"Selena Gomez"

28:08Someone's taller, someone's shorter, someone's thicker, someone's thinner, someone's got bigger feet, smaller feet. Like there are equal number of variables in the brain. And the fact that we've got medicine, therapeutics, an environment that is tolerant of all of those variables nowadays as opposed to back when our parents were our age. And Jason, on top of that, community. The idea that you're talking about it, it sheds a light and says, you're not alone, there's somebody else. And somebody else can relate to that and identify with it. Certainly, I know from my own life, and I can go, somebody else says, I have this, and they go, oh.

28:45And they talk about their experience, and I go, oh, you have this too. And then we can talk about it in a way that, And that kind of really breaks it wide open. It definitely, it connects you as well. I mean, that's why I released my documentary. It's all based on mental health. Which was incredible. Thank you so much. I haven't seen it. Forgive me. I'm going to watch it. I want to see it too. No, pause right here. We're going to watch it. It's really kind of sad. No, no, I'm putting it on here. But it ends well. I think that's why I did the documentary. I was terrified before it came out, and I had already signed the contract, and I was like, damn, I can't go back.

29:18But that was a really big moment for me. And then I had people coming up to me not saying like, oh, my God, can I have a picture? They would say, I've dealt with depression or I've done this. And then I end up having a connection with people. Yeah, I love that. Sometimes with all my health stuff, like I've had a kidney transplant. I have high blood pressure. I, gosh, I have mental health. And I don't even know. I'm sure I have other problems that I'm not aware of. I love talking about all that. But you can think about like a situation and say, why me, why me? And instead it's given me the gift to say, oh, I know why it's me.

29:58I'm there for those people that are going through what I went through. And I can say, I hear you and I see you. Not just be in and say, my life's perfect, but I'm sorry. You know, it's like, well, I can be honest with you. I'm a big believer that the person upstairs or whomever's upstairs for anybody, doesn't give you anything more than what you can handle. Yes. And so the fact that you've been given all of these gifts, challenges, and that you're able to go through them so successfully in a public space such that you can give encouragement and support to others is like, I mean, talk about using your years right.

30:44You know, we've talked about it on the show before about, you know, when you get to the end, we're all going to look back and hope that we used our time correctly. I mean, the first 30 years of your life have been incredibly accomplished spiritually, mentally, certainly. Yeah, I guess the question really is, now what? Yeah. You know, you're fixing your brain. You're fixing the world. I don't know. I think I just gravitate towards things I connect to. And I'm all about authenticity. I can't really force myself to be anything other than who I am. And it's just, you know, luckily worked. I'll bet your ability to recognize and attract those who are equally authentic is really keen too.

31:30You know, like I was just thinking when you're talking about the documentary, thinking about Alec Kashishian and his sister, Aline, we both work with. I mean, people like that, like you probably have a great team around you. great friends around you, like all of us as we get older, you have less and less friends, but that's usually by choice. Talk to us about your ability to kind of pick up on people's uniqueness and authenticity or lack thereof. Is that something you always had or has it just gotten sharper? Maybe it has gotten sharper, but ever since I was younger, I like to think I had good discernment with people.

32:11And I could just sense when I felt that it was being forced or that there was something they were wanting or whatever. I just could feel that in a lot of people. And I mean, obviously I put some of those people in my life when I was younger and then I, you know, later realized, but most of my friends, like I said, they're, I mean, they can go from being a writer to one of my friends as a real one of my friends as a realtor so like i i kind of is that richard erlich kind of just it's not richard erlich is it no um yeah well it's it's it's it's like it's having people skills right and i wonder if if you're like me that's part of what has always attracted me to being an actor is because i'm just fascinated with people and i really enjoy kind of reading people and seeing is this a person is this person a match for me or not and I just wonder what that is.

33:07Also, it's just staying curious, right? The moment you stop being curious, like Jason just said, you become one of those dummies. Yeah, I know. I love life and I love people and I find it really fun. Do you find that, which do you find is more cathartic for you, more sort of a lane to explore and enjoy parts of you? Is it with playing different characters or being a songwriter? I think it's a little bit of both. I wrote this ballad called Lose You to Love Me, and that was probably the most personal song I'd ever released about something that was on everyone's mind for some reason. and then in acting I feel like I have these moments in my life that have happened and I'm able to use that and it actually feels great and it feels like after a good cry or something it's like a good feeling Is there something that you...

34:04I mean this is going to be one of the dumbest questions you've ever gotten Is there something with every single thing that you've done where you're just like, you know what I've never done? I need to do that before Oh, yeah. I don't think I've even began, like, in a lot of areas. Like, not necessarily cosmetics and stuff, but like I've said many times with you guys, I think acting. Like, I don't think I've been able to even touch the surface of what I know that I'm capable of doing. and I'm very selective or else I'd be in all of the movies that I get offered and I just fight for my roles and I'm always auditioning, so I like to earn it.

34:43Yeah, good. That's great. We'll be right back. And now, back to the show. Something I've sort of really gotten more and more passionate about is not playing characters as much as just playing somebody that doesn't force me to do a lot of acting and play a character. I kind of like to be the audience. And a lot of that comes from my desire to try to be as not full of shit as possible in my life and not be fake and phony and pretending to be other people. So I really like trying to be as authentic as I can. Do you have a similar sort of battle when you think about acting? Because you're so good about being really you and being in your skin and being honest.

35:34Does that run counter to the whole thing that we try to do as actors? Kind of, but I just finished this movie, this Jacquardillard film, and it's all in Spanish and it's a musical and it was one of the most challenging things that I had done. That's cool. But it's really... What's it called? Emilia Perez. I think that will come out next year. But it's so good if you just said none of your business. I'm excited for that because, for example, there's the scene where I'm being left. I'm not giving anything away. And I remember I channeled the moment when I had to go to rehab for the first time and leaving.

36:16And I remember I told my co-star that's what I was feeling in the moment. and I just felt like it was getting that out when I remembered that first moment and being terrified. That's cool. So it felt really cathartic. Speaking of that, have you ever wanted to go to, you know what I'm going to ask, go to the Broadway or do live theater? Maybe you have. I haven't. I think I would like to. I'm not sure I'm there yet because I think I'd still be a little nervous. Oh, really? Yeah. After touring and stuff? You've already been like a stage performer. No, but it's different because I love when I'm doing my concert because it's like, oh, these are my peeps.

36:54Right, right, right. And like you feel comfortable. You feel safer, yeah, yeah, for sure. Well, will you talk more about that, about battling? Because like I get very nervous when I have to speak publicly. Like I can't even give a toast. Really? Yeah, he goes white. Yeah, but I have an enormous amount of confidence when it comes to other things that are going to be made for the public. Like a big one in front of a camera. Right, for millions of people as opposed to 10 people at a dinner table. So I don't understand that about myself, the difference between having a lot of confidence or zero confidence that are sort of similar things.

37:37Because, Jay, because you're so well-spoken in life, just, I mean, clearly in life, that's why it blows my mind that anytime we're at like a dinner party or like two or three years ago, we are at your birthday dinner party at Richard's house. Yeah. And I said, let's go around the room and say how grateful, how much we love Jason and I'll start. And I got up and I gave this little speech and it got to, and you were like, I'm out. I don't want any part of this. It's like, goodbye. But yeah. So how do you manage that? Like what is that switch that flicks for you when you can stand up in front of, you know, 100 ,000 people and give a concert or do a movie or television show that's going to be for millions of people versus like maybe going out on a date for the first time or doing an interview for a magazine or whatever might give you anxiety.

38:28Do you know what that is, that different thing? Because I'm still trying to figure it out with myself. I think when I was younger, I had a very, very public life and it wasn't fair in a lot of ways that I got to the point so much so that I was like, if I don't talk about what's going on, everyone's going to continue to narrate my life and people are just going to buy it. And I need people to hear from me. And I genuinely stopped caring. Like, I don't I don't care. Like I would be happy to stand up and speak very highly of someone. I'd be happy to do it. Even if I mess up, I'm like, all right, well, that sucked.

39:11But, you know, I tried. Like it's fine. So I don't know if I'm just I've done it for too long that I just have lost a little bit of that fear. But I still get the butterfly feeling. So maybe I just got used to it and then I'm kind of like, well, people are going to like it or not. Yeah. I have a friend of mine, Maria Shriver. She, you know, I've known her for years and years and decades. And she, whenever I would have dinner at her house, she's the one who forced me to get up and talk like that. And it's so, I was littered, you know, sorry, I was riddled with fear about it. And, but she forced me to do it.

39:51She's like, we're going to go around and stand up and speak how you feel. And I was like, pass. Go on to the next person. Were you so nervous because you had just littered? Is that what it was? Like, I'm having a tough time following what happened. But now that you're saying it, I think, like, for me, it's like I'm afraid of being accused or judged as either being full of shit or being stuck up. I had a real complex about being conceited and stuck up when I was in middle school. Like sixth and seventh grade was really hard for me in school because people, oh, here comes that guy on TV. He stuck up.

40:30So I wasn't really, I was shy about being confident because people would think I was stuck up. So then I tried to seem not confident. And then maybe that part of me kind of took hold. You know, but what's crazy about that, though, is think about it. That's inauthentic. Yeah, exactly. If you think about it, you fell victim of the very thing that you were trying to prevent. I mean that honestly. And when you're thinking about it that much, you put a space between you and people you're trying to connect with, Jay. I really mean it. And if you can break that down and react in real time, then it will never be inauthentic.

41:08But the second you start thinking about you're trying to curate what other people think of you, that's inauthentic. Yeah, because I'm so nervous because I'm having to manage two things at the very same time. Right, right. Because you're taking care of their feelings before yours. Yeah, you're never going to be able to, I remember somebody saying once, you can't tell everybody how to treat you or how to look at you. There's nothing you can do about the way people think about you. Because none of your business. Well, yeah, there's that and also like you'll never get to it. Selena, one second. Yeah.

41:43No, it's okay. I'm enjoying this. I like this conversation. But really, just really quick, it's the same thing that I've carried around for so long being gay. It's like I've constantly my entire life. I just came out. My entire life I've spent taking care of other people's feelings and putting mine second. And then you have to reach a point where Selena is saying, where you're like, I can't, I'm exhausted. But why did you do that for being gay? With regards to you being gay? Is that what you mean? Yeah, yeah. Like if I enter a room, even today, I still have a little bit left over, but for the most part I don't care.

42:18It's like I have to check. I'm so used to it's in my blood now to check how people think about me entering a room. Are they thinking about my being gay or not? I used to do this when I was younger. I remember I was doing an interview and I sat down and there was probably 14 people behind the camera. And I think I was maybe 21. And I started to sweat and I ran away and I started crying. Because this is what I was thinking. I was like, these people probably think I sound stupid. They're going to go home and tell their partners or friends about how much of an idiot I am. And I feel like a horrible interviewer.

43:05I just, it used to kill me. Really? A panic attack. Yeah, I've had that. And I couldn't, I couldn't, I was stuck there. And it just becomes exponentially more horrific and terrifying because now you're convinced, now they can see that I'm having a panic attack. Now it gets even worse. It's like, oh yeah, yeah, yeah. Yeah. And so. You have that too, huh? I mean, I still fall back into it, but I've, you know, here and there. But for the most part, I'm like. I really mean this. I'm sure there'll be a lot of listeners like, shut the fuck up. Really, this is new to me. I don't understand it in that way.

43:41Everybody's wired differently. It's a form of paranoia. Like when I got this, you know, when I got this, and I was so obviously. He's holding up just some sort of just plain white faceless body. And I thought, fucking thank you to everybody. But I feel like the older I get, the closer I get to our favorite term, sexy indifference, or rather, better said, a healthy indifference, where you do care what people think, but you're not obsessed by it and you're not pulled around by it. I will challenge you on that because we're doing it right now today. That is also put on. It's not real because if you have to think about the sexy indifference, then it's not organic.

44:24Right. No, no, I'm saying I'm trying to get to that place of honest and healthy indifference where it's just right-sized, you know, where you do care about people. You don't want to be rude. You want to be sensitive to people. You just want to seem desperate. The freedom is when you don't even have to recognize that you do have indifference, that you're just living. That's the freedom. Otherwise, you're shackled by the idea of it. It still lives there as an idea. Yeah. But it's also what we do for a living, right? It's part of our job to be aware of what people think and kind of manipulate that.

44:57We're professional liars, you know? It was a little bit of a head screw for me. obviously still is when i was a kid when you're trying to figure out who you're who you are and who you're becoming imagine as you're training yourself how to fake to be somebody else it was it's kind of a little bit of a blender interesting it's very do you still think about that selena absolutely i remember i was talking about i was talking about this with someone and there was a study that said um the moment you get famous at a certain age you end up stuck in that area for a while because it's emotionally. Yes. Cause it stunts every year.

45:34You're dealing with things that no child should be dealing with and criticizing my body or something weird. Like it just, it felt, Oh, just it doesn't feel good. You can't grow privately. Like, like most people do, you know? Yeah. So, I mean, I don't regret my life, but there's a huge part of me that's like, yeah I wonder what that would have been like to just be me for a second so but this I'm assuming that you know you've got millions literally millions of people that that admire you more than any of us could probably imagine and because of how brave you are with how honest you are and that is not going to go away thank God I mean you're you're you're you're a role model whether you like it or not.

46:26Until I run away from everything. No, no, you're not going to go. Wherever you go, you're going to be there. No, don't take away her out until you run away, if you want. I run away. But I now get it, though, Jay. I want to say, because you just mentioned that, I want to say that I now get it when I sort of earlier, flippantly, when we first started talking about how many millions of followers you have, I now understand. I get it now. your relationship with that number, with those numbers of people is tricky. Yeah, it is. And I sort of have a little bit more of an understanding. I really mean that.

47:02Maybe I'm a slow learner. No, no. It's weird. It's such a bizarre thing. And they give you way too much information. Like they'll tell you how many accounts you had reached and they'll tell you the percentages of women versus male or non-binary, whatever it is. it's like, I don't need this information. I just want to post a photo and let it be for my fans and move on. And they are definitely attracted to all the things that are very special about you and not to take away from any of that. But I think it is also very indicative of how common it is for people around the world to be not perfect. Yeah.

47:45You know, and I think they really are comforted by how you are so honest about how not perfect you are and I think that's just a real gift that you give to people and myself included I thank you for that I cannot believe we're already past an hour this is literally the fastest interview yeah I'm stunned we're not an hour right now but it is pretty crazy yeah I'm like guys let's go have brunch I want to let you go but I know we have probably a couple of more questions. Sean, go. Yes, no, I just want to know only murders. I love the show. I love you in it. I love Stephen Marty. How did it come about?

48:25What was it like when you started? Did you just love murderers? Was that how you got into it? Just murderers. To be honest, yes. And I like very dark documentaries sometimes. So I tend to like lean into those, especially scary stuff like mentally. And John Hoffman is one of my very, very close friends of mine. But no, it actually happened because, well, Steve's original idea was that it was going to be three men. And then John Hoffman suggested that they hired, yes, who created the show. He said, I think it would be really cool if we added like a younger character, maybe a female. And Steve liked the idea.

49:05And I guess this was really a gift because they had me in mind. and I remember thinking, I'm like, okay, well, what does this mean? And then I had FaceTime with all of them, with Steve, Marty, and John, and producers, and I was like, oh, I just have to do this because simply the people are amazing. And then the success of it after. It's a good hang. Yeah, and then the success after was just such a surprise and we just were happy to do it. And only murders in the building, never manslaughter. Never manslaughter. Just murders. Okay, I'm fine. I'm allowed to ask. Yes, you are. And that is in its fourth year or fifth year, coming up on the show?

49:52We just got renewed for season four. Season four. And we may have to cut this, but John, I asked John, I was like, how many more seasons? And he goes, well, I asked Steve, and Steve said forever. I know, he does. Because my favorite thing about Steve, and he knows that I've said this before, but my favorite thing is Steve will be like, I've got to get home. I've got to get home. I've got to go. I've got to get out of here. I'm too old for this. And then I'll be like, well, I go, Steve, how many seasons do we do? He's like, oh, I don't want to stop. We're going to keep going. And I'm like, what?

50:25You've got to get home. Exactly. But you need to be home. So sometimes I'll be like, I'll carry the load because I get it. It is the greatest trio, but as has been said before, one of the oddest trios ever. It's amazing. It's awesome. Thank you. Awesome. Yeah. Great. Thank you. Well, Selena, this has been great. Thank you, honey, for being here. Yeah, of course. I like it so cool. I just wanted to tell you, Jason, really quick. Yes, ma 'am. I am going to send your wife, Amanda, and your girls some of my new collection from Rare Beauty. Oh, you sweet thing. And like a whole little box, because I would love to see, you know, what they thought.

51:03They're enormous fans of yours, as is Amanda, my wife. Yay! So I want to send you that because this is going to be one of the biggest collections that I've released. And I'm beyond stoked for it. I know it's little things like that that make me happy. Yeah, but it's not a little thing. It's really impressive what you've done with this. This company is potentially, if it's not already, bigger than anything you've done in music or in film or television. Or in social media. I mean, it's an enormous company. And you really should be proud of that. But I think it's good products. And we also just try not to be everything else, you know.

51:48Like, I'm not huge on promoting, like, crazy, you know, makeup. I love makeup, but I want my line to represent yourself and to have fun with it. It seems very consistent with you and what you represent. Well, might I say your skin is flawless. Oh, my goodness. Well, thank you. She takes off her glasses. She goes cross-eyed. She did a Richard Ehrlich. Say, it's where. Say, he's a little bit confused. And then look at that. Beautiful. Let her say it's where. Say it. Ready? No, I swear. I swear. Oh, my God, that's good. That's really good. You look just like Richard Ehrlich. Great. Selena, you're the greatest.

52:32Thank you so much for doing this. This was a big, big get for us. It's so awesome to finally meet you, too. I am so happy, and hopefully I'll get to meet you all in person. I'm sure I'll run into you, Jason. I'm a big fan of all of you, and I've really been wanting to do this for a while. I'm sure you know Jason. So this has been really great. Thank you. Yeah. Thank you for doing it. Thank you. All right. Have a great, great rest of the day. You too. And thanks for talking with us. All right. Bye, honey. Bye, guys. All right. Bye, Selena. Thank you. You see, now, guys, there's a nice person. You guys have asked me multiple times.

53:10You say to me, you say, Jason, how do I get, how can I become nice? How can I become nicer, you know, and be pleasant? Have success. Isn't that your theory? Have success and then you're allowed to be nice. After that, try to be... Remember that, John? Not before. Somebody is... Not before, because then they're going to be accused of wanting something. Kind and as gentle, as loving as she is. Okay? What is that? Will's holding up a fake award. This is my dressing room. I don't know. It's just something like... It looks like an award. It doesn't look like an Oscar. I... Yeah, she's really terrific.

53:41Yeah, no, she's great. What did you both... Did you learn anything, you guys? I did. I feel like I'm lazy. Yeah. I think you're lazy. Well, A, lazy, because she's just so... It seems like everything she does, she's successful at. Even mental health. Right. She's successful at that. I know, right? Because she's not running from it. She's going right through it. It's pretty remarkable. And she's such a talk about, we were talking, authenticity was a central theme today. And she's so authentic. Yeah, she's like superhero. Like she said, she just does what she loves to do. Everybody's welcome to come or don't come.

54:18And you know, it's funny. I was going to say she said that she didn't care, but it's almost like she, it's not that she doesn't care. It feels like she just, what she cares about is just being herself and being honest about it. Yes, and what she loves. She turned that care internal. She's taking care of number one, which for me, always lets me be a better person to the people around me. Sometimes I over-index in the selfishness, but I'm trying to get the right balance. Yeah. Yeah. No, you're down. Sorry. No.

54:49Still rolling. Let's get one more of those, Will. A little more convincing. No, Jason. By the way, I held up on so many because it was such, so many things I wanted to throw in and I didn't because it was just out of respect. Oh, so you've got some unused jokes you'd like to workshop real quick? I mean, no, no, no, no. There was one at the end, certainly, that I wanted to make. Yeah, let's hear it. Which he said, don't worry, I'll carry the load, Steve. And I was like, Sean, how many times? Okay. Okay, so to you. It's Steve, right? It's Steve, right? Do you want to know, though? Speaking about Archie, your son, you know, one time outside.

55:25This is a buy. No, no, this is a buy. Outside, once I had a wizard crawl up my pants.

55:33Did you really? Yeah. Truly? Truly a lizard crawled up? A wizard. And how hard did it get up before it pulled a quick 180 and said, no, thank you. No, that's such a funny thing, wizard. You could use it for so many things. Oh, yeah. Oh, you know what? Okay. So part of my, what is it called? The gay tray that Jason calls it? Oh, yeah. No, no, no. What? Yeah, no, the gay tray. It's an Invisalign thing. I didn't know you had it in today. Yeah. So I have it in every day, but I can whiten my teeth. but my dentist three days ago said you can hear some teeth whitening stuff you can put in the Invisalign trays but you don't have to put them in the back where the bicuspids are.

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