Friends Thru A Lens: House Parties with Alexandra Haddow

0:06Hello and welcome to Friends Through a Lens, the podcast mini-series where I talk to my real-life friends about the show Friends through a lens of their choosing. My name is Caroline and I've been put in charge of Cuffs and Ice and it's Rachel's birthday so it's time to poach the salmon. It's Alexandra Haddo. Hello. You are here today in a very special context which is I believe you to be the queen of house parties. Thank you so much. That is one of the biggest compliments I've ever received. How is it that you've come to earn this title? About nearly, was it actually it was only about two years ago i mean i've always enjoyed them yeah about two years ago so i'm 37 i was yeah i was 35 and i was like you know what i haven't been to a great house party in years because i feel like you have them a lot in your 20s up to like 27 28 and then i feel like everyone um puts on a play of trying to be old and grown up for a while yes and then you realize i mean i'd never did that but like a lot of people did and then you sort of um house parties just went for a while i think it's yeah that age that it happens and i was like you know what i'm gonna throw a big christmas party and i told everybody about it months in advance big christmas house party you came you bought a bottle of moe i remember it it was a good year for me it was fiscally speaking very clear i was like wow caroline has really classed this up a notch um and it was such a great time that now i have one for christmas and my birthday but then we just had one for my boyfriend's birthday so three a year which i think yeah but you know what's funny because i feel like it's much more regular than that but I think do I just think that because the general paucity of people having house parties in their 30s yeah maybe yeah it's interesting because I think I think you are right I think when we're very young and very broke a house party is something that's had a necessity because you can't afford to drink all night yes in someone's gaff so obviously when we're young it's pre-drinks um which is often kind of a party of its own yeah and then you go out and then you might have an afters or whatever.

2:05Exactly, yeah. And then that sort of might go into your sort of mid-twenties. And then, and I do think sort of Instagram and sort of people getting increasingly house proud has something to answer to this. People stop inviting people over because people are very shamed of their homes. Yes, yeah, yeah. Or it goes the other way. And when you get a bit of cash, you're like, oh, my house is nice. I don't want to invite everyone over and ruin it. There's that in it as well. But there's both. I think it's both polarisation of that. Yeah. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Definitely. So house parties, as per the show Friends, I actually do think you see that exact journey mimicked in Friends.

2:41Yes, I think you're right. There is a lull in the middle seasons. Yeah, and during that lull, the house parties get very bad. Yeah. It's kind of fascinating when you see it because ultimately this is a show that takes its characters from the average age of about 25 to 35. it ran for 10 11 years and um so it does and they this show is always sold on the concept of that period of life where your friends are your family yeah and everything you have endless time to hang out with them and no one's taking their jobs that seriously and I think everyone's pretty much unanimously agreed that like once the pressures of like real life comes in on the show like once they have to have kids and more serious careers and all that and get married it does feel less effervescent you know what I mean yeah 100 % and uh and with that the house parties as well yeah absolutely and that's and I I do think a lot of the stuff in friends comes full circle as well like like you were saying there's a slight lull in the middle there's a slight lull in real life as well like when you're in your 20s most of you are probably single and I remember being in my 20s and because most of my mates were single they it was like if you got if you sometimes if you liked someone and you knew that you were going to have a relationship with them you almost felt a bit left out because you were like oh obviously I like this person I want to be with them but everyone's single and that's the that's the craziness and the drama and stuff like that and so the house party is full of possibility yeah yeah yeah yeah and then when you're kind of when you grow up a bit you may be like you know you're either you don't want to bring people around because you're ashamed or or you've got a nice house and then like half and half of you like there's half of you that are in a relationship and it's I think you're all a bit like fragmented around the leading up to 30 and everyone's kind of panicking about 30 which is in is in the friends uh party universe as well the 30th ones yeah and then when you kind of all come out of that slight coma where you're all kind of like pretending to be grown up it's so interesting i think i i would love to people to write on the comments on the instagram or whatever about whether or not everyone i think from 28 to 32 is when i noticed it the most in my kind of gang the exact age i would this sort of um pretend signality kind of thing of like suddenly it's like oh we're having couples dinners why yeah what are you on about you're barely born you're barely born yeah and I never had that and so I'm glad that everyone now is kind of I think come full circle and then you're in your mid-30s and you know you're like oh we can afford some half decent booze and we've got a nice couch come around right right there's kind of I think when you when you start getting fragments of adult life in your late let's let's say this is in the kind of a people living in an urban environment which is obviously the world of friends and the world that most of my listeners are in yeah um it's like people overshoot the runway they're like okay i moved in with my boyfriend yeah i own two separate baking dishes i guess now i make a souffle from for my husband's boss and his wife and we're like is it this is it this is my we kind of have to try I'll never give her a bitch.

5:48This is not my beautiful house. And you do sort of have to let go then after a while. Like, and if you don't let go, God help you, because you'll find yourself at what I described earlier on as a CV party. There's nothing worse than a CV party. Just people you don't know standing around comparing their CV. I think the mark of a good party, and I think, I hope this is what happens at my parties, is that nobody leaves knowing what anyone else's job is. oh my god I remember you're just like you to me like if there was a contact in my phone that like just like a good time for a good time call Alexandra Haddo for a good time call this number that is written on some phone boxes I think you are for you are literally for a good time like the why not I remember one time I left a restaurant with you and we were with our our two men and you were like you know I love about that meal no one even pretended to order water

6:45because you know you were saying about this pretend senility did you just say yeah that's a constant bugbear of mine where it's like you know all those memes that are like um you know oh the best thing is when somebody cancels on you and you don't want to go out oh my god drives me mad and it's like get better mates or get more interesting that radicalizes me that's what i mean yeah ashan akbar my good friend and comedian was on his uh instagram today and he's doing a preview of a special recording and he said look i'm doing a show tonight top secret comedy 6 p.m it's a pound it was like 6 till 7 p.m you'll be home by you know you can come after work you'll be home by uh 7 40 don't give me this bullshit about not coming out on a monday you live in london and i was like yes this is the thing no one's saying go on a go on an all-night rave seven days a week yeah yeah but just just be open your mind to a bit of fun okay and that doesn't have to be getting wrecked.

7:39Yeah. Can I tell you something that I read on Substack the other day and changed my life? Please do. I think it changed my life in the sense of it put into words something I've been thinking for a long time already but some rando girl said it better which is 90 % of the time when you think you need rest what you actually need is fun. That is absolutely correct. That is, yes, I'm going to get that tattooed. People think they need a bath in the yoga class and what they need to do is take a fucking MDMA with their spouse at a Bjorn again gig. 100%. Because that's the thing. I think what people equate is going out of the house with spending a whole night with people you don't know and staying out till four.

8:19Or spending a ton of money. Yeah, yeah, it doesn't have to be that. Or showing off. Or social pressure. Just open your mind a little bit. Like, social pressure. Like you say, that's the CV party. There should be no social pressure at an actual good house party. Yeah. Because what it should be is, my rule is 80 % of the people should know 80 % of the people. There should be a few people that everybody doesn't know. Yeah. And that's how you make... But that's why when I have a house party now, people that have met at my house parties before then hang out. And then it's not... I have huge relationships with people I only know from your parties.

8:54And it's like, oh, it's you again. Lovely. And also, crucially, don't invite anyone that treats it as a CV party. No, no, no. Sometimes you find out too late, though. Yeah. Well, let's get to the friends then. I mean, I had to ask everybody on this mini-series. do you have a relationship with friends? Yes, I do. I am a massive, massive fan. Yeah, I mean, genuinely, in my 20s for a while, I would say I watched Friends every day. Yeah, I think so. Yeah, yeah, yeah. For a good few years. Because it was always kind of on. But also, when you live with flatmates, it's the one thing you can all agree on.

9:32Yeah. Because you all basically like it. Do you know what? I think I wrote about this in my first novel. In Promised Young Women, there's a scene where the heroine, Jane, is like watching TV for the first time with her flatmate and she's getting excited because they're watching Friends and they get sort of high off the residual friendship coming off of Friends and they order a pizza together and it's the first thing they've done. And like, I remember that happening to me in house shares. Yeah, it's a bonding thing. The energy is sluicing off the television and into our awkward house share. Maybe we could be them.

10:04Maybe we could be them. That's essentially it, isn't it? Yeah. I think that's part of its appeal. My boyfriend's never watched Friends. My boyfriend's never watched Friends. Oh, that's... He's watched, like... I'm trying to bully him into an episode of this podcast, which is Friends through the lens of someone who's never seen Friends. Yes. That's get him and Joey on. But yeah, and I... That fascinates me, because I'm like, how did you avoid it? Yeah. Like, it was just so... It was everywhere. And I remember, one of my pivotal Friends memories, I guess, was my mum and dad who, you know, they're not together now.

10:36They're friends now. But when we were growing up, I never felt like they had very similar interests. And I remember my dad had gone out to like cinema and to have a few pints with his mates or whatever. And him, the next day we were all hanging out and on the Saturday morning and my dad being like, what happened in Friends last night? And my mum telling him and them like really bonding over because it was with the Ross Rachel kind of, that time where it was almost like a drama as well as a sitcom. It can really, it can dip into that sometimes. Yeah, and that's what makes it a good sitcom, I think.

11:06And that's a really pivotal moment of me being like, and I was a bit too young to watch it, so I was like, oh, I can't wait to watch this show. And then, you know, and then I got into it, obviously. But I genuinely think the first five seasons of Friends are in my top three sitcoms of all time. I think it's fantastic. What else is in that tier? I would say Gavin and Stacey. Yeah. Yeah. Tell you what, that is a show that knew when and how to take its bows. Yes. Do you know what I mean? Comes back for the right amount of time at the right time. Yeah. Even that, I thought the final special of Gavin and Stacey was really good.

11:38Oh my God, I was fucking in floods. Yeah, I love that. The other one, I didn't think was that good. No. And I think everyone's forgotten about it and we've all just like quietly. I just, I mean, I know this is a show about friends and not Gavin and Stacey, but I think the genius thing of that very last finale, which I hope will be the last time we ever see them because I think it's a good place to leave them, was like, there's this whole bit of like trying to get a coach through a field or whatever. Yeah. And like, it's all just them, again, in the back of a car, arguing about what route to take.

12:06Exactly, yeah. I was like, this is like, it's getting, it's like so cinematic because you're trying to like, drive this like bus through a field and like, it's actually shot really beautifully. But it goes back to exactly what the show was always about, which is travel admin. Yeah. Like, family and travel admin. The reason it's a brilliant sitcom is it's kind of a show about nothing. Yeah, it's a show about driving from England to Wales a lot, basically. and yeah it's hilarious like and it's great but I think to your point of like not really enjoying it so much after they sort of all settle down and pair off is because um it as the premise of the show fundamentally changed because inevitably the characters are going to get pair off and settle down that's kind of what happens realistically with time and people but once you reach a point where people's main solace isn't their friends it is their husband or their you know their immediate family yeah the premise of the show has has changed and so exactly yeah kind of you kind of can't enjoy it in the same way we're all joey in the last five seasons because we're all like why is everyone moving on come on why can't we just have 10 years where they're all shagging people they shouldn't be you're like come on so i'm gonna treat this episode with you as the sort of like house party agony aunt yeah because you've had a lot of them i know you're saying you only had like a few since you were 35 but actually i feel like i remember a lot more than that yeah but That's what I mean.

13:25There was a break. You came to a great one I had when we used to work together years ago where it was my friend Fran's Stag do. Oh, yeah. That was a great one. That was a good one. But that was probably like seven, eight years ago. And then so I started them off again. Oh, right. Two and a half years ago. Okay. So there was a bit of a gap, yeah, and then I realised how much I love them and thought, why don't we do this all the time? Yeah. Yeah. Well, great. I mean, we're coming up to the Christmas season. Exactly. So this is everyone's sign to plan a bloody house party. Yeah, you must. It's honestly the best.

13:57There's no closing time, there's no queues. It doesn't cost you loads and you have the best time. Yeah. And so we're going to basically go through kind of chronologically what we've both deemed to be the kind of iconic party episodes of Friends. Yeah. And you are going to sort of diagnose them. We're going to agony ant them. We're going to see what we could have done better. Yeah. Might have some questions about what was done wrong. I'm so thrilled. I am as well. Finally my skill. I know. Okay. So season one, episode 10, the one with the monkey. This is Marcel's debut into the Friends Averse. I know.

14:30I couldn't believe that. And it's also the New Year's party where they all decide that they're not going to bring dates and it's just going to be a small dinner. Yes. And then it sort of snowballed out of control and it becomes a formal New Year's Eve party. Like a big party. Yes. And then they all have nobody to kiss at midnight and then they inevitably, I think Chandler gets kissed by Joey. Yeah, Joey kisses Chandler and someone takes a picture and obviously that's gay. Oh yes, the gay band of friends. But yeah, it comes full circle. At one point, everyone, they don't want a date, then everyone has a date and then by the end no one has a date.

15:08So all kind of, fucking phenomenal in 24 minutes or whatever an episode is. Yeah. You know? It's so good. It's such a good like premise, reversal. Yeah. It's incredible. Whatever they call that in the technical screenwriting books that I have bought and not read. I think this is like, I want to talk about Marcel the monkey. Please do. Because we recorded an episode on Ross the other day and we forgot to mention a very important Ross fact. Go on. Which is that Ross was so disliked by the American viewing public that they, and this was like the time of Ace Ventura, Pet Detective. This was the time of Dunstan Checks In.

15:46this is this the 90s it was the time of the monkey it was the time of the monkey yeah and they said how are we gonna make we've given all these kids series contracts how are we gonna make everyone like david schwimmer let's give him a monkey that's why they gave him the monkey that is some that is some coked up thinking right there let's give him a monkey let's michael jackson him give him a monkey why not wow that is because i remember not thinking it was a strange storyline at the time and now I look back and when you kind of actually say it I'm like why did he have a monkey? If we ever do a return series of Friends Through a Lens we'll definitely do animal husbandry in Friends because the chick and the duck I love that they never just have a fucking cat and a dog.

16:31I mean when they get a cat it's like a hairless cat and it's disgusting. Yeah and it's horrible. Yeah there is Friends animals isn't there? Yeah. Another thing that's very notable about this house party that I wanted to ask you about is that It's a formal house party. Which I approve of. Go on. I think if you're going to have a house party, there's so many advantages, right? You're not going out. You're not spending loads of money. There's probably comfy seats around. You can sit on a rug, okay, at your choosing, at your leisure. Anytime during the night. Importantly, there's nothing more glamorous than a woman in like an evening gown sitting on a rug.

17:05Exactly. Exactly. What's sexier than that? Everyone just came listening to that. I know. Silk on a rug, you know? Which is exactly what Monica's wearing. She's wearing a floor-length silver halter. It looks like the most expensive thing on the Reformation website. Doesn't it? It's a compliment. It really does. And I think, hasn't it got like a kind of teardrop cutout above the breasts? It's like the best she's ever looked. Yeah. I say that a lot with her because she, sometimes early seasons Monica, you're like, are you like Lana Turner? Are you like? Yes. She is like unbelievable. Like 1950s movie star.

17:39Yes. Crazy. and at the time when I first watched it I didn't really clock that no because you were just looking at Rachel yeah you were we were all just looking at Rachel you were and I was always you know yeah I was always like trying to not have Rachel as my favourite because I was like boring but then I didn't really Chandler was just always my favourite yeah gotta be but formal house party yes sorry formal house party because I think when you've got all these amazingly casual and chilled options available to you like whatever drink you want wherever you want to sit whoever you want to talk to it's nice to just look as good as you can possibly look.

18:12Do you know what I mean? I think it's like, it brings like a sense of party to the house. Because the rest of the time you're in your house in like a tracksuit, right? Yeah. That's the thing. The thing about throwing any house party is that what separates it from just people at your house? Exactly. Exactly. And outfits is a big part of that. Yeah. And I think... You must remember going into the Christmas season. Yes. And I, yeah, I'm a big believer in that. Like when people say, what should I wear to your house party? I'm like, dress up. Because I'm like, why the fuck not? Do you know what I mean?

18:37Like so many times, so many things at the moment of people being like, oh, you know, just don't bother and wear slacks and go home early, bestie, we live in hell. And we're like, do you know what I mean? Go home early, bestie, we live in hell. Yeah, yeah. I think I've kind of stolen that from Milo Edwards, who said every advert these days is like, do you want a coffee, bestie, we live in hell. So props to him for that. But he is that kind of attitude of like... And I'm like, no, like, dress up and go round to your mate's house and have a fucking great night. I think it lends a sense of occasion.

19:11Also, by the way, you can take your shoes off at any point if they're hurting at a house party, even if you're dressed up, or if you're the host. Even more glamorous. Yeah. If you take your shoes off. If you're in an evening gown, your shoes are off. Glamour. 100%. Glamour. I also love what Phoebe's wearing. She's wearing a kind of gold medieval renaissance. Looks like she's doing Shakespeare in the park, but it's braided through with a glittering fabric and her hair is ringleted. She does look like she's doing Shakespeare in the park. But like the most fabulous version of that. Yeah. And it's a testament to her character and dressing her there that you don't even really look at it.

19:43Yeah. But in a good way. Yeah. When you actually analyse it, you're like, God, she looks phenomenal. But you're not like, why is she in almost fancy dress? Yeah, yeah. You know? Early Phoebe is styled so well. Towards the end of Phoebe, you get a lot of like what I theorise to be somebody who has like been poor their whole life and has never stopped shopping in charity shops. And so nothing really quite fits properly. and some things are just kind of novelty, but like she's never going to get out of that frame of mind. Yeah, there's a lot of bon marche by the end. Bon marche! Do you know what I mean?

20:11Bon marche, eh? I don't know. But just like, yeah. Like a lot of kind of like v-neck fuchsia jumpers with a little embellishment. Hate. Do you know what I mean? Hate. It's like, that's not Phoebe. Early Phoebe with the kind of waistcoats and ringlets and long dresses. They've been the best styling ever. Yeah, 100%. I think she looks amazing. Gorgeous. And you were kind of in a lovely semi, you were like a sort of sexy milkmaid at my party recently. Again, an outfit that I never wear out because I always feel like I'm a little bit in a costume, but in the context of a house party, gorgeous. And what makes this house party feel so real and good as well is that they're all way too dressed up, but they're essentially there to watch telly because the whole thing is that the American thing, which I believe is where the whole kiss at midnight thing comes from.

20:57Again, one of those things where I cannot tell whether it came from America or American sitcoms, the idea of having someone to kiss at midnight. Now that you're saying it, I don't know whether it was intrinsic or from TV. So much of my life I'm like, did Americans invent this? Or did American writers invent it for sitcom? I don't actually know. For example, the phrase bite me. American sitcom is full of people saying bite me with the tenor of fuck you. And is it just because American sitcom writers wanted to have something that sounded as extreme as fuck you? Yes, because they say it with such venom whenever they do say it in Friends.

21:33But I've just realised, not that I've just realised they don't swear, but I've never really consciously thought of that they have to have these six people who are in their 20s who would obviously be effing and blinding the whole time. And they have to be like, you know, even if they're talking about, I think they say the word sex, but if they're talking about anything specific with sex, it's all innuendo. Well, this is the kind of, this is what's so impressive from a writing perspective, because you have these, again, six people who are in their 20s, and they're supposed to be like, on the loser end of cool, right?

22:01But like still cool. They're dating. They're out. They're going to parties. They're having parties as we're talking about. And so but in order to have that feel like a realistic portrayal of people in their mid-twenties while simultaneously appealing to children and old people. Like the audience for sitcom is everyone. Yeah. It's like ages 12 to 90. Yeah. And to not offend any sensibilities is such a feat because they still do it. And there's like these weird things. We were talking the other day about the way Friends treats smoking feels so out of contact with everything, with how people in their 20s would behave in New York in the 90s.

22:37They do, like if you substituted every mention of a cigarette in Friends with smoking crack, the reaction would make sense. That would be the reasonable response. Like, Chandler, no! Chandler, you tried so hard, you stopped. You were out of it. You were out of it. He started doing it because his parents split up. What? Smoked a cigarette. A tiny succulent cigarette. What's the crime? A tiny succulent cigarette. And there's a whole bit where, it's another party episode actually, the one where Rachel smokes, where she smokes to be cool with the fashion girls. Yeah. The way this is talked about, it made me wonder, the whole thing, oh, these people smoke and they're bonding and coming up with all these professional fashion things and ideas and planning trips and shoots while they're smoking.

23:20I was like, is this a tongue-in-cheek thing about fashion and coke? Because if you didn't do coke in fashion in the 90s, I imagine that would be tricky. I wonder if this is all kind of coded, because I am thinking of Bite Me, yeah. Is this all the kind of, you know, it's a bit like when you do your online shopping, and it's like, we couldn't find you an apple. But is it all like, right, every time someone would say, fuck you, say Bite Me, every time it's smoking, it's coke. Every time, because even when, in another party episode, Monica gets it's the one where they all turn 30 Monica gets drunk because she doesn't realise Chandler has thrown her a surprise party yes and he's like oh my god your parents are in there and she's like my parents have never seen me drunk bearing in mind this is her 30th birthday party and she she acts and then her parents react as if she is like admitting to a class A drug addiction yes right it's so straight and then another one is where it's like the one where Ross gets high and the whole thing is that the Gellers don't like Chandler because they believe in college that Chandler got Ross high.

24:26And it's like, okay, that was 20 years ago. Yeah. Or whatever it was. But it makes you think that like, okay, I understand that we need these sort of like taboos or whatever to exist within the world of the show to create friction. But it does seem, and especially with the subject of house parties, in order for a house party to feel exciting and dangerous, It needs to be exciting and dangerous. In order for a sitcom to make a show that can play to nine-year-olds and 90-year-olds, nothing can be truly dangerous. And so there's the elevating of things like smoking a fag. You're totally right. You've got to kind of create the jeopardy.

25:03You've got to create the like, oh, the badass stuff. Next time I have a house party, should we put the friends rules on everything? So if I see anybody drunk or smoking one cigarette, I'll be like, Caroline, no. No, Caroline, you're out of this, man. we went to the meetings the meetings we all went to smoking rehab with you yeah come on we were happy for you you were free but yeah it is absolutely insane and I like this episode as well because there's loads of talk about them being single and they're trying to be like we're not going to bring a date to the party essentially they want to have a date free New Year's Eve so there's no pressure to kiss and then they all end up with a date and then by the end none of them have a date.

25:52I think many people have these awakenings and they come back to friends like for example realising how hot Tom Selleck is as Richard. Good lord. Good lord. But also realising that Janice is a babe. Yeah. She looks fucking unbelievable in this episode. She looks amazing. And when you're watching it you're like ugh Janice and then you watch it back as you know kind of with a break and with some clarity and you're like yeah she I think she was supposed to be you know not that attractive I mean I know she's supposed to be annoying which sure it's the voice right which makes her less attractive but like she's kind of the most beautiful woman I've ever seen yeah yeah she's got these like bee stung lips and this big pile of dark hair she looks like if Amy Winehouse never found drugs she does look like that actually do you know what Amy Winehouse is the response that you would have psychologically as a person if anyone was as mean to you as those friends are to Jamis yeah it's like she does nothing wrong she just has an annoying voice you live in New York people have voices she just likes Chandler her one crime is to like Chandler a lot and I also and this is kind of where it is all set up of like she is I mean I think the reason the Janice storyline is so good is because everyone's been somebody's Janice and everyone's had a Janice go on and it's your mates that are like oh for fuck's sake like not again totally and I think you were saying as well that it's not it's not necessarily that they hate Janice is that they don't want to have to talk about Chandler leaving Janice again.

27:20So right. The older you get the more you're like okay there's the bad news boyfriend or girlfriend your friend has but like then you leave and then we have to talk about you and there's just not that much to talk about and then I have to be do my concerned face and it's so boring. And we know you're going to get we're going to slag them off and then you're going to get back with them in five to six weeks. And so the cycle continues. I've had to be that friend for you. You have. For your Janice. You have. You have had to be a fan, Janice. If he's listening, hello. You know who you are. You have your Monica now, though, which is the first and last time Joey will ever be compared to that woman.

27:56Yeah, Janice has this very heartbreaking time where he breaks up with her again at this party. And she says, One of these times, Chandler, it's going to be your last chance with me. One of these times, it's going to be your last chance with me. And of course, at that point, no one can know. she's going to appear every season with another chance of Chandler being another shot at love with Chandler and this is just the beginning the final big question I have for you vis-a-vis house party etiquette and this specific episode is regarding fun Bobby who was a real recurring character in early Friends and if I can remember correctly it was always that fun Bobby was Monica's ex-boyfriend but it was always a reason why he couldn't be fun that day yes yeah yeah yeah so you have this like you have the character of him in your head without actually ever seeing that character because you're imagining what you've been told he is you've never we've never seen him be fun once yeah he can't be like the fun you have to it has to be imagined levels of fun because you probably can't emulate that in a sitcom because you know because you'd be having one cigarette exactly one cigarette and a cheeky line but he comes to the party and oh my god Fun Bobby is here yay and Fun Bobby's grandfather has just died and then he bums everybody out and brings the whole tone of the party down and that's how Monica loses her kiss at midnight.

29:14Yeah. My question for you is, do you think it is better to go to a house party in a bum-out mood and hope that the winds of the party will raise you or do you save everybody from your bum-out mood by abstaining and staying home? My advice would be to have one drink, possibly two, at a nearby pub with a trusted, close pal. and if you get the flavour head on out and that trusted close battle has to be trusted enough that they can be like you're not well yes you know what mate go home this isn't for you tonight yeah you're being a bummer and I say this with great love you're being a bummer but also has the chutzpah to go to a party alone yeah exactly mine would be Jamie Finn mine would be Jane County she'd be great yes exactly and that's exactly what you need that would be my advice to you because sometimes a house party like that especially if you know people and you know it's a sort of a friend group of yours can really really kind of like flush everything out brush away the cobwebs and make you feel like do you know what it's going to be okay but if you're just a little bit too sad it's the worst place you can be yeah god because you can't really be a wallflower like you can in a bar you know what the worst part is i remember going to one of your parties years ago where i was talking to your friend sash and i was not in the good way i can't remember why i just he was like how you been I haven't seen you in a long time and I was like you know what pretty depressed actually and I thought that I was doing that thing I thought I was almost like charming my way through my own mental state but in my head being like do you know what if I'm just frank about how I feel then we can all have a laugh about it and he just said to me don't bring that to me and then just talk to somebody else and I was like do you know what I don't know you well enough to bring that to you just starts having a total freak out Someone's telling me something important.

31:07No. Don't bring that to me. Oh, no, no, thank you. You're right. We all have to learn about boundaries, and I had to learn that day. Sometimes you have to relearn about boundaries. He wouldn't say that now, because he does know you. I also think a big faux pas in this episode is Joey's date bringing her kids to a party unasked. Yuck. Absolutely not. Never. But in the context of that she met him and he was a Christmas elf, maybe she just thought that hanging out with kids was a thing. She just thought he loves kids. I can just bring them around to a cool New York 20 somethings house party. It's also funny in the sense of like, I don't think, I mean, that's obviously a crazy situation for a sitcom.

31:41I don't think people are really bringing their kids to parties. But there is like a moment where someone in your 20s goes out with someone with a kid and thinks they can just sort of do it. Yeah. And thinks that like their life can just mesh in. And it's like, it can't mesh. We can just do the exact same things as before. No, you can't. I'm afraid. but yeah and I do final thing I would say about this episode is I do love the fact that they're watching the TV at midnight because I have been to New Year's parties where you know we're in a really cool house with really cool people and everything and then it's Jules Holland's food nanny on and then the fireworks on the London Eye it's so cute this is the thing I think this is a delicate art of a house party of like a mixture of the high and low an evening gown and telly exactly you know too much high it's pretentious event yes and it feels like a CV party too low and it feels like well I'm just round your house absolutely I'm just bloody round your house yeah tiny little activity 60 % of the way into the night I would say yeah bring everyone round and that activity can be singing someone happy birthday yes bringing out a cake yeah yeah yeah yes good one exactly let's move on the one with the two parties season 2 episode 22 so this is when Rachel's parents have just spit up and they they come to her surprise party and in order to keep the parents apart they have to separate the party across two flats.

33:01Yes, I think this is the perfect episode to demonstrate how to have a great house party and how not to. It's a direct comparison because the boys end up having quite, you know, it's not supposed to be in their flat, end up having quite an impromptu, you know, kind of a slightly more laddy, unorganised party with, you know, they're all kind of having a mad dance and they're all a bit pissed. and then Monica's trying so hard for the organised fun and this is really where we see Monica you know become you know she's Monica from the start but as in like this is her in a party situation being the most Monica you can possibly be It is bad and I love how this whole episode begins with this like protest from them because they're all in the diner and Monica says I'll get candled and my mum's lace tablecloth and seeing as it's Rachel's birthday I'll poach a salmon and Ross says why are our parties always about poaching things?

33:57And it's this very well-observed dynamic of like, sometimes your most organised friend is not your most fun friend, but the most organised friend often puts their chips on the organising and volunteers to do it. But it's like, no, we can't poach things tonight. I know. And often what you need is, you need the fun friends to come up with the idea and then the organised friend to implement it. Right. but with the chaos of the unorganised friend. So it's a logistical nightmare. It really is. Because oft you cannot have both. And yeah, and I feel like as well, when I was younger, I didn't really, when I watched this episode, you know, when it was on or whatever, when I was a kid, I didn't really get the, oh, her parents can't talk to each other, like whatever, why can't everyone just kind of grow up?

34:43And now that I've had friends whose parents have split up and like can't be in the same room together, you know, like people that are getting married and like both parents won't come to the wedding. You just think, get over yourself. This is so sad that you can't do that. You're an adult, whatever. And I really empathise with Rachel in this episode now. The fact that, you know, she's the adult now. Like she has to be the one that's, you know, that's keeping them apart. And everybody is like tiptoeing on eggshells, you know, because of these two adults that have split up, you know. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

35:18And there's a bit where she says, because this is when her and Ross are still going out. And he says, well, who cares? Let's just let them hash it out. They're grownups. And she goes, I care. Yeah, yeah. And she's like the thing of like, she's just seen them fight at her sister's graduation. She's like, if I watch them do it again, I'll die. And I've definitely spoken to people who've had that where they're like, they're just witnessing one more fight or one more awkward conversation with their parents away from like a total mental breakdown. I would rather uphold a fiction, actually. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

35:49And Rachel has a moment in this episode where she really seems like she's going to break down or whatever. And also, can I just say, the actor that plays Rachel's dad. Fit. Firstly, fit. We have not been focusing on him enough at the culture. We must find him. I'm sure he's dead. Possibly, actually, yeah. But also, whoever played that character, so formidable. I mean, I'm scared watching him. He feels like one of the great psychopaths of cinema. Yeah. he feels like he could be like an Alfred Hitchcock yeah yeah right just being like some kind of soulless monster right there's this bit where like Ross is trying to keep him busy and he sits down next to him in the armchair he's in the boys flat and says to him like so Dr.

36:31Geller how's the cardiovascular game going just because he's a heart surgeon or whatever and then he turns to Ross and he goes it's not a game Ross a woman died on my table today I would honestly speaking to that man and I always use this analogy would be like when somebody watches you type, you start making mistakes. Yes, and David Trimmer is so good at that in this whole episode. You're worse than your average self when you're in front of somebody being like that because you're so overly thinking. Someone watching you type is so correct. Isn't it? Because you know when someone is that antagonistic and that kind of against you, you start saying stuff where you're like, I don't know the end of the sentence.

37:13What am I going to say? I've panicked. I've gone totally off-piste. The bit of that episode that never fails to fucking make me laugh is that when he's like keeping Dr. Green away from the girl's flat. And so Ross goes into a bedroom to get Dr. Green's glasses, cigarettes and jacket. And on the way out, he gets waylaid by Rachel's mom. And she's like, oh, those look like my husband's things. Ross is like, no, no, I wear bifocals and I smoke cigarettes. And then he just like has that. And he looks so mental. he looks like Cat Stevens or something I was going to say he looks like when you put glasses and a hat on a dog that's exactly how he looks do you know what I mean the way David Schwimmer nominally a handsome man can make it look so fucking mental that he's smoking a cigarette and wearing glasses no actor has done it like it ever since it is like clowning almost yeah then he just goes out into the hallway and he's wearing them and like that cigarette is so in his mouth it looks like it has like goo and residue on it and Dr.

38:18Green is just there just staring at him everybody's met somebody like that and obviously it's a hyperbolised version of it but you're just in his shoes and you're just like oh no don't fuck it up I know the spin-off that came out of Friends was Joey but there's another spin-off where for whatever reason Ross and Dr. Green just hate each other just open some kind of practice together dinosaurs and heart medicine dinosaurs and hearts because I just love watching them react to each other and it's great in the later seasons as well when he comes back and he doesn't tip the waiter and Ross does it's just electric those two yeah he's absolutely brilliant I'm going to look into that actor after this episode but then that bit where like he's trying to go to the other it's constant shuttling oh it's incredible physical comedy in this episode yeah where the boys like he's like he's like they keep trying to make excuses to keep him in the thing and they're like no he's like shut up everyone I'm doing what I want because he just can't be contained and he marches across the hole and they dance him across the hole yeah they're like like trying to shout kind of above Rachel's mum like who's literally stood there like a Bob Fosse amoeba just like all the legs moving at once it's like when you're trying to get your drunk mate into a club and you're trying to you're trying to kind of up your drunkenness by like two points so that they don't see and surround them so that they don't seem like they're off they're not I am dancing for anyone it really is it's one of the great house parties of Friends but it's also one of the greatest episodes of Friends I think I think so yeah it's brilliant there's so much stuff going on and I really like as well there's a really sad moment a really poignant moment in this episode as well when Rachel's sort of having it out with her mum about the divorce and you know about how they can't be in the same room and all this sort of stuff and Mrs Green says you didn't marry your berry honey I married mine and you're like oh it's like one of those things where you're like oh my parents are human Awful Her I think she actually says that line In a previous episode Like a few episodes previous Oh is it?

40:19No but there's more of that in there I can understand why you were confused Because it's like There's all these bits Where Rachel is just sort of Zoned out Listening to her parents Complain about each other And it's cutting between the two parents And it's like Her mum is like You work And you work on a marriage And it goes to Dr. Green Like you work And you work on a boat And then it comes to this Really lovely moment Where it comes to the very end where Rachel's having a complete melter in the corridor with Chandler and he's just like, yeah, because he's been through it as well. Yeah, because he's like the poster boy for it.

40:54And it's like, they have very few moments together. I think everyone likes when they're alone together because there's very few reasons for them to be together, those two. And it's always nice and he's like, yeah, it's really horrible. And she has this very lovely bit about how she's never going to have a 4th of July again with her parents on the boat where everyone just shuts up and watches the fireworks together. and he just gives her this big hug and then Ross comes out and transfers the hug on to her. It's like the way in which your friends can care for you like a spouse would or like a partner would.

41:22It's like they're offering the same level of support. It's like, yeah. And they've been through it. They've been through the same thing as you rather than your parent kind of helping you through something. It's like, no, you're my peer here and you've gone through this thing. Yeah. Yeah. So I'm kind of like, I am your parent in this scenario because I have been through it. Yeah. And I know what you're feeling. It's really nice. And it's like there's so much in... I guess naturally in this miniseries you keep talking about the nature of friendship anyway. It's impossible not to with this. But it's something really nice about the way the hug transfer happens of Chandler and Rachel to Ross and Rachel.

41:58And the way he kind of passes her over like a little kitten. And it's like not... I think there's this perception with friendship and with romantic relationships that the romantic relationship is the thing where you get the ultimate comfort from. but there's this nice thing in this episode where it's like oh they're not ranked do you know what I mean? there's like a level thing of like being able to get comfort from all of your friends and your boyfriend in the same way which when you get older and people get married and again why the premise of this show was fundamentally always going to date you do disappear more into your heteronormative or whatever or your marriages or whatever partnership you're in and you don't get the same solace from friends that you used to emotionally because often you stop telling them stuff because life gets harder and more embarrassing.

42:45Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. And especially as you're in slightly different stages, you don't want to tell your friend that's in the throes of this horny, new, amazing relationship that maybe yours has an issue or something like that. Or you don't want to tell your friend who's renting that you're having a problem with your mortgage. Or once you get older, the comparison... Dali always refers to the 30s as the comparison generation because when people's situations just change, whether it's romantically or where they're living or their jobs or their families, and it becomes this thing where you want to protect the taste or the kind of comfort level of everyone.

43:20So people just share less. I wish I did in a way. I mean, not you, people. Yeah, I think I've held that tradition quite well. But yeah, but I do know what you mean. It's completely true. And I also, I feel like the little bits in this episode like that Chandler and Rachel bit have kind of seeped into common parlance because a few weeks ago my friends Roddy and Rich went for a drink together and then they said oh we're out having some sake in some Japanese bar and my friend Jamie Allerton just said this feels like a Rachel and Chandler episode what's going on like they never hang out on their own that's so funny so it is that thing like you say it's nice to see them have a kind of a serious moment together because they're never really on their own.

44:07No. And yeah, bonding over that little thing. Yeah. Such a small bit of this episode. It's so good. The bit with Phoebe trying to smuggle people out. Oh, that's fantastic. So there's like, if you really think of like the physical, like again, what's achieved in 24 minutes. We said a minute ago with everyone, swearing they won't get a date, then getting dates, then losing dates by the end of the episode. In this, not only do we have the shuttling back and forth of Rachel's parents, we also have the shuttling back and forth of guests who are nameless. Yeah. Because Phoebe has... So many nameless guests.

44:39She's like smuggling them. She's smuggling them out of Europe during the war. Yeah, and they're like, oh, can I take a drink? And she's like, no, they have everything you need in there. Like, just take nothing. Take nothing. You take coach, she'll get suspicious. Yeah, yeah, yeah. You and you, but not you. Not you. Not yet. No. It's so good. It's absolutely brilliant. And then, you know, Monica kind of goes mad at her because she finds out. and it's just amazing because you can never tell your friend that's bad or boring at a party that they are. Yeah. And you just have to do your best. You can.

45:07Yeah. Her little game, we're writing down your most embarrassing moment and then we never hear about anyone's embarrassing moment because she gives them a lecture on markers. And there's a brilliant bit as well where right at the end, Mrs. Green, who kind of thinks she's had a good time because she knows she's been in this awful marriage for 40 years or whatever and she's like, oh, she says something like, let me know what poem you make with my 10 words. and you just know you're like oh my god people have come to me because I run a club night and stuff like that and I you know and I hopefully throw a good house party and I run comedy gigs and do comedy gigs and stuff people often say to me I've had this idea for a night or I've had this idea for a party or I've had this idea for whatever like some kind of event and they tell me like four things they want to do during the night and I'm like people I can't think of it but what I'm saying is they'll be like so I thought we could all you have to show such and such to get in and then you have to and then what I thought we'd do is kind of like emotional charades or whatever and then I thought we could all get at one point we could all get into groups and it has to be that you do and I'm like people don't want an itinerary on a night out people want like you say maybe a little event a tiny theme if it's like a book launch or something like that a lovely little five minute speech a theme of cocktail absolutely that's the level that people want they want a little common ground they're there anyway if they were at a party they probably want to be there.

46:29Like, don't interrupt their night with activities that you think are going to make it unique. No one gives a fuck. Right? And I'm not talking about an activity-specific night. I'm talking about any type of party. And that's what, like, Monica's doing here. And then it's just, you know, you go into the other room and you can just let loose. Because it's a party. Have you ever had a situation where there was, like, a game like that where it went well? I guess when people invite you around for a murder mystery, it's different because you know what you're doing. Yeah, that's totally different. And I enjoy those things because I know I'm going around for that.

47:01In fact, since I last spoke to you a couple of days ago, I was booked to do a quiz for like a corporate networking mingling night. It was like a party, right? And the mistake that everybody makes with stuff like this when you have comedy at a corporate or something like a quiz. And a quiz is quite good because you can still kind of chat. Yeah, yeah. It's like, you know, it's kind of informal. Camaraderie, teams, funny team names. Exactly, that funny team names. and, you know, I'm a comedian, but I wasn't doing it like completely straight-laced or whatever. It's like, it's a good idea for something where people might not know each other and it's a bit networky and stuff like that.

47:35They did it. The people have been there since five. They put me on to do the quiz at nine. Do you think one person cared or listened to anything I had to say? No, because they've been at the thing for four hours and they now don't want to be told to sit down and shut up and listen to somebody else. If you're going to do a thing like that, it has to be early in the night. when people are still getting lubed up. It has to be the first thing. It has to be the first thing as people are getting a drink. Then after it, they've got someone to talk to someone they don't know about, about what just happened.

48:05The comedy set or the quiz or whatever. Or the bit of paper that's been handed. Yeah, whatever it is. And the place we met where we worked, the launch night of that, they were like, we're going to have a talk here, then a talk here, then a talk here, then a talk there. And I was like, no one will listen. People are stood up having a drink. Do you think they gave a fuck? The instinct is to chat. The instinct is to chat. That's why you're there. People haven't seen each other in a while. all that sort of stuff so yeah just and Monica is essentially the corporate quiz at this at this night you need minimal structure for a great party it's so funny though you need lots of other things but you don't need any itinerary and also it's very relatable as well to this time of life when it's funny with the friends because some of the friends have jobs and it means nothing to them like for example Phoebe being masseuse means nothing Chandler's job who no one knows the name of transponstant means nothing it's just sort of like a vague sort of gesture to like who what kind of a person they are.

48:56But like Monica and her food stuff, her food career is like very intrinsic to the Monica character because it's all caught up with her weight and her eating. It's actually quite bleak in many ways. But like it's that point of your life with your career where you don't essentially have a career yet, but you have all this frustrated ambition. So she's putting all this like frustrated food ambition into her friend's party who doesn't care. Who doesn't care, yeah. Which is why Rachel has a birthday flan. Is that not the saddest thing you've ever heard in your life? I know. But it's so a 25-year-old who desperately wants to work in food.

49:32I know. I know. And at the time, I think, is she working at the diner? Yeah, with the big fake tits. Yeah, yeah. So she's like, I've got no creativity in my actual job. I'm going to bring it into my life. Everyone will appreciate it. And they keep referring to it as a custard-based Mexican dish. Which is so funny because a flan now, we all know what flan is. But do we all know what flan is because of friends? Because of friends, yeah. I wouldn't I don't think I would know but there's something quite cute about it knowing how like how fancy this show ends up getting like that in the the kind of credit scene in this whole episode is just the credits playing over the flan with like happy birthday Rachel and then like a volleyball hits it it's really stylistic at the end isn't it yeah it is but also kind of quaint and shitty you know like that's exactly how a birthday flan would look in someone's apartment yeah because how many times have you brought out a birthday cake and somebody has one slice on the night maybe two and then it just sits there withering withering with the candles on like a 45 degree angle God I remember when you and I used to work together and there was like a clutch of birthdays all every woman we worked with was the same star sign for some reason there was like a few weeks where it was just Collins every day I still can't eat Colin the caterpillar I can't I can't I actually think I've got an aversion to it now yeah I'm immediately transported to having to set an alarm in the morning to get up for a job I didn't want to do I can't even eat one of those boots without wanting to gag his little boot the next one we have is season 3 episode 11 the one where Chandler can't remember which sister now in terms of actual parties in Friends I think this is not only one of my favourites because they do actually get Chandler gets really drunk I think it's the most British because it's quite DIY it seems kind of it's kind of yucky yeah it's just like a sort of icky house party with a big drinks table arranged by boys yes exactly Yeah, yeah, yeah.

51:22It's your mates that have quickly gone, oh, it's Joey's birthday. We're going to throw him a party. And Chandler has the fear the next day about the fact that he can't remember which sister he, again, maybe it's a sitcom thing, fooled around with. Fooled around. What does that mean? Did you figure it out? It must mean fingered. You're right. All that sort of stuff. And he says, I fooled around. I also, I don't think you see people getting the fear after a night out in a sitcom a lot. Yeah, yeah, yeah. And so I really like that. So for Americans, what is the fear? The fear is... Lily Allen wrote a song about it.

51:53Yes, she did. The fear is when you wake up. Do you know what the worst type of fear is? You wake up after a big night and your memory hasn't really caught up with you yet. So you're just like, oh, what a night. And then what happens is you start to realise you don't remember some of the night. Yeah. And then the worst thing in the world is sometimes, this has happened to me a couple of times, you get a text from someone you didn't even realise was on the night out saying, how are you feeling today? And then the fear sets in. That's terrible. Yeah, yeah. And then you realise that you were, like, out of control.

52:24You don't know what you said. So you're just panicked that... I don't have the thing of, like, oh, everybody hates me, which I think is what most people say. But I think I have the panic of, like, oh, God, I said some weird stuff and people are going to be talking about it today. I said some weird stuff would be a big one, yeah. Because for me, I rarely don't remember something. Like, I'm generally compescentist. I get giddy, I get excited, I get silly. And I say mental shit. Yeah, yeah, yeah. And I love saying mental shit. I will never stop. Yeah. I will also never stop getting the fear about it.

52:57And I also think, though, that 99 times out of 100, the fear is unwarranted, yeah. Because also, whenever I've seen anyone else in a situation where they've been way more drunk than everybody else, nine times out of ten, they're fine, and you're laughing at them, and it's silly, but you're not like, oh, I don't like that person, or they're an idiot, or whatever. You're just like, yeah, Steve's out of you. Do you know what I mean? like he's having the time of his life I actually can't even talk about the fear for too long without remembering times I've had the fear and then I get the kind of hormonal drag of having the fear again yeah yeah it's horrible just remembered one time yeah it's the absolute worst and you're texting around everyone being like was that alright last night but yeah Chandler has this when he walks in it's kind of like the one of the best things I like about House Party as well is the is the post-match day analysis you know like there's a lot of post-match day analysis in this one yeah there's a I love talking about dissecting the House Party and the tribes that formed and who became friends with who and all that sort of stuff and who you know snogs who or whatever um and i think that they're doing they're doing that a lot in this and they're trying to help him you know they realize their friend's fucked up and he's like oh my god i've got to try and remember which sister and they're all kind of there's like a great camaraderie in the in the delirium yeah party and chandler's like you know in that place that we've all been where he's panicking and and yeah it's brilliant i think i love this one it's i love looking at that drink table so much because Again, it's such an English or Irish drink.

54:17It's a Western European drinks table. Because it's a lot of like two litre bottles of mixer with the cap off. Room temperature. Room temperature. And just like the trestle table is like sticky. I don't think there's even a cover on it. No, there's no cover on it. I do think that boy apartment is one of the best observed spaces. Oh, yeah. If you look around that flat, nothing matches. anything else it all looks like shit they found on the street yeah and it probably I mean it's not because it's an LA set but you know what I mean just living in New York that's what you would find like a random it's a random tribal mask in there for no reason yeah the set designer of that because the girls apartment is nice and lovely but the boys apartment is so boyish and the older you get the shitter it looks as well it's so brown and beige and yellow and I would say in fact I was doing an interview earlier today and I walked past my friend's it was called Ladpad a friend's house that three boys I know used to live in.

55:17Shout out Hubert, Jamie and Rich. And it was the worst flat I've ever been in in my life. It was a new build. The actual flat was nice. They just... They had like a camping chair in the front room. It was just a nightmare. I was like, guys, you could... And like one bit of art on the walls, like it was in the wrong frame. And honestly, it was so bleak. So, you know... There's a lot of panic in this episode about friends getting off with your siblings? Yeah, I think it's always a weird thing. My sister has been with her boyfriend for like a million years, so I've never had it. And I don't think she's ever had it the other way around.

55:57But I can't imagine that I would be that bothered unless it was someone really horrible. But in terms of your friends. I've had it happen a few times. That's just what happens when you have a brother who's close in age. But like, and to be honest, it's kind of whatever. like I guess it's different when it's a older brother and a younger sister there seems to be more of a protective vibe there but I because me and my brother are so close in age I remember when he used to have house parties when our parents were away because he was cool and I was not and he used to invite loads of girls around and some of those girls because I'm only the school year below him would be from my class and I would literally be upstairs alone in my room trying to fucking play Everybody Hurts on acoustic guitar and these girls from my class would come up to the stairs and be like in their tarty clothes or whatever and be like hey oh that is a nightmare that is a living nightmare i would hate it was in a word character building yes oh my god now i know why you're so successful because i have such an axe to grind with so many people to be fair when my sister got with my brother-in-law now um he's in my school year he wasn't in my school but he was in my school year and a lot of my friends knew him and my sister had the she was like the cat that got the cream when she first got him because he's four years older oh my god my sister and my sister was always like oh do you know so-and-so and i was like yes charlotte like i've known them for ages she was like oh right yeah well i was out with him on the weekend and it was very like charlotte you bitch yeah she was rubbing it in my face um but it worked out so yeah but it's very it's very like um you know italian catholic uh right because this is the only time that we go we see the whole tribiani family yeah yeah yeah and um there's a brilliant bit as well you mentioned the other day when we were talking about this about Joey's grandma he's saying like that she's really formidable she's the sixth person to have spit on Mussolini's corpse so there's so many good which is incredible good bit there's another line I think it's in this episode maybe the previous one we're talking about where Joey comes up to Chandler in the middle of the party he says hey I have a question for you about volleyball how much do you like that grey lamp in your room it's just such beautiful joke writing it's incredible isn't it But yeah, and I think there is also a little bit of that 90s overprotective, like you touched my property, which means like a female family member.

58:15But, you know, it was 1995 or whatever when it came out. So it is, yeah, it's great the way it all sort of plays out and Chandler kind of tries to rectify it and then snogs another sister, doesn't he? Yeah, I do think it's great. I think it's a really sloppy, it feels impromptu house party that kind of something mad happens at and, you know, someone gets way too drunk. There's jello shots. There's jello shots and they, yeah, the most American thing ever and they're like bright blue, I think. Yeah. And they look like they're in sort of ketchup dishes. Yes, they do. They're almost in ramekins or something.

58:47They get like a burger restaurant. Yeah. And Gunther is there, obviously. Gunther gets an invite to every party. Yeah. It's because it's the only like sort of extra person that's in Friends. But that's kind of crazy when you think about it. Yeah. There's no like, you know, you've got Mr. Heckles in like series one. There are very few like reoccurring characters There's really... Yeah. There's like the super... Trigger. Yeah, Trigger. Trigger. Yeah. Mr. Heckles, he dies. Gunther. And a lot of people are kind of two or three episode wonders. Do you know what I mean? I mean, even David, who, you know, Phoebe gets with in the New Year's party one, we're supposed to believe that he's like this great love.

59:23The love of her life. I think just because they kind of forgot to give her like a romantic storyline. Do you know what just occurred to me literally in the shower today? Yeah. Do you remember when Phoebe went out with a cop for a while? Yes. For what? That like ages. Yeah. and then they were going to move in and then he shot a bird yeah

59:39such a funny way to close out a romance yeah he shot a bird brilliant though if they were like well we're not going to make this guy a proper thing so we need to get rid of him fast but like it's been a really good relationship so what would be the worst thing for this character to do you know what I mean yeah so yeah she has like little relationships but there's no kind of you know Ross and Rachel are this yeah and then like once she gets with Mike that's kind of it then yeah and I think they were like oh we'll bring David back as if he's some great love and I think the plan was probably to ham that up and make David the one but I think Paul Rudd was just so unbelievably attractive and like and you know handsome and everyone loved him that they were like oh no we're gonna make it Paul Rudd yeah yeah like I think they thought that the audience would think it was more of a harder choice than we thought and nobody did listen we love Hank Azaria but it's Paul Rudd yeah it's Paul Rudd yeah without a doubt yeah so jammy I know like just imagine being um Jennifer Arsene must have been livid I know I've been kissing Ross yeah I've been kissing David Schwimmer for 10 years Kudrow was snogging Rudd yeah you'd be livid do you reckon they said to Lisa Kudrow who do you want your like final love to be yeah and she was like can we get Paul Rudd Okay, so we're kind of halfway through the sort of party going time.

1:00:54we're at the end of season three we started strong with that New Year's party like lots of 20-somethings trying to be fancier than they are very relatable then we're kind of like plateau kind of spiking with the sort of manic energy of like the two parties and the sister and all that the kind of madness and now we're going to talk about the sort of downslide moment that you mentioned at the top of the podcast which is that strange moment in your late 20s when you decide you're 50 yeah yeah and you think that kind of having fun is a marker of immaturity and... Right! Juvenality, is that a word?

1:01:31And yet, but you're not, like, you're sort of trying to be something that you're not and it makes for a shit fucking party. And this is a shit fucking party. Yeah. It's one of a few shit fucking parties around this time, but the episode's called The One Where Rachel Smokes, which we mentioned already. The one where Rachel does lines of cocaine. And the main thing about this party is that it's, Monica takes over. no surprise and her and Phoebe were supposed to plan it together but Phoebe can only be in charge of Cups and Ice yeah the Cups and Ice is funny like it's funny to watch but in terms of you watch the vibe of the party people are standing around to reggae music and like this is where all the party episodes from here on out tend to there's no mayhem there's just people standing in groups and often people saying that they're having a bad time yeah and I think I mean maybe they didn't do it on purpose but maybe it is a comment on that thing where you're trying to be something that you're not and therefore it's just you think that being boring is being sophisticated.

1:02:31Yeah. And you think that all this drama and, you know, somebody getting too drunk and everything is, oh, that's beneath you. And it's like, no, that's why you have a party. This is where we downshift into CV parties. It is a CV party. It's a comparison generation where a comparison era of one's life where the horses are beginning to separate in the race or whatever. People are getting fancy jobs. They're not getting fancy jobs. and so parties become worse because they are about comparing your CV. Yeah, and you long for the time in the future which will happen in three to four business years where people just go.

1:03:02Where like people move away and then I remember you saying this to me maybe it was on a podcast or maybe it was on a show but you were like in your 30s the dance purists emerge and it's so true because the people who like still want to go out and really like tear up a dance floor and be a bit silly and mad or whatever are kind of left and all the dancing poseurs have gone to have kids. Yeah, the people that are performatively boring where they're like, oh, I just can't even have two drinks anymore. All right, well, why don't you just go and die? do you know what I mean? Like people that are kind of trying to show off to you about how they don't have fun anymore and you think, what is your aim here?

1:03:41Because I don't, I mean, go and not have fun somewhere else and I think they eventually, yeah, they all like, you know, you're so funny and merciless when it comes to people who don't want to do what you want to do. It's not that. I love it. I don't want you ever to change. Okay, yeah. I do genuinely think do whatever makes you happy. And for some people that are staying in every night and go for it. But it's almost the people that are trying to persuade themselves that they're not as fun anymore. That's what does my head in. I've got mates that genuinely, they are just like, they're a cat. They're on a sofa in pyjamas, 340 nights of the year.

1:04:09Yeah, and I love it. Crack on. Yeah. And I go around to theirs when I want to do that. Yeah, yeah. And also, what's nice about those friends as well is they want to hear about the gas happening at the party. Absolutely, because they've got no desire to be there. But it's the people that I think they're trying to persuade themselves of something. You get this very often with reformed party girls, where particularly the kind of women who did a bunch of drugs in the 90s, had sex with famous people, lived it all, wore the tiny outfit, and then they come through the tunnel of that. And because they weren't really able to find...

1:04:43They're not all addicts, but they find it hard to have a relationship with moderation. and so they just sort of disappear into wealthy marriages where they then become mummy at full-time mummy. Again, nothing wrong with it, but the way they talk about their past is as if they were a kind of a reptilian creature and anyone still having a laugh is a reptile. That's exactly it. And that's what I don't like because I think, as in, you know, if that's genuinely what they want to do, then that is absolutely fine. Nobody wants to have a combative relationship with fun. I'm going to put that out there.

1:05:18Nobody does. And if you are performing that, there is something rotten in the state of Denmark. There's something wrong. That's exactly what I'm getting at. It's the gap between what you say you like and what you actually like that people can see through a mile off. That's what I can't. By the way, I hate the word inauthenticity because I feel like wellness cunts have just co-opted that. But it's the inauthenticness of the people that pretend that they suddenly want this life of like 2.4 children and a white picket fence. and I want to live in some god-forsaken town where there's one pub. And then all they do is complain about it while saying, like, oh, no, but no, I needed to do that.

1:05:53And then lo and behold, seven years later, without a doubt, some bomb goes off in their life, whether it's, like, a divorce or they want a new partner or they're like, I need to move back to zone one immediately or do something. Because you can't, because you're essentially, you've kept yourself in this box for so long that isn't you. whereas actually what you needed to do was just like take it take the vat off like this is a phrase that you've introduced me to this week yeah the vat off just take the vat off yeah yeah basically like whatever you're doing do less take 20 off take 20 off and you would have been fine and you could still have fun without going yeah yeah yeah and obviously like it is different yeah but that's not what we're talking about we're talking about people who you know suddenly they're like oh you know oh this is henry and i've married him and you're like what?

1:06:42No. This is Henry and I've married him. No you haven't. What? And yeah that's what I can't say. I think essentially to bring it back to the episode I think that's who Monica is being in this episode. She's like trying to be this adult thing and this is how adults have parties and this is how adults have fun. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Tuscan finger food. Yeah. Exactly. Fuck off. Get a prawn ring from Iceland and enjoy yourself. You and the prawn ring. I love a prawn ring. It's a symbolic thing. Yeah. Also, something very interesting about this episode is that Rachel comes in and she's like, oh my God, wow, surprise.

1:07:16It's a month early. And she goes, guys, Chandler's birthday is before mine. Yeah. And everyone's just like, oh, some people are going to have a big birthday party thrown for them and some people aren't. And that is indicative of life. It's really tough, that one. That's an allegory, I think, as well. Because the thing is, Chandler is, I would say, a really main friend. He's like a big... They're all a main friend. I know, but what I mean is like... He's the centre of a lot of interpersonal drama. Yes, and he's literally in one of the two main flats. You know, like Phoebe and Ross are kind of, I always think...

1:07:48Tertiary friends? Yeah, slightly out of it because... Well, they're not holding parties. We haven't even talked about the party that Ross throws in his building. Oh, God, yes! Oh, my God, because we've just been focusing on the two main flats. But the party where he just moves into Ugly Naked Guy's flat, he is expected to give money to the retiring of the caretaker or the janitor or whatever he's like I've just moved in I don't know this caretaker I shouldn't have to give$200 to him which I'm sorry I was agreeing principles my principles yeah $200 if it was$20 I'd be like yeah sure I've just moved in $200 for a guy I've never met for a guy I've never met I was on board with Ross there I was on board with Ross there yeah yeah but then it just spirals out of control and he throws a party and then your man's retirement party is the same day.

1:08:39Yeah, it just completely goes off piece. I guess it's not a real house party episode because the house party doesn't really happen. I mean, there is a house party. It just happens on another floor and it looks like a massive rave. And it looks great. That pilot would be in top three, I think. Howard. If we saw any of it. Yeah, Howard, the, you know, whatever it is, the super. Yeah. Yeah, I totally forgot about that one. Gosh, yeah. But what was it? Yeah, so sorry. Chandler then forgetting his birthday it's so funny because he is like such a you know he lives with Joey he's in the kind of main physical yeah the main logistical two flats where a lot of the storylines happen and yeah sometimes there are these digs kind of thrown at him yeah no one really likes him yeah yeah which is so weird I think we've talked about this elsewhere but like this idea that like I think most people have this relationship with Chandler when they're young being like god I wish I was that funny god it would be so amazing to be that funny I wish I was his friend I wish I was his girlfriend yeah and then as you get older you'll be like I would not be friends with that man.

1:09:35Yeah. I would not make it through a conversation with that man. I would like to be a work friend of him. Yeah. Yeah. But just the constant zinging. Exactly. It's so strange how the older you get, the less and less you value that in a person. I know. And we both were talking about this the other day, that actually you really like Joey. Yeah. Every episode we've done on this podcast so far, everyone's been like, I really love Joey this time, right? You're solid, kind of fit mate that you probably would sleep with. Yeah, and it's just easy to be around. Yeah, just nice, good, solid, stupid. Bit of a laugh, relaxed.

1:10:12Yeah, never going to have men's mental health. He will never have men's mental health. He's always your mate that you call up. Do you want to go for a beer? Yeah. Yeah. You know, lovely, stunning. This is something I've been talking about a lot with Gav as we've been watching The Traders, is that I'm so obsessed with that guy, Joe, the rugby guy. I'm sorry, you haven't been watching it. You don't watch it. I'm the only one in the UK, but I have seen a lot of stuff about him. People don't like him, do they? I love him. I think I love him because, and this is where it's relevant, my favourite genre of man is the thoughtful meatball.

1:10:47You've been investing in thoughtful meatball since 2014. I saw that every day on your story. I have a vested interest in Thoughtful Meatball Incorporated the thing about okay we've just gone through the era of the rat boy probably a recession indicator and the idea that like all these guys like Miles Teller and Jeremy Ellen White and these kind of like can I just say very quickly Jeremy Ellen White was on Graham Norton with the personality of a fucking plant he doesn't seem fun god he seems like a bore he doesn't seem fun these boys with interesting faces and sort of spindly bodies who he's not spindly But do you know what I mean?

1:11:22Like just sort of like Sinewy Pretty and unusual And like what is he thinking? Timmy t 'heilby Timmy t 'heilby They've never been my judge personally Because my personal experience with men like this Often tends to be They've grown up being called gay Yes And that has made them By unthoughtful meatballs Thoughtless meatballs Yes So they've grown up with a chip on their shoulder They think that girls don't like them And they think that other men think they're gay And so they are passive aggressive to women and they suck up to other men. They can often be cowardly. I'm not saying that this is a blanket thing.

1:11:56No, no, no. I'm just saying lots of men who discover through the rat phase that they're apparently hot have a kind of a toxic vibe and this is where it comes from. Had a kind of a not hot at school, got hot after school kind of... Rage. Bitterness, yeah. Bitterness and rage, yeah. Now they're cleaning up on the apps and they want to punish everybody. Yes. They want to punish everybody. Yes, I think that's a fair assessment. Bring in the thoughtful meatball. The thing about thoughtful meatball is that a real thoughtful meatball has been six foot since he was 12. Yeah. He's been shaving since he was nine.

1:12:28And he has a pituitary gland that has been working overdrive since the day he was born. And so he's probably been brought up by people who are like, the thing is, is that our child scans as a man. And we must treat him to tread gently through this treacherous world because women will fear his murderous bulk. Yes. So we must teach him to speak softly to women and open the door and be a gentleman because otherwise people will find him scary and weird. Yeah, I do know what you mean. I think those guys overcompensate for the fact that people find them physically imposing and therefore think they're going to be kind of macho or testosterone.

1:13:04And they're often very gentle and very thoughtful. Yes, yes. And I bet they hug like a fucking dream. You can just lose yourself in there. Gavin O'Day's hugs. He's a thoughtful meatball, alright? He is thoughtful meatball. I hope you play like nice lift music as you do that pitch. It's like, and here enters the thoughtful meatball. The thoughtful meatball has been scanning as a man since 12.

1:13:36Reach out to your thoughtful meatball today. Check in on your thoughtful meatball. I've always loved a thoughtful meatball, man. And I just think something about that Joe guy. it's really I'm like it's the age of the thoughtful meatball fair play yeah also Travis Kelsey the thoughtful meatball I'm not sexually attracted to Travis Kelsey but I enjoy a thoughtful meatball yeah why not yeah because he's smart enough to know how dumb he is and he knows what side his bread is buttered on whereas rat boys always think they can do better yes yeah yeah yeah because they want to test the limits of how far this rat attractiveness will take them I don't think Joey's a rat boy my boyfriend but I think he's like a he's a rat man like a happy snake

1:14:18he's such a happy snake yeah thoughtful meatball and happy snake we gotta move on alright the one with the Halloween party season 8 episode 6 that's where Ross comes as Sputnik or Spudnik yes I think this is a classic it's come full circle because it's quite a good party and they're a bit older you know even just me picturing it now I feel like there's kind of quite nice food and drinks about it's like you know everyone's kind of looking like Monica looks really glam again as like she's in like a cat lady yeah and I think and as well you know this is when it's come full circle and some people have had you know that relationship where they're pretending to be grown up too soon and stuff like that like Ross brings Mona so it's like a date scenario yes Phoebe is single she falls in love with Ursula's fiance played by Sean Penn Sean Penn Academy Award nominee yeah so there's like there's drama going on not drama but you know i mean there's like yeah there's romantic um excitement going on even though like chandler and monica i think are like married by this point and you know all that sort of stuff so there's like so there's like stability and then you know people that are in there kind of at this by this point like mid-30s or whatever yeah still dating and kind of doing this you know this dance yeah i think it's really they're they're kind of first relationships so the first major marriages or whatever like ross has been divorced three times yeah jesus things have broken like people have been humbled by life enough to just be silly again enough to wear a spud costume yeah the pretense from everybody is sort of worn off a bit it's actually just like no let's just have fun do you know who I don't get in this episode go on Chandler the bunny he's wearing a pink bunny outfit and he like just looks really unhappy yeah and it's like oh you're so stupid and embarrassing you're in a pink bunny it's like it's a costume party it doesn't really work yeah it's really strange and I don't He looks like a mascot for a football team or something like that.

1:16:16His thing is to be grumpy that he's doing this job. He lost a big job and now he's a mascot. He's like he's fallen from grace. You're right, it's weird. Yeah, Russell's costume, great. Yeah, all of the rest of them I think are pretty good. Have you ever gotten the ick with someone over their Halloween costume? That is a great question. It's a question you only ever ask someone if you have an answer ready to go. Oh, go on. I was going to say because I don't off the top of my head I don't think I have I remember when when me and Gab early doors were still going out together we still work in the same office yeah and we had an annual Christmas party and the Christmas party was always um costume yeah and he wanted to he went as the ghost of Christmas present but he was a ghost who was dressed as a Christmas present so he was in a big cardboard box that looked like a gift and I was like this is the unfittest thing I have ever seen in my life just like being with a man who is like got a huge prop a big box a big box yeah oh no I remember I was just like I think I gotta break up with you

1:17:24that would give me the ick as well actually I don't I haven't had it yet but maybe it's coming yeah not that I can think of I used to love whenever I was going out with someone at uni or something like that I used to love dressing them up in drag oh really not in a sexy way I was just fascinated to see what they would look like yeah but yeah the big yeah the big present no absolutely not it was like a big it was so big and it was just like a big prop that was always around and then when the prop was off the outfit made even less sense yeah and it's just like they just look like Morph yeah because they're just in like tight clothes yeah yeah I love that in this episode Joey is dressed as Chandler oh my god yeah he's like I'm Chandler and everyone's just like oh yeah yeah okay it's so fun and also the fact that Ross and Chandler have a arm wrestle in this episode oh yeah and they're both equally as strong or equally as weak yeah yeah and again there's just that that natural assumption that like Joey is like the coolest and the most masculine and the strongest and like even Chandler's wife like Monica's just like you're the strongest apart from Joey I love when they look to Joey for masculine concerns yeah I love that I love this in fact there's a there's a great bit in the one I think where Chandler pulls Joey's sister.

1:18:41It's one of my favourite lines of all time and I use it, I would say, so much in life. Where it's the first episode that Rachel meets Mark. Oh, yes. And Ross is jealous and he's just at the party and Joey's like not even in the same conversation as him. And Rachel's like, how dare you suggest that this man would only be nice to me because he wants to get me into bed or whatever. And then Ross just turns around to Joey and goes, hey, Joey, are men ever nice to strange women just to be nice? And he goes, no, only for sex. And he's like, thank you. And I'm like, that is such a brilliant piece of, like, anthropological study.

1:19:13It's so good. And also, what I like about that as well is that you get this B-side from Monica being like, does that mean he gets to? Yeah, which is completely true. Which is the other half of that. The other half of that, which men do not want to hear. No, they don't. But, you know, it's so just brilliant. Like, Joey is like your mate that you would call in a breakup when you're ready to be told the truth. and there's a bit in another the one where they all turn 30 which there's a house party and where Monica gets drunk where Phoebe actually realises she's 31 yeah and she's like oh my god I've lost a year I haven't done any of the stuff I was going to do by the time I'm 31 I haven't had the perfect kiss I haven't met a Portuguese person and then like Joey she goes like sort of walks home because she's sad and then he just like follows her and says hey Phoebs turns around gives her like the perfect kiss and then says and hey I'm 116th Portuguese and you're like that is the man you need in your life like as a friend do you know what I mean because there's always like a slight flirtation between Joey and Phoebe that's never realised which is great how it should be yeah which is exactly how it should be so yeah I think that there is a case for Joey being the best Friends character I was listening to an episode an interview with Matt LeBlanc earlier today and he talked about how he was worried he would get written out of the show because in the early seasons it was always just him trying to see one of them naked or trying to get with one of the girls or whatever.

1:20:33And he was like, as soon as he sleeps with one of them, which inevitably he will, there'll be no dramatic sort of steam left in this engine kind of thing. So he kind of made it, he was like saying to the writers and the creators a lot, like, no, he's their brother. Yeah. He's like, he sleeps with everyone in New York except for them. Except for them. Yeah. And he never does. No, no. Not even Rachel when they tried that weird storyline. Yeah. Thank God. He talked about that as well. He was like, Did he? Everyone hated that. Yeah. Every member of the cast hated it. We all hated it. Really? And apparently one of the creators, David Crane, he was like, it's like playing with fire.

1:21:07It's dangerous and we shouldn't do it. But once we've stopped, it'll be very exciting that we did it at all. Yeah. It was, I hated every minute of it. Yeah. It was like watching your, it's like kissing your sister. Do you know what I mean? Exactly. Literally that, yeah. Yeah. So it's interesting as well. Like you can really feel as the, you know, no sitcom should run for 10 years, really. Yeah. I will die on that hill. As I was watching the later episodes yesterday, so many of the plot lines come from characters having dreams. And that is like the first, there's a whole episode where Phoebe's mad at Ross and she can't remember why, and then it turns out it was a dream.

1:21:46The reason that Rachel wants to kiss Joey is because she had a dream. There's a load of dreams. That is the first lesson of creative writing. is like don't make anything be come come about because of a dream or be solved because of a dream no no no it's just it's it was totally farcical and not in the same way that we're talking about the physicality and stuff in the early ones by the end i just i didn't actually enjoy it i was just kind of watching it because i felt like i wanted to a see what actually happened to them and follow the whole thing and you know you're you're invested by that point and you feel like you can't really yeah abandon it but at the same time i never re-watch anything from like i'm kind of like sort of enjoying they are not as fun because again they're not about what the show is about which is about the part of your life where your friends are your family exactly once you start pairing off people that those people become each other's family yeah and people split into subgroups and it's just not as effervescent in the same way but like i'm interested watching it back now as like someone in their 30s with a flat or whatever and like you can see ross's thing and be like have a really like yeah he should stick to his principles or whatever yeah he should not tip somebody he's never met 100 yeah i remember even at the time like no i'm on ross's side of them being like oh am i stingy or whatever no definitely not yeah so it's fun like looking back on it from that perspective yeah one that i wanted to bring up feels very personal to me because i feel like i have been rachel in this one is the one with the fake party season five where emily is going away emily has been there for you know 10 days or whatever and her and ross have had this whirlwind romance um rachel really fancies joshua her client but he's kind of leaving he's almost done so she has to try and find a way to kind of like move things along and kiss him and so she creates this entire like going away party for emily and And it's just, it's a brilliant episode, actually, because you see Rachel, who traditionally is the cool girl.

1:23:45You know, she was the cool one at school. Monica was always the uncool friend or whatever. Rachel loses all of her authority, all of her cool in this. And I feel like there's so many times where I've orchestrated a situation for a group of all of us just so that I can try and pull somebody. 99 % of the time, unsuccessfully. Because if you try that hard, it's never going to happen. It's the Turn the XCX song, only through this party for you. Yeah, it's, oh, I've metaphorically and literally done that. I love how digmatised Rachel gets by Joshua in general. Like, he becomes her, like, reason for living.

1:24:20Yeah. And she puts on the cheerleader outfit, and then she does a cartwheel and busts her lip up. And there's the whole thing throughout the whole episode of the boys telling her to take off her bra, like, under her top, because they saw it in Flashdance. And it's just, like, this cultural touchstone that they're all, like, wanking over, like, the whole episode. and I just also they play spin the bottle and I was thinking the other day I was like I bet if you were I bet if you were pissed and you did not full on like tongue snogging but I was like I bet if you were you know if you needed a jolt in your like friendship group or in a party or something like that and you played spin the bottle as an adult it'd be a laugh here's the thing I was thinking about this that like I think culturally the time for adults to play like spin the bottle ended in I would say 2017 I'll tell you why First of all Brexit No because I feel like there is now such a Certainly urban dwelling people Are so now over familiar with the language of non-monogamy And threesomes and sex or whatever I feel like it would edge into this place of like What so you guys gonna fuck or you gonna do it or whatever Like we can't just have an innocent snog anymore What happened to us?

1:25:34You're so right Do you know what I mean? I feel like for anybody to be... Caroline's wisest moments. For like at a 30s house party, if it were to be like, we're all a bit pissed, we're all a bit silly, we're all a bit whatever, let's like place them in a bottle for the crack. It would like, people would want to push it to this more intense place and then the people who didn't want to push it to a more intense place would feel weird. And then the atmosphere would go off. It would be a very specific group of people who are like, oh, let's all just have a little snog and it'll be really funny. Yeah.

1:26:04Yeah, maybe I'm putting like just, I'm putting quite a big slant of innocence on it right I think the age of innocence is over we've left the garden of Eden now oh yeah the snake has told us about polyamory and ruined everything the snake has built field and now the snake has built field left the garden and now we're in field we're in field and you know people are selling feet pics but yeah I think this is a great episode because I think it's it's also what I wrote down is it's also the worst number of people to be at a house party. Oh, yeah. Because it's not so little that you can make a joke of it and there's like four of you and you're actually mates and you're like, oh, fuck it, let's just hang out or we can go out to a pub or something.

1:26:47But it's not enough that it is an actual proper party. I think it's like 11 of them or something. Oh, it feels awkward. Yeah, it feels so bad. There's so much space and light. There's so much space and light. Light, a big part of throwing a good party as well. It's true. this party has got the big light on in reality and I think spiritually where Rachel's faking it yeah it's uh it's bad and uh but I also think this is such an this is such a example of like sitcom time moving on because we're only one we're only like two seasons away two seasons in the future of like we were on a break which is like the biggest cultural moment of our lives and then suddenly Rachel's like oh I want to shag this other guy so hard that I'm going to throw a party for this woman that you've fallen in love with.

1:27:33And we're all supposed to be like, yeah, you'd do that. Yeah, you'd do that, sure. Yeah, why not? Emily's there looking at pictures of Ross. Yeah. That's what she's doing on her party. And her and Rachel are like, woo, little bum buddies. Bum buddies! Bum buddies. Bum buddies, yeah. The final major party that happens in Friends is season nine, episode 20, the one with the soap opera party. So now we've extended to a whole new level, which is that Joey is throwing catered parties on the roof with Chinese lanterns. Catering is the final furlong, I would say, for house parties. Imagine having a party that was catered and it wasn't even your wedding.

1:28:07Crazy. I know, my friend does it and he's a very, very classy gay man. A gentleman of quality. A gentleman of quality, yes. Indeed. I've never seen a spread like it. Incredible. But yeah, I think this is really signifying that they are out of the trestle table of cups. Yeah. They're having a Days of Our Lives party on the roof like Joey is successful now you feel you feel like finally I feel thrilled for him yeah your large adult son has fled the nest finally he's going to be okay you know he's not living paycheck to paycheck and also I was like it's funny because it's a work house party and it still feels too personal to like have it in your flat you have to have it on the roof of your building yeah yeah yeah there has to be a separation there has to be a slight pullback I really feel thrilled for Joey on this as well because he's really learned how to separate work from life by now he's put boundaries in He's put boundaries in.

1:28:59He's like, these aren't my proper friends. These are the friends that I need to impress and keep warm because of my job. Yeah. This is what I do. You don't need to be part of it. And obviously they crash it and ruin it. They crash it. They shouldn't be allowed at it. No. But I do think this is a very adult house. To be honest, it's not actually that bad of a house party. Because the friends crash it, they kind of bring it down a peg or two, which makes it quite fun. Yeah. Oh, it seems great. I would want to crash that party. Yeah, yeah, yeah, definitely. That's what I mean. you could still have a classy house party and it'd be good.

1:29:29The marker isn't, you know, isn't how the food has to be bad or you'll have to dress shit or whatever like that. I think it's like the more high and low end you go, the better usually that it can be. The problem with having a house party that is segregated to a segment of your friendships, for example, is that that is a cruel thing to do. Yeah. Would you argue it is sometimes a necessary thing to do? Yeah. Because when does it go from like, I had a few people over who are related to this part of my life? Like, for example, if you had comedy friends over or whatever. Yeah, yeah. Where does that go from like, I had a dinner with 10 friends to tipping over to the point where like, I'm saying to you, what, you had people over and you didn't invite me?

1:30:10I know, yeah. Where is that invisible line? I think it is if you have to segment something off, you have to say, oh, it's for comedy friends or whatever. Yeah, yeah. Otherwise, I, you know, I mean, it's like when you, I always think throwing a hen or a stag would be really difficult. It's really difficult. It's difficult because it's like you actually would want lots of people there. But realistically, you're like, I can't plan a night out for 40 people. I find that really hard with my hen. Especially in this line of work where you know a load of chicks. And some of them you've been for drinks with and you really like.

1:30:40But where is the line? Exactly, yeah. I think it's really difficult. And I think as long as people... I think most people are... Like they realise that you're friends. But your hen is almost kind of... you've got to whittle it down somehow. I think it's the same with a house part, with a, sorry, with like a, like you say, like a gathering where you're like, how do I segment this off, you know? Right, right. Before it just becomes like, do you know what, invite everybody. Yeah. And then it's all fine. Yeah, I think it's, I think for a, yeah, a hen or a stag is hard. It's tough. Because you have to backwards negotiate from who's invited to the wedding.

1:31:14Yes, of course. That's the way of slitting it down. Yeah. But then you have to decide, which I had to decide at one point, is this going to be the kind of wedding where loads of aunties and families come. The kind of hen party where loads of aunties come. Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah. And I know some people have that kind of relationship where they like get pissed with their cousin all the time. I don't. No, I don't. And also my mum and sister live in Ireland. Am I going to get them to come to London for a one night out in a Chinese restaurant in an underground karaoke club? No. That feels like a lot of hassle, you know?

1:31:42And I know that we're like proper adults in our 30s, but I do still think that maybe not having a parent there for like the meal or something like that I think that's fine but I do still think it puts a slight you know like hello Miss Paterson hello thank you Miss Paterson I think everyone's still kind of on their best behaviour when there's a parent around having a parent at a hen do is like having a dog at a wedding

1:32:08it's like it doesn't matter how chill the dog is or how well behaved it's the dog's wedding it's the dog's wedding and the thing is don't insult your mother's dignity by having do you know what I mean it's not dignified it's true having her for the meal or whatever is good for the whole night we're getting Maureen pissed it's like I don't think that's very nice no and everyone does treat her like a dog ran into your school yeah that's exactly how they treat her and they say me and Maureen we're like tearing up the dance floor it's like were you really or were you kind of having a laugh off my mum sort of in a private not a nasty way but you were sort of having a laugh off her exactly yeah yeah yeah and I think just don't do it I'm so glad we're aligned on this that will not be a popular take no I think no but I do think if you know if your mum lives nearby and you're going from you're all going for a meal first and your mum brings a pal or something or like your auntie or whatever I think that's different like you're all just having a meal you're having a chat whatever but once you start getting wasted no I'm dignified go home well this has been the delight of my life I know we've gone off peace what a way to end it Alex Haddo where can we find you oh find me find me in the kitchen at parties hey but really but really but really come and find me on Instagram I'm at Alexandra Haddo also if you want a good party that admittedly isn't a house party but I also run a club night called Indie Amnesty and we're throwing a great Christmas party on the 5th of December there's live music there's dancing there's great tunes come along it's cheap we're a party Alexandra Haddo yes I love you love you thank you

1:33:49Thank you.