How to Develop a Creative Style That Actually Gets You Hired ft. Vuhlandes

25:34Your work is really good. What amazing opportunities have come from that? Man, just, I'm extremely grateful and just like blessed to have been like to be put in a position to kind of see the world through the just because of the images that I make. It's amazing. Like you said, Tokyo was honestly probably to the day, yeah, the best kind of opportunity I've gotten through through creating images ever. There was no better experience than going to a place like Tokyo for that. But I've gone to Sweden with Epidemic Sound. Where else did I go? I'm kind of blanking, but I feel like just like now, I never thought that I'd see another, let alone other places of the United States, but other places of the world.

26:35It's like, there's a lot of people where I'm from who haven't, who aren't even familiar with outside of their neighborhood or outside of our neighborhood. And it's like, I never thought that I'd have the opportunity to kind of like see the world and meet new people and just experience new cultures, life and food, and just all of these beautiful things about human beings that I'm excited and just grateful that I got to experience. Yeah. I still think about there. We were driving and I believe it was a 7-Eleven and there was some really sick, I think it was like one vintage car or two, like old school cars.

27:14And you were so pissed that we didn't stop and we couldn't get the photo. I still remember that dude. I still talk about that. I was just telling somebody about that. Really? Bro, I'll never forget that. It was like set up. Like I was like, this is kind of crazy. It's like begging to be photographed. Like, geez. Man, that's funny. Okay. On the pre-show call, you told us that you've always kind of had this like chip on your shoulder that you feel like you needed to prove it to yourself and prove it to other people that you could actually, you know, make something of yourself, especially growing up in Detroit.

27:51Have you had that chip on your shoulder in multiple different times in your life as well as now? what I mean by that is you started off in photography and maybe you had a chip on your shoulder to become a successful photographer. And then you got into video later on. And then you're like, oh, maybe you're thinking people think I can only make photos, but I can also make videos. And now you're also stepping into one, you're working on a book until you want to direct actual proper films. Has that chip on your shoulder been consistent through the different phases of your life? I think so, bro. I think just, again, I hate to keep being dead horse, but again, just growing up in Detroit, I feel like it's just like who we are as people.

28:38It's like the city of Detroit is so, like, it's looked down upon amongst the rest of the country. Like, you don't have to be from Detroit, but like, if you hear about Detroit, you're going to hear like very kind of negative things and again like i mean you guys aren't from detroit but if you guys heard somebody mention detroit i'm sure it wasn't in like a context of like oh that's a beautiful place i want to go there um but but it is it's so fair but you know i've always met the nicest

29:06Vuhlandes:people from detroit carhart's based in detroit really great people yeah everyone in detroit was fucking nice to us when i because i i went to detroit a few times um when i was working for the Lakers and everyone's always really nice in Detroit. Also, Big Sean in high school, finally famous was my shit. And so I was like, the numbers in my high school too. Shout out to Big Sean in Detroit. Yeah. See, that was, that was good PR for Detroit.

29:38But, but yeah, it was just like, I think just nationally, just kind of, we've had our, are moments in history where like it wasn't the brightest and I feel like that kind of cloud loomed over the entire city for the entire country um without people ever actually coming here and experiencing it because I would always say stuff like that like oh man like a lot of people have so much to say about the city but they've never even been here or interacted with people here and like you know just gave it a chance um before you let someone on the news tell you how you should feel about a place but yeah so I think because of that like you just naturally have like you just naturally feel like the underdog I was I'm very like I'm a short guy so like I played football growing up so I always felt like I had to be like proving myself in that term like oh I can play these positions I can do this I can do that and I think it kind of just naturally rolled over into like what I do now where like, yeah, I mean, you do have to work a little bit harder when you're not in these, in these places, um, like New York or California, certain areas.

30:48So you feel like you got to work a little bit harder. You feel like you get overlooked a little bit because you're not in these places. You're not from these places. And, you know, to me, I was putting out work that I thought was beautiful and, and good enough for like what you know brands or companies or whatever the case may be would want to see and work with me because of it but then you just realize like this this shit is all like a business and it's it's not it doesn't always go the way you see it in your head or how you expect it to be or what you think is fair so um I think so I think I do still kind of have that chip on my shoulder but also like I'm a little bit older now so like I understand a little bit more how how life works I don't have life figured out but like I get things and I understand that things are are are the way because of certain things in life so yeah I don't know I just try to do what I what I do and if I get opportunities I get them if not I'm gonna just keep pushing and

31:49Vuhlandes:doing what I do how important has the personal work been for just growing your photo and film directing business as a whole like for you as a as a creator oh i think it's everything i think without personal work which like that's my favorite thing to do is personal work because i have all the input and say into it but also being told what to do man fuck jesus i'm like just let me take the shots and edit it i'm a peacock you gotta let me let me fly let me fly let me cook man but yeah i think yeah i just i love personal work i have all these ideas in my head that like i want to do and again like no one's gonna come to me and be like hey what you thinking you want to do it it's just like i gotta go do it and a lot of times i have ideas and i want to complete them so bad that i'm like i have to do this tomorrow like i have to go do this like right now.

32:49I'm going to be anxious about it. But I love my personal work. And I think because of my personal work, without personal work, without work that you created on your own, it's like you don't really have anything to show or what you're capable of or what you do, for lack of better terms. It's like, yeah, I mean, my work, the things that I've gotten hired for was solely because of like my personal work so um i think it's super important i think i make a lot of time for my personal work there's like a lot of times where i'm like no i actually can't do that job because i have to like do something for myself um which i'm incredibly blessed to have the opportunity to say no to stuff to work on things that's gonna make me lose money actually so it's like yeah I think for me my personal work is like it's extremely

33:41Vuhlandes:important when you think about this new book that you're doing which is a passion project right how difficult is it to come out with a photography book and pull down probably tens of thousands of pictures into your 80 favorite like talk us through that process not easy at all honestly it's like I want to put every photo that I've ever taken in there almost like and then a lot of my I like switched to film very early on in my uh photography career so like I have a a bins of like just film negatives that like I have to sift through and like look at in the light and like I'm like is this the photo like I'm not sure so it's like it's definitely not easy and And it's also hard because for me, I'm doing a book based around my kind of progression in photography.

34:34So what I started off doing to what I'm doing now.

34:40So I can have a little bit more, like I can have more photos in it because it's a book over, I don't know what, 13 years.

34:51Vuhlandes:so I think I think it's appropriate to have a bit of work in there but I couldn't imagine having to make a book and it's like only 70 pages and 10 pages it's writing and just like blank stuff and I have to pick 30 pictures like I don't even know how that would work I feel like if that's something I had to do it'd be have to be for like a project like I did this one project and I'm turning it into like a book but because that's just too hard it's interesting that you're doing your 13 years as a photographer is there a clear year as you're pulling these photos is there a clear point where you're like i got better right there and if there is like what do you attribute um what do you attribute to improving as a photographer Is it simply going out and shooting more?

35:48Or is there some sauce that you can leave us with of like, this is actually if you take this mindset or this little trick, it's allowed me to come to a scene. Or if I'm just walking around, it's allowed me to come out with, you know, better photos. Yeah, I think, yeah, there's a there's a lot of clear points with like going through these photos was kind of crazy because I'm like, geez, what was I doing? and at the time you were like these are so tough at the time i'm like this is tough but a lot of a lot of it comes down to like the way i edited the photos too i'm like this actually wouldn't be that bad if i didn't like like deep fry it like what was i doing like i was in light room cooking too much overcooking um but yeah there's there's some times but also i'll say now like i I still to this day take photos and like get a roll of film back.

36:46And I'm like, I don't know what I was thinking. Like this is not good, but I think a lot of that stems from just like me being my, my biggest critic and like wanting things to look and feel and come off a certain way to me, not even everyone else. And sometimes I kind of get discouraged by not really discouraged, but I think we could all agree that we want to be the best versions of ourselves when we, when we're creating anything, even if it's something we don't want to do, we still try to do it to the best of our abilities. Just so just cause that's who, that's just who I am. So I think there's times where I look back and I'm like, these photos are good, but I just see, I just see a kind of a style change, honestly, over the time.

37:31I feel like the subject matter is, it's pretty much more or less the same, but I think just like the way I approached it and the way that I went about photographing I used to shoot wide open and wide like 24 millimeter 1.4 all the time like I don't think my lens even left one point I don't even think that my 24 millimeter ever left 1.4 aperture the entire time I had it so I think now like I'm now that I'm older I just like have a little bit more understanding of just photography and image making and image creating in itself i don't know everything still but i i know that other apertures exist now so yeah what are you primarily at like

38:16Vuhlandes:are you are you primarily like an f4 or 5.6 what it what are you when you're walking around the streets and you're looking for something what are you typically at i think i'm more of like a 5.6 I feel like that's like the especially shooting I shoot a lot of medium format too so like 5.6 still looks like 2.8 it's like okay it's kind of wild um yeah if especially too like if you kind of understand distance and stuff like that any a deep aperture could look wide not wide open but it could have some blurriness to it so it's like I kind of like to um I've also learned that like I want more of like uh my scene to be seen if that makes sense yeah totally totally so it's tough because like a lot of times I'm like man this background and just like this environment is really beautiful to the work but then like you crush it by like just blurring it out completely and a lot of times now I've I've wanted the environment to interact with the subject more So I'm just, yeah, I think shooting and figuring out lighting and stuff like that.

39:29Vuhlandes:I'm with you on the aperture. Where I am. Yeah, I'm with you on the aperture. Like I remember when I was shooting sports, I was always at 1.8 or 2.8 or whatever it was wide open. And then slowly as I got better and better and started to understand this composition more and framing, I'm like, man, I could be at F5.6. and this, you know? Here's the thing, because Brayden used to shoot a lot of, I mean, he worked for the Lakers for five years, so he shot sports damn near every single week. I was in the music scene for like three years. You're dealing with low light conditions. Yeah, that's true. Because of the environment, you're almost forced to shoot wide open.

40:06Vuhlandes:Yeah, that's fair. I am with both of you guys, as of recently, probably this year, I actually, I watched a - This week? Yeah, this week, yesterday. day uh i watched a video by i believe his name is cam mackie and he was saying he was having this conversation he goes i used to shoot wide open all the time he goes but i was wondering why my photos weren't looking like these other photos like they're just a different feeling he's like so i did a test i went to go shoot the same exact photos wide open versus like 5.6 to 7.1 he goes there's just a different look and feel he's like i can't explain it i can't put it into words you guys can clearly see that there's a difference and so i saw that i was like oh i do like the the like not so wide open photos so i've taken that into my work and i've actually found that the photos that i've been taking that aren't wide open i've enjoyed the look of them more and that's just so so on the topic of you looking back at your old stuff i don't like critiquing people's creative work that don't fucking ask for it because i think that we all have a starting point and we all were ass at one point, like we're fucking terrible.

41:12Vuhlandes:And then you slowly get better over time. Then you're like, wow, my stuff is, you know, at a great level. But if you could go back and you could just talk to someone that's young right now that might be looking at your photos on Instagram and they're like, I know I'm not at this level yet, but I'm trying to bridge this gap. Is there something that you could say to them that would help them with when they go out, how to find these frames and how to find something that when they actually go get into Lightroom that they're like, I'm happy with this. Like I know I'm getting somewhere. I'm not just shooting fucking flowers when I walk outside every time.

41:40Vuhlandes:Like I'm finding these little micro moments because you go on your page and these photos, they fucking talk to you. Like you can see there's like emotion behind them. I love when you can see the faces and you can see like what someone's feeling and you know, these beautiful, you know, sweeping scenes. What would you say to that person? hmm i think i'd say to approach photography from a standpoint of wanting of approach photography from a standpoint of not trying to i guess take an amazing photo but like take a photo that is interesting to you. Take photos that are like, that mean something to yourself.

42:27And it doesn't have to be like emotional, but like you liked the way that the shot, like you liked the way the shadows look on this street at a certain time of the day and you walk this street every single day, like go out and photograph that and then go out and photograph that again and again, and just like do it over and over and just kind of make yourself see things differently a lot of a way that I felt like I got myself better was like I said I would walk around the house taking pictures of random things but another thing that I did was I used to there was this back street by my house that like had this car on it and um it was the car wasn't abandoned but it never moved and I would take pictures of that at least three times a week different ways every single time different compositions different times of the day different um uh what is it um seasons summer winter fall like raining bright like I feel like that forced me to kind of see the exact same thing differently and that's something that I really wanted to do because with Instagram and just like being on social media all the time a lot of this stuff can kind of get muddy and kind of start looking the same, especially like when certain things are doing well, you're like, okay, I need to be doing that thing.

43:48Or then like, because at the time, a lot of people were shooting at 1.4. So I'm like, oh, that's like what, that's what we're doing. You know what I'm saying? Like, that's like how we're supposed to take photos.

43:57Vuhlandes:We've all agreed. This is the law. Yeah. So like, naturally, you kind of, you know, do those things as well. So I think it's important to kind of find what you like, even if it's of something as mundane as like a car sitting on the street. It may not be interesting, but I feel like it's a good practice to kind of figure yourself out and kind of figure out what you like and what you want to do and what you want to see within your own work. Because what you do should be for, not for you, clearly if you're putting it on the internet, it's for the masses. But at the end of the day, it's like you You don't want to be another, I don't know, what's the school of fish that's always together?

44:41I forgot what kind of fish they are, but they all look the same.

44:44Vuhlandes:It's like you can't, yeah, you can't tell them apart. You can't tell them apart. But then if a nice, shiny, big orange and yellow fish swims through the middle of them, you're going to be like, what's that? Who's that? And terrible analogy. But I think it's important to kind of be yourself and kind of stand out from like what's what's going on and like what's popping and what's not popping. It's just like do whatever you want to do. No, I think it is. I think it's a great analogy because I think Rick Rubin had this quote about making art for yourself. And inevitably, that makes it better for the audience because you're not making stuff with the thought of how are they going to perceive this?

45:24Vuhlandes:And I think it's like exactly what you're saying. It's a really dangerous game that we've all been played into because you notice that something works. You're like, I'm going to rip this again. And then you get in this mindset, especially when you're getting money for the creative stuff. You're like, OK, that obviously is 100 ,000 people saw that and liked it. If I do it again, pretty high chance someone in there wants to work with me. And then you do it again and then you do it again. And then you almost compromise your not style, but just almost what you would naturally do anyways, because of the little numbers on the screen.

45:57Vuhlandes:And then the comments and people are like clapping for you and shit. And it just kind of, you know what I'm saying? It's just like, it's a tough, it's a tough game that we all play. Because at the same time, yeah, it is it is a business, you know, and you're trying, you're like, I'm paying rent with this camera and with this, like these photography, you know, so it's, it's super interesting to think through. I think it's so interesting that you talk about how you shot this car over and over and over again. Yeah, I love that. And I can relate to it because I just moved back to Santa Monica. And I can't see the pier from my apartment because there's a freaking hotel block in it.

46:35But if I walk across the street, I can see the pier. And I've always been super drawn to, like, photographing the pier. when Brayden and I lived together and I had to do some sort of brand deal. I was like, let's go to the pier. I don't know why. I've just always, it's always been super interesting. There's always like street performers. It's such a classic part of LA. And I have an idea for shooting. I would love to create some sort of photo book that, you know, captures the west side of LA and, or maybe even just shoot the pier. But I say all that to say this past weekend, there was like a hurricane that happened.

47:10And so the waves were like massive and the weather was crazy. And I went down to go see if I could shoot some photos and get something. And I got a photo that I could not have gotten like any other time. It was just a unique situation where the time of the day, the waves like that. I've been to the pier a million times. I've been to the same spot that I took the photo a million times, but a unique photo came from it. And so I love the idea of like practicing on the same thing because you might think that you're getting bored because you're shooting the same thing. But maybe you give yourself some restrictions.

47:49That's another thing. Like I love I have a I have like a Leica Q2. And at first I was like, fuck, like it only it's a fixed focal length. It only has one focal length. Like I I'm going to be limited as a photographer. But I kind of love it because restriction forces you to get creative. And sometimes as an artist, if you have unlimited options, if I had like how unrealistic is it for me to carry around a camera that, you know, I have my 16 to 35, a 24 to 70 and a 70 to 200 and a focal length and maybe a 200. Like you can't have everything and it almost makes it overwhelming. So I love the idea that you're saying of shooting the same thing to practice different times of the days, different focal lengths, different seasons.

48:37Like you'd be surprised at the different types of images you'll create shooting the same thing, but with different options. For sure. I agree.

48:46Vuhlandes:Yeah, I like it. Going into YouTube right now, what are you focused on making? like in this in this new season your life right now 32 where are you trying to go with the films that you're putting out there these movies yeah man I think I'm trying to figure it out with YouTube I feel like YouTube's always evolving and something that I'm always trying to do is evolve I never want to kind of stay the same or kind of just keep doing the exact same thing so So I think for me with YouTube, because YouTube used to be my livelihood, like that's how I would make money. So you kind of have to play into like certain tropes of YouTube with like thumbnails and titles and what your subject matter is.

49:40But I think for me, moving forward, I kind of just want to start getting back to making videos just because I want to make videos of like whatever. whether it's something about photography or filmmaking or whether it's just like a video of me doing something that I want to do or talk about something that I want to talk about I kind of just want to have my YouTube be more of a representation of where I am now in my life and I think I just want to make stuff I don't want to do the whole um the whole thing anymore I think that's kind of ran his course with like the uh what do you call it the um gear the gear videos and the breakdowns and kind of testing gear which I still will do but like in a different way that makes sense and kind of feels refreshing to me at least so I think just moving forward I kind of just want to start making films and letting films live on my YouTube channel without um I'm trying to find a way to kind of remove myself from from all of that and kind of just like make films because like if you go to my instagram page i'm not on it like i i take photos of other people i post other people and though like that's that's what i do so i want my youtube to kind of reflect that as well even if i am in a video i want it to be a video that makes that like i think is uh a good video i guess i just want to make good video i just want to make videos that's it um how often are you putting them out do you feel any sort of pressure that you need to follow this you know i need to put out a video every single week or bi-weekly um and like what is your creative process are you now just saying i'm gonna make something when i feel inspired and that is what it is.

51:35Yeah, that's what I'm saying. Yeah, just whenever I feel like I want to make something or make these like little stories, because yeah, I think just, I just want to have these ideas, make them and then put them out. And that's really it, whether I do it twice a week or once a month or once every two months, whatever the case may be, because I used to follow a strict schedule with posting. But now ever since my cancer diagnosis, I've kind of had to like forcibly step away from that. But I think it was good because it helped me kind of like relax and, you know, realize that these things, like there are no deadlines, there are no timelines, there are no things that I'm like required to do.

52:19I can go at my own pace and like it's okay and it's fine. I feel like for a long time, you feel like if you're not posting, you're going to lose your audience. Or if you're not doing this, you're going to lose your audience. And you always, I mean, I'm so grateful for my audience. So like, I always think a way that I pay them back is by making these videos and by like, you know, giving back in that way. So yeah, but I think now I'd rather just make things with substance and things that like I like making rather than just like putting something out because I feel like I need to.

52:55Vuhlandes:I remember I was sitting on my YouTube home screen a few months back and the video popped up about you losing your hair to cancer. And it was one of the most impactful films I think I've ever watched on the platform. And I want to go through why you made it and what you were thinking in that period of time. Because I remember I hadn't – I'd watched – I'd seen your Instagram before. I don't think I had watched many of the YouTube videos. and I watched that front to back and I was like, man, what a brave video to make for also all the guys and gals out there that are struggling with the same thing and see it from a storyteller's perspective and walk you through this process of what it's been like to have cancer and go through chemotherapy and have to lose your hair and something like that.

53:49Vuhlandes:Can you talk us through that? yeah no um i appreciate uh i appreciate the question but yeah i think for me like just naturally like i said i want to tell stories so even when something like traumatic like that is happening i'm like i have to find out a way to because for me that's it's like therapy i feel it's like i have to find a way to kind of document what's going on like i said i want to tell stories about things that actually happen and like what better way to then like what better way to document something that's happening. I feel like specifically that video too, my hair, I had my hair for so long.

54:31Like I started growing my hair when I started photography. So it's been with me on this entire journey of, and I've been through so many stages in my life up until that point. So like, is my hair like, felt like it was a part of me in a way that like nothing else was. It's been with me when I was going through really tough times, really exciting times, just so many different times in my life, just all wrapped into like the strands of hair that I felt like made me who I was. And the reason I really made the video is because that impacted me so much because losing your hair to chemo isn't unique to me.

55:10It happens to everyone who goes through it. But I felt like it was unique. But I felt like it was unique to me because I had never gone through it. And my hair was important to me. And I found out I was losing my hair because I was in the hospital for something else. And I was like really sick. And it was on my birthday. And I was just like in the hospital for like five days. And I was just like, bro, like I just, I don't feel good. I don't know why. because it was something unrelated to like me having cancer to why I didn't feel good but it was something to do with cancer if that makes sense it was like a side effect from from the shit um and then like I'm like tossing and turning one day like the day after my birthday no it was on my birthday I'm like tossing and turning that like I take my pillow and I turn it and I just see like a shit ton of hair just like on the pillow so I was like yo what so then I'm like feeling my hair and I'm like can feel my scalp and I'm like when did this happen and then um I just think the experience of of all of that so when I got home I was like okay it's falling out so before it falls out I need to like cut it and um yeah I think it was just like for me that was the moment even when I was like dead sick to me that was the moment that like it felt real to me that like it felt like I had the the uh disease because I was like oh this is like a visual representation now that like I'm sick because before that I could just kind of I mean if I don't look sick I don't look sick like I have my hair I like I could like look like this and be sick but you wouldn't know but yeah I was like losing weight lost my hair so I was like that's when like it really hit me that like oh shit this shit is real like it's actually not like a joke so yeah i was like oh no i gotta document this because it'd be one great for people who go through the same thing because i went through it blind didn't know what to expect and then two also like i do photography i'm a photographer like you kind of a lot i feel like we equate having cancer to like really old people or kind of like younger kids for some reason it feel like it doesn't happen to someone who's like healthy and they're 20 like late 20s like doing like working out eating good and stuff like that you feel like it doesn't happen to us but it does and it's like I feel like I need to make those videos just to kind of shine light on that in my own type of way what was the response to that video when you put it out man it was I think the response to all the videos I put out were just overwhelmingly like good just very a lot of people who I don't know wishing me well and just like you know saying really nice things so it was it was it was overwhelming the response like it was it was nothing but good responses but it was it was overwhelming because I was like wow like there's a lot of people out there who don't know me that care there's a lot of people came across that video for the first time not knowing me at all that were like I don't know you but hope you like beat this and stuff like that so it was just like really good responses to it that's amazing I'm also curious like how you're doing now and how the journey has been um and I mean that's what you what you've gone through is is incredibly heavy and so I'm curious if there's something you were able to lean on or something you kept going back to that got you through the hard times because I could imagine if if something like that was to happen to me like you lean on friends and family and stuff but But I think that I would lean to like – I'd probably consume a lot of like stand-up comedy and try to get myself a positive mindset or obviously try to go on walks and clear the head and all that kind of stuff.

59:25But I'm curious if there's anything like that where – when things did get really tough, if there's something that like you went to that helped you get through what you were going through. Yeah, man. And I just watched a ton of movies, just like comedies and rom-coms, serious stuff. I watched sad stuff about people with cancer. It was like a lot of stuff just like, I felt like, I don't know, I love filmmaking. I just love watching videos and movies and films. So I feel like I had nothing else to do. So I was just consuming a lot of like things that were made for like movie theaters and stuff like that.

1:00:19I felt like I had to kind of get off of social media for a bit. So I wasn't really too heavy on that. and then um i kind of just like formed just like a deeper relationship with myself i think just like in life in general and just like being so grateful for life that like i don't know i just feel like that's really all i've kind of cared about it just kind of made me view life in a different lens and like move through life differently just more compassionate I felt like I was already a pretty passionate uh compassionate person um nice to strangers and stuff like that but I feel like it kind of molds your brain into like it molds your brain in a way that like I can I don't think I could have ever done without it, if that makes sense.

1:01:20So I am, in a way, grateful for the experience. I'm doing better now. I still am on a regimen. I have to take pills and stuff like that. But I don't have to do any of the hard stuff that I was doing, which is great. But I have to take pills and stuff like that. But other than that, I'm doing fantastic. I'm alive and well. All the stuff is great. a good time. I'm so happy to hear that. If someone by chance has made it this far into the episode, they've maybe come across the video that you put out of maybe losing your hair or another video of yours and they've stumbled across this and maybe they're going through something like similar to what you went through.

1:02:05Do you have anything that you could tell or share with that person? maybe a piece of advice or something that you might, that you think might help them in the time that they're going through?

1:02:21I'd say don't feel like you have to do any of the things that you're doing alone. A lot of times I would feel like even if I explained to someone what I was going through that nobody kind of understood what I was going through even if people saw me and what I was going through like it's kind of tough to feel like you know you you you're not isolated in like that experience but I would say kind of lean into like these groups out there that are full of people like me and if that person has something similar there's a lot of people out there to talk to a lot of people out there to connect with about this.

1:03:06And I would say probably don't isolate yourself and, and do that because outside of your family, of course you have your family and friends, which is amazing, but I feel like there's nothing like connecting with people that's gone through or are going through the same thing that you're going through. Yeah. I think that's, that's really fair. I think that you can, um, with what you went through, um my fiance has gone through some pretty heavy stuff and i think just being able to talk it's one thing to lean on and talk to people who your friends and family i think like you just said it is another thing to be able to talk to someone who's gone through the same thing as you because you can just relate to them um in a different way so i totally agree i i also think what's really interesting and you brought it up is like when that happened to you your your whole livelihood you know changed like you're forced to slow down not work as much and so as someone who you know their livelihood was or does depend a lot about like being on this hamster wheel of putting out content every single week or consistently um what has that taught you or like what have you had to had to learn to like like how did you deal with that because me and Brayden have talked about this a lot where we're young we're healthy you kind of feel invincible and you're the reality is we could wake up tomorrow and and receive some sort of news or something that forces you to uh kind of reshift your life in a way that you didn't expect to and so I'm curious to know like how you dealt with that and how that has changed how you go about your work now yeah no it's crazy like like you said it could just happen to to anyone because literally the day before i was playing flag football and like scoring touchdowns and just like running and like you know just doing things like that and the next day i'm like like you know what i'm saying it's kind of just like happens out of nowhere which is it's so crazy but I think that that experience I'm also grateful for it with when it comes to like my work and just like life in general because since it kind of forced me to take a break and like kind of sit down and not be able to create things or go out or and do things or just kind of like be in this kind of grind grind like grind state grind state where like I feel like every single day I wake up and all day I'm just like doing something to kind of push and further my goals whether it was sending emails or going out to shoot or like doing three shoots in a day and just like kind of just grinding and grinding because I'm like I'm tracing my dreams and this is what I want to do it kind of forced me to realize that it's okay if you're not doing that it's okay if you aren't posting for a week a month it's okay to take breaks.

1:06:14It's okay to not have to feel like you have to do all these things all the time. Because out of nowhere, I couldn't do any of those things. And the things that were still there were my friends, my family, my pets. It's like the things in life that matter way more than my camera. And at the time, I'm like, nothing matters more than my camera and doing the things that I want to do, but there's so many more reasons in life to live for. And I felt like I didn't see that until this happened. So I feel like it definitely helped me form more of a healthy relationship with creating content and like putting it in the internet itself, because I was off the internet for a while.

1:07:01And for the longest time, I'm like, I can't be off the internet for a day, I'm going to miss something, I got to be interacting with people and this and that. But But yeah, it's just helped me kind of like form a better relationship with my friends and family, social media, my career, just everything all around. Just because I think there's things in life that matter more than my career. Yeah. 100%. Yeah. How has, when did you move to New York and how has that experience been? We got here seven months ago. We moved in February. Good time to move. Been here for a little bit. amazing it was it was it was the best middle of winter yeah don't move in february it was wild it was tough and then the movers we got it was only two of them and like i had to sit in the the truck and it was freezing just like because i had to watch our stuff so i'm like oh it was it was brutal man but um other than that it's been it's been a great time it's been a really good time.

1:08:07I've been wanting to move to New York, but never kind of like really press the button on that. My fiance loves it here. And she kind of convinced me to like kind of take the leap because I was kind of just like, nah, like my work is so embedded in like the Midwest landscape. I don't know how I would work in New York. I don't know what I would do. We were coming here so much though that it almost felt like we were living here before we lived here like I know how to get around I know I catch a train I know what areas I like to be in and go to have friends here um so it wasn't it wasn't any of that it was more so me just like wanting to like I was comfortable with like what I was doing I also felt like I wasn't really done doing what I was doing but um to go back to the cancer thing too I'm like once I got done with that I was like, it was nice to kind of get out of Detroit because it was just like reminding me of that experience.

1:09:08And I'm like, okay, since I beat this, like I'm still young and I do still have my life and health. So like, I want to at least go live in a big city while I still can and like see what it's like and just do things like eat different food, see different people, take public transit and just live a different life than I was living in Detroit. So, yeah, it's been a good time, though. It's been nothing like, I love it here. I don't know if I ever leave. This is great. What a place, man. New York's sick. I was there a month ago for my cousin's wedding, and it's sick. I always wish I pulled the trigger and moved, but you're inspiring me.

1:09:55Maybe it's not too late. it's never too late brother it's so funny man this has been this has been an incredible

1:10:03Vuhlandes:incredible conversation i think uh i've loved learning more about your story and about everything that you're doing your why if you could go back and talk to your 18 year old self before you went on this journey nothing that would change the journey but if any wise words of encouragement anything that you would say to yourself what would that be relax just just relax yeah just relax everything's gonna work out I love that because I think I just again I just on the go just I don't think I'll change but just like the mental part of it I think mentally I think I think the mental side of this stuff is just important is like the creation and just like what you're putting out you can get in your head about a lot of stuff that has nothing to do with yourself or what you're doing and yeah just to relax and make the decisions you're going to make and make them with confidence and yeah that's it I love that I love it man this has been an insane episode of the 505 podcast if you're still here please hit the subscribe button, drop us a comment, leave us a like and we'll see you guys all next week.

1:11:23Vuhlandes:Peace. Let's fucking go.