First to Laugh with Matt Johnson & Stavros Halkias

18:58Matt Johnson:Lotus. lotus exactly he's literally the we see odysseus on the beach weeping because he's getting too much good pussy and snacks it's like get real that the odd the odyssey's three years because he had a seven-year vacation where he got to fuck a goddess and have the best food of all time it's just a fun i couldn't believe that the because i because i wanted to get the the timeline right going into the nolan movie because i was like i just don't remember i remember the scattered stories and i and it really happens much, it's a much shorter, it's much more truncated than you think. I think they did that because they didn't want to create the feeling you're talking about right now, which is big whoop, bro, I'd love to take that Odyssey myself.

19:37Matt Johnson:Yeah, yeah, yeah, exactly. But it gets, you know what, it gets at something which is true that I bet you you can relate to at a certain level, which is, you know, you like smoking cigarettes here, smoke the whole pack. Yeah, yeah, yeah. You're going to smoke the whole box. Of course, of course. I guess it's nice that you're crying because you miss your wife. It shows you as a moral center. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Even though Odysseus, in the book, really is like, he is a piece of shit. This is what I remember from way back when I was a kid and didn't understand the text at all. I had to read both of those and it was just, it was so over my head, but I loved the hits.

20:08Matt Johnson:Yeah. I loved the hits. The myth that I know well is Gilgamesh, which is similar but different. Gilgamesh goes on his own odyssey, which I can tell briefly. And as soon as you hear this, you'll be like, oh yeah, you're just making that movie over and over again. And this is the story. It's a story Gilgamesh is secretly in love with his hotter friend. Bro. Really? Wait. Wait. Wait. Okay, so he's got a best friend who dies. That's the first half of the myth. And Gilgamesh is the king of this gigantic palace. He's like the man, but his friend is dead. And so he goes, you know what? I fucking hate it here.

20:44Matt Johnson:I'm getting out of here. I'm going to go try to figure out how to live forever. And so he leaves his palace, which he's so sick of, And he's like, this is the worst place ever. I'm trapped. This is a prison to me. And so he leaves. And he goes and tries to basically meet the gods and challenge them. And it's a lot like Hercules or the Odyssey. And he's given all of these impossible tasks where it's like, you got to stay awake for seven days and he stays awake for three and falls asleep. You got to do this. And he almost makes it every single time. And the last one is you got to dive to the bottom of this lake, grab this like vegetable at the bottom, bring it back up and eat it, and then you'll live forever.

21:21Matt Johnson:And he makes it almost all the way down and just can't, and comes back up and he's like, I can't do it. And he walks home to his palace of failure. And as he crests the dune, and he's like, just like, oh, fuck my life. I can't believe it. Like I'm coming back and I've done nothing but waste my time. He sees his kingdom as he comes over the dune and he watched, he looks at all of it and he starts to cry at how beautiful it is and he's like I'm so lucky that this is mine and it's like the it's a message of renewal through failure that I've for whatever reason it's the message of my life because as you witnessed on set daily I all I do is fail and I'm I'm met with things I can't possibly do and and I tell myself a lie that that you know what it's gonna be okay right I will figure this out later you and i were like this on the set of your special absolutely you went through this oh dude i i completely understood it where it was like we had our first show was the was literally the worst hour of my life for maybe the last 10 years i remember that's exactly the first thing you said when you came off stage because this special too i've built up so much right like i've been working on for three years uh and i was supposed to do it and then i broke my arm and I'm just like, I just want people to see me as a top-level joke writer.

22:42I don't want people to think of me as just a crowd work comic. I want people to understand I'm a five-tool player. I can do everything when it comes to stand-up. And the day, the week of, I start to lose my voice. The week before, my back gives out. I need cortisone shots. I injured my back the week before tires started in January and I broke my arm the week we were supposed to do the special originally and the week before and then right after that I was going to go do this Apatow movie and so before every production I break my arm or I throw my back out or you lose your voice I lose my voice and then I lost my voice and then I had the tune-up the silver lining for breaking my arm was I was going to have the tune-up tour on the west coast and I was going to get everything word perfect and I was going to every odd at every loose end and I lose I get so sick the day I'm going to do four cities in four nights.

23:38Four cities, four nights, five shows. The day that starts, in a different city every night, riding a bus, that's the day I get sicker than I've been. And so I prescribe steroids for my voice to get through it. And I'm not working on anything. I'm just trying to like not. Stay alive. I'm trying to stay alive. What I should have done was cancel the shows. But it already happened. I was already there. What the fuck am I going to do? And it's like I've already canceled a lot of stuff and lost a lot of money canceling things. so I'm like, all right, fuck it. The first show was so bad, we got the lighting wrong, got the energy wrong, and it was the first time I'd spoken in two days because I was on vocal rest, so the first words I have, I say, are me, that's about, supposed to be this culmination of three years, and I'm bombing, and you guys, from a technical standpoint, were able to, were able to get it looking right, like, you fixed all the problems you had to do, right, and then on the second show we get a lot of stuff done and I'm like wow I'm actually set up to what is about to happen is this special is going to look incredible they're going to be like Matt Johnson's a genius

24:42Matt Johnson:everyone I mean you think I'm going to get all the credit no no but not just you like the lighting like I think is going to happen because we I was really set up there for a second to be like oh they because you guys fixed all your tech the camera looked incredible everything like the set deck and it was going to be like stav tried to buy himself a classic he got this great director he got the best people he got he got this beautiful theater he you know he clearly spent money on set deck we're trying to get this awesome song right like right like everything around it is like marquee special but he fucking sucks at stand-up oh so you were going to expose yourself even more it was going to be not only did i do just a mediocre job but you put a bullseye around And now I've put all, and the only thing that's going to be bad is the stand-up.

25:24So that's what I'm thinking. It's like, not only am I just going to blow it, I'm going to blow it in a way that people think I'm the worst fuck, I'm the biggest fraud on earth.

25:31Matt Johnson:Right. And I'm a loud mouth piece of shit. You know me. I fucking think I'm the, you know, when it comes to stand-up, I talk, people sometimes have a problem with how arrogant I come off just because I've dedicated my life to this. So there would be people very happy for you to fail publicly. Right, right. Especially on a throne. On a throne. Yes. That's regicide to the finest. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Yeah, of course they want that. But I was so fucking angry going into, like, even the second show of the first night, before we even got anything. And I was like, all right, man, that's what you're up against.

26:01I was like, and in a fucked up way, though. Oh, it helped.

26:04Matt Johnson:You know Michel Gondry's got this great line on Block Party with Dave Chappelle where he's on a conference call with all the musicians saying how they're going to put on this show and there's not going to be any prep and they're just going to do it. and Questlove says, well, okay, we're going to try. I mean, it's not going to be perfect, but we'll do it. And Michelle Gondry says, yeah, no, no, no, but it will be better than perfect because we won't have any idea what we're doing. And so we will transcend perfection, which is what you want, right? Like nobody wants to see something perfectly prepared and executed.

26:36Matt Johnson:Well, I won't put it that way. I'll say that what gets people up on their feet screaming and going, oh my gosh, is when they see somebody at the brink of failure, but they pull it off. Yeah. Because that's so much more exciting. That was, I mean, listen, that's what this special is. We literally, after the first one, I was like, this fucking, I just, my life is fucking up. I made a big bet on people taking me seriously as a stand-up and I fucking lost. And by the way, and it wasn't a good bet, right? It was like, I got horrible odds. You know what I mean? It was like, you have to bet a thousand to make a thousand, two dollars, right?

27:12Oh, yeah, right, right, right, right. I bet everything on a short thing. You just get your money back. Yeah, I've been everything on a sure thing, and I still lost? Because it felt like a sure thing, right? But we figured it out. And when they see the special, they will see a man on the brink. Because most of what we used is that second show, which is me back against the wall. We just had the worst show in the world.

27:33Matt Johnson:But you must recognize this from all performance. It's like the kind of easy just do your line, get it right, and have the director go, okay, yeah, you got it, great, great, great. That's not what you want, right? Sure. Like, I'll talk about myself. Like, I want to feel out of control, and I want to feel like when it's done, I will never be able to do that again. And when I'm looking at performances, you remember when Leo punches Antonio? Yes, one of the most electric moments. Yeah, and I'm watching Dom through the camera as he's watching these guys. It's the only one take where Leo throws Dom at the wall, and Dom hits his back.

28:13Matt Johnson:No, I remember that. The door closes and it's like, and I'm watching it being like, oh, is Dom okay? And then Dom watches these guys scream at one another. It's only one take of it. You could never ask him to do that again. And you're watching it like, all right, well, this is it. No, but that's the beauty. Okay, so that's what I've actually loved about camera acting, right? That to me makes so much more sense because you are trying to capture this lightning in a body. Something that you couldn't repeat. That you couldn't repeat. And stand-up is so the opposite. You're so right. You're so right.

28:45Sinibasol is all getting it down. And, in fact, I think I am very proud of what we did, obviously. But I do – I really do wish I had just one week to be physically healthy. Like, I wish I had one week off to just be mentally and physically there. But the other thing you realize is, like, when you are playing – when you do – when you're trying to do something really great, I mean, the logistics – we were never going to get this – we were never going to be able to do it again. There was no way we could postpone it a second time. It was crazy. like getting there are a hundred people

29:14Matt Johnson:there are just setting it up there's a hundred people and this is the hubris of wanting to do a really big level special there's 2 ,000 people each show we're gonna get them to buy tickets three times again a third time and you're about to do fucking eight movies and we have Jared we have fucking Kurt and Bobby well it was never gonna happen again it was never gonna happen again so it was this thing where it's like alright man there's no perfect anything even though you've been working on this for three years you're not gonna Some of these jokes are not going to be photographed. They're not going to be remembered in time the way you want them to be.

29:49Exactly. But there are other things we did that are even better. So that's the tradeoff. And I'm thinking about this so much because in the midst. We're about to deliver this in a few days. We're in the midst of the final cut, and I've been wrestling with these things where it's like, what can I live with? What can I not live with? What am I okay with? What am I not? And it's like, at the end of the day, that's the beauty. It still is at the same time. It's not exactly what I wanted, but it's a different and better artifact, I think. And what I loved was just collaborating with people who, this was really cool working with you on it.

30:21I'd never had anybody who's like, creative vision I respected to do different stuff on this. Because I would never, that honestly for me was a big thing because stand-up, I'm such a control freak over stand-up. But doing Tony, I was just like, I really, the way you directed was so, there was like, so communication based. And so we are in this together based. There was no, there was no dictatorial. It was, it actually really amused me because the way you direct is like, if you had to, if you showed aliens and you're like, hey, who's in charge here? The answer would not be me.

30:53Matt Johnson:I think that's everybody's assistant. I think, I think somehow this guy is everyone's, everyone's, everyone is his boss. like that's what it feels like because you're because you really want to set people up and you really also want them to be heard but you know and and that's why going back to the very beginning when you when you said like you're you hate hierarchy like you hate it you know i hate power you hate power and you hate you want flat a flat hierarchical system it's a very interesting way because i do think most people who hate that you behave you become the thing you hate like right like most people and i think i have this problem where it's like i hate being told what to do and that manifests itself sometimes in me being a control freak and being like, no, I know what the fuck is going to shut the fuck up, which is bad.

31:37You know, I never even, until you said that right now, I had never even considered that the way to rebel against authority is to create a system that has no authority. You know what I mean?

31:49Matt Johnson:Now, that only works if you're working with people that really do want the best for one another because that goes bad really quick as soon as someone's got an ego and they're like, no, no, no, my idea has to win because it's my idea. Right, right, right. And that's when you're fucked. Totally, totally, totally. And so any type of collaborative fraternal system like I'm always trying to make goes south quickly and I've been in those situations where you realize one, two people are feeling their noses at a joint. Oh, they haven't had a pitch go through in a little while. Yeah, yeah. Oh, and because I'm in some ways pantomiming that I'm not in charge.

32:25Right, right, right. That becomes infuriating when you're the person who's never getting their idea through and there's no boss. Right. Or actually, you know, on some level, it's like, it's not that there's no boss. It's that you don't have the decency to admit you're the boss. Bingo. It's almost a corrupt evil. You don't, yes, you don't want to do the, you don't want to be like someone's got to. It's cowardly. It's cowardly of me. On some level, it is a little cowardly. Hugely. And I recognize that.

32:53Matt Johnson:And the way that I've tried to protect myself is to be around people who I love and would really do anything for. Right? You've met Kurt and Bobby. What I was just going to say is working with you guys on the special is literally what I strive to do on a collaborative thing. Because you guys were so open with each other. And sometimes what would read as straight up mean, but it wasn't mean. It was like, we don't have enough time to even fucking talk about this. I know the answer. Just shut the fuck up. But then the same person who said that four seconds later would say something else. You'd be like, you're a fucking genius.

33:29Right. You're the fuck. You'd be kissing him on the mouth. That's such a beautiful idea, right? And there was just such freedom to truly no ego and truly you motherfuckers moved as a real unit. You know, it was like you, Kurt, Bobby, Jared felt like Power Rangers were the separate. The Megazord. The Megazord. The Megazord.

33:46Matt Johnson:It felt like you guys felt like the Megazord. It's a great feeling. And the truth is, there's a Steve Jobs quote about this, which is that if you work with great people, you realize very quickly you work for them. Right. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. And that is, I've just found that it's not just that it's a true idea. That's just reality. Right. Like I need to keep them interested. I need to keep my collaborators involved and invested more so than they need to impress me. Right, right, right. Because at any moment, these guys are so talented, they could leave and do anything they want. They could do anything they want, which is so challenging for me.

34:24Matt Johnson:Because, well, think about it. So you call me. You say, hey, Matt, guess what? You're directing my special. Remember what I said at first? I don't. I said no. Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah. Of course. I said, no, I don't know how to do that. I don't want to. And you said, unfortunately, you are. And that's really all it took. Like, we're close enough that that's all you had to say. Well, I was also like, dude, this is not. Well, yes, you lied to me as well. I did, I did. You said there was going to be no work. easy yeah right right but i also i knew that lie would work because yes there's a version of a special where i could have directed a special yeah but i know i knew you would never do that i knew you were good you don't work on anything you manipulated i did i manipulate and look i thought i was like no really what it was like if this motherfucker just gives me some long lens like if we just shoot this interesting at the baseline i remember you said that to me as well I told you, I was like, I just want this to look different at least.

35:16But I think what we did, but I just, I had a hunch. And here's the funny thing. I had a hunch something magical would happen. But at the same time, the thing you pitched, I thought would never work. I remember. I was like, all right, dickhead, sure. We can't just interview 100 lunatics in Toronto until we get one guy. Yeah, my technique. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Of course. Right? I was like, we need to come up, we need to find a magic random person. We only have four shots at it.

35:42Matt Johnson:And we need to find him in the first two shows. And realistically, it has to happen in the first two shows so we can, like, whatever. Like, we have this whole idea and watch the special. I do – I don't want to suck us off too much, right? This is – but I do think we pulled off what we thought might be possible. Exactly. And so you've got to imagine my perspective when I go to these guys who I work on everything with and I say, hey, so I'm going to go direct this Stavros special. Do you guys want to come do it? And then, of course, I'm in the position that you were just in, which is they're like, well, why would we?

36:13Matt Johnson:And I realize, of course, I need to do work that is worth their time. Right, right, right. And it's the promise I make. I mean, you tell me how you feel about this because it's so different for a standard comedian. But you, too, have a group of people who are supporting you. And in some ways, they work for you. But you owe them. Yeah, that's my family. I mean, truly. That's your family. In a fucked up way, my family are my employees in that my best friend, Eldis, is my podcast producer and my tour manager. And until very recently, my assistant was my best friend growing up, Christina, who we live.

36:50Me, Christina, Eldis lived in Astoria together. They had real jobs. They subsidized my life. They let me live in the corner of their apartment for 500 bucks a month when I was dead broke. And these are people I can trust. Anyway, I just – yeah, that unit is just – and Ben O 'Brien who, you know, we go way back.

37:08Matt Johnson:Unbelievable guy. The best in the world. The best in the world. But you see what I mean when I say that when you have a responsibility for you to do well, to do well by them. And so when I'm pitching Kurt and Bobby and Jared, hey, do you guys want to come make this special for Stav? I need to make it worth their while. And by extension, when I'm making a deal with any collaborator, and if that's like a member of the crew of a movie or an actor, I mean, it's the deal I made you. I said, hey, listen, you have no reason to really trust me. But I promise that if you do and that if you – what's the word?

37:46Matt Johnson:It's not that I asked you to take a huge risk. But if you risk embarrassing yourself, I promise you, I promise you, I will be the one in the end who makes sure that this is maybe not the best movie ever. made, but it's the best I am capable of making. And I'm not going to give up on it ever, ever, ever. And I will be the person who's fighting with the studio, with anybody who's telling me that we actually need to change something. And I feel like more than anything, that's the role I provide to people on these projects, which is that, yeah, I don't really know what I'm doing. I'm kind of stupid.

38:20Matt Johnson:I don't have a great idea of how movies even get made, but I promise that in the end, I'm willing to die for this to be good. Yeah, and I believe you. Maybe even too much. Too much. I do think too much sometimes. And that, I think, allows people to then go, okay, so then I can commit everything to this. A hundred percent. And listen, it was like such a no-brainer when you called me to do it. Basically, the call was like, hey, can you come bully Dominic Cecil for two weeks? And you remember what you said? You said, I have a lot of things I could say to you. I know. I know. I mean, I don't know.

38:52I said this at a different interview. I think we did so much press yesterday, but I really, really was like, I didn't actually want it, but a part of me was like, I hope Dom is a piece of shit. I hope this guy's a piece of shit. Because look, my whole life, the villain in my story is a handsome guy. Handsome guy who gets everything handed to him. Who's been handed everything, right? And like Dom, and there's a way to look at Dom when you don't know him. Easily. And you don't know his story. Private school kid who gets cast in an Alexander Faye movie.

39:18Matt Johnson:And he's good. Yeah. And that's the most fucking annoying part. He wasn't just a pretty face that they put in the background while Paul Giamatti did all the heavy lifting. This motherfucker acted his dick off on that movie. And he had no, and it was like, where did this kid come from? I didn't even tell Dom the story, but it was like, when I watched that movie, I watched it with a girl. And it hit me so hard, mostly, and I'm trying to be cool. And she's just like, oh, this is a pretty good movie. And I'm like, yeah, that's pretty good. And I'm like, just trying not to start crying. But that's how effect, and so yes, handsome, like model good looks.

39:50effortless effortless gets handed a not just a movie career but like leading man career at fucking 20 I think within like

39:57Matt Johnson:six months of that movie coming out he was on the cover of like GQ right right right and so part of me is like yeah I can fucking I can go destroy this kid on camera God sent me to humiliate him yes yes yes but then Dom is the best kid and he's he tried he was trying so hard he was putting himself into it and it's interesting because what does try even mean because what you what you've told them was like your part like i just need you to react basically i said don't do it don't change a fucking thing don't do anything and and that's even in some ways that's harder because there's no homework to do there's no exercise there's no it's like hearing you're going to war yeah and all you do is sit in the boat yeah yeah just wait for somebody to hand you a rifle and then all right action you know what i mean like and so he was and and so when i met him he's the the best kid of in of all time really and i loved him immediately um but it's and it actually made it harder to hit to hit him because i remember that that day was like fuck i feel bad for this kid because i can't because you can't just the guy i'm playing is a blue collar fucking he's not going to come up with an in-character insult about the about this tony bourdain kid he's going to see a gawky guy and he's going to say you look like a fucking you look like you're wearing women's clothes yeah yeah yeah yeah yeah yeah yeah Yeah, yeah.

41:15Could have called him a gay giraffe. Bingo.

41:17Matt Johnson:You know what I mean? Like, that's the level of insult that he's... Things that he probably is more sensitive about than if you were to talk about his psychological issues. Exactly. Just pure surface-level roasting. And I literally, I was like, this is the worst, this is the worst, like, roasting I've ever... These are the worst circumstances for roasting. It's a target I don't want to hit in a completely silent movie set. Yeah, and Antonio Banderas is watching. And Antonio, yes, yes, yes. And it was like pretty early. Oh, yeah. And I was like, and dude, more than I gave a fuck about the movie, I was like, I need Antonio.

41:52I need sort of like that. That's all. Dude, truly, that's all I get. And we got there eventually with the first, you know, he was the man we were, you know, he would actually just like, you know, somebody who's that legendary. If he was like, if you called, if there was a lunch break and a helicopter came down and picked him up for 40 minutes. Nobody would have blinked. Of course. And he doesn't even land. He just eats lunch. He does a circle. He eats lunch circling our green room. Great. Makes it too windy and hot. I'd be like, thank you, sir. It's an honor to eat in the wake of your helicopter.

42:22Your helicopter wins, sir. Thank you. But no, he was there. He was fucking hanging out. He was the man. He was so graceful. Yeah. I'm sad he couldn't make it to the premiere. I literally miss Antonio Banderas. I miss him more than members of my family. Easily. If you told me I could have one day with Antonio Banderas or a year with my elderly aunt. Oh, sorry. Another healthy year. Another healthy year. A healthy year in my life. Oh, easy, dude. But I need a full day. I need a full day in Malaga. You know, for a year of my life, I need...

42:49Matt Johnson:And he treats you as a peer. Exactly. Yeah, yeah, yeah. He takes me to the little restaurant he only knows about. Get me the freshest paella. You know what I mean? We got dancing. I want to go, you know. Did you see him dance? No. He's unbelievable. Of course he is. He's unbelievable. He's unbelievable at everything. The first day on set, we're shooting the scene where I had to send him and Dom out in a boat with these fish. And of course, boat doesn't work. We entered a fish. and he rightfully on mic says to Dom I've never really been in this situation before and Dom's looking at him he can't defend me I'm back on the shore and I'm like oh yeah well I really fucked this up Antonio Banderas thinks I'm a clown and the movie's done anyway he comes back after we finish the scene and he's staying in a local person's house just somebody in Cape Cod because we have no green room so we're like in the community and he's in their home and they've graciously said I mean how graciously they said Antonio Banderas has come to your house.

43:44Matt Johnson:They said, of course. I go in to talk to him because I'm going to apologize. I'm like, I'm sorry, things have gone so badly. I walk in and I can hear piano music. And I walk in, I'm like, what's going on? Him and the entire family, they're all around the piano. He's playing and singing traditional Spanish music and everyone is dancing. And I look over, I go, Antonio. And he looks over at me like, hey, one second. It's like he's an X-Men whose superpower is everyone you meet will fall in love with you. They love him. It's insane. And not even, he chooses the type of love. He chooses platonic, romantic, whatever it is.

44:21Agape. Agape, yeah, yeah, yeah. Of course, every different type of love. He can choose what type, but he can make, if he sends his little laser beams on it, he'll decide, you're toast. Eros. It's Eros. Yeah, I would say that's his real secret weapon. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Yeah.

44:36Matt Johnson:Yeah, truly the man. Yeah, I loved him, and he gave us such a gift by coming to be in this film. and I don't know how he even did what he did because it's not like he and I had a plan where I was like, okay. I mean, I made the character Roman Catholic. I gave him as much biographical information that was pertinent to him as I could, but that was all him. He's like, I'm super humble. I never raised my voice. I got a problem with taking the Lord's name in vain. Right, right, right. Yeah, he, that was, I mean, look, I've been lucky to work with some good-ass actors, obviously, with barely acting myself, but it was like there was a lot of heavy he was doing so much heavy lifting in that kitchen because we all everything, what was awesome about this movie was that the real life dynamics just mirrored the movie it was kind of insane how exactly perfect the casting was for where everybody was in their lives and yeah our characters are taking their cues from Chef but also every actor in there is like whatever the fuck Antonio Banderas does, I'm getting on that wavelength.

45:43Matt Johnson:Bingo. If Matt says that's wrong, I don't fucking care. I'm doing what Antonio Banderas says. Thank God that didn't happen too much because that would have been a real problem. It really didn't. I remember the only time it ever got tested was when he was absolutely convinced his character needed to make a shrimp paella. Do you remember that? Where he was like, it's important, my character must make one. And I was like, Antonio, it's not on the menu. Yeah, yeah, yeah. And he was like, and then this was the compromise. He said, I'm going to do it anyway. and you just don't shoot me. And I was like, deal.

46:14Matt Johnson:I mean, what am I going to say? Like, yeah, you got it. No problem, boss. You got it. And then so for that, and do you want to know what scene that is? That's the scene where Leo comes in and punches him. So when you watch that in the movie, watch what Antonio's doing at the beginning of the scene. Oh, my God. He's peeling shrimp for a shrimp paella. That's so fucking funny. I guess it's just for family meal. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Which was another big part of it. But yeah, it led to my favorite scene in the whole movie. And I love that reaction from you. God, it's one of the few things that I had in my head when I'm putting the movie together.

46:47Matt Johnson:I was like, man, the expression that Stavros can have watching Antonio Banderas get punched, which is because you have an attitude both in real life and in the film of just try it. You know, I'm ready for anything. I will never be surprised. Right, right, right. In fact, it's one of your gifts. Right. I can literally roll with the punches, right? Whatever happens, you'll be the first to laugh. Yes, yes, yes. And you're gifted in that way. It's almost like you're unflappable. There's a great term in a John Updike book. You're as invincible as a Clorox bottle. And it's true. It's very hard to imagine you seeing something that makes you panic.

47:24Matt Johnson:And I thought if Leo punching Antonio can get a rise out of Stavros, then the audience is really going to know this has really crossed a line. I know what you mean. Crossed a line that is scary. Yeah, because particularly my character in this is like, he is the guy who's like, all right, everybody, shut the fuck up. He kind of is, he's like, for a sports analogy, he's almost like Draymond Green, right? On the Warriors. Do you're a basketball guy? I don't follow this reference at all, but I will play ball. Anyway, whatever. Let's just make it more general where it's like, he's not the best player on the team.

47:58And I'm not a good chef. if I'm not, whatever, even in the story. That's not why you're there. That's not why I'm there. Yes. But I do a really good job, and the intangibles, I kind of do feel like, in many ways, my character was sort of like the locker room guy, the backbone, almost like the family backbone of this. Of course, you set the culture of the place more than anybody. The heavy lifting I'm doing is not, you don't see it, but it's, yes, we're all, let's all get along, and I have this all, they definitely used to go out you know they would go out drinking and I would organize and we'd get a little piece of that at the you know during the family service and also there's a guy who's been there for 10 years right in my head right and so if he's like oh fuck

48:42Matt Johnson:this has never happened before of course yeah because I even remember I remember and I never I was like we'll do anything I don't give a fuck the one thing I was on the page that scene I think I told you this already where I was like I just feel like my character wouldn't, would get in the mix. Like, I remember, I remember, I remember, I remember feeling like, and I, and truly, I never had a single, mostly because we never, it was always, every, every time I got on set, we kind of decided what to do. It wasn't like, there wasn't much, but that was such a crucial scene where we were like going over it.

49:14And I was like, dude, I don't, I just, it feels right to me. And like, right before we were shooting, I was thinking that, even to the point where I was like. That you would need to break up the fight in some way. Or even that I would get, that it wouldn't feel right not to get in the mix earlier. And then this is such a testament to Leo where it's like the way he acted, the way his character behaved, it was like it legitimately, I was like, oh no, I would be fucking scared to get in this.

49:39Matt Johnson:This is just way above this dickhead's pay grade. And that was also a moment where I was like, oh fuck, there is really good acting. You know what I mean? Like there are moments of how the last couple of years have gone where it's like, it just like, I hate how much like, actor-y bullshit is getting into my head. You know what I mean? But it works. How much like, talking about energy. You know what I mean? Like, talking about shit like that. And it's like, but man, if like, I straight up was getting goosebumps. Like, Leo was so fucking good that it felt different in there. And I was like, this is the perfect performance.

50:21he's acting so well that background act background acting is hard when you're not a real actor when you're some guy that they bring in to say insults

50:30Matt Johnson:yeah right but that was like I just felt like and again that kitchen felt like a kitchen it didn't feel like a set at all right right right it was fucking insane how much I felt like I was at work I was gonna say how much do you want to bet that how much do you want to bet that the whole reason that I find your reaction in that scene so powerful and why for me it makes the scene is precisely because you believed that you would never not step in. Ooh, yes. How much do you want to bet that it's your expectation being broken in the moment that then for me watching it as an audience member goes, oh, something has happened here that was not planned.

51:08Yeah. There must be a relationship between those two things

51:12Matt Johnson:because why are you feeling so strongly the other way? And I mean, I have no expectation. Had you, by the way, gone in and been like, guys guys guys fucking relax in fact there is a moment and when you're watching the scene you'll hear it you hear your voice and it's in the scene i'm in a close-up on leo and you hear you go guys and you say it with that tone of voice that i've heard you say yeah when you witnessed an argument in real life where you go guys and leo turns to you we don't even see you and he goes shut the fuck up he screams in your face yeah and that's the last time we hear yeah yeah because he's so in the pocket.

51:45Matt Johnson:Yeah, he was. He was. And we're just improvising. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Like the scene is just happening. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. And nobody breathed a word after that. Because I don't want to get beat up by Leo Woodall. Of course. And he took it there. Yeah, he really did. No, he was at 10 for sure. I had a fantasy early on when I'm writing that where I was like, oh, and then they should bring out knives and they should fight and I'll have Zorro fighting. Right. There was a knife fight that we cut. You're right. You're right. And then it was Antonio who came up to me and he said, do you think I'd really bring up a knife to this guy?

52:15Matt Johnson:And I said, why do you say that? And he said, don't I love him? And I went, oh wait, that's the whole scene. That's the whole scene. Of course, you would never try to hurt him. You love him. And that's why the scene becomes, what do you mean? How could I punch you? I love you. It's Leo completely tearing up the constitution of that kitchen. And then having him thrown back in his face. Because the brilliance of it is, of course, the first half where he throws this punch and you go, hey guys, everything's changed and this is no longer a safe place. And then he says to his father, basically, okay, well, you know, we're finally going to do this.

52:52Matt Johnson:I hate you. You hate me. So let's see who the real man is. I think it's me. I bet you think it's you. So let's go. And then Antonio Banderas is looking at him and he's kind of flummoxed, almost crying. And he goes, I like you. And then of course, Leo is so crushed by the realization that, oh wait, this guy wasn't my enemy, he was my friend, that he has to run away and basically swears revenge. Of course. Because what else are you going to do? It's so my experience where my whole childhood, I'm like, oh, my mom hates me. She hates me. And that's why my life is like this. Holy shit. And okay, fine.

53:25Matt Johnson:She hates me. I hate her. Easy. I know how to play that game. We just, that's why I was put here. And that's why she was put here to torture me. And I was put here to try to get out from under her thumb. No problem. And then my first step into adulthood is realizing, come on, she's acting this way because she cares about me. She loves me more than anybody will ever love me in my life. And I had it so backwards. And there's nothing more painful than that. That sent me reeling for years. That's your Gilgamesh right there, bro. Oh, yeah. Yeah. That's the foundational understanding what you had. Yeah, I'm still making movies about it.

54:04Yeah.

54:07Matt Johnson:Yeah, next one we'll make about your dad. Oh, that's going to be a good one. Yeah, yeah, yeah. I know, I do think... Greek Town. Greek Town, baby. Let's do it. Fire it up. 824, hey, we're on the podcast. Can we get a little... Oh, wait a minute. I think they might actually own it. Yeah, oh, fuck. I didn't sign shit. I think they might own the movie. Anyway, thank you for tuning in to the 824 podcast. It was wonderful. I'm Matt Johnson here with Stavi. Oh, yeah, let's introduce ourselves.