"Stephen Graham"

28:51But with the process of this, and again, you know, back in Sean as well, we have that wonderful rehearsal process like we would with a play. But then you're right, on the day, no take was identical to the others. Because what it does, and again, I don't, I'm a working class kid from Liverpool, you know what I mean? I can't sound pretentious. By the way, you never run the risk of sounding pretentious. Yes, you're good. Just for clarity. All right, good. but it's, and now give me a moment because I may do, but it's the most zen I've ever felt as an actor and it also puts you right in that place No, you did it, you did it You did do it That's what my microphone's leading on, do you know what I mean It's not I'm just saying it for shits and giggles, that's my sweet So in the same respect it's that kind of, you know you're completely, like you said it's that immersive experience for the audience but picking up on you, Jay, it is for the actor because you have to be present, truly present.

29:50And what it does is, to me, acting is all about listening and reacting. Oh, I've got to write that down. Do you know what I mean? So you're constantly listening and reacting to what's in front of you. Well, you know, somebody, as you know, Stephen, I had this discussion with somebody very recently. They said, oh, is it hard to memorize lines? I was talking about this, having lots of dialogue. And Jay, I know you just came off something where you had a lot of dialogue. And the truth is, as we all know, it's not hard when if you're present and the person says something to you, what you're going to say next makes sense to them.

30:22You don't have to memorize because it makes sense what you should say. If the writing's good. You know what I mean? If the writing's good. Yeah. But that's what I love about your process about it being like theater. You can discuss like, I don't know that I would say that. I would say, I feel like this would make more sense and that collaborative experience probably made it all the better. Completely. Yeah. Tell me about, wait, So I want to talk about breakdancing. First of all, what's scouse? So like scouse is what? What's scouse? Is that? Scouse is like a terminology for the particular type of person who comes from Liverpool.

30:59It's like a subset of. Well, it's like, you know, if you're from Liverpool, you're called a scouse. If you're from Newcastle, you're called a Geordie. Oh, okay. If you're from London, you know, you used to be called a Cockney. Do you know what I mean? Oh, right, right, right. All right. And if you're from Scotland, you're called a joch. Why? So it's different kind of things. Where did all these come from? Like if you're from Beverly Hills, you're called a douche. Right. Right. So, yeah,

31:27a scouser is... So a scouser is someone who comes from Liverpool. Who's like a true Liverpudian who has a, you know, who's, right? Yeah, yeah, that's it. Working class full... Why do people think you're faking the accent when I read? I have no idea. It's how I've always spoke so to me. It's so weird. I don't know. I've never heard that one. All right, tell me about breakdancing because I did it too and I would absorb the pain and then walk away like, that was really fun, but I'd be in so much pain. Like I never did the head spins or anything, but I constantly was breakdancing. It was just... We did it as kids.

32:02Because he did it in Liverpool and I did it like... I was like, when I read that, I was like, I did that too. That's so crazy. Where was you when you did your breakdancing? Oh, anywhere. Anywhere there was a... A mall. A fucking dinner theater. Anywhere there was a piece of cardboard. I would just go, watch this. We even bought lino. So you know the lino that people used to put in the kitchens back in the 80s? Yeah, yeah, yeah. We used to carry our own bit of lino. Yeah, yeah, yeah. It was like back in the days of Electro 7 and Grandmaster Flash and Melly Mel and the Fioris 5 and all that kind of stuff.

32:37And we just, yeah, I don't know. It was just this whole thing that just popped up. Obviously, it came over from America. And it ended up in a little town where I'm from, Kirby. And we used to go and do it in the town center. I don't even, because we couldn't watch videos or nothing like that to work out what they were doing. So I don't even know how we, I think it got past that. But now it's an Olympic sport. Yeah. Isn't that funny? You can see how good it is. It's amazing, isn't it? It's pretty good. It's the next level. How were the outfits? Were you proud of your outfits and your hairdos? Yeah, I used to have a, I had a shiny shell suit back in the day.

33:10Oh, my God. Something that you could spin on, do you know what I mean? And the parachute pants and like, yeah. Sean, were you in like an Adidas tracksuit or were you like MC Hammer pants? No, no, but I did have parachute pants because I thought they were really cool. I used to have a really lovely velour Adidas. Oh, yeah. Oh, nice. Velour. Wear that straight to bed. Yeah, it's lovely. So you grew up in Liverpool or outside of Liverpool. Kirkby, where's Kirkby? Kirby, it's just kind of like 35 minutes from the city center. Do you know, Stephen, you must know John Bishop. Not personally, but I've...

33:49Not personally? No, I've met him a couple of times socially, but I don't know him personally, yeah. Okay, that's the guy you did the film that's based on, Willie? Yes, who's also a scouser. Yeah, the film that we did is based on his life, yeah, his story. When's this film coming out? But I thought you would. fairly soon yeah we just I met John by chance and he told me a story of how he became a stand up comedian which is a really kind of an interesting story and he kind of by mistake and he was going he was he was separated from his wife and they were getting divorced and he went to to do stand up he went to go for a drink and they were charging a cover because it was open mic night and he put his name down just so he could get in and they called him and he had a few and he went up and just started doing stand up and then it was quite cathartic and he started going back and he didn't tell anybody and that's how he got into stand-up.

34:41Will, did you ever discuss doing it as him and doing the whole Liverpool accent and anything? Not really because we didn't want it to be too much, you know, too like Billy Elliot or Full Monty, you know what I mean? Like all due respect to those movies, we just wanted to tell a difference. So we set it in New York, Stephen, and I wrote it with an Englishman with Mark Chappell and Bradley Cooper directed and Bradley's in it with me as well. Will, do you think you could do a Liverpool accent? Yeah, you can. No, it's tough. It's a tricky one. It is quite tricky. Yeah, because you hear me say, it's a tricky one.

35:13Like there's a kind of like an almost like an in-head. See, but then he sounds a little bit like Miss Doubtfire there. It's a tricky one, children. Let's come down. No, we don't speak like that. It's a very difficult accent. That's why I just kind of, I leave it alone, that one. It sounds like there's a little bit of Scottish in there. Is Liverpool north? Yes. Yeah, it is. and it's kind of, I think it's an amalgamation of Irish, Scottish, but also kind of because of the docks and the pollution, it's kind of to do with nasal and throat kind of extractions or whatever, do you know what I mean? Will's got that down.

35:44There's a science behind it. There are a lot of Irish people who immigrated to Liverpool. Yeah. Yeah, because it sounds a little bit Irish. Well, a lot of Scousers, I say Scousers are just lazy Irish that couldn't be arsed going to America. when the boat came, they just stayed at Liverpool and didn't move forward, do you know what I mean? So it's kind of... Now, the fellas in the Beatles, did they have famously thick Liverpool accents? But back then, the accents were slightly different. Really? And obviously, it's changed. But they, yeah, all of them, Paul, Ringo, Leo and George, George, obviously, they all have that Liverpool accent.

36:23But theirs was a lot more kind of singy at the time, do you know what I mean? Right, right. It's more theological and like nice little notes and things. That's the go-to when anybody does an impression of a little. Yeah. So wait, so growing up there, what was your window to want to be an actor when you were breakdancing? You're like, wait, if I'm not a breakdancer, I'm going to be a... For me, it was really interesting because when I was about, I think, 11, we were doing a play in school. And across the road from my nana's house, a wonderful man called Drew Schofield lived there and he was an actor and he was on television and he was on a show called Scully, which was really popular.

37:07And that was about a young man who had this dream and this fantasy of playing for Liverpool. And he was the lead role in that. And he lived across the road from my nana's house. Wow. And no one in my family was ever into the arts or anything like that, you know what I mean? Me and my dad used to go to a gallery and stuff like that and everything and heavily into films. my dad got me right into films when I was a young lad but no one had done anything like that but I could see Drew across the road and he was on the telly every week so it made me realise that it was a possibility and he came to watch a play we did in school his nephew was in the same play and at the end of it he said to my mum and dad he said look I think Stephen's really talented you should look at maybe taking him to a youth theatre or something thank God do you know what I mean I did I went to the Everyman Youth Theatre and that's kind of where it all started How about that?

37:55Did you ever think along the way in high school, maybe I should do my studies in such a way where I can get into a college and maybe study up on another career? Was there ever a backup? There wasn't, but there was also that kind of, my intention was to go to university and if I couldn't make it as an actor, but give it a go, then I would hopefully fall into being a teacher. That was kind of the other role I was looking at and the other way of going. Really? Like an elementary teacher that teaches all subjects or specializing in one in high school or college? No, just teaching drama in like a high school, do you know what I mean?

38:35Because over here we have GCSEs and stuff and that kind of, so that secondary school, being a drama teacher, that was another possibility that I looked at. Or if not, believe it or not, I wanted to be a fireman. Yeah. Sure, why not? Same. Now wait, but this is pretty wild. Like I had no idea. B with a fireman? Yeah, B. What did you say? No, no, it's firemen and village people, that guy. Yeah, that's right. I keep forgetting that's what it is. Wait, your dad, your biological dad was Jamaican. My granddad was from Jamaica, yeah. And your stepdad, African-American. Yes, yes, Pops. That's awesome.

39:17Yeah, and Pops, you know, has been here since I was 10, so he's the man that's raised me. He's my father. living and you ever talk to your biological dad i mean when he was yeah yeah we you know we haven't spoken for a while there's there's no animosity there you know i suppose kind of through that but he didn't he didn't shine are you familiar with this area yes yes oh god hang on i gotta get that dad calling one second hello sometimes you grow apart don't you do you know what i mean in many ways yeah or yes sometimes you just drive away yeah yeah exactly that's the running joke Steven that my dad left when I was five.

39:50Anyway, so... Okay, so, and you have siblings and... And did he really leave when he was five? Oh, yeah, he spun the wheels. He just threw it in drive and there was a screech. They didn't see any warning signs, I mean, other than he bought a sports car, a two-seed-y sports car with five kids. No, no, no, wait a minute. Let's be serious for a second. Did he just, did he say, I'm just going to go to shop, I'll be back in a minute? Yeah, one of the minutes of milk. He was in the Korean War, and he came back, and he married my mom. A Korean War or the Korean War? The Korean War. He was in the Army.

40:30And then he came back, and he married my mom and had five kids, and said, this isn't for me. Back to Korea? Yeah. I don't know where. This isn't for me. I'd rather be back in a war theater than be part of this. Shit. So we hang on. So five. Yeah, yeah. And then he made the decision to fuck off. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Wow. Look at Steve and himself. Selfish bastard. If you spend a lot of time with Sean, it'll make sense. No, wait, wait. Sean, what number are you within that five? Five. What? What number are you within that five? Are you the first? Oh, I'm the youngest. I'm the youngest. Yeah, he's the one that really sealed the deal.

41:06Fuck me. Well, he stayed for the first four, Sean. Yeah, you were the one. I'm sorry, man. The bang on the money there. I mean, he put up with four and he was around. as soon as you came it was like get the fuck out of here Sean do you think it was the break dancing do you think that was the plan maybe I ain't raising any kid that does that Sean you really were the straw that brought the camel's back weren't you I really was Paul Bacchus do you get a lot of therapy now though Sean oh god I love it totally I love it yeah you know what I gotta say of all the jokes that we do about it there is Sean is so in front of this trauma if you will in a way that you talk about it in such a very healthy way, which is why we do joke about it.

41:47For our listeners, sometimes people are like, man, you guys are really rough on Sean. No, I mean, the way that we deal with stuff, all of us, is by laughing about it. Yeah, totally. And it's earned laughter because you've been through all the processing and all the therapy, and now you've landed in the laughter. And I don't know, Stephen, I grew up Irish Catholic, so we stuffed everything. So my therapy is to talk about the shit that I wasn't allowed to talk about when I was a kid. Exactly. And so it feels good to do it. That's why I talk about my mom's fake eye. Anyway, we go on that. Yeah, Stephen, so we can move over to the mother now with just the fake eyeball.

42:20Yeah, yeah. Had nausea. We talked about it. Stephen just was like, what? His sister, we were on tour, and his sister brought the eyeball out on stage and opened it in a box and stuff, and we took it out. It was a lot of fun. Stephen doesn't know whether we're kidding or not. It's true. It's true. So your mom had a fake eyeball? Yeah, we were never allowed to ask about it. except when she it was a glass eye then yeah it was a glass eye yeah yeah yeah how did she lose it nobody knows she still can't find it no she had cancer when she was two years old and so they had to take her eyeball out anyway it's a hilarious story angel is your mom still alive nobody knows again no she passed away no but the eye is no she she passed away oh god six years ago maybe seven years ago anyway I want to talk the irony that you don't remember in that she well I know it was January of 2021 no 2019 maybe yeah yeah but look how well balanced you are I know whatever it is it's a nice young boy no no I mean it the way that you talk about it that you're so open about it and that you have come out the other side as JB said and done all the work it is very healthy it's inspiring to be honest it is inspiring We'll be right back.

43:45And now, back to the show. Wait, so you had brothers and sisters growing up, yes? And were they interested in what you did or no? Not really, no. They don't do anything near what you do? My life's very complicated because with that biological father, similar to yours, he went off and he had four children to four different women. Wow. Wow. Yeah. But, you know, look, everyone, he's to their own. I'm all right now. I'm on the other side of it. Are you an only child from? No, I'm not because my mom and pops, they had Nathan, who there's a 20-year gap between me and Nathan. Older or younger? He's my little brother.

44:24I'm 20 years older than him. My mom had me when she was 20, and she had our kid when she was 40. Wow. So the beauty of that, though, is I had all my time with my mom, who, God bless her soul, I adored. And all that time with Pops, who, you know, I love to bits, who raised me. Like I said, you know, he taught me about my history, Marcus Garvey, Malcolm X, Toussaint Louberture, all of those things about my historical, you know, background and where my origins are from. So I was given all of that beautiful information by him. So I was always educated in that respect. And then when I was ready to leave, to go to university at the age of 20, Nathan was born.

45:05Wow. So we never had any of that sibling rivalry. And I love our Nathan's a bitch. You know, technically, look, he could have been my child. Do you know what I mean? That kind of thing. That age difference is there. But it's a wonderful relationship I have with Nathan. And it's a beautiful relationship I have with my dad, who's there for my kids massively. I love that expression, our Nathan, that you get. Like my friend who grew up in sort of the West Country, they say like our mark. Yeah. You know, I love that. There's something really endearing about it. And just sort of the inclusiveness of it.

45:39Sweet. I mean, my dad, sorry, just to pick up on that point as well. When I was about 14 and I said, I think I really want to be an actor, dad was like, all right, come on, let's go. And I was like, what? And he was like, do you want to do it properly? And I was like, yeah. So he took me to the video shop. Remember the old-fashioned video shops where you go into like a library? Yeah, Blockbuster video. It was before Blockbuster even. This was just the local video shop. just the little independent ones. And we went in and we looked and he picked these three films and it was, he picked The Deer Hunter, The Godfather and Taxi Driver.

46:19And then we went home and he was like, right, we're going to watch these. This is how you do it properly. Let's watch these films. And we spent the whole weekend re-watching those three films. Which is your favourite from those three? It's a tricky one, isn't it? I love The Deer Hunter. I love the deer hunting I love that and then when you were in your 20s you were in like 14 years old you said you wanted to be in it six years later you're in Gangs of New York with Martin Scorsese that's crazy another incredible film mind blowing as well to be a part of what was that like from the moment that you knew that it was a project that was happening to getting an audition to being there well it was It was, I got the call from my agent and said, right, we need you to come in and do a read and put yourself on tape.

47:10And so I went into London and I met Ellen Lewis, who's wonderful. We just had a really lovely time and I read these couple of scenes and then I went away. And it was one of them, you know, where you don't hear for like four or five weeks later and you kind of go, it's over, there's no chance. So as a job, an actor and a young lad, I had to go for this. we've all done it let's be honest I had to go for this bag of shit audition and I really didn't want to go it was fucking awful but I'm on the train I'm sweating I'm on my way into London you know you've got to pay the rent haven't you you've got to eat so I'm in and I'm like and I'm going through this fucking awful script and I'm like okay alright having a coffee and then the next minute my phone goes and it was my agent Jane and she said she said are you sitting down I was like yeah I'm sitting down she went right okay you've got that part in Gangs of New York I was like, what?

48:01She went, yeah, they came back today. You've got to fly to Italy. Say this was Friday. You've got to fly to Italy on Monday. Marty wants to sit down and talk to you and go through the character. And I was like, what? I was made up. But then the best bit was I went, does that mean I don't have to go for this audition now? Yeah. She went, no, you don't have to go for that. I was like, thank fuck. And so then I flew out there and, you know, and we met and it was wonderful. And it was just a wonderful experience. Yeah, that's great. That's when I became friends with Leo as well. That's when we... Yeah, Leo.

48:33And there was some story about a golf cart or something. You wore a golf cart and we were on the set? Yeah, I tipped a golf cart over and I nearly broke his leg. Oh, okay, okay. Yeah, you can get really messed up on those things. Yeah. Yeah. You don't realize they're dangerous. I think that if you go to my Wikipedia page and you look at my filmography, Stephen, they all fall under the category of you have to pay the rent. For what it's worth. Okay. And then this is wild. So one of the three movies you mentioned was The Godfather, and then you're with Pacino in The Irishman. Well, can you imagine that phone call to me, Dad?

49:12I mean, that's incredible. That's incredible. I had to go to it. It was a wonderful, wonderful story. I was doing a little series over here called The Virtues with Shane Meadows, and it was a wonderful experience. And on the Friday, I had to fly to New York to go to Marty's house to meet Robert De Niro because Rob was an exec and you had to meet him and he wanted to make sure that I was right and things like that. So you can imagine how nervous I was and I had to fly to New York. So I finished work, I think, first thing Monday, they let me go early. So I had to fly out and then I got there. Literally, I had to land, go to Marty's house and see Marty.

49:53and then I met, I'm sitting in and Bob comes up and he's got his little cap on and he's got the paper underneath his arm and a pair of shorts and a little baggy shirt and he's like, hey. And it was unbelievable, it was amazing. We had a wonderful afternoon, but Ellen had said to me, look, he doesn't really talk much. So, and I'm thinking, oh shit. She's like, so you might have to make some conversation. I'm like, okay. Anyway, cut to, we were there for about two and a half hours and then they went like, right, okay, you best go. And then I said, have I got the part? I went, I can't leave now without knowing if I've got the part.

50:26And then Bob was like, just give us a minute. Go on, just give us a minute. And I was like, oh, shit, okay, I've tried my artist. I don't know if this is going to work. I hope so. I don't know if he likes me. First of all, he was like, you're not Italian. I'm like, no, I'm not Italian. And so then I come back in and I sit there and he goes, sit down, sit down, I'll let Marty tell you. And then Marty was like, okay, kid, so do you want to do this? And I was like, of course. and then I got a hug off them and I felt like, you know, in all the films, I felt like I was a made man, do you know what I mean?

50:58Or you were about to be killed. Yeah, or I'd be taken out the back and put two in the head. And then you can imagine that phone call to my dad and the pride gets me emotional just thinking about it a little bit. You know, I'm a young kid from a block of flats, a young mixed race kid who had a dream to be an actor and my dad took me to that video shop, like you say, Sean, and then the next minute I'm phoning him up saying, I'm going to be in a film with Robert De Niro and Al Pacino and being directed by Martin Scorsese. That's really cool. Oh, man. It's one of those beautiful stories. And Martin Scorsese is famous for many things, one of which, though, is his kindness and his warmth and his spirit on set.

51:37And you've had the chance to work with him at least twice. Three occasions? Three times, yeah. Wow. Yeah, good for you. Yeah, it's really cool. He's a lovely one. And then when I met you, Stephen, at the Graham Norton show just in February, and you were so, I mean, I just fucking loved you right away. You were so normal and kind. That's such a fun show. Stephen, what did you think of Sean? I mean, he said that about you. And be honest. And be brutally honest. He was lovely. It was wonderful. He was like a ray of sunshine. Yeah. Sean was a ray of sunshine. Yeah, he was lovely. Our Sean. Your Sean.

52:14See, look, see the end here and there. Your show was lovely. I found him really wonderful. Do you know what I mean? He was very gregarious. It was lovely. And afterwards, I was like, oh, my God, you've got to come on the show. So it's nice of you doing that. Yeah, he did. But wait, you were promoting a movie where you trained to be this boxer. And the movie's called A Thousand Blows. It was yet a TV series on Disney, A Thousand Blows, set in the 1800s. And I haven't seen it yet, but those clips, I was like, that looks incredible. Oh, go ahead, A Thousand Blows. No, Sean and Jason and I are just looking at each other.

52:48Who's got the joke here? Who wants to go on a thousand blows? Do you have it? I don't have it yet. I'm still writing it. Will, if you're there, go ahead. See, my missus went, as soon as he said, right, a thousand blows, my missus went, sounds a bit like a top shelfer. I mean, it's just, it's like, Sean, right? It's like my summer in, Sean Hayes, my summer in Mykonos. A thousand blows. my timeshare on fire island

53:20I imagine it's different than that Stephen yeah the movie are you are you did you train did you did you train as a fighter yes I trained oh sorry you're asking him yeah I did yeah yeah I did yeah I did will yeah I did yeah yeah I did a lot of boxing and that shitload of protein and did, yeah, it was great. I had six months and I got into the best shape I've ever been in. Yeah, I mean, you're very young. I mean, you're not 20, but you're still pretty young. I'm 51, yeah. Yeah, to do all that training at 51, that's crazy. Were you a boxing fan or are you a... Yeah, I've always been a boxing fan, yeah.

53:58And how do you feel about where boxing is now? Have you transferred over to UFC or are you still a purist with the boxing? I like UFC. See, I just, I'm not 100 % on the kind of, look, it's attracting audiences. I get that. I understand that. But I think it's gone a little bit sensationalist now. So brutal. I'm more of a fan of the pure art of pugilism, do you know what I mean? And the belts. And I feel like the belts are important. And to be number one in the world, or a world champion is an important thing to be, do you know what I mean? I'm going to say something that's maybe unpopular, which is that my problem with the sort of the MMA in general is that there is a, to me anyway, there is a kind of a darkness around it that I find, you know, around the culture of it that I find really puts me off.

54:44Almost a bloodlust, yeah. Yeah, there's something about it. Boxing you get that is sort of the purity, right, of the sweet science, is that what they call it, right? Yeah. Sort of the art of it. And of course there's a ton of art to MMA and I'm not disparaging what the athletes do. But the sort of the culture around it, To me, there's a, I don't know, there's a sort of a darkness to it. Just me. I mean, starting with them doing it all in a cage. Yeah. The obvious of it. But it's still, it's really fascinating. And it's the multiple disciplines inside that cage, too. It's kind of cool. So, yeah, I'm conflicted on it myself.

55:25And to me, though, one of my favorites is Paddy the Baddy, who is also a scouse. Oh, my God. He's amazing. He's great. He's fantastic. Do you guys know this guy? He's so funny. Is he a boxer? He's an MMA fighter. He's an MMA fighter. He's so profoundly funny to me. Every time I see him, God, he's good. And he's tough as nails. Yeah, he's amazing. He's brutal. But he also doesn't take himself too seriously. At all. And I love the kind of showmanship of that. Look, Ali was the best showman we ever had. Yeah. But, you know, he also, and you go, yeah, but Ali respected the other fighters. No, he didn't.

56:02No. He listened to some of the things he used to say, especially to George Foreman. Some of the things he said to him was horrific. And Patty the Batty, he uses that thing that you guys, the scousers do of calling everybody lad and putting lad in everywhere. And there's something sort of hilariously disparaging when you use the term lad, yeah? Yeah, I know what you mean. Have a look at him, Jay. Some of his videos, he's really funny as well. He's very sharp. What weight class is he? I'm not too sure. It might be lightweight. Oh, yeah? Yeah. All your tattoos, did you have to, did you just not cover them up?

56:40No, I did, yeah. You spend like 50 minutes in this year getting painted. When we did the thing, yeah. And they don't come off in the shower, the cover up. It's going to be. Oh, really? And you have a tattoo for your nanny or something? And I never heard this term, a fairy cake. We just call it a cupcake. Yeah. No, my nana, she used to, when we were kids, she used to make fairy cakes. Yeah, cupcakes. Cupcakes, okay. Yeah, nothing on fairy cake, Will, no? I'm sorry, GB? No. No? I'll give you a couple more minutes. Go ahead. Continue with the interview. I never heard that before. I never heard fairy cake.

57:22No, no, no, no, obviously not a lot of Americans have. Hey, fairy cakes, did you?

57:32So then what is your, when you're not doing these incredible projects, Stephen, what is something, what is your primary hobby? I bet it's not boxing. What is something that occupies your time that people might be surprised about? Oh, meditation. Yes? Great. Meditation. I love that. I'm constantly trying to learn how to do that without falling asleep. That's the key. It's right on the edge. No, he's bang on the door and you may laugh, but that's the key. Yeah, the key is not to fall asleep. There's a wonderful practitioner called Muji. Yeah. If you get a chance, go on YouTube. Muji. Type in Muji and have a listen to him.

58:16Okay. His voice is fantastic. But his pointings and his teachings are wonderful. And he always says, you know, look, the basic aim is to try not to fall asleep in many ways with meditation. But in the same, because that's, but if you think about it, when the head shuts off, most of the time is when you're asleep. Yeah, right. You know, that's when the subconscious comes into effect. But predominantly it's that kind of trying to stop the white noise and that constant pounding of the head to step out. But it's just allowing it to, oh, where have I gone here? It's just allowing it to be. It's trying to get your brain to think about nothing.

58:51Yeah, nothing. Right? But then that's the key we'll see. Sorry, Jason, that's the key, isn't it? We're trying to get the brain to think about nothing. And in that trying, you're already doing. So it's that kind of just letting the clouds pass. Yeah, I love that. Do you know what else I've got into? Ice baths, but not in an egotistical sense. Just that kind of like maybe two minutes. If you do two minutes, it does everything your body needs physiologically. Will does it all the time. I've been doing it for 10 years. I've been doing it for 10 years and it's been a game changer for me, man. Absolute game changer.

59:22And it is, that is, I don't, I wish I could meditate. Like JB, I've thought about it. I've sort of, I've gotten apps before and I've tried it and I've had, and I remember somebody saying to me once, like imagine a stream and leaves are falling off the stream and each thought is like a leaf, each thought is like a leaf and then just let it go with it a little bit and then you can just reset back to another thing. I just started doing it. Right, and it does work, but I do it in the cold. I do, I get in that thing where I just, I'm like, I'm going to do three minutes and I just think about my breathing, think about my breathing and then, yeah.

59:52When I first started doing, When I first started meditating, this is, I'm talking about a month ago, like really doing it. I started, every single time I would do it, I'd start to cry because my brain works overtime constantly from the moment I wake up, the moment I go to bed, I'm like constantly thinking about, and it's going 80 miles an hour from anxiety or whatever. And sugar, a lot of sugar. And sugar. And I didn't know what to do with myself when I'm still. So I would just start welling up and I was like, oh shit. But now I'm not anymore. That's good. that's sitting in that moment. Oh yeah, you seem fixed for sure.

1:00:26You nailed it. It's that, look, you can be mindful with anything you do. You don't have to, the art of it itself is the art. The practice is the art. Do you know what I mean? At least you're taking that time. You also might be out of tears, Sean. You might just be rebuilding the well. This is true. But there is that thing of also like when you're doing it and then you hear like, you isolate the sound of the refrigerator running or whatever and that's okay. Then think about that. Then focus on that. then allow those things. And it's just, it's the allowing, it's the constant. And then when you're done with the meditation, you really do feel calmer and more focused and present.

1:01:02Have you ever tried TM? Stephen, have you ever tried TM? I've wanted to do that. What is that? Oh, transcendental. What's the difference? Yeah, I don't really know, but I guess that's a different, it's a different practice, the transcendental meditation. That was all that kind of David Lynch skill, wasn't it, and everything? Was it? Yeah, I think so. Stephen, we've taken up way too much of your time. Thank you for being here. Not enough of your time. God, I could talk to you forever. I know, I love you. I agree. Where are you right now and what are you going to do the rest of the day? I am in New York.

1:01:31We got here on Monday. And then Seth Meyers, I think we're doing today, this afternoon. Sure. Later on. And then I'm going to go home. And to answer your question as well, Jason, my family is my favorite thing to do in the whole world. I'll bet. I feel very blessed. I'm very lucky and I'm full of gratitude that I have. I have the most amazing wife and two gorgeous kids. I love them to bits. That's so great. I love that. Well, we love you. Thank you for being here, Stephen. Thank you, Steve. Big, big fan of yours. Thank you very much for me. Keep going. Keep going. Thank you. All right, my friend.

1:02:08Thanks for doing this. How do they say goodbye in Liverpool? I don't know. Ta-da. Ta-da. Ta-da. I never heard of that. Ta-da. Ta-da. Ta-da. Ta-da. Ta-da. Enjoy the rest of your day. See you, bud. You too. Take care. Thank you. See you later. Bye-bye. Bye-bye. Sean, what a guest. I love him. I mean, when I met him at the Graham Norton show, I was like, oh, I totally know Stephen Graham. Like, I know his work. But you never know how anybody is. And I met him. We ended up just talking and talking. And I'm like, he's such a great human being. A nice spirit. Great vibe. Yeah. And so talented. And so many things that we all know.

1:02:50You know, so many big movies and TV shows. Yeah, he's been a really high-level character actor for a long, long time. Like, if you put one of your favorite movies on and you haven't watched it for a while, you go, Oh, there he is. Oh, there's Stephen Graham, yeah. Another great example, we were talking about recently, of somebody who had talent, didn't come from an environment that was conducive to making his way into showbiz and had a mentor, had somebody who said, Hey, this kid's great. He should go here. and just another, you know. Yeah, we've talked about it before. You need that next stage of people that believe in you after your parents.

1:03:27Yeah, yeah, yeah. I'm still looking. Oh, I know. Listen, I believe in you. Sean, look at me. I'm looking at you. Hey, you're great. Oh, no, your eyes are crossing. Your eyes are crossing. I'm trying to find you. I'm trying to find you. So, Jason. Here we go. Jason and Will, I had, I ordered, remember when I told you I was in Ojai? Oh, my God. You know what the worst part is? It's just the fucking... It's his face. I'd love to watch you change lanes on the highway. You must put your car into a four-wheel slide when you do it. I love... I'm still laughing at... So, Fairy Kicks, listen... So, no, I really did order some...

1:04:13When I was in Ohio last weekend, I ordered some tea, and it was hibiscus tea. Yeah, okay. Yeah. so the opposite of hibiscus tea would probably be chamomile? Are you trying to get us to say bibiscus? Hibiscus, yeah. Well, that's not a thing. That's not a word. We do that sometimes where it's not the thing. No, no, sorry, Jay. I deciphered that. I mean, we almost needed the Enigma machine for that to try to decode. I was nowhere near. I can't believe you got that. I was nowhere near that. Hibiscus. Okay, let me do another one. We know what we just planned on the back of the day. Oh, you got ours.

1:04:49Did you see him click the file? This is what you do during the day. I was in the backyard and we planted some hydrangeas. Okay. Okay. And so after we were done and I walked away, I said, Bye, dranges. That one's not bad. Jesus Christ. Sorry, listener. We'll see you next time. Smart. Nice.

1:05:21Smart Less is 100 % organic and artisanally handcrafted by Michael Grant Terry, Rob Armjarf, and Bennett Barbaco.

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