In short
Ali Wong and Oscar Isaac discuss A24’s podcast episode with a focus on their work on the TV series Beef (especially Season 2), emphasizing how creator/EP Lee Sung Jin’s tone blends painful realism with absurd comedy, and how actors co-create through vulnerability, improvisation, and committed performance choices. They also cover specific scenes and production details, including Stephen’s church crying moment, Josh’s masturbation/OnlyFans material, and the Bufo psychedelic sequence.
Guests
Ali Wong (stand-up comedian turned actor; known for Inside Loon Davis and later dramatic/TV work) and Oscar Isaac (film actor; praised for Ex Machina; stars in Beef and previously worked with Carrie Coon on Drive and with her again on Llewyn Davis).
Key claims
Sung Jin’s “spiritual” sensibility (Ram Dass tie-dye shirts) drives deep, open collaboration; commitment makes dark moments funny; character construction traps people; some scenes were added via actor conversations.
Notable examples
Stephen crying at church; Josh’s “man cave” masturbation staging (legs splayed/laptop positioning) and OnlyFans addition; Bufo scene researched via YouTube sound/risks; wardrobe/mullet as “tiny rebellion” and cues from Sung Jin’s Crocs/oversized sweaters; Carrie Coon’s parallel-play chemistry and their long-running rapport.
Written by AI. May contain mistakes. Listen to the episode to check what was said.
Chapters
Tap a time to open that second in VOOscar's Love for 'Beef'
0:45 to 3:00
Oscar shares his initial experience watching 'Beef' and his emotional reactions.
“It was one of those where I was like, I gotta finish that.”
Humor in Painful Moments
3:00 to 5:15
Discussion about the blend of humor and emotion in performances, referencing a specific scene.
“But it is what I loved so much about talking to Sonny about this one too, this beef too, is his incredible observations of things that are both really painful and really funny.”
The Creative Process with Sonny
5:15 to 8:00
Oscar elaborates on his collaborative process with Sonny for 'Beef' and the character development.
“And so his sensibility is really what won me over because at that time I think there was maybe one episode, and even that episode, it wasn't quite there yet.”
Challenges of Character Preparation
8:00 to 10:00
Ali and Oscar discuss the challenges and experiences of preparing for their roles in 'Beef'.
“but it was like playing this Russian gangster trying to sell plutonium on the black market.”
Fashion and Character Representation
10:00 to 12:15
Their wardrobe choices and how they contribute to their characters' identities in 'Beef'.
“And playing with that idea and also what the suits looked like.”
The Theme of Endless Grasping
12:15 to 14:03
Discussion on the show's themes of desire and the struggle for fulfillment.
“Is it true that you also auditioned for that at the very last minute?”
Creative Collaboration in Film
14:03 to 18:18
Explore the dynamics of co-writing and improvisation in film scenes.
“it's all very, very intentional, you know?”
Portrayals of Vulnerability
18:19 to 19:59
Discussion on the challenges and authenticity of sensitive scenes in acting.
“Yeah, right these constructs of identity and of life and of surroundings and of goals and And inevitably, like everything that is constructed falls apart at some point.”
Character Development in 'Beef'
20:00 to 22:39
Insights into the emotional depth and complexities of characters in the series 'Beef'.
“That's exactly what I, I know I look like that in Joshua Tree at that Airbnb, you know?”
Working with Sonny
22:40 to 25:24
A look at the collaborative process and creative decisions made while working with director Sonny Lee.
“i mean we were in korea like shooting the last episode where are you gonna go yeah nobody gonna get those pages Just, right, you know.”
Show all 11 chapters
The Nature of Chemistry in Acting
25:25 to 26:36
Understanding the importance of chemistry and ease in acting relationships.
“just because of how collaborative it was.”
Transcript
Automatic transcript. May contain errors.0:00Ali Wong:Are we supposed to introduce ourselves? And do we do to the camera? This one? Hi, I'm Ali Wong.
0:05Oscar Isaac:Hi, I'm Oscar Isaac.
0:07Ali Wong:And this is the A24 podcast.
0:10Oscar Isaac:I'm using my podcast voice.
0:12Ali Wong:You sure are. Very NPR of you. Very non-threatening. Very cozy cardigan. Very... A little cloud drink. Yeah. So Oscar, I don't even know. Like, I just assume that people who are movie stars don't watch TV because it's beneath you. So I was surprised that you were a fan of beef and that you watched beef. So how did you even come on to season one?
0:38Oscar Isaac:Well, everybody was talking about it. I remember watching the first two episodes and just loving it. And then I have children that don't let me watch anything. So then I didn't get to finish it. It was one of those where I was like, I gotta finish that. And then I had gotten a call from Sunny about a new season.
0:53Ali Wong:Oh, nice. And so I was like, well, now I gotta finish it.
0:57Oscar Isaac:And I loved it. And it was so funny because I already liked it from those first two. But then in that third episode, it takes such a turn emotionally. You know, when Stephen's at the church and the song is playing and he starts crying. And yeah.
1:12Ali Wong:You know what's funny about that? Is that so in that scene where he starts crying, we were all at dinner together. And I was like, oh, my God, Stephen, I just watched that scene. And I was like, he was like, oh, yeah. And I was like, it's so funny. And he was like, no, it's not. And I was like, yeah, it is, man. I was like, it's hilarious how you just start, how like you're like that and you just start crying. And he was like, I don't. And can't stop. And yeah, and then he was like, I didn't think it was, I really don't see it or whatever. And then I was so uncomfortable. And I went to go to the bathroom at this like Korean barbecue place.
1:48I was like, oh my God, did I have that Steven?
1:51Ali Wong:But then thereafter, a lot of people. And then he sort of like embraced it. But because he was so committed. Yeah. That's why it worked. Of course. Because he can't judge it and think that that scene is funny.
2:01Oscar Isaac:You know, it reminds me of, I remember when I was doing Inside Loon Davis. Okay. And whenever I would.
2:06Ali Wong:Which I just saw recently. Yeah. Yeah.
2:08Oscar Isaac:Well, when I would do. So good.
2:10Ali Wong:Thank you.
2:11Oscar Isaac:When I would do a scene, and if I thought of it, I was like, oh, this scene's pretty funny. I would do it, and there wouldn't be much of a reaction. But whenever I was in my most in pain.
2:22Ali Wong:Yeah.
2:24Oscar Isaac:The Coens would just be cracking up.
2:26Ali Wong:Yeah. And so there's just something about that. That commitment, you know, where it is so, you do take it seriously. And the part of you that can connect to taking it seriously is like that's what makes it work.
2:37Oscar Isaac:For sure. I mean, I think it's also like Sonny's tone, right? The fact that that is happening, which is very real, but surrounded by all this like hyper-Christian praise music that's happening at the same time. And I grew up in like evangelical Christian world. And so it also, I found it very funny from that standpoint as well. And like the youth groups and like the rock, Christian rock and all that. But it is what I loved so much about talking to Sonny about this one too, this beef too, is his incredible observations of things that are both really painful and really funny. And like the absurdity and like in a way the compassion with how small people can be.
3:20Ali Wong:Yeah, it was so I mean, it's Season 2 is so great You're so great in it You're so funny I mean
3:29Oscar Isaac:It means a lot You're so, so funny
3:32Ali Wong:I mean, everyone knows that you're funny I think What do you think? I think, like, it's when I watched Ex Machina That's kind of when I got put on to, like I was like, oh, this dude's, like, so, so funny In addition to being a great actor Like, when you're wearing that, like, that fur vest and you're like having the time of your life and then it all, the joy just like drains so quickly. Like you go up and you go down and then you're like down about being down. It was like, there were just, yeah, like a lot of really, and you have like a real menace to you too, which is like, which is such a fun part of beef too.
4:11Ali Wong:Because in a way, like you're not really like a gangster, but everyone in Beef is like, gets to be a bad person. And it's so fun. So how much did you ideate with Sunny over your character? Well, I'm curious about you too.
4:25Oscar Isaac:Because for you, the transition too from stand-up into something like this, what that was like for you. And I was very curious, going into this role in Beef that you had, was so massive and asked so much of you how that transition worked for you. and what your conversations with Sonny were like. So I want to hear about that, but I'll answer you about this. It was like a courtship. I remember I was doing Frankenstein at the same time, and we would have these.
4:55Ali Wong:He gets so excited when he calls.
4:56Oscar Isaac:Yeah, and we'd have two-and-a-half-hour conversations that I would cry. We would go really deep. If I read anything from a self-help book recently, I'd be like, hey, I just read this. And we would just go down that path together, incredibly open about his own life, which encouraged me to be open about mine, which was strange with somebody I'd never met other than just on Zoom. And so his sensibility is really what won me over because at that time I think there was maybe one episode, and even that episode, it wasn't quite there yet. There were some ideas, but it was out of those conversations where I thought, he's got his bead on something, and he's really funny, and we connect so much on just like the spiritual journey of getting into middle age.
5:42Ali Wong:Yeah, I mean, he really asks, I mean, you've seen those tie-dye t-shirts with the Ram Dass quotes that he wears. Like, he's a very spiritual person. And so it sort of, like, begs of you to really be vulnerable and open up with him personally in those conversations. And then it's really interesting what he extracts and extrapolates from there to your character. And then it's like, it's kind of the best version of co-creating with somebody. but there were times where like for some of the scenes I wasn't used to memorizing like that amount of dialogue.
6:18Oscar Isaac:Do you memorize your standard routines?
6:20Ali Wong:I do but I write all of it right and so with a lot of some of the dialogue I was like I remember there was one day we did like you know because we had a lot of time constraints and I said to him I was like I can't do this in one take I know you want to do it in one take but I just can't do it And he was like, I think you can do it. And then he was like, we gotta go. And then that was it. And then I kind of just didn't have a choice to think about it too much. And I'm not the kind of person to go back and forth with him because it just, it exhausts me. So I'm like, all right.
6:53Oscar Isaac:To try to fight it.
6:54Ali Wong:To try to fight it. And I see, I think that's a lot of people's process because it's like in that they understand more or I don't know. I don't really know. I don't really relate to that. I just am like, go, I'll go where you tell me and I'll do whatever you say. And then I just kind of say the words. But so, but we also just didn't have time. Right, right. It was the first one. Yeah, exactly. So I think that was like really a blessing because I just didn't have time to think about it.
7:27Oscar Isaac:Overthink it. Was it like that for you? It's the enemy. It's the overthinking.
7:30Ali Wong:When like on your first big project? Were you like, did it?
7:35Oscar Isaac:I mean, I was so hungry to get an opportunity coming out of drama school. Yeah. And I think when I got it, I just was like, this is everything. This is going to be my dog day afternoon.
7:47Ali Wong:And what was that?
7:48Oscar Isaac:This was a movie that Scott Burns, a good buddy of mine, says he's a great writer. And it was the first film that he directed. It was this it was called PU 239, which is like a plutonium isotope. but it was like playing this Russian gangster trying to sell plutonium on the black market.
8:05Ali Wong:Oh, yeah, and you're like, this is very important. Yeah, yeah, yeah. This is going to change the world. This is going to change the world, yeah, exactly.
8:12Oscar Isaac:So, yeah, yeah. And I can be an overthinker and like to talk about things and like to try things and question everything. It says I come in through the door, but why don't I come in through the window? Why don't I come in through the window? Why doesn't it? So that all the possibilities collapse to the only thing it can be.
8:27Ali Wong:I see.
Read the full transcript
8:27Oscar Isaac:That's kind of fun for me, you know? Yeah, I guess. And in fact, figuring out what it is is usually kind of a bummer because then it means all the other possibilities. All that is gone. Yeah. You know, I like when it might be anything. It could be this. It could be that. It could be this.
8:40Ali Wong:Did you collaborate a lot on your wardrobe? Because I found your wardrobe so subtle. But that's another thing about beef. It's very subtly funny. Yeah. The wardrobe. Yeah. Like Carrie's wardrobe. Crack me up, dude.
8:54Oscar Isaac:Yeah. Yeah. The wardrobe.
8:56Ali Wong:She was wearing like those like she had these coordinated linen suits that had embroidered little dumb things on them, and then your wardrobe was like, it was just so coated and still. Okay, what did it say to you?
9:09Oscar Isaac:Well, Olga's incredible. Yeah, she's amazing. She's astounding, and she's so funny and subtle as well. But before that, the first place I started with was the hair. And I worked with somebody named Tim Nolan, who was incredible. And the first thing I do is like, hey, what's this head going to look like? You're going to see a lot of this head. What are we doing? and we landed on this like little mullet.
9:32Ali Wong:Uh-huh, yeah, it's like the most neat.
9:35Oscar Isaac:It's the tiniest rebellion, you know, of trying to hold on to something. To youth, yeah, to that like. Exactly, to youth and to like, hey man, I know I'm a country club manager. A cool guy. But you know, man, I'm a cool guy.
9:49Ali Wong:That was like really riding that line, like it followed through with the whole wardrobe.
9:54Oscar Isaac:Yeah, exactly, so that was really important And sometimes we would take our cues off of Sonny.
9:58Ali Wong:Right.
9:59Oscar Isaac:Of what he was wearing and the Crocs and the oversized sweaters. Yes. And playing with that idea and also what the suits looked like. And we wanted the suit to look like something that he wants to look good in, but he doesn't want to look like an agent or something. And he wears the Oura Ring as well. I know. And all these little things that kind of create.
10:20Ali Wong:He's really trying to still have it all. Yeah.
10:22Oscar Isaac:Yeah. Yeah. Yeah, and that's a great thing I heard recently, which I feel like kind of encompasses Josh. I heard someone say, you can have anything you want, but you can't have everything you want. And I think the show is a lot about people trying to have everything they want. And it's just endless grasping, endless grasping.
10:44Ali Wong:Yeah, just even when he's talking to, like, who's the guy who's super rich at the club who has the private show? Troy, yeah, Bill Fidner. And you're still trying to have everything, and you're not even, it's so, I mean, Troy plays it really well, but you're not reading the room. Whereas before, your character's so sensitive. You're so desperate that it's like, you're not, you can't read his, this clear sign that he's like, that something's off.
11:17Oscar Isaac:Yeah, yeah, the desperation overtakes all of that, the fear and all that.
11:21Ali Wong:What was it like working with Carrie again after all these years? Because Bill showed me Inside Lillian Davis because I'd never seen it before. And I was like, this is amazing. And you hadn't worked with her since then, right?
11:33Oscar Isaac:I hadn't worked with her. So we worked together on a movie called Drive.
11:35Ali Wong:Oh, right.
11:37Oscar Isaac:That was the first time I had met her. We were both still in our 20s.
11:42Ali Wong:You guys are a couple.
11:44Oscar Isaac:In Drive? Yeah.
11:45Ali Wong:Oh, no, you're not.
11:46Oscar Isaac:In Drive, we are. You are, but then you die. Yes. So fast. Yeah, like I'm in prison and then her and Ryan Gosling kind of get together. Right. And so we were like young and it's Hollywood and just things were starting to open up and it was like amazing to meet her at that moment. And you know, and then years later, Llewyn Davis and I had met my significant other, she had met her significant other Marcus and we were just like newly in love and like this big, you know, role and about music and and so that was amazing to meet at that point. And then now to come together again.
12:15Ali Wong:Is it true that you also auditioned for that at the very last minute?
12:19Oscar Isaac:For Luna Davis? Yeah.
12:21Ali Wong:Like they had already decided, like a decision had been made. They hadn't decided yet, but they were...
12:27Oscar Isaac:I had heard that a decision had been made.
12:30Ali Wong:Well, they were getting close, I think. And then you came in and they weren't really familiar with you. Yeah, no, I hadn't been able to meet. And then after you sang and you had auditioned, they were like, Oh, no. We don't have a choice. They didn't tell me that part. That's what I've heard. That's funny, yeah.
12:47Oscar Isaac:No, I mean it was definitely was the character was designed on Dave Van Ronk who was like a six foot five 200 pound Swede, you know But anyway, yeah, so then we met on that after we have kids and lived a lot of life It was just I've never worked with anybody better She's just I talk about you know, you know with kids when they talk about parallel play Right, it's like kids play next to each other you know and and then a developmental thing is when they actually start playing with each other yeah and it's like acting with her feels like oh usually I'm just doing parallel play you know usually I'm just kind of doing my thing next to somebody doing their thing often it can feel that way but with her it's I don't know it's just something else happens and I just think I'm
13:31Ali Wong:mesmerized by her yeah it really feels that way like when you when you guys are together and I think it's because I don't know if it's because also we have this as an audience have a relationship relationship with you guys as a couple in these different forms, but it kind of already feels like you have reincarnated many times together as, I don't know, it was really interesting. I mean, that's the other thing that's interesting with, you know, Sonny when he does casting, it's all very, very intentional, you know? So I think he takes that into account too.
14:09Oscar Isaac:but yeah I think that was a big part of it and then when we started working especially on that first fight scene you have to be really comfortable with someone I mean to go there yeah yeah and also just to write it together like the three of us wrote that thing together you know I mean he wrote it yeah but the way that we workshopped it the way that we would come we do very long improvisations and some of that you know in that kind of Sidney Lumet style would come into the you know he would incorporate that and right around it and And yeah, it was, that was really exciting to kind of have authorship over it that way.
14:43Oscar Isaac:I mean, you know, a couple of EPs sitting here, a couple of beef EPs.
14:50Oscar Isaac:You know, that was a really cool feeling to really feel like.
14:53Ali Wong:Yeah, that's the best part about working with him, you know, and then you're like, did I? And then you watch it and you're like, oh, like he put that in there. We put that in there. Oh my God.
15:04Oscar Isaac:Yeah, for sure. When I would get some of the scripts, I'd be like, ooh, that's a direct quote right there. I'm not sure I can. I know.
15:12Ali Wong:Okay, there's two things I know Sonny loves. He loves it when people get at somebody with their bodily fluids. He loves that. He also, and he had it twice this season. But you were an unknowing receiver of that. Of the body fluids. Yeah, but he also, there's also. I give some bodily fluids, too.
15:35Oscar Isaac:Oh, you do?
15:35Ali Wong:There's also your masturbation scene. Is that your first masturbation scene? No, it couldn't have been.
15:43Oscar Isaac:Surely I've had many more masturbation scenes that I can't think of at the moment. But, I mean, it might.
15:51Ali Wong:I mean, it's, okay. How did you? You did great. Did you believe it? I believe it, but that's the thing. Again, you have to not think that you're doing a masturbation scene. Like you have to really commit because it's an embarrassing thing to do in front of people. So you really have to like, but I don't know. I mean, for you, was it, you're like, oh, what? I've done it a hundred times. Have I done it once? Yeah. Clearly it was like not.
16:21Oscar Isaac:I've just been around for a long time. Like I'm sure, I'm sure I did it somewhere. I mean, of course, it's so goofy. Like the.
16:29Ali Wong:But you have to make it not look goofy. You can't be like. Like, you can't be, like, cartoonish about it. You have to, like, you know. And the truth is, when most people masturbate, it probably doesn't look good.
16:40Oscar Isaac:No, no. That was a big talk. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Sonny and I on set talking about, like, well, how should we do this? And Sonny's like, well, if I was going to do it, I would do it like this. I was like, oh, that's interesting. Legs splayed out. All right. Laptop. Laptop. Yeah. Okay. I'm more of, like, I guess the side, kind of, on the side. and we would try to set that up. What story does that tell? Yeah, how much self-love is it? There's a lot of elements of that expression. But for us being like, okay, well, I guess this is kind of his safe space and it means a lot to him to be able to do this.
17:16Oscar Isaac:He's in his man cave. He's in his man cave. So it's actually...
17:19Ali Wong:No one's watching.
17:20Oscar Isaac:He's mindful of it. It's not just like, let me just rub one out while no one's around.
17:24Ali Wong:Yeah, this is the wind down. Exactly, it's the wind down, right. That's what it felt like.
17:30Oscar Isaac:Yeah, yeah.
17:31Ali Wong:Whereas it felt very real in that way.
17:35Oscar Isaac:Yeah, exactly. And also, I mean, that was something that through our conversations got added in that wasn't there originally. Not only the masturbation, but the OnlyFans.
17:44Ali Wong:Uh-huh.
17:44Oscar Isaac:You know, it felt like, you know what? I think he's got to have something of his own that he's holding, that's a place where he allows himself some freedom. I mean, that was ultimately the big thing with Josh. is like I found even playing him, even talking about him, I start to go back into my throat like this.
18:02Ali Wong:Yeah.
18:02Oscar Isaac:Because he was like such a strangled character.
18:04Ali Wong:Yeah.
18:05Oscar Isaac:I actually had to do work with somebody to be like, this thing is strangling me too much. I don't know why, you know, that happens. And it's, I think it's just a real testament to his writing, which is that it's just the response that it creates in me when I start thinking about him and his life and how things go. It's just everything gets tight.
18:23Ali Wong:Yeah, I think that's like a common thing with all That's very relatable But all the characters in beef have a way of feeling really trapped, you know by By a life that they built for themselves, you know or by
18:40Oscar Isaac:Yeah, these constructions. Yeah, right these constructs of identity and of life and of surroundings and of goals and And inevitably, like everything that is constructed falls apart at some point.
18:55Ali Wong:What was it like working with Kaylee and Charles?
18:58Oscar Isaac:They were so great. I mean, I've been a huge fan of Kaylee's actually for a while. I remember seeing her in Devs, which is Alex Garland. He did this show and she played like a little boy. Not little, but like a teenage boy. Oh, wow. And I said, who is he? And it's like, actually, it's Kaylee Spaney. And I was like, this is an incredible, incredible performance. And she's great. I mean, that scene that we get to do at the beverage cart on the golf course, you know, was like one of the first scenes. It's so fun.
19:28Ali Wong:Yeah. Because she's not saying anything. No, no. It's just, yeah. Yeah, just twitchy and like trying to, you know, say the right thing.
19:36Oscar Isaac:I know.
19:36Ali Wong:And then she just really goes on the journey of being just like corrupted. Yeah, yeah, you see that.
19:41Oscar Isaac:So, you know, she was fantastic. And then Charles is such a mensch. He's like such a beautiful soul. like so funny as well and he's great I think I just I find that the character that he made just indelible and so he's just he's so great he's pitch perfect in this thing I really yeah I love working with him
20:02Ali Wong:the speech you give to Charles after you do Bufo and like I love that I love the Bufo scene so much and when you're they do the like what you're seeing and then they cut to you just on the ground like and your hand it's like and you're on the ground and the way you're like again I mean when you do psychedelics it's not fucking cute like I get like with masturbating like people and like a lot of times again when they when on TV when they masturbate they like are feeling their hair and they're like going like this I'm like no one is doing that like your fists are clenched it's like a tense experience and like a lot with psychedelics, like when you're positioned like that and doing that, I'm like, that's exactly, you look like a squid on the floor.
20:54Oscar Isaac:Yeah, that's what's happening.
20:55Ali Wong:That's like out of water. That's exactly what I, I know I look like that in Joshua Tree at that Airbnb, you know? So I was like, who made that decision?
21:06Oscar Isaac:Well, that was thankfully, I mean, this YouTube is an amazing place. So I was like, there's gotta be people on Bufo on YouTube. And so I went down a rabbit hole and I found somebody making that exact sound going
21:21Oscar Isaac:Bubbling saliva, you know, and then and then read more about it and like it can give seizures and it can give different kinds of You know the reactions there's lots of different reactions, especially if people start having a freakout.
21:33Ali Wong:Yeah And so there's some videos but there's a way and that feels like that when you're doing that was like there's a way that feels good Yeah, yeah, yeah very free in channeling. Like a baby, like whatever you're experiencing, where it's like, it can be exhilarating, it can be like a big release or whatever. But I was like, that is -
21:52Oscar Isaac:It's an animal release. Yeah, exactly. It's like an animal shivering.
21:56Ali Wong:It was like a sea creature. I was like, this is really, like that fluttering. I was like, oh, this is very, very real.
22:04Oscar Isaac:Well, the way that you guys did that whole psychedelic scene was so, also very beautiful. and so deep. I mean, it lifts in such an amazing way, that part.
22:15Ali Wong:So that, I don't know if Sonny told you. We didn't know what we were doing, I think, until a week before.
22:25Oscar Isaac:Okay, I'm seeing a pattern here.
22:26Ali Wong:I'm seeing a pattern here, Sonny Lee. and then and then uh and then and then all of a sudden we were just in that that national park or forest and i was like okay i guess no no time to fight no time that's his trick
22:45Oscar Isaac:i mean we were in korea like shooting the last episode where are you gonna go yeah nobody gonna get those pages Just, right, you know. Because we're here.
22:55Ali Wong:But it's kind of good.
22:57Oscar Isaac:Yeah, yeah. You know? Yeah, and especially at what point in the shoot did you guys shoot that? Was that towards the end?
23:02Ali Wong:That was at the end.
23:03Oscar Isaac:That was at the end.
23:03Ali Wong:Yeah.
23:04Oscar Isaac:So there's some trust at that point, too, that you know what's what.
23:08Ali Wong:Yeah, well, at that point, too, it was, I had worked with Sonny before.
23:13Oscar Isaac:What did you do?
23:14Ali Wong:He was a writer on this animation show I did with, oh, you're a former co-star for, was it the card counter? Tiffany Haddish and I used to play these best friends who were birds. Tiffany, I have to say, it was very funny. Okay, so I love Tiffany, and she's one of my dear friends. That trailer, okay, I laugh so hard when there's the glass between you, and there's the shot, do you know what I'm talking about? And then her long fingernail comes in.
23:48Oscar Isaac:The credits start to go over the finger. What? What is this movie? What is this? What is this alternate?
23:58Ali Wong:Paul Schrader, man.
23:59Oscar Isaac:He's a wacky dude.
24:03Ali Wong:Tiffany and Llewellyn Davis are together and her long fingernails shaking this hilarious combination. So Sonny wrote on that. We've told this story a million times, but he had wanted to do this show about a road rage incident he had with this guy and he wanted Steven in it. And he always pictured the opposite character as Stanley Tucci. Did he tell you that?
24:34Oscar Isaac:I think I'd heard that, yeah. Oh, yeah.
24:36Ali Wong:And then I randomly had a conversation with Sonny during COVID.
24:40Oscar Isaac:I'm sure it's been your issue the whole career is always Stanley Tucci or you. Stanley Tucci or me.
24:44Ali Wong:I know. No, it's like some women are like that Jesse Buckley, always. And I'm like, oh, Stanley, I wanted that pasta show. But I wanted to play the killer in The Lovely Bones. Is he the killer in The Lovely Bones?
24:59Oscar Isaac:He was the killer in The Lovely Bones.
25:00Ali Wong:Oh, yeah. So then I talked to Sonny one day during COVID, and he was like, you know, this whole time I wanted Stanley Tucci, but now I think it would be a lot more interesting if it was you. And I was like, oh, my gosh, yes, I would like it's been my dream to work with Stephen. And you're such a fantastic writer. that would be amazing to collaborate with you guys. Yeah, I had never done anything like that before. And then once we started actually getting into it, I was like, what have I done? But it was great. And I mean, it was one of the best experiences of my life just because of how collaborative it was.
25:30Ali Wong:And then like, I don't want to get like too woo-woo, but like I do feel very, I mean, those guys and I still remain very close. You know, it really is. I imagine, and I hope to have the kind of working relationship that you have with Carrie for years to come with Steven. Just because you really don't find that every day. That's true. I used to think when people would talk about chemistry, I always thought it was like a romantic sexual thing, but it's really not that at all.
26:04Oscar Isaac:No, I think it's more about ease.
26:06Ali Wong:Yeah.
26:06Oscar Isaac:I remember sometimes doing auditions. I remember I was doing like, whatever, it was a play. And I had already been cast, and I had to read with a lot of people coming in. And sometimes, like, I couldn't tell who was better, just sometimes it was way easier to do the scenes. And sometimes it was a lot harder. And not because they were necessarily worse actors. There was just something that made it easy. You know, that's rare.
26:35Ali Wong:Okay. Is that it? yeah do we want a more nice conclusion okay great it'll just fade out on this
26:45Oscar Isaac:talking yeah
From the publisher
Topics covered include:
NPR podcast voice, evangelical upbringings, Beef creator Lee Sung Jin's incredible observations of things that are both really painful and really funny, little mullets, Ali's love of Ex Machina, parallel play, the impressive amount of bodily fluids in Beef seasons 1 and 2, Oscar first meeting Carey Mulligan on set of Drive, getting to play really bad people, going down a YouTube rabbit hole to learn how people respond to psychedelic toad venom, the intricacies of staging a masturbation scene, Ali competing for roles with Stanley Tucci.