Findings and Learnings

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1:07Hello and welcome to Tailenders. Hello and thank you for having us on Tailenders from the bottom of my heart to yours. Oh, well I felt that from the bottom of your heart and it's gone straight into the top of mine and now going to the bottom. There goes my hero. How you doing, Greg? I'm very well and I'm very very very happy to be back on Tailenders this is such a great place and I've missed you very much although I did see Matchin Tendorka in Bristol obviously saw the King of Bristol on my cycle and you cycled past my son's school I did I cycled past mini Matchin which was absolutely insane to see him.

1:55That was like my, that was my seeing Elvis at the top of Kenimanjaro. Except it was me seeing your son. And I went, ah, Jesse, legend. You know what, Greg, I've already done that joke on last week's Tell Enders where you, I don't know if you remember this, but when I joined you the next day in Birmingham, you saying to me, oh my God, is that the lights of Ederson? They're beautiful. And then we realised it was just a five-a-side court, but you'd been cycling for so long you were starting to have sort of hallucinations. I really, really wanted to get to Edgebaston on that day. Yeah. And I just was hoping that the lights in the distance were the floodlights.

2:38I felt it in you because I started asking you who your favourite Warwickshire players of all time were. Yeah. No, it was nice. And I think I said Alan Donald. You did say Alan Donald, yeah. Which probably is slightly controversial with you know for the homegrown talent but you know whatever um i stand by it answer i was looking for roger twos well you could have had penny you could have had tim munton you could have could you could have gone for did you did we say keith piper yeah um jim trowton asif din was one that i mentioned yeah you did say asif din um but anyway i'm back from that adventure and it's been a few weeks and fee it was so nice to for you to join me on the back of that bike i hope you enjoyed it.

3:18Mate I had the best time and we should just quickly say because I know that you want to get into cricket Greg because you probably missed it. I do desperately. But we're so proud of you man. Thank you. It's amazing what you did. I know Jimmy is as well and Sharky when he fades himself up will say the same thing but what an incredible thing. I heard from Jimmy a lot over the week and I heard from Sharky a lot and actually saw Jimmy's mum and dad which was really nice. They were on holiday in Jedbra and they were waiting at one of the pit stops so I saw Michael and Catherine Anderson looking nearly as proud as when they were watching their son bowl.

3:53Okay. They were very sweet. Very nice to see them. Before we move on and introduce our special guest today and our, well, really our Jimmy Anderson replacement. Like for like. It is a like, and it is a like for like replacement. I just want to say a huge thank you to all the tail enders, not only for the nice messages about my dad, who will be listening to this episode in hospital. He's sort of come back to the point where he's now able to watch and listen to a few things. Come on out. So big out. All the tenants behind you. So big thanks to all the messages about that. But also the overwhelming number of go wells while I was doing the challenge.

4:32Yeah. You heard them, Fee. I know. The resounding greeting was a go well around most corners. There was. And I thought when I saw you before we'd done our bit of the ride that you were sort of making that up to make me feel good about what I was about to experience. But when we were actually on it, there were so many people shouting, go well. Yeah, it was a ludicrous number. Greg, physically, what was the difference with Felix joining you and the future King of England? What were the, could you compare and contrast their styles? It's a really good question. It's a really good question. Felix probably a lighter unit.

5:08Yeah. Well, lighter responsibility. Well, a lighter responsibility. less serious if I was to fall off with Felix on no offense yeah the course of history necessarily well no no no no no indie rock history sure exactly yeah but actually because me and Fee are such close friends and he's known me for so long we were more in sync than the future king yeah yeah because like he knows Felix knows what I exactly and I could tell him what i needed i couldn't really demand too much from him i didn't think from william from prince king william i was um but also he was just because i know from my job on the back of your bike i just stared at your ass for 45 minutes right which the future king of england will have done as well because there's not many other places you can look on that bike are there no for balance reasons you can't so you can't poke your head out of the side and look look at look ahead so he'll have a really good sort of like four-dimensional idea of your backside now a really clear one yeah he will yeah i did i actually said to him how the mighty have fallen like he's staring at the back of my head and back but he had a nice time he didn't need to turn up did he didn't need to but did quite quite stressful i'd say that was a very stressful ride but was it what for you just yeah yeah were people noticing that he was on the back i guess no that's the weird thing is that they didn't believe me when i was shouting at school kids look it's prince william yeah and he was like he's hallucinating it could have genuinely changed the course of history if he had fallen off yeah you know who would be king then harry harry yeah god can you imagine can i can i ask Also, that's a lot of things.

6:59Oh, Sharky's up. Yeah, that's Woken Sharky up. He's shaking his head and he's saying. Sharknado? Am I faded up? Yes, you faded up. Royally. Royally faded up. I think his son, whose name escapes me. George. George would be next in line. Should. Of course. Yeah, of course. Anyway, look, that is, that is, there's catastrophizing matching and there's that. It's all fine. it would have been at the you know probably at the very most a sore arm if we'd have fallen off but it's fine great one more question how many cricket analogies ran through your head during the week-long cycling so for example we talk about this all the time but were there moments where you were like day three and fading light being sent out to bat all of it got to dig in our last half now just get through the last half hour yeah get through to tea get through to lunch exactly dig in yeah i've actually been thinking i i spoke to my dad about this when he first got into hospital and i said you are going to need to be graham thorpe and nasa saying in karachi so the neck for the next two three months yeah this is what you're dealing with here yeah yeah that's it and i i think i felt like i felt like alex stewart a lot that's what i need that's what i need to channel i was like be graham thorpe be alex stewart get up this hill just dig in just grind it out, grind it out.

8:23It's a lot of that. And you did it. Did it. Anyway, shall we get back to the best thing in the world? Cricket. From the James Anderson end, ESPN Crick Info's Vithushana Hintaraja. Vish, welcome back to Tailenders! Thank you for having me back on Tailenders. What a joy. Well, it's nice to actually have you here because you can monitor how many of your ideas, opinions and thoughts we recycle.

8:58I have noticed that when I've been listening. I just, you know, every now and again, Jimmy will say something and be like, yeah, that was my idea, I think. Yeah, but also Vish. He's such a magpie, isn't he? But we also, I always credit you. No, you do. If I've lifted a Vish, I'll always credit. Yeah. I haven't read. You go double Vish an episode sometimes. Oh, yeah. But that's when, that's because in times of trouble. Mother Mary comes to me. Daddy Vish comes to us. Speaking words of wisdom. He does speak words of wisdom. You always do. Plagiarize Vish. Speaking words from the wisdom. Plagiarize Vish.

9:36Speaking words from the wisdom, not the wisdom, the ESPN Quick Info. Speaking words from wisdom. So it's, I don't know. I've had such a positive eight days. but we can find some positives in that we have to laugh at this because it's absurd my i don't know how you all feel but consuming yet another rob key interview who over the years i like rob key we've he's been fun on the podcast he's it was great fun when he was a player great pundit we were really hopeful when he joined all the rest of it but i cannot listen to any more interviews i can't do it i think more than anything there's no anger from me i'm so bored i'm so bored of the whole i'm just not excited for the for the england summer i'm me and fia just chatting we're excited about good friday county championship starts that's what very much we're just excited for some cricket but i'm not excited for mccullum key gould thompson cricket i'm just not it was too soon for the chat wasn't it it was too soon to hear from them all again a little bit i think it was yeah yeah a lot of uh so i've got oh sorry i was gonna say there's a lot of management speak wasn't it and i know you hate that rob stop saying learning the the uh i'm sorry rob that sounds like management speak i know you hate that um there was um fish you were in the actual like review just take us in there like what happened did they actually they did they show the journalists their findings is that what happens it's findings and learnings yeah yeah yeah look shut up the uh yeah it was it was really i was gonna say it was interesting but that would be a lie it was um you know like the the way it was put to us was what was interesting in its own way because it it felt like they like they gave us a presentation they didn't actually show us the findings of the review and i can kind of understand why a lot of that stuff would have to stay in house because they they basically spoke to every player and i wonder if they spoke to certain well certain players certain coaches under anonymity to a point because obviously if things get leaked out and people find out they've said certain things about certain other people then it becomes quite messy but basically instead of the actual review we got a two slide powerpoint presentation and i think two slides is technically the smallest presentation you could have two slides because one is the title page yeah that's just a text isn't it and then and page two is the meet and there wasn't even a conclusion how big a font are we talking a lot of double spaces a tail ender's listener needs to mock up what they think it would look like we should come up with whatever you think that powerpoint look like and we'll post all of them because I imagine summer it's pretty easy title page second page we think we should just keep going we actually we've we've concluded that actually we should keep our jobs see you in the summer that'll be 150 pounds please a ticket cheers we can show you a graph of runs versus profit and look where the line goes yeah i mean look We joke about The Office a lot, but it is...

12:57I think I've got the bit. Let's just play it in, because this is... We don't even need the audio from the press conference, because it's just... It's just this. It worries me when someone feels they have to go over your head and come to me. Snitches. Do you know, I've never seen you write anything down. You've got two computers. I don't even know what you're using them for. You've got to have some sort of system. It's all up there. Yeah, but it's not all up there, is it? Most of it is. Look, David, I'll tell you now. When I was managing the Swindon branch, our perception of your branch was they're having a laugh.

13:27Thanks very much. Thanks very much. No, not in a good way. Having a laugh, mucking around at the expense of Wernham Holt. I was to say, if they weren't mucking around, having a laugh all the time, it would be much worse. I'm not interested in that, David. Look, I get the impression you'd rather be popular than steer the ship in the right direction. Well, rubbish. And I resent the accusation because this branch has performed very well. It's performed okay. I want to perform a lot better. It's actually, it's so similar. because I could show you a graph of people versus task and where does the line go?

13:56The line goes where I want it to go. Now, if you can't improve your margin and your volume sales with or without making people laugh, if you can't do that, you and I are going to have to have a very serious chat. Oh, my God, it's so... Just wearing around all the time, keeping tabs on me because I like the bank's there. Well, with respect, David, I think you do. Now, I'm aware of this management training thing you're doing tonight and I'm worried it's going to affect your performance at work. That's extracurricular. That's the 100. Golf as well. It's not performing. as I want me to perform. You're not performing as I want you to perform.

14:24I'm performing as I want me to perform. I don't want you to perform like that. It's a bit of performance. Let's agree to disagree. No, let's agree that you agree with me.

14:35It's the same. That is startling. Yeah. It's extraordinary. Do you know what was so obvious, I thought, and they all said it, this idea that it was groundbreaking and part of the long-term planning that what we normally do is we get smashed in ashes overseas and then we sack the coaches. But have you thought about this? Get smashed in the ashes and don't sack the coaches. Like that was somehow innovative thinking. Like in our case, how about this? We don't sack anyone. Yeah, you kind of flip it, don't you? Have you thought about not getting smashed in the ashes? We can't do that. We can do that.

15:16Too late for that. Yeah, that still really happens. you know this is um this is probably a bit of an unpopular opinion and one that i've not really voiced before you've been scared to say and this might be the most of unpopular of all the opinions i don't necessarily think that no change is a bad thing but it was it was worse after that presentation on monday because i figured you might as well at least keep those people in there and get them to learn force them to learn from it and then after the meeting on monday i was like oh no i don't think they will i think really this might end badly this is a huge risk anyway and you know just to caveat that with i know they weren't going to necessarily show us all the things that were they were going to change and how they were going to change them because obviously a lot of that stuff is between stokes and mccullum between them and the players and that kind of stuff but i definitely left it thinking oh Oh, lads, I don't know.

16:18I don't know. Really? But you don't know that they've taken stuff on? Well, no, I just don't know how they will. It was, ultimately, the two most important people in this whole project weren't in the room. And that's probably why they got away with doing a PowerPoint presentation, because I can't imagine McCullum and Stokes have any time for that kind of stuff. Two slides. Yeah, well, yeah. But, like, ultimately, it's going to be determined on the pitch, it's going to be determined in the changing room. And with all due respect to Key and Gould, they don't really have any say in that, regardless of what they might try and instil in them.

16:52So, yeah, I just don't know how much actual change there'll be. But, you know, win games and the narrative changes. And I don't think that it's beyond England to win both the series this summer or even go and give South Africa a game this winter. But, yeah. That's the tricky thing, isn't it? It's uneasy. Look, we are, this is a positive podcast. There are so many things about the England set-up that we love. We love those players to death. Like some of our favourite ever players are currently playing. That's why it's so frustrating and boring that that's the, I want to hear this. I don't want this.

17:33Do that behind the scenes. And if you are going to come out and say your findings, make it more interesting and more confident. There was no confidence in all that stuff. It was like just lame interviews and soundbites. And then there was a bit where Rob Key said, look, it took Jimmy Anderson five years to become a great bowler. Yeah. And then you sacked him without any replacements. Well, actually, can I just say something about that? Because I thought that was really interesting because I heard it on a couple of Rob Key's interviews where he talked about, well, actually, we've got a very inexperienced bowling attack there who didn't have experience of the conditions, etc.

18:12I found it frustrating hearing that because that was what the years of planning were moving towards. That's why Jimmy was let go when he was let go with a view to then. And they were talking as if it had been sprung on them. But the bowlers didn't have any experience in the conditions of playing there. And all these things were outlined quite clearly by everyone that's been around in the game for a while. And I found that really, I don't know about you Vish. did you when you heard that was it a bit like well this is what year that's you had years to work towards that or do you think that was a fair point no no i agree i think they're trying to have it both ways to a degree because part of the reason they started again with the bowling attack and even with some of the batters to a point was the idea that you can tune these guys up and then send them to australia where they haven't been burned before where they haven't where they're not scarred.

19:07Yeah. And they can, you know, use that confidence as a springboard to go and do something remarkable like win an Ashes in Australia. But they didn't, yeah, you know, they didn't give them the best chance of it. They brought up preparation again. I actually thought, weirdly, there was too much talk about the Ashes on Monday. I think there should have been a lot more moving forward when it became apparent that everyone was staying put. Lawrence Booth, the editor of Wisdom, asked Richard Gould about what are the changes that McCollum is going to instil that gave you the confidence to persist with him.

19:40And Richard Gould gave a nothing answer and Lawrence Booth went back at him as a follow-up and said, OK, but can you give me some actual examples? And then Gould mentioned the fact that they used walkie-talkies during the World Cup. And it's like, yeah, no, sure. But just like something tangible would be good? Like, yeah, walkie-talkies is fine. I do like a walkie-talkie. Yeah. They're great fun. Fun for all the family. what is that because they were doing what a game of hide and seek around the around the ground you started playing Marco Polo that's it's you know what would have been better just to come out and say we got nothing better to do we've got no other options we're just going to have to keep going just for now we can't we just think it's fine isn't it too expensive to get rid of Brendan McCollum just be honest be honest just say we f***ed it we'll try our very best again we cannot change things now we're too deep into it we've got some great players we think this is probably the best way to go about it you're going to have to bear with us we're really sorry we have been useless but let's all get behind it and yeah it's mad what I really liked was the Barney Rone doing a list of things that we're not allowed to talk about anymore because you know we've all been gaslit by all the things and then there's always like quick do a press release and then we forget about all the other things quick so the Harry Brook altercation in which he lied to the public via ECB media channels key not being able to explain the Noosa stuff and being like yeah Noosa was booked but that's fine drinking culture can't talk about that anymore terrible ashes preparation the panicky selection failure to hire specialist coaches don't talk about the 4-1 in the ashes and don't talk about the fact that we changed our playing method when the series was kind of already gone and we're like actually maybe we should dig in oh no too late it's 3-0 so there's all of that just so we need to protect ourselves from gaslighting just so we've got all the things that are flying around our heads what can we talk about?

21:58walkie talkies walkie talkies the future of walkie talkies Jacob Bethel's good isn't he Jacob Bethel but don't talk about the fact that he might have been picked earlier don't talk about that though the disconnect is interesting don't you think because it's interesting how many people how angry like even for example we're talking like we are on this show we would always make a conscious effort to be extremely positive on tail enders about everything it's just interesting looking back on the last few years of his team how how we've got to this point like I it was and I don't know in part whether it's because we all were so overexcited with them in the first year or whether because even when you were just talking Ben Greg what you just said I actually felt in my body relieved then just hearing those words even coming from an imaginary head of cricket made me feel relieved just to get a very straight heart and say sorry a little bit we're gonna try our best these are our options that just made me and I think it's somehow hearing what we always hear from them and the lack of communication.

23:07And when we do, you get in this feeling that they're quite, they're very unwilling. They seem like they've come, they're being forced to show contrition and they don't really want to at all. And there's this like horrible, can you feel it in the interviews themselves, Vish, is there like all that stuff? Yeah, definitely with Key. I think you're so right about the first two years of all this because you say, did we get overexcited? Did England fans, did journalists get overexcited? I mean, that's the whole point of it, yeah? You have to allow yourselves to enjoy it. You're supposed to enjoy it.

23:47It's fun. It is fun. It's the sport we all love and they were playing it so damn well. And it was so entertaining given what happened previously. I think ultimately you know I suppose the counter reaction I don't think that's been a bit over the top because people had such high hopes for the ashes but it's I can't remember it being this this vitriolic I think and it might just be you know it's my own echo chamber on social media but I like to feel like the people I follow are all very sensible and quite like you know quite good at reading the game i might not necessarily agree with all of them but you know i follow them for a reason because they're good for perspective and there is so much hate there there is so much anger i i feel a bit for key i think some of the stuff he some of the criticism his way on social media and he's you know he's active on social media is understandable i think some of it is properly out of order um and he is probably someone you see in most like i i think you can you can tell in the way he talks about it now the fact that he's resorting to management speak which to you know borrow a nihilism is something that he did hate coming into the job it's why he wanted to come in and be it be someone who was a bit different because he hated the stuffy boardroom types he felt that the way people people were talking about cricket at the ecb was just wrong and out of touch really and so to see him like go through some of that patter and almost go into autopilot a little bit part of that comes from being knackered but also just from i don't know i suppose you do get a bit institutionalized don't you wherever you end up working whatever governing body of whatever sport um but i think for him in particular that's where i see it most about just the toil of the shift from being look you know lauded and loved to where we are yeah but they're interesting there is a you raise a great point about the fun of the first couple of years of Baszball and the relief that we all felt when we saw these players doing what they want to do and being confident and being allowed the time and space to be confident.

25:58But none of this feels in any way fun. And what I really worry about is that they've completely lost the room. They've just, even for the cricket nerds like us and the everyday lot of fans that just kind of switch in and switch out. It's just like, oh, yeah, it's sort of become a, oh, yeah, they're useless, aren't they? It's sort of, it doesn't matter how hard they're trying and how many reviews they do, the perception of a thing is often even more important than the results sometimes. And there was a, the perception was amazing for a couple of years, and then it started chipping away. And then you go, oh, are they actually winning enough series here and then and then it swung the other way but the the honesty would set them free i really do think that i think you've just you have to we we as fans have to have something to latch onto and get behind even if it's just a stark truth of rob key going i've i did not nail that but i'm gonna we're gonna go again and here's and here are three actual tangible things we're bringing in Matt Pryor.

27:13We're chatting to Alistair Cook. Here's a great fielding coach. Here's Trevor Penny. You know? Well, whatever you want to do. He did actually mention Troy Cooley, the bowling coach quite a lot. Like, this is the guy. He's going to solve it. Yeah, but I think you need some stuff to go, come on! You do need an off-air talisman as well as the Ben Stokes talisman. And you need the players to be coming out and being confident. and like where are they again we've said this many times but where are they are they gonna stand up are we gonna see them doing fun stuff on socials are we gonna get they're gonna try and gauge the fans are they gonna don't just stop talking like do some that's the thing that winds me up it's like this is supposed to be a laugh come on like don't get bogged down in the ashes so with that where do we go vish what what happens now do we just sit and wait and wait for 33 for 4 on the first morning at the Lord's test and then go f*** you again or what?

28:13What happens? I mean yeah I think so I mean yeah like Great see it Lord's Thanks very much let's get on with Matching's quiz

28:29There are a lot of like moving pieces at the moment there's obviously the hunt for a new national selector who Matching as someone well yeah whoever it may be i mean matching can bring the fun but whoever it may be will be seen as someone who has to come with answers they'll you know they'll have a little lot more leeway than i have answers anyone presently there but they but they all um you know they'll have an opportunity to to pick this team up actually and it's interesting like i've been speaking to a few people who are either had conversations about it or are interested about it and a lot of them are wondering basically what the role is in terms of like so what do we how do we you know what was our role within selection meetings what's the kind of scouting side of it would our opinion actually matter can we actually do something worthwhile and obviously with that comes the element of like reconnecting with the county game which is part of the selector role the easter weekend is when the county championship starts as you've said at the start greg we're all looking forward to that to get back to watching some actual cricket actual cricket that will now have a bit more meaning than it used to previously because they said they're going to go on county form and they're going to pay more attention to county players Do you think they will?

29:45We'll find out if that plays out No, probably not actually but you know they said it haven't they so that's something to hold against them

29:55Until they go no, no, no not this year's county championship next year's county championship but legitimately they could pick anyone and be like well you know we picked from the county championship like yeah he's technically in the county championship yes well done for picking him the IPL but he's been at the IPL for three months but he's technically part of the county championship so he was born in a county yeah uh a minor county but we should pick from the minor counties that's that that's quite basball to go what about the Hertfordshire opening batter? I thought about that. What do you make of Ben Duckett tapping out the IPL and going back to his county?

30:42Good question, Matt. Good decision. It cost him 200 grand, that. I think he'll be okay. But yeah, I think that is a good move for someone who obviously had a rubbish winter, sat on the sidelines for the World Cup. But also, people get irked by Duckett and like from his style of play to some of the things he says from to his grey carpet to his grey carpet to his social media to his living room there are a lot of reasons people take against Ben Duckett pouring a pint over Jimmy's head yeah provoked though wasn't he so Jimmy's never not provoking any of us yeah that's true actually but you just have to not pour a pint over his head never once pour a pint over his head he's provoked us more than anyone's ever provoked any of us and yet the pint glass has stayed upright.

31:32What would happen if one of us poured a pint over Jimmy's head? Dead. Oh my god. I don't even know. Immediate death. I would rather do that digitally here but just pour it over the computer and imagine it was Jimmy's head while I was looking at his face when in real life and just f*** my whole computer instead of doing that. Anyway, I'm actually sorry. By the way, Jimmy's in Spain. We haven't fallen out with him. He's in Spain doing pre-season. Having a laugh. Adi Flamenco. Yeah, I thought that interview was quite good with Ben Duckett. He kind of owned up to his mistakes. Well, not mistakes, but just said I've had a...

32:04He did what you said, Greg. He said, oh, I had a rubbish, ashes. I wanted to get better. It didn't. I'm going to try and put it right. That stuff sets you free, though. Yeah. It really does. Yes. Because if you're not hiding, and if they're not scratching around, making excuses and doing two slide PowerPoints, just be... That can set you free and will actually get you a lot more fans, I think. it will make people go oh they're humans and they've they're trying but it doesn't feel it sounds like they're just saying they're trying without actually doing anything yeah there's a difference between like saying you care and showing you you care but sometimes you can do both and i think duckett has done that and does that quite a lot like he obviously cares deeply about playing for england and like loves everything about it as he said in that interview with wilmer first and the telegraph he obviously took it too far not that he took it for granted but obviously with the noosa incident and i suppose like some of his prep leading into the ashes it wasn't ideal but you know i mean he's someone that i personally would persist with because he's shown how good he can be but again greg as you said like i almost feel like at the moment i'm working in politics rather than sport yeah yeah because of that you can't admit you've made a mistake overtly in case someone clips it up and it's you know on like a dad campaign for a rival party or people just hold it against you and people don't need that from their athletes do they like a bit of honesty makes you more relatable it does and also just a bit of passion to say how much you love playing cricket just just say that to be fair that's what you believe surely unless you don't believe that but they do believe surely they believe yeah stokes did say that didn't he yeah but we believe that about him we know that about him like we already know that ben stokes puts his body on the line every single day to play the sport that he loves and he's amazing at it but like everybody else do that tell us show us how much you love playing cricket and that it actually means something to you because then it will mean something to us because we'll want to come and pay and watch it yeah i was just thinking i just i think there's so much there's so much philosophically opposed stuff now isn't it where it's like almost like if you revert a certain way then it's a bit i told you so and all of this kind of thing so they're very cornered in that sense it's like if they were to say we got it wrong then they would there's probably a whole group of people they've got in their minds that would be sort of like sniggering at the back of the class type thing saying oh you know we've told you this all along and they're probably talking to them as well that powerpoint should have just been called you told us so and you were right yeah and slide one is you told us so and slide two is and you were right yeah yeah by the way i would quickly say i've really enjoyed the energy and the effort and the same key interviews i've had to do because obviously nasa and mike have had to be very clear that even though we all know they're friends and they all will be probably working together soon doing banter they have to they know they're going to be under pressure to hold rob key to account on a professional level and they've been very clear in their you know infinite professionalism to go hard in immediately and even through rob rob's like he's made a very slight joke when mike went after and went straight in with a question oh nice start and then oh yeah atherton said why did you keep how did you keep your job yeah i just went just went straight because he had and you could almost feel after and like it must have said before and wincing going like i'm gonna have to say all this to you here Rob type thing and then just like swimming that little lake in between you know what I mean they're all trying to work out the exact delivery and way so I mean it's a it is a minefield but I thought they all dealt with that well they all dealt with that well I don't think yeah um we're definitely not enjoying them not have a nice time but yeah it's just become uncomfortable to find it funny I would rather that Rob Key was having a great time to be clear I would rather we weren't talking about this but you do have to try and find some funny stuff somewhere because it is Do you think he's had time to think about my Tessa World Championship of late or do you think that's gone too far?

36:19I think at this point I think at this point you've got a great chance of that being funded Do you think so? Yeah, I think so Hello Rob, just circling back on us Hope you're well P.S. Don't listen to the latest episode of Tailenders I hope they do listen to tailenders This is all said with love Of course, I'm joking We take the piss obviously But you know, you have to talk about this stuff Because it's cathartic for us This is summer at its peak Whole Foods Market Summer Fruit Fest Is your invitation to eat the season Fresh, organic and bursting with flavour Start your day with peaches and organic blueberries and yoghurt Build a grazing board with fresh fruit, prosciutto and artisanal cheese.

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