"Maria Shriver"

24:57It was so long ago. It was over 20. Is that another thing that I wasn't at? No, you were there, actually. You were... You had switched numbers. You had changed phone numbers, I think. No, no. This was like 25 years ago. Yeah, it was a long time ago. We were still friends then. That's cool. We'll double back on this after we sign off. Anyway, yeah, you're right. But it is great having those kind of people in your life. Yeah, I love that. And I like, these guys, we have the same thing. It's not holding your feet to the fire, but it's the ability to go, hey, this is what's going on and being unafraid to say, hey, have you thought about this in a way that's kind and constructive.

25:37Yes. And that exercise that Maria was talking about where we wrote each other, like, you know, good things, things to work on, whatever, blah, blah, blah. I said to her, you remember mine, the big one to you, was, hey, do you think you could introduce me to people when I come over to your house? Because she, for your whole life, has been so huge, filled with so many people constantly, 24-7 in your house, out of your, It's like a revolving door of all these people that come in and out. And I'll see these people and he'll be like, yeah, that's Martha. So anyway, come over. And I'm like, who is that?

26:10And I'll be sitting next, like having a hamburger next to somebody. And I'm like, I have no idea who this person is. And you just assume that I know them. And are you bringing your own hamburgers? Are you bringing the burgers with you? He does bring his own dessert though. He does bring his own dessert. He sure does. He does. Is it any wonder why his husband is a diabetic? Sean's got a trunk full of treats. No, I bring my own desserts because, as wonderful as you are to feed me, a lot of the times the desserts are gluten-free, sugar-free, bubbly-free. But that's because of Scotty. Why are you doing a funny voice?

26:44I'm doing that because of Scotty. Oh, I didn't know that. Out of respect, Sean. Out of respect. Unlike you, she's not trying to kill your husband. Right. I love his husband. He's so calm. He's the best. We love Scotty. We love Scotty. Scotty is the best. Maria, you touched on going back home and visiting your family and needing to sort of arm yourself, if you will, with a spiritual program. The idea of growing up with that kind of and continued sort of being part of a family that is under that kind of scrutiny, what does that do? Because we all have sort of - Tell Tracy, like, so your dad is the great Sergeant Shriver.

27:26Your mom is Eunice Kennedy, who is the sister of JFK, and you're the niece and blah, blah, blah. Okay. I am Maria. I am Maria. Right, and that's what I wanted to talk about. I am Maria. And that's what I wanted to talk about. You can find it on paperback. Or I am Maria. I am Maria. I am Maria. I am Maria. I am Maria. The son, the niece, the cousin, the this, the that. And you're like, I am Maria. But that's what I wanted to talk about, about the Hoffman's place. Is a guy came up. Remember this conversation was like three, four, five years ago. Do I talk to you or do I talk to, I mean, or Will?

27:57Will ask me a question or do I go to you? Do I get with Will first? Thank you, Maria. Thank you. No, where do I go? I just would first like to deal with Will. Welcome to SmartList. Because I'm your guest or should I go to you? But it has to do with Will, what Will's about to say. Okay. So the reason I brought up the Hoffman thing is because you shared with me that part of your journey at Hoffman was a guy came up to you and immediately started asking you about your lineage, right? And you're like, hang on, and it upset you because you're like, wait, my name is Maria Shriver. I am my own person.

28:30I have my own accomplishments. I have a family. I'm all these things that you are without the Kennedys, right? And then you had an epiphany that you shared with me. Like, wait, but part of me is that. And to shun it is wrong, right? And so, and then I know that has, that's kind of a prep to what Will's probably going to about to ask you. What was it like? Well, I had already asked her. What is it like? Do you feel, but yes, sure. That's adjacent to what I'm saying, which is, yeah, that's a. I'm right here. Yeah. Jason. Jason Abatement. Jason Abatement. Yeah. My new mold removal company. Yeah, yeah.

29:07I think it's going to do well. I think it will. That's funny. But talk about that. It's a lot. It's a lot, actually. But I find after doing a lot of work, I find myself now in a really good place about it. Well, because, and the reason I, what's interesting is, you know, you hear people who are, who have made names of themselves as a, whatever it is, name the discipline. But, and then people say, and if they say, well, it's tough being in this position, the critics say, well, fuck it, that's the price you pay for being famous. And they say that, right? So you can't complain. And in a lot of ways, even though you've had so many great accomplishments that you've forged on your own, you were born into it.

29:52You didn't have a choice is the truth, right? Right. Yeah. But I think we all have a choice about how we want to conduct ourselves in that experience. Right. And I think what I tried to do was outwork my lineage, which was a mistake. and I thought like oh if I you know get accomplished if I do all these things then you won't be introducing me by whose daughter I am whose cousin I am whose niece I am and won't be talking to me only about those things and that uh was a driver uh certainly but I think it was unrealistic because I came to understand like I'm never going to outwork that I'm never going to outperform that I'm never going to out that, right, so to speak.

30:37So getting to a place where like, okay, wait a minute, let me figure out how to accept that, how to be happy when people come up and that's all they want to talk to me about. And then just try to understand that I have my own practice. I have friends who understand who I am, who love me for me, and that I can't change everybody's opinion. Like I go through the airport or I sit down and that's what all people want to talk to me about. I just go, okay, now I understand that. I just let that be and I don't get mad at them. Yeah, yeah. But it's so funny. Like growing up in my generation and seeing you on TV all the time, I would never ever think of talking to you about that because I grew up seeing you as Maria Shriver only.

31:22Yeah, exactly. Even more famous than any Kennedy lineage could put on someone. You were extremely successful in carving your own name, your own position, your own profile. But people want to talk to me about the other. Right. Yeah, exactly. And so I think it's just getting to a place of understanding that, that that's part of you and not fighting it. And then just trying to figure out, okay, what do I want to do? Which brings me back, you know, what are the issues that I care about? and not feeling like I'm not performing if I'm not running for president. That's kind of how I grew up. Like, if you're not going to, you know, run for that, like, get out of the way, you know.

32:05Go to the back of the room. So I had to go like, okay, you know. And my mother was also a total force of nature. She certainly was. Quite a tough woman. And she also was not interested in hearing any complaint about anything. Right. So I wanted to ask you about that. Yeah. Because the few lunches I had with her and you, I'd be sitting, she scared the shit out of me. I'd be sitting there having lunch and we had a couple of good laughs. Yeah, she's funny. Yeah, she's funny. But you're right. She's very guarded or whatever, however you want to describe it. And you are one of the best mothers I've ever witnessed.

32:43Thank you. The rules that you put in place and the boundaries and the love and all of those things as a mother was incredible to witness. But did you recognize that in your mom, that she is this kind of, like you said, force of nature in an emotional way? Did you find that, okay, well, like all of us, we got to take the good stuff from our parents and the stuff that maybe we don't want to take. And how did you find that balance? And were you aware of how she was? Well, I was aware she terrified everybody. And she terrified me, too. So, I mean, I was aware of that. I was aware that she was formidable.

33:22And, you know, I stood up, as I said, every time she walked in the room till the day she died, right? Both my parents, I was raised that way. My grandparents, my parents, you know, like they're in charge, they're running the roost. And they had really high expectations. And I was, and my brothers, so they were very clear about their expectations. So, and if you were not doing them, well, you just did not do them. Yeah, yeah. How did that transfer into your style of parenting? Like my dad was super duper strict and I found that I kind of went the other direction to a certain extent. Like I wanted my kids to feel a little bit more of a friendship with me than I had with my dad.

34:11But then I also recognized that I had this big authority figure, this disciplinarian in front of me was very good for me, gave me a lot of structure. And so I thought, oh, maybe I'm doing a disservice to my kids. So I kind of tried to tack back. Like, how did you find a balance there? Well, I tried to kind of take a lot of the things both my parents instilled in me. But I tried to be softer in that I tried to say, I love you. I tried to touch them and hold them. and nurture them and, you know, I guess really touch, you know, hold them. And, you know, I think my, but I also have, and through Hoffman and other work, understood that my mother, you know, asking my mother to give me something that wasn't given to her was unfair.

34:59Right, right, right. And so she didn't grow up being held like that. She didn't grow up being, she was loved in a different way. And I felt loved, but not like how I would look at other people's mothers. It wasn't the same thing, you know. We'll be right back.

35:23And now back to the show. Was that a big moment for you when you started? I remember certain things about not forgiving your parents, but when you have an understanding and appreciation of what it is, what their limitations are because of how they were brought up, et cetera. First of all, it happens later in life than you wish. You wished it would happen when you were 18. Right. What was that like for you? Was that a sort of a watershed moment in your life? Yeah, and it continued to be in multiple ways. And even after my mother passed away, I continued to learn about her and continued to change my relationship with her.

36:05In death as well. And trying to understand how she was raised, what she was up against. You know, my mother, she dressed in men's pants. She carried a briefcase. She smoked cigars. She only hung out with men. She'd have, you know, like our table was filled with men. And when, like, they would bring their wives and maybe wives would go into one corner, she'd always go with the men. She had her cigar out. She'd have her, you know, pencils in her hair. and she was like on it. She was like not messing around at all. So I was like, okay, is that a woman? I was like, is that the way you're supposed to do it?

36:45You know, I don't know. She was very competitive, hyper-competitive, tried to beat all her children, beat everybody who came around. And so she was - And challenging, not physically. Very challenging. Yeah, not physically. Be competitively. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Not beat them. Thank you, Sean. You're welcome. That's what I'm hearing. But I admired that. That's how she created the Special Olympics. That's how she created change in the field of people with intellectual disability. She willed it into action, and she stomped the halls of Capitol Hill, and she forced her brother when he was president and her other brothers when they were in the Senate to change laws.

37:25And she was relentless, and that created tremendous change. So I kind of watched that and I tried to figure out, okay, how do I do that out of the house, but not in the house? I'm sure you've answered this a thousand times. I apologize for not knowing the answer. But what was the main thing that kept you from ever really formally going into a political position and the feeling that you could affect change a little bit more from the private sector? Well, my experience with politics was assassination. And I also, my dad ran for vice president at 72 and lost. And it was a big, that was a huge watershed moment for me.

38:08And I also watched people come over to our home who were involved in politics, who were one way in our house in a different way on television and outside. And I didn't like that. So for me, it was just, it felt, you know, I felt, and I watched my mother, as I said, do things outside of politics and create change. And my dad as well started the Peace Corps, the War on Poverty, Head Start, you know, foster grandparents, Job Corps, the list goes on. And I watched how they changed the world outside of running for office. And so I thought, you know, that was a good model to emulate. What incredible examples of like, and using their time and their position and Jay, how many days a week did you play golf last week?

39:01Oh, boy. I can tell you, first of all, let me say, I was very peaceful while I did it. Okay, good for you. The core of what I was doing. I don't think that's what the peace core means. Yeah, they put a P on the end of it for some weird reason. I was actually talking to my 18-year-old yesterday about, oh, no, it was the 12-year-old. I can't remember. One of the daughters yesterday about service right after school and how some countries make that a requirement. And where do you sit on that? I feel like it'd be such a great thing. Someone was talking about it on TV the other day about how it would foster this great healthy sense of shared responsibility.

39:44Should it be monetary service? No, it could take any form. Yeah, in some countries it's military. In other countries it's just serving the greater good, some sort of civil, Peace Corps came to mind when I was talking to her. That's what made me think of it when you were talking about it. Where do you stand on that? Sean, you did up with people for two years, didn't you? Yeah, I did down with people. I think it's a great idea. I think it's a great idea. We actually, in this weekly, I heard you asking about, you know, newsletters. And I have a newsletter that goes out every Sunday called the Sunday Paper.

40:19And we actually published yesterday this op-ed from these two friends of mine, John Bridgeland and Alan Casey, called Big Citizenship. And the idea about proposing to this administration about what we actually need is a big service corps where everybody could be of service to their country for one or two years. And you could be in AmeriCorps, you could be in Teach for America, you could be in the Peace Corps. And actually, when Arnold was governor and I was first lady, we tried to do that. We started a California Corps of people volunteering for California. And I always felt that that would be something that people would bring people from all walks of life together.

41:00And I worked for a while on a National Service Corps proposal, which never got off the ground. But, you know, it's a financial, I think it's more of a financial issue for the federal government. I think there's tremendous desire there that people really want and would, whether it's a gap year and that there's so many ways to be. You could have an environmental core. They have that in California, environmental core. I tried to do that because we need so many more caregivers for people with Alzheimer's and dementia and Parkinson's and all this sort of stuff. If people went, could they get free tuition if they went to a state school, if they gave two years to be a caregiver?

41:37It's a great idea. Yeah. JB, when they canceled, Hogan family, didn't you have a gap year? Oh, yeah, yeah. A lot, more of a decade. He doesn't remember it. But yeah, that would be, you know, not to be too cynical, but it does seem like the miracle of it all or the big thing that would get it moving would be what is the carrot on the other side for the person who's volunteering, quote unquote. Like, is it free tuition? Is it a more favored consideration on your application going into a state school? what's in it for them aside from the good feeling you would have? Well, that would be big to get tuition lessened.

42:22I think that's a huge carrot for people. Why not just waive it? Or just a higher consideration, a different list that you're on when you're in consideration for a state school. Because I know my 18-year-old, that's so much anxiety for kids. Like getting into a school, have I done enough extracurricular, blah, blah, blah. Like if that was something that like, oh, you go right to the top of the list in consideration for these UC schools, that would be big and it wouldn't cost, I don't think it would cost the state anything. We tried to do something like that. I was chairing a task force for the governor here on Alzheimer's and that was one of our recommendations about that.

43:00So it hadn't happened yet, but I think there are ideas like that around, which I think are great. And I think that young people would really like that. Service Corps, you know, there are some programs around like that. But I think the question always is, you know, they don't pay well, obviously. But you're at an age where you don't need the money just yet. Like you might still potentially be under your parents' wing, you know, just right after high school and before college. And maybe the parents would be okay, give them one more year of support while you're off helping the country or the state.

43:36Yeah. Well, yeah, a lot of people do need the money. So it's like looking at so that it's a diverse workforce, that it's, you know, different states have different needs, right? Different states have different needs. And so I think it's a great idea. There are a lot of people who've been pushing it for a long time. It has not happened. I thought it was an intriguing op-ed that these guys wrote originally for the Washington Post last week, and then we repurposed it in the Sunday paper on Sunday. I want that newsletter. Big citizenship. I like that idea, big citizenship. You know, it's funny. I mean, we sit here, we talk about it, and we're in a unique position.

44:14We get to sort of talk about these ideas, et cetera, and they make a lot of sense. And how funny or how unfortunate it is. As you say, there's met resistance. It never happened. It wouldn't go through. And it really does make you wonder, why? Yeah, that's what I was wondering. Why don't people want to do it? Why don't people, why isn't there a sense that we should, you know, do something for the greater good? And people go, well, we don't want to. Yeah, or a couple of people don't want to. Well, there's a lot going on, actually. You know, like I look at Special Olympics all the time, which is one of the largest volunteer programs in the world, right?

44:52And people are, you know, from both parties, from all different age groups, go out and volunteer. And I think because they're asked, they're asked like this program won't succeed in your neighborhood or your community or your state unless you volunteer. And I think sometimes people, it depends who's doing the asking, right? You even see that in our own homes, you know, sometimes like who's asking you to clear the table? Who's asking you to do the chore? And then what figure is asking you to be of service? And I think we young people aren't volunteering for military corps because sometimes they look and see like, well, how does that person get taken care of when they come back?

45:33Who's doing the asking? What is the life like on the other end versus, you know, many years ago? Right. So I think it's I believe that, you know, if the right person raises it up, puts it front and center, makes it inspiring, calls young people up and tells them we need you in order to rebuild the country, in order to, you know, put our values front and center, in order that you can have a country that's going to be the country you want to live in with the values you want to live in. And so I'm calling everybody up. I mean, I think it's, nobody's called people up like that, right? It's great. One of the pieces of advice I've actually shared with these guys before outside of this podcast is anytime there'd be an issue that came up politically or socially or whatever it was, and I would complain about it to you and you would say, I know, isn't that awful?

46:30So what are you doing about it? Yeah, exactly. And I'm like, oh, and it completely disarms people because you're right. It's like to everything you're saying, you have to be the leader of that. Instead of sitting and waiting for somebody to ask you. Will, I think kids would listen to you if you just ask them to serve. Me? You think they'd listen to me? I think they would, yeah. So wait, so Maria. I love that. I mean, I think, Jason, you should take that on. I think like my kids, if you ask my kids, they pay attention. They'd be like, did you hear it? God, he asked us to be of service. I think Will has a better voice.

47:04Will makes a lot of money with his voice, a lot of timber to it. I'll set him up with a big phone bank. I think, Jason, we'll send a car to get you out of the house. Will, I think you're uniquely suited for this. You got a whisper booth there. A whisper booth. Everything's all ready. Whisper booth. So, Maria, before we leave you... You're leaving? Yeah. You're already in overtime. I'm going to go tell the leaf blower he can go back, right? Yeah. Yes. But wait, I have one last thing. One last thing. You're super successful. You've seen it all. You've met everyone. You've had more experiences than anyone I know.

47:41What is it there? What is that you haven't done or want to accomplish that speaks to your values? How about that? Oh, that's a really deep question. Yeah. Wow. Should have gave her that at the beginning and give her a chance to come up with an answer. I don't know if I'm going to tell you the answer. I know the answer, but I'm not going to tell you this. Come on, Maria. No, no, I'm not going to say it. You're not going to tell us what you— I'm just going to keep on going. I'm going to keep on going right down here. I totally am always thinking of like— You're pointing in the right direction. I'm pointing in the right direction.

48:15Yes, that's true. I'm moving forward. You are. I think—and I always tell you, I think like, who do I want at my 70th birthday? Who do I want at my funeral? And I work on those relationships now. I love that those are two different lists. I love it. I love it. And I'm now going to include you to the other boys now at my funeral and my birthday party. I just grew my list. That's right. I'd love to say a few words if that'd be okay. I hope so. I hope you'll bring a poem because I've got this book of poetry. So that's mainly when people use poems, right? They stand up at a funeral. They stand up at a wedding.

48:50I asked to get the copy of the book and it's not ready yet, but I can't wait to read I Am Maria and the poems. Yes, and then a poem. Do you have a poem in your life that's like important? Nothing. No, roses are red, violets are blue. Nothing. How about you other guys? No poems, no poetry? I've got to work on that part. Sure. I mean, I could cite like, you know, Rilke or somebody like that. You know what I mean? Jeez. I mean, what are we going to do? Poetry is, you know, is useful in times of celebration, in times of heartbreak. So you don't want to answer the one thing that you haven't done that you want to accomplish.

49:25Well, but you made it specifically to her values. Now, you could say something a little bit more trivial, like is there a place you'd like to go or a person you've yet to meet? Yeah, how about that? Oh, yeah, I have a person I'd get to meet. I really want to sit and have a meal with the Pope. Aha. I really want to meet the Pope. Let me just check. I want to move in with the Pope. I want to hang with the Pope. He's pretty jammed. I'm looking right now. Yeah, he's, I mean, how's your April? How's your April looking? I'll change. I'll even give up my Sunday dinner for the Pope. Let me talk. I'll move everything around for the Pope.

50:05Wow. For Francis. Yeah. He's my man. I feel like you can make that happen. All right. I'm going to work on that for you. Will you work on that for me? Yeah. Just put me in your luggage. Take me there to Rome. I think if I could just get in and sit down at the table, you're not allowed. My brother went there. And you're not, if you see him eating there, you're not allowed to go over and talk. And so my brother said, well, you would break that role, Maria. I said, oh, for sure. Let me just say this, Maria. Maria, let me just say this. If anyone can, the Vatican. Okay, so don't worry. You're going to let it happen.

50:36Oh, that's funny. The Vatican. There we go. Maria, we love you. I can't wait for your book. I love you, Shawty. Yes, so much. One of the most important people in my life is you, as well as these two fellas. So I'm all in one show. It makes me very, very happy today. Really nice to meet you. Thank you for having me. Thank you for having me. Thank you, Maria. I want to come over and clear the table. Invite me. I'll be a good guest. Yeah. Okay. You don't have to ask him. He'll just do it. He'll do it? Yeah, yeah. I love it. Good example for my boys. All right, honey. Love you. Okay, bye. Now do I go?

51:07Thank you. You slam it. Yeah. Okay. You can slam it shut. Yeah.

51:16Yeah. Right? She's awesome. Emotional sobriety. I've met her a couple times with you, about it so briefly and I never really got a sense of like how, I mean, a little bit. She's obviously super smart and stuff but like she's amazing. Yeah, but and 10, I mean, there's 10 ,000 other things that she's started or programs or I mean, we didn't even get into any of it but she's endless. Every single day she wakes up thinking about how she can serve. I know we talked about that before with other people but how can she... Don't sell yourself short. You told me the other day you started season four The Mentalist.

51:48That's true. You and Scottie.

51:53the mental how do you have that at the ready the mental anyway maria maria maria i love uh sean i love that i know you've talked so fondly about her and her family and how important they are to you and your life yeah right it just like because he doesn't like does not like to cook that that is why no but like real jen's on sunday Maria's on Thursday. Real rocks, real rocks for you. Like really, real right now. Oh, thanks, Eddie. Yeah, thanks. Like a real steadiness added to your life. Yeah, she is, yeah. As are you guys, by the way. Oh, thanks. Yeah, but... Yeah, she's done so much for so many groups hearing her talk and it's just incredible.

52:38Anyway, thanks for indulging and I'm glad you enjoyed her as much as I did. She is. She seems like she would be absolutely my favorite person in the world. Yeah, well, why don't we do? We'll do a din. Yeah. Make it happen. We'll do a din? Yeah, that's short for dinner. Yeah, we'll do a dinzy. You know? Do a dinzy. This guy's a hip guy. He's got riz.

53:05Sean, anything in the bifolder? Oh, there we go. He's got the bifolder open. I don't want to pull up the bifolder. Put on your bifocals and anything there? You know, we watched... Oh, yeah, go ahead. Here we go. This is a made-up story. Oh, you know, we watched a show last night. Oh, I used this one before. I used this one before. You know, I like to, if I'm driving around, I'm hungry, and it's a Sunday, and Maria's having family dinner, I like to stop. Bye for a quick... Bye. All right, bite. Quick bite, and bye, everybody. Bye. Fuck, we are scraping the bottom. Smart Less.

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