20 Rental Units with a Full-Time Job & 7 Kids: She Did It in 5 Years!

22:48You want to make sure your tents are happy because you don't want to allow it to be a similar situation, and also because you want to make sure your assets taken care of. But you also want to make sure it's fair from a landlord perspective that you're seeing that they're saying that they're renting quickly, they're getting their statements on time, things like that. From there, I talked to the property managers and I talk to them and say, hey, I'm looking to buy a near area. I want to make sure I buy an asset that works for you just as well as it works for me. So what areas do you not manage in?

23:20And which do you manage in? And the best property managers actually have an answer for where they won't manage because they have enough business that they don't need to deal with the areas that are more sketchy where you might not want. If you're going D-class neighborhood investing, that's fine. But you workforce housing, normally like a C-class neighborhood, is a very good option for cash flow and also safety perspective. And so that or higher, you know, you'll talk to them. And I've had many a property manager say, you want to invest east of this street, south of this street, right behind this hospital, not this hospital.

23:53And so it really gives you a view and they really appreciate that because they, everyone I've talked to says they hate when they meet a great owner and they say, here's, here's the property I want you to manage. And they have to tell them no, because it's something that they don't want to manage. And so from there, I went into that first market, but that one was actually slightly different. I actually was on the BiggerPockets forums and found an investor-friendly realtor who happened to be in that market. And I did cross-reference with the property manager the way that I mentioned for a property that he brought to my attention, which this is the only one I've bought that was not on the MLS, but every single other one has been on the MLS.

24:36And so this was just a pocket listing that he had that they were going to be listing in his particular realty group. And it was interesting because it went from these dream tenants to these individuals. One side of this duplex, it was a nice, pretty turnkey rental. But one side we knew that was under market rents and the other side had been two months behind on rent. And so we knew it was likely an eviction. and for me I felt decently comfortable because it was not even a$200 ,000 house and because of my income and my husband's income I'm like okay we can push through this a little bit especially because I talked to the property manager and they were like hey I think it's like 350 bucks that pays for the lawyer to file the paperwork they give the notices go to court do the whole process for me.

25:31And again, this is where picking markets really matters because there's some states that make it very quick and easy to, you hope to never have to evict somebody. But if you pick a more landlord friendly state, it makes it a lot easier than if you pick another market. So if you're in some markets, it might take six months in this particular market, you can normally do it within a month and a half from those not paying. So I talked to the property manager and they made me feel a lot more comfortable about it. And I talked to my husband and he's like, Hey, if you feel you can stabilize this, I'm down to try it.

26:03Real Estate Rookie:Angela, what a difference from deal number one to deal number two. So just for context, you guys live in Utah and the market that you chose was Ohio for the second deal, right? Got it. So I appreciate you walking us through the process of like, Hey, here are the data points that I looked at. But I would assume that again, looking at a map of the United States, There's like 20 ,000 cities. There were probably hundreds, if not thousands of other cities across the country that were maybe similar to Ohio in terms of like what it offered. So how did you actually come to the conclusion that Ohio was the right market out of the 20 ,000 potential options that are out there?

26:41Real Estate Rookie:Because I think that's where most people get stuck. They understand the process of like funneling the list down, but actually get into the point where they can make a decision to say, okay, this is the city that I want to focus on. That's where they struggle. So walk us through that step there. How did you get to the point where you felt confident enough to say, I'm going to ignore everything else and focus on Ohio? So for me, is there enough population there is huge. Secondly, is there reasons that people either stay there or like stay in that area or is it growing? And so what I tend to look for, you know, like I said, I crush review, I tend to look through the 510 top size cities and then do my calculations from there.

27:22But then from there, looking like I'm saying these different aspects. Also, I look at the general safety of the area because that's something that matters, right? Especially as people are trying to, I tend to buy two, three, four bedroom homes. And so that's something that you're going to have families. And so they're going to want to make sure it's safe kind of locations. And so if the trajectories, it's pretty stable or it's a little bit, you know, getting better from like crime perspective. then that's something that's a good indicator as well. Additionally, when I think about markets, I think it's important to think about your investing in real estate is similar to a stock portfolio.

28:05So this is something, I think I might've heard it on one of the Bigger Pockets podcasts, but I really like this idea of portfolio architecture. So for example, we have a couple here in Utah of rentals and that is more of an appreciation play. They give a little bit of cashflow. I mean, the first one more so, but it's a little bit of cashflow, but it's more, Hey, this is going to appreciate over time. So these are more of the appreciation play like the, that you're hoping for. So Ohio to me, when we went into that and looking at the appreciation of the homes versus the cashflow potential, I looked at that as more of like middle of the road type of stock, essentially where it's going to have cashflow.

28:43It's going to have a little bit of appreciation, but it's kind of a nice blend. And then as I looked at different markets, I was like, well, well, I still want to get some cash cows, as it were, you know, that just truck along and just give you some good cash. We'll appreciate, but maybe not as much as, say, like a Utah. And so that's where I went and found my Indiana market. So it's really where you are in your investing journey, as well as helping even out the risk, because it's been funny looking at my investment portfolio during coronavirus from 2021 to now, where some properties, I mean, even some of my cash cow area, they've actually been appreciating quite a lot.

29:22And I did not anticipate that. And my rents are going up and then it's slowed down a little bit. And then another market I'm in Indiana, actually, I thought that was gonna be pretty stable over time for the rents. And then those started ticking up. And so it's just interesting because I think it helps you both even at your risk, as well as help you know where maybe you want to start your journey, depending on what your goals are. Are you talking a 30-year time horizon that you're thinking through or are you talking more 5 to 10-year? That's going to decide a lot differently as to when you're looking through the markets, what makes the most sense.

29:58Real Estate Rookie:Now, Angela, you've also had a really good strategy of looking at listings on the MLS and determining that there may actually be something inaccurate with this listing. And this specifically happened in a property in Indiana. Anna. So can you kind of break down what you noticed and what was the outcome of this property? This property I love so much because this just goes to prove, again, MLS, you know, people are not perfect. And so maybe things get listed wrong or maybe details are missed. Pictures aren't uploaded that you can find pictures elsewhere on the internet. So in this case, this is a property that had one photo.

30:38Actually, let me back up. So this property is one that I'd been looking and looking, running numbers on a lot of properties. And you kind of, if you've ever tried to underwrite properties, you sometimes get desperate. You go and you're like, I need to buy something. I want to buy something. And so you kind of go back around. You're like, maybe the house is okay. Maybe I can figure it out. And so I went back to this particular one and I happen to, a lot of times in a lot of markets, if there's people that are tenants in it, they won't have inside pictures. but life hack if you go and you take that address and try to put it into google or your search engine of choice and put that address and say for rent a lot of times the property managers might have interior pictures from his last trying to be rented on apartments.com or especially if it's a duplex it might have property pictures from separate listings like the different unit numbers on zillow so you can actually see interior pictures and so i saw some interior pictures and I thought they looked really nice.

31:43And so, whereas people might've looked at the outside, just a normal brick duplex, might not that much. I'm like, the inside looks pretty decent. And so I looked at the notes on the listing again, and it had said that each head of this duplex was a two bedroom and a three bedroom. And that the rents were something like 650 and 750. And even for this market, that seemed quite low versus, cause I already had a couple of rentals in that area. and but conveniently it said this property is managed by and it was actually my property manager so I thought oh I'm gonna call them and ask them why you know it's the rent so low so I talked to the property manager and I talked to her and I was like hey this property I'm interested in she's oh yeah that one and I was like given that it's a two and three bedroom why is it rented for so low and she goes I'm sorry what she goes that's a three and a four bedroom and mind you this house for perspective, if this is a three and four bedroom, this house was listed just shy of like 150 ,000.

32:41If it's truly a three and four bedroom, it's a$200 ,000 house. And so I was like, wait, are you sure? She goes, girl, I actually walked that property. I'm the one that took the photos when I was the one that got it rented. And I was so excited. Then that suddenly I was like, well, then why is it a three and a four bedroom? Are you renting it for 650 and 750? And she's like, where are you getting these numbers? And I said, what's on the listing? She goes, I don't know who put that in, but the rents are$9.95 and$1 ,125. So you're talking a difference of$1 ,400 versus$2 ,120. And so I was so excited.

33:16And so I immediately went to go negotiate on it. And funny enough, it was something that I got the details on what happened because it was actually my realtor. It was their broker who had listed it. And apparently there was an investor who was like, I'm important. I want the broker only to list it. And so the broker's busy, you know? And additionally, apparently whenever this, cause I didn't tell my realtor until we got under contract cause I didn't want it to blow up. Right. And so once I got under contract, I told him he thought it was hilarious. And afterwards, after the whole deal closes, he hassled his broker about it.

33:57The broker said, Hey, I was just going off of what the owner told me. So the owner didn't even know his own property. And so he listed it and priced it accordingly. No one walked the property to verify this. So I ended up getting a killer deal. And additionally, when they were going through for the inspection, there were some things where there's tenant rights that, I mean, it was the middle of Indiana winter. It was like December. And one of the furnaces wasn't working and the electricity to the upper stairs, upper area of one of the duplexes didn't have any electricity. They were running lights up and like toilets weren't working and they were still paying rent.

34:37And I wrote back, I'm like, you guys have to fix some of these things. These are like living rights. Like if you're a tenant and they're really unhappy with it, but I'm like, this is not even a me thing. This is like a legal thing. And so ultimately on top of getting a killer price on the house versus what it could have sold for, we got about$10 ,000 of repairs of a new furnace, electricity fixed, new toilets put in, all these kinds of things. So this went and was a property that cash flowed us just shy of$600 a month on it. And then now we've raised rents and everything. And so we're actually at a 23 % cash on cash return on that home.

35:21Real Estate Rookie:I think the lesson here for rookie investors, and I'm curious if you'd agree, Ash, for you as well, because obviously you bought a bunch of long-term rentals as well, is that sometimes the listings that you might question like, oh, it's only got one photo, this must be a terrible listing. Or, man, this has been listed on the market for 389 days, right? It must be a bad listing. Sometimes those turn out to be the absolute best deals. And I think if there's a lesson for the rookie audience, it's don't take anything in face value. And exactly like you did, Angela, can you dig a little bit deeper to understand, is there something to uncover here that allows us to manufacture a much better deal?

36:03Real Estate Rookie:So, man, what an incredible story. So, Angela, obviously an incredible deal here on the duplex. But as you found markets that have worked and you want to keep growing your portfolio, I think a question that a lot of rookie listeners have is, how do I keep scaling? Like, where is this money coming from? Because maybe I pull all my money and dump it into deals one and maybe number two. And like, how do I keep going? So how did you use your existing homes to create ways to fund the next purchase? Yeah. So that's something that I now advise everybody on of how we've been investing, because this is something where Home Equal and Accredit, incredibly useful.

36:42So for listeners, many are probably familiar, but just to kind of quick level set, a lot of times I've talked to people, they're like, oh, to get money out of my house, I have to go and refinance the house to get the money out. But maybe they have a lower interest rate, so they don't want to do that. They're like, oh, my gosh, that's going to be a whole thing. Or they think they have to get a home equity loan, which is the difference basically between your current normal mortgage to what it's worth now. And so that can work. But the thing that I didn't like about that idea was that, again, it took me a year and a half to find my first real purchase deal of an investment property.

37:18So during that time, I'd be paying back principal and interest, therefore dwindling my stockpile of money. additionally if i had cash from my normal w2 or cash flow to pay down that that home equity loan that's something that it's not changing my payment every month and so i didn't love that i did and so that's where i learned about the home client of credit which is essentially kind of like a credit card on your house but at a lot more affordable rate so in the case of my home client of credit now i'm getting loans for example investor loans dscr type loans under llcs for about seven percent interest right now.

37:54And my home Atlanta credit is only like a 775. So it's a very manageable type of rate. And I tend to like home Atlanta credits, HELOCs, that are interest only payments, have as long of a draw period as I can, and then have at least like a 20 year repay on the back end. Now there's nuance to you can do another home Atlanta credit before I have to do the repay period. But in essence, what's fantastic about this is if you do it on your primary home, it's something where a lot of times it can be something like in my case on our primary, I'm able to do a hundred percent loan to value. So let's say for example, my house is worth 600 ,000 and my loan is say 400 ,000.

38:38So I can actually access all 200 ,000 of that availability, which I joke is kind of like monopoly money because it's only because the market says that it's worth something, but you're still living in your house. And then, but I really, my regret and in this investing is I didn't know yet more about this because you can get home like Atlanta credits on investment properties. So we did on our first home that we, the townhouse, but it only let you do an 80 % loan of value. So there's some that's locked up that I can't touch. And so anytime I've had friends that are maybe trying to do the little, I'm going to try to rent out my first house.

39:12I'm like, do not do anything until you, you get a home like a lot credit on it because there's normally not an annual fee. If it's your primary home, usually you don't have any payment to get one put on. And so even if you never touch it, at least it's in case of emergencies or whatnot, or even if you don't ever invest. But in the case of us, we got it afterwards, we got on the investment property, and then we have it on our primary home. And so what's been great about that is it lets us be able to not feel under pressure to buy a home because money's ticking out of our bank account every month.

39:44It's ready to go when we're ready to buy a home. We go and use that for down payments. And then with the cash flow that we get in, we suck that towards paying down the loan, which then is nice because then your monthly payments ticking down every month as well. And then obviously two plus our W2 income, we're putting that into it. And then, so therefore you're buying into days dollars instead of having to save up for the next down payment that might take you a year or two. So you're able to buy that property and then just sock down till you have more availability and then you go buy the next property.

40:17So that's kind of how we've been doing investing. So, again, this is something, again, almost every single property I bought is on the MLS and using money that's just in your normal home. So you don't have to have some high income, high income kind of job or anything. and additionally when you're thinking about what houses to get this is something that I've tried to tell others too because every property that I've bought I've always underwritten that HELOC payment is part of that so like for example a house might be 16 % cash on cash return after I pay off the HELOC but in the interim so maybe let's say afterwards let's say it's I could do$350 a month in cash flow but even considering property management mowing fees, mortgage payment interest, all of that, and the HELOC payment, instead of maybe$350, I'm still cash flowing$200.

41:14That's still money that just because I had equity in my house that I've leveraged, I'm still cash flowing over top of that. So it's something that's even more comfortable for us to feel to invest because it's something where you're able to have even cash flow using money that you didn't even have to save up for.

41:31Real Estate Rookie:Angela, I think that's a really big question for rookie investors is, but how do I pay the HELOC back? And you just said it right there. You work it into your numbers. So when you're analyzing the deal, you're basically putting in there that you have two mortgage payments on this property. You're factoring in the first mortgage that's on the property and then your HELOC that you're going to be paying back and see, do the numbers still work? and Tony and I actually both did this on properties. We both are turning primary residents into rental properties, but before we're moving out and into a new primaries, we put HELOCs on.

42:09Real Estate Rookie:And I think another thing you mentioned that is really important to listen to is that it should be free to do this. A lot go to local banks, credit unions, things like that. I don't know about bigger national banks. It's normally those lower ones that get you those deals. They'll cover the appraisal fee. There's no closing costs, nothing. Like I didn't pay anything. If I close the loan, if I close the line of credit in three years, I will have to pay like$1 ,300 or something like that is the fee they will charge because I haven't banked enough interest for them to accumulate because I closed the loan.

42:50Real Estate Rookie:So that's the only thing. and I just had to sign a document saying if I close in three years, this is what I will have to pay to do it. In comparison to going and refinancing your actual property, you're probably going to pay a new appraisal. You're going to pay a commitment fee. You're going to pay closing costs, you know, all these different things to have it done where with the HELOC, you shouldn't be paying anything. So if you're getting charged to do your HELOC, make sure you shop around and find it for free. I did one that was for six months, I think like 4.99%. And then it will change to whatever the variable rate is probably around seven to 8%.

43:30Real Estate Rookie:Tony, what about you? Did you get any kind of introductory rate on yours? Yeah, same. I want to say it was like five and some change for the first six months. And then yeah, it goes variable. But to your point, exactly, Ash, like we pulled the HELOC on the current primary before we're moving out here in like, you know, three weeks or so. So I think it's one of the best tools. And we've interviewed a lot of people who have kind of repeated that same process of turning their primaries into rentals. And that's how they build their entire portfolio. So it's your current house, assuming that you're willing to accept some of that risk, I think could be one of the best tools to help a rookie investor actually get started as a real estate investor.

44:05Real Estate Rookie:And you guys coming soon, Tony's first long-term rental in a long time. We got to do like a debrief once we get it up and running. Well, guys, don't go anywhere. Angela's going to close out with an unusual short-term rental that most lenders would not touch. The simple questions that unlocked both financing and insurance and the tenant placement that brought her story full circle. We'll be back in a minute. Nobody has a perfect plan when they start a business. I sure didn't. I just had an idea and a lot of nerves. And between t-ball games, weddings, and whatever chaos summer throws at you, there's genuinely never a good time to sit down and figure it all out.

44:44Real Estate Rookie:That's honestly the best thing about Shopify. You don't need a free weekend and a computer science degree to get something live. My go live day is still one of my favorite memories. I picked a template, dropped in some photos, and Shopify's AI tools basically built the bones of my site for me. It looked like something I actually paid a designer for. And when a customer is ready to buy, Shopify checkout keeps it simple. Their info is saved. They checked out in one click and you get to hear that little cha-ching before you've even finished your coffee. If you're on the fence, here's my advice. Stop waiting for the perfect moment.

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47:23Real Estate Rookie:Quick note before we dive back in. This episode is brought to you by Cash App. I've been using Cash App for years to send and receive money. Sometimes I need to pay someone who doesn't take credit cards or if I want to split a check or just to pay back a friend for a shared cost. Cash App also helps me online shop safely. More investors are thinking about where Bitcoin fits into a broader portfolio, not as a short-term trade, but as long-term exposure to an asset that behaves differently from traditional markets. Cash App makes that kind of Bitcoin strategy more straightforward. You can buy Bitcoin directly in the app, set up recurring purchases, or make larger buys when it makes sense for you.

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48:42Real Estate Rookie:That's exactly what Rent to Retirement does. They're a full-service, turnkey investment company handling everything for you. In some cases, investors get 50 % to 75 % of their down payment back at closing, plus interest rates as low as 3.75%. They've partnered with BiggerPockets for over a decade, helping thousands invest smarter. If you want to do the same, visit biggerpockets.com slash retirement to learn more. All right, guys, welcome back. So Angela, your portfolio now includes nine properties and 20 doors across multiple states. But let's look at the newest strategy, the one that you're building toward and what the journey has meant beyond the numbers.

49:19Real Estate Rookie:So your newest property is very different from the rest of the portfolio. You decided to pivot into short-term rentals in Arizona. What made that feel like a compelling opportunity for you? And speaking of financing, how did you get that first deal financed? So this is something where I guess important to note is I started with just normal single family duplexes. I then try to graduate up. My husband and I realized, hey, this is fine, but we could move bigger quicker if we bought bigger properties. So we went and got an eight plex in Indiana. So I felt like that was a baby step to getting to this next step of short term rentals because that in and of itself is its own thing, how it's appraised, how it's valued running that.

50:04And I think that was important to have that step because it got me a little more brave into doing something different. And this is something where we personally have gone to many different Airbnb on family trips and have loved it. And it's something where for tax benefits, in our case, we knew it was going to be very impactful for us because I knew it was going to self-manage. And it's worked out great for that because a lot of times, I think it's worth noting, long-term rentals tend to be about a 10 % fee for property management. whereas short-term rentals often can be 20 to 25%. And I knew myself, I get too involved even during like when there's lease ups in my long-term rentals that I'm like, okay, what are we thinking?

50:43What's our interest on this yet? So I was like, oh, especially with a short-term rental, what if it's not booked? Maybe I want to have them tweak things. I'm like, for tax purposes and for my own sanity, I think it'd be good if I managed it myself. And so this is something that we were curious after we liked a certain area in Arizona. And so we decided to move forward with getting a long-term rental or sorry, a short-term rental. Now this is something that I started looking at the market. I picked another investor friendly realtor who specialized only in selling short-term rentals. And so we started talking about the different markets and looking and there wasn't anything that was really compelling yet for me.

51:21But when I opened it up, it was interesting because I happened to see one that I thought was listed wrong and it was listed as a modular home. So a little different from a mobile that it doesn't have the seams or anything. It looks very, the outside looks a little like a mobile home, but the inside looks like a normal house. And so it was listed as an eight bedroom, five bath house. And, but it was only listed for just shy of 420 K. Whereas in that particular market, normally such a size home would be about eight to$900 ,000. And so I was pretty excited because I understand maybe because it's a modular home, that was the case.

51:56But when I looked into it more, I talked to the individuals that, you know, the 10 % down vacation home loan type of people that I'd already pre-called with. I talked about this particular property and they said, oh, we're not going to lend on it because it's over 20 years old. And I did not know this is an issue for modular homes, mobile homes, and every single lender of my normal network that I'd already pre-called with, they were like, nope, pass, pass. And so I happened to know there was another group that was looking to buy this home. And so I had to move quick. And then I thought, I'm like, well, wait, somebody had to have lent on this because they just bought it two years prior.

52:31And so I asked my realtor to go ask, you know, hey, you know, can you see what, who they had bought it through? And so she got who they had got the loan through. And I talked to that, that particular group, never heard of this group. And I talked to them and they're like, oh yeah, we'd lent on it. We lent on it just two years ago. Yeah. I sent that man 45 different documents to prequel that day so I could get the prequel letter to go and offer on it. And I did the same life hack for that for the insurance because I asked for some insurance and it was just over the no flood zone. So it was like a hundred year flood risk.

53:09So it wasn't too big of a deal. But a lot of people are like, because it's modular, because it's in this little bit of a flood zone, we won't do it. And I was like, well, it worked for the loan, let's ask for this. I had found one insurance group that was going to do the insurance on it. But when I did and checked with the group that they're already with, doing so saved me like $1 ,000 a year. And so I was so excited that I just copied their homework and I was able to do the loan on the deal. And just like earlier, we talked about the 1 % rule with normal long-term rentals. With the short-term rentals, the idea is 20 % rule.

53:46If you look at any of the short-term rental calculators out there for your particular area. The idea being if you buy a$500 ,000 house, you want to find one that gets about a hundred thousand gross, because that's going to be including cleaning fees, platform fees, things like that. And this is something where it had been running as a very sad looking Airbnb prior to me. I'm talking very cheap linens, very towels weren't matching. They were trying to charge hundreds of dollars a night, not varied pricing. And they had cups from like T-ball team, 1995, like in the cupboards. And so they had in the prior year, according to the data I obtained, had got about 68 ,000 in rents, which still fair, given what they were offering.

54:34I came in, put tons of themed, like tactfully themed decor. Or it's Arizona, you know, you've got to have the nice kind of native type rugs and bulls and just cacti and just lots of art pieces. And from all of that, better photos, dynamic pricing, really good hospitality, really have a lot of automation set up that makes it really good, too. Whereas they had only got about 68 ,000 this year already, and we still have more of the year to go for the year's bookings. I have$97 ,000 on the books. so we're at something like 23 or so rule right now and so again we still have more time to go so it's crushing it we've loved it and it's just something where because i'm able to provide a premium service but my house is half the cost of my competitors i'm able to be a more affordable choice so affordable plus a premium feel great reviews and get tons of bookings from that which means that we've been able to really succeed in that and have a lot of fun with us as a family, that it fits all of us even.

55:42Real Estate Rookie:Angela, incredible story. But I think the biggest lesson that I want rookies to take away from hearing that is that you talk to all the lenders that you already knew, and all of them said no. And then you talk to one person and immediately they're like, oh yeah, we do those kind of loans all day. And I think that's the biggest thing is that oftentimes rookies can get fixated on one no from one person and think that everyone's going to have that same response, but different lenders focus on different things. And there are some lenders for whatever reason that won't touch modular homes. And there are probably other lenders out there who like 90 % of their businesses is modular homes.

56:15Real Estate Rookie:And they're like the modular home lending people that everyone goes to. So as you're searching for and hunting for lenders specifically, don't stop until you get the answer that you're looking for, because I guarantee there's someone out there who will lend on the type of property. Now, will the rates and the terms maybe be a little bit different? probably, but at least they're willing to give you what it is you're looking for. So don't stop with the first no. Keep checking along until you get the person who actually understands the asset that you're trying to buy. Well, and I think to your point, I think something people need to think about is that interest rate is higher, but the number still worked out for me.

56:47And I think that's another thing too. A lot of people, even in this current climate, they talk about the higher interest rates and they're waiting for the interest rates to come down to buy. But yet it was not but a few years ago that people were saying the house prices are too expensive. So they didn't want to buy. And so that's something I think so incredibly important to think about. Really, I always like to use the seesaw analogy. So if you think about at the end of the day, you have the house price and you have interest rate. And at the end of the day, it tends to be like this in the marketplace, but holding it all together, holding it up is a number.

57:20So that could be$2 ,600, for example, how much somebody can afford, like in a normal traditional home, for example, like a single family home. Or in your case, what number you need that to be to be able to make it cash flow. So at the end of the day, it doesn't matter. Like right now I'm buying homes. That particular home was like a 775 interest rate. And I just bought a single family home in Indiana a few months, two months earlier for like a six and a half percent interest rate. So that hurt a little bit, but my numbers still made sense. And in this particular case and where we are in the economy, me, if you buy the higher interest rate, but your numbers still work now, you have the chance to, if the interest rates drop eventually, you can actually refinance and actually benefit from that lower price.

58:05Obviously, make sure they work today, but it's something where it's not something you need to be scared about buying in today's current interest rate environment or that particular deal. In my case, where I was like, oh, that hurts. Again, if the deal works for you, it works.

58:17Real Estate Rookie:Well, Angela, thank you so much for joining us today to share your story, share your experience and the lessons learned along the way. Where can people reach out to you and find out more information? Yeah. So I mean to get actual investing Instagram up or whatnot, but you can feel free to reach out to me on Bick or Pockets under Angela Wassum. Additionally, you can email me at Angela.N as in Nicole.Wassum at gmail.com. But yeah, happy to answer any questions people might have. And good luck investing. And I hope everybody actually jumps into it because it genuinely is life changing for, in my case, myself and those my generations to come.

58:59Real Estate Rookie:And I think that's why it's so impactful to have other rookie investors onto the show to share their journey that is achievable. And I mean, just as you said it, like it is life changing. I think Tony and I can both agree with that, that real estate has also changed our lives drastically. And I think too, in wrapping, I wanna just mention, it is such a amazing thing what you can do when you actually jump into investing because I grew up in HUD housing and one of my most impactful moments of investing was when I had a rental that I was having a HUD housing, a section eight voucher individual trying to apply through.

59:38And it was a gal with some kids and we accepted her and she's still there. She's been there a few years. and I remember when he accepted her, I started crying because here's this full circle moment where I grew up in that kind of household and now I get to provide a clean, safe environment for that group, that family and her kids and again, you can make the difference both for your family as well as other families out there depending on how you are as an investor. So it really makes your life and others totally changed.

1:00:08Real Estate Rookie:Well, Angela, thank you so much for joining us. everyone thank you for listening if you're not already make sure you are subscribed to our youtube channel at real estate rookie you can also find us on instagram at biggerpockets rookie i'm ashley he's tony and we'll see you guys on the next episode