"Sam Rockwell"

24:29I don't know Duran. I don't know Duran. Tarek has an unbelievable elbow. When he gets it there, forget it. So anyway, so Sean and Sunday Night were at dinner with our friends, and he goes, I'm going to get you this thing, this rocking thing. It comes the next day, Monday. I do it yesterday. By yesterday afternoon, I feel infinitely better. Really? That's really good. Dude, it's the fucking, it's unreal. You just got to touch your hams and your calves, and you're good to go. Yeah, you've been screwed up for a few weeks on that. I have. Indeed, I have. It starts with the feet, yeah. Sam, so hand injuries from the car.

25:03Any injuries from Broadway? Yeah, hamstring. Well, I've had tendinosis. Two calves from other stuff. That's about it. Shoulders are creaky. Yeah. How old are you now, Sam? I'm 77. No, I'm 55. Right, so we're all about the same age. You look great. You look fantastic. Thanks. You guys look great. Things start to ache a little bit, right? Like, I don't feel like I deserve the kind of knee kind of tweaking or the hip kind of tweaking because we're all staying in pretty good shape. We exercise and stuff. But, you know, the car does break down. It does break down. It's really annoying. But so, Sam, talk to me about the, quote, well-paying 1994 Miller Lite commercial.

25:45Oh, my God. Right? So is that when you knew, like, okay, I got this big commercial. It pays really well. maybe I can quit all my other jobs. And what were those other jobs? Well, I worked in a lot of restaurants, Barback, Busboy. I delivered burritos. Wow. You know, I heard your Ruffalo when he was bartending. It was kind of a similar time around when I was 28, 29. I started working more as an actor that started doing movies and stuff. Yeah. But delivering burritos on a bicycle was my last job. No shit. Who do you go furthest back with of the actor buddies that you still have. Like, do you go back furthest with, like, Crude Up or Mark?

26:27Well, yeah, Crude Up and Thoreau and I were together during 9-11, and we knew Phil, and very happy for Jeffrey Wright and Paul Giamatti and Ruffalo. For Tracy, that's Philip Seymour Hoffman. Philip Seymour Hoffman, yes. We don't really mention, as you probably know, we don't really like to mention Thoreau on this podcast. So we'll cut that out. It's funny you should say that. We'll go back, we'll trim that out. He's kind of persona non-G around here, you know? Yeah, well... Uh-oh, does he have a message for us? He told me to give you a message. He said, you could ask Arnett this question from a listener in New York named Justin T.

27:01Will, when you buy button-down shirts, do you take them to someone to remove the top five buttons? Or do you just buy them pre-removed? Also wondering, what's your nighttime, let me get this right, decaluge routine? Love the show, keep up the good work. Oh, my God, that's so true. That's rich coming from a guy that removes his sleeves. I didn't realize you don't usually button. You don't have any buttons. Is that true? Yeah, it's true. What do you call it? Is that called a bird Reynolds? You mean like you go like that? Yeah. I do. If I'm wearing a button shirt, yeah. I do a lot of this. Why? Because you think people, like you're doing people a favor.

27:42You got to give people what they want. You got to give people what they want. This is a world. you have to understand that we are always transmitting and receiving. And so I'm putting out and I'm also receiving. And so I feel from the world they want to get more skin. Sammy knows what I'm talking about. Oh, my God. Yeah, you got to do it. All right, Sammy. Lawn dogs. Yes. Talk about skin. Yeah, lots of skin on that. I know, right? Wait, so you received critical acclaim. Yeah. And your performance was, like, incredible. Thank you. Thanks. Yeah, I loved that movie. Those were the days. I've not heard of Lawn Docks.

28:18Lawn Docks? You've got to see it. It's so good. Yeah, I get naked and... I think I've seen it. Boy, I was in good shape back then. Yeah? Is that the thing you think kind of opened the doors for you? The porn? Yeah, I think so. I think that was one of them. I did Safe Men with Paul Giamatti, Ruffalo, Dinklage. I was going to say Safe Men that Hamburg, right? You know Safe Men? Yeah, it's a little gem, I think. I knew some of those guys. I was just, those guys who produced it, I think they were the same dudes who made my buddy Steps movie that I did. Yeah, anyway, great guys. Yeah, and then Box of Moonlight was those three kind of.

28:54Box of Moonlight. Yeah. Helped me get, and then Galaxy Quest and Green Mile sort of happened. Okay, so I want to talk about Galaxy Quest. It's one of my favorite movies. Dude, I saw Safe Men. I really love Safe Men, by the way, and I knew a lot of those dudes. But then when you did fucking Galaxy Quest, Rockwell, you absolutely destroyed. Yeah, incredible. I auditioned for the Enrico Oh yeah Still waiting here You're not right for it Well they agreed So wait this is from So your character Guy Fleegman He was so He was so fucking great This is from Scotty Scotty said the whole bit About you not wanting to be sent down first Your character Like when he goes to a planet those characters always died.

29:44That was a reference to Star Trek. You probably know this. Star Trek and the red shirts. Yes. Which are expendables. But a lot of people don't know that. I didn't know that. That in Star Trek whenever Spock and Kirk would come to a planet That's right. They would always send these guys down first and they would always die. It was such a funny character. I just kind of stole my performance from Bill Paxton in Aliens. Pretty much. Hey Sean, just widen it out. I just want to see if I can see them make out the Mountain Dew on your desk if it's possible. if I get the fucking monster energy drink. And the Star Trek cosplay outfit.

30:17No, but it was. You know what, though? It is true. That was the first time somebody sort of made that kind of joke on screen. Your fucking delivery, Sammy. It's just un-fucking-real. Dude, every time. We lucked out with that movie. Sam, you're one of those guys, and I talk about this from time to time on the podcast. You're one of those people. It doesn't matter what you're doing. It never sucks. It could be the worst. You never suck. You could be in the worst movie, the worst play, the worst TV. You're always unbelievable because you're so committed. I fucking love that about you. I know. I love that too.

30:48Do you ever feel like, I was going to say the same thing. Do you ever feel like movie to movie, obviously you never know what you got or what you're in or what you have. Can you feel it by now at this point in your career as you're going day one, week one, month one, month two? You know what? I think I'm in a piece of shit. Or I think this is working. or I think this is really working. Because I said when I did Good Night Oscar, we had an invited dress rehearsal with a bunch of kids who didn't get any of the references because it takes place in the 50s. And it was crickets the whole play. I came home to Scotty.

31:26I said, I'm in a piece of shit. I think I'm in a piece of shit. Yeah. It's always scary, isn't it? Yeah, it's scary. And the next night it was. Yeah, that's a great thing. So what is your barometer on that? Like, how do you feel? Well, first of all, thank you. And right back at all three of you guys. But yeah, I think you always think it's fucking Hamlet, right? I mean, you think it's Citizen Kane. I mean, when you're working on it. And then at a certain point, you realize maybe it's not. And then... Yeah, starts to take on water. Yeah, yeah. And then you're like, oh, yeah. And then you're like, oh, shit, this could be bad.

32:00This could be. I remember Baldwin once said to me, Alec once says to me, he goes, he goes, you never, he goes like, you never intend to make a bad movie. He goes, you know, you go like, you agree to do something and you're making this movie with people and they go, hey, we're going to go over here. And you go, great. I can't wait. I'm excited to go over here. And then you start making it. And all of a sudden you start going the other direction. You go, hey, I thought we were going over there. And they're like, no, no, no, no. We're going over here. Yeah. Yeah. And you can, yeah. Sometimes it comes from watching another performance or a decision a director makes or just the general vibe on the set from the crew or whatever.

32:39And you could start to smell it, right? And you just can't get, there's nothing you can do about it because you're only doing one little piece of it. So does it take away the energy? Like, do you start depleting yourself of kind of the same chutzpah you entered in? I don't think you do. You always deliver, though. Well, I think if you sign up and you get talked, I think when you get talked into something, and I won't mention any names, but when you get talked into something, that's when it's bad. You know what I mean? And you try to do a fixer-upper thing on it. Right, but you have, you know, Willie, you said that he fully commits, and that's certainly part of why he's so great, but I've seen a lot of crappy actors fully commit to a crappy performance that doesn't fix it.

33:26I mean, he's fully committing to a performance that's coming from a guy with great taste. Yes. There's somehow that you have the ability to keep one eye on yourself and judge whether the choice you're making sucks or not. And you're staying away from sucky choices with the way in which you play characters. Is that – Sean, do you make a lot of sucky choices in your life? Do you make a lot of sucky choices? Ignore that, Sam. Ignore it. You know, you want to make God laugh telling your plans, right? So you just never know. You never know. Right. But you have good taste. Did that come from, did you get it from mom or dad or from watching a bunch of great stuff?

34:08You know, again, I think it's just more ego, to be frank. I think it's more like just wanting to have a big part of it. Right. Have a reason to get up there. Right. And doing something that you're going to want to watch. It doesn't mean that it has to be a lead role. It can be a supporting role. Sure. Yeah, that you're going to want to be a part of. Do you watch your stuff? Are you one of those actors that can't watch it? If it's good, it's like a home movie. If it comes on, Seven Psychopaths came on. I love that experience. It was really great. Yeah, I hear Martin McDonough is just about the best guy in the world to work with.

34:48He's the best, man. And Chris Walken, I'd done a play with him, and then we did the movie, and Colin and Woody. So it was just a really nice time. We had a great time. Yeah. So it's like, isn't this like a home movie, right? When you see, and it's either a bad experience or a good experience, you know? But what about like on set? Will you watch playback to sort of help in calibrating your performance? Or do you like to stay in the dark? Only if it's like mainly for the canvas or if I'm a lot of times just to get maybe a tone and then I stay away from it. Like, and a lot of times I'm noticing if I do look at it, I'm under, or I used to be over the top.

35:26but I'm noticing it's actually, I need more. And then I need to contain it. I would say, tell the director to bring the camera closer instead of you reaching out, you know? Fucking, if they can't see it, they got to get closer. You stay small. Or bring your own. Yeah. Or bring your own. Wear one of those GoPros, turn back on yourself. When you say to see the canvas, do you, to see the canvas and the tone are those two different things? Like, do you mean sometimes that you actually look at it and go like, because when you're in it, you don't have a sense of, like, the bigger picture, and then when you get to see it, you go, oh, okay, okay, in terms of staging and what effect it is.

36:04I guess I'm talking about stakes, you know. Oh, interesting. I'm talking about stakes. Interesting. You know, Crude Up is one of the people I've gone to, beyond my acting coach or my friend Chris Messina, who, you know, I'll go to, I've gone to a lot of friends for help. um stanley tucci lots of people and uh but crude up is particularly bad yes he's rough sorry i cut you off yeah yeah he's got to go back to nyu yeah he's hard to look at hard to look at no what are you gonna say he's he's particularly helpful yeah he's very articulate about acting I went to American Buffalo. I was losing my saliva, literally.

36:54I couldn't get through the speech. And I said, man, I need your help, man. I can't get through this fucking thing. And he came over, and he really helped me. He really broke it down for me. He's really smart. Isn't that amazing? What was it? What's the key to keeping your mouth nice and lubricated? Who's this for? Who's that question for? Sorry, Sam, I was looking at you. Okay. Very good question. Voice warm-ups, Sean. Voice warm-ups, right? Keeping, I mean, they say bite your tongue, but, you know, I do a voice warm-up, 20-minute link later warm-up. Also, isn't it wild when you're doing a live...

37:33Peel a lot. Free a little water. Yes, that's good. When you're doing a live play, that you've created this character and this world through weeks of rehearsals, then you get up on your face, so you created this piece of art, and you think people will know your choices. Like they think, so for your speech, for example, you're like, well, I can't change it. This is how it's supposed to go. But people don't know that. So you're like, well, I don't want to change. But you're like, hey, buddy, you could take the biggest pause in the world in the middle of a monologue, drink a glass of water. You can add anything.

38:09Nobody knows how it's supposed to go. But in your mind, you're like, no, no, I'm compromising the role. I'm compromising the part. And that's the thing I always bump up against. I once saw John Malkovich do Burn This. Oh, yeah, me too. I saw that. Right? So what about that opening monologue as he comes in after, you know, fucking trying to get a parking spot out in front of the goddamn building and he's fixing his hair in the mirror and he stops in the middle of this, middle of a sentence, not at a punctuation point, middle of a sentence for at least a minute while he's fucking with his hair and then picks right back up on his monologue another minute or two, you know, talking.

38:44I just couldn't believe the balls. you know I was a young actor watching this like oh fuck that's incredible what this guy does incredible favorites that performance was unbelievable yeah yeah unbelievable so I anyway I added two glasses of water in the scene I'm like I think my character should drink water now yeah no no absolutely I had a six-page model like I had the director I said can I have like a water fountain he said no oh really well what can I can I have it I just put get a lifesaver I was in a park and so I was like all right now I'll ask you a real hacky question here that there is no answer for but I'll ask anyway you prefer doing theater over uh camera work no I mean it's totally different I think it's just the gym and it's really scary and it's like going to the gym yeah and it informs your film work I think but it it helps like you know like Chris Walken does that monologue in Pulp Fiction I think it's because he did Hamlet he did Rose tattoo yes but stanley kowalski but would you not agree that that if you do a stage level performance in front of the camera you'd be doing too much oh yeah for sure definitely but but interesting talk about that talk about that idea it's like going to the gym for for film work well it's just obviously you can't scream you can't do a stage performance especially the ones i've done because they're big.

40:09You know, in front of a camera, that would not work. But I think all you got to do is turn the volume down, I guess. I mean, maybe that's not as simple as it sounds. Well, it's calibrating. Do you enjoy the bigger movement? Or do you enjoy getting super, super small and letting the camera find the little stuff? I prefer being small even on stage. I don't want to get big on stage, in fact. I think that's the trick of... But I've never done a musical, so I don't know. that's a whole other thing but i think keeping it real and still being loud with your and still being able to hit the back row with your voice is a trick you know yeah um phil hoffman taught me a lot about that i mean he thought that sounds name dropping but right he also is somebody who he directed me in a play and he he was very uh he you know but no but listener doesn't want to hear about process well sure they do they'll listen to whatever they have to listen whatever the fuck we tell us.

41:06Really? You know what I mean? By the way, the podcast, it's free and they can not listen. If they want. Yeah, man. What the fuck? I love hearing you talk about this shit. Yeah, I do too. Well, Phil, you know, Phil was the, he was, you guys know him. He was. Yeah, of course. I'm envious that you guys knew him and I didn't. But tell me about, do you like doing, I love that whenever you're doing like a lead role in a film, I just like, because I'm just, I want more of you at all times. Dude, I love you. But oftentimes the lead role is not as spicy or as fun as some of the secondary or tertiary roles.

41:50What's your, do you have a preference? Yeah, you know, I think that's something, I mean, here we go with the name drop shit, but Clooney, I think. George Clooney. George Clooney. I don't know. Clooney's not a name job here. But Clooney taught me a lot, you know, because I come in with all these props and all these, I'd be schmacking it up. Well, you were the lead in his first film. And I was the lead in the film. And he's like, hey, man, you know, we can't do Bows of the Clown every scene. You know, we got to like. That was the note? He didn't say that. But I was like, you know, Zero Mostel in there.

42:27I mean, one of the great actors, Zero Mostel. But, you know, he said, you know, too many props and let's just keep it. You're the lead guy. You've got to, like, keep it simple. And I learned a lot from him about that. It's true because it's a canvas, right? So you're not necessarily the color red all the time. Right. You know, Kevin Costner in Dances with Wolves, I mean, he's, you know, they've got other people providing those colors. Yeah, you've got to really suss that out when you read the script and you talk about it and you develop it and you show up and you're like, where do I fit? Yeah.

43:04And you have to be, sometimes you have to be a blank canvas, right? If you're the lead in a certain way, you have to be able to let other colors. Jason obviously has been a blank canvas to me for so many years. He's been this off-white mayonnaise sort of eggshell color. Well, I think Jason's performance in Identity Theft is... There we go. Now you love Identity Theft. It's fucking amazing. Let's walk through Identity Theft movie. Let's show a clip. We'll just show a real quick clip. Let's go to a clip. It's pretty amazing. By the way, I will say, I will say, I love identity theft as well. I've told Jason that before.

43:38It's a fucking great identity theft. It's really good, man. Identity theft. But the other one I like a lot, even more than what I saw recently, and I've told him, is Game Night. Have you seen fucking Game Night? I love Game Night. That's a good movie. Jason is... Sammy, have you not seen Game Night? I need to see that. I need to watch it. Oh, my God. It's so good. It's so funny. I need to watch that. Jason is so good in that. And he knows how to play stakes, right? Dude. And still be like, you know. Dude. I love that movie. That movie holds up to multiple viewings. It's fucking. That's one of my favorites.

44:09By the way, Game Night is one of the most, is one of the like last great, I haven't seen a great film comedy since Game Night. Yeah. Game Night. I'm not even kidding. Those guys. It's going to be your new identity thief. It's going to be a great job with that. Sam, you have not seen it yet, right? I haven't seen it, no. So good. It's not bad. Oh, it's Rachel McAdams. I've seen Morrible Bosses. I've seen the one. Jesse Plemons. You piss in the pond. Oh, yeah. The old Magic Pond with Ryan. You know who's really funny in that movie? Billy Magnuson. Yeah. That guy's a real talent. He is hilarious.

44:47Yeah. He is hilarious. He's a really good dude. Everybody's great. And Sharon Horgan's in it, too. Sharon Horgan is amazing. Kyle Chandler from Friday Night Lights. How great is Kyle? Fucking Sam's with us. Sam Rockwell. Let's talk about all his sins. Game night. I'm on it. We'll be right back. And now, back to the show. So, wait, Sam, I... You guys haven't said anything about my shirt, my T-shirt. Oh, yeah, what does it say? I was trying to read it. I couldn't see it, and I wasn't... It's bad. Sorry, that's bad framing. I am serious, and don't call me... Wait, he's wearing tan pants, and for a second I thought he was shirt cocking, that he just had his shirt.

45:27Wait, Sam, what is the shirt? Shirt cocking is a real... It's an airplane shirt. It's airplane. And it says, I'm serious and don't call me Shirley. And don't call me Shirley. Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah. That's great. That's a great T. I mean, they should redo that movie, right? I mean, there's a whole... Not because it needs to be redone, but just because there's a whole new generation or three or more now that haven't seen it that would love that stuff. I'm against the reboots. I'm against the reboots altogether. Just haven't watched the old one, right? I watched the old one, and maybe it's not as quick or doesn't cut as fast, but it's good.

45:55It's got value. And then let's do some new stuff. Leslie Nielsen. Let's create stuff now that people 20 years will say, let's reboot. You know what I mean? There's so much of the same shit. No, no, no. Let me go on a fucking tirade. Wait, Sam. By the way, guess who Sam worked with a couple years ago? You guys are going to blow both of your minds. Leslie Nielsen. No, it's a friend of the show. It's one of the great names of the show. It's one of the all-time references of the show. Kareem Abdul-Jabbar. He comes up on the show all the time. I talk about him all the time. Chappie? Chappie, Mark Chappell, who wrote See How They Run.

46:27Chappie's one of my best pals, and he's my corretter. He's great. And must be giving Will at least$10 ,000 every time his name is mentioned. Chappie comes up a lot. He's a recurring on the show. Get the scissors out, guys. Sean, drive the interview. We're not cutting Chappie out. Great scripts, the other one. Yeah, so Moon, when you did Moon, I loved Moon. I mean, it was just you God bless you I love that movie so much Now Duncan Jones knows how to direct, huh? I know Go back and talk about It's okay, you can talk about process That's why we're here I don't want to bore the hell out of Because I'm fascinated how you What was it like day to day?

47:11Did you like the process of being the only person in the movie? Yeah Tracy, this is a movie where he's the only guy in it And he's stuck on a spaceship It's stunning It's incredible I had a really good movie. Thank you. Thanks guys. Well, you know, my acting coach, the first thing he says, watch buddy movies. He said, watch Midnight Cowboy I watched. Midnight Run. And I stole a lot from Midnight Cowboy. And then, you know, Rachel Weisz just did a reboot of Dead Ringers, which is fucking amazing what she did. Wow. And I was watching the Jeremy Irons one. That was the best time, the best version of that trick I had seen.

47:46And I listened to the DVD commentary and there's a very noisy camera called the motion control camera that's used for that gag to get two people in one frame. And it's a very weird process that I could go into. Give us a little bit. Well, there's a lot about timing. The sound guy would put the previous take, the master, on my iPod. And while I was going to hair and makeup for the other one, I would listen to it. So the ping pong scene would be a timing thing. So when I went back to the other clone. So you're acting against yourself. Acting against yourself. And so I would listen to the sounds.

48:28So like if he dropped the handle of the paddle like that, the other clone would retract because he's coming towards him. So I'd have to listen for that. And know how many beats you have to wait before you speak. Yeah, and he was saying, Doug was like, don't ad-lib, don't ad-lib. But you could ad-lib if you fit it in the window. Right, right. the timing you know you can change the line but it has to be that time you know I wonder if today technologically it would be less antiquated it's gotta be Tom Hardy did a good job with it too but it's tricky it's tricky but and it's a lot of work and talking about paying attention you have to pay attention in a scene as it is but now you really gotta pay attention because you're also trying to you know pick up on timing and other things did it scratch did it scratch an itch in a way that you didn't No?

49:19Like, were you, was it satisfying on a certain answer? Absolutely. If you're a narcissist and a director, a closeted director, you know, you have control of the scene, obviously, for obvious reasons. And Jeremy Aaron's talking about contrasting energies. So one twin in Dead Ringers was aggressive and Rachel Weisz did the same thing very well. One was more timid. And so we had to, that was the trick, was having contrasting energies. and so one was a clown and one was more together and uh yeah you can control the scene in fact we'd have two rehearsals the ad would go you know hey okay go to hair megway so mick you know we got to do the other rehearsal we do the other one so you'd rehearse twice you know wow before you went oh wow yeah you'd rehearse both sides before yeah wow and then i had a body double guy and i who was also an actor.

50:13And then the other line was coming to you through an earwig. Yeah, an earwig. And sometimes you'd be looking at a tennis ball, sometimes the actor who kind of looks like you from the back. Yeah. You know. So that's a contemplative, sort of melancholy, dramatic movie. Yes. Do you, again, another brain-dead question, but do you have a preference about drama versus comedy? Well, it's funny you say that because it was a little too serious, and I said, we got to get some jokes in the beginning because it was so dark. It was like Edgar Allan Poe. And we got some jokes in because we were going to lose the audience because he gets so depressing.

50:50Yeah, but then there's the risk of setting the wrong tone for that which is going to come. Right, so there's a balance there. I remember I was like, I was super precious and annoying and overly sensitive about any sort of humor any sort of humor going into Ozark. You know, the writers have these great sort of moments of levity in the first season. Where did you find the compromise eventually? Well, once we established that, you know, this Jason Bateman show is not going to be a comedy, once the audience knew that after the first season, I felt more comfortable about, you know, making it. Did you watch, a serious question, did you watch, after asking them to sort of erase all that, did you watch it, once you got to post, were you like, fuck, I wish there was a moment there?

51:38Did you miss it a little bit? I don't mean a goofy thing, but it was a little bit of contrast. I was too sort of paranoid about it being taken seriously in the first year that I didn't worry about that. But the second year, I was like, yeah. Anyway, sorry to talk about fucking me again. It's fucking great. Sam, what do we got to do to have you working? You see where you beat the guy up in the car is fucking great. Yeah. But you earned that. You earned that. Yeah, you fucking earned it. What about, how do we get you working 12 months a year so I, as a Sam Rockwell fan, can have more to enjoy? That's a great, yes.

52:16I mean, I think I have to, because you're balancing theater and film. So I got to go to New York to see you sometimes. Yeah. Right, which I'm coming. I'm coming this weekend for seven months. So get ready. Okay, all right. We're going to do some hanging. It's the road, we're all waiting. So wait, Sam, what's the, you know, So when you, we're talking about all these kind of preps things for roles in different movies. Do you have a thing that you first do when you either walk on a set or prepare for a character? Do you have like a go-to, any kind of superstition thing like we do in theater? No, it all comes out of fear, trying to memorize the script and panic.

52:53And then you go to a, go see my coach, Tara Knickerbocker, where I go. And sometimes you have time to do research, sometimes you don't. and you might have the luxury of a few months and then you would do research, like three billboards or something. I did research, but like, you don't always have the time to do that. So you're kind of like, just like, all right, I'm an arms dealer. Okay, fuck, I'm going to watch Bill Murray and Kingpin. That's it. That's my research, you know. Yeah, yeah, exactly. But are you like Billy? Because Billy talks about it and you know, you guys know, like, Billy likes to spend time with the dialogue for weeks.

53:29Yeah. Right, like, yeah. Did you see the one-man show he did? Jesus Christ. No, damn it. It's a lot of dialogue. I missed it. But are you good at learning your lines? Are you quick with that? No. Terrible. I need time. Really? I need a lot of time, yeah. Yeah. I need a lot of time. Have you always been terrible? I mean, I tape the monotone. That's a Meisner thing. But I tape them, and I run them with a reader, an actor. I think Billy does a similar thing. Billy's smarter than me, though. He knows how to, he really breaks his shit down. My partner does too, Leslie. Her script is like really organized.

54:06Mine looks like a kindergarten grown-up. I'm always fearful that I'm going to, if I really, really work on it and I do a bunch of research and all that stuff, that I'll end up acting. That all of that is to do the greatest acting job ever. But come on, Jason, you do work. You put work in. I do put a lot of work into it, but there's a list of techniques and homework stuff that I used to do when I was a kid. I went to acting classes and stuff like that. And I found that I was so proud of the work that I had done that I was hell-bent on making sure the audience saw that work. I understand that. Yeah.

54:44I mean, I don't like backstory. That's the thing I don't really care about. Yeah. I don't. Interesting. But important for some actors. Everyone's got a different thing. It doesn't work for me. Yeah. Yeah. I, you know, I think it depends, you know, uh, it depends if it, if it makes an imprint on you, you know, you can get an ad lib from a, from somebody, a real person. Do you ever get a, um, um, I was going to actually, Sean, get into like sort of the difference and with you, uh, Sammy as well about then when you work on, on, on stage, then you have the, the, the sort of the luxury of time to work on that.

55:16And you understand, and you have a facility with the dialogue because you've been working on it for months. but before I get into that have you ever had the thing where I've had a couple times where like a guy like a member of the crew will go well like between takes will go hey you know what I thought would be really funny if you said and I go what's that now like pitching me a joke or like a different way to say a joke and I'm like what up and then and it's not bad and they go like I just thought it'd be really funny if you said this I'm like oh yeah okay man well I thought it'd be really funny if you move the fucking C stand over there you know But what if it's a good idea, you dick?

55:54No, I'm kidding. I'm being a fucker. Actually, it should be. I'm just saying that just to be funny. The truth is I've actually had some pretty good pitches before from like sound dudes. And there was a boom operator that I knew, this guy Tom, who was really fucking funny. Jay, do you remember that dude, Tom? Yeah. And he was super funny. And every once in a while, like between takes, he'd go like, hey, you know what? Blah, blah, blah. And I'd go, fuck, that's fucking great. And I'd use it. thank you give him a little wink while he's holding an actor does it you know what if another actor does it and then you're like all right fuck that's a fight i'm always like best best whatever yeah if it works it works i don't mind that i never mind like a line reading from a director either because you're always going to make it your own no but you know what there is there is that thing and i will and i will not say who this is but there are there are things before where like an actor might say to you like hey you know it'd be really great say this and they'll in rehearsal and they'll say it to the director as you're doing a rehearsal.

56:49So you're, at that point, you go like, everybody's kind of waiting for me to do his pitch. That he said out loud to the director. You do it and then they laugh. Yeah. See, isn't that amazing? And you're so embarrassed. Well, that brings me to my thing about directing is I think, I was thinking, Jason, I don't know what you do with actors, but I feel like you're really good with actors. But I don't know when a director screams a direction across a long distance over the crew, it's kind of telling the whole crew that the rabbit's going to come out of the hat before it does. And then you're like, hey, man, there's a lot of pressure to take the rabbit out of the hat.

57:29You know what I mean? Right. And then you end up adjusting your reading to make it surprising for the crew when it's not really the reading that would be right for the audience at home. Yeah. I kind of want a conspiracy with the director. I want a secret. Yeah, whispering. Sam, what do you do when we're not talking about this and you're not doing this? What do you do? What's the hobby? What would our listeners be excited to learn that you do? Kickboxing. Well, somebody, I think maybe Thoreau just told me, potato chips are not a protein, which is alarming. It's alarming. When I was during the pandemic, you know, I got into some potato chips.

58:13No, you know, I overwork out and then I overeat, blah, blah, blah, you know, I do it. I'm kind of compulsive. What's your exercise of choice? Are you a jogger? Everything. Like I might hit hot yoga or I might with weights, or I got the soul cycle here, hit the mitts, you know, that kind of shit. And that's all to facilitate your snacking. All to facilitate, yes. Because that's why I work out. A little bit of, a little IPA, a little potato chips, some chocolate. Well, you do a little, you do a little bit of boxing, right? You do a little bit of boxing. I've been doing, Thoreau got me into like doing the soul cycle of boxing.

58:52Oh, yeah, my friend does that. Fight camp, right? Yeah, my friend does that. And by the way, got me in shape. But now my son, what's interesting is my son, my oldest son who's 15, Archie, because I started doing that he got into it because sort of because of throw through somebody else anyway he starts to fight now he's fighting with a real guy in a gym every weekend which is crazy oh he's sparring your son's sparring so he's sparring and he's really getting into it he's way better than me oh shit don't be careful so I know I'm very excited to see Argyle should I be? yes yeah I saw the trailer it looks incredible and I love Matthew Vaughn it's really fun that looks like a blast to shoot a movie like that a whole movie about a sweater yeah So it starts with the idea, then the knitting, and then someone wears it?

59:37Walk me through it. You just gave away the end. That's right. No, it's a lot of fun. You guys, your head's... Do you like doing all the action stuff and the stunts and things like that? Did you get hurt at all? You must have. No, we had an amazing stunt team. He's agile, dude. He's fucking looking at me. Yeah, but you got to do the start of the stunt and the end of the stunt, right? Yeah, you got to do a little bit of the kung fu fighting, yeah. Yeah? And you had fun with that? I like it. It's fun. I like it. the fake stylized violence. But, you know, I had an amazing stunt double. Every time I would do something, I thought I was going fast, and then I'd watch him, and then I looked like I was in slow motion.

1:00:11Is this a stunt double you've worked with before? He's amazing. No, he's a prodigy. His name's Greg Talley. He's like a Jackie Chan. He's from Northern England. He's a gymnast. He's a double for Spider-Man. He's 26. He was 24 when he did mine, yeah. Wow. Did he get hurt? He did get hurt on another thing, but he's fine. Okay. He's fine, yeah, yeah. Have you ever gotten hurt or hurt somebody doing a scene? No, Tim Roth and I kind of hit each other, kind of clipped each other in a rain machine doing a fight, but it was fine. Nothing serious. On holiday or during a shoot? I broke my toe talking to my agent in my house once, you know what I mean?

1:00:52I once sprained my finger getting into a Tesla, yeah. you know uh sam we took up way too much of your time i want to ask you about oscar though how did you get how did you get ready for that how did you how did you do that how did you what was your research for that well i took a g5 to new york and then uh and then an escalade from teeterborough uh to the upper west side i think you really but you nailed that guy what i mean that's a lot of that's a lot of behavior, man. That's a lot. It's a whole thing with the imitation. Forget about the piano. It's a long, long story. And it took about 20 years.

1:01:29Does it involve scooping up bagels from Zaybars and filling them with peanut butter?

1:01:36By the way, Sam. It's endless. It's endless. Call me on a side. Side zoom me. All right, we'll side zoom. It's all side zoom. But really quick, I did put on a few pounds. And there was, I've said this story on here before. and one of the reviews in Chicago where we opened it said Sean's going to be great on Broadway but he needs to kill the fat suit and the plastic wig. Both my body and my hair. Yeah, you weren't wearing a wig or a fat suit. Is that right? No, Sean. Oh, Sean. But anyway, thanks for asking, Sam. That's very sweet. I'd like to hear more. But we didn't even get to be handing in Spokane or like, you know, billboards, which you won the Oscar for, which I fucking blew my mind.

1:02:18You blew my mind. There's so much to talk to. I will say there are very few people. There are a lot of people. No, sorry. That's not true. I will say a lot of people are deserving of Oscars all the time, every year. But to see you win an Oscar was so cool. You deserve 10 of them. So fucking cool. I love you guys, man. Because you're so fucking deserving, dude. You're so talented. And really quick, when I was doing, you were doing Behanding in Spokane while I was doing Promises, Promises. That's right. And I went downstairs to the basement to get my hair cut from a woman named, I think her name's Carmel.

1:02:49And I walked down getting ready for my weekly or two bi-weekly haircut. And there you are sitting in the chair. And I was like, holy shit, that's fucking Sam Rockwell. What's he doing here? I'm like, why did he come here to get his haircut? I just thought that was the coolest thing in the world. Like I was guffawing. I'm just a parasite. Yeah, listener, if you're not in the entertainment industry, you need to know that this guy is the guy everybody wants to work with, be friends with. He does constantly the best performances. It's just catnip for actors. And the fact that we're able to even call ourselves friends with him is enormous.

1:03:31So yeah, you deserve multiple statues. Yeah. And I want more. You need to get a Thalberg right now. You need to get a full, like the full, you know, right? We're going to give the smart list Thalberg. Let's do that. Listen, I love you guys. I love this podcast. I'm a true, true fan. I know the terminology. Anyway, I love you guys. Love you too, Sam. Thanks for being here today. Can't wait to see you soon. And the beard looks fantastic. Thanks, guys. You look amazing. You look amazing. Thanks for doing this, dude. Dude, thank you for having me. Thank you for having me. And let's give Thoreau endless shit.

1:04:08Oh, yeah, please. Oh, yeah. I mean, you can't hurt him more than he hurts himself, you know? Let's be honest. All right, big fat love. All right, big fat love. Thanks, guys. Peace out. Bye, buddy. Peace out. Bye, Sammy. Thank you. Bye. Oh, Sam the Rock. Shani, great, great guest. I love him so much. He's such a good guy, too. He's just the greatest, you know. Yeah. Well, I sound like a broken record, but I truly do. But, you know, when you go, like, Will, when you were saying, you go through all of it, when I was researching him and knowing he was coming on today, You go through all of his films and his projects, you're like, bam, bam, bam, bam, hit after hit.

1:04:49And if they weren't like a massive hit, he was great in it. Like you said, he was great in it. It's just, you know, it's the result of dedicating your life like he has to a craft or an art or anything. He also is just like no matter what part he's playing, even if it's, you know, sort of just like, you know, the lead that's kind of just kind of the straight guy, where he'll find a way to give that character some quirk, something interesting. There's a little bit of like sparkle to... Color, little sort of shades. It's easy to overdo that and overplay a character because it might not be written in the character, but he finds the right spots to do it.

1:05:26Yeah, you know, I was going to say, I've always sort of used... John Goodman is my example of the person who's amazing in everything he does, no matter what the thing is over time, right? And different volumes, different tones, dramas, comedies. Sam's in that same category and always good. He's in that like dramas, comedies, things. And like you say, Jay, like just adds color, has a little something, brings a little sparkle. Like it's the career that you wish I had. But I want him to be cast in Leeds, you know, as well as just like the... Well, but it's not as often as they... It should be. He and I have talked about this.

1:06:07Like there's just, there's a, you know, there's a certain kind of sort of like, sort of like an average type of look and person and presence that studios feel comfortable with putting as the lead. They don't want anybody too definitive or specific. Well, that's because they're worried about, because they sort of think, they're always trying to anticipate what they think audiences and they think about sort of economics. They're like, what is the thing, the prototypical? Or physical types. Yeah, but he can play something completely normal and level and just at the moments where it's appropriate for the lead.

1:06:49But he's almost like too interesting in a way. And I mean that as a compliment, not too weird. He's got so much personality. He's super smart. He's super fucking cool. He's magnetic on screen. By the way, we joked about Chappie. You should see how they run. It's a really good movie. He's so interesting and that as this, he's the lead, he's the detective who's got all this shit going on. He's fucking, you're like, fuck, man. This guy's just, he always brings it. Always brings it. By the way, Iron Man 2. We didn't talk about Iron Man 2. Written by? The Justin Theroux. Justin Theroux, that's right.

1:07:20Yeah. That's, he wrote so hard, that's when the first time the sleeves came off because he was writing. Yeah. And it smoked him off. Yeah, it was. It was a fire, right? It was a fire. It was a wrist fire that worked his way up his arms there. Hey, Will, I don't know what you're doing later, but are you open to throwing me? Oh. Sure. Can you just throw me, please? Sure, man. You want to be careful, though. You don't want to break your arm. And if you do break your arm, you want to break it around the forearm. You don't want to break it up near the... Bicep! Bicep! Smart. Nice.

1:08:02Smart Less is 100 % organic and artisanally handcrafted by Bennett Barbaco, Michael Grant-Terry, and Rob Armjarf. Smart Less.