Building the Beast: Dane Brugler's midseason top-three at every position

0:02Welcome to another episode of Building the Beast. I am Dave Hellman. Every single week, Dane Brugler and myself seek to build the beast, his annual NFL draft catalog. Today, we took a step back. We wanted to look at the bigger picture. We talked a lot about how we felt about this draft class over the summer heading into the season. And as we near the halfway point of the season, we wanted to see how some of those projections stood up. Who has impressed? Who has lived up to the hype? Who has come out of nowhere? all of that good stuff. Dane was gracious enough to indulge me by ranking his top three players at every position in the game.

0:43We went through all of them. Really fun conversation with Dane and myself. Let's get into it.

0:53And joining me now, as always, it's my co-host, Dane Brugler, coming live from the former home of Joe Flacco. Dane, how we doing, bud? Good. Yeah, you don't really see the inter-division trades very often, but this is one of those, eh, sure, I guess. Why not? I mean, you know, the Bengals are desperate, right? And the Browns, it's a rookie movement, so Browns need to find out what they got with these young guys, and it's going to be the Dylan Gabriel show, at least for the time being. We'll see if that changes down the road. From an NFL perspective, anything that makes the Bengals resemble watchable is a win in my book.

1:34And then on top of that, for our purposes, Dane, we'll get plenty more Dylan Gabriel opportunities. And at some point, I don't know, maybe Shadur Sanders enters the conversation. I think it's still too soon to have that talk right now. But with Joe Flacco off the roster, I think that becomes a more realistic possibility at some point during the season, even if it's not soon. Yeah, which I think is what we all expected at some point. You know, the Browns need to know what they have in him. And, you know, I thought Dylan Gabriel was fine in his debut, like a tough, tough place to make your NFL debut.

2:10But he was fine and he's just limited. He's always going to be limited. But in terms of moving the ball, getting first downs, like he'll be able to do that. And I think he'll be better. But yeah, I mean, there's a reason I think Dylan Gabriel is looked at as a backup projection around the league. So, yeah, I think the Browns, they're still open for business when it comes to the quarterback of the future. I think it's funny. The Browns draft class was already a gold mine. If you talk about draft prospects like we do, and now we might actually get to see, you know, the guys that got all the headlines who haven't been playing, they're going to join the mix, too.

2:49So we'll see what that looks like. That is not the topic of the day though. I'm really excited for this show. We're taking a little bit of a departure. We're not doing so much of a recap and, and the, the normal format of the show this week, because we're getting, we're getting into October. We're getting into conference play. Teams are starting to get into the meat of their conference schedule. We've also just got a decent sample size. We've played six weeks of college football. everybody's played at least five games so it's close enough to the halfway point of the season that i wanted to do something and dane i appreciate you playing along because it's a heavy lift on your part to re-examine how you feel about guys and and you'll have your revised top 50 out later on this season this is this is not that right but for the purposes of the podcast we just kind of wanted to revisit where things stood as opposed to in August when we had nothing to go on.

3:51So what we're doing today is we're going to look at every position in the game and just go through Dane's top three players so far this season. It's nothing set in stone. It could change as soon as this weekend. We're going to mention some other guys that maybe we'd like to see a little bit more from some guys who have had disappointing seasons so far that still have a chance to fix it. So it's fluid, but we wanted to look at where things stand at the top of each position in our opinion anyway. And I think this will be a really good thought exercise after a little bit less than half of the season.

4:28No doubt. It's a good chance to reset the rankings because obviously, yeah, like you said, things have changed. and so this is a good opportunity to kind of take a step back reassess like you said there these things are very fluid rankings shouldn't be fluid in february you know you shouldn't be drastically altering what you think based off 40 times and all of that but in season when there's still tape to be watched and games to be played updated evidence out there yeah there's going to be some fluctuation and so i think this is a good time to do a reset see where guys stand and then And, you know, maybe a couple of weeks from now, we can even do it again and kind of get a sense for how these rankings are shaping up.

5:09All right. So let's just jump into it. Otherwise, we're going to be here all day the way we like to talk about prospects. Let's start with the moneymaker, the headline grabber, the quarterback position. It's been a relatively surprising year compared to the preseason hype, but a lot to dig into with this position. So you've got your top three. Take it whichever way you want to go. You want to start at three and work our way up, or do you want to start at one? Let's do two and three, because that's my view on these guys really hasn't changed. That two, Lenora Sellers, South Carolina, three, Fernando Mendoza, Indiana.

5:45Look, both these guys were ranked top 20 prospects for me coming into the year. They were quarterbacks two and four. And so Sellers stays at two. Mendoza jumps Nussmeier, takes over that third spot. And I think there seems to be a narrative that Sellers has struggled this year. And I don't think that's exactly true. The stats aren't amazing. And I understand why he's not a Heisman candidate. But from a scouting perspective, I don't think anything has really happened to drastically change what you thought of him coming into the year. Super explosive athlete still is probably the strongest quarterback I've ever evaluated.

6:18That still shows up every single time you watch him. And I think he's getting incrementally better as a passer. there's throws where yes the placement needs to be better um the pacing isn't there he's trying to throw a fastball when he needs to throw a change up but again he's still he just turned 20 years old this is a young player that's growing in front of our eyes and he missed one game due to a concussion that's a factor in this uh as well but every single tape from this year there are multiple throws that make you sit up and say okay yeah that that's the guy that i can see why people are getting excited about him so he's at two and then Mendoza I he's played exactly how I expected to be honest coming over from Cal to Indiana the physical traits aren't going to blow you away but he's efficient he's accurate he knows how to attack defenses so nothing has really changed in my eyes from the Mendoza evaluation so with all due respect to Fernando Mendoza I mean we've talked a lot about him on this show and he'll have another big opportunity to prove himself this week.

7:19Indiana goes to Oregon. Huge game on the schedule. I'm glad we're talking about sellers and like if I'm looking for blind spots as a host, we haven't talked a ton about him this year. Other like we talked about him when South Carolina beat Virginia Tech in the opener and it's kind of been quiet ever since and I feel a little bit bad about that, but by potential QB1 standards, you kind of mentioned it. There's not that much to go on. Like he gets knocked out of the Vanderbilt game early. And, and then last week against Kentucky, I mean, South Carolina beat the brakes off the Wildcats, but a game where you're not really asking a whole lot of heavy lifting of your quarterback.

7:59I mean, he did have a very impressive day as a runner, but just not like a game where you needed your quarterback. I will say there were some really, really impressive throws on the Missouri tape. I know South Carolina lost that game, But all the stuff people were excited about, and I feel like that game kind of got lost in the noise, but all of the stuff people were excited about was on display there with with his arm talent and the throws that he was making. Yeah, no doubt. The Missouri, there was a one I think is in the second quarter. There's like three plays back to back to back where it's just like, oh, yeah, NFL throw, NFL throw, NFL decision.

8:35Like he makes plays on every single tape against Kentucky. There was one play where he was rolling out to his right and threw a perfect seed for a first down, move the chains. Like there are enough improvements that he has shown as a passer that tells me he's on the right trajectory. Now this weekend going to LSU against a, a pretty good defense that will be okay. Next step. Let's see you do it. That'll be a big step for him. Obviously in the sec, see almost every single week you're playing a pretty good opponent so you know we it's a constant evaluation on these guys but i think where we are right now sellers mendoza neither guy have really i think played outside of what we thought coming in they've both been pretty good you can see why you know people could be excited about their future um so two and three have been pretty what we thought number one now that's where we this is not what we thought coming in uh yeah I'd say that's, I would say that's fair.

9:34Well, with Dante Moore from Oregon, all we had was a five starts at UCLA that were bad in 2023 backs up Dylan Gabriel last year at Oregon. And this year has just been outstanding. He is obviously the newcomer here. We've been talking about it almost every week now. It feels like as, okay, this is a quarterback on a first round trajectory based on what he's put on tape so far, 14 to one touchdown interception ratio. The amount of times on the Penn State tape where it was on the quarterback to bail out the offense, whether it was the left tackle not making the block or, you know, the way that the offense is structured, some of the receivers not turning in time to look for the ball or they're not executing the route combination exactly how they're supposed to.

10:21A lot was on the quarterback to make things right, and he did it consistently, both with his arm and his legs. So such a promising start for Dante Moore in this offense. And I mean, based on what we see right now, how can he not be the favorite to be that number one guy? Now, obviously, you wish he had more starts under his belt. If he does make that jump to the NFL up to this level, he's only going to have, you know, have under 20 starts to his name. And that's not ideal. But the way he's been playing, talking to scouts, they think it's now a more realistic possibility. he could make that jump.

10:58And it's, it's always tough when you're dealing with that limited sample size. We'll talk about this with Ty Simpson, the Alabama quarterback moving forward. Simpson's been a strong quarterback as well, but he has five starts. And so it's, it does make it a little difficult, but with Dante more until he proves us. Otherwise it's hard not to have him at the top. He recently became the betting favorite to win the Heisman trophy. And just looking at Oregon's schedule, I would guess they're going to be favored to win the rest of the games until they reach the college football playoff, which I hate to act like it's already like set in stone.

11:37But that just feels like where the Ducks are headed. So, I mean, there's plenty of opportunity as good as we feel about him, like as much progress as Dante Moore has made in the eyes of evaluators since September. there's that much more opportunity if this ducks team does in fact wind up with, I mean, I would even say it seems likely that they get a buy in the postseason the way that they did last year. Well, honestly, that might come down to Oregon against Ohio state in the big 10 championship game for that. Bring it on baby. Exactly. Like that would be a lot of fun. I mean, Ohio state that defense has been unbelievable this year.

12:12We'll talk more about those guys in a little bit. They have yet to allow a red zone touchdown. I think there's like eight, eight chances for the offense and zero, zero touchdowns allowed in the red zone. So it's been it's been crazy watching that that group this year. Minnesota had no shot. It'll get tougher here. You know, Penn State's coming up, you know, some more offenses that can score points coming up. But I would from an evaluation perspective would not be upset to see Ohio State and Oregon meet again. They met twice last year, split that one. it'd be fun to see that third matchup, uh, this year as well.

12:50Without giving anything away, we'll be highlighting plenty of Ohio state players on this, on this list of ours, uh, real quickly. I think you, you mentioned, I think, uh, Mendoza passed Garrett Nussmeier to move into your top three. Obviously it's been a, it's been a forgettable season for Nussmeier so far. We, we talked last week about why that might be the case. Nussmeyer had a week off, so hopefully coming out of the buy, he is a healthier player. And yeah, I mean, Garrett Nussmeyer versus Lenora Sellers is a heck of a, I guess, if Dante Moore and Fernando Mendoza is like the top billing, that's a nice little undercard on Saturday to see where those two guys stand.

13:32No doubt. I mean, it is a good chance to just check in and see, okay, yeah, because we've talked about it before with Nussmeyer. He's clearly not healthy and that's affecting his play having the bye week when it did was seemed like a good time how does he show up against a south carolina defense that can get after you um that'll be dylan stewart's one of the best players in the country a defensive end for the gamecocks how does that uh work itself out and you know nussmeyer right now it's not like you're not speak for myself i'm not bailing on him as a prospect at all he just he's more in limbo right now because it's because of the injury because of all the factors of that offense you know there's just no run game the offensive line things we've talked about before so not bailing on Nussmeier by any means it's just he his draft stock is a little bit in limbo right now as we let the season play out and get a better sense for okay how much of this is on the quarterback possible regression how much of it is the supporting cast and the the injury that are really affecting him you mentioned it about South Carolina too.

14:34I mean, Lenora sellers and Garrett Nussmeyer, it's all out there in front of them still even halfway through the season because South Carolina plays like half of the top 10 over the next month. And LSU has four more ranked opponents on its schedule as well. So even if it's in particular, more, more so for nuts, I mean, I don't think sellers has been disappointing, but just in terms of making a stronger impression in the second half of the season, And there's still plenty of opportunity to do that. And I would both of them. I would throw out the, you know, material when he comes back for Oklahoma, it sounds like he might be able to play this weekend against Texas, which is crazy when he just had surgery on his throwing hand two weeks ago.

15:15You know, I think Josh Hoover, what he's doing at TCU name to keep on the right on the radar, Brandon Sorsby at Cincinnati name to keep on the radar. These are younger. These are all underclassmen. If they play their way, they're capable the rest of the year. we'll be talking more and more about them um and i did want to mention drew aller and kate clubnick um i didn't have either of these guys in my first round um with first round grades coming into the year so obviously no real change there neither have really played up to what we hoped you know maybe they could take that next step clubnick was better against north carolina but it's north carolina and uh you know drew aller that that penn state loss at ucla was tough but honestly it might have been Aller's best game.

15:57There's a lot of issues with that Penn State offense. The lack of explosive plays in the passing game is astounding. They have 13 completions all year over 20 yards, which is the same as Northwestern. It's like 106th in the nation. So it's something that the offense needs to figure out, and it's more than a quarterback issue going on in Penn State. I don't want John Mateer to do anything irresponsible, but it would be a hell of a story if he can play 16, 17 days removed from surgery on that hand. I don't do anything reckless, John or Oklahoma, but it sure would be a fascinating storyline. I'll have my eye on the Red River shootout in Dallas this weekend for sure.

16:46Let's move on to running back really quickly. I think not, not terribly surprising. Jeremiah love still your top running back. I don't know if we need to dive super deep on that. You know, we, we gave it, we, our eyebrows perked up a little bit with the slow start that he had against Miami. And then Notre Dame has proceeded to remember that he's their best player and his performance reflects that we've known running back one from the start. Obviously Jeremiah love is, he was the only running back to make my top 50 in the preseason and um I think the bigger question was okay who's going to step up and be running back to right now I'm leaning towards Justice Haynes from Michigan who has played well Alabama transfer um I'm surprised that they let him go as easily as easily as they did um I think some will remember his dad Varon Haynes who was a running back for the Steelers not that long ago but just a good player.

17:45But Haynes was born to play the position. Love his vision, the run balance, the way he drops his pads into contact, he grinds yards, catches the ball well. I think his ceiling might be capped a little bit just because I don't see a lot of suddenness. I don't see a lot of the creativity as an athlete where he's going to make a lot of explosive plays, but he does all the running back specific things well. So all the talent is there for him to be a quality pro back. with all due respect to justice hands, can we talk about your number three running back who is an early favorite of mine? Like it's way too early in the cycle to say that you have a pet cat, but it's not, it's never too early, man.

18:30The first night of the season when Washington played, I think it was Colorado state. I got my first look at Jonah Coleman and every week since I just check in on him and I'm like, yep, still a badass this guy's really fun what tell me more please yeah i know he's the only uh player in college football with double digit rushing touchdowns um he is he's looking quicker this year for a guy that's stocky and like he's short but not small he is built like you want a running back to be built um he his pacing his tempo has been awesome the vision's been terrific uh he and like i said he just looks a little bit quicker this year um and a lot of the what i said about haynes fits for coleman where he does a lot of the running back specific traits uh a lot of those things he does it does them very well and he catches the ball well um he he won't put the ball on the ground um you just you trust him and so he didn't have a great week this past week against uh when they went to maryland but uh you know he will get what is blocked for him plus a little bit more he is this is not a loaded running back class but both these guys I think justice Haynes Coleman Jonah Coleman you just have a good idea of what you're getting with them however much he might have struggled against Maryland I was that impressed by what he did against again you talked about how nasty Ohio State's defenses and I thought he made a very good showing of himself you're so right like 5 '9 to 28 just gives me a mental image of what you might look like running the football and it's not Jonah Coleman dude like his his feet are constantly moving the suddenness with which he makes cuts he he does not move like his uh like his bio suggests that he might and it's like he's a jump cut runner like he is and he is chiseled he is rocked up uh but the way that he can run with burst through a crease but then also getting in and out of his cuts is really impressive for a guy that size.

20:32And like I said, he sees the field well. He can work between the tackles. He can work outside the tackles. Yeah, I think he'll be drafted somewhere in the top, probably top three rounds. There's a good chance Jeremiah Love is still the only running back in my top 50 when I update it in a month or a couple of weeks here. But these two guys are worth watching on day two. So before we take a break, any other running backs that you want to mention, even if they didn't make your top three? Um, you know, I, the Penn State running backs, I think the way I thought, you know, Singleton being a 220 back, he's going to run a four three.

21:12It's like, okay, I get the talent is there. Katron Allen's been a better back this year for Penn State. And another guy that looks quicker, um, I, Penn State needs to get Katron Allen the ball more. uh, plain and simple. And that's, that's something I'm hoping to see here over the next, uh, the second half of the year, because that stood out big time watching the UCLA tape, watching the Oregon tape. Katron Allen gives them a little more juice because he can find extra yardage. He's not running into the back of his blockers. Um, he's just a better, there's no doubt that Singleton's a better athlete, especially at that size.

21:47Katron Allen's a better running back. Um, and so I think teams will really be split about, okay, hey, do we want the better running back or are we going to bet on the better athlete? Hope we can develop him. But, you know, these two backs are worth watching the rest of the way. Really curious to see how Penn State responds to such an obvious disappointment. I mean, to fall out of the top 25 as a playoff favorite. And obviously they've got plenty of draftable players, plenty of chance to salvage the season. I mean, you got you got games left to make an impression. And I mean, I don't really care about the playoff picture for the purposes of this, but how guys with this talent level and NFL aspirations respond to being very far from where they thought they would be.

22:34I think that's that's interesting to watch. All right. We are going to take that quick break. And on the other side of it, a fun conversation about the wide receiver class.

22:46All right, Dane. Receiver is a position that I remember all the way back in August. We had a couple of names. We weren't sure how it would all shake out. We weren't sure who would make their claim at the top of this position group. Roughly halfway through the season. How do you feel about it? I mean, I do think there's one obvious guy that is living up to his billing, but how does the rest of this shake out for you? I feel a lot better about this receiver group now compared to the middle of August. No doubt about it. and the three guys in my top three were all in my top 50. So not a big surprise here.

23:25Start with Jordan Tyson, Arizona State. The guy we've been talking about is wide receiver one the whole way. Fluid athlete. The field awareness is outstanding. The ball skills. He's cut down on the drops, which has been awesome to see. He's creating his own space consistently in his routes. And I think just having the continuity of the coaching, the offensive coaches are the same. Heinz Ward still there coaching him up. the quarterback Sam Levitt still there making plays I think that has helped his development is just having that continuity from last year to this year he leads the FBS and touchdown catches and I think he as he continues to develop his craft you see the impact he's making just get bigger and bigger which is saying something because he was already making a big impact I think so I still have him at wide receiver one the I think the interesting thing is at wide receiver two which felt wide open coming into the year I think it's it's less and less wide open now because I think Mekhi Lemon from USC has been he's really proven himself as a guy that wants that spot at wide receiver two I think the best way to sum him up is I think he could be this year as a makeup Buka uh and I say that because well that's that's an eyebrow raising statement considering what a Buka is doing in the NFL right now well and I say that because uh like the test Testing might not be amazing with, you know, that was it with a Buka.

24:47He wasn't an amazing athlete, good athlete and not not a bad athlete in any by any means. But he didn't run a four three, anything like that. And I think it'll be same with with Lemon. He's he's not going to be a physical freak in terms of size and the testing numbers. But he knows how to play the position and he knows how to play it at a high level. He can line up across the formation. You want him to play in the slot. You want to play the X, the Z. He can do all of that. A gliding route runner. he can maneuver through coverage he doesn't have to gear down he finds he's so good at finding those open zones for the quarterback he is an elite zone route runner it is really fun to watch uh he catches everything he plays through contact he's rarely and this is one of my favorite things about him he's rarely tackled where he makes the catch and that is key because those hidden yards are all over his tape uh with the yak with how efficient he is making the catch tucking it away and then immediately getting upfield.

25:42I just, I love Lemon. He is so much fun to watch. He is a pro receiver right now. They've got a big one coming up here against Michigan's going down there to LA. Michigan's a pretty good defense. And so this will be a big test for that passing offense, which has been phenomenal this year. Lemon is averaging eight catches for 114 yards in conference play. Like that's eliminating cupcake games. He is balling out against the conference opponents, the tough opponents on the schedule. I don't know if we need to get deep into this right now, but I am curious. I mean, Emeka Ibuka was still a first round pick, a top 20 pick.

26:24But it's always interesting to think about the way people view guys who maybe have like a limited upside, whether it's because of their physical profile or because they play in the slot and people get enamored, rightfully so, with these freakish ex-receivers. But more often than not, guys who are just good at football prove themselves. I mean, you're seeing it with Ibuka right now. I think people just, not that they thought he was bad, but he just wasn't a super sexy prospect. And you're just seeing what a very complete, smart football player can do in the NFL. It makes me wonder what the ceiling draft wise might be for a guy like Mekhi Lemon.

27:10And I think we're all guilty of that. I mean, I know I am in terms of because ideally, yes, you want the six, three, the four, three, you know, you want the monster receiver. That's Julio Jones. I, you know, I get that with a Mekka Buka. It's just an appreciation of what he is. He is so, you know, he knows how to play the position. I think there's an appreciation for that. And Jackson Smith and Jigba is the same way, right? I mean, another guy that we talked about, is he slot only? And he didn't go until, what, the 20th pick? So, you know, there's something to be said about exactly what you're saying.

27:49Being proficient at playing the position as opposed to fitting the mold of what you want. and I think Ibuka is very much that because he's quarterback friendly uh he understands the subtleties of how to uncover and win at the catch point and so to me like that's like I compared him Ibuka coming out my comparison for him was like Rashid Rice where I thought that was his best like let him work in the slot let him get open he can make some plays after the run after the catch but I think he's even um you know past that with the way that he's lining up at the X why not lining up across the formation, doing all these things that Tampa needs him to do.

28:27And I think Lemon can be somewhat similar because he's so diverse with the way he can win in coverage. And just the fact that he's he's a little bit smaller than a Buka, but not by much. And I don't think the testing is going to be all that different. So it'll be it'll be really interesting to see Lemon go up against some better defenses down the stretch. Maybe Lemon will also benefit from what a Buka is doing in the NFL right now. but I'm totally getting ahead of myself wrapping up the receiver spot. I was interested. I, it felt like you had a choice between a guy that you highlighted before the season and Chris bell and a guy that was on your preseason top 50 in Carnell Tate out of Ohio state.

29:10Yeah. And maybe it's recency bias about what, what Carnell Tate did to Minnesota on a Saturday night. But yeah, he gets my number three spot. And I look, Like I've been high on Chris Bell since the summer. I've really been kind of pushing him, but I have a second round grade on Bell. And, you know, he is there's some holes in his game. He needs to work on. He's he but he's a real guy worth talking about, getting excited about. So hated leaving off Chris Bell. I mean, Jeremy Bernard is another one of those guys that just knows how to play receiver. Hate leaving him out of the top three. But Colonel Tate, I mean, you give him any a little bit of a runway.

29:49Good luck. I mean, he's so talented on those one cut routes. the double moves he can manipulate his pacing he can create separation um he's really long as an athlete strong hands drops haven't been an issue for him this year which popped up a little bit when you watch his 2024 tape uh he's one of the best receivers that i've scouted in terms of working the sideline and i think it's such an underrated skill for wide receivers the ability to tightrope the white the length the pull throws out of bounds back in bounds um both the length and the strong hands, it's absolutely a skill and something I think Tate does routinely on his tape.

30:29The clip you posted earlier in the week of the entire Minnesota defense reacting to the Jeremiah Smith end around. Oh my gosh. To open up Carnell Tate on the double move, which, hey, nothing wrong with that. And hopefully Carnell Tate will have a receiver like that, not to take credit away from him, but yeah, I mean, if he's, if he's drawn one-on-one matchups, you're in a good spot. We're going to have a Jeremiah Smith problem. Uh, when we start talking about him next summer, it's going to be a problem because I, I'm trying not to get like hyperbolic about him. He's just so dang good. He's so special.

31:10And for a guy at 220 pounds moving like that, getting open with ease, as soon as he catches it, It's just his acceleration is immediate. He is in a lot of ways exactly how you want to drop a wide receiver. And it's so it is it will. I'm not even going to worry about it right now. I'm just going to enjoy watching him play football. But next, starting in the summer next year, it is going to be hard talking about him without going overboard as a prospect. It's wild to be in that situation with a receiver. Like we've had it happen with quarterbacks a few times like Caleb and Trevor Lawrence. but for a wide receiver to just so obviously be that caliber prospect of full.

31:52I mean, we knew it last year and we know it again this year. So like two whole years before he can be drafted, but never, I digress. We don't, we don't need to do Jeremiah Smith right now. Let's move on to tight end. And here's my question for you, Dane. I don't think I'm, we don't need to be dramatic about this. Kenyon Sadiq at Oregon is your number one tight end. I think just anecdotally Kenyon Sadiq seems like, one of the very favorite players of draft analysts all over our, all over this community. Like everybody loves the guy and he's, he's having a very good season so far for an undefeated Oregon team.

32:30My question for you, and hopefully I'm not putting you on the spot too much, but how high do you think he can climb? I mean, we just saw Colston Loveland and Tyler Warren go in the top 15. Like what caliber of prospect do you think we're talking about here? um i see it's difficult to answer that because of this class specifically like this class is like in the top 10 is not it there's not a lot of lock top 10 picks you know like the quarterback situation is very much up in the air uh you know if sellers goes back to school dante moore goes back to school um you know like some of these defensive guys we'll talk about here in a minute uh you know they're they're promising but they're not locked so it is tough to gauge you know how high he could actually go when the top 15 seems very unsettled um I don't think that like like he's not Brock Bowers okay like I I don't I feel very confident saying that Brock Bowers is what the 13th pick but he was in a draft where there were six quarterbacks that went ahead of him uh a couple, what, three stud receivers, Joe Wall.

33:38Like, I mean, it was a specialized draft where Brock Bowers just happened to fall out of the top 10. This year, it's a little bit of the opposite where the top 10's a little bit in flux. And so that could put Sadiq up maybe a little bit further. I don't see him on that level as Brock Bowers. Now I love him. I think he's awesome. He was what, like 18, I think overall in my top 50 in the preseason. And I kind of still feel that's kind of like where I have him, where I don't, I'm not going to get too high where I see him as a top five, top 10 pick. But I think anywhere in the teens, it would not surprise me if he ends up being getting drafted.

34:14Behind him, you had Joe Royer at Cincinnati and number three, you talk about recency bias. Maybe Michael Trigg down at Baylor having an eye popping weekend against Kansas State. Maybe that has a little bit to do with him landing at third on your tight end list. yeah and like i mean roy you're at two i i think the tight end is kind of like running back where there's a clear one and then two there's a lot of debate you know there's a lot of there's a lot of right answers i think you can make a debate for some guys here i went with roy you're at two because i think he'd be a playmaker in the passing game is blocking getting gets better and better he can be a true why for you at three with michael trig it's tough because on talent and ability it's absolutely deserved he's a top 50 player uh he looks like a basketball player on the football field you know he's big he's smooth the way he catches the ball with ease um you know it looks like i i every morning before uh my uh kids get on the bus we're in the parking lot playing catch with this little nerf football uh every morning and it feels like that's how he that's that's the ball he's playing with because he's playing with a nerf ball yeah like but even a smaller one because his his hands just just grip the ball and it's crazy the one handed grab he had against Kansas State um he he had 150 155 yards receiving career high so talent wise like it's not a mystery here with Trigg now the unknown variable is some of the off-field stuff um every scout you know I talk about Trigg it's kind of the same thing where super talented maturity a question mark and that's something that has followed him at every stop you know He started at USC top recruit coming out.

35:56Then the Ole Miss for two years. I think he even served a suspension at Ole Miss. So now at Baylor, he's a fifth year guy. Hopefully he's able to prove to teams like, Hey, that stuff's in my past. All those concerns in my past, because if he does, if he can do that, man, he's going to be a hot commodity come, come draft time. Catches like that from the tight end position have a way of, of making people take notice. If you haven't seen it, please go go find Michael Triggs performance against Kansas State from over the weekend. You'll you'll get the hype pretty quickly. Offensive tackle. I think we can do this kind of quickly because we've highlighted a lot of these guys.

36:37But I am I am intrigued. The order changed. And look, I mean, you have Caden Proctor falling from your preseason number one to your midseason number three. I think that's fair, but it does seem like he's been playing better ball here over the last couple of weeks. Yeah. And I'm glad you said that, because that's that's part of what makes him an enigma. Right. It's he looked bad on the Florida State tape. The Wisconsin tape was shaky. And so it's like, OK, what are we what are we doing here? The pass pro landmarks are off. You know, the he sets very tall and he's so he's late reacting the inside moves.

37:12He's very late with his hands. some of the tendencies that he's played with just they look lazy but then you throw on the Georgia tape okay a lot better throw on the Vandy tape all right all right the last two weeks this is the guy we were hoping to see but why is it taking until now to see that and so I need to see better urgency from him down the stretch and we're going to see plenty of opportunities to see him tested Missouri this weekend so Zion Young that group Jonathan Joseph in Tennessee the week after that And then Dylan Stewart and the Gamecocks the week after that. So we're going to learn a lot more about Proctor throughout the rest of October.

37:46He could absolutely move back up. But what he did in September is I just you just can't ignore it. And so that's something that sticks with me. Proctor at number three, Spencer Fano at number one for Utah. It hasn't been perfect by any means, but he came in as a top 10 potential pick. I think he's played the talents evident with him. I think that he still belongs in that conversation. The movements, the efficiency, especially in the run game. the play demeanor and it's interesting that the top two guys on my list are both right tackles because I have Francis Maui Noah from Miami at number two and I get those that saying he's a guard I think his skill set would probably be maximized if you move him inside a guard but I think he can play tackle as well so I'm going to keep him here for for the time being at least outstanding grip strength he can create vertical push in the run game he can put edge rushers in a vice especially when they try to go through him he's going to make them pay um so all the tackles we've been talking about as possible first rounders i think it's him that's been the most consistent so far um and so it's it'll be interesting as we as we kind of go out throughout the season with these tackles um you know proctor can he move up but by the way did you uh did you see what the what they call the offensive package for him uh when he's a target or a ball carrier no but i need to know please it's crispy as in crispy cream because according to tie Simpson he eats way too many donuts um so that that's uh that's what it's called in the playbook uh and one other interesting tidbit that's phenomenal I don't know if you saw this so Xavier Chaplin in Auburn left tackle he was in my precincts in the top 50 he's really struggled the last two games both on the road especially with penalties Hugh Freeze came out this week and said that he has a hearing problem and it was a main factor in those those penalties and some of his issues and something they have to get figured out.

39:37So that was a new one to me. That's something you hear about a lot and something that we need to monitor because the dude's big, he's talented. But obviously that that's, that's, that's an issue. If you know, you can't communicate with your left tackle. And so that's just something to watch. It's an interesting thought. And we'll talk about this over the course of the draft cycle, but, and, and obviously Hugh Freeze brought that to light. So we know about it now, but there are so many issues like that, that. affect prospects that the vast majority of never make it to the national consciousness, you know, where I've had conversations with scouts where I'm like, man, y 'all really, you didn't like that guy.

40:16Like his tape is so good. And they're just like, well, what you don't know is this thing about his health that never made it to the public. And you're like, oh, right. Y 'all are working with more information than the rest of us, aren't you? Yeah. And sometimes it's, you still roll the dice. Other times it's like, you just, you can't, you can't do it. And so, yeah, it's, um, and that's where I try with the beast to paint as clear a picture as possible, get some of that information without killing the kid, you know, like it's always a fine line to walk, but yeah, try to get as much information as possible as to why a player maybe isn't going where you thought.

40:53Very quickly, your interior offensive line, top three, Connor Lou, the center at Auburn, like I said, that Auburn team loaded with good prospects, unchallenged at number one. And then a guy you gushed about after the Penn State Oregon game, Vega Ione, the guard at Penn State. And then Brian Parker, the second who you have on the interior, even though he plays right tackle at Duke. Obviously, we see that all the time. But I think that's that's worth noting that maybe this is a guy whose future lies on the interior. and I'll push back a little bit on um the unchallenged because I not unchallenged okay because I mean Lou's been fine but I don't it hasn't been great and so I think like right now he's still a top 40 pick but I want to see him play better the second half of the year for him to kind of stamp himself and go that high because yeah you'll want a from from Penn State has been awesome at left guard and then yeah Brian Parker I've kind of penciled him in at center he might be a center only just because of his body and the way he's built but he is a technician and this isn't like Graham Barton who was you know Duke's left tackle and we knew he's going to move inside he's not on that level as a prospect but character's elite he's a really good player so I think he's he's somewhere in that mix along with you know Brailsford at Alabama and a couple Oregon players so it's a that second tier of interior offensive linemen definitely in flux as we as we work through these guys i spent five minutes during prep digging for the pronunciation of vega's name and i still butchered it so i i apologize to you vega well hopefully i said it i don't even know if i said it completely correct either so this is this is what the this is what the cycle is all about by like we will we will get there and like we're all works in progress just the way these prospects are so there's plenty of time for us to get this right the point is he's been playing some awesome football that does it for the offensive side of this on the other side of this break let's dig into dane's top defensive prospects through the half point of the season all right dane the money position we all know it edge rushers there doesn't need to be suspense here ruben bain has 30 pressures through miami's first five games he had 11 against Florida State on Saturday night.

43:17Three sacks, interception against Notre Dame. I mean, you said a couple weeks ago he's the prohibitive favorite to be the top prospect in this class right now. And it doesn't seem like that's changed recently. Yeah, and I don't think anybody will be surprised that he's at the top here. He's not super long and that'll be a problem for some, but he plays with so much power and burst that it just, it gives blockers fits. And I like you watch defensive ends to see them rush the passer. But I love watching Reuben Bain against the run. He is an elite run defender. And so he's just been the most impactful edge defender we've seen so far.

43:57He deserves this top spot. Keldrick Falk at number two, TJ Parker, who we talked about Clemson's struggles among their big time prospects. but as Clemson is trying to dig out of that one and three start, maybe he's, he's off on the right track. Well, and yeah, with folk, I think there'll be plenty of debate with him because I, I don't think the production's necessarily going to be there for a top 10 pick. But when you watch Auburn, they're in a three man front a lot. So folks in four, I five techniques, sometimes at the nose, they aren't asking him to line up off the edge consistently and just rush the pastor.

44:35So he's long, he's athletic. There's a ton of power behind his hands. Youngest player in the draft. He won't be able to legally drink until alcohol until after his first NFL game. So there's just a lot of, you know, we're betting on traits here with Falk. That third spot with Parker, it came down to TJ Parker and then Texas Tech's David Bailey, who you mentioned Bain has 30 pressures. The only player in college football with more is David Bailey with 31. he he I think he also had 11 uh pressures against Houston just the tackles had no shot uh in that game but the better all-around player is TJ Parker and that's why I went with Parker I gave him the edge but if I'm looking I think just depends on what you want if I'm looking for a pass rush specialist then I'm going Bailey um I still have questions about him as a full-down player uh especially within the run game but if you're looking for that edge speed Bailey has a fastball and he knows how to use it.

45:31You said you gave Parker the edge and expected me not to notice, but I did. I did. I'm hip. I'm hip to your games. Yeah. David, David Bailey, dude, 11 pressures, two sacks, three quarterback hits against Houston. I not that he's been bad to this point in the season, but with the amount of attention he garnered by, by transferring over to Texas Tech, I've just, I've had an eye on him and I've been waiting for a performance like that. Like I said, not that he's been bad, but I was waiting for that sort of dominant game and he showed up with it against Houston last weekend. Defensive tackle. Again, we talked about the Clemson prospects.

46:08It has not gone the way the Tigers wanted it to so far this season, but not enough to change your opinion of Peter Woods as the top prospect in this D tackle class. Yeah. And I don't think he's lived up to being the top prospect overall. Like, like we thought potentially, but he's still one of the better defensive players in the class. The talents there, he was pretty easy for defensive tackle one. Then I think it gets tricky after him. I ended up going with Amari Washington from Oregon at two. And then Caleb banks from Florida at three Washington. It's kind of like Falk. It's, it's based on traits.

46:45It's based off of guys, 330 pounds. Shouldn't be able to move like that. And so Washington is a, you're betting on the potential here. He's got all the talent. with Banks it's tough because he has that left foot injury doesn't sound like they expect him back anytime soon so that complicates things but the talent still says he belongs there but I you know they were I hated leaving off like Dominique Orange you know big citrus if you're looking for a true nose tackle he'd be an appealing option Christian Miller at Georgia is not putting up big numbers but his tape has been pretty good Daryl Jackson of Florida State dripping with NFL tools.

47:20So after Woods, I think that there's plenty of debate about, okay, what's that next tier looks like? It looks like, and just what kind of defensive tackle you're looking for. You answered this for me, but that was going to be my big question. Caleb Banks, we've talked about him before when he's healthy and doing his thing, he looks like a top 10 pick. He's terrifying. He's six, six, three 30. He moves really well. He plays really violently, but he re aggravated his foot injury and had surgery on it after the LSU game. I mean, before the Miami game, or excuse me, the, um, goodness gracious, the Texas game, I'm like, who did Florida just beat before the Texas game?

47:58He's out on the field with a scooter, you know, to keep his foot elevated. So like, this doesn't look like a guy that's ready to play anytime soon, but you think him being listed at three is just more about that ability than anybody else being underwhelming, because that was my big question. Yeah, and I think it's we don't know enough about the injury right now. You know, if it's something that will linger and something that you just never know what the guy 300 pound plus bodies and foot injuries are always tough, always something you worry about. So we'll know more about the injury as we move forward.

48:31But I'm not going to downgrade him just based off of that. I don't think anybody has played to the level where they're going to take that spot, at least so far. Like I love big citrus, but you know, he's a nose tackle and you know, I think there's some limitations to what he's going to be. So as long as the teams are okay with the injury with Caleb banks and think he's, he'll be fine for training camp. I'm not going to downgrade him too much. All right. We have reached the linebacker portion of the show. I'm just going to give the floor to you. however long you feel like gushing about I what your pet cat uh please I mean let's let's just let's just talk about Arvel Reese no shock at number one um with the way I've been talking about him all season just a phenomenal all-around player length power he can play off blocks amazing change of direction for a guy that's 6 '4 240 pounds the burst to close um the pass rush value is definitely a big part of why I think he's going to go early or why I think he's going to go in the top half around one.

49:34But, you know, he also he leads Ohio State in tackles, arguably the best defense in the nation. He leads a team in tackles. Oh, he also leads a team in pass breakups. So, I mean, this is a guy that is a do everything linebacker and we haven't seen him, you know, I think at full capacity yet. So I think Matt Patricia and that hire has been such a an unlocking event for him it really allows him to show off that versatility that that diverse skill set that he brings so easy at number one for me now two and three were a little bit more okay I could see you go this way or that way I went with CJ Allen at two he's been very good sideline downhill as a run defender it's what he does best so no surprise there in coverage to spend a little more up and down but i think he shows enough promise there so i'm keeping cj allen at two sunny styles at three um the other or six four 240 pound freak linebacker at ohio state they're listed the exact same way i was like ohio state can we at least you don't have to copy and paste these guys measurements like surely they're not exactly the same size i'll be interested with reese to see what exactly he is because styles is actually that big uh he it's so his styles is 6043 uh so six four and three eighths and 237 pounds um and oh yeah he's still 20 years old um so like yeah it's he's uh it's hard to find guys like that that have that type of athleticism at that size who are still young still growing he got better every single year and you talk to people at Ohio State and he's a captain.

51:16He's one of the best leaders in the program. They rave about him. So teams love styles and it's not hard to see why. So but I do want to say, too, like this linebacker group is fun. Like I have no problem with those top three, but I hated leaving off like the LSU kids, you know, what weeks Harold Perkins with the way they've played like Anthony Hill at Texas. I don't think he's the superstar. Some people are making him out to be, but he's still a good player. my guy Jake Golday from Cincinnati who I just keeps rising and rising and rising as he gets experience moving from defensive end to off-ball linebacker this past week against Iowa State had a couple really nice plays in coverage so big fan of Cincinnati number 11 but this linebacker group as a whole is a it's a it's a fun group a lot of good athletes a lot of fun players that I think will be interesting to talk about throughout the process I feel like I have to ask you a reckless question.

52:10I feel like I'm obligated to do it because over the last few years, it's a common it's a common refrain to be like, hey, he's a fun player. We don't have to compare him to Micah Parsons. We don't have to do this just because he's got sick closing speed. A lot of guys have that, but when you watch Arvel Reese, like Arvel Reese is a guy where I don't think it's stupid to think about and I just want like a do you think I'm off base and be like, is this a guy where we need to talk about what his fit is at the NFL level? Like, is he good enough off ball linebacker that that's what he needs to do? Or could this be a guy that spends a lot of time on the edge in the NFL?

52:56We'll have a lot of conversations similar to what we talked about with Jalen Walker coming out of Georgia last year, where, you know, you're, you're primarily when you watch him on tape, he's off the ball, but some of what the best things that he, that he does is getting after the quarterback so i i think with with arval reese it's like he's only limited by your lack of imagination and i understand like it's it can be tough when you're drafting a player like that to have a have a plan in place but um he can do so much for you he why can't he line up on the edge and you know he has shown he can do it he has the length he has the power he has the burst but he can also drop in space and make plays so i yeah i think that he is I'm not going to compare him to Micah Parsons just because I Micah Parsons is arguably the best non-quarterback in the NFL and so I just I can't do that but in terms of role and how you want to maximize a skill set yeah I get it totally and there's a reason why I'm saying Reese should be he'll be drafted someone the top half of round one like he has that type of ability that's just it's just different you can't do it but I can and And if I can be the irresponsible idiot half of this show, I will do it.

54:08I'm rubbing off on you. Go watch some Marvell Reese tape and tell me it's crazy because I don't think it is. All right. Cornerback, I thought was very intriguing because your top guy has not played football yet this year. And I feel like that is an endorsement of Jermod McCoy's potential, even if it hasn't been realized yet. Yeah, and it's unfortunate because there was a lot of buzz about, hey, we think he might be able to be ready for the season or at least by October. And he's not been medically cleared yet. So no change with the top two McCoy. I'm just I'm going to hit pause on that one until we have better idea.

54:53Like, who knows? We might not see him play at all this year. And the ACL happened in January, I believe. So it's not crazy to think that, hey, let's just shut it down and let's get ready for pre-draft testing as opposed to pushing yourself to get back. And then, God forbid, something something negative happens. So he's at one. And then Avion Terrell from Clemson at number two. Love the competitiveness with him. He's exactly what I want at corner in terms of play style, even if he is just a little bit undersized. So the third spot, that's where I think it got interesting. Just, you know, who is going to take over that spot.

55:30I went with Mansoor Delane from LSU, a player we've talked about multiple times over the last month. He's done nothing but put good play on tape. And I've mentioned this before, but he's going to get picked apart during the process. He's not super long. He's probably not going to run a blazing 40, but he's just a good football player. And we can't lose sight of that because I think that's what's going to translate the most. six catches allowed through five games for lsu um to go with an interception do you know six uh six catches on 20 targets see if it's six and like 11 like that's okay but 20 yeah that that says something i mean opponents just aren't throwing in his direction lsu lost old miss a couple weeks ago and they were trying to pick on anybody but number four in the lsu secondary so So, you know, it's easy to build a South Carolina LSU game as sellers and Nuss, but sellers going against this LSU defense, particularly guys like Mansoor Delane for for our purposes.

56:32That is very, very intriguing. We'll wrap it up with safety. I feel like we've been saying Ohio State guys all down the line of of the defensive half of this show. I don't think anybody's particularly surprised that Caleb Downs in the top spot here. Caleb Downs still Caleb Downs um he's a top safety in the draft um and I I hate that I've been like trying to hit the brakes a little bit with him just because you know I because I said I wouldn't be surprised if our Val Reese is the first Buckeye um defender drafted and I got a lot of pushback on that and it's not that I don't think Caleb Downs is a good player I do it's just the NFL has told us how they draft safeties, especially safeties like Caleb Downs, who doesn't have this elite ball production or, you know, the physical traits are more good than great, or he doesn't play, you know, in the deep half of the field.

57:25He's more playing closer to the line of scrimmage. So I just wouldn't be surprised if Caleb Downs could go five or 15 and I wouldn't be surprised at all at either spot. And so it doesn't mean he's not a good player. Caleb Downs is awesome. but I think that's just, we have to be open-minded because of what the NFL has told us to draft and safeties. I think that is always, yeah, we've talked about it before. That's worth keeping in mind. I mean, I love Caleb downs. I think he's phenomenal. I think it's tough to get draft drafted in the top 12. If you're a safety, I mean, it's hard not to think about Kyle Hamilton and how far he wound up falling.

58:01So I think that's worth keeping in mind, even if he is one of my favorite players, your number two guy, is the only group of five school player represented in this podcast. Emmanuel McNeil Warren from Toledo, six, three and a half, 210 pounds, four or five speed. You know, he is he's a younger player and he wasn't even like full time football until he really got to Toledo and decided or like the coaches were able to develop him every single year. He's gotten better and better and better. Still very young. it's just the vision from the boundary um the way that he can read react it's i liked him over the summer he's playing better and better this year so yeah he's he's one of those guys that i think could get in that top 50 conversation um and then i went with kamari ramsey the usc safety at that the third spot he's been banged up a little bit so uh you know the first month of the season he was good i think he's supposed to be back this this week against michigan which will be awesome because Michigan, we know, like to run the ball, like to throw their tight ends.

59:02So Kamari Ramsey will be important for the Trojans to slow down that offense. A long list of guys to consider. Really fun conversation. And even better than that, man, you just mentioned it with Ramsey and USC going against Michigan. Another loaded weekend, dude. Yeah, it is. I mean, last weekend was a little bit of a step back, but right off the jump, Ohio State, Illinois, real quick, like you as an Ohio guy, I got like, is this the biggest Illibuk game in recent? Like when was the last time the Illibuk game looked this good on paper as number one, Ohio State and number 17, Illinois? It always seems to be an interesting game.

59:41I know I can remember when Juice Williams quarterback in Illinois, they upset, I think it was still the core or the head coach of that. Yeah, it was Juice Williams. And I think like, yeah, that 07 Illinois team really is before that. before that you're talking about like red grange right this is this is uncharted territory for ohio state illinois uh alabama playing a good missouri team an undefeated missouri team too yeah we mentioned indiana oregon obviously big showcase for fernando mendoza and dante moore organ's only favored by seven and a half too which isn't i mean i you know it's at it's in eugene which is a very tough place to play i thought it'd be a little bit more than just seven and a half but so that's an interesting line i think people i think this indiana team is you know i know they didn't play anybody in non-conference but i think they're they're better than they got credit for when they were making their playoff push last year no they are i mean the way mendoza's playing but honestly they should have lost iowa they needed a few things to go right for them to end up winning that game and so um yeah against a better opponent in oregon i can't wait to see this one because it'll be a great test for mendoza um same thing with uh you know just the the receivers for the hoosiers uh they're some a couple good players um just overall all these games which one are you looking forward to the most uh is it indiana or is it one of the other ones i think um lsu bias aside yeah lsu bias aside obviously i mean that is good though like objectively nuss nuss and sellers is is very very interesting I would say, yeah, I mean, I'm, it's so basic to, to be intrigued by the quarterbacks, but Mendoza and more, I think that's a huge stage for them.

1:01:31I'm, I'm very interested in that. And then after that, yeah, I would, I would say the ones with the quarterbacks are, are the best. I mean, if, if John Mateer plays in the red river game, then I'm all in. Cause you know, like Texas Oklahoma is always weird anyway and Texas losing to Florida should not change anybody's opinion about how wild of a game this could be um so I mean like I said I don't want John to jeopardize his health but it would be really really fun if he was available in that game it would and Texas coming off that tough loss uh the offense is just a mess which I did not expect from a sark offense it's like arch yes arch is part of the problem but they they don't have an arch problem they have an offense problem and arch is part of that no doubt but the offensive line can't block anybody uh there's no running game the receivers have been okay but not great so it's it's it's something that we we have to watch and see how how are they going to fix this how are going to get right um because yeah so far it's been it's been tough and it can't be all on arch to get it you can't put all that on his shoulders to make it right because this is not going to happen so uh yeah that one will be fun um georgia at auburn that'll be you know plenty of prospects that we mentioned just in this podcast they'll be playing in that one uh michigan at usc will be fun um i nc state at notre dame a sneaky one as well i was about to say yeah a frisky nc state team i don't we don't have a ton of time left but i want to watch hollywood smothers in this opportunity he's fun against notre dame yeah he's undersized like he's like right around i'm just under 200 pounds like i i you hit him and he's going backwards but he is a fun player with the ball in his hands and then watch the tight end to number seven uh justin jolie um i he was a guy that I considered at that third spot as well in my tight end rankings.

1:03:33A loaded, loaded college football weekend. Arizona State and Utah. We got to mention that one too. Can't leave it out. I didn't want to bring my bias into it. My fiance went to Arizona State, but that is another, I mean, if you're looking for a test for Utah's offensive tackles, this is probably the best one left on the schedule. And then obviously Sam Levitt and Jordan Tyson, another opportunity for them. I love it's it's a I mean, it's a 1015 game for you, but you might have to watch that on Sunday morning. But probably I'm I'm really excited that this is going to be just getting going when all the other games wind down.

1:04:10And I can I can throw this on before I go to bed for sure. It's it's spread out pretty nicely. Yeah, there's it's not overloaded in one window. So hopefully it's a full day of competitive games should be fun. We will be recapping it in detail next week on Building the Beast. Until then, thank you all for listening. Dane, always good talking to you, bud. We'll talk to you soon.