to you know like leave out anything that's slightly open i go so overboard on that just can't risk it i'll tell you where that that's come from that's from do you remember mr bean where he ate something dodgy.

24:30He ate a dodgy oyster or something.

24:33Tom Kerridge: I love how you're living your life because of something Mr. Bean's done. I mean, we're in a whole world of trouble here, mate. Do you not remember? He had the steak tartare. Yeah, he hid it. And he started hiding it. Yeah. What a loser.

24:51Tom Kerridge: Oh, dear. It was a memory, though. What's the sauces like with it? Because one of them is with a garlic one with shallots to it. and one of them is white wine and parsley. That's the best bit for me. Once you've finished it and you've got that little soup at the end, bread in there. Soak it all up. Yeah. We actually do a flatbread at the restaurant, which is essentially more marinier, that last mouthful on a flatbread. And we basically make a butter with a mussel butter, cover it in mussel butter, load of pick mussels on top, and it kind of melts and you're left with this beautiful flatbread, which is essentially that reminiscent of dipping into the last.

25:27That's incredible. that's cool man

25:29Tom Kerridge: because I think there's a huge debate about what bread you should be dipping in muscle I've never found the perfect one yet do you know what I mean you can't just be whacking with all due respect just no you've got some French bread that's been signed off by some by the French degree yeah that's exactly it

25:50Tom Kerridge: now it's my round and this week my ingredient normally talk about ingredients and normally uh chris does all right on this one actually mind it's like so this week we're going to talk about peas and the kind of difference between garden peas or petit pois or the ones that are coming right into season now and i love what peas represent there's so much about them are because we talk about seasonality now france is also deeply enriched a bit like great britain in seasonal produce and the way that it works and peas absolutely represents a time of year doesn't it it really is now like june july it is summertime it is peas and they first start off we get them in this country they start coming through from spain and we won't get them through in the uk probably until at least a lot later this month but there's something magical about peas the sweetness of them the flavor i remember as a young chef the podding process of them the thing like one of those repetitive jobs as a young chef you just keep doing you just keep doing and you just do boxes and boxes of peas and and they really do um really sum up i think great british summertime also there's so much about them you can use now you can pod them and then shell them once they're cooked or you can serve them as just little round peas in their shell which is lovely but also the pods have so much flavor do you ever utilize the pods as well yeah yeah we use them yeah they're amazing so you use them as an infusion if you put them into stocks or you can make dressings with them or you can smash them up and just gently warm them with olive oil and then pass it off and the olive oil's got this kind of like sweet pea flavor with it they're fantastic they're absolutely amazing absolutely so up summertime for me so can i can i ask you a question this is something i heard you guys can confirm it so in the supermarket you're better going with frozen peas unless you're getting super fresh peas from a garden and from a veg supplier that you know is coming from the ground because the moment peas are picked what happens is the sweetness of the sugars they start turning to starches so the moment they start going to starch that freshness that sweetness kind of disappears now frozen peas they are picked and frozen they say most places they're done within an hour the one mistake that a lot of people do make with fresh peas is they don't cook them enough.

28:07Tom Kerridge: They just like blanch them like they're just like little things because they think they're a tiny little thing just getting cooked really quickly like a frozen pea. They're not. They take a lot longer to cook. Oh, really? Yeah. All right then, question number one. In Cockney rhyming slang, what is a pea shooter? Oh, okay. I've got an answer. Pea shooter. That's it. Cockney, right, you've almost got to work backwards, haven't you? Yeah. All right. Matt, what have you gone for? It was definitely wrong, but I've gone for gun, which sounds logical. Your pea shooter? Shooting peas. I know it's not copyrighted slang at all.

28:47I kind of missed the question there. That's okay.

28:50Tom Kerridge: So I went with two different things. I started off going pea shooter, your hooter, which might mean your nose. But then I went, oh, hold on a minute. It might be your scooter. So I've gone with going down the shops on me old pea shooter. Okay, you see, I've gone the other way. I've gone pea shooter, hooter, nose. You went hooter, nose. I've gone for scooter. And the answer is, oh, mate, you're right. Get in. Come on. A pea shooter is your hooter, which means your nose. Makes sense. Well, it doesn't at all, does it? It does. Come on. It does. It does. Matt, can we talk MasterChef? Talk us through what that did for you, what you enjoyed about it.

29:27Do you reflect on it differently now? Yeah. Talk us through it. I mean, it's kind of one of those things when you're training to be a chef that you kind of look down on. And it's like your friends and family will always ask you, when are you going to do MasterChef? And you're like, I'm not doing that show. And then I basically did it. I just got sick of everyone asking me. I said, I'll give it a go. So I did it, and I didn't really expect much from it. I sort of got pushed into it by my wife. Obviously, what you were cooking there, one of the standout dishes, I'll never get the name of this right, poulé en vessi.

30:00Yeah. And this was a huge success. Yeah, so that was another thing that it was like I was cooking. It's a show where you cook what your food is. And, you know, as you go through the competition, you have a lot of great chefs telling you, reaffirming that your food is good and, like, you are doing the right thing. Like, you build confidence in the food you're cooking. And, yeah, poulé en vési was kind of towards the latter end. I just thought I'm sure no one's ever cooked a chicken in a pig's bladder on MasterChef before. So I thought, why not?

30:30Tom Kerridge: I don't think they have. I was a strong dish though so it's a classic if you ever if you ever managed to go to Lyon and do that kind of temple of gastronomy that's Paul Bacuse it's the dish that you have to have Poulion Vessi oh really and it's a classic dish where they kind of like steam and roasted chicken that's stuffed with truffles in a pig's bladder so am I right you had to get the talk me through this so basically you had to get the bladders in you can buy bladders that have been inflated and dried not at M &S you can't no not easily but anyway i couldn't get them i couldn't find them anywhere and i wanted to do the dish so badly that i asked my butcher like please please can you get me some pig splatters and they're like i can't get them from you for you from the uk i can get you some from france minimum orders 16 kilos do you want them and i was like yes send them so i was i just thought that they would be like big pig splatters like a big enough to stuff a chicken in and they come they were tiny they're like the size of brussels sprouts so i was like i can't get a chicken in there like and then i was reading online what you do to inflate them and people used to use them as footballs and you like blow them up tie them leave them to dry and then you could kick them around so basically yeah in the back of the restaurant i was there with a with a bike pump pumping up these pig's platters like as big as you dare and then tying them off letting them dry so that i could stuff them with chickens but they would like i mean out of 16 kilos i've got like four that worked the rest exploded in my face yeah and like the restaurants just the back of the kitchen stunk and they had like oh it was it was horrendous um but yeah i had what i literally got one that worked and that was the one i used on the show and then i now found the supplier and you can buy them 10 in a bag massive dry clean ready to go yeah it's great when you get these links in the world.

32:24Tom Kerridge: Pirate TV, mate. That's what happens, mate. Question number two. How many mattresses... This is not really a strong pea food question, I've got to be honest, right? Okay. Bear with me. How many mattresses were laid on top of the pea in the fairy tale The Princess and the Pea? I've never heard of it. Just want to put it out there. I've never heard of it. You want two kids. Princess and the Pea? Yeah. I've never heard of it. I couldn't sleep properly because there's a tiny little pea underneath a hundred ten seven I don't know mattresses made her uncomfortable so the question is how many have you heard of this I've heard of the story have you I think I might have watched it when I was yeah younger I was more Poddington Peas myself who you know down at the bottom of the garden I'm too old for that between the bird and the bees there are lots of little green things they're called the Poddington Peas no I don't know no no really how old were you when you watched that I thought you'd have that Matt nah sorry bought him some peas they were ledge I could I like the theme tune yeah they're an example of a show where the theme tune was just outrageously good unnecessarily so honestly mate down at the bottom see that was my that's a good theme tune anyway I don't know I've never heard of it what have you written 10 I've written 10 also I went 99 99 I thought it was 100.

33:54Tom Kerridge: 20. The answer is 20. It's 20 mattresses were laid on top of a pea in the fairy tale of the princess and the pea. Okay, should we do the next question? Yes, next question. Are peas, it's quite an interesting one, right? Are peas a fruit or a vegetable? See, the fact this is a question means it's going to be a funky answer, but I think this might be a double bluff, so I'm going to go vegetable. I've written vegetable. Yeah, I've gone vegetable. The answer is fruit. Nah. Nah, VAR that. Yeah. We all know the tomato thing now, but it turns out peas identify as fruit, which I just think is utter woke nonsense.

34:32Tom Kerridge: I love that. That's a Daily Mail sentence for you there. Well done. Former BBC Radio 1 presenter says peas are woke, identifying as a fruit. I dare they. Right. Okay, Matt. I really want to talk about your book. So it's called French Classic. Can you talk us through it? Talk us through the inspiration of it. What made you go for this? So when I started on the Instagram, basically to do something a little bit different, I wanted to do French food and I wanted to keep it real classic. So I put like a checkered red and white cloth over my table. I got the old chalkboard and I basically wrote a menu of the French classics.

35:16So you started, you had the beef tartars, you had the snails, then like then you had the bouillabaisse you had coque van you had creme caravan you had chocolate mousse you know so it was like 15 or 16 dishes and as i went through them i kind of crossed them off and this like just as being a point of difference you know starting the video crossing something off doing something that people weren't cooking it got traction and it did really well and then the book is essentially you know it's grown out of that so i went from french classics I did a potato series all about the best potato dishes. Dauphinoise, Aligo, chips, mash.

35:55Oh yeah,

35:55Tom Kerridge: Aligo. That at Michel Bras as well. Unbelievable. See, that's a life experience you've got to have. You've got to go with Michel Bras just to have Aligo, mate. There you go. Aligo. Yeah. What is Aligo? It's kind of like... Cheesy mash. Cheesy mash. But it's beating so much and it stretches the starches and it goes, it's like oink. Oh, really? Yeah, it makes that noise. It goes oink. And then they dump it in the middle of the table for you and they work it at the table and it's just, it's unbelievable. Oh, that sounds, you see, I love that. That sounds like a bucket list experience that you need to have.

36:26Tom Kerridge: Yeah, Michel Braff. And then, yeah, so I did this little series on eggs and then, so basically the book is following that theme. There's a section in there for starters, main desserts, potatoes, eggs, vegetables, blah, blah, blah. You've got a Charlotte section? No Charlotte in there, unfortunately. But you've got essentially in there the greatest hits of French food. I wanted to talk to you about the illustrations in it because I think it's such a lovely point of difference with this book. I've got books which were written 50 years ago, and they still sit proudly on my bench. And that's, I wanted to do a book that would still sit proudly on someone's table side in 20, 30 years, and it wouldn't age, and you could refer to it when someone's coming around or, you know, any given night of the week.

37:06And I just, the little nods and the illustrations. So the book is out in August? 28th of August, the book's out in the UK, Yeah, yeah. Great. You've got to get on this. Who did you get to do the foreword for it? Raymond Blanc. Yeah. Didn't get the call up, eh? Me.

37:24Tom Kerridge: Not French, am I? Did email him five times. Yeah. What, me? Yeah. No, I didn't. No, I didn't. Come on.

37:38Okay, Matt, we're going to get into your rounds in a second, but before that, it's dessert time. We're sticking with the French theme. and what we have in front of us oh sorry round one

37:46Tom Kerridge: second time just a little glass in front of me there you can tell I'm excited right what we've got in front of us is the M &S collection profiteroles stack that's quite literally just a stack of profiteroles here I had one of those for my wedding day we had loads of profiteroles pastry chef at the time where I was working made them for us but we so we got married our wedding reception was in a pub in King's Cross there was 200 of us there the pub was a little bit warm and it was just so the profiteroles started to like so we had we had a wedding cake before the steak we did it in reverse because of structural issues with the stack yeah because of structural issues with the staff the profiteroles like the caramel was just beginning he went you might want to eat the profiteroles you might want to go for the cake first he's like alright cake first it is these look lovely get in there bub do you know what I like that's just our childhood memories like of going to the bakers and you're having like a soft cream bun but they're just tiny little mouthfuls of them that are just great isn't they it's not a bad stack to finish the evening is it when i was at uni i used to do the student radio and i was trying to get into radio and i convinced the cat the ladies who worked in the cafe there because i would do a little breakfast show on student radio and uh they created a seven there was a seven item breakfast that you could get for 2.99 and what I got them to do was create what I called at the time a Starkey stack, which was the seven item breakfast, but piled high in a tower.

39:16So if you listen to the show and you ask for it, and I couldn't obviously add anything extra to it, so it was£2.99. But what I got them to agree to do was if someone orders it, you give them a high five.

39:27Tom Kerridge: So you've got a free high five. And how many did they sell? I don't know. I just always like the idea of it, you know. Starkey stack something for M &S to think about maybe free high five with every stack yeah you buy a Starkey stack high five from the checkout someone stands there and they're just just waiting as you leave high fiving mate I think there's an added value imagine that on your menu for the next one of your puddings served with a free high five yeah it's interesting okay we should say as well look thank you M &S for the food today it's been much needed it's been quite a long day for me and it's been great fuel and lovely to have a French theme we've not really done I haven't done a kind of themed podcast yet in the same way.

40:08You know, food throughout it like that. It's fantastic.

40:14Tom Kerridge: Right then, Matt, it is your round now. And your specialist subject is, I wasn't quite expecting this, but sea life. Yes, it is. Sorry. Do you know how you've arrived at this, Matt? Yes, I do. My wife has a place over in Florida, well, her auntie does. And they go every year. We've been going every year. and her dad knows everything there is to know about turtles, sharks. Anything that grows is in the water close to Florida. He knows about it and he talks a lot. And so I've just kind of absorbed. If you're listening, John, thanks. Right, question number one. How many hearts does an octopus have?

40:54Okay, it's plural, is it? There's logic in my answer, but it also seems ridiculous. I mean okay what's yours? I've gone eight a heart for each leg because a tentacle the legs is a strange situation tentacle sorry yeah

41:13Tom Kerridge: so what have you gone for? I've gone for one okay like one heart because like it's a trick question why why would it what else has got more than one heart? I feel like they have got more than one but I've just guessed at three I was like one a backup and then another backup the answer if you tear it apart the answer is three Matt Matt I just subconsciously have taken that on in the last few weeks that is extraordinary but how is that I can't give you the answer to why yeah but also why what a random thing if you've got like it doesn't even make sense in terms of in terms of even in odd numbers it's got eight legs but three hard like what's the it's an absolute mess of a beast isn't it it really is in all honesty an octopus is in all sorts of trouble isn't it it's kind of like like what's it I mean that's not there's some freaky stuff under the sea isn't there that's what's kind of exciting about it especially for you guys as chefs because the more they find these things the more you can get creative in your industry cooking the French are doing for us the one that always gets me I think about it at least once every two days is there is a shark that is 300 years old okay this thing is in the sea right now right floats around its heart beats once every three years.

42:35It's ludicrous.

42:36Tom Kerridge: What are you talking about? It's like it just does nothing. And then occasionally it's like, oh. So you've got to think what it does, 400 years old we're hearing now. Is he talking about like one fish? Yes, I'm talking about one. There is one shark that is in the sea right now that's 400 years old. How do we know that? Because it's there, Greenland shark. No, but how do we know? It was there 400 years ago that went, oh yeah, like this shark, and now 400 years later. Okay, bonus question for you both. This is a great one. At what age does the Greenland shark reach its sexual maturity?

43:20This will blow your mind, but it also gives us all hope. Matt, what are you going for? I've gone for 150 years old. Yeah, he's right, 150 years old. You do know your stuff, don't you? You freaky 300-year-old shark octopus boy. Matt, question number two, please. Well, no, it's a good one. Like your pub, the oyster and butt. Which sea creature breathes through its butt? See, they're all freaky down there, mate.

43:49Tom Kerridge: So there's a 400-year-old shark. There's an octopus with three hearts, eight legs. Yeah. What have you gone for? Okay, you've gone starfish. Of course he has. to be fair there's logic in your answer starfish Matt you I've gone for turtle any any substance to this I know it breathes through his butt I went the blower fish just because I just assumed a turtle breathes through his yeah it's a turtle what is going on wow what but what a design flaw right then question number three please Matt question number three last one what is the largest sea creature to have ever existed okay I'm assuming it's whale based you'd have to think I've gone blue whale yeah you're probably right what have you gone for I went for giant squid see I went for full on dinosaur I've gone for megalodon yeah they are huge actually them things I've got dinosaur top trumps with my lad and it's that wins on everything except intelligence I think if I remember right we've done everything except intelligence okay what's the answer it's the blue whale it's the blue whale well done Matt before I give the scores today's pub quiz which has taken all sorts of weird turns have you enjoyed your experience c 'est bon c 'est bon yeah

45:22alright here are the results and well done if you got any of those questions like any of them If you got the turtle question right, ask proper kudos. Okay, the results. In third place, two and a half points. It's me.

45:37Tom Kerridge: No. In second place, with three points, I can tell you, it's so low scoring, it's Tom Kerridge, which means the winner of this week's Proper Tasty Pub Quiz with M &S Food with double Tom and some, seven points. It's Matt, everyone. Yes! Go on, sir. Thank you. Matt, I've thoroughly enjoyed today's podcast. Thank you so much for sharing your knowledge, your expertise. Your book, French Classics, is going to be everywhere this Christmas, surely. Yeah, it's a beautiful, genuinely, it's one of the most beautiful books I've seen. I think if I, from a chef's perspective, I think it's a magical book. It's a book that every chef or aspiring chef and every home cook should have.

46:20Tom Kerridge: I think it's a magical looking little book. It's out in August. Matthew Ryle, French Classics. Thank you for the kind words about the book. It's very sweet. Oh, Matt, well, listen. Thanks for having me. It's been great. It's been an absolute pleasure, mate. You've been a superstar. And of course, big thank you to M &S Food as well for today's delicious French food. Yes. And remember, if you've enjoyed the show, please follow it wherever you get your podcasts. Leave a little review and give it a rating. Go on, give it five stars for Matt here. And it obviously helps more people find the show, which is what we want.

46:48Tom Kerridge: We'll be back next week with another quiz and we will see you then. Matt, if you do the honour, there's a bell somewhere. Give it a little ring and call last orders. Hey, get out of my pub. Yay! Thank you all, everyone!