Three mothers who shaped American history

0:00This message comes from ID Tech. ID Tech is where kids 7 to 17 find their people. The Camp Crunch Labs IRL, BattleBots, and Game Design people. Visit IDTech.com and use code IDTech to save$150. This is the TED Radio Hour. Each week, groundbreaking TED Talks. Our job now is to dream big. Delivered at TED conferences. To bring about the future we want to see. Around the world. To understand who we are. From those talks, we bring you speakers and ideas that will surprise you. You just don't know what you're going to find. Challenge you. We truly have to ask ourselves, like, why is it noteworthy? And even change you.

0:41I literally feel like I'm a different person. Yes. Do you feel that way? Ideas worth spreading. From TED and NPR. I'm Manoush Zomorodi. On the show today, one of my favorite conversations with sociologist and author Anna Maleka Tubbs. Last year, she released her bestseller, Erased, where she examines why women's contributions to American history have been erased. I interviewed her back in 2022 about her first book, which is called The Three Mothers. It seems to me that the only thing that the mother can do, the Negro mother, is to try from the beginning to instill in the child a sense of somebodiness.

1:30You may recognize this as the voice of Martin Luther King Jr. This was what my mother tried to do. She made it very clear that in spite of these conditions, you are as good as anybody else and you must not feel that you are not. In this clip from a 1961 interview, he's talking about one of the most influential people in his life, his mother, Alberta King. But most of us know little about her or have even heard of her. Yeah, it reminds me of the many different times actually that MLK Jr. gave credit to his mother, but that scholars and journalists often ignored. and where he really believed that she was one of his primary inspirations in understanding, you know, the history of slavery, the history of the Civil War, the history of people telling Black people that they were not worthy of their humanity.

2:37Anna spent years researching these three mothers, Alberta King, Louise Little, and Bertis Baldwin. Women who shaped American history, yet whose stories are seldom told.

2:50Anna Malaika Tubbs:Every year, around January 15th, the world rightfully celebrates the birth of the great Martin Luther King Jr. Here's Anamalika Tubbs on the TED stage. Yet virtually no one has stopped to consider who else was in that room that day in 1929. As if, somehow, MLK Jr. birthed himself. I toured the location where he was born, a charming, quaint, two-story home in Atlanta. And while it was an honor to even be there, I left feeling frustrated by the tour guide's script. Of course, MLK Jr. was the center of most of the tales, and then came stories about his father, the inspiring Reverend Martin Luther King Sr.

3:39Anna Malaika Tubbs:But what frustrated me was the lack of attention being paid to his mother, Alberta Christine Williams King, even though this was actually her childhood home first and the home where she later birthed her children in a room on the second floor. The thing is that she's been erased and despite the fact that she was so clearly influential in her son's journey, we have kept her from our shared knowledge and understanding because she doesn't fit this more patriarchal notion of who the heroes and the leaders of our stories are. And therefore, she's been swept under the rug. But it's time that we correct that.

4:22It's time that we give her her due and we celebrate her influence, not only on her son, but on our entire world. So Ana, we're dedicating this hour to hearing the previously untold stories of these three women. But first, I have to ask, why did you choose to spend so much time researching the mothers of MLK Jr., Malcolm X., and James Baldwin? Because I'm guessing there are many other mothers you could have chosen to focus on. Yeah, it was really a narrowing down process. I started with a really large idea. I was inspired by Margo Lee Shutterly's Hidden Figures. I loved, loved, loved her work. But I was really angered by the work because it was the first time I was hearing these women's names that she'd researched.

5:08And so I said, I'm going to be somebody who finds other hidden figures, other people who have intentionally been erased from our history. And I knew I was going to talk about black women. And then I thought about the fact that my mother always spoke to me about the importance of mothers in every society. She was a lawyer. She advocated for women's rights, both in the US as well as abroad. And so I thought, okay, I'm going to talk about mothers because they're being overlooked. They're not being celebrated in the way that they deserve to be. I thought about the civil rights movement because we so often come back to it in our policy discussions, but we also speak about it from a pretty male perspective.

5:44It's a lot harder for us to name anyone else other than male leaders in the civil rights movement. And so I said, I'm going to play on that patriarchy. I knew strategically if it had some more of these famous names, more people would walk away knowing three Black women's stories. Well, that sounds like a lovely goal. So let's get to know these women, starting with Alberta King. Tell us about her, where she came from, and what her early life was like. Alberta King, well, Alberta Williams originally was born in Atlanta, Georgia in 1903. And she She was born to the leaders of Ebenezer Baptist Church.

6:24So her parents established this church. And they believe that Christian faith should always be intertwined with social justice. And so this is what she's raised to believe. She participates in marches at an early age. She participates in boycotts. Her and her parents are some of the very, very first members of the NAACP. and she believes that she can use her education. She has this privilege of an education to advance freedom causes forward for her entire community. So she gains a bachelor's degree and a teaching certificate and she has a dream of becoming an educator in the Atlanta public school system.

7:06So she's well educated. She is well aware of the role protest plays in hopefully getting rights for Black people. but she doesn't end up having a career. No. Yeah. At the time, there was a law, it was called the marriage bar, that stated that if women decided to get married and in turn start a family, that they could not work outside of their home. And so when Alberta falls in love with a man by the name of Michael King, originally, who later will change his name to Martin Luther King, she really has to make the decision whether or not she's going to start a family and walk away from her career or continue to pursue the journey that she's been educated for.

7:52And she decides to have a family. As we know, she decides to have a family. She decides to get married and have children. But this isn't really the end of her teaching. The word that I would use to describe her is balance. She's both encouraging of them and very loving of her children. When they are scared or confused, they come to her and she sits with them and holds them tightly and says, you know, you are worthy of love. You're worthy of dignity. But she's also very stern. They had very serious rules in their household. They had a schedule and a routine that they followed every single day. They went to school.

8:29They came back. They sat down at the table. They read the Bible. They did their homework. They ate dinner together. So she was also clear that they would follow her rules while balancing that with that love and that warmth. And never is she saying you need to go out and become a famous leader. But instead, she's telling them that we as Christians believe equity and justice are possible on this earth and that this is what God's vision is. And so she's telling them how you do that, that you can achieve justice and equality. And your role is to try to do that here. We've heard people in the past say that Martin Luther King Jr.

9:11got his oratory skills from his dad. But what do you think he got from his mom? Is there something? I don't know. When you watch him in videos, when you see him giving speeches, what does it make you think about Alberta? everything about alberta and everything about mlk make me think of the other um and i have to say yeah when i was doing the research i wasn't even trying to make these direct comparisons of you know because alberta did this mlk did this but then it became unavoidable it was so clear that this was her son she believed in marches she believed in boycotts she everything we celebrate him for, she was his closest confidant.

9:58He called her almost every day to check in with her when he wasn't with her. When he was with her, he would sit with her and try to talk about what was happening in the world and in his direct community and moments where he's experiencing racism. He would go to Alberta because he felt like she understood him better than anyone else. Of course, this academic that he is, this is directly after Alberta. And it's not to say that his father didn't also inspire him, but it is almost as if they are the same person, Alberta and MLK, if you read their descriptions and their degrees and their passions and their upbringing.

10:41One thing you do say, though, is that as her son got more and more famous, she really worried about him. She worried about his safety a lot. Yes. Yes, she was. She was always concerned, even to a point where she was on bed rest at one point. She was so worried it was taking a physical toll on her. And this is a reminder to us that MLK Jr. was a person, a human being. This was her son. You know, he wasn't this deity. He wasn't just a character in our history. He was a human being. And he was risking his life for the work that he was trying to bring to life and trying to use to help all of us. But this wasn't something that was easily done.

11:27And when you see it from the perspective of his mother, you can really fully appreciate his humanity and his own fragility. I have a dream. That my four little children will one day live in a nation where they will not be judged by the color of their skin, but by the content of their character. I have a dream today. On August 28, 1963, Alberta and her family watched Martin Luther King Jr. deliver the I Have a Dream speech on television. And here's Anna reading a passage from her book. Free at last, free at last. Thank God Almighty, we are free at last. These were the teachings with which Alberta had raised her son.

12:16Martin's family sat in silence as pride welled in their hearts and tears welled in Alberta's eyes. They knew this speech would go down as one of the most powerful in history. Their quiet astonishment was suddenly interrupted by the phone. Call after call came through from loved ones all around the country sharing their excitement and joy. These were the moments that balanced Alberta's deep fear for her son's life with happiness and hope. He was so clearly doing what God called him to do, and she would never stand in the way of that. In a moment, the day Alberta King's worst fear came true. And another assassination we don't hear much about.

13:02On the show today, Anamalika Tubbs, author of The Three Mothers, How the Mothers of Martin Luther King Jr., Malcolm X, and James Baldwin Shaped a Nation. I'm Manoush Zomorodi, and you're listening to the TED Radio Hour from NPR. We'll be right back.

13:28This message comes from Middlesex County, New Jersey. Here's why companies are actually making the move to Middlesex County, New Jersey. It's ranked in the top 2 % of U.S. counties for talent and knowledge creation and is more innovative than 98 % of the nation. The opportunity's real, and it's right here. Visit biz.discovermiddlesex.com to set up a meeting with a business advisor today. This message comes from WTTW. Join Jeffrey Baer as he tells the story of how railroads shaped Chicago. Riding the rails with Jeffrey Baer. premieres April 13th at 7 p.m. on WTTW. This message comes from ID Tech.

14:08ID Tech is where kids 7 to 17 find their people. The Camp Crunch Labs IRL, BattleBots, and Game Design people. Visit IDTech.com and use code IDTech to save$150. This message comes from Whole Foods Market. Enjoy the fresh flavors of spring with their cold-pressed juices and tropical-flavored sparkling waters. Seasonal must-have fruits like mangoes, kiwis, and papayas are at their juiciest. Plus, for adults, there's white wine with tropical notes. For wine, must be 21+. Please drink responsibly. There are everyday low prices on 365 brand items. Plus, look for the yellow sale signs throughout the store.

14:47Enjoy the fresh flavors of spring and save at Whole Foods Market. It's the TED Radio Hour from NPR. I'm Manoush Zomorodi. My guest today is the author of The Three Mothers, How the Mothers of Martin Luther King Jr., Malcolm X, and James Baldwin Shaped a Nation. Ana Malika Tubbs, thank you so much for being with us. Thank you for having me. So Ana, before the break, we were talking about Alberta King, the mother of Martin Luther King Jr., and how she shaped our history in part by how she raised her son. But as the civil rights movement gained steam in the 60s, the situation got more and more dangerous for him.

15:30And she became really worried about his safety. And of course, her worst nightmare did come true in 1968. Yeah. All of this worry that she's had for years and these fears that she has for her son's life come true. You know, the worst news that she each day is worried she's going to hear. She finally does hear over the radio that our civil rights icon, this kind of prince of peace, has been killed.

16:08And in the moment from her husband's description in his autobiography, he says that she was almost quiet and that tears were just streaming down her face. I pray that his family can find comfort in the memory of all he tried to do for the land he loved so well. I can only imagine the thoughts that are going through her mind, but we also have to remember she's aware that people are watching her. She's a leader in this church. She has been since she was a little girl. and she knows and is fully aware that she has to also think about what everybody else is going through and how she needs to show up for them.

16:55Alberta King lived until 1974 and I did not know how she died, Anna. And I've asked a lot of other people, did you know? And they said they'd never heard this story. Do you mind sharing it with us? Yeah. It's an extremely shocking moment, completely unexpected. Of course, she's playing the organ at church, as she always does every Sunday. And it's a joyous day. But a man stands up in the middle of Alberto playing, and he says, I'm taking over today. He starts shooting. He later tells us and kind of tells the media, the news reporters, that he wanted to kill MLK Sr. This was his original goal. But on that day, he decided that since Alberta was closer to him, he was going to shoot her first.

17:49And Alberta dies at the hospital. She saw it in the back while playing the organ in that very famous church in Atlanta. Yeah. The church that she grew up in, the church that her parents established, the church that her husband becomes pastor of, that her son does, both of her sons do. This is also the place where she dies. I mean, incredibly tragic ending. and yet the way you write about Alberta, there's certainly a calm joy to her life. What do you think are the, what do you think is her legacy? Her legacy, not just her son's. Yeah. Her legacy is one where she reminds us over and over again that there is, in her belief, a calling on our lives and that there is a reason that everything happens and that that doesn't erase, you know, our human concerns of fear or worry, but that we also have to follow that calling.

18:56That's what she believed. And so I think one of my favorite parts of the book, although it's very painful to read, is her obituary and the words that are read about her and that her music is living on, her message is living on through her students, through her daughter, and through her grandchildren.

19:22Let's turn now to the second mother in our trio. Louise Little was the mother of Malcolm X. She was actually born in the Caribbean in Grenada. And Ana, I knew very little about this Caribbean island, but it very, very much formed who Louise was and who Malcolm X, or Malcolm Little as he first was known, became. Tell us about Louise. Yeah, I like to start in the book by noting that these women's lives don't start just the moment that they're born, but that this is all about generational knowledge and this generational celebration. And especially in the case of Louise, her island of Granada is filled with histories of resistance to white supremacy, resistance to colonization.

20:11And so one primary story is the Carib Indians are, well, there's colonization coming and they're aware of this. And instead of surrendering, a group of them jump from this hill to their death. And they're making the statement that they would rather die than live in captivity. This is legend or history? This is history. This is real. The hill is called Leaper's Hill in commemoration of their act that they would rather jump than to surrender or to live in captivity. And so it's a story that's told over and over again around Native communities and Black communities in Grenada, all about you do not live in oppression.

20:58Okay, so she's growing up in a culture that really reveres independent thinking and hearing stories about this fierce spirit. And she, Louise, actually moves as quite a young woman around the age of 20 to Montreal and then the U.S. Was that atypical of young women at the time? Very. I mean, we also even have to talk about her grandparents, the fact that they were at one point enslaved and they were able to gain their freedom. And so they also believe in black self-sufficiency, black independence. They're telling her this. They are Nigerian. And so they're also bringing with them West African stories of leaders who have fought against slavery.

21:40And so she grows up with all of these notions of you stand up for yourself by any means necessary. You fight for black pride and black love. And she wants to join this international fight. And so she joins this international movement for Black lives, which is called Garveyism. It's based on Marcus Garvey's beliefs in Black nationalism. And she writes for his Negro World newspaper. So she's also very unafraid of putting her name in writing and saying, this is what I believe. So does her career also get derailed? Or I shouldn't say derailed, but does it get cut short by marriage? Interesting. I wouldn't say it gets cut short by marriage with her.

22:27She meets a fellow organizer at one of their meetings and falls in love with him. I think I would say she falls in love with the fact that he is also unapologetic about his feelings of Black self-sufficiency and Black nationalism. them. And Marcus Garvey takes note of them and sends them very strategically to cities in the Midwest that are already kind of showing that they want to fight and they're responding to white violence with their own presence and their own strength. And so the goal is to send Louise and Earl, her husband, to these places to further inspire this revolutionary spirit. And it's part of their strategy that they'll be known by the KKK and by groups like the Black Legion, which is similar to the KKK.

23:17So that's what they're there to do. They're there to kind of be like, yeah, we're here. They're agitators. It's almost like missionaries, but even riskier. Very risky. It's very risky what they're doing and also intentional, but that puts them in danger multiple times. Tell me about that. Tell me about the dangers that they faced. Yeah, their house is burned down at one point. When Louise is pregnant with Malcolm, she is confronted by a mob of white men who come to her house and are trying to intimidate her, especially in the absence of her husband. They're trying to get information. They're trying to scare her.

23:58And she walks outside, stands tall. She tells them she's not afraid of them. She shows that she's pregnant, which is really something that, you know, wouldn't have stopped them from hurting her. There's no respect for black women and black pregnant women, as I detail in the book, many examples of that. But she's she's there and she's showing her other three children that this is what she wants them to do in the face of hatred. She might risk her life in doing so, but it's more important to stand tall rather than accept these notions of of white supremacy. Okay, so these stories about his mom, her demonstrations of putting her life on the line for her race, they clearly shape Malcolm Little, who becomes Malcolm X.

24:45But he's also growing up around a lot of violence, right, and tragedy. And he believes, most people believe, that his father may have been killed by white supremacists as well. Yes, so this was the next attack in a series of attacks against the Little family. And it happens one night, Malcolm witnesses his dad leave. And the next thing he knows, he's waking up and there are police officers at the house. And they're talking to Louise and taking her to identify her husband's body. The newspaper says that this is an accident. But everybody who knew the little family, especially the black community members in Lansing, all believe that this was murder.

25:33And she has to identify his body and then go home to her seven children at the time. So here's Malcolm. He has six siblings and now a single mother. What is it like growing up for him? And how does she care for her family in the 30s? Yeah. After her husband is murdered, Louise does her best to maintain her independence. But it's also legal at this point for white welfare officers to enter her home whenever they want to without permission. And she hates this. She hates that they just can come in, examine her, judge her, judge the way she's raising her children. Again, we have to remember this continued attack on her and her family because they are these radical activists.

26:23It's well known that they are radical in their approach and they're teaching their children also to believe in their same ideals. And so these welfare officers are pulling their children aside and telling them, asking them questions about Louise, saying that she's acting a little crazy, starting to plant these seeds in their minds that their mother is unwell. She does experience, I would say, depression. She's sad. But a white male physician was sent to evaluate her. And in his doctor's note, he says that she is imagining being discriminated against. This is a quote verbatim. verbatim. She's imagining being discriminated against.

27:01And this is enough for her to be put away in an institution against her will for around 25 years of her life. Wow. And each of her children are taken from her and placed into foster homes. Do we know what her life was like in the institution? There's very little that we know, and we can only make informed guesses, really, because the record of her time there is mainly kept by the state writing letters to the hospital and the hospital responding. So they're asking, how is she doing? And the hospital responds by saying things like, she continues to resist us. She continues to resist us. And this hospital was known for weird experimental treatments, which, I mean, would have been kind of the case in the 1930s and 40s for mental institutions.

27:52You know, for so long, it was, we should lock you away and kind of put you away. So especially for a Black woman, a Black immigrant woman put in a facility that's known for experimental treatment, I can only imagine what it was like for her to be there. Yeah, and only imagine what it was like for him. I mean, this is, you're describing a pretty traumatic childhood. Both parents are out of the picture. and later Malcolm X does end up spending time in prison. Do we know how much he traced his troubles back to when his mother was taken away? Yeah. He even says he starts to forget the vocabulary that she's taught him.

28:31He starts to feel even more anger. We know this kind of famous story about the teacher who says he can't become a lawyer because that's not a good dream for him to have as a black boy. So he doesn't have that love that he used to return to that would have said, don't listen to that teacher. Like, we believe in you. So it helps us to better understand why somebody who has turned to this life of crime, who is now in prison, starts to see a homecoming in the lessons of Elijah Muhammad and starts to see direct connections in this Black nationalist approach that is all about Black pride, all about Black independence.