The Tell: A Conversation About Healing and Re-Parenting Oneself with Amy Griffin

0:00The following podcast is a Dear Media Media Production.

0:10Welcome to Raising Good Humans. I'm Dr. Liza Pressman. And first, let me just say happy, happy holidays, happy new year, happy all of it. I'm so excited to step into the new year with all of you. Today's episode is with my dear friend, Amy Griffin, who's actually an American venture capitalist, but you might know her as the massive bestselling author of the book, The Tell, which was an Oprah book club pick. And here's the thing, just a warning, this episode is heavy because this is about her experience remembering abuse from her adolescence. So we had this conversation And I also am going to have an article on Substack that kind of goes through prevention and protection for kids when it comes to predators, because that's something that I often get asked about.

1:12And I want to make sure that I provide you with information. But this is a different kind of conversation. It's about her experience and naming what she's gone through so that she can help other people do the same. Of course, you can find me on Substack, drlizapressman.substack.com. I'll definitely write this article. And obviously I do articles every week that try to summarize the show and the main points or pull out something that I've really been wanting to talk about. It's also a place where you can ask me questions and I can write articles that are more along the lines of Q &A, which I can also do when you DM me questions on Instagram at Raising Good Humans Podcast.

1:59So hopefully in this new year, I'll be getting lots of questions answered. In the meantime, I really hope you enjoy this episode. And I recognize that it's a little bit harder to listen to, and I want to make sure that you're prepared. And I would say this is not an appropriate episode to listen to with children. I told you I read this book when the fire started in LA and our power went out and I was like, all right, this is perfect. And then I was like, I didn't want the power to come back on because I just didn't want to be interrupted because it was so incredible. But that's like a weird feeling when it's about a person who's going through, I can't help, even though your book isn't centered around trauma, I couldn't help but see your book in this, like, here's this beautiful thing.

2:53Here's this beautiful parenting thing. Here's this beautiful woman. Here's this beautiful friend. But here is, how did this, how was this, how could this happen to her? So it was like, and why am I reading about it? Like it was so, it was such a, and I couldn't stop. It's so interesting, right? Because so many people told me that and that I had, well, I couldn't have conviction around the book itself and the writing, but I had such conviction around my story and I was living in it. So I never really stopped. And I'm glad that I didn't stop to think about, oh my gosh, what if I've given my book to friends and they don't like it?

3:29And I'm asking them to participate or support me. And I, and I think that's why when I, you know, truthfully, honestly, every part of this process has felt so incredibly authentic that I actually was using the book not as a way to say, do you like, I've never thought, I've never thought about, does someone like this book? It was really more of this process that I went through, which I remember I was saying to you, I started in watching you at your book party of the telling. And it was this true, authentic telling that I'd been through every step of the way. And honestly, I could not wait to come on with you because now that the book has been out.

4:05The idea like that you would hand over the book and you're not looking for approval. You're not looking for people to be like, this is amazing. It's so clearly not what your purpose was, which is so funny because in so much of your life, you've been, and you talk about praise. And like, I just think about, oh my God, you probably can't imagine more praise. Who could get more praise than you're getting for this book? Except you weren't seeking that in writing this book. and I feel like so much of your life, you were seeking that praise and it's like such an ironic, interesting, almost scary thing to know like you put this out there for a completely different reason and now you have to receive all this praise.

4:51I couldn't be having a better conversation at any moment in time because I'm dealing with these beautiful conversations. I can only say that when people had said to me, oh, be careful, a book tour is draining or this, that and the other. I have felt so the opposite. I cannot tell you that every conversation I've had has made me not feel alone, has made me feel connected. I wrote this book first for myself, never knowing that anyone would ever read it. And I think that's what's most interesting is that my husband came in at a very difficult moment and said, you know, do what you do best. Here's a journal, go sit down and write.

5:27And so it was, the book is called The Tell, but The Telling, which is through my parenting and talking about my parenting and the telling is actually what I've done and releasing it out into the world. So in terms of getting praise, yes, I will say, isn't it fascinating that when you absolutely let go of needing validation from the world, the minute you do, I've been giving myself permission and I've been through this process of writing this book, I've been parenting myself. Yes, it's so wild. And in the notion of like breaking it down, I couldn't wait to talk about the idea that not only do I relearn how to, and my children were still, I say they're young enough, but I'm so happy that there was a reparenting of how to parent my children, but also the parenting that I was doing with my mother.

6:18So it was going upwards all the way through the generations down to the fact that I haven't spoken about. And I know you will love this, seeing the pictures of your grandfather, that my mother, a week or two before the book came out, drove to Oklahoma to go and tell my 97 year old grandfather. And no one, I've never talked about that, but it was this understanding that my mom who also had her own story needed to go share with him and tell. And I had mandated that I said, it is not my decision. You can decide if you tell when you tell him, how you tell him, if you don't tell him, he is the most wonderful human.

6:55And then there was this decision. It would think it was a growth. It was growth on, in my family's part. And definitely like for me and my mother to be able to have her say, I'm going to go tell. It was an unraveling. It was a telling birth to myself and a telling to my family and then a telling of the friends closest to me. And so it became an understanding of telling. And if anything, I used your parenting books and what you've written and what I've learned. And I think life is a combination of all parts of you. And so that's why today was really, truly important to me. So I'm really grateful.

7:27I was thinking about when, because in framing the book, in framing everything nowadays, like ever since I started to have to have so many conversations about the five principles of parenting, relationship, reflection, regulation, rules, repair. And like all of that is how we build resilience. Rules, repair, using it over and over and over. I was finishing my book after I read yours. And I was thinking like you embodied every one of those principles that is not to your point, like reparenting you, parenting your kids, repairing with your parents, like everything is so, and I'm not suggesting repairing something that was broken.

8:13I mean, truly just like connecting, reconnecting in a way like the, I'm jumping around now and we'll get into some actual linear conversation, but I was thinking about - because I think that's so beautiful. No one's ever said that to me because people think, oh, everything was, and that's again where this is not, this is not a novel. It wasn't all broken. Yeah. And then it became perfect and we don't like the word perfect anyway, but it was not that. It was the fact that I actually came from a beautiful family and parents who deeply love me, which is actually something that I haven't gotten to really talk about.

8:44Just the fact that I think that it was the parenting at home, the loving relationship that I went home to every day that did keep me safe, that allowed for me to be alive and to be here today. And now for a quick break. This is a very stressful season for sure. And budgets are going crazy. So I want to tell you about Monarch because it will really help you control your finances. So if you're feeling like things are off the rails, Monarch is awesome. It's rated Wall Street Journal's best budgeting app of 2025. It is the all-in-one personal finance tool that brings your entire financial life together in one clean interface on your laptop or your phone.

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11:01I don't, but like, let's say I wanted to wear a Lycra fitted dress. The Fitz Everybody skims underwear would look great under that. I obviously am not wearing a Lycra completely fitted dress, but you know, I still want not, I don't want to have granny underwear. So that's one thing. And then the other thing is they have a, like a bra that is supportive, but it doesn't have underwire. And for a gal who likes to be cozy, relaxed at home, And also I work from home so much of the time. I just want to be comfortable, but I also don't want to look sloppy. So those are my two pitches for the Fits Everybody collection.

11:41Shop Skims Fits Everybody at skims.com. And then after you place your order, if you are in the mood, be sure to let them know that I sent you. Just select podcast in the survey and then say Raising Good Humans in the dropdown menu that follows. And if you're looking for the perfect gift for everyone on your list, the Skims Holiday Shop is now open at skims.com. I think there's a way as a parent to look at this and go, how can I make sure that this never happens to my child and that I see every sign and that I am, you know, asking the right questions and looking and connecting and all of that. I think there's also a way to look at it and say, I cannot, I could do all of the things, all of the things and stuff is going to happen.

12:28And so how can, in the context of terrible trauma, how can that relationship protect my child? Like, I would rather prevent trauma. Like we all would rather prevent. And you can decide whether you want to go into that. Well, I was going to say for the listener to just to ground them over. Thank you. And no, just the idea that we're talking around this. And yes, I wrote a book about, you know, on one hand, I wrote a book that is about trauma. I talk about trauma, deep trauma that I ensued from the hands of sexual abuse for many years by a teacher in middle school that I never disclosed to anyone.

13:12But on the other hand, what I, and then I had part of the book is also that I've written this crime thriller that I didn't realize I was living in. And that's why you said you wanted to keep reading and you wanted to keep reading. Well, trying to recognize too, I was writing this as it was going on. So I too wanted the answer. I wanted the answer and I wanted to tie it up with a bow and I wanted to be able to go to my children and tell them that I'd solved this mystery such that I can say I'm the perfect parent and this is what happens when you do the right thing. And I wasn't getting that. And so I was trying to sort of do two things at once, which was to solve this crime novel, crime mystery, wasn't a novel, it happened.

13:49And to solve this mystery at the same time that I was trying to take care of my family and myself and do the reparenting and the rebecoming and the surrender and all the things that were happening. And I think that the gift to me around the idea that I could not pursue criminal justice of this person because of the statute of limitations loophole was actually, I can't say it was a gift because I'm not glad it happened, but I did go in and refocus of how I really was going to move forward. And that was really only investigating myself. And so many things have happened just in my relationship with my children.

14:24I mean, the idea of my children, my family, that was really the catalyst of a lot of this was that my daughters, this is the funniest story too. One of the stories was recently my daughter, who was the one that was 10 at the time, who's just like totally five steps ahead of me. She, in the book, I'll tell you in the book, she comes to me and says, mom, we really don't know you. You know, we want to really know you. We know, we think you're perfect, but we want to know you and understand you. And we don't know who you are. And it was a very difficult moment. I went to my room, slammed the door.

14:51John was like, what just happened? That was a moment of me recognizing that I needed to either listen to what she was saying or just keep going as I was. And if I was going to keep doing that, then there was going to be problems. So I listened to that thread of that 10-year-old. That's where she was parenting me. But it's funny because she came to me and said, Mom, I have a notice on my phone if you get a bad review. And I said, well, I haven't read any reviews because I can't take the reviews in. It's too hard for me. That's not why I wrote it. And she said, well, I get one. And you got this review.

15:22And I looked at it and it said, there's no way that a 10-year-old would have said any of these words. And so I found her and I looked her up. And I don't know, she DMed her or whatever she did. And I said, I absolutely am that little girl who's now, I'm a 16. And I wrote, I said exactly what my mom said in the book. And I told this woman she should take it down. And it was just like another part of the process, right? It was another part of the believing. It was another part of what we've gone through together as a family. It was just, it was insanely beautiful. Well, it's interesting that you brought that up because I was, of course, thinking as I I was like, okay, well, how will I have a cohesive conversation with Amy about this?

16:01And we'll start with relationship. And I wanted you to tell the story of, I think, this moment of recognizing how committed you were to this relationship. But also, so the story of your daughter, which you just told, but maybe we can expand. And then also your relationship with your husband, because his response to me, there are so many moments where you're just like, relationships are supposed to be safe and you like keep having these moments where you're like you're watching in real time this this ability to keep moving forward because you have a safe harbor and we need a safe harbor and I was like kind of blown away by by that safe Harbor, allowing you the safety of, I cannot imagine having been through what you went through, having gone through what you went through, and then to have your daughter after you're like, I've spent my life being perfect to get to this point of being the perfect mother, to have you called out.

17:07So beautiful. And thank you for also saying, because you're right, this safe harbor in John. You know, I can say that my daughter was the catalyst, but not to give John too much credit because he's gotten so much credit. And what's fascinating is you're exactly right. Because in that moment, when I slammed the door and went to my room, John said to me, what are you solving for in the relationship with them? Are you solving for the relationship? Are you solving for a sense of control? And he pulled that thread in me that I maybe would never have pulled. And maybe that is going back to my conservatives or Southern upbringing from, you know, in the eighties, the eighties in Texas, which I loved where I'm from, but I have my certain ways as I talk about it in the book, the salt and pepper must go around the table together at all times.

17:53Now I'm getting more comfortable with the salt might go around the table without, without the pepper. And those were just things that were ingrained in me and were part of the culture. And whether it was that, or it was on that plus my trauma, I think John started to help me pull at those threads to understand, you know, to look at my parenting style and recognize what are you solving for? The control factor. He was the one that was noticing the control in my parenting style. And I love to say this too, because the night after the book launched and Oprah did this, ah, surprise, Oprah, like came on stage and it was amazing and surreal and still is.

18:29And I kind of still wake up and think, did that happen? But I went up to my 12-year-old's room and I said, Julian, you know, I realized you were seven when I wrote this book. And he said, Mom, that was great. It was just great. So great. And he was smiling ear to ear. And I'd really never had such in-depth conversations with him about the book. And then I said, but how did you feel about all of it? He said, you know, I never realized you had that conversation with my sisters about wanting to know you better. And, you know, I never knew that that story took place. and I realized I'd never told him.

19:02And even in the writing of the book of the five years, because he's going on with his life and I'm processing as I'm writing. But then I said to him, well, Julian, what do you think about the book? Would you think about maybe reading it? Because you were also too young to read at the time. You couldn't read the book. Would you mind when I read it? And he turned to me and he just casually in the way that we know his parenting said, oh yeah, mom, I'd love to read it, but I think I'm gonna do it when I have a book report due. so I can kill two birds with one stone and I'll do you know I'll do a book report and I'll get an egg is it's your book and it'll be great and I think that I'm hoping that you would agree that that's a sign of sort of maturity in our relationship that we've gotten to a place where I was like great perfect yes we need it from you we have the heavy weight of conversations we have to have with our children and what we're going to say exactly and all of these things and all that matters is that he's like, yeah, yeah, yeah.

19:58I feel safe enough to have this conversation and also to tell you, I'm gonna kill two birds with one stone. He's not ruminating. He's like, because he's allowed to just like, this is just out there. It's amazing. And I also said to him in that moment, I said, have people talk to you about my book? And he said, my friends asked me what it's about. And I said, it's about memory. and you know, your life. And I said to him, and it was this opportunity for me to say, which I feel like this is the crux of all of it, right? Is I said to him, Julian, you can go and say anything you want to anyone about the book.

20:37You can tell them exactly how you feel. There's nothing that's off limits. You can talk to them about any part of the story that you feel that makes you comfortable. If it's uncomfortable, you can tell them it makes you uncomfortable. And so we were able to have that conversation too, which was just amazing. And now for a quick break. Bobby's USDA organic European inspired infant formulas are so awesome. I definitely wish Bobby had been around when I had babies. I so also love that they support breastfeeding moms, formula feeding moms, combo feeding moms, backup in the pantry formula moms, like whatever you're going for feeding your babies, they're supporting you.

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24:23But now how do you take that and parent forward? I laugh only because the same night that I went to see one of the girls and I said, how'd you think the night went? She said, it was great. It was great. But now you got to live by those words. And so right back in it, you know, just right back in the throes of parenting of like that push pull of what's important and what are you solving for? And, you know, I think that my kids, I have asked them, I asked Gracie, I said, what has changed? Have you noticed in the last five years? And she said, well, you become a lot less reactionary. So when I slam doors to get your attention, you don't come upstairs to have a conversation with me.

25:05I wouldn't even say yell because I was never a yeller anyway. I didn't yell at my kids, but it hurts me less. I can also recognize that in many ways, 13, 14, 15, 16 year old slamming a door is also what a 13, 14, 15, or 16 year old probably is meant to be doing in that moment in their life. And it's not a product of something that I have caused or a friction in our relationship. So I see so much more. It could also just be with the age of my kids and maturity of myself. And I think that was part of the, you know, this process of coming forward with all of this is like a maturity of confidence in myself and being able to give myself permission.

25:46I use permission, compassion a lot. Like a lot of things can be solved with permission, compassion. And, and in parenting, a lot of it can be solved with humor. I mean, we use a lot of humor, a lot of humor these days. And, you know, a lot of humor more, I write in the book about sort of my daughter's outfits, like things coming in little packages and I can't tell if they're a skirt or a shirt. And I used to like panic and feel a dread. And now I've come to really understand that in paying and moving forward, that what my children wear is not a sign of reflection of who they are. And maybe it's their reflection of who they want to be that day or that night or whatever it is, but that that's also not a measure of safety.

26:28And it's also not a value that they're based on depending on how short the skirt is, right? Or how clunky the boot. Right. And, you know, I wonder in thinking about like how you regulate yourself, because I think you found a lifetime of regulating yourself in a way that maybe looked super healthy and adaptive, but was hurting you. And now are you finding that in those moments when you're challenged, like with the, you know, You could see a world where you see those, nobody can see us, but I'm imagining like a two-inch skirt. But when you see those things, but like you see those things and they could trigger.

27:13And trigger, we don't use lightly because it's been overused, but these are officially appropriate ways of thinking about how one could be triggered. That you have to reckon with raising adolescent girls. You have to reckon with raising adolescent girls and also regulate yourself so that you're raising them and not the version of them that you experienced. Thank God. But also, how do you find that you've shifted how you regulate? How do you figure out what feelings emerge in you to decide, like, how am I responding? Is it, you know, am I overcorrecting? Am I, you know, what happens for you? Are you doing sort of like, just letting go of this?