"Kris Jenner"

15:07Sean Hayes:I had one in my old Chevy Tahoe 25 years ago because it came with a thin orange and I didn't like it, so I went to a guy and he put a thin blue over it. That's right. And it just made all the difference.

15:16Will Arnett:That's right. I don't know what you're doing messing around with Chevy. I mean, that should have been a GMC. This is pre-GMC day. Did you not like professional grade back then?

15:23Sean Hayes:I do. I love professional grade. I love everything in the GM family. So he did that. And then he also was a guy who had a company that put antennas on the roof. Okay. But he actually did it. Like he had a few guys that work for him. Yeah. So if you bought a TV.

15:43Will Arnett:Yeah. I remember we got our first color TV. And then he would have a company that advertised and came out and put your antenna on your roof. The rabbit ears up on the roof. Yeah. Yeah. I got you. So my question behind the question is where— So I guess he was a business smart. He made money. Did that start to—how early did the business interest in you get sparked? that entrepreneurial sort of creative kind of what could I get into next kind of thing? Oh, that came from my grandmother and my mother. So my grandmother and my mother both had their own stores in La Jolla, California. Right. And I grew up in San Diego and then La Jolla.

16:30And my mom still lives there to this day. She's almost 92. But she had, her last store that she had was a children's store, 45 years, called Shannon and Company. Her last name is Shannon.

16:44Will Arnett:Yeah. And my grandmother had a candle store called the Candles of La Jolla. So basically when I was 12 years old, instead of going to the La Jolla shores to learn how to surf with all my friends, I was going to my grandmother's candle store and working. And the first job I had, I was the gift wrapper. So my grandmother taught me. It was the best. And by the way, I'm the best gift wrapper. Are you really?

17:09Sean Hayes:Yeah. Ever. I like it. I watched those videos of the Japanese people. I saw that too. Yeah, and I'm like, I'm trying to emulate. I'm the worst wrapper. At Christmas, I realized I'm the worst. I love it.

17:20Will Arnett:Wait, so Chris, do you have like incredible techniques about like hiding edges and curling seams? Yes. Yes. Oh, and I do, like one day, I learned how to use the ribbon maker, the bow maker machine. So I got really good at bows. And so I have these hidden talents. Like they say we have no talent. Oh, I've got talent. Yeah, I've got some great gift wrapping talent. Do you have a wrapping room at the house? I do, I do. A gift wrap room. I have a friend that has a wrapping room. With rolls of wrapping paper and drawers of tissue. And it's very exciting.

17:53Sean Hayes:Chris, can you look at a gift or something you want to wrap and can you just eyeball it and go, I know exactly how much paper I need for that. I used to a little bit better. Now I've, you know, if I really get confused over a gift, I just cellophane it and put a bow on it. Call it a day. And it's so cute.

18:14Will Arnett:Cellophane will help you avoid those terrible paper cuts you can get from wrapping gifts. That's right. But I love those videos from Japan. I know. They're so fabulous. They're so crisp and like, yeah, OCD. So wait, Chris, so after you learned some business while you were wrapping, and you're like, wait, how did that work? And how did that kind of - Well, your mom and your grandma were a great business inspiration for you. So I think, listen, when you're young and you see your, my mother at the time was a single mom and my grandmother and my grandfather lived across the street and my grandmother helped raise me.

18:53So when you see the two most important people in your life at the time, my grandmother and my mom, get up and get dressed to the nines and go to work every day and get there at nine o 'clock and have a routine and have a business and pay the bills. And they were so proud of their businesses and how they ran them. I worked for both of them on and off. And I learned a lot in those days. I finally graduated to being on the floor with customers. Then I graduated to the cash register. And I just learned a lot. Those were some of the best learning years of my life because I learned so much about, and then from there I became a stewardess for American Airlines and I was a flight attendant.

19:38And when I was a flight attendant, that gave me great social intelligence, social skills. I didn't know you were a flight attendant. Learning how to run a team and just like some really interesting things that were very valuable at a very young age.

19:52Will Arnett:My mom did that for like 30 years at Pan Am. She did? Yeah, it was the coolest thing for me as a kid, just flying around the world kind of, you know, in the back with my little suit on, you know, because I had to be able to dress up for the free tickets. You still fly Pan Am, don't you, Jay? Yeah, they keep getting canceled, these flights.

20:12Sean Hayes:And he still fits in that suit. Yeah. You guys. It sounds like, yeah, you know, the thing is, at the heart of it is like this, you've had this consistent work ethic. I've learned, yeah. That's super strong. I'm really proud of what they taught me and what I was able to absorb. But then even more importantly, how I raised my kids and what they were able to learn from the whole experience and how they were raised and how they, it was always, my kids joke and they say to me, you know, mom, during the summer, or they'll tell a story and they'll go, my mom during the summer when we were in, you know, it's supposed to be on vacation.

20:51My mom, you know, in the old days, the 90s or the 80s, we used to have a landline. And on the landline, as we became more successful and had more opportunities, the stuff in the house got better. The TVs got bigger. The phones got more complicated. And we used to have this intercom system on the phone. So you'd have a big landline phone sitting next to all these counters and all the buttons. And there was a thing. And Chloe always tells the story, My mom used to intercom the whole house. It's 7 a.m., time to get up, make your beds. And so I raised my kids like that. Like, no, no, we're not laying in bed.

21:36Life is happening, get up. We've got stuff to do. I love that. Yeah, me too. Yeah, that's really cool. Wait, so what happened after the candle thing and working in that store? And what was kind of the next venture for you after that that made you want to propel further into being a businesswoman? I worked there. Then I worked at a boutique in La Jolla for a friend and then for my mom. And I loved having structure in my life. I loved having something to do and to get dressed for. And my mother and my grandmother always told me that it was so important to present myself to the world in a way that I wanted to be.

22:21Like, look your best, be on your best behavior. If you don't have something nice to say, don't say anything at all. You know, really good manners.

22:32Will Arnett:Right, right. I was going to say, for me, like, I've got to believe it before I can expect anyone else to believe it. So get up, get out there and look like where you want to go. That's exactly right. And, you know, a couple things. So then I became, then I went and I applied to be a flight attendant, Sean, to answer that question. And then from there, I got married to Robert Kardashian. So that's kind of, and then I started having kids. So that's the, you know, the Reader's Digest version. Which was the real job. Which is, yeah. You know, the kids and being a mom, that was at a very young age.

23:09But, you know, along the way, the one thing you guys can probably relate to or think about or your listeners can think about is my mother-in-law was the first one. Now it's a mantra in our house. But my mother-in-law, Nana, was always saying, Robert, to her son, Robert, show me who your friends are and I'll show you who you are. And she used to just gripe at all of us about if she thought anybody around us was shady or dishonest or a little creepy. Or, you know, anything off. She was, because I met her and Robert at such a young age, you know, he was 12 years older than I was. But I just learned so much because then I had this whole Armenian family surrounding me that I'd never had a big, big family.

24:03I had one sister. And my mom was divorced for the longest time until she met my dad and then got married when I was 13. But a lot of my life, it was me, my mom, and my sister. So having this big Armenian family around me was very, it was so amazing. And some of the things I learned, I let it all soak in. I was like a sponge. I was like, I love having all these people watching out for me because they met me so young. And they were helping me grow up.

24:36Will Arnett:Right. Yeah. Right. A big community. Yeah. That's so great. Go ahead, Shani. No, I was just going to say, I was just going to share one of my first jobs was at a furniture store in downtown Glen Ellyn. And I had to answer the phones. And all I did all day long was call my friend Sherry in Arizona. And then the bills would come. And their phone bill was like hundreds of dollars, which was huge back then. Like probably like$1 ,000. It's huge now. Yeah, the guy would come and be like, who are you calling in Arizona? I was like, that's my sister just trying to be in touch. But it was my best friend.

25:14And then I got fired because of that. Oh, my God. That's my story. That's my story, my first job. I love that story.

25:21Sean Hayes:Yeah. Hang on. I'm just trying to look on the chart where I'm going to put that. You know what? One of my first jobs, the things that we will do, one of my first jobs, I was really wanting to do something. I mean, this is how I guess, I don't know, motivated I must have been to make some money. But because my mom, it wasn't like she was, you know, passing out money to buy clothes. And we were getting to the age where we really loved clothes and we wanted to buy things and we're teenagers and all of it. And so I got a job up the street from my house that I could then get on the school bus and get to middle school or high school.

26:02and it was at a donut shop. And my job was to take a glaze scraper and scrape the glaze off of the floor and they would give me a little money and some free donut holes every morning. Wow. And I was the best glaze scraper in, I think, in San Diego. Pretty sure.

26:27Sean Hayes:Sean, how lost are you in this story? he's trying to figure out

26:33Will Arnett:if it's a bad job he can't decide whether it's a bad job hey this is a job you guys are going to ruin my makeup I'll eat the glaze off the floor I mean that's incredible free tone and hold guys it was amazing Sean's volunteering for any sort of glaze scraping in any part of the room So if you ever need anybody who, like, listen, these skills somehow, you know, worked for me later in life. I don't know. Go figure. Yeah. And we will be right back. Summer gatherings are easier when the grill does the heavy lifting and Whole Foods Market has the ingredients to make it all come together. Start with no antibiotics ever, meat, or grill-friendly seafood like salmon and halibut.

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29:02And now back to the show.

29:05Will Arnett:What would you say to these young people that are going off to business school and they're killing themselves trying to like top business schools and learn all the business stuff that one needs to, like where would you, what size would you put that sort of, the traditional business structured, you know, in today's society and climate for business success? Wow. The nuts and the bolts of it. I'm going to get in trouble here because I did not go to college. That's okay. And that wasn't important to me because I didn't, I wasn't the most amazing, Like I didn't love school because I was social.

29:48Sean Hayes:Does that make sense? I love being, I love the socialization of it. I love, I think, you know, some of my kids have been trying to decide, do we want to just do homeschool? Do we love, you know, this kind of school as the kids get older? And Kendall and Kylie, my two youngest, went to homeschool the last year of their high school years and then they graduated. But it wasn't this, you know, it's always been for us or for me about socialization and making sure that obviously I have a good education and I know my ABCs. Yeah. And, you know, I'm a smart cookie and I love to learn and I soak it all in.

30:29Yeah. But everyone learns differently. There's so many different options. And I think that's what's interesting. And so I think the options out there are so vast. However, it really, you have to follow your heart, but it's also what do you want to go into? Some rule of thumb and thought of some parents and kids alike and people in general is that if you get that education under your belt, then that's your safety net. Then you can go forward in your life and now you're set with your, you know, you have your tool belt on and you can go out there and do various things. And I love that too. My son went to USC.

31:11Kim went to college for maybe a couple weeks. And Courtney graduated from college. And half of my kids did it and half of my kids didn't. So it's a mixed bag for me, but I think it really depends on if you want to be a doctor or a physician of any kind, a surgeon, a medical field, attorney, lawyer, that's necessary. But I think it's just going to be what you're, you know, follow your heart. What is it that, you know, that gets you excited about life and what you want to do with your career?

31:47Sean Hayes:And start sooner than later. Yeah, you know, I'm going through, JB, you went through it with your eldest and I'm kind of going through it now with my teenage boys because they're at that point where they're looking at colleges and we're going to do a college tour at spring break. and I keep sort of saying to him, you know, there's a pressure not just from the parents, but you can feel it from the peer group as everybody's talking about it. So it builds up this kind of frenzy about where to go and all this sort of stuff. And I said, look. Yeah, having to decide what you're going to do as an adult.

32:13Sean Hayes:Yeah, and I go, you know what, man? Any one of these places, you're pretty much guaranteed of getting a really good education. You've got to decide what you want your experience to be. Right. What you want your life experience to be. So true. Right? And don't, I urge you not to get caught up in that. And I'm really, and I think it's kind of lending because I just, I see them, I see these kids and they're getting so wrapped up in it.

32:36Will Arnett:Yeah, life will narrow you like real quick soon anyway.

32:41Sean Hayes:Yeah. Keep your experience, your mind opens. I dropped out of college after one semester because I was like. You did? Yeah, for me, I went, you know what? This is not, I looked around at all my peers and my friends and kids I'd grown up with and I said, this is not where I'm going. I want to go over here and I want to jump into life. And I moved to New York at age 20. But what it did for me, I went for four years and never graduated, but still got a doctorate. But anyway. That a boy. Wait, we want the recipe for that. From the furniture store? Yeah. No, but what it did for me was, what it does for a lot of kids, is it gets you out of the house.

33:20That's it. And you get out of the house and you're with your peers in a totally different setting and you find out who you are. Neon horizons. Neon horizons. And yes, academics aside, socially what it did for me was I was like, oh, I found my people. Shani, you know what's funny about that?

33:38Sean Hayes:Like JB, you were working as a young kid. You were already working as an actress. So you were already sort of socializing. You were already doing that. You were out of the house in effect. With your peers. I had gone to boarding school at age 12. So I was already out. Like I'd already gone, you know what I mean? Yeah, that was like an early college boarding school. Yeah, yeah.

33:56Will Arnett:I should have studied something to fall back on. See, I think that's important to note though. I think that everyone, and I really believe that everybody needs structure and a purpose. That's what it is. And a community and socialization. All of that I love about school. and if you're not ready to jump off the diving board into the pool with no water in it, so to speak, because you don't know what you're going to do, then that's probably a great decision because then you'll figure it out. Yeah, because I went to college knowing I was going to study music. That's it. So I had a purpose. But you're right, Chris, about what you said.

34:43I love that. If you're diving into a pool with no water, you probably, there's no reason.

34:48Sean Hayes:No, and Sean, the music that you studied, it did help you. It has been a big part of what you do. Well, yeah, no, but continuing on and like you wouldn't have done Goodnight Oscar, all of that, the Tabasco.

35:00Will Arnett:What a show! This is a program!

35:03Sean Hayes:But had you not done that, you wouldn't have had the skill to do that. Right? Totally. One thing leads to another. But I'm lucky, like we're all lucky, the four of us talking right now, and there's many people that we know that are lucky, that if you know, if you have a passion inside of you early on as a kid and you know what you love to do, the earlier you know what to do, the earlier you know what you love to do, the more success you're likely to have later. A thousand percent. And it's like Jason said, he had a direction. Like he knew that's what he wanted to do. So why I'm over here with, you know, all my energy needs to go to my dream.

35:40And in order to accomplish my dreams, it needs incredible focus. dedication to this. It doesn't mean you're sitting at home playing video games, doing nothing.

35:50Sean Hayes:And you need to pay the rent too, right JB? For real. You gotta keep the lights on. So Chris, then talk to me about Keeping Up With The Kardashians. How did it start? What did it do for you? Were you apprehensive about doing it? Because you're like, oh my god, there's cameras. Like, what? And what was your perception of beginning the show? and when did it start to change?

36:15Will Arnett:Yeah, and did this start, does this story write where Ryan Seacrest started talking to you about this perhaps and on the heels of the Osbournes getting a lot of traction? Is the timing right? Do I have that right? No. Right. So I think a lot of people talk to me and a couple of my older kids from time to time, but always, I mean, for years had said to me, you're a family, you've got to do a reality show. Nobody would believe what goes on in this life of years. Today's Brady Bunch. And it was just, you couldn't make any of it up. And so I eventually decided to create this show in my mind and it kind of lived up there for a while.

37:06And then I remember we had been approached by a company years ago and they thought it was a good idea. And my best friend was living in New York and she was doing a talk show, Kathy Lee Gifford. And Kathy would go, you guys, you know, she was Kendall and Kylie's godmother. And she would, you know, when they were born and she would always go, oh my God, you guys are wild. You know, this is crazy. And she'd come visit and think, people have got to see what's going on. And I just thought it was normal. You know, I thought I'm living the life. And one night, this girl, Dina Katz, came over to my house.

37:48And she's the casting director for many shows amongst them, Dancing with the Stars and things like that. And she's close friends with Ryan Seacrest. So she came over and she couldn't believe what was happening in my house on like a Tuesday. Wait, what's going on over there? For spaghetti, yeah. What was going on over there? Just the people that would call or stop by, just a lot of celebrity interaction and drama and just wild. It was just extraordinary. And she would listen to my life and think it was wild. And so she said, I'm going to present this to Ryan Seacrest. So the next day, I spoke to Ryan's team and went in for a meeting a couple days later.

38:30They had just signed a production deal with E, NBC, Comcast. And they then, you know, Ryan presented it to the network. They picked it up and 30 days later we were shooting Keeping Up with the Kardashians. Wow. That's amazing. So it happened really fast.

38:49Will Arnett:What was the conversation like with the kids? Like did it take, did you have to twist any arms or were they excited about the idea? Listen, at that point, and I mean, to this day, I'm still their manager. But at the time, I was nobody's manager. Courtney and I were working in our clothing store called Smooch, and the girls had a store called Dash nearby in Calabasas. And it was, I just said, family, I have this opportunity, and this is what I want us to do. and everybody said, okay, you know, I'm not going to lie. Courtney kind of looked at me sideways like, mom. And I'm like, Courtney, we can sell more T-shirts.

39:33Imagine, the show's in, you know, it's a global network. It'll air in 200 countries. Why not? You know, I saw an opportunity and it was just something that I wanted to do because it was also going to help me keep the lights on, if I'm being honest. It was like income. and Kendall and Kylie were nine and ten. Wow. Kylie was nine years old. That's amazing. Kendall was ten and I told them what was happening and I said, guys, you don't have to be on the show but if you want to come and be a part of it, you can film on the weekends or holidays or after school or whenever it's appropriate. And that's kind of how it got started and that was we started filming, I think, 2006.

40:20It aired in 2007 and right now we work for Disney. We're filming The Kardashians and this is season 28. Wow.

40:31Will Arnett:So what was the ask? Like how did you present this to them? Like was it, well, the cameras are only going to be here for like an hour a day or they're going to be constantly set up or they're going to be fixed cameras and there won't be any camera operators so you won't really know. Like how did it start then versus how is it now and what were the expectations as far as their role would be? Right. Well, we all fell into it like a fish in water. It was quite extraordinary. So easy, comfortable. You can't do something. Listen, I can create something and I can produce something, but you can't control other people even though they're your kids.

41:15I mean, I have a great deal of love and respect for my children and I'm never going to make them do something that they don't want to do. But it was, I was in heaven because everybody, a crew shows up. We had, we started with one crew. So it's like maybe three cameras, two cameras and sound.

41:34Sean Hayes:Do they come at like 7 a.m.? We started very, very early in glam at seven. But the first season, we literally were filming seven or eight days a week and about 18 hours a day. I'm not exaggerating. I thought, I don't know. I used to say to myself, I'd look in the mirror in the morning and go, I don't know if this is sustainable. How am I going to get through the day? And then we would just keep filming, filming, filming. And in those days, editing, we, I'm probably, I don't know if this is accurate, but I'm probably one of the only women in reality television world that has editing rights to our show.

42:17I am able to take anything out. And that was from the very start? From day one. I said, I'm not doing this unless I... So the key to our success...

42:28Will Arnett:And you could tell the kids, don't worry about it. You just let it all fly because at the end of the day... Right. And you know what's interesting about that is over the years, from day one, when we knew we had that freedom and that kind of power, so to speak, It made us more comfortable. It made us be the way we always are and how we're bonded together as a family because we're very close to each other. And we were able to say things that were, you know, very intimate or, you know, only our family knew or whatever it was. But things started to, you know, develop in a way that we, I was thinking to myself, you know, oh my goodness, this is really crazy.

43:17And knowing that we could take it out, and you know, we never did. We would come, we would have a meeting and we would say, you know, the FBI showed up today, you know, or Kylie ended up in season, episode one, season one, is a nine-year-old child on a stripper pole. And I had the, you know, and I'm looking at the footage going, how did this happen? How did this happen? I left Kim and Robin Anton in a room for five minutes and Kylie's on a stripper pole? You know, so it was really insane. Anyway, it turns out that the things that I would remove or take out ended up to be, oh, my God, the back of my hair looks crazy.

44:02Sean Hayes:Take that out. Or I look so fat. It keeps you human. Or can somebody fix my lipstick? Like, what? So that's the kind. I was so vain in, like, I had never really been on. I had been on TV, and I had done QVC, and I had done things with Bruce Jenner and, you know, all this stuff. But I'd never been on a television show that was unscripted like that. And it was a very vulnerable feeling. I wanted to ask about that. So that starts to happen. So, right. So the vulnerability I can only imagine. Because we know what it's like a little bit. We talked about it earlier about stuff happens and then people out in the world have a right to comment on it.

44:44Sean Hayes:Especially now in real time and stuff just right. Right. Right. to go through that experience especially early on when it was like early social media days when you guys started it was really early I mean and to have people commenting on your life on your parenting like you say the stripper pillow have opinions all the thing and your kids growing up and people have opinions in real time there's nobody bigger than you guys at a certain point you sort of you guys rock it to fame and everybody in the world has an opinion on you and your family and your kids and blah, blah, blah. How did you kind of meet that and ride with that over the years?

45:26Sean Hayes:As you say, you just finished season 28. You've obviously found a place and a way to accommodate that. But what was that like? What was that learning curve like to deal with that? You know what? I think it was one day at a time. It was leaning on each other. It was learning from one another. It was understanding that it takes an entire village to do what we do. And then it was all these realizations over the years that occurred to us. And first of all, we had to have really thick skin. And I said to my kids very early on, because they were a lot younger. I mean, when I started the show, I had no grandchildren.

46:16Now I have 13. I mean, life changes so fast. That's amazing. So I said to my children, because they were young enough for me to tell them what to do still, and I do tell them what to do every single day, but sometimes they don't listen. So I told them, nobody's going on the internet. Nobody's engaging in the bullshit. And that was after the first episode. and, you know, I had even close friends that I trusted that would have one eyebrow up going, really, the stripper pole? Not knowing that Oprah just had the stripper pole, you know, on an episode of her show because it was the new exercise, you know, the craziness that everybody was doing this.

46:58And, you know, Robin Anton had come over to show Kim how to use it because Kim had bought me one for Mother's Day and to do my exercise, you know, and Kylie ends up on it. But, you know, it was just they wanted to edit it a certain way. And it wasn't really edited. It was just like people took it a certain way. Sure, right. And I just said, let it fly. We know what happened. Like, who cares?

47:20Will Arnett:Yeah, I was going to say, I would imagine that a lot of this stuff, the element of the world now having access inside the serenity of somebody's home. I can imagine would only make you guys closer in that you guys are the only ones that know the real story. Right. Who we really are, what we really feel. Juxtaposed to this outside opinion multiplied by millions. I guess you were kind of forced to quickly say, well, that's their kind of idea, their opinion, their narrative. versus what the real thing is almost makes you guys even more solid and intimate and a unit. Yes? I think so. I think we felt really close.

48:13We felt like we could always help each other out. I remember, you know, when we first started the show, for example, there was no Instagram. There was no Snapchat. There was barely Twitter. And Ryan Seacrest called me up one day and he goes, you know, you might want to tell Kim about this little thing called Twitter. I'm not really sure what it is. I'm like, Twitter? What is Twitter? And so, you know, Kim, you've got to get on Twitter. And, you know, we just helped each other learn and grow, and it takes a village to do what we're doing. And then on top of all of it, the years went by, and we realized how many thousands of people we employ, who the network employs, the people that benefit and have.

48:57We've had people that work for us for years write to us, like write notes to us and say, you know, and hand them to us and say, thank you for changing my life. Thank you for giving me purpose. Thank you for giving me a job. Thank you for, you know, so you start with the smallest things, the assistants, the glam teams, the people who are getting us from one point to another, all the fashion side of it. the, you know, it's just tens, you know, thousands and thousands of people. And then as time went on and, you know, we started making money and we were able to give back to things that meant a lot to us and help people that were less fortunate.

49:40And, you know, that felt good. And, you know, so it's been an evolution of our whole process. Yeah.

49:47Will Arnett:And even specifically what the social media has done. It wasn't around when you started. Now, of course, it's around. But the way in which you guys are such a presence there as well. And talk to us a bit about how that, I think, help me, educate me. It is one of the major engines to some of the stuff that you guys do, sort of your brand positioning and leveraging one and being spokesmen for other things. It all sort of exists almost entirely on some of it on this platform versus, you know, linear TV and whatnot. Yeah. It's how the business has evolved for many businesses around the world. You know, having this example that started actually when Kim got on Twitter, that first example I gave you when she first learned about it.

50:49And I remember she was the first one who really, she really educated us about, meaning my family and I, about how she could communicate with the audience and be a part of the Twitter universe by engaging in these conversations. And she genuinely loved it. Like she would, I remember the first time, and I think she was the first one to do this, she sent a tweet to her fans and to all the viewers of our show and just out there in the world. And she said, I'm going to launch this fragrance. And here are the two, you know, packaging options. The bottles. Do you guys like this choice or this choice?

51:35You know, the pink or the black or whatever it was. And the response was overwhelming. And I knew that she was so smart and so, not that it was, you know, she wasn't in any way being manipulative. She was being genuinely wanting her own focus group. She was able to put together this group of people that no one would have had access to in the entire world except for her. And as her numbers grew, her audience grew, our audience grew. And then one by one is as different social media platforms emerged and were developed. And as all of my, you know, me and my children all became very active on all these social media platforms and the numbers grew and it just snowballed.

52:30And I think, like, if you added up all the numbers and you added up all the kids and all the platforms, there's a couple, you know, on our global network with Disney. And we're on shows in over 200 countries and on and on every single day. And Disney just bought the rights to Keeping Up with the Kardashians. They just bought all the archive. So, you know, there's billions of people daily who are.

52:56Sean Hayes:Not only that, you said that, you know, thousands of people you employed. If you think about it, you launched an entire industry in that you guys were the first people to understand the power of, as you pointed out that example with Kim, of using social media and creating that. And Jason says sort of establishing the brand and putting that out there. All these people in the world who now make a living doing that. Right. They all have really, in effect, you guys to thank.

53:24Will Arnett:Well, it's also now, it's the major engine for many of the mainstream traditional legacy companies.

53:32Sean Hayes:Corporations all took it from you guys. Everybody.

53:34Will Arnett:Yeah. Airlines to media companies, to oil companies. Like, everybody wants to figure out how to harness the power of that direct one-to-one connection to your customer. And it's about reach. It's about connecting with the people that are actually engaged with your product. you guys have this enormous power and influence in that space. I would imagine, and you don't have to answer this, but I would imagine that you're constantly being courted, solicited by any number of companies to help them understand how they can reach more of their customers, stay engaged with them, amplify what it is that they do.

54:18Sean Hayes:Chris, wait till you see Jason's hair thing that he just said for Anniston. It's amazing. We're true.

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58:08And back to the show.

58:12Will Arnett:I would bet it's, you can be, you could probably spend all your time just trying to educate people on how to best integrate. Utilize their, yeah, their social media. Well, it's like when Kylie launched her lip kit, you know, all those 10 years ago. It was insane because I went to her about, I don't know, a month before the launch knowing that she was going to create this thing. She goes, Mom, I know what I want to do for the rest of my life. And it's beauty. and I want to do this lip kit and now you've got to take this and run with it and figure out how to make it. And so I contacted some people I knew that could do this.

58:53They made it. And I said, so what are we doing about the marketing? Like, you know, we need an ad in People Magazine and we need to have a billboard. And, you know, she goes, are we okay, mom? Like, I know what I'm doing. Just relax. And I said, I can't relax. You just spent every dime you've ever made on Keeping Up with the Kardashians to start your own brand by yourself with your own money. And I'm a little nervous. Mom's a little, you know, you're 17 years old. So what are you doing? And she said, I know what I'm doing. And so I'll never forget the morning she launched her brand, which was the first time she disrupted an entire beauty business because she pressed send on the link to go buy this and put a post out, go buy my lip kit.

59:37and I think it was four seconds and we thought the site crashed because we had to launch, you know, and it was just sold out in seconds.

59:48Sean Hayes:Wow, wow. And then we knew, you know, and she developed, that was her, that, you know, and then it was on. She was the first one to do that. The first one to do. We need to have a meeting with you offline. We need to have an hour meeting with you. Okay, guys, come on over. I'm in Chloe's podcast room. She'll never know. She has so much to learn.

1:00:05Will Arnett:So when you say one of the first, Do you mean about how sort of the brick and mortar sort of model of? Yeah. Yeah, I think how to sell a beauty brand online like that had never been done. Or any brand. Well, and also I think Kim was probably the first to ever sell a fragrance. Think about this. Yeah. Millions of fragrances online without ever smelling it.

1:00:33Sean Hayes:Yeah. Wow. Is that not crazy? Yeah, I'll take that fragrance. And you've never, you're trusting that you want to smell like Kim. Meanwhile, it's still, the first fragrance is still the fragrance that I wear. Really? Every day. And every day somebody goes, oh, what is that? You smell so good. So I'm so proud of that moment for her.

1:00:54Will Arnett:How was the smelling sessions for that as you guys were developing that? Sniffing a bunch of stuff and narrowing down what the scent would be. Kim and I, yeah, Kim and I went to a fragrance company in New York a few times. And by the way, this whole journey, everything I'm telling you, all the stories I could go on for days is all on film for Keeping Up with the Kardashians and now the Kardashians. And that I'm so grateful for because I have the best home movies in the world. and I have all these beautiful, I mean, I remember we were filming, we filmed The Birth of Mason. Good God. And I'm like, we filmed that?

1:01:36Like I sit and go, we filmed that? But we did. I always think that's wild because my sister just sent me an audio clip that she found when she was 12 years old and it's really scratchy and you can barely hear it. You can tell it's her, which is so different than how kids grow up now. They have everything. They have home movies every day. You know, because of social media. And it's high quality.

1:02:01Will Arnett:It looks like yesterday. Yeah, it looks like yesterday. So it's a weird thing about how memories now are stored in our brains. The kids now are stored differently than the four of us do because we didn't have that. You know, it's not archived as a kid. We didn't have any archives. Can I ask you guys a question? Yeah. Capricorn. Off topic. Okay, good. So do any of you ever go back and really look at the photos? that you have a million of in your phone? You do? Yeah, mostly on my kids. Oh, no, not in my phone. No, not in the phone. When I was a kid, like the actual hard copy photo that was taken.

1:02:39Yeah. Yeah, yeah. So you know what I do? Every year, at the end of the year, before January 1st, I edit all my photos in my phone. So you know how you take 75 photos of one thing, edit, edit, edit, get it to where those photos on your phone are what you love. Right. And there's probably 3 ,000 or whatever there is. Oh, that's a big job. I have them taken to a very trusted printer that I've been using for since the early 90s, literally. And they print them out, and I put them in an archival photo box, and they're in my archive, and I have a hard copy of every single photo that I've ever taken. Because I'm probably the only one in my family who will do that so that, you know, Many, many moons from now, they can look back and go, I remember this.

1:03:28Going through the photos is such a thing for me and how I have memories of my family, my grandmother. It's more tactile. I think everybody should go copy their phone once a year. That's a great idea. And archive it in a box. I think I get them at the container store or something. But there's archival boxes. You can get them on Amazon. And they protect the photo. but for everyone who has kids, you know, it's so special. Yeah, it is. That's my tip for the day. You should have a party and just go through each page one by one, right? And just do like a four-day party of just like each page. Or turn on Keeping Up with the Kardashians.

1:04:10Yeah, or do that.

1:04:12Will Arnett:Chris, with all your incredible business success, I bet you're most proud of what seems to be an incredible ability to be both a manager and a mother to not one, but six of your children and wear both of those hats in a way, because my parents were my manager as well when I was growing up. And I remember that was a tricky, challenging thing for both them and me to manage together. Yeah, and try to keep both of those sides of our lives pristine and honored and where one is sort of like a peer relationship and the other one is that sort of traditional deferential relationship where, you know, the kid looks up to the parent and completely, you know, listens to and defers to and follows behind kind of thing.

1:05:12Will Arnett:So they're not at odds with one another, but there's a few areas of overlap, but they are different, you know? And so your ability to do that, it seems, has been incredibly successful because all your kids, from what I can see, just seem incredibly well-grounded and kind. So can you talk a little bit about that? I think, first of all, my most important role is mom. So I recognize that. And that's the most important thing in my life. And I feel like God has put me here at this point in my life to make sure they're okay. And I think every parent's dream is for your child to identify what they want to do in their life and go out there and find how their dream can come true, help them get there, set them off and set them up and good to go.

1:06:09Like that's my, I mean, when I think about my kids and I go down the line and go, okay, today, this one's okay. I got to do the, you know, but in general to have your kids at a really good, happy place, whether they want to be a housewife and a mom, whether they want to be an athlete, whether they, whatever their dream is, if they're happy. And the most important thing for me is I always say, God first, family second, everything else is third. and I've always raised my children like that. And I've always raised my kids to be, all that matters to me is that they have good hearts. They have integrity, character, great character, great integrity.

1:06:50They would help people that in need, that need them and they're kind. Be on time, be kind, be gentle with people. You never know what kind of a day they've been having. But stick up for yourself and be strong when you need to be strong. And all the things, you know, all the things. And it means the most to me when I hear other people's experiences with my kids. And daily, if I show up to something and someone's been there before me, like let's say I was on this podcast and maybe one of my kids had done it, or somebody came up to me Saturday night at a dinner and said, I have the store over here where we were, and your children come in there from time to time, and I've never met more kind, gentle people in my life.

1:07:48They're the nicest people I've ever met. Every time I hear that, my heart just swells. I'm so happy because that's all that matters. Yeah.

1:07:55Sean Hayes:You know what, Chris? It's funny you say that. So I was going to say, and you guys will relate to this, is there's no greater feeling than when somebody says to you, hey I just ran into your kids your kids are great your kids are so nice it feels so good you never get tired of hearing that never when somebody compliments your kid on their character ever and I will say this I don't know your kids and I but I have heard and this is anecdotal but I have heard time and time again over the years what nice people your kids are I'm not making this up I have heard that so many times that makes me so happy it's absolutely true yeah absolutely I've had a couple bad bad encounters I'm just going to be honest.

1:08:33That's different, Sean. That's different, Sean, though.

1:08:36Sean Hayes:I mean, you're so confrontational. Sean, we can't hear you anymore. Sorry, babe. Yep. I think your mic went out. No, lovely. I, too, have met them, and they're just so genuine. They love you. I love them. I love you. I had that great time. I know. Yes, okay. I know. Sorry, how much fun? I know. A secret date. I'm going to text you right after this. Okay. Wait, text me. Do I still, you guys? I have your number. Do I still have?

1:09:01Will Arnett:I would imagine that, I mean, your days, my God, I can't imagine how full your days are. With all the business stuff, all the parenting stuff, you'd have to delegate a great deal. And I'm sure you've got incredible people around you. But what is the thing that you simply cannot delegate, will not delegate? Well, let's put it this way. at the end of the day, especially lately, the year started off like, whoa, like if you were on a treadmill at like level 62. Yeah. I get at the end of the day, decision fatigue. Yeah. If you can imagine. Like I start off so early, like at 5 a.m., I let people have access to me at that hour, meaning I alert people, hey, we're rolling.

1:09:56You know, I'll call, I'll text an attorney, a business manager, somebody in Europe, somebody in New York, like, okay, we're ready to go. And it never ends. So I think that, you know, just being able to juggle, I feel like sometimes, some days are like that guy in the circus where he's got the plates in the air and you just keep taking the stick and spinning them all, you know, just making sure they're all spinning. Some days, if they're like that, that's a chill day. But if it's really buckling down, putting out fires, I mean, most days I'm a fireman. So putting out fires, making sure everybody's okay.

1:10:37And then like this morning, I got a 6 a.m. call from Kylie. And she just wanted to go through something personal that she was wanting an opinion on. So stop the, you know, the momager hat, roll into, okay. And I just got my coffee again and sat down and listened to the whole thing, gave my opinion. We're good to go. She goes, okay, it's going to be okay, mommy. It's going to be great. Okay, we're good. And so everybody needs, you know, that emotional check-in every day. And we all just like, I get a million times a day from Chloe. I love you, mom. Mom, you're the best. And my kids are so, Kim and I, for the last two days, texting, you know, all day from London and then Paris because she's at the Skims opening in those two cities.

1:11:33Yeah. And then, you know, so there's always business to talk about and then an influx of photos from the event that they're at or, you know, all of it, you know, all of it. And it's been great. It's a great journey.

1:11:46Will Arnett:What kind of crisis would it be if you woke up one day and you forgot to plug your phone in overnight? Well, that would be bad. Right? That would be bad. But I would imagine even waking up with a full charge, you're charging that phone around four o 'clock every day anyway. Yeah. Right? Yeah. Yeah. Oh, my God. For sure. For sure. Especially if you have like a little Zoom in between. Yeah. Like that's a little bit of a dreamer. But it's, yeah, no, you just, you know, you have to be prepared and ready for everything, I guess. I think I'm great at multitasking and I'm great at, I think I have, you know, emotionally I'm pretty strong.

1:12:26I cry on a dime. I'll cry at a commercial or, you know, or if I think about something really sad, you know, I get all welly. So I try to stay out of that danger zone. I try to like, we don't need any tears today. But I think I'm a very emotional person, but I think I have good emotional intelligence.

1:12:50Will Arnett:You don't have to say who, but I would ask, is there somebody in your life, or probably a few maybe, that you can dump all this stuff on and you don't have to be the person who figures everything out? She calls me constantly. I'm sorry, Sean. Sean carries a weight around my family. It's insane. But you know what? I love it. Yeah, you do. You're good at it, too. You're a very strong guy. What do people think you control that you absolutely do not? A skims discount.

1:13:27Will Arnett:People wanting to get a little break because they know you? A skims discount, yeah. But Jason's previous question was good. Of course, you don't have to say names, but who is that? Who is that person that you get to lean on at the end of the day? Is it your kids? You know what? I'll tell you something. It depends on the subject and what's going on. I do have a selection. One of my best friends, Shelly Azoff, is we'll talk about the craziest stuff and we just get each other. And then I don't have to talk to her for two weeks. She's not that person who's needy and needs me to emotionally check in with her all the time.

1:14:02and then my cousin Cece, but, you know, and then Corey, my partner, of course, like my boyfriend, he's amazing. He's probably thinking, this is why. Sometimes I want to just go in his brain and, you know, wonder. He's probably thinking, what did I get into? But he loves us all so much and is so great. So, you know, obviously the person that you live with is the person that probably hears and gets the brunt of it through and through. But you know who's so amazing and supportive are my kids. And each one for a different reason. Like if there's real drama with somebody, I'll tell you the times. I don't know how Chloe carries it.

1:14:47Chloe, you guys have to, you haven't had Chloe on yet, right?

1:14:51Will Arnett:No, no, no. Chloe is such a great guest. But Chloe, Chloe is this, saint. She's an angel. She not only is like the Pied Piper with all the kids, and she's the one who every single weekend has the sleepover and is making Taco Tuesdays for all the kids and having Bible study on Thursday nights for the kids at her house. And I mean, she's like all the cousins are, you know, she's the Pied Piper. She's the cutest thing ever. But she's also got such amazing, intense, emotional support to offer if you're going through something. And she's so intelligent about stuff. It's really great. And so is Kim and all of them.

1:15:32I mean, I was talking to Kylie, like I said this morning about something else, but they're all so, you know, Kendall's like my therapist. And if I want to talk about anything in the environment, you know, Courtney's my go-to and she'll come over and throw all my pots and pans away. So, you know, they're all, we're all so connected.

1:15:54Will Arnett:Yeah, but so when the house thinned out, because I'm dealing with this now, one just went off to college and my youngest, I've got another few years, but I'm already just like dreading being an empty nester. I'm just going to miss them so much. As your house started to thin out and now it's just you and Corey, right? Right. Well, okay. So the part that maybe you're missing is I live in a gated community and we all live down the street from each other. Right. Okay. So it's never - Chloe lives next door. She lives 50 feet away. Right. So it doesn't get any closer than that without being in the same bedroom.

1:16:36Sean Hayes:Right. That's great. And then I'll come home and, you know, I mean, Kendall's the only one who lives a little bit further, but everyone, we all live in the same area.

1:16:45Will Arnett:Oh, how great. Area. We're all at each other's houses. And, you know, I'll call Kim's house at least three times a week. Do you guys have any food over there? I'm starving. I don't buy it. And then somebody runs over to get it. It's like it's very convenient. I can only imagine that the holidays are just like this, just like an idyllic. So fun. Just all those, would you say 13 grandkids running around? It's our Super Bowl. Oh, yes. It's delicious. And one of the kids has Christmas Eve. We usually do a big Christmas Eve party. And then I do Christmas morning. That's my tradition. And we have so many amazing traditions in our family.

1:17:26We celebrate, you know, Groundhog's Day. We celebrate everything. Really? We can't wait to do a party. We can't wait to celebrate somebody's special occasion or event or, you know, the kids graduating from kindergarten. garden or, you know, it makes life really special.

1:17:44Will Arnett:Yeah, you keeping up on all that stuff will be a full-time job for me as it is right there. Well, she's keeping up with the Kardashians. Yeah, there you go. You know, when you say your, yeah, when you say your kids are, you know, like an empty nest thing and your kids are getting older and it happens so fast. And, you know, I think that it's just really important to remember that we're just, that they're not far away and just create these memories and moments as much as you can to stay connected. Because people ask me a lot, how do you raise a family? You guys are all so close, genuinely close.

1:18:22And, you know, I often say you just, it's not something that you can really teach. It's something that you just have to feel and do.

1:18:32Will Arnett:Yeah. I got to tell you, we've done, how many of these have we done you guys a couple hundred we've done like uh like 300 this is the first time not no joke that i've looked at the clock and been shocked that we are at an hour 15 i know i thought we were like an hour i thought we were like 40 minutes i'm first of all i'm sorry that we're 15 minutes over it's fine chloe's chloe's i'm gonna have a meeting with her and we're filming our show and she's probably gonna walk into our studio and go what the hell are you doing um before before we let you go, excuse me, I want to talk about All's Fair just for one quick sec or a long sec if you want.

1:19:11Will Arnett:The show on Hulu, executive producing on, so now this is scripted, yes? Yes. Ryan Murphy's producing, writing, directing. And this, do you prefer the scripted stuff? Do you want to mix it all in? Do you want to go, you know, how much, tell us about the the ratio between scripted and unscripted going forward for you guys? So doing an unscripted show is truly unscripted for us. We have no scripts. I don't even know half the time, I'm being perfectly honest, what we're gonna film that day. I'll know on my schedule, amongst all the other things I'm doing that day, it'll be glam, Kardashians is filming, you know, blah, blah, blah.

1:20:01sometimes I don't know what's happening. I think, you know, I knew my crew was going to be here today because I do know that we're going to film something later. And I'm working with Chloe and I think Kylie's probably here. But I'm really not sure. Some days, like what we're, but it always works out and it's always magic. So that's that side of it. I don't think, honestly, I could do more than one of those types of shows because it's not something that I want to manufacture what's going on. And at that point, what else is there to talk? So it would have to be scripted. So when Ryan Murphy came over for dinner one night and I said to Kim, come by, because as I said, we all live down the street from each other.

1:20:48I said, come over, Ryan Murphy's going to come over. I'm so obsessed with him and we love what he does and all of that. So he came over and I remember we had a conversation and I said, why don't, he said, why don't you, you know, to Kim, you know, maybe we could work together. And I said, Ryan, maybe write a show for her. Like, why don't you write something and we'll do something really exciting. In the meantime, he put her in American Horror Story, which she did a great job. And she's not a trained actress. She did phenomenal. and she got, she was happy with it. She loved the process, which I thought was a little concerning to me because there's a lot of waiting around.

1:21:32There's a lot of structure. There's a lot of, it's much, much different than, oh, bring the camera over. I'll shoot it on my iPhone. You know, I'm doing a reality show. It's much, obviously you guys know that better than you're three actors. You know, we're not actors by trade. Right. And so when she did it, she loved the process. And then I've suddenly got a call from Ryan And he said, I have something for you. And I said, hold up, come over, let me get my crew. So he came over to the house. We had a martini. He presented this idea for Kim for All's Fair. And we love the idea. Kim signed on. They talked about who would be her co-stars.

1:22:13And let me tell you something. These women were so generous and kind and amazing to her. and really wrapped their arms around her. And Ryan Murphy surrounded her with the most incredible group of women. And we had the time of our lives. She suddenly had a renewed spirit. She was making friends with people she would never have these relationships with. And I saw her beaming, you know, and really enjoying what she was doing. And now it got picked up for season two.

1:22:49Will Arnett:Amazing. And it's been, you know, Sarah Paulson and Glenn Close and Tiana Taylor and Naomi Watts and Niecy Nash and Kim and this beautiful cast. All-star cast. And the fashion that they all loved. And they just all loved hanging out with Kim. She loved hanging out with them. And I saw this genuine friendship evolve and develop over time. and it's been really, really amazing for me to get to witness that for my daughter. I'm so proud of her. That's great. Yeah. Really, really great. Yeah. And they're going into season two and that's a big deal and they start next month. So I'm really excited. And now Kim is filming her first, well, not her first movie, but a big movie that's a comedy.

1:23:38Will Arnett:Yeah. And it's going to be really, really good. It's called Fifth Wheel. Very nice. That's great. I'm glad things are finally working out for you guys and you're starting to get a little wind at your backs. We're just trying, man. It's just awesome. Every day, it's a grind. Chris, it really is incredible. I'm so, so thankful that you came on and you spent more than an hour with us telling us how you've done it all and how you continue to do it all. And we're rooting for you and we'll be watching all the next years going forward with this incredible story, truly. I appreciate you guys so much. And thank you for being so lovely and supportive.

1:24:20And I'm just grateful to be a part of this, you know, life and the entertainment community and to be able to add a little something. And I just, I come from a place of incredible gratitude. So for everybody that watches our show or has given us any kind of support or kindness or just, you know, just, you know, being watching from afar, it means the world. And, you know, I think that, you know, it's just it's great to be and come from a place of gratitude and just be kind to each other.

1:24:55Will Arnett:Yeah. The audience is certainly grateful for what you've done. Well, we love you. We love you. Yeah. Love you guys so much. Thank you. Thank you so much for coming. Truly. And Jason, I can't wait for our next vacation with Amanda. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Us too. Us too. Okay, we'll plan it. You guys figure it out. Okay, good. All right. All right. All right. Thank you very much. Bye, guys. Bye, honey. See ya. Bye. Bye-bye.

1:25:23Will Arnett:Wow, yeah. Powerhouse. Powerhouse. Powerhouse is right. I did not realize the time. I could have listened to her explain it all for even longer. She's so well-spoken and succinct. There's so much more to that story too, right? Yeah. Dang it. And, you know, when I feel like lazy or something, like, look at her, man. I know. Like, what? Her days. She's got 80 ,000 things going on. She's starting at five in the morning and probably goes till 10 at night on something that you just can't phone in. Right? I mean, the switch has got to be flicked on and she is just running shit. But I mean, if I have like two things in my day that I've got to like focus on, I'm like, oh, damn it.

1:26:10Will Arnett:Like, when can I put my PJs back on? If it's after four o 'clock, it's just... Forget it. Oh. I'm kidding. These are jokes. But yeah, I love the entrepreneurship and the philanthropy. And she's just a cool hang. Yeah. I like her. Yeah. And you know, she's so unique. Uh-oh. She's so unique and she's so different. It's really like one in a million. She's really, she's like a human being that's not, it's not easy to come by.

1:26:47That's the sentence. Come by. It's not easy to come by.

1:26:51Will Arnett:Okay. Yeah, someone like her is not easy to come by. There you go. Smart. Nice.

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