"Pixies"

20:41We used to go to the club called the Ratskeller in Kenmore Square, which is no longer there, but it's an old venue because I believe my parents used to hang out there when they were teenagers. And anyway, we used to time how long the sets were for the bands because we had to figure out, well, how do we do that? You know, how do we get from just having a couple of rinky-dink tunes on our guitars or to having a full-fledged band where we're doing what those kids are doing? Yeah. And so, yeah, we used to hang out in clubs in time. Oh, we need 25 minutes or whatever. And we need to, who do we got to talk to?

21:23You know, it takes a while to figure out. Oh, you got to send a letter to that person. You got to send the pets to the sound man's girlfriend, Maria. She's the one you have to get the tape to. oh here's the tape you know there's this process of getting the tape to the right fucking person and then finally getting the Monday night and then the Tuesday night and then I suppose it's the same thing with comedy or anything you know was there a particular was there a particular night that you had at the club that that that that really caught on you could feel the audience was like oh these guys are rad I'm gonna I'm gonna sign up just come see them wherever they play next did you know that you had an audience

22:04Sean Hayes:A following was kind of developing. Yeah. I'll tell you when I knew we had something going. Yeah, yeah. Remember we were practicing at your apartment there in Fenway and we heard a door knocking. The door knocked. Yeah. And go, shit, we're too loud. You know, it was the maintenance guy. Yeah. And we answered the door and he goes, I just want to tell you guys, you guys are sounding good. Yeah. That's fucking rad. That's great. Yeah. And this is a place right near Fenway? Yeah, yeah. You live in the Fenway at the time. In the Fenway, yeah. Yeah. And that's where we had our first real, well, our first real rehearsal space was somewhere else, but we eventually ended up with a, like a place with a sewer cap in it.

22:57And it was down in the basement, and there was a bunch of bands down there. But, and it was very expensive, even then. You know, it was like fucking $500 a month for like a little windowless room with a sewer cap in it and then when it rained, there were all these like bugs suddenly like flying in the space and it smelled like shit and it was just a god-awful place but that's like the best that we could get.

23:20Sean Hayes:Those are two opportunities where Jason would have quit the band with the shower and then the sewage space. And the rehearsal space. I'm happy to produce. I'll see you guys at the mixing studio. But wait a second. Were you guys See you at the Hollywood Bowl. When did you guys become Pixies? What was the kind of the moment you guys became? How did the name come up and what was the moment? Like, okay, now we're Pixies. Well, I suppose it would have been our second show officially because the first show we were listed as the Puxies. And so officially we were the Puxies in our first engagement. And then the second engagement.

23:54Because it was a typo? They got the spelling right. Typo. The Pixies. But I suppose Joey picked the name of the band. He was saddled with that responsibility or took it upon himself. And you had a dictionary, right, Joe? Yeah. I'm using a dictionary right now to hold up my computer. But I believe you were in the P's and there were a lot of P names. No way. Did you just throw a dart? It just looked good. You know, it had an X in the middle. That's funny. That's really funny. Also, what's the definition? Mischievous little elf. I love that. So that's a good one. That's when I start calling you, Willie.

24:39Thanks, man. Yeah, you're my little pixie. Get over here. And we will be right back. You know what's underrated? Not thinking about your stomach. It shouldn't get a vote. You want a stomach that minds its own business so you can go do something more interesting. New Culturel Complete 3-in-1 Biotics Mini Chews are delicious, crunchy bits you easily pop in your mouth every day. No water needed. They help with occasional bloating, gas, and digestive discomfort to keep your gut drama-free. Because when your stomach is boring, your life doesn't have to be. Culturel Probiotics. The science of a boring gut.

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26:32and now back to the show so you guys are playing you're practicing and you and you were open when you guys sorry to go back

26:42Sean Hayes:to purple tapes but that was kind of your first recording you guys were were you opening for other bands were you guys opening where did i read a long time were you opening for throwing muses or something is that right do i have any of that right yeah we did sure yeah we used to open up for them great because they were a little further along than we were with all of the showbiz you know so i think they had a record out and they had a manager and stuff but uh so but that's how so we got hooked up with them and some of their people you know some of their some of their crew and some of their manager.

27:13We had the same manager for a while. But the same producer for a little while. But I suppose that was, if there was any camaraderie, that would be the one band that was the, if we had any camaraderie. There wasn't a lot of camaraderie in Boston. For us, I think. I think, I don't mean in a negative way even. I just mean that we didn't bother with that. It just, it seemed very clear and apparent to us that we had to get out of Dodge in order for it to mean anything significant. And, you know, we had to, because, you know, those bands that come through that are from other places, you know, you see them come through.

27:59There was this Australian band, what are they called? Celibate Rifles. I remember the Celibate Rifles used to come through and they would have to draw 50 people or whatever every time they played at the Rats Killer. But it was like, wow, I don't know. They figured out how to get all the way here from Sydney or wherever they're from. And they're playing a show. And I don't know. It seems pretty fun to me. Like, so how do we get on that thing that they're doing, you know? And, of course, you know, it's not that glamorous. But it doesn't have to be glamorous when you're, you know, 20 years old. It's like you want to travel or meet people or whatever, you know.

28:35Sean Hayes:I think that there's also that thing of, like, maybe you're from where you're from the place and you want to kind of be, there's something mysterious about a band that's coming from somewhere else. Like you want to be from somewhere else. I don't know if that figures into it either, like to just sort of like add to the mystique. Is that part of it or am I reading that wrong? Well, I suppose Joey and I both probably had this, we're the same exact age and we both have the same, he's originally from the Philippines and I'm originally from Massachusetts, but we both have the same kind of level of Beatle knowledge and sort of Beatle sort of brainwashing or whatever.

29:18You know what I mean? And other stuff from the 60s and 70s, but putting just for the sake of conversation, putting Beatles at the front of that pack. You know, so by the time we met up when we were 17 or 18, it was like, oh, you like the Beatles. I like the Beatles. Yeah. And it's kind of like we have that, if you love the Beatles, then you have some affection for that lore, right? For the Liverpool thing and the little club. And when they went and played the strip clubs in Hamburg and blah, blah, blah, blah. The Star Club and all of the history and all of that. Even if you've never been there, you have a lot of romantic feelings about those histories.

30:02You know, and so when you finally get to go on tour and then you're there and you're playing in those clubs in those same cities, you're kind of like going, ah, this is what it was like. And this is what it's like to record at the BBC radio studios or whatever, whatever the experience is. Sometimes that matches right up with the with your heroes. It'll be the same building, you know what I mean? The same stage or whatever. and so that's satisfying you know to be out on the map somewhere far from where you're from and be like yep but i'm doing the same thing that yeah you know that the fab four did you know it's corny as that you know but that's that's the way it is was there a band that was um that was uh really doing it when you guys got started that you kind of had your eye on and said boy if we If we could kind of go in that direction, we'd have something.

30:55That's where we want to go.

30:56Sean Hayes:Well, they were doing it in sort of tonally that you liked, that you were like, oh, this is kind of, was there any of that sort of influence-wise? At that time? I don't know, Joe. What did you think? I'm trying to think, did we talk about that kind of stuff? I like the Zulus. I remember the Zulus. I don't know that. They had something, you know, just wild guitar, wild vocalists. Yeah. I kind of want to jump to, so you guys are doing this stuff, and you put this stuff together, and you do, the Purple Tapes becomes basically, come on, Pilgrim, is that sort of right? Mm-hmm, yeah. But then your first real full-length record is Surfer Rosa.

31:38Sean Hayes:That's 1988, and that's kind of your introduction on a bigger scale to you guys, to the world, and it's meant with a ton of critical acclaim, acclaim like this this puts you guys front and center and what's going on i'll tell you something man knowing that you guys were coming on uh i have a 15 year i have three sons my 15 year old son is really into music and we've been listening to you guys a lot the last couple days like in the car and stuff and i keep going oh man we're gonna have these guys on the podcast and i i was playing some of your songs and i'm like yeah this record came out in 1988 my son's like no fucking way because it seems so relevant musically.

32:20Sean Hayes:It seems so pressing. Everything about it just seems so, for lack of a better word, modern or current or whatever. And you realize kind of how ahead of the curve you guys were in terms of just sonically, I think. And I know that, and I'm sort of jumping all over the place, I know that since you guys, you put out five records in a really short period of time and then you took a break for a number of years. And it was almost like after you guys, the first time you broke up, people went like, oh, we missed that. We didn't realize at the time how great these dudes were, what these guys were doing.

33:02Sean Hayes:Fuck you. Yeah. Was there a sense of fuck you? Okay, fuck, let's hear it. Was there ever fuck you? Or we told you so, man. And we were making, and when other bands started coming, because I know everybody, I mentioned in the intro, like Kurt Cobain, the guys in Radiohead, they've all talked about how much you guys influenced them. And when you kind of like, is there a little bit of like, yeah, we're trying to tell you that, man. No. Yeah, I don't know. I don't know if we take it all that seriously, you know. I mean, we take it seriously in the sense that we thoroughly enjoy it. You know what I mean?

33:37Yeah. Thoroughly enjoy the whole routine, the whole, whatever it is, you got to do, you know what I mean? You know, play a show or, you know, I don't really like doing TV shows, but, you know, like you got to do that sometimes. You know, go record a record and kind of, you know, you're in a friendly way competing with some other people maybe that are, I guess, contemporaries or whatever, you know, plus competing with your heroes and everything, you know, so it's all really fun. but, you know, you can't take it too seriously. I don't know. I don't know, especially because I don't know if I, it's not like I feel like I went to, we went to music school for 20 years and slaved away for, you know, trying to just absorb all this stuff and worked so hard at it.

34:29I mean, we just love it and we like doing it and we're not, I don't know. So if other people like it, it's like, oh, good. You know, I like you too.

34:40Sean Hayes:but Charles you talk about you talk about like doing tv shows and stuff and then I wanted to get in this and this is all in no particular order because I'm just kind of vomiting my uh my obsession with you guys um I was thinking about how much you know the influence you guys have had well first of all I was thinking like in media like if you think about where is my mind where you guys felt about where is my mind being the the last song comes up a lot I'm sure so I'm Sorry, forgive me. You know, it plays over the very end of Fight Club. And then kind of the world is falling apart. And that was, I think, for a lot of like a new generation, like an introduction to you guys.

35:19Sean Hayes:Everybody was like, holy shit. And when you see a song that you wrote, I don't know, I'd like to know where your mind was when you wrote that compared to what it's been applied to because now it's sort of represented in a different way, sort of the end of the world and stuff. What is that sort of that gap between where it was when it started and when you wrote it and what it ended up sort of symbolizing later because of its use in the movie? I don't really know. I don't have a lot of memory of putting it together or feeling that it was... Important? So notable or anything like that. But my girlfriend was, usually I played in the bathroom, you know, because it was the one private space in a little apartment, right?

36:11But she was in there doing makeup and said, and so I was in the bedroom with my guitar playing those chords and kind of working out maybe an arrangement of the song. And she stopped what she was doing and said, finish that song. She said, that's a good one. And I went, oh, okay. But that's the only memory I have of it, really. That's cool. I guess when I go back and I analyze it, it just sounds like a silly little folk song or something, you know, that I would have learned how to do stuff like that when I was in about third or fourth grade. I used to hang out with a lot of hippie kind of folk music types in Newton, Massachusetts.

36:55And they schooled us in a lot of sing-along-y things that were kind of cool, actually, in retrospect, including Woody Guthrie and all that stuff. You know, but so to me, whereas my mind kind of just fits in with that, you know, here we go, third verse. Same as the first verse. Here we go, everybody. You know, it's not even a sensical song or anything. It's just like some delightful words to trip over, you know, while you're kind of skipping through a melody and, you know.

37:26Sean Hayes:I know. Well, that's nice, but that's interesting because we all have, I mean, I have had so many experiences listening to that song myself in sort of deep moments and that sort of haunting that Joey, that guitar. You know, that whole, like, it just, and it's had another life, as you probably know, like on social media and TikTok, Like, my kids see it all the time that it's used in all these different ways. And it's, again, Charles, I mean, I know it's so funny to hear you that, like, yeah, you're just kind of coming up with it in a moment. And then it goes on to have this other application. It must be kind of trippy.

38:03Sean Hayes:Like, Joey, when you hear that guitar riff, it must come up sometimes. You hear it. And do you remember recording it when you guys recorded it? Do you remember that day or thinking, like, this is cool? I do remember it. I remember you showed us a song at your apartment. We had some Vietnamese food. And then that part came right away, and it was like, I'm done. That's what I said, basically, I'm done. Because I wanted to do that little Chuck Berry thing, but I didn't do the double note. So I just want to fit that in. Yeah, it's good. Well, is it, does it matter more or less for a song to have a long life of, like, would you rather a song be super duper memorable because of its tune, because of its melody, or because of the words that it says?

39:01Like, you know, Charles, you were saying, it's like, you know, it's just like a couple of chords here and some words that you might, you know, like what is more important to you of the staying power of a song, the melody or the words that what you're trying to say, you know, does it matter? I mean, both work, right? I mean, you know, because you have people that feel very warm or poignant or whatever about a particular lyric or whatever or the meaning of a song. But then a lot of times it's just sounds and combinations of sounds and chords and, you know, things that give you the chills or the goosebumps.

39:36And, you know, I don't know. I mean, I don't think any of our, I mean, half of our audience is like doesn't speak English. So they speak rock English, you know what I mean? So I suppose they can connect to it a little bit. Yeah, that's a good point. But, you know, there's a lot of other stuff mixed in with it, I suppose. So I don't want to put too much. It's nice when words can be good, but when someone can declare, oh, this is indeed a fine libretto, you know. But at the end of the day, it's a rock music context. So it's like there's a lot of... You know what I mean? There's a lot of other kind of elements that are kind of coming to the party also.

40:25You know what I mean? Where's the most surprising place you have found a dedicated fan base? What corner of the world surprised you? Like, wow.

40:37Sean Hayes:You show up in Lisbon and all of a sudden you're like, wow, we got a lot of fans. in Lisbon. It's like we found that in Iran we have a big audience. Yeah, for a podcast. It really blew our minds. We were like, what? We were like, what? We're lucky enough to have a pretty far-flung audience, but I don't know that, like, I don't know if we've discovered that enclave of, like, you know, whatever, someplace in, somewhere way off of the beaten path, like, I don't know, like, like Inner India or somewhere like that, you know, where they've somehow discovered our music or whatever. But we do play a lot of places.

41:17So I'm trying to think of some place we've played. I mean, talking about, like, Portugal, like, we do really well down in Portugal. There you go.

41:26Sean Hayes:What did you guys think about, Charles and Joey, what did you guys think about, what was the way that people used to talk about, they used to try to, like, because I hate when people get categorized, but when they tried to like call it like the soft, quiet, loud or whatever, what was the term that they used? Do you remember that they used to try to describe you guys? Loud, quiet, loud. Yeah, loud, quiet, loud. Yeah. And when you heard that, were you like, oh, okay, well, that's just us. Like, whatever. We certainly didn't invent it, you know? I mean, Chkalski's 1812 Wolverine sure had fucking cannons, you know?

42:07Sean? That's true. That's very true, yeah. Yeah. I mean, you got... Go ahead, Chuck. I was just going to say something about touring. So you guys still tour, it sounds like a lot. And when you do, do you see each other before a show or is the first time you see each other when you're on stage? Like, do you hang out backstage before the show? Yeah. We hang out about an hour before the show. We convene and there's an espresso machine in our tour manager's office. that we all go there and get an espresso. Oh, that's good. And then we sit down in the dressing room, and then we have, like, some acoustic guitars there.

42:46There's one acoustic guitar. And then I think, Dave, you should just find something to tap on. And then we sing for about a half an hour or 45 minutes and kind of go, oh, yeah, that's how we play. And then we go on tour. But, yeah, we don't really – we don't live in the same city anymore, so I think we have – I don't know. I don't want to call it that we're lazy, but we've just been doing it for so long that we don't really go over it over and over and over.

43:16Sean Hayes:Do you guys, so you guys, so I mentioned before, I kind of want to jump back. So you do five records in a short amount of time, ending with Trompe Le Mans, which again, another one of those records that years later everybody's like, oh man, this record is amazing and we should have recognized it at the time. And you take a long break. You guys were basically broken up for, I don't know, 10 years or something. 12 years. And in that time, you all go off and do different things. Frank, you do, I call you Frank because in that time, you were known as Frank Black. You put a bunch of records out as Frank Black.

43:54Sean Hayes:Of course, Teenager of the Year. I didn't know this. Teenager of the Year, by the way, I just want to say sort of Pixie's side note if I can, Charles. I didn't know that you had actually been named Teenager of the Year in high school I read that somewhere Is that true that you were named Teenager of the Year? What's that mean? It's an award that was given at the high school that I graduated from I don't know why it's given but I think it's like a It's like for the good kid that didn't do that much but he stayed out of trouble and he seemed nice so we got to give him something and it's like a little hey, you're the Teenager of the Year I was the class ghost.

44:34Wait, is that true? Is that true, Joe? The class ghost. No pictures of me one year on the yearbook. I refused to have my picture taken and anything. So I wasn't even, I didn't even exist.

44:46Sean Hayes:Joe, what a perfect pairing. You're the class ghost and the teenager of the year together. Like it's almost like meant to be, man. It's like written in the fucking stars. And so then you guys have this 12-year hiatus from Pixies. And you get back to it. Is that what it was? Was it just a hiatus to do other stuff? Or was there acrimony and you guys were like, no, fuck this, let's not do it? Oh, no, we broke up. The band was broken up and we had to go pay our dues, I suppose, because we didn't really pay our dues the first time around. I mean, I'm not saying that it was all super easy, but, you know, whatever.

45:24It was like every band's got five years, as they say. And you do it all in five years and it all kind of implodes. And then we imploded. And then, so we were just, whatever, treading water for 20 years. And I mean, not treading water, because I know Kim actually had some pretty big success with her band, The Breeders. And she had a big hit and everything. So, and, you know, I mean, I wasn't, you know, I shouldn't, it sounds like a complaining, but I'm not. But, you know, it's not like I was, or we were doing all these amazing projects that were, you know, so successful, whatever. You're just kind of hovering around and kind of staying in it as best as you can for a whole, and, you know, plenty of humbling experiences, I suppose, to go along with it.

46:16Sean Hayes:Well, you inspired in that time, little do you know. I will tell you one more sidebar, Charles, which is years ago, what is it, 2025? 25 so like like 14 years ago i was trying to come up with i was i had this idea for this show that became a very little watched show on netflix called flake that i wrote and uh and i was flying over to the uk and i was just outlining this like dumb idea and i was like what is this thing what is this thing i was gonna and i was gonna meet my my partner chappy who's a great friend of jason's and uh the best you have the greatest name in the world and uh mark chapel a great writer who wrote, we've written a bunch of stuff together.

46:56Sean Hayes:He wrote, Is This Thing On With Me with Bradley, our new movie. So anyway, I'm going over there and I was listening to Teenager of the Year. And I was listening to Freedom Rock, that track, Freedom Rock. And it goes, for you guys who don't know, it goes, My name is Chip and I'm different. And I just wrote that down, that lyric down in the thing while I was writing the synopsis with no idea. and later a couple days later Mark and I were writing and I looked back at my notes and I said this guy's name and it really helped me kind of get into this guy into this character that ended up becoming this character Chip in my show and it was based on listening to Freedom Rock so just so you know when you thought you were doing nothing you ended up years later really inspiring me so thank you that's cool I'm glad that worked out you know I think it's just you know if you have any kind of love of language and it doesn't even have to be I don't know, academic or whatever.

47:57It's just the way that, you know, the way you play around with words, words that you like. You know, sometimes you find a word or a name or something and somehow you incorporate it into your thing. Yeah. We'll be right back. Getting a good deal is kind of a big deal. So get this. Prime Day is coming June 23rd through the 26th with all the best deals you've been waiting for. Prime Day delivers more than great prices. It delivers that big deal feeling. So upgrade that old mattress, score a great new pair of noise-canceling headphones, snag the garden gnome of your lawn decor dreams. Whatever you've had your eye on, you can get it for a great deal.

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50:12And back to the show. Anyway, so you guys go do that.

50:18Sean Hayes:And then what happens, what is the moment 12 years after you break up? Who calls whom? Who goes? Because you guys all get back, right? Joe and you, Charles and Kim. What's the moment? Who makes the first call? Who has the idea like, fuck, let's get the band together? Yeah, was it just a text that said, you up? no because it was still kind of um believe it or not i suppose people sent texts but i think that we even in 2003 or whenever this was uh you know people weren't quite yeah glued to their phones of course the way they are now um but i did an interview on a radio show in london and it was It was an early morning show, you know, a lot of joking around and kind of, and, you know, they're like a bunch of Brits, and they're talking circles around me, you know, and they're kind of being all nuanced and everything.

51:18I'm only getting half of what's going on. But anyway, I start kind of trying to joke around with them. They're saying, do you see the other band members? I'm like, yeah, we jam all the time. And I'm just kind of being sarcastic, you know, and kidding around a little bit. and then they knew I was being sarcastic but they decide to pretend sort of that I wasn't because I always got you you said it you said you guys are back together and you're jamming but I was being obviously like I said not serious but they after I left the radio station they kept that was their little thing they talked about I guess the rest of the show or whatever because by the time that I got home to my hotel or whatever, like, I don't remember barely, but there was a world, remember there was a, where we'd suddenly CNN was 24 hours.

52:12And so everyone was kind of aware of like the ticker. Yes. Yeah. You know, that the kind of the idea of a ticker, of a news ticker, you know, and for most, I suppose, Joe Blow people, common people that weren't like following stocks or whatever, it would have been the CNN would have been the ticker that they would have been aware of. And somehow our reunion made it onto the ticker. And so like people started. So I don't know if Joey might have called me, I think, and said like, what the fuck is going on? Because I'm watching CNN here and we're like back together. Joe, you're reading the ticker and you're like,

52:55Sean Hayes:what the fuck, man? Are we getting back together? Like what's going on? I was pissed I didn't buy Apple. Yeah. No, no. Get in line, man. Yeah, I suppose, yeah. I kind of remember a little differently, but yeah. I love this. I do remember Charles calling me. I guess I didn't have CNN, you know. I mean, I try not to watch. I still try not to watch the news. That's smart. I guess it's always been bad, but especially now, I just can't fucking watch it. But anyway, yeah, he called and then that was it. Wait, wait, that's it. I think I asked you. I think Joey agreed to call Kim. I said, would you call Kim and see if she's up for it?

53:48Well, my friend started saying, you guys are getting back together. And it's like, what? And I didn't know, you know, until I got the call from Charles. And then it's like, oh, it is true. You know? Because every five years, people would tell me, when are you guys going to get back together? There's always this rumor that we're going to be going to Coachella or something. There's always this thing. But Joe, you must have known.

54:14Sean Hayes:Like, you guys had to have known because you guys were so beloved and so missed that, like, what happened? Like, the touring company or manager, whoever calls and goes like, hey, guys, this is great. Like, we're stoked. Yeah, but I'm sure that there's still that other element, which is much more sort of delicate and nuanced, which is I don't want to be the one to say, hey, guys, should we do this? Because the other person on the other end of the line might be like, yeah, no, fuck that. What are you talking about? I'm not getting back together with you. Like someone's got to pull their pants down first.

54:48I would imagine that's a real delicate part of any sort of reunion with any band, with any group.

54:54Sean Hayes:Yeah, pulling the pants down is certainly a delicate. Yeah, it's like, you know, is there a belt? is it zippers is it button fly you know it's it's complicated button fly well Charles you were you were busy so you know Kim Dave and I got together and and to to practice the songs wow together because you were somewhere else and then we made a deal no pun intended that that that if this thing's gonna sound like crap with the three of us were going to shake hands and move on oh wow i didn't know about this deal but yeah yeah well it's true though if it wasn't gonna work out reasonable enough very reasonable but but uh the first three songs that we went over we just smiled and go oh my god we still it still sounds the same because my my marshall's my marshall has sharpie marks on it so all i had to do is like dial it in and um and um that was that was that sound and and but more importantly the quantizing of the groove i mean they we had it you know so that had to be such a rush to hear that the first time it was almost it was almost comical yeah yeah wow yeah what did you say the quantizing of the groove what does that mean you know the the way the way the the way the the bass and the the rhythm, the pushes and pulls.

56:25You mean the actual combination of your sounds individually together to create one singular noise? Yeah, just like the nuances of the push and pulls. Yeah, yeah, yeah. We had it, you know. Oh, that's great. It's, you know, it's just a feel. And you had settings on your amplifier that were specific to that Pixie sound that you had to get back to? Yeah, yeah, it was just, it was sharpied on there. So I just like. That's wild. That's cool. That's really cool. Yeah. That's awesome.

56:55Sean Hayes:So, by the way, so Charles, you go and you get with these guys, you don't realize until today that they made this deal that they're like, hey, if it doesn't work out, we're not going to do it. No, but, you know, I didn't, you know, I suppose I had other concerns or whatever. Okay, so let me just ask you this, because we got a lot to get into. and I got to let you guys go in a minute. What, you know, I outlined again, and not at risk of embarrassing you, which I talk about influence on other musicians and artists throughout the years. Did you ever, is there a moment for each of you that kind of sticks out, like a cool moment that somebody came and said, somebody that you like or somebody whose music you really respond to who said, hey man, I really like what you guys do.

57:47Sean Hayes:Is there a moment like that? because I've had moments like that in my career. I think we all have where somebody who we respect comes and says, like, hey, you done good. The biggest damn one, Charles. Come on. Who's that? We were playing at the Orpheum at the time, and then our tour manager says, hey, someone wants to come by after our show and say hello. And he goes, oh. Like, who the fuck is this? He goes, oh, it's David Bowie. It's like, no way. Yeah, David Bowie came by at the club and said, they like us. That's really cool. That'll give you some fuel for a few years. That was it. Yeah. Charles doesn't remember.

58:38No, no, no, definitely he looms the largest, I suppose, in those kinds of terms, you know, in terms of like a, you know, musical royalty or whatever. Yeah, for sure, yeah.

58:52Sean Hayes:Charles, were there other ones for you, like other sort of like bands who you liked who were like more, I mean, Bowie is like an iconic. It doesn't get big. Well, I remember the first TV show we did was in New York. Do you remember there was a late night program hosted by David Sanborn? Oh, yeah. Yeah. I forget what the name of it was, but he would have on like four or five different people, and they'd all come on and do a song. They did this jam at the end, which was a little awkward, as I recall. But he had on the Sun Ra Orchestra, you know. And so they were these like, you know, old jazz musicians, you know what I mean, who had really kind of been around for a long time and kind of seen it all.

59:40So anyway, we did this ridiculous number called Tame, which is the epitome of the loud, quiet, loud dynamic. And then we had the ha, ha, ha, ha, and the quiet part. And then rah, and the loud part, right? Anyway, it does get quite loud. And, you know, I guess I have a loud voice or whatever. And it's very minimalist in terms of its orchestration and our musical idea. It's very minimalist. but it does do get loud and it does get quiet anyway but one of the gentlemen from the sunra orchestra you know i don't know if he was complimenting me but he just said he said he said boy he said you sure can holler like that after the show and i was just like yeah it's like all right one of those guys thought i was cool you know he's basically saying you know good holler you know like good utilization of your loud chops or whatever you know and he he didn't quite get it necessarily musically, but he got what we were trying to do.

1:00:41And so I liked that validation a lot, you know, from a, from a cat, so to speak, from a jazz cat felt really great.

1:00:48Sean Hayes:Yeah. Yeah. For, from somebody who doesn't, who's not like, who doesn't play the kind of music or that you guys do to sort of acknowledge that way. It's gotta be. Someone who's truly paid their dues, shall we say, you know, you know, to get validation from them or whatever, I felt like, okay, all right, so maybe we're on to like something. It's real or something. It's got some sort of, you know, mojo or whatever. We have some sort of magical thing going on. It's special. It is, we are special, you know? We have something. Yeah, we are. We're good. Wait, so now, but now you paid your, you got to admit now you paid your fucking dues.

1:01:25Sean Hayes:You guys are 40 years in, basically you're doing a 40 year reunion, not reunion, I shouldn't say that at all. You guys are doing a 40th kind of, almost like an anniversary tour, if you will, this year with your, is it your ninth studio album? Is that right? Ninth or 10th? Something like that. Right? The night the zombies came? I'm not sure about this 40th anniversary angle. I feel like I was telling Joe that if it was like 50th, maybe we'd be like, all right, we got to own it. We're like really old and we've been doing it for 50 years and whatever, but 40 feels a little bit like, shh. we really need to like talk about like how long it's been going on no just like talk about you you know so i'm no you i don't mind you bringing it up i've just i'm realizing because we don't necessarily choose the hook you know that yeah maybe a publicist or somebody is employing to to promote your next little run of shows and recently i learned it was like 40th anniversary and I'm like, fuck it, man, it's 40.

1:02:29I'm not going to show me the money. Yeah. It's unimportant.

1:02:34Sean Hayes:This is a good note for your publicist right now. Your publicity team will let them know to drop that from all materials going forward. But you guys are going to tour. Yeah, I mean, it makes sense. I get it. It's a good hook. I mean, you know, but whatever. I guess I'm a little, you know, what's the word? I guess I'm vain is what it is. Is that what it is? Yeah, we are too, man. I mean, it's hard to imagine that Jason's vain by looking at him, but he is very vain. And so do you guys, when you go out on this tour this year, I mean, you just finished, it sounds like a couple weeks ago, a show. But when you go out on tour, how much, because you guys are so prolific.

1:03:13Sean Hayes:Like, as I mentioned, your ninth or tenth studio album. How much do you mix up new stuff with, I mean, you've got to have people going like, please play, here comes your man, which is just like, you know, or whatever. Like, you must have, do you play some of the songs from across your catalog? Sure, yeah. Yeah. We usually rehearse up, like, 50 songs, and then we just call them out, you know, when we play a show. And then, you know, we kind of know which are the top ten, and we know which are the ones that we like to play that sound good, I think. I mean, I don't know if everyone gets to scratch their itch with the set list that's chosen, but, you know, there's a lot of songs that, you know, kind of like they fall flat or whatever, you know.

1:04:02You think, oh, that one they're really going to go crazy for, but then when you do it every time, it's like, eh, it's okay, you know. So I think it always kind of gravitates towards, we just learn a batch. Our brains can handle about 50 numbers. That's a lot. All right, let's just fucking go on tour.

1:04:21Sean Hayes:By the way, Charles, that's a lot. 50 is a lot. Joe, do you have a song that you have always loved to play, like when you just start to play it? Do you have one? I'm sure it's hard to narrow it down, but do you have one that you kind of get into that, into a thing with it and you just love it? It depends on the night. I do like to play tame because I feel like a wise ass on it. I think the song has three chords the whole time, Charles. Yeah. And I do one. So you give him up. Charles, it must feel good, though. I mentioned Here Comes Your Man. I mean, that was a song that you wrote. That was an early song of yours.

1:05:11Sean Hayes:and it's still got this, talk about a song again that's just got this kind of staying power that still feels just as relevant today as the moment you dreamed it up. Does that, it must be kind of gratifying. I have grown to like the song eventually. I think that when we played it in our early repertoire, it was one of the ones that were kind of maybe a bit poppy that we didn't know if it was too poppy or too kind of nice sounding. But the producer, Gil, that we did a couple or three records with, four records with, he really liked that one. So it got resurrected from the early repertoire, finally, to the record that it showed up on, which was Doolittle, our third record.

1:06:04and I believe that the record company that was distributing our record in the USA was, what were they called, Joe? Electra. Electra Records. And they had like all kinds of connections to showbiz. And I remember that was the only time we did some sort of real artsy-fartsy, screw you all, we don't care move, was they wanted us to play that song on what show, Joe, was it? Arsenio Hall. Arsenio Hall. And that felt like too weird to us to like, oh, that's silly. Like we don't, that's our silly song or that's our song that's too sweet. And maybe it's all, we don't understand. Like it's all going too fast.

1:06:51Like they want us to play in our city hall and we have to do that song. There's no other song we can do. That's the thing that's going to represent us. And we just, I think now we'd be like, oh, awesome TV. Yeah, you know, but at the time, I think there was a little bit of a concern of being, there was a little bit of a too, I didn't have a big, we didn't have a big too cool for school attitude, but, you know, a little bit once in a while, you know, we don't do that, you know. Yeah, we've all been there. So we had that, I feel badly because it wasn't anything against any particular program or whatever.

1:07:26It's just the idea that that feels too mainstream and it seems wrong.

1:07:30Sean Hayes:Arsenio is mad at you too late. Listen, man, I want to say, what I love about that particular song, I will say that it feels like it could have been written any year from sort of 1950 on. There's something about it to me that just kind of cuts across everything. There's something, I don't know, timeless. So I love that song in particular. That's just me. We play it every show. I enjoy playing it now, and I've tried to gradually appreciate whatever it is that people are responding to in it. And yeah, it's a nice little doo-doo. It's bouncy. Everyone seems to be in a pretty good mood when we play it.

1:08:04And I don't know, my mood seems to pick up a little bit when we play it.

1:08:07Sean Hayes:There you go. That's the most important thing. That's a good sign. That's good, Charles. Listen, guys, we've dominated your time. It's such a thrill, both Charles and Joe, to have you guys here today. Very nice of you guys to join us. I mean, you guys, your 9th or 10th studio album, The night the zombies came is just an absolute testament to your staying power. You guys are on tour this year. Charles, I won't say your 40th reunion tour or anniversary tour at all. I've taken that out. We're just calling it a victory tour. Your 26th victory tour. By the way, Charles, I think next year, if you don't mind being paid by rubies instead of currency.

1:08:53Yeah, there you go. 40th anniversary is the ruby. It's the ruby. Is that bothering? You know, 40th anniversary is the ruby. It's like diamond, ruby.

1:09:03Sean Hayes:So it's ruby. Oh, it's like stones. Yeah, it's stones. Next year we're going to be paid by rubies. I'm into that. Yeah, we got a guy in Antwerp who's going to be mewling some rubies to you, Charles. So it's all good, man. What a thrill. You guys, unbelievable. Continued success. You brought so much joy and so much just amazing music to people over the years. and I'm such a fan and I just thank you for your time, honestly. Thank you so much. Thank you for all the kind words and thank you for having us on. We appreciate it. Thanks for being here, guys. You guys are awesome. All right, Pixies, everybody.

1:09:32Thank you, guys. Bye, gentlemen. Adios. Thank you. Adios. Bye. Bye. Guys. That was pretty amazing.

1:09:41Sean Hayes:Yeah. What a thrill for me to have Pixies on. Yeah, I remember in college, I think they started in mid-80s and in college. You were here when we were talking to them, right? But I mean, specifically, it was like 85 or 86 or something like that. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Yeah, and I went to college in 88 and they, yeah, they were big on campus. I mean, I heard some of their songs and I know a couple of their songs, but I didn't know anything about them until today. So it's really cool. I think I wore a t-shirt of theirs in something. A lot of people had their t-shirts for some reason. I remember seeing t-shirts.

1:10:21And I think on the back it said Adios. Or was that a Sonic Youth shirt? And when it just said Adios there at the end.

1:10:28Sean Hayes:Cool. I was like, you know, you'd see somebody wearing like a Pixies T-shirt. You'd be like, all right, this person knows what's up. Yeah, this person knows what's up. Unless it was JB, of course. Yeah. I'm just playing a character that's cool. Yeah. All right. All right. I would love you to play a cool character once. That would be fun. Didn't you wear a Pixies T-shirt and Black Rabbit? Yeah, that's what I'm talking about. Yeah. And I took it. I took it. I was like, hey, can I have this? When we finished. Because I want to be cool at home. I want to be cool, Dad. You have a Pixies shirt at home?

1:10:57Oh, yeah. A couple of them.

1:10:58Sean Hayes:Let me come over and bring you some soup. Would you please? Yeah. I'm sick, man. It's not to steal your Pixies shirt, okay? It's not to. Come on up. We can just try on a bunch of stuff, you know? No, we're not doing like a try on. Put some stuff on you. Just dress you up a little bit. What are you talking about? Take some photos. Smear some lipstick on me. I'd love to put you on a bunch of my clothes. Wouldn't that be fun? If you just come over and I just put you in a bunch of my clothes. We're running one day. Oh, my God. That sounds so creepy. Silence of the Lambs. I'd love to see you in this.

1:11:29That reminds me of Sandra Bernhardt in King of Comedy. She starts knitting him a sweater when she's got them all tied up. I'd love to see you in this. You think the sleeves are too short? Anyway. I haven't seen that in a long time. Do you remember that?

1:11:43Sean Hayes:Oh, here we go. Do you remember that song? Oh, he's got his hands on one. I can see. It's the twinkle in his eye. Well, they mentioned Modern Love by David Bowie, and I was thinking about those lyrics of Modern Love. Never wave. Yeah, I'm standing in the wind, but I never wave. Bye-bye. Yeah. Smart. Less.

1:12:13Sean Hayes:Smart. Less. Smartless is 100 % organic and artisanally handcrafted by Michael Grant Terry, Rob Armjarf, and Bennett Barbaco.

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