Demystifying AI with Heather Murray: A Non-Techie's Guide

0:00Season three of the Built Right Podcast is right around the corner, but we've got one big change coming your way. The Built Right Podcast is now the Talking AI Podcast, and we've got a lot to talk about in AI. In the Talking AI Podcast, we'll be having in-depth conversations with both AI experts and early adopters of AI. That way you can understand how the technology works and how early adopters are beginning to implement and, more importantly, get value from AI. Our guests range from AI research scientists to founders of AI products to industry leaders putting AI to work in their business. While you're waiting for season three, go ahead and subscribe on your favorite podcast platform so you don't miss an episode.

0:41And make sure to leave us a comment about the AI topics that you want to hear about. So get ready to talk some AI in the new Talking AI Podcast, coming your way August 6th.

0:53Welcome to Built Right, a podcast by Hatchworks where we help you learn how to build the right digital product the right way. In this season, we're going all in on generative AI with guests ranging from international AI speakers, founders of Gen.AI products, experts in specific domains of Gen.AI, and leaders across industries. We're here to help you figure out how to take advantage of this new emerging technology so you can win in the market. So whether you're an AI techie or just AI curious, we got you covered. Let's get into it. Welcome, Built Right listeners. I am pumped for this discussion today with special guest Heather Murray, AI trainer, international AI speaker, and AI advisor.

1:34She's the leader of AI for non-techies, and she's even building this awesome brand around this movement. She's helping companies integrate AI into their business, helping them make sense of all the craziness going on in the world of AI right now. P.S., make sure you stick around to the end because we're going to get into some of Heather's awesome AI frameworks that you're not going to want to miss. We're going to do those live here on the podcast, but welcome to the show, Heather. Thank you very much for having me. I'm really excited to be here. Yeah, we've been chatting back and forth and this is one episode I've been looking forward to for a while, but to get us kicked off, how did you get into the world of AI?

2:15There's been so much craziness going on over the past couple of years. What kind of drove you into this world of AI? Is this part of your past life that you've kind of got into or have you really come into this as of late? Oh, well, first of all, I'm completely non-technical. So I don't know the first thing. And I'm not a first mover either. So I don't have the latest iPhones or the latest technology. So it's really strange that I found myself in the middle of this AI world. So about two years ago, so I run a marketing agency. And about two years ago, we started to, we found a tool, actually. and we started to use that in our client's lead generation work and we thought oh this is really exciting it was an AI tool it wasn't called an AI tool at the time yeah it turns out it used a lot of AI and that helped us sort of hyper personalize a really dig deep into the personalities of prospects and to cut a long story short it ended up in really really amazing results so two years ago is when I started to use AI properly and I think technically we've all been using AI for our entire lives really kind of all in the AI but within a business context that happened and then sort of fast forward a year and then chat GPT came out and I suddenly thought wow this is a seriously exciting opportunity I've been looking for ways to make our agency stand out somehow and I thought wow this we can be the AI first agency this AI driven and we can offer services around AI and just be you know right at right at the forefront of it if I put in enough effort and I think you really can learn a lot if you really put in a lot of time so literally from day one of finding ChatGPT I put in three hours a day every single day including Christmas day just learning about what is this thing what is this amazing thing and so just testing what ChatGPT could do playing around with things learning how to prompt listening to podcasts watching YouTubes there's so much I did and then just playing around just thinking well okay I used to be a copywriter so it's kind of what kind of copy can it can it build what else is out there and then I started to sort of share what I learned along the way so I always think that's a really good uh way to to learn anything is to share and to teach what you've just learned because it keeps you on your toes um and then people start to expect a certain level so yeah I've got into it through just wanting to differentiate um our agency and starting to see the results and it just made me incredibly excited and it's so cool to watch your journey from you mentioned kind of finding this AI tool that really sparked this for you to now you're putting out amazing content.

4:52Like you really are kind of an expert in this space. But so much has changed in the past you related to AI, like we're talking about. And there's literally been this explosion of innovation, disruption, questions, all the things. And I'm sure like your story's not unfamiliar. There's a lot of people that are jumping into this new, there's this almost this democratization of AI movement going on. So why do you think that is? And what's the potential of it as it starts to advance very quickly? Yeah, well, I think first of all, this is, you know, we've had AI since, I think it was 1956 was when they coined the term artificial intelligence.

5:36So actually, it's been around for decades. And, you know, there's this thing, the Turing test, even before that in the 50s early 50s um and the first chatbot was 66 as well so this is nothing new but what has changed with chat gpt is our ability to access it so up until now you have to be a technical type to to understand how to use ai it just wasn't user-friendly chat gpt created uh the ability to speak with it like you would a friend um and just speak conversationally with it and get things back and that's what changed and that's why I think so many people are going oh my god I don't have to go on a really long course or I don't have to learn a new skill set to be able to use all these tools which we've never really had before there's usually a much steeper learning curve to pick these things up particularly things that produce these you know building all sorts of things yourself you know I can now build a GPT that is crazy with no technical knowledge quick break in the pod if you're listening to this podcast chances are you've been thinking about how to actually use AI inside your business.

6:38And that's exactly why we built the AI Opportunity Finder. It's a free tool that helps you uncover high impact, tailored AI use cases based on your business, your goals, your pain points, and your industry. No fluff, no generic use cases, just real ideas that fit your business and they're ranked by ROI potential. It takes about three minutes to run and it's like having your own personal AI strategist for free. If you wanna try it for free, check out the link in the show notes or go to hatchworks.com backslash ai-opportunity-finder. But yeah, I think the fact that we can now access this, I think somebody was talking about creating a billion developers.

7:18We're all becoming developers now. It's going to create this world of people personalizing and customizing their own businesses in a way that they couldn't do before. And they just find that, I always say the word exciting all the time, So really do find it exciting. We've been so limited before, but now we can build anything we want without knowing all this stuff. So how thrilling is that? It's insane. So we were leading a training yesterday at our company Hatchworks. It was that same kind of thing. So many people, I feel like in this latest movement, they get stuck in chat, chat, QBT of, okay, I got it to write an email for me or I got it to write a social post.

8:00And then that's kind of the extent. there it's you know that was cool but what we were going through was actually having it create code we we even got to the point where we were having it act as a data scientist doing a technique called k-means clustering it was insane like this stuff used to take weeks months to develop in literally matter of seconds it's spitting out the analysis so it's it's just insane this this advancement And the craziest part to me is how early on we are in this journey. Where do you see this going? I mean, really, it's the past couple of years since really chat GBT was almost that inflection point.

8:41How quick do you see this movement moving compared to other transformations, you know, the internet, cloud, mobile? What's kind of your hot take around that? I think it's going to be the speed. I don't know whether it's because I'm not usually, as I was saying, I'm not an early adopter. Normally, I'm not in that innovative part of the technology adoption curve. So I'm not usually privy to this bit. So to me, it's moving really, really quickly. And it's, you know, the rate of innovation is absolutely insane. So, you know, you get used to a tool and two weeks later, it's almost unrecognizable. And people are taking, look at OpenAI with ChatGPT.

9:21How quickly do they respond to feedback? So I don't know whether they just had an amazing version ready and they've been releasing it in basic levels. They're going, oh, look, we've fixed this. They knew it would be a problem in the first place. Maybe they're doing that. I don't know. But I see this moving faster than any of that. The only problem is, I think like any new technology, there's this huge amount of resistance to it as well. And people are scared. They're linking it with the idea of the robots are coming and, you know, everything's going to change. And, you know, it may well be. and so there's a lot of resistance and a lot of anger and a lot of fear around it so I think that's going to slow it down in its integration.

9:59I think the PIs speak to a lot of rooms of people and most people are cynical or dubious or scared. It all stems from fear I think and just thinking what is this thing and why is it affecting everything we do and why is everybody talking about it i was in a a taxi yesterday and a really you know local radio station that usually plays pop music was talking about ai and i was like wow wow yeah this is a very unusual thing we see on morning breakfast shows are usually quite you know they're just talking about you know generic things but it's everywhere so people are starting to go oh yeah it's it's i think very very quickly if people are willing to accept it and embrace it yeah that's when you know the hype cycle is reaching peak mode right there when you're seeing it permeate everything in our culture but i want to go back to one point you mentioned like there is a lot of fear doubts uncertainty which is like a natural human emotion with anything that happens but you you talk to a lot of people you lead a lot of big trainings like what what is that proportion do you feel is it like a 50 50 thing is it 80 20 How do you feel it kind of splits there where people are gung-ho, super excited, they want to get into it versus like, I don't know about this, kind of that point you're mentioning there.

11:20Yeah, I think I can only speak from my bubble. So obviously on LinkedIn, there's going to be people following me who have generally a positive sentiment towards it. I still have a lot of people in my inbox, you know, getting it all out and sending me angry messages. I had a guy threatening me the other day you know people get really they think I'm not AI I'm not even a it's really strange I'm not even a totally 100 % pro AI person I just find it very interesting in some things it can do I'm not in any way advocating that you use it for everything or that you replace people with it or anything like that I'm showing my curiosity I'm not like everyone should use AI I'm more like here's how I'm using it if anybody else wants to do the same like here you go that's my stance um but and again there's a skew in the room when i'm training people in ai because they've been you know they've all wanted to be there but i think probably the best representation is corporate training when somebody has decided that a room full of people should be there and i'm speaking to them and that's when you're going to do this yeah yeah that's it i'd probably say 30 percent of people are in the heavily cynical or angry phase and i think that they both fit together as i say both stems from fear of hang on a second am i gonna lose my job in embracing this, am I going to make myself redundant?

12:35Which is, you know, a really good point. They're seeing, they're thinking, right, if you can do, we have a team of five, if suddenly AI is going to take away two of those, is that one of those people going to be me? So I think there are a lot of people who are maybe coasters, who there's a lot of consultants, and I don't mean to become consultants, but people that have been providing quite a low-level service for a while, and they're worried. And I think that those are the people that should be worried. You know, if you're not providing a cutting edge, top notch service, it's really insightful and really at the top of its game, then you should be worried because AI can come in and start to kind of mop up that sort of stuff.

13:15And they're the jobs that might be displaced, I think. Yeah, I always think it's the repetitive, mundane, sometimes boring. Like those are the ones that are the ripest for, you know, taking over. but you mentioned a critical point we're hitting on some like deeper topics here but you know that is a real thing we hear a lot of is ai going to take my job it's a real concern right because if you start seeing these tools starting to do the some of the things you do uh but what's what's your view there do you feel like it is going to be displacing jobs or i've also heard theories where it's going to create completely new jobs and roles we never knew that even existed there's this big you know point here where it could change how we work as a society in some ways if it really does continue to advance but any any thoughts there just from what you've seen so far um jobs society like kind of those deeper meatier topics yeah i think it will um i think AI amplifies talent I don't think it replaces it so I think some people that are getting it wrong say you're starting a new business and you think I don't need a copywriter because I'll use AI for it I don't need someone to build this because I'm going to build it myself using AI I'm going to get an agent to build it for me those people are not are not using it in the in the right way people that say right okay I'm going to use a talented copywriter and I'm going to increase their output and potentially the depth of their work using AI.

14:53Because that's another big thing, and we're going all over the place of the way I always am, but a lot of people think AI as a time saver. Actually, for us, it's been a service deepener. We're able to provide something better because we can access information that we couldn't before. So it's not actually saving any time, but we're able to create much better results from understanding people in a way that we couldn't or we didn't have access to before without having a huge budget a team of researchers um so yeah i think it's it's really sure i kind of use the analogy of you know um you you can you can learn to cut your own hair if you're watching a few youtube videos but there's going to be as good as going from an actual hairdresser and having it done in the salon so you know you might even be get really good at it yourself but i feel like there's always going to be that expert thing i think what the ai is acting as the youtube there is when it's helping you get further than you ever could before on your own there's still not going to be you know like people are building things but you guys build stuff it's going to be 10 times but you you're always going to be staying ahead of the curve whereas ai is always going to be a little bit behind if that makes sense yeah like in our training yesterday we did kind of a immersive workshop where we were building gpts and one of our architects built a gpt that effectively takes in the questions from the client and it builds the architecture recommends the architecture and provides the diagram and that allows him to actually do more of the deeper work right he's more of the advisor to the ai i guess the ai is not going to get it right every time but i took some notes it's the amplifies your business there was the the point around uh it's almost like the youtube there were several points that were just really good there that i that i liked that i have not heard uh referred to before but i did see i don't know if you saw this the uh the tesla robots I forget what they're calling, but I saw them folding sheets.

16:49Yeah. So they're folding sheets now. So you wonder, I don't know if I would let one cut my hair. That may be a little scary with scissors in hand. Yeah. But I saw somebody say the biggest test is going to be, can they fold a fitted sheet? That'll be the ultimate test. If the robots have the correct dexterity, then we're done. I'll get one straight. Yeah, exactly. Exactly. So one point you mentioned earlier, it kind of stuck out to me. I took a note around this. You mentioned you're not an early adopter to this. And I would challenge you there. I think you are very much an early adopter in this new wave.

17:26Like you mentioned AI has been around for a very long time. But I think that point stops a lot of people because they do feel like, oh, I'm already behind everything that's going on. Like I'm already too far behind. But whenever I hear that, I'd say you've never been so close to a new wave. to a starting line of a major transformation than right now. Because you only get a couple of these in your lifetime, right? I think that's the point. People feel like they're already too far behind. And you may be a little behind, but it's months, not years, compared to other crazy advancements we've been through in the past.

18:04100%. I think almost every single call I have around AI starts with, And it's from big enterprise companies to solopreneurs. They all start with, I'm so behind. I realize I'm so behind everyone else, but we want to do this. But I think the fact that you're on this call now puts you ahead of 99 % of people. Certainly enterprises, you know, enterprises, the bigger the company, the more behind they are. That's what I'm noticing. They haven't even begun the forms to fill in, to see if they could use ChatGPT within the workplace. and that itself would take six months to go through and be authorized.

18:41Whereas the little businesses are like, okay, this afternoon, shall we check out ChatGPT and see what it can do for us? That's amazing, the power of those small businesses over the big businesses, which is why I've chosen, I've chosen in particular to work with small businesses because we can do so much more together. Yeah, that's awesome. And I want to get into that topic now. And after this, we're going to get deep into the tactical, get into some of your frameworks that are really cool. But you mentioned that. You've done trainings and engagements with very large Fortune 10, 100 companies and also the small SMBs.

19:17Who do you think is going to win in this new age? How are the SMBs going to be able to adapt to this technology versus your very large enterprises? What are you starting to notice out in the wild with how they're reacting to this technology, how they're starting to engage with it, utilize it? So I'm noticing, as I was saying, that the bigger companies are much further behind. Bigger companies need to sort out their red tape. They need to be open to innovation and be able to loosen their processes in order to stay ahead. So there's big enterprise sasses going for, big enterprise companies um and they're both really really slow so what they end up with is something that's six months old and six months old in ai terms is is just dead you know the technology they use is that it's that you can't be six months behind you have to i think they'll have to start embracing and taking risks um big big businesses um they tend to be so risk averse and they'll go through the whole procurement process and i think they're going to have to loosen all of that um in order to stay ahead there really are um and then there's small businesses i think you could just i mean i've got i'll go through that mindset thing um afterwards but i've got a framework around you can just go straight into it you can say right okay what data do we have how are we going to because that's the best starting point ever is looking at what data you've got because you know you were saying about um chat gpt and the likes of that being people start off going can you write me a post or can you write me a blog and actually content creation I believe is is ChatGPT's absolute weak spot it's so much better at everything everything else and if you don't realize there isn't everything else it's not a content creation platform it's a it's a can be a business strategist it could be a like you say a data analyzer it can build code it can it can help you um drive sort of insight driven decisions for the first time without having to have a data guy you know it's that is exciting so starting with your data is really, really important.

21:29I think a lot of the small businesses I work with ask me that question as well. They say, I'm really behind. How do I start? So I always say, just starting with one thing and just trying to integrate that is a really good place to start. It's where I started and it worked really well. Yeah, I love that. And I think any small business that feels like, this is one of those David and Goliath moments where you're empowered with the slingshot, right that's your that's that's gen ai right now uh i've also seen with the big companies you mentioned the red tape i see a lot of okay we got to go get our gen ai expert which a lot of those don't really exist yet right you're you're head of gen ai yeah it's it's a new thing yeah i'm just sorry i've met so many heads of ai that know nothing they're coming to me going I'm head of AI.

22:17What is this chat GPT thing? Oh my God, you're head of AI. Yeah. I've seen that too. It's because, you know, to your point, AI has been around for a long time, but this whole advancement with transformers, LLMs, empowering things like chat GPT, it's, it's new and emergent. And then I also see, okay, we got to get this big committee around it and we're going to put our policies around it. And they haven't even started testing the thing. So go test some use cases, go do some things with it before you even start to think about policy or all the negative things that could happen. Because there is a risk averse nature when you are a large enterprise.

22:56I understand that, but it's going to be those that really look to adapt and take risks that are still going to be around, you know, 20, 30 years from now. Yeah. And speak to your people as well, particularly as enterprises. You were saying about that 30 % maybe of people that are really scared. In an enterprise, that's probably higher because there's a lot more people and in an enterprise, you can kind of hide. You're not, I always think, you know, in a business, it's laid bare. If you're not good at your job, it's really obvious. But I've worked in massive companies and there's plenty of people hiding in teams that have got away with doing very little for a really long time.

23:33And it's just not spotted and that's going to really affect people. And so I think chatting, talking to employees and just saying, look, how are you all feeling about AI? Do you know what it is? You know, we're all seeing it. So there's a couple of us, I did a motivational talk for an aerospace company recently and they're really forward thinking, a European big company. And they just wanted me to talk to their employees. There's like 300 employees on the call and just say, look, this is what AI actually is. This is what ChatGPT is. This is what it looks like. It's nothing to be scared of. And these are some of the things you can do with it.

24:07and nothing practical just purely an introduction to it and that went down really well and then off the back of that there was groups of people that then wanted to do prompt engineering more you know sort of introductions to prompt engineering so you know maybe 30 people out of that 300 were like let's maybe have a little look so I think that enterprises should be starting with that yeah that introductory piece and just say we're not ignoring this let's all talk about what it actually is I think if you can do that you're going to be that's the way for enterprises to start definitely and in a smaller way small businesses as well yeah totally agree all right so now let's get into the tactical more fun uh pieces here so there's two different things the ai maturity matrix and the optimization mindset and we're actually going to pull these up on the screen and heather's going to talk through it so for anybody listening just on audio the podcast we will be very descriptive and walk walk through these things uh but yeah which one makes the most sense to start with here?

25:04I think starting with the AI maturity matrix here. So I will try to be descriptive as well if I'm not, you'll have to pull me up. So this is a matrix. It's designed as just a starting point really to look at where am I? And then see what, you know, what businesses are saying I'm really behind, but this actually helps you understand, are you really that far behind and which areas you need to work on? So I've split it down the side into the four things I think are really, really important. And we've covered quite a lot of this today already and what we've been speaking about, but data. So what data do you have already and what state is that data in?

25:41So you want to be making insight-driven decisions, you're going to need those insights to start off with. Technology. So how into technology are you? You know, what are you looking at when it comes to these AI tools and what facilities do you have? People, which we've just spoken about, how are they feeling about things? You know, how aware are they? um is there any interest and then process as well so what you know what process have you sort have you sorted out you know do you have that ai task force do you have a way to um test tools out properly so we for example have a little just a google sheet it's always an mbp version um a google sheet and we just have um ditch trial or later so we try something out looks like it It won't be promising in six months.

26:27Again, like AI terms, huge amount of time. We'll look at it later. If it looks like it's not very good and it's not been well thought out, we'll ditch it. And if we love it, we'll trial it. And we just end up with this list. And I think that is just something as simple as that as a really good place to start process-wise. So along the top, so it's a matrix, it's a grid. So we've got data, technology, people and process down the side. And then along the top, we've got the different levels. so that level of awareness which is where you start off you go through into exploration preparation implementation and then finally optimization when you have got organs firing and you are really ready for AI so it'll really mature in the world of AI so you know for data with the awareness so at one side if you're not very not very into your data you might have limited data collection which I think is a lot of people so you have you know you've got your social data you've got your website data you've got data all over the place but if you do look at it it's manual so you'll pop onto linkedin and have a look at how your posts are doing for example something a lot of small businesses do on the other side of things you've got continuous data analysis and you've got ongoing refinements and it's all structured and clean and beautiful and you might have a data warehouse and everything's looking fantastic um for technology on one side on the on the far left we've got you've got very basic it but then on the other extreme if you're really into it optimization you've got regular updates with your technology and you're scaling your ai you're not only using it you're really scaling the use of it um for people um on one side you've got limited ai awareness so we just spoke about having those introductory chats with people what actually is ai because i did a um a event this this week a couple of couple of days ago in London and a lot of people just don't actually know what AI is they think AI is robots is it or what what is actually AI what and what does chat GPT mean and all that sort of stuff and then on the other side of that you've got a culture of learning and AI adaptation so you've got this everybody's really embracing the kind of knowing and that's it's not ever having learned it because it's constantly changing it's that culture of learning and then adapting AI for your own needs that customizing it and then last one we've got process so everything's very manual you're not making decisions based on data which is a lot of small businesses they go ah I'm going to decide to do this and why oh we just have a feel for it our competitors are doing it um on the other side you know optimization in process you've got continual optimization and all of your AI insights are integrated so not just your data you've got your insights from it It's a whole other level.

29:05So you just kind of use this as a matrix to kind of think, right, where am I in data, in tech, in people and process? And what do I need to be working on? So I used it for my own business and thought, actually, you know, my people are really, really good, but actually data-wise, we are really not strong. So I think we need to work on harmonizing our data and actually put somebody to work on that so that we can get better and kind of become more of an optimizer. No, this is great. Such a good kind of foundational roadmap litmus test. And for those listening, it's almost like this matrix heat map.

29:36It's like as you move to the right, you're getting hotter and hotter, more dangerous. But no, this is great. And I think the point that's interesting is you're going to be at different parts in your journey related to those things of data, technology, people, process. And it's great to kind of have an idea of, okay, where do we stand and where do we need to improve? And I love that you have data kind of at the foundation because, you know, there's the whole saying that data is the new oil. I don't think that's ever been more true than right now because the ability to differentiate, build a note around something is going to be so much harder.

30:12But what is going to be truly unique and differentiating is going to be your data, your IP, things that are unique to your organization. right 100 and when you even things like you know when we're talking about content creation if you have data on your yourself your own data so how you write so you ai can sound like you if you train it with enough data and the data in that case would be really good reports that you've written like this you know your amazing report an amazing article or amazing email and an amazing linkedin post you've got enough of those enough data that's structured nicely feed it into let's say a custom gpt you're gonna it's gonna start sounding like you so you're gonna get better results so that's what you need data is everything really there's so much of it that people you know i've had i've heard people say i haven't got any data you really it's everywhere yeah yeah there's so many cool tools i was playing with heygen the other day where you kind of upload a video and then you can feed in a script and it creates this ai generated video of yourself it's kind of creepy but you just start to think about okay that that tool is really cool this one's really cool but these things are going to start to integrate together and that's where it's going to be really insane you know where it starts to really take off well with hey jen imagine so the data you're going on how you look and how you talk that's one set and then you've got you know your your dream prospects you know you can delve really deeply into who they are their pains their motivations their objections put that those two things together you've got the most amazing outreach video ever that's just for them and specifically for that person not just for their job title it's incredible so here's here's a crazy idea and i don't think it's possible right now but we should put this on the what is it the later the later list so we should do a hey gen of each of us right hook it up the chat gpt we'll create a gpt of like okay this is this is how matt sounds and what he talks about and here's how heather sounds and then we'll put our two ai agents on a pod together let's just let them talk and see where it goes that would be an interesting experiment down the road yeah that sounds really good and then we put it out there and see if anybody can tell yeah yeah well yeah no i've got so many ideas for things like that but i think actually that's that will happen next the ability for them to automatically talk to each other um and that yeah that'll be that'll be creepy as hell to watch but that idea of like i feel like a lot of times we think of humans interacting with ai like a chat gpt but what happens when you have these agents and then the agents are interacting with other agents interacting with other agents it creates this whole new level that i i am just now like starting to think about and then you kind of go down this rabbit hole of like what's possible then you know yeah so i mean it's already there with auto gpt isn't it those autonomous agents um got and even you know there's a i always say to people there's a version called god mode that you can just play around with give it a problem it comes up with the solution and implements it for you there's none of this iterative prompt engineering needed it just sorts it out for you i want leads it'll work out how to get leads you know it's that's the next step but that's i think a little bit too far from where it's working yeah we need we need a little progression to get there but to your point that it's it's happening like the auto gpts and anybody that's not familiar with that go go do a google or or chat gpt go talk to chat gpt they'll give you some details uh all right so this is awesome the ai maturity matrix what about the optimization mindset yeah so that is this next one here so So this is, as I said before, a lot of small businesses come to me and say, where do I start?

34:01So I built this framework and it takes into account all the steps we've already spoken about, but in order. So it starts off with AI readiness. So have a look at the data. So we've just been talking about data. So these kind of the two things work together, but how much data do you have? What types have you got? And what is the quality of that data? How relevant is it? How accurate is it? And again, that cleaning an organization is a really good point. Even if you just put everything into one sheet, a Google sheet, we're not talking about working with a data company and spending$10 ,000. It's something you can just put, you know, there are dashboards.

34:38There's so many things you can use that are really user-friendly. Everything I do is from a non-technical mindset. I was always speaking to other people that aren't technical and they don't want to be technical. And then AI vision. So what is your goal for using AI? Don't use AI for AI's sake. you know what's it going to help you with so a lot of people they want more landing page traffic or they want to improve the quality of that or they want to generate leads or they want to just improve the brand image or what I'm always thinking from a marketer I'm a marketer but there's so many things it can help you with do you want to kind of increase the your staff retention rates by making them really happy and giving them access to a GPT that answers all their questions straight away instead of having to wait for you particularly or improve your onboarding there's so many things so what do you want what is your goal for for um using ai what would you like to what how is it going to tie into your business goals then um market scan and testing these two things kind of link in but market scan having a look at what's available to solve your pain so i think that's something that's a little difficult at the moment because there's a few um areas There's a few websites that will help you find AI tools, but they're not reviewed.

35:52So it's a bit of an overload at the moment. So you can find a thousand tools that will do one thing, but half of them will be dead by now. Another kind of quarter won't work. And then that final quarter, it takes a long time to go through them. So I think there's a real market for verified reviews. I think that would be really useful. Something I wanted to do, but I just, yeah, so many other projects on the go, I don't have time. So somebody please do it. And then testing. so rigorous testing of the tools are available so when you find them just try and you know use them properly like push them push their boundaries because a lot of these tools are still in beta mode and they're brand new and they've gone to market really really quickly so they have holes so you know these aren't flawless perfect things yet and that's again something that's quite new for us we think if a product's out it is finished and complete and these often aren't so properly testing them and then stakeholders what we're saying that change management piece with all of your stakeholders so not just your employees but the board your co-founders you know talking to everybody your suppliers you know how do you feel about us using our clients how are you feeling about ai you know if we started to use it like how the transparency piece is if you're using ai do you have to disclose it which is the whole other topic and then training so expert training to facilitate that change so bring in people and educate people as you go it's really important and deployment so that I think the key word here is gradually so gradually introduce AI into everyday operations not everything all at once don't just suddenly go right we're going to become an AI company this is amazing just go right we're going to try this one thing so for my business it was using a tool called Sybil just sits on my calls and records them gives us really good transcripts we can then use to create all sorts of different things content and all sorts um so So that gradual deployment.

37:39And then, of course, like anything else, a review. So monitoring the impact properly. Reviewing that data, so right back up to the top. Analyzing bias, very, very important because, you know, all of these tools have been trained on data, human data. So therefore, it's inherited human bias. So you need to have a layer that will analyze, are we going into a biased way here? Because we're not generating, we're not working in the normal way. We're working in a new way that has a heavy bias. and then always that continuous improvement. So this is, yeah, just as I say, a very high-level framework for people to go, okay, so I'll start to work through this and I'll start to actually integrate it into my business.

38:20It's great to have this framed up. I'm thinking for us at Hatchworks, I'm like, yeah, okay, we are on the right path. We're hitting some of these points. We've developed our generative-driven development approach, right? So we basically ingrate Gen.AI into everything we do related to design development and testing and deployment and the other piece that ties into this framework is the training piece so we're doing a few things here you know we have our ai champion so it's kind of a small group that are already really into the evangelist you know so they're they're helping really go deep in learning they're educating our other hatchers uh and they're really a part of kind of pushing the the momentum along right so this this framework's really great you put this um along with the uh the other one we just reviewed the the ai maturity matrix and you have a nice starting point of okay where do i focus and how do i get started right yeah yeah that's exactly and that's and it was just giving something instead of just saying oh this is it's giving people something to actually use and that's what i'm all about so just being helpful and practical um and just go right here you go do this and you'll actually get further instead of here's a and something i see on linkedin all the time and it's just it really grinds my gears is here's a thousand a list of a thousand tools i don't think that's useful to anybody and again have you personally gone through all of those why are you recommending these tools of course they have yeah it drives me drives me crackers no they've they've cracked it i love that no they've probably done a chat gpt give me a thousand tools popped it into a thing and i'm sure all of us everybody listening has probably seen those downloaded them but how many people have actually gone through it because there's too many you can't like can't comprehend it right so yeah and it's the most popular content i think people go oh the more the more i have kind of downloaded the more i'm going to understand it but actually the people i far prefer content when they say here's one tool and here's all the things that I do with it and here's me using it and this is the ROI that's so much more useful than a thousand tools or I think the number's just going off I've seen lists of five thousand tools or cheat sheets with everything just crammed on and it's not practically useful um so yeah yeah all right now I want to wrap with this a couple rapid fire questions uh so I'm going to hit you with a question first thing that comes to mind so what gen ai tool or technology are you most excited about right now it could be one you use a lot or something that is lesser known like which which one kind of is exciting you right now um too many too many to think you linker human link is most exciting to me um okay because even like you're yeah it generates sales playbooks um by um analyzing so high ticket leads it analyzes content breadcrumbs and comes up with these amazing sales playbooks that's what i'm most excited about that's cool i like that okay who's who's your favorite person to follow in the ai sphere right now oh isabella bedoya hands down i think she's amazing so she is so different to everyone else but she i've spent time with her and she's a genius like she's she's great um but she really does build and try everything that she recommends um there's no gloss that that she just is super useful and yeah really good person to speak to love that and where can you find her linkedin i'm assuming linkedin i think i'm only on linkedin myself so i don't see where everybody else is i think she's on twitter as well yeah nice and last question uh one what's one thing you wish you could go back in time and tell yourself before you get started whether it's before ai or further back into your your past what's what's one thing that you would go back and tell yourself um i think i'm sticking with ai i think i did what everybody else did and just tried so many tools i've just got had this shiny thing syndrome oh that's exciting that's exciting i never actually properly properly tested things i would just try one i've said i keep on saying it but just go with one and you get so much further than if you try and do 10 at a time and try to resist all those brand new tools that you see on the email newsletters the ai newsletters you think oh that sounds great that sounds great that sounds great try to just focus on one one problem and one tool to solve it if you can yeah shiny new object syndrome is good advice for for anything in life i feel like all right so awesome heather having you on really great discussion i really enjoyed it but where where can people find you uh we'll put some of these frameworks in the notes but where can they go find you find these frameworks get engaged with you i know you do a lot of training and education as well.

43:05Yeah. So the best place to find me is LinkedIn. I'm on there all the time with all these sorts of frameworks, with just anything I find new, new, interesting tools. I don't do any sponsored posts so you can trust that the things I'm talking about are just purely from my experience. So yeah, LinkedIn. And then I'm soon to launch non-techies.ai. It's not there yet, but it's soon going to be there. And that's going to be an affordable, accessible membership site that's just going to be full of really interesting stuff. So webinars, business toolkits, mini courses, everything. And it's all, yeah, for a flat rate around about$20 a month.

43:39That's perfect. It's right. It's our topic of democratization of AI, AI for non-techies. Everybody can access this technology and take advantage of it. Well, awesome, Heather. Thank you for being on the podcast. My pleasure. Thank you very much, Matt. That's great.