Making $25,000/Year Cash Flow by Buying the Worst Rental on the Best Block

21:55Tony Robinson:again is now I have more wholesaler connections that I've actually met through this process in this deal and I would probably just go directly to the wholesalers I've known and met over the time

22:04Ashley Kehr:Another easy way, if you're like me and very introverted, is just Google sell my house fast in Buffalo, New York, and you will get all of the wholesalers' websites that come up. And you just, instead of wanting to sell your house to them, you say you want to be put on their buyer's list too. Now, Alex, you had a rental budget. You said that they told you initially 100, but then you said, hey, let's shoot for like 125. Did you actually hit that number of 125?

22:32Tony Robinson:No, we ended up with furniture, which is a different story because I got a lot of stuff on online auctions, which I highly recommend. That is like the biggest rookie tip I would give to anybody is see if there's any online Amazon return auctions that you can buy literally a whole house of stuff on. But we were all in around$200 ,000. Okay. I want to go back to 200K because that's obviously more than what you had projected. But tell me about this Amazon online auction. I haven't heard of this before. Someone who furnishes a lot of property. Yeah, there's two. I mean, there's two I would mostly use.

23:07Tony Robinson:So high bid.com. If you go there, there's like, you know, all kinds of auctions on there. And then auction hub, Texas, which is obviously I'm in Dallas, which has a lot of building material auctions. So anytime somebody returns something to Home Depot or Lowe's, or sometimes even Costco, they've Costco auctions on there, that stuff does not get restocked. It goes to like on a pallet and gets sold off for pennies on the dollar. And then these are the auction sites that they then take that stuff, disassemble it in a warehouse. You go get a box truck like my husband and I rented and you go pick up a bathtub and a whole bunch of other stuff for, you know, a quarter of what you would pay at Home Depot for it.

23:52Tony Robinson:It definitely is like the time money balance. So do you have more time or do you have more money? Because it definitely takes a lot more time. But at that moment, we were really sweating, sweating bullets with the amount of money that we were burning onto this renovation. And so we were like, what can we possibly do to cut some costs? Probably the best one I found was a, and I met, I met, I also met a ton of fun people along the way, and that's the joy you have to find in some of this. But, um, I met a guy who had bought a warehouse, like bought a building and it was filled to the brim with light fixtures.

24:29Tony Robinson:So it was like, had been a lighting company, I believe beforehand. And they were high end light fixtures. And so I bought them, I bought the entire house, like all the lighting, like beautiful designer light fixtures for like 20 bucks a piece, you know, just all kinds of things, um, that I was able to save money through that and really kind of elevated the property, honestly, more than I would have if I would have just stuck with like, I don't even know, Home Depot and Amazon or Lowe's or wherever you buy things.

24:56Ashley Kehr:You can't even buy a standard boob light for$50 or$20 anymore.

25:02Tony Robinson:I love the hunt of it too. I think that brings me joy. So I'm on the high bid website and I would encourage all of our rookies to at least go check it out because there's categories of virtually everything. There's sporting goods, normal toys that seems normal consumer electronics but then there's also boats and aviation uh construction and farm uh real estate even this is this is pretty cool i've never bought anything from an auction so i'll just go go and check that out um but let's go back then alex to the actual rehab itself so you know you budgeted 125 it's still ballooned to 200 where were some of the maybe the the gotchas that uh kind of pushed the budget up yeah so um part of this you know i'll start at the beginning of the the condition of the house like i said was was very very rough um the first day i walked in it was filled filled to the brim so she was essentially kind of a hoarder and um we spent six that sixty five hundred dollars in trash removal and dumpsters throughout the, the, the level, like the, the time of the process.

26:08Tony Robinson:So, um, you know, immediately we got in there, we got, you know, as we are like, we closed and I drove over there to meet the, the junk removal guy, because time was like a really big factor in all of this. Um, so the initial, you know, initial walkthrough really after we had removed the junk and I could see it, there were, um, fleas everywhere. Uh, I had to go home and put on my rubber boots and truly like should have had a hazmat suit, honestly, in there. The previous owner had been cooking out of the fireplace. And so the, the smoke from that was just in all of the insulation, all of the drywall, we, we had to, we could have saved some of it and, but we just made the decision of just, it's a short-term run all.

26:51Tony Robinson:If there's any type of scent there, people will complain. So that was a, that was a pretty big whopper of just removing all of the drywall and all of the, the insulation, the HVAC system, and then all of the duct work all had to be replaced as well. Some of that was due to the fire. And then some of it was just damage again from like cooking in the fireplace. And then there was a sunken living room, which I work in insurance. I know all about liability and people love to sue. And so that was something that I just knew couldn't stay. And so we had to get an engineer and figure out how to fill in the sunken living room, which again, as a rookie, I was like, Oh, you just throw some concrete in there and that'll be fine.

27:39Tony Robinson:Um, no, that is too heavy for the foundation. And so we had to, um, went through several different ways of thinking about it, but we ended in what we ended up doing was, um, filling it in with like sandbox sand, like the really fine sand that my kid plays with, rebarb. And then, and you fill it in mostly with that. And then leveling it with like a two inch layer basically of concrete. Maybe it's, maybe it's thicker than that. I can't remember, but that was the recommendation from the engineer so that it didn't just, I guess, be too heavy for the rest of the house. And it could all balance out.

28:19We also had to do 20 beams,

28:22Tony Robinson:for the foundation. We had to add those. That was six grand. That was like nothing compared to everything else. So it was one thing after another. We replaced about 80 % of the electrical. The house just, it was like we completely just rebuilt the house and there was really nothing that could stay. And I knew the house was bad, but I didn't know it was that bad. So those were some of the bigger ticket items. I want to talk about like budgeting and absorbing those costs. But before I get to that, Alex, I think just hearing everything that you just listed, that is a very heavy rehab job. And you work in marketing and advertising.

29:05So it's not like you have a background in construction. Does your husband work in like a trader related field?

29:11Tony Robinson:Oh, no. He's in sales. And yeah, Neither of you have like this, you know, wealth of knowledge when it comes to construction management. How the heck did you figure out executing on all those different things? Like, who was your kind of guiding hand here? Was it the contractor who was kind of like your right hand where you're working directly with subs and you guys are just like YouTube University trying to figure it out? Like, how did you not get overwhelmed and how did you identify what actually needed to be done? I really honestly, to start with, I think what gave me the most confidence is that I had worked, I've worked on events before.

29:47And so I know what a project and

29:50Tony Robinson:a budget looks like. I know I'm very used to like managing a budget and, you know, using spreadsheets and all of the above. A couple of things here. So I did buy, I think it's James Daynard's book on estimating rehab costs. Okay. So I use that. That one's Jay Scott. Jay Scott. I'm sorry. Yeah. Yeah. Jay Scott bought that. You guys told me to buy that, bought it. So I started there and we had done the renovation, um, on our primary home, which we was paid for by insurance. And so like, I had a little bit of understanding. We had a general contractor. I did get three bids, know all about the three bid process and trying to like compare and negotiate, know that from my day job.

30:32Tony Robinson:Um, so I tried to do that as much as possible, just upfront. But once we decided to go with Carla, if I'm golden builders, who I would plug because she was honestly just emotionally really there for me. She was our general contractor. I like that she was female. She worked with all of our subs, really organized everything really, really well. That I would say, like, not to be just completely biased, but like I have never worked with a contractor as organized as she was. And I do think like having a female of some of those types of things, I think sometimes helps. She was super organized with the timelines and got me everything that I needed.

31:12Tony Robinson:So that was super rare. It was also in my day job in advertising, you get to pick two of the three things, speed, good, cheap. And so we chose speed and we chose good. We did not choose cheap. And I kept having in my head this idea that every day we're not open, that's$200 in Airbnb rent that we could be obtaining. And so I just kept that in my head as just like, how can we get this done as quickly as possible? We had holding costs. We had, which I'll talk about in a second, the juggling of our borrowing against our IRAs. And so I had to get it done quickly. And so she really helped with the timeline and with managing all of these like very large things.

32:01Tony Robinson:Was she cheap? No, no, not at all. So that's just the trade-off that we made. And what about the actual funding piece, right? I mean, because you went over budget by 80 grand, give or take. How did you got, like, what was the mix of cash and other funding sources you used to actually get through the rehab? Yeah, so we really had to figure this out. as we went along. And I would say that like, that is the biggest piece of advice that I would have given to myself at the beginning of this. If I could go back and say like, it's going to be okay. So I'm 43. My husband is, um, 46 and we have, you know, we've been working in the corporate world.

32:41We have sizable IRAs, 401ks.

32:44Tony Robinson:We got, we got all the retirement stuff, you know, for somebody that has not been investing in real estate. And so, um, at the end of the day, I was just like, you know what, if we if we absolutely have to break the glass and cash out one of these things, we've got it. But it turns out we didn't we didn't have to. We just juggled it all. So we started originally with hard money, which I know, Ashley, you've said that you do not like hard money. And I do not like hard money either now after this process, because I don't like the draw process. The draw process is not in your favor. We had to basically you get reimbursed, you know.

33:18Tony Robinson:So it's like I thought they were just going to kind of write us a check for$100 ,000. If you do private lending like I would do next time, that's what happens. But you have to like wait for the inspection. And I couldn't do multiple things at the same time. Carla needed like, you know, she needs a check for like 20 grand a day or 30 grand. I was like, this is literally I'm giving you a car right now. So I was just like, I was like, how is this going to work? So we pulled a HELOC on our primary home, which was about$55 ,000, which anyway, that's another story because I should have appraised for a lot more, but it didn't.

33:57Tony Robinson:But that was fine for what we needed. So we pulled a HELOC. We used that cash and I pulled it all out. I was like, I need all of this cash right now. So pulled it out. And then we did use some of that to then pay and get access to the hard money, which we had to do in draws afterwards. Then we took a loan against my husband's 401k, which was about$33 ,000, which is probably the best tool that I didn't know about until I had to know about it. because all of the interest just goes back into his retirement fund. So he was going to be contributing last year anyway to it. Might as well use that money.

34:38Tony Robinson:And then all the interest that we're paying, which is, I don't even know, I think maybe 8 % or something like that. So if you're already going to be contributing 8 % to your 401k, you might as well borrow that money, use it if you need it. And then you're paying yourself back. And so there's like literally no downside to using that. So that was 33 ,000 of it. And then as we were kind of shifting all this money around for the hard money and for just sort of temporary, we first borrowed, you can borrow, I'm not a CPA, I'm not a whatever, but you can borrow money from your IRA as long as you pay it back within 60 days.

35:15Tony Robinson:So we borrowed$50 ,000 from my IRA and then we borrowed another$50 ,000 from my husband's IRA to pay back mine originally. So this$50 ,000 was sort of like floated for four months. And then because I knew we just have to get to the refinance, we just have to get this thing appraised and do the refinance and then we can pay all this back and get it figured out. So I was just trying to get to that end game, which I knew I could get to if we opened on November 1st and had everything set for that. So that was the juggling of it all. But all of this was just information that I honestly learned and started asking questions of our financial advisor, the establishments we have our money in, and just started asking questions.

36:05Tony Robinson:I really didn't know that we could do any of this before I started. Alex, I would think that there were maybe some folks listening whose heads are spinning a little bit with like all the different moving pieces you guys have going on with this deal. And even more so, you know, like Dave Ramsey is probably like, you know, shaking in his boots right now here and here and all that's going on right now. Now, how did you not feel fearful about what would happen if this doesn't work out the way that we want it to? Because I think that's what holds a lot of people back is they can read the books, right?

36:41They read the book on estimating rehab costs. They can find the contract. They can even find the deal. But they stop because they have this fear of what if it doesn't work out the way that it's supposed to? So with all these kind of different, you know, plates, you guys were spinning at the same time. Was there any fear around what happens if this doesn't work?

36:59Tony Robinson:There was a crippling fear to the tune of I actually lost 15 pounds like without doing anything because I was so scared the entire time. I would I was not sleeping. I, you know, it was super scared. But, you know, what I kept going back to and I'll give a big shout out to my friend Sarah Weaver, who is in the MTR space. I saw her speak at an event. It was my very first like very first event I ever went to and really identify with her. I was, you know, we have a lot in common, um, personally, but she talked about stepping into that fear and just owning the fear. And it's almost like an anxiety tool where you're just able to look at it for what it is and say, you know, this is a fear I have basically.

37:44Tony Robinson:And just saying at some point you have to make a decision in your life and you have to say, I'm going to step into this and I'm going to live my life being a little bit of fearful and having a little bit of that anxiety, but I know that I'm going to bet on myself. And there was a lot of that like self-talk. And I said to my husband at the beginning, like, I believe in you, I believe in me, and I believe in us on this. And we just kept saying that to each other over and over and over again. But yes, it was absolutely the scariest thing I think I've ever done in my entire life because the whole thing, you know, it could have appraised for way less than we thought it was going to.

38:18Tony Robinson:You know, we could have, I don't know, the whole, we were also the previous owner. was still sort of hanging around the neighborhood. And actually at the very beginning of the project, like came, came back and like broke, or I don't even know, I don't know who it was. I'm not going to assume it was her, but I'm assuming it was somebody affiliated with her, broke all the windows, you know, and got, yeah. Cause, because we cleaned this place out and I think somebody was mad about that. So, um, you know, there was, there had been drug activity at the house. Like there was just all kinds of stuff that I was afraid of, of, you know, kind of constantly afraid was going to happen.

38:52Tony Robinson:Like once we put all this drywall back up, it was this whole house going to get burned down one night. So all of that stuff definitely kept me awake at night. But like Sarah said, at some point you have to step into that fear and just bet on yourself and go for it. And I just kept saying that to myself. So I appreciate her and her that advice.

39:10Ashley Kehr:We also love Sarah and I think she's a phenomenal speaker and also investor. I can definitely resonate with that fear though. That was like one of the things that stopped me from getting started. And we always say like time, money, experience or knowledge. And then just that fear, like having the courage to actually take action. And I just thought like all these worst case scenarios. And one thing that always helps me is like, okay, what is, what is it that I'm afraid of? What will happen if that happens and how would I have to solve it? So now I have a plan in place like, okay, the roof flies off.

39:51Ashley Kehr:I'm having reserves in place to make sure my tenants are put up at a hotel. I'm contacting my insurance company and I'm putting in a claim and I'm having the roof rebuild and now I have a new roof. One thing that I've started to realize with guests on the show and just other people I've met in my life. And you seem like one of these people. I'm going to put you in this box. Laura Sides that we had on as a guest is another one. We have no real estate experience, no construction experience or anything like that. But you're willing to make the phone calls and you're willing to take action upon action until you solve the problem or figure it out.

40:31Ashley Kehr:And I had this aha moment recently when I'm purchasing a house and the owner is in assisted living and I've been dealing with his daughter. She has no real estate background. She doesn't work now. I don't know if she did at any point what her background is, but I know nothing with real estate or construction. We had some things that we wanted corrected in the inspection. Within a day, she had four different vendors lined up, scheduled, and will be at the house next week and everything will be repaired and completed. And I'm thinking like, wow, I'm really slacking. Like I can't even move that fast on things.

41:08Ashley Kehr:But it was just like she makes a decision. She takes action. She gets it done. And I think that is a more valuable tool than to actually have construction experience or knowledge that you're actually willing to take the time to figure out and make the phone calls to actually get something done.

41:28Tony Robinson:Yeah, I think to me, it's just all project management. And anybody that has any type of adjacent role in project management can do a large renovation. I think, you know, as long as you've got some type of understanding of this is what this person told me. I'm going to get a couple more quotes. I'm going to compare that. I'm going to see if that tracks. And then I'm going to move forward with one of them. So, Alex, you go through this renovation that would have scared 99 % of rookies away, but it turns into a short-term rental that you're actually running. So we want to hear about what that experience has been like right after a word from today's show sponsors.

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45:31Tony Robinson:Banking services provided by ThreadBank. Member FDIC. All right, we're back here with Alex, and we heard the story of how she found the deal, the ups and downs of renovating it. And now we're here, what happens when it actually goes live. So I guess really quickly, Alex, how long did the full renovation take? So we started June 28th and we finished the first week of October. So that renovation itself to rebuild this whole house took a little bit more than three months, which was miraculous. Yeah. For how extensive of a rehab you had to do. Yes. Then the more miraculous thing with two full-time jobs and a three-year-old, Um, my husband and I, uh, took, we took control of the property with the first week and end of the first week of October and, um, November 1st, I hit go live on, on Airbnb.

46:20Tony Robinson:And so it was, it was three weeks to get it furnished, designed all the little touches, you know, closet, closet rods, hooks, all those things. Um, in about three weeks, which was, it literally almost killed me, but we did it.

46:35Ashley Kehr:So now the question that everyone's wondering is, what is the number? Did this end up being a good deal? So your purchase price, your rehab, what did it appraise for? And what do the cash flow numbers look on it now?

46:49Tony Robinson:So we were all in, you know, around like 4.10 or so, you know, give or take a little bit. And the day before the appraisal, I did not sleep. I was prepared. So I had a full six-page document of every single upgrade that we had made on the renovation also. And that was advice that I had probably picked up from this podcast or some, one of the, one of the bigger pockets podcast was you need to be at the appraisal, the walkthrough with the appraiser. You need to present yourself as the owner, not an investor. And you need to have everything documented, which I did. And they took the information. And so I was sweating bullets.

47:35Tony Robinson:We both were because we knew it needed to appraise. Our number was, was it needed to be appraised for basically, um, four 60 or more for it to kind of all make sense for us. and that was the realistic number. There had been one other property. We actually waited for the appraisal a couple more days because there was one other property that had just sold, and so we were waiting for that to sell before we did it too, which was also highly helpful for us. It did appraise for$475 ,000, so we were able to get all our money back out and be okay, basically, with all the loans and everything we had taken out.

48:12Tony Robinson:Not all of our money we didn't get out, But like we were able to pay off all the loans and do what we needed to do with that appraisal. So that was one key. And then now where we're sitting now, so we just passed a year. Our gross revenue for the year was right around$62 ,000. And then our operating expenses were around$36 ,000. So basically we're netting around$25 ,000, which is exactly what I had expected and anticipated when I had run the numbers originally. So it wasn't this like screaming deal. I really didn't need it to be. I just needed it to not bankrupt us. And it's done pretty well. And for the most part, it's been really full.

48:58Tony Robinson:We had a six-month midterm stay almost right off the bat from exactly like our avatar, exactly who I wanted it to be. It was a family with four kids that had an insurance claim and then lived in the neighborhood. And so that told me exactly what I needed to know, which was I was right. I was right. And I knew this was going to be a great place for people that were displaced from their homes in the neighborhood. And most of the short-term stays after that, which have been, you know, anywhere between two and four days, are mostly just people visiting their family in the neighborhood. And it's really stayed consistently filled with that type of thing.

49:35Tony Robinson:It's not necessarily in a location where people who are just, like, coming to visit the Dallas area, which there's not – I'm a little biased. I don't think there's, like, a lot to do here. But I guess there's enough to do here. But it's just – it's people coming to visit their families. And that's what we built the house for. And you said, Alex, you guys grow somewhere around like 65, I think you said? Yes, around 62. Yeah, yeah, yeah. 62. So somewhere in the 60est range. And you guys are all in it 410. So that means you've got like a gross yield or I've heard people use different terms. Basically, if you divide your revenue by your purchase price, you're at about almost 16%.

50:14And what I would usually encourage folks is you want that number to be somewhere between 15 and 20. If you're at 20, it's like a screaming good deal. 15 is like a good baseline. So this is like a really, really solid first deal for you because you're like right in that sweet spot. And I think even more so, and I would assume that you guys have learned so much on this deal, that anything that comes after this is going to feel like a walk in the park because you guys did so much on this first deal. But I want to talk Alex a little bit about like the actual experience of running this short term slash midterm rental.

50:49And obviously you're a marketer focused on experiences, and I'm sure you bring that into hospitality. What kind of things have you leveraged from your day job that you brought into your short-term rental that might make you a little bit more unique as a host? Yeah, it's so fun to host because I work for

51:08Tony Robinson:Settily. I work from home for the most part. And the ability to connect with people and be there for them, whether it's just like them visiting your family and doing something really fun and extra for them. So I almost always go and I know I need to probably delegate this out, but I love doing it. I go over there and I leave them a personal note and I usually leave some type of gift. So depending on what they are coming for. So if they're coming for like, you know, some cousins or a nephew's second birthday, I'll leave them some balloons or I'll go pick up like a$5, you know, muffin situation from the grocery store that's like across the street from the property.

51:48Tony Robinson:And so I'll always go do something like that for them. And it just really brings me a lot of joy because a lot of people will always, they'll write notes. We have 100 % five-star reviews, which I'm very, very proud of, super host, all the things. Because honestly, because of that, we had, we just hosted a woman for two weeks that was recovering from a cancer, a breast cancer surgery. And a good friend of mine just went through a breast cancer, a battle with breast cancer. And so that was so meaningful because she lives far away. It was so meaningful for me to be able to be there for this woman.

52:20I went and got her extra ice.

52:23Tony Robinson:I left flowers for her. I coordinated extra with a company that delivered like a recliner specifically, you know, for people who are recovering from that surgery. And so I do, I just get a lot of joy from it. You know, apart from, from money, it is like a true creative outlet for me. The, the family that came in and stayed the very first one that we stayed, I, it was around Christmas time and I went and got gingerbread cookie making kit. Like all of this stuff costs five, five to$10. And Ashley, I know you I've seen that you do a lot of similar things. It does not take much to really exceed someone's expectations.

52:59Tony Robinson:And it brings so much joy to me personally to be able to do that.

53:03Ashley Kehr:Yeah, I definitely prefer to set the bar low and then to exceed expectations. Well, Alex, thank you so much for joining us today. We really appreciated having you on. Where can people reach out to you and find out more information?

53:16Tony Robinson:Well, you can follow us on Instagram. Our continued real estate journey at the Real Estate Reeves is our Instagram handle. We're hoping to, our next trick of our sleeve is we're hoping to do a live and flip next year. So we're actually about to go look at a property right now to potentially buy for a new primary and then turn our primary into a rental property. So that's our plan.

53:40Ashley Kehr:Great. Well, we'll have to have you back on when you complete that live and flip. Thank you. I'm Ashley. He's Tony. And thank you guys so much for joining us for this episode of Real Estate Rookie.

54:10Tony Robinson:Do you ever notice how every passive investment somehow turns into a very active lifestyle? Active spreadsheets, active phone calls, active stress. Here's a better question. What if you could buy brand new construction homes, 10 % below market value, in the best markets across the country, without making real estate your second job? That's exactly what Rent to Retirement does. They're a full-service, turnkey investment company handling everything for you. In some cases, investors get 50 % to 75 % of their down payment back at closing, plus interest rates as low as 3.75%. They've partnered with BiggerPockets for over a decade, helping thousands invest smarter.

54:47Tony Robinson:If you want to do the same, visit biggerpockets.com slash retirement to learn more. Hey, rookies, if you're watching this, we want you to apply to be a guest on the Real Estate Rookie Podcast. That's right. Ashley and I are looking for amazing stories just like yours to be a part of our Real Estate Rookie Podcast. Now, look, you don't need to be an expert. You don't need to have done thousands of deals. Even if you've done one deal, your story could help inspire the next listener.

55:10Ashley Kehr:As a rookie investor, especially if you just got your first deal, it is all fresh in your minds. And you are the best person to tell your story, give your experience on how you got it done to help someone else get their first deal. So head over to biggerpockets.com slash guest if you want to be a part of our show. Again, that's biggerpockets.com slash guest. And we'd love to have you on.