Rio on Mohamed Salah: Is there an agenda against him? | Carragher got too personal

0:0033 days, 33 episodes, no off switch. From the goals and the glory to the politics and the problems of the World Cup, if you want soccer analysis from a podcast that's been over-analyzing the game for more than 20 years, then this is it. Join me, Max Rushton, and our expert team of soccer journalists every day of the tournament. Can England end 60 years of hurt, or will this be another year of falling just short? Probably. World Cup Daily, listen wherever you get your podcasts, or watch full episodes on YouTube. you you think you you have been here one year bro you think you can take me out of team it's fine make me sub he's not happy etc make me sub that's fine yeah but the fact that when we need something in a game and you're sitting looking at our bench and looking past me no that's bad that's the that's the that's the disrespect that's the way i feel that he's sitting there going there's more than just making me sub here there's more there's a bigger picture here the manager yeah the manager's got a different agenda here i think

1:01hello guys and welcome to another episode of rio presents brought to you by crafted our trusted partners um a little change to our schedule guys obviously we normally go on a monday yeah but obviously man united played on monday so we thought we'd bring it the reaction straight after on a tuesday morning and it was an opportunity to have us all together in the same room come on boys I'm back in the smoke. What's going on? I didn't know what kind of steel I was going to see. Is that what I get when I come back? Oh yeah, here's a gift for you, Rio. Yeah, man. From Crafted. All right, folks, Marcelo, you've been giving presents out there.

1:33Thank you. So, before we go into football, we should mention Crafted. They are our official partners of the show, right? You've got to talk to us though, Rio, man. No, listen, there's a couple of bags dotted around. There's a couple over there as well I saw on the way in. But these are obviously a Christmas presents for the guys, the team, all behind the scenes. You're going to get one of these, Steve. But I don't know about you, but I'm not into rapping. But the way they put this together, I ain't got to do all that. So it takes one of my jobs off the table. So they're making life easy, man. So when you book off the website, all this stuff comes.

2:04You've got the option to get a gift wrap so you don't even have to leave your house. And like I say, yeah, I ain't got to do that crazy, bubbled up, mashed up rapping. Someone gets it and goes like, what, it becomes a laughingstock of the house. And it gives you real high quality as well because, you know what I mean, it is very helpful. The links are obviously in the description, everything to help others, right? Yeah, and I think if you're after a bit of quality men's jewellery, that's not going to cost like an arm and a leg. I ain't going to like blow your wallet out. And it's a decent, decent purchase.

2:33Right. So all three of us back in the studio together, where do you want to start? I was just worried that I was going to be coming here, first show back in the studio, and United hadn't got a result. The warning signs. They've not won. Well, seven consecutive losses. United have conceded like a mad amount of away goals we only win when we have less of the ball and more of the ball and you're just thinking this is written they haven't won all season two points like historically worst Premier League team that there's ever been yeah I really thought you were going to get like you were going to get beat and then they equalised that's what threw me really okay what did you like most about the performance oh that it ended I'll tell you what I thought there was there's a few little bits to pick up.

3:20We start strong, and we start most games pretty strong, and we got a goal, but then we go into this sort of mental coasting where we get sloppy, and there was some real sloppy play from us, like real sloppy red zone stuff, real sloppy passing, extra touches. I just thought sloppy was the only word. Sloppy red zone stuff, what's that? Well, red zone, and it comes into the box, overplaying in there rather than just clearing it. Like people taking an extra touch inside our box rather than just sticking a foot through it. The basics work for a reason. But when we got to 3-4-1, I thought you could see what a confident Manchester United looks like.

3:55Because the game wasn't in that weird game state, which we've had for like a year where we need a goal or we've only got a goal cushion. We had two goal, three goal cushion, and United started playing and it was up back and through and it was one touch and it looked confident and it looked slick and it looked capable. But we obviously don't have the confidence, like deep-rooted winners, us where we can just start playing games like that and play thinking we'll get games and we'll kick on like we're not confident and I think that's the biggest thing I mean Amarim's reaction to the win was this is a specific case we faced a team that is really really struggling do you reckon he was playing it down or I just think it's how you frame this I think a lot of things are how you frame stuff in a changing room if you go into a changing room the players can walk in there you know oh we should have won this anyway they're bottom of the league how that manager then comes into that changing with the energy the right energy after that game can dictate how the team then go on I think you can come in there there's two different ways you can come in there come in there and go you know what guys that ain't good enough we've got the bottom of the league we should be putting these away easily are they getting a shot even on goal let alone getting a score on a goal and we've got to sharpen up there's that angle I think that's when you're confident you can do that I think this team probably need guys well done we lost that last year we're definitely able to draw on that game last year.

5:15But look, the character, the resilience now, the understanding, the way that we played, the way that tactically you guys got on it straight away and then the confidence that came out on the back of that momentum. It's like, I think this team need that. You're doing the right things, guys. I see it there. Show them the examples. And there's individual cases in that. I think you look at Mason Mount for one. I think that you can look at him and use him as a bit of a yardstick and go, guys, this is what we need. This is the energy of what we need. He's come back in again. Oh, mate. Great goal. But not something I'm surprised by.

5:48I'm just surprised by LMA United, because you haven't seen enough of it. But you know he's in there. But you just need to get him on the pitch more. But I don't know. It's the way that I think is framed in that changing room that can dictate and determine how the team come out of that game. But speaking about the changing room, I just wanted to point out that Amarim left players alone in the dressing room at halftime because of the frustrations of conceding the goal. I love him, you know. I think he's absolutely mental. You always talk about giving what the game requires. That's a massive thing you mentioned, right?

6:21Did Sir Alex Ferguson give you that sometimes? What the game required? Like half-time, I'm not saying anything. No, no. The manager never, ever, never, never said his piece. He came in and whether it be a shorter version, he said his piece. Because you've got to understand that the manager, this is my team. I know what my team are capable of and I know what they can do and they can achieve. and if they're not doing it, they're going to get told. But every manager is different. Do you know what I mean? Amarim is still working out his team. He's still trying to work out the different pieces that he has.

6:51So he's trying to find different ways to get a reaction. And he might go, I might have to do this a few more times now, I'm not going there. I might have to just stay outside. I wonder if he thought, if I don't go in, obviously my assistants are going to be in there. I'll see who steps up. I'll see, does Casemiro go right? Does Bruno go, hey, pin him back, listen. And like, we keep talking about players needing leadership on the pitch. What better way to give them the leadership than to not go in the dressing room at half time and be like... Is that good leadership, in your opinion? Well, it worked.

7:22If it didn't work, no. But it did. So it is. That's true. It's against Wolves though, isn't it? So like I'm talking about... Yeah, but they just equalised. So you walk in, you're thinking, he must have had 97 ,000 things that he wanted to say to him. And he must have just gone, I'm either going to batter one of them or I'm going to explode on them and maybe I shouldn't. So I'm just going to leave them. Yeah, I think that's where he was at. I think he was at, if I go in there now, I could lose a few people. I could lose, because I couldn't get personal. Because that's what football does, doesn't it?

7:51Football makes you emotional. It makes you the passion, because there's so much passion and emotion, it can spill over to being evil at times. Do you know what I mean? And listen, I've been in change rooms. I've been on the pitch. I've been where things are said and you go at a time, it's like red mist and you're saying stuff and people are saying stuff and afterwards you look back and you go, that's quite embarrassing that, how I've gone that mad. And he was right. Yeah. My intentions and the why I said it would never be changed and I won't go against it. I'm right. But maybe the way I delivered it.

8:22Do you ever tell you about, Alex Stepney told me about Matt Busby's team talk against Real Madrid away. Champions League semifinals. You think about it's 10 years post-Munich. It's Champions League semifinal. We're losing 2-0, I think it was, in the Bernabeu 1-0. We're behind at least anyway. He said he's coming. He said, the players are absolutely tearing at each other's throws. You're not picking your money. You're not doing this. You're fucking crap. And you can picture Samat, can't you? Just sort of like, he sits down in the corner and he just starts cleaning his pipe out. Silent. Proper methodical.

8:56It's like a ritual into building a pipe. Sits there, lights it, and just starts smoking his pipe in a dressing room. And then just starts chuckling to himself. And he goes, in the meantime, all of that argument and everyone at each of us throws, everyone's kind of sat down, calmed down, chilled out and just sat there watching him and Alex goes, it was the most genius team talk ever because he just started chuckling and he went, you're all good players. Go and be good players. Have you had anyone react to you like that? No. You know, you only get it after a game sometimes. I remember loads of managers go, guys, you've lost a game or you've thrown a game away and drawn or whatever.

9:36or even if you've won sometimes I've been psyched a couple of times going do you know what just go and get in the shower I'll talk to you Monday really yeah or get in the shower coming tomorrow we're going to go in the classroom in the video room and I'll speak to you but that was disgraceful that was pedagogical you see the the John Sitton the famous John Sitton brilliant that must happen more often than the other one yeah yeah 100 % that's probably one of the best all time classic changer in clips I fucking love it have you seen that you would have seen it basically I think they're losing at half time.

10:06He sacks a player at half time, doesn't he? He's like, you're done. You're on your notice. You're not playing for me ever again. And he's like, you, your big CNX Tuesday and you, your little CNX Tuesday. He's like, you two. And if you want it outside, I'll have it with both of you. Yeah, and bring you dinner. Yeah. It was good, man. Did you hear, by the way, the Man United fans' reaction when Cobby Manu came on the pitch? Very positive, isn't it? I was watching on my phone yesterday. Great show of support. So I was trying to watch on my phone. Oh, was it? it's a great show of support wasn't it no I looked at it and I thought to myself I think he's been hard done by like obviously we're going to talk about the Mo Salah and Liverpool stuff later on but I just still can't understand Rio why he hasn't been given a chance and I also think Amarin was a little bit harsh on him in the press conferences a little bit like I'm not sure if he meant to chuckle at him earlier on a few days ago I don't know if he knew the question was coming but that boy from what we can see he's been a victim of what his own success feels like he's gone in January doesn't he whether that's permanent or on loan I saw shout out Buddy and Scolzi on their podcast I saw them talking about it the other day I totally agree with them if I think about it and I put myself in Kobi Manu's shoes I'm out of there I've got to go do you know what I mean he's playing for England he's one of the best players for England in a tournament like not many players can say they've been that he has but it's just he's wasted 18 months of his career now at Manchester United and I think he's he's probably been there 6 months longer than he should have been yeah you know what I mean he should have just gone and I think his agents and more importantly, his family around him have to protect him and say to him, listen, he might be sitting there going, I've made United too much to go.

11:42I want to stay and fight. But it's going to be two years in the summer. You can't lose two years of a career. It's a short career, man. You've got to make decisions that are best for you. And I think me, if I was him, I'd say, listen, guys, the manager, you ain't going to start playing me now. If you've not played me all these matches that have gone before, you're not going to play me now. So let's just be honest with each other. I'm surplus to requirements. Get me out of here. It's true. Doesn't that worry then for like the game state last night? I thought Ruben Amarim had a perfect opportunity to flip the narrative.

12:13So the narrative at the moment is he doesn't trust our youth and he's not playing the academy. He could have been a couple of them. You've got Shea Lacey on the bench. You're about to lose forwards to AFCON. United fans back and give a lot of time and really enjoy seeing any youth player given opportunities. you could have really bought some goodwill from the fan base if you had to give Shea Lacey 10 minutes last night. I was surprised. You're not losing that game. Exactly. When you go a few goals up like we did, I'm surprised he didn't get on the pitch. I totally agree with you, but I just don't think the manager thinks like that.

12:46He don't care. I think he's thinking this is about us now. He's like, can I make another set of rounds up? Can we just forward to Garnaccio? Because we've got him on air. Garnaccio, he's interviewed the other day. It was in the press conference, wasn't he? and he said that it was an easy decision to leave United the manager trusts me here yeah and there'll be fans at Man United that go you cheeky little yeah but if you as a footballer take your Man United hat off if you feel the manager don't trust you I've been there with England at the beginning I didn't know if Capello trust me you ain't getting my best performances do you know what I mean I didn't know if Steve McLaren fully trusted me and I don't know if they did or not but I got a feeling so once you feel that feeling I can't get away from England I can't change and go and play for Scotland Ireland, Wales or wherever I'm staying with England because you can't change that badge but at club level I'm certain if the managers don't trust me I'm certain that I'm sitting there going well we both shouldn't really be around each other because it's going to blow up and you're not going to get best out of me and you're not obviously getting what you want so you've got to go and Garnaccio has made a decision that was best for him and I think sometimes you've got to do that as a player did you see him in a press conference the other day that again, journalists asking silly questions.

14:00They asked directly, do you regret leaving Manchester United? You said no. And I just thought, what did you expect him to say? Yes. I mean, even if he did, he's saying no. Anyway. Let's get on to Salah. Yeah, we've got to talk about Mohamed Salah. Not just the Mohamed Salah discussion, but Jamie Carragher's explosive response on Sky Sports yesterday. Salah was already preempting that. He was waiting for it. Let me just get where I thought I was. Let me just prepare myself. Hold on so I can read it. Hold on. just go on what are you going to ask me just prepare my answer okay cool do you reckon that's what we do now do you reckon hold on let me just read this properly because this has got to be done no no it's not mine was Jamie reading notes he was reading notes on it I don't know did you see it yeah do you reckon that was proper like preempted no what made me laugh here I love Jamie he makes me laugh right but he this is what Jamie he was talking here to what's his name Rob or something the reporter no no David Jones David Jones sorry yeah And he was going, yeah.

15:00And Mo, when he was at three, and he's made the comment, and I mean, because as a Liverpool player, you can't do that. And it was just, oh, it made me laugh, man. But do you think Rio, right? He is being scapegoated, Mo Salah. Who? Salah? Yeah. I think in his head, he's being scapegoated because I think if you frame it like this is, and from Mo Salah's perspective, he's sitting there and going, I'm the guy. When you needed anything for the last eight years, I'm that guy who stepped up and scored and produced, right? Not on his own, but he knows that if you wanted a goal or a moment or creating a chance, 350 goal involvements tells you they probably look to him most of the time, right?

15:45And to go from that for a bit of bad form, and can I just reiterate, it's not through getting older because he's running stats. they're a mirror image of last season by 0.1 or 2 either way, here or there, right? It's a distinct lack of form over the last few months. So he's sitting there going, if you needed a moment last season, I was the guy he looked to, and the eight years before that, or seven years before that, I was the guy. And now this season, okay, put me sub. I don't think that he's, listen, I think he's disappointed. I think this is what makes Mo Salah the player, is any player that is happy to be on the bench and is fine, you shouldn't be playing football.

16:23the difference is is that he can't hide that right which I think as a team mate I'm going listen I know you're not happy but listen calm it reign it in a little bit where I think he sits there and goes this is an absolute disrespect and actually there's a motive somewhere and I think the manager's got a different a motive somewhere else that I'm not sure about right now is where when you're needing something in a game where we're not confident we're not getting points we look shaky anyway and we're not in a position where we thought we were going to be you are looking down the line on that bench and looking past me are you taking the mick?

16:57Who do you think he's being scapegoated by? I don't know I'm just saying in his eyes he's thinking there's someone in that club I think he's looking at the manager first and he's thinking also you lot above give me a contract Yeah literally last year or this year this year and I could have gone Saudi but I wanted to stay here and this is how the manager's repaying me looking past me when he's making a decision to try and get a result Where did they finish last year without his goals and assists? They don't win the league. Yeah, they don't. They don't. He was the main man. Did he even finish top four?

17:26After trophies they've won without him in the team, they probably don't get near winning. When looking at the Jamie Carragher interview, for the first minute, I'm not going to lie, I thought he might be onto something here. In the part where he said Mo Salah only does mix zone interviews when he wants something. He does. He's probably only done like four. But he does. Yeah, but that's not good, right? What do you mean? You can't just come out when you're unhappy or whatever. Just talk to the people more regularly. is what I would say. But he's consistent. I would like him to talk more. I would like him to talk more, yeah?

17:56Because he's Mo Salah. The best players in the world, I want to hear what they say, how they think, yeah? But at least he's consistent. He goes, you know what? If I'm not happy, I'm coming out. Otherwise, I'm silent. Yeah, you can't. To me, that's the wild part. So I thought to myself, ooh, Jamie might be onto something here. Wait, sorry. That's the club's fault, by the way. Why? Because if I'm not talking, if someone's not talking, I remember Karen Schottmult, who's the lady who controlled the changing room when it comes to media. every game finishes media asks for particular players every game they're asking for Mo Salah right every game they're asking for Wayne Rooney or Cristiano Ronaldo or whoever right so she'd come in and go Wayne Cristiano and they go no whatever no then some weeks she'd go listen or she'd go to maybe Gary or whoever listen they ain't done it for like six weeks you've got to share it around listen Waza come on man just go out there and just give him five minutes he's fine huff and puff go they go but that's what happens in within a squad not everyone I agree not everybody should there shouldn't be a single person that doesn't have to do it you should share it yeah he's going to do less because he does more elsewhere right but that's down to the club Mo Salah we'd all like to do less if we can get away with it it's human nature we will do you know what I mean no but his less is he's being allowed to the point is he's being allowed to so don't point the finger at him solely it's a holistic I don't know about that I haven't played for Liverpool Football Club but where where Carragher got personal was when he starts talking about he was seen as a failure at Chelsea Football Club roll it back because he was like he goes I've never criticised Mo Salah you're like just pull this up because I think I've got about 12 incidents and some of them like you said are mad personal so like he's known as the player that failed at Chelsea whoa whoa like for starters whoa what are you talking about we know that it didn't work out there he went elsewhere he did really well you're making it seem as if yes Liverpool obviously gave him the platform but at the same time you're going to tell me that he hasn't done anything in return for Liverpool it was it just seemed really personal and then said his legs have gone and then was like that's not criticism his legs ain't gone yeah and also they haven't and then on top what I thought was very interesting he was trying to like spin the narrative to say look you've won all the trophies with Liverpool but with Egypt you haven't won you know AFCON and that Egypt is one of the most successful African countries but then a few months ago Mr.

20:26Carragher you were saying that AFCON wasn't seen as a big big tournament all of a sudden you're using it to help fuel your agenda that's what I thought nah you know and you can't then caveat it and go oh but he's a good player he's a great player yeah yeah come on you can't do that right man we've got loads still to come right on this pod but we'll be back shortly after this

20:4733 days, 33 episodes, no off switch. From the goals and the glory to the politics and the problems of the World Cup, if you want soccer analysis from a podcast that's been overanalyzing the game for more than 20 years, then this is it. Join me, Max Rushton, and our expert team of soccer journalists every day of the tournament. Can England end 60 years of hurt, or will this be another year of falling just short? Probably. World Cup Daily, listen wherever you get your podcasts, or watch full episodes on YouTube.

21:16I didn't expect this from a lot of Liverpool fans I've got to be honest because they pride themselves on being loyal and being like we back our players but in the last in the last six months to eight months with Trent with Mo Salah with the new manager I'm the new manager I'm seeing the amount of get him out I want him out of the club now but all of them guys have been crazy I'm laughing I'm laughing I'm laughing I'm laughing I'm laughing until you decide you don't want a beer anymore or we don't think you're good enough and then you can kick fucking rocks do you know what I hope I hope that the Egyptian fans give Mo Salah the love that he deserves and they get round him and support their boy because he's given these guys far too many good nights man and good moments that will live with these guys forever and will be etching the walls of Anfield for many generations to come and then for people to be going and do you know what we all sit here and go we want our players to be a bit more emotional and then show us who they really are this is who Mo Salah is this is what this is the guy that helped you this is what makes him he's an emotional guy passionate guy and if anyone's going to try and disrespect him he's going to point out and pull him up and go no after what he did last season I think he's fully entitled to be like do you know what I keep hearing people saying oh yeah but he shouldn't have done it in public listen when a club is ready to air out a player and get rid right they don't waste no time and go oh we get a tiptoe around this business but we expect it from the players all the time no I'm sorry I wish more players would be a little bit more like this the only thing I would say right is I think I wish more players would come out and speak out when not happy but I think the only thing I would say about Mo Salah is he could have articulated it a little better definitely I think he could have if he had come out and gone do you know what guys I have been underperforming I haven't played as consistently well as you've seen Mo Salah play over the years right I've had a bit of a downturn in form but it's not for the one to try and here's my stats running wise just so you know doesn't loyally go both ways Yeah, and also, by the way, I want to be at this club and I want to play.

23:15But my biggest point, listen, is I don't mind if the manager is going to make me sub. I don't like it, but I can swallow it, right? But I do find a concern with, and it alarms me, that when he's looking for something in a game, he looks past me when he's looking to make a decision to make a sub. No minutes. This is where I then feel it's personal and there's something wrong. If the manager comes to me and says to me, I don't want you at this club no more. I'm not going to play you. Sorry, I'm going to do 100. Fine. Fine. fine fine I'm going to ride Keenan here yeah fine oh no go away do you do you think it's personal though Rio like does it feel personal to you the thing is right there's a lot of questions still is he looking beyond him now I've made him sub but his reaction in training has been really poor we don't know so I'm going to teach him a lesson he can go on eventually he ain't playing yeah we don't know that is that the reason and that's not the reason that's fair from the manager but we don't know that but if we're going by just what we're seeing here and we're presuming that he's bringing them out of the team.

24:14And also, most times he's going to be sitting there going, hold on a minute, we've all been shit. We've all been rubbish. All of us are having bad games. So why? It's not just lack of scoring goals. Look how many we conceded. Yeah, exactly. Alisson's back now as well. Vandai's not getting dropped. Canard is not getting dropped. What's going on here? We're conceding. Arnstlock could argue that, hey, the guy that I dropped you for scored. So what's that? Nah, man. come on he could I'm just saying he could if it was someone else you would say well it's justified why is Arna Slott because I see this all the time with the likes of Amorim where they go who's he improved who's he getting the best out why can't he get the best out of this player well why can't Arna Slott get the best out of what Liverpool fans tell us is one of the greatest Premier League players ever yeah this isn't someone five years past his prime this is someone who might have hit his prime last season this year great point like why can't he get the best out of him here like I said loyalty goes both ways yes he's been poor but like the lack of communication from him even if the manager had gone yeah do you know what look Mo's not having a great time in a minute we're going to take him out of the team a little bit we're going to polish up some of the stuff he needs to do and then we're going to bring him back and you lot will see next year but that's a great point I think that's the way Mo Salah's looking at you like you guys are telling everyone that I'm the best Premier League player ever right that fan base but yeah it's fine to take a seat make me be a sub for a little while because I need to get confidence back that's fine but then when you're looking for a moment close a game out or whatever the supposed best player ever to play in the Premier League who's still fit and firing physically you're going to look past him?

25:49That makes sense. What's going on here? That's what he's thinking. I want to bring it back to a time where Sir Alex Ferguson and David Beckham were knocking heads a little bit just before Beckham left. You were there weren't you? It seemed like there was obviously issues there but he still brought him on. against Real Madrid. Because he knows that he can deliver at some point. You're going to get something. There's certain players that have got quality that other players don't possess. Most players have a quality and a knack of producing a chance or a goal or a moment in games, big or small. He's proved that over 350 times in a Liverpool shirt.

26:27So how can you go away from it? And I don't like this comparison. I think it was Jamie. I'm not sure it was. I was trying to compare old legends who were actually, and can we just hone in on the word old? They were old at a time when he was talking about them. They didn't cause any kind of uproar and they didn't say anything. They kept their mouth closed. They just got on with it out of respect for the club. No, no. The difference is they were aging, old, slower players, great players, but they were older, slower, aging players. Mo Salah's not an aging, old, creaking player. He's just a player lacking confidence and lacking any type of consistency.

27:07But is he overconfident as well? Because I want you to listen to this quote, both of you, right? I don't have to go every day fighting for my position because I earned it. I'm not bigger than anyone, but I earned my position. Is he, do you reckon, saying that he's done enough so that he doesn't need to fight for his position? Or do you reckon that's just the translation? That's where I think articulating yourself in the right way comes in. Like, I just feel that I had it in my mind I was there weren't ever a moment in my career where I didn't feel I have to prove myself because there's always someone coming who's next someone looking to take your shirt someone looking to write bad things about you I'm not giving them I don't want to give them the opportunity but I think he's talking out of pain there I think he's talking he's going listen the facts are I'm the guy I think that's how he's talking I'm the guy how can you look past me and the articulation of that I think is the issue I think that's where I go Mohamed Salah maybe that's where maybe a statement's better do you know what I mean than actually talking but you don't get the emotion a note screenshot yeah I mean but if you're especially when it's your second language yeah imagine if you had to try and do something in a second language you'd sound mental wouldn't you so like respect to any player that comes out and actually gives interviews in the second language agreed for real even though it's only four times and he does it when he wants something respect that still if you're Gakpo and you hear your teammate talking like that.

28:35What's your thoughts? Shut the fuck up when I haven't done anything near what he's done. I'll be honest. I mean, how many goals has Wurt's got to do? 350 before he gets anywhere near Mo Salah. Do you know, I think it's a big moment for them. I think this is where I think Virgil van Dijk can be somebody that can play a role in this situation. I mean, he can be the go-between between the manager and the people upstairs. Mo Salah, he can be sitting there talking to his teammates and, listen, man, just tell me how you feel and what's the problem and I'm going to go and speak to the guys. Like, I think you've said enough now, but I think it's like, this is where the captain's got to stand in and really take hold of the situation.

29:17Did you have to do that at United? The situation didn't really arise. I think, listen, the situation with Waza, when he said he wanted to talk about Man City, so you have a conversation with Waza and go, what the hell, what's going on, man? Because none of us were happy that he's talking. You can talk about leaving, but not to go City. That was the point. What did you tell him? What could you tell him? I was like, what are you doing, man? It wasn't one of those conversations, like you're sitting down with your mate, just going like, fucking, I know you want this or that, but... Where's this conversation taking place?

29:48Like, canteen? I think you might have been in a room before a match. Before, was it a room before a match? Or you might have been, you might have been in the change room, I can't actually remember exactly, but that's the type of conversation you have is like it's like what are you what are you trying to get out of it are you just trying to get more money that's the thing I would say is this just a ploy to get more because you ain't going to go sick do you know what I mean when he was like I fucking will I will Wazza's quite come on one of those guys if you disrespect him he's going to go the other way he's going to go extreme that's the way Wazza is like if you're playing games and like oh thicken someone's ear Wazza will go and get a hot tablespoon put it under a hot bit of water and he'll put it on your ear I've seen him do that Sounds like you though I've seen him do that to Dan Fletcher Yeah yeah Is it Fletcher you must cry Fletcher's the one's crying but that's what Wazel's like he always go a step further so he's trying to control that and gauge where he's at and I think that's the senior players within that squad Andy Robertson will probably be one of those guys as well like he was going and saying listen Mo fucking you've put us right under it yeah man it's like going out and talking like where are you at can I help this situation because there's no doubt in my mind these guys don't want him to leave because he helps them win trophies do you think he will I think he's gone I think he's gone yeah I think he's gone too far I think he's just thought no I ain't having this this manager's got an ulterior motive and he wants me out do United sign him no way send a fax Osada don't go to my United depends how pissed off he is I don't think he's got that wiser streak I don't think he's got that wiser trait in him where he's wanting to go like the extra mark or Tevez but if you're United do you poke the bear yeah I'll make an offer public public one as well I said Mo you don't even have to move house yeah yeah commute you in you have 15 minute late start we'll give you security give you our security whatever you can have it wow can you imagine I'd do it just for the fucking riot that I had caused in Liverpool it's unbelievable isn't it yeah it would be a joke you know what before we finish I think it's good that we focused on the pressing points we don't need to talk about anything else I want to focus on Man City actually Cherokee nice little flick oh because objects in the rear view mirror are closer than they appear is it?

32:01Is that what it is? I just don't think we need to go into it. You are bottling the league. You know this don't you? What do you mean bottling? How long ago was it? About five, six weeks ago where I said put the champagne back. Yeah. You've all been congratulating yourselves a little bit too much. You say it every week Steve. Who's overtaking you? Villa or City? Which one? What are you thinking now? Where's your head at as an Arsenal fan? It's only December. Exactly. It's only December but you were wearing shades last week and you were popping champagne bottles. It's only December and plus everyone talking like oh yeah Villa I was just on TalkSport with Gabby and he goes and he's getting excited as if Villa are competing I said Gabby bro like your team has had immersed more than 70 points in the last one season can I ask you one question you're not doing anything would you would you would if Unai Emery had stayed and been backed the way that Arteta has been backed financially what to the tune of a billion pound do you think eight years do you think that he would have won the league by now maybe I do, I do think there's a strong chance.

33:00Good evening. There's a strong chance. And I've gone on record saying this. I believe that, look, I'm very thankful for what Mikel has done. He's taken us out of the trenches. He's restructured the club. But I also think Una is an excellent manager as well. And I think the voices from the Arsenal fan base, not me, more like troops in that, yeah. They're the ones that really got him hounded out quicker than what he should have done. win the league this year and someone like City basically tossed the first half of the year off and that's right on your shoulder Aston Villa could definitely they're not winning nothing bro like I don't think I like how you dismissed them completely despite the fact you've won fuck all right what if they did Villa are just our bogey team they've beaten us six times okay but they're also second in the league currently or they third yeah but they're gonna tail off you know they will they'll probably win Europa if you say what do I reckon they'll do they'll get Europa that's his competition but yeah regarding Arsenal we'll still win it because everybody else is so rubbish even but what if you don't you're only three you're only like hold on you're only three points about Villa two points about City who've been bang average this year exactly and I think they're going to carry on being bang average and they're going to bang average their way to another title I don't think so I think this year you guys are like non-believers you know after one game all of a sudden all I'm saying here is you You guys are so up and down.

34:26It's unbelievable. Your shades, cigars and champagne one week and going, it's too early the next week when you get beat. It's too early to kind of... Well, as I say, you ain't going to win it and I'm always right. Consistency over there. Yeah. Yeah, but come on. That's like me saying, we're going to win it. We're going to win it. We're going to win it every year. Eventually, I'm going to be right as well. Yeah, but for 24 years, you're not... Whatever it is. 22 years. I just think a bit of realism is needed. It's December. What do you reckon, Rio? It's all right. I still think Arsenal win the league.

34:54I still do. I still think Arsenal win the league I think they're making hard work of it now but what team doesn't normally make hard work of it at some point your defence has been class and I think the injuries the squad players that you've brought in have been very good the level hasn't dropped so you've got like 16 good 11 players and that's plenty but if you don't you better believe I'm there I am there I'm going to the parade of whoever else wins it if we do if we do do you want to come to the parade with me I'm at the Barbers I think yeah no no no I think that's what with Arsenal fans I think they're so up and down on a rollercoaster because you've been so starved of success which is understandable but I just think you'll get over the line and I think it could be the start of something special Can you imagine the shit they're going to come out with when they do it I've already seen Arteta's building the 0-9 pass all over the team and all sorts of shit Here's a question for you Who finishes high United or Liverpool?

35:52That's a tough one I reckon United at this point I think Liverpool are in such disarray so in the summer when Liverpool were champions and they spent half a billion on all of those players if you'd have sat there and said I think United get above them this year you'd have been like I think they're going to start drug testing I don't think anyone takes the bet no one takes that bet and just says no just leave it leave that alone just leave Joel to the madness anyway focusing on more pressing issues Cherky Rio did you see Ryan Cherky the little Rabona that he did for Phil Foden to score goals. Who is having a great season, by the way?

36:28Who? Who's having a great season? Phil Foden. Okay. Quality, innit? I'm here for players to do stuff like that. That's what we want. I'm certainly not for people to just pass themselves to death. You see Pep's interview talking about it. What's the quotes? Oh, he said like, basically when it's good. Do you want to read it out? He said, Messi is the best player to play the game, but I never saw these kind of crosses. I like the simplicity because I learned from Messi that I never make a mistake with the simple things. I get what he's saying. He wants that efficiency. Yeah. But... He's actually pissed off he's done it, hasn't he?

37:00Yeah. Yeah, he was. So for him to talk that out he seems like he's pissed off. But for me, he's looking at it as a manager. I don't want no chances or risk taken when there's a chance to score a goal. Just get it scored and we go back. Whereas, and he sees beauty in the simplicity. Me as a fan, I see beauty in simplicity but I see even more when there's Maverick, when there's something that's just not many can do if even try let alone the bollocks try it in a Premier League game this is my issue with Pep he's the greatest he's a control freak he controls his whole team and he controls his team to winning titles and big trophies probably drop him next for it but it's crazy because his game is built on getting his wide players especially into 1v1 situations to go and beat the fullback or to create another 2v1 at some point when someone comes over and then he's saying I don't want you to over elaborate I don't want you to do anything that's kind of like magical I think it's a balance it's because you can't repeat it that doesn't work in his head because he needs it's not his yeah he's doing maths and this is an algorithm this is why Jack Grealish just couldn't thrive over there you know what I mean really you're not allowed to be elaborate I'm even surprised Docu's allowed to do what he does it's because he's quite direct with it you kind of see what you get there's a shot normally at the end of it but yeah I don't know.

38:24I think Pep is quite a control freak. He's an obsessive natured person who wants things done his way. And this is a meticulous way that he sees the game being played. And that's what's won him so many trophies. And if anyone's going to do something a little bit over elaborate or out of the ordinary, it's got to be someone like Messi. Yeah. But I've always said that Jerky isn't his type of player. Despite that though, six assists in 13 matches for City this season. Mate, if you look at his little cameo, get the video on it. Doing some bits. I saw one the other day when he was 13. See that one? No.

38:56Same player, looks the same now. Really? Doing mad stuff. Yeah. Serious. I like the fact that him and Phil like to play with each other. You know when you have players with skill, sometimes it can be like, oh, they enjoy. Did you see the reaction of Phil when he went after the goal? It was almost like, oh my God. That was a proper Rio reaction. Yeah, it is. But that's why you play. You're like, oh my. No one does that. Yeah. Like, that's what it was. That's what the reaction was. He's like, I'll drop next week. Yeah. You dick. Don't you ever do that again. Let's enjoy it for the moment. Guys, I have to say, it's been a brilliant episode having everyone together again.

39:31Warms my heart, man. I'll keep coming back and getting presents. Please, come back and get your crafted gifts, man. All good. Steve, back to Manchester. Me, back down the road. Rio? On a plane. Come on now. Guys, thank you very much for watching. Rio Meats is coming soon with some exceptional guests. Oh, what I've heard so far off camera. I can't repeat, but I'm telling you. Can you repeat? I'm not going to say nothing right now, but the person we just interviewed, I don't know if there's many better goal scorers in the last 25, 30 years. He's arguably one of the best goal scorers. Diego Fallon, I've been waiting for this one.

40:09He was actually there. That was a good one. Yeah, Diego was there. But the guy we interviewed, there ain't many players that have got, they've done that well, that their name becomes a nickname. over there birth certificate name what are you doing about for you to make go in the comments and let us know what you think we're talking about okay let us know guys thank you very much for watching Joel Baer Stephen Alson Rio Ferdinand signing out peace

41:09We'll see you next time.

41:21you want soccer analysis from a podcast that's been overanalyzing the game for more than 20 years, then this is it. Join me, Max Rushton, and our expert team of soccer journalists every day of the tournament. Can England end 60 years of hurt, or will this be another year of falling just short? Probably. World Cup Daily, listen wherever you get your podcasts, or watch full episodes on YouTube.