From the Vikings to the Jets, assessing the open QB situations

0:02Welcome to the athletic football show. I'm Derek Klassen. Robert is in South America right now. Dave is over in Europe right now. So we've got me hosting the show. And today we're going to talk about some of the open seats on the quarterback care. So I think we both on this show in other shows later this offseason, even we talk about a lot of the quarterbacks that are on the market. Maybe don't spend enough time talking about what is actually the quality of these places that these quarterbacks are potentially going to get moved to. Where would they want to go? What kinds of quarterbacks are going to end up in these spots?

0:32So we're going to talk about all of that. We've got Dan Paisuda as our guest. So let's get right into it.

0:42So every year we get into the offseason, we talk about the quarterback carousel. I think that that is a huge topic that everybody's going to want to talk about, especially with having a veteran free agent quarterback having just won the Super Bowl. And I think we spend a lot of time talking about how good these quarterbacks are. Who is the who's going to be the bell of the ball? Who's the best second option? Should teams just go look at guys in the draft. And we maybe sometimes don't spend enough time talking about how good are these seats on the quarterback carousel, actually. And so that's what we're going to do today.

1:11We're going to talk about a half dozen teams that, in my mind, clearly need to be going after a quarterback. And then at the end, we'll sprinkle in a few teams that are in the maybe category. And here to do that with me today is Dan Paizuta. Dan, how are you doing? I'm doing well. How are you? I'm pretty excited. I think. Did you have like a particular process that you went through when you were starting to try to rank these teams for this and like looking at, OK, like who is actually the good teams? Who are the good situations? I like you're like, where did you start with some of these and where did you end up?

1:41Yeah, I like loosely, like when I went through the teams that we were looking at, kind of rank them by coach and scheme, the receiving talent around them, the offensive line, kind of future outlook of room for improvement and then kind of had a base ranking with all of those things combined. So that's how I kind of came up with how to rank these teams. And it's it came out interesting. Did you end up tiering them? Because I put them into like kind of bucket, like obviously I ranked them one to six as well, but I also kind of tiered them to try to break it up for people a little bit. Yeah, I have them in a in a loose tier, especially, you know, considering when I kind of came out with the rankings and adding them up.

2:23There was a pretty kind of clear tears that that came up in some of these. That's kind of how I feel. So let's start with the first one. This. So to set the board here a little bit, these are the six teams that I'm talking about when I say these are the ones that in my mind when I went into this show, these are the ones that clearly need a quarterback. These are not in ranked yet. The Raiders. And obviously they're kind of set on who the quarterback is going to be. But I think it's worth exploring, like, how good is this situation actually for Fernando Mendoza, the New York Jets, the Miami Dolphins, the Arizona Cardinals, in my mind like that.

2:52I think the Kyler Murray thing is going to blow up and he's probably going to get moved. The Minnesota Vikings was even some of the more reporting that has just come out about J.J. McCarthy and what they had to do the offense for him over on the athletic, actually. And then the Cleveland Browns, they're the last team. And then there will be a couple like the Steelers and the Colts that we'll talk about the end who are in the kind of maybe category. But those are the six teams that we're talking about. And so, Dan, when you looked at those six teams, the Vikings are pretty clearly number one in this group right like that that to me like what it almost the ranking started at two for me yeah yeah that's absolutely the case and it's it's interesting because like when we go into what their quarterback situation was like I wasn't a huge JJ McCarthy guy coming out of the draft but my entire belief that JJ McCarthy could work is because he was going to the Vikings and because there was such a system around him between the coach and the the offensive skill players that whoever was going to be quarterback there I just kind of figured would work the fact that it hasn't is what makes me even more a little pessimistic about whether JJ McCarthy can be fixed but yeah when you still look at so much of what's still in place with the Vikings it's all still there even if we haven't been able to see you know, what it was even like during the Darnold year last year.

4:14Right. Like last year with J.J. McCarthy, a lot of the offense didn't necessarily turn out well, but all the reasons that we had for optimism going in are all still there and they're not necessarily set to lose a ton. Jalen Naylor is going to be an independent free agent, so they'll have to do some shuffling around potentially to replace him. But I don't think, you know, when you have guys like Justin Jefferson, Jordan Addison, T.J. Hawkeye, like it's they'll probably be fine in that department. Maybe like Ty Chandler and backup up tackle just in school or some of your other impending free agents, but they're really not losing a lot.

4:43And then kind of in terms of like setting the table for how can they maybe improve this team cap space wise, they're in a little bit of a tricky predicament. They are 40 million dollars over the cap. So that's going to be difficult for them. But they do have two extra third round picks. They've got some extra sevenths to work around. So like they can take swings on these guys to replace a Jalen Naylor and all that stuff. And so with the offensive line mostly intact, even if it's a group that's banged up regularly, you still have maybe the best receiver in the league. You've still got one of the best offensive play callers in the league.

5:11Every reason that we thought this team could be in this offense could be like a top 10 unit quarterback agnostic. I think a lot of that does still hold. Yeah. And I think that there might be some more questions about what this receiving core actually looks like. Like, could Jordan Addison be a trade candidate just because he's heading into the last year on his rookie deal? I'm not sure if TJ Hawkinson, because of how much his cap hit is, and he hasn't really been the same guy since the ACL tear like could he be a trade or release candidate so I think maybe there are still a few more question marks but I think Justin Jefferson alone is still like the best thing we're going to talk about for a supporting piece in any of these quarterback situations um so and when you go through the cap space like if you restructure Jefferson and there's a couple other moves that the Vikings can do that could easily free up some some cap space to bring in some guys and I think there's a lot of like when you look at the last four games of what they did with jj mccarthy who over those four games he had the highest epa per play in the league and the highest success rate that was very fake and very schemed up but that's also kind of the point of minnesota of what they were able to do and they were against bad defenses that was washington that was dallas he had a bad game against the giants and then like green bay's backups in the season finale uh but when you look at kind of what they were able to reach like rework in that offense it was a lot more empty which McCarthy actually played really well in.

6:35And then it was getting the ball out quickly and kind of saving him from himself. So the fact that there were those good last four games, I think that's more of a case of Kevin O 'Connell still got it and still knows the levers to pull rather than thinking this might be somehow saving McCarthy. But when I look at what they did over those, like the last part of the season, when the offense did play a little better, I think that is showing that, you know, this this structure in place, I think, is still going to be good for whatever, whoever the quarterback is. I think that's a really good point.

7:05Like Kevin O 'Connell still showed the ability to like, even with some of the constraints that J.J. McCarthy was putting on the offense down the stretch, like still found ways to even maneuver around that and find some stuff that he was good at. And like it's funny to like obviously some of the reporting that has come out by Alec Lewis on The Athletic, like talking about how they were kind of pulling some of the middle of the field concepts off the field for J.J. McCarthy. Like that actually tracks really well with a lot of the empty stuff because empty is like, OK, we're giving you the full picture here.

7:34Pre-snap. You've got to make you've got to see one thing pre-snap and just go throw it. And so I think Kevin O 'Connell adapting to his quarterback there made a lot of sense. But I'm with you like that to me didn't say enough about J.J. McCarthy being a guy that the Vikings should necessarily move forward with. This should be like this to me, like says more of like, again, OK, Kevin O 'Connell is good. The offense around them is good. Then the question with the Vikings becomes like, which caliber of veteran do they want to go after? Do they want to go like really aggressive and be the Kyler Murray team?

8:04Which Kyler is probably the only true veteran type answer on the board, whereas a lot of the other guys are young dice rolls. It's can we get by with Mac Jones? Can we is Malik Willis good? I don't know. I mean, they're familiar with him in the division, so maybe they think he is. I don't know. But I guess that would be my final question on the Vikings. Like, is there any of those vets that you think makes the most sense for them? Yeah, that's that's the tough thing with Minnesota, because it seems like even with, you know, the Darnold here, like just being OK at quarterback can be enough. And I think we kind of saw that as they got into the playoffs with him last year.

8:40We saw that with Darnold this past year in Seattle. Like, I don't I don't know if they have to take a huge like Malik Willis type swing. And it is, I think it's weird and kind of sets the table for what we're talking about with these quarterback situations that Malik Willis would be like the big high upside swing in this quarterback class, which, which is interesting. But like, if I don't think Mac Jones gets traded, like he would be someone who I think kind of makes sense is the quite caliber of quarterback who is probably okay. I think San Francisco probably just wants to hold on to him just based on what Purdy has done all the injuries they've had over the past couple years just knowing how important that backup quarterback can be um it's it's tough like i i think i like kyler there like there's some of the middle of the field stuff not necessarily opens up and kyler's a weird quarterback that i think we'll we'll talk about once we get to the cardinals but it is weird where i do still think whoever the Vikings pick is going to be OK.

9:44And that's just because I just think this environment is so much better than everything else we're going to talk about. And my I think my cope with Kyler is that, again, I know the J.J. McCarthy stuff did not turn out as well last year, but J.J. McCarthy is like a 21, 22 year old, very young quarterback trying to learn the ropes of the NFL. Every time Kevin O 'Connell has had a veteran, he's gotten the best out of them, going all the way down to like the Josh Dobbs and stuff like that and all the way up to obviously what he got out of Sam Darnold. But even honestly, it was like a miracle he got anything out of like Carson Wentz at certain point.

10:17Like, you know what I mean? Like he's always been able to find whatever he needs to out of these veterans. And so I know Kyler Murray feels like damaged goods a little bit at this point, but I do think that they could probably get like three quality years out of him. And I think another part of it is that I know we've seen the Vikings and Kevin O 'Connell kind of get away with lesser quarterback play when it was Sam Darnold initially and he kind of made him better. But at least part of that calculus is like Sam Darnold is exceptionally talented. Like he's a really good athlete. His arm is awesome.

10:46He's big. And so that's why like when I have tried to frame some of like the do they want to trade for Mac Jones or do they want to reunite with Kirk Cousins? It's just like it could work, but I just don't feel like you would get the same ceiling you got when you had Sam Darnold. Yeah, but I think the thing is there's not a lot of guys who were even going to it is just kyler yeah it really is kyler it's i mean i don't want to go down the anthony richardson path i'm trying not to we'll talk about him in a little bit we could and that is like the talent and maybe you were able to to structure some more things in there with with the arm and everything but yeah it's it's just when you're looking at who these quarterbacks are and like maybe Malik Willis is like that guy with the strong arm and you can have some of the like the quarterback run game that I think would be new for uh but I think you know Kevin O 'Connell was around when the Rams got Matthew Stafford and how much that the offense changed from having a guy you can scheme up in Jared Goff to Matthew Stafford who made the offense and I think the Vikings would love that I'm sure they would uh but there's just that caliber guy just isn't available right now.

11:58And that's a good point with Matthew Stafford, because like part of the calculus there was like, we want a guy who can make us right when we're wrong. Sometimes I think those coaches have started to learn that. And Kyler Murray, for some of his flaws, will make you right sometimes when you are wrong. And that could be a really nice thing for them. So I think we're both in agreement here that are they the only team that you had in this tier? Like the Vikings are alone for you. OK, that's what I thought. So let's move into our tier two here who did who did you kind of have in this tier and if you have them ranked specifically in order that's fine too my mine are more like tiered and they're not necessarily ranked within the tiers but who do you got in this next one yeah so surprisingly i wasn't really expecting this when i was going into this i have the cardinal second i i do too well okay well i have them in this tier i'm not necessarily like second or third but like they're in this tier to me so i have the cardinals and raiders kind of in the same me too okay and i had the the cardinals just kind of in the rankings come up a little bit which this is the exact opposite way i thought about their head coaching vacancy which i wouldn't have wanted to go near but to put a quarterback in this situation right now where you have if you can figure out marvin harrison jr right uh michael wilson who i'm not sure was talking about enough over the second half of the season uh from week 11 on he was second in receiving yards behind puka nakuha uh and a lot of that was he had an a dot of over 10 in every game from week 11 on um and with the same number of routes as he did from weeks one to 10 he went from 0.76 yards per route to 2.24 i was because he played a lot more outside and part of that was because marvin harrison jr only ran 62 routes uh over that span so it was a lot of they figured out how to use michael wilson without him so if you can figure those guys out obviously Trey McBride, maybe the best tight end in the league.

13:48And I like Mike LaFleur. You know, going back to what he did with the Jets, even there was a lot of the, you know, Shanahan McVay scheme that was there that was working, but the quarterback was atrocious. If you kind of look like his, his first year, Elijah Moore was getting open his second year with Garrett Wilson, he was getting open. The quarterback just couldn't get the ball. And now he's been with um sean mcveigh for the past couple years uh kind of learning some more i think there's going to be a more diverse run game uh having you know depending on who the quarterback is just going to have some more open passing concepts to be uh with what we have with the the personnel in uh arizona too where you could go heavier into 12 and 13 personnel that was something they wanted to lean into uh and didn't quite work because i think there were a couple you know tight end injuries there but I think this is a place where you can get decent quarterback production from what they have in place I think you can't do like I'm the more I sat with the Michael LeFleur thing I'm actually kind of okay with it because again like with the Jets he was not the problem there the problem was some of the talent the quarterback thing and again maybe he's not perfect maybe he's not as good as Liam Cohen or Ben Johnson all this stuff but like I do think that he probably clears that bar and to the point that you made like he starts mostly as this Shanahan guy right and then he over the past couple years takes his transition and sits with McVay and I do think even though we often bucket those two guys together like you said the run game with McVay is a lot more diverse now than you know a lot of the time especially when he was with Shanahan before Shanahan himself started to diversify a little bit and then to me like the drop back passing game between those two is so different and that's partly a product of the quarterbacks that they've had right like because Sean McVay went out and got Matthew Stafford, they can do a little bit more from empty.

15:39They're just like pure drop back shotgun stuff is a little bit different than what the Niners like to do, where it's still a little bit more quick game based and stuff like that. And so I actually do think him having that kind of like sitting in both offenses, two of the best offensive minds, I think that that is going to help him a lot. And it kind of opens up who they can go at for quarterback, right? Like it doesn't feel like they are maybe locked into like, you know, if he had just been coming off of straight off of all of the Shanahan stuff, we might be like, oh, he's got it. They got to be the team that goes after Kirk Cousins.

16:11And it's like, I just don't feel like they are necessarily locked into that type of thing. And so I do think that that helps them a lot. And then I think the part is that really shocked me. And especially with how bad last year went. Obviously, they only won four games. I think they've lost like eight straight or something down the stretch like they were terrible. But I look at the roster and it's not that bad. And they're really not losing that many guys like I think they'll need to fix the offensive line a little bit obviously you hope Marvin Harrison Jr. plays well but they're only really losing a couple of like depth pieces you know Zay Jones and Greg Greg Dortch are free agents and then it's just some like offensive linemen that they probably would want to replace anyway like Jonah Williams who they might do with the third overall pick in the draft and then they have 34 million dollars in cap space like they can go out and attack some of this stuff and then I think even to the last Last thing I would say about the roster on the other side, and we're mostly here talking about like the quality of the offensive line and stuff that is actually around the quarterback.

17:05I think the defense is better than they showed last year because they were just so banged up like they didn't have a lot of their best players, especially in the secondary. Walter Nolan missed a lot of the year. Like if they're just healthier on that side, you make two or three additions on the offense. Like I think whatever is around the quarterback can actually look pretty solid. yeah i'm there too and keeping nick rollis as the defensive coordinator i think is something continuity is huge more optimistic about what the defense could be once healthy you're not completely shifting like these were guys that were kind of specifically brought in for some of the weird stuff that obviously has been talked about very often on this show uh you know all the the weird defensive structure that they've been doing so the fact that that's staying in place I think is going to help the defense.

17:52And then, yeah, like you said, this the I think the quarterback has the possibility to be productive, which makes me wonder, like, are we sure Kyler is getting moved? so that's I'm I think this is a really good discussion because on one hand it feels like this is just a marriage that it's kind of run its course like this would be on the third head coach with Kyler all that stuff but I I do wonder if Mike LaFleur looks at the quarterback market and is like well what else am I gonna do there's nobody to draft that's where I I came from it of the teams that we're going to talk about, Arizona would have the highest bar to clear to improve at quarterback.

18:37And, you know, now that you have a different offensive system in place, I think he wore out his welcome with the old coaching staff where with Petsing, there was never like a clear fit of what they wanted to do and what Kyler is good at. And I think that instead of meshing more as they spent more time together, they got like further apart in what those two were. So I don't know. And like, it's going to be hard because you kind of have to trade Kyler, right? And you have to then get someone who's going to take on his salary. I'm not opposed to them just kind of playing this year out, especially since you don't know where your next quarterback is coming from.

19:20I don't know if that's bad. And so the thing I wanted to talk about about Kyler is he had one of the strangest years I can really remember last year so I put together and I shared this on Blue Sky I think at the end of the season I put together the range of quarterback play from their worst game to their best game by EPA per play and Kyler ended up like 21st in overall like EPA per play average he ended up having weirdly like the same average as lamar herbert and jalen hurts but he had the smallest gap between his worst game and his best game he had the second best worst game but the worst best game there was zero range of what he did so the like the upside that we see from kyler just wasn't there but he also wasn't awful and now i just had no idea what to make of that well that's really funny too because isn't that that's so opposite of how we've talked about Kyler for a majority of his career where it's like eight games a year he's gonna win you the game and five of those other games he might lose you the game and that like you know again he wasn't perfect last year and there were there were some you know games where he maybe had lost you the game but it just didn't feel like the vacillations were quite as wide and maybe that is partly Kyler Murray becoming a little bit more mature and playing in a different way like he I think was moving around the pocket a little bit less I I think he was less willing to just hang in the pocket and like make some really tough throws.

20:48Like I think the ball was just coming out quicker. And so maybe that was leading to less of the volatility that he was he was getting. And then again, just the structure of the offense is different, especially than some of the cliff stuff. But I do wonder if there's like, OK, if that floor is now raised a little bit from what it had been previously, and then this new coaching staff and maybe again improvements for Marvin Harrison Jr., which maybe that's going to be a thing that we do for like five off seasons. But you get the point. Like maybe he does finally get better. And it's like, OK, I can start to sell myself on this.

21:18So I maybe I've been too quick to dismiss the idea that they would keep him. It's just like I think maybe I've already predisposed to convincing myself like he's they're going to move him. Right. And I think we started having that conversation as like just a league wide thing when we all thought Jonathan Gannon was coming back. And I and I feel like we've just kind of kept our thoughts about them moving on from Kyler. because we thought the coaching staff was going to be in place still. And those two just hadn't meshed anymore. So I do wonder if there is a higher possibility of Kyler staying just because you're going out into the wilderness without a very, one, a clear upgrade or a clear place to get another quarterback in general.

22:02I mean, you have Jacoby Brissett, but we saw what a longer term Jacoby Brissett thing does. It helps for a little bit, but you don't want to be doing that for a full season. Yeah, Jacoby Brissett is great for the particular situation they found themselves in last year, but you don't want him to be the week one starter. I guess, too, the last thing I do want to touch on a little bit more here before we move on to the Raiders. You mentioned a little bit like they found a way to use Michael Wilson. And I think an interesting part of that is like he came into the league as one of those like power slots.

22:31And then, like you said, started to play a lot more outside in part because Marvin Harrison Jr. had some injuries, got moved around, all that stuff between him and Marvin Harrison Jr. Is there anything that you want to see Michael LeFleur do a little bit more of? Do you want to, like, make sure that he keeps Michael Wilson outside? So maybe they go and seek out a different slot receiver this year. Like, is there anything any thoughts there? Yeah, I think that's the path. What you said to keep Michael Wilson outside, have him be that, you know, field stretching guy that they had Marvin Harrison Jr.

23:02kind of play. And, you know, we've we talked about him being this like static X, like down the field guy that didn't really work for the past two seasons. So I think that can potentially open up Marvin Harrison Jr. a little bit more. If you have Michael Wilson as the outside field stretcher, you can maybe move Harrison around. And then it's much easier, I think, especially even in this in the draft in free agency to find a guy who can fit in in the slot than having to try to find someone who's going to play so much on the outside. It's also going to be probably much cheaper to do that also. So I think that would be the path I would go to fill out this receiver room.

23:37And cheaper is a good option, too. like it would just be easier for them to probably either in the draft or especially with the way that this draft class looks in terms of the slot retrievers or just to go find a guy in free agency. I think I think I'm pretty much in lockstep with you there. All right. Before we move on to the Raiders, we're going to take a really quick break here and then we'll come back and talk about them.

23:58All right. Finishing off, I think finishing off our tier two here, at least I only have these two teams, but we're going to talk about the Las Vegas Raiders. And so to set the table a little bit for them they're also not losing a ton in terms of the skill players like really tyler lockett's the only guy potentially leaving they've got some offensive linemen they need to potentially rework like dylan parm is a free agent this offseason center jordan meredith is a restricted uh free agent and then also half of the defense is gone but again i think we're mostly trying to keep this to to what is going around in the offense lucky for them they have almost 90 million dollars in cap space to work with they've got a couple of extra fourth round picks um so that's kind of setting the table there and then obviously the other thing with the Raiders the other five teams we're talking about here it's a question of like who is the quarterback going to be and what will it look like for them not the case with the Raiders it's going to be Fernando Mendoza so I think I just want to spend a little bit of time here with you talking about like how good is this situation really because I think a lot of us at least myself I'll speak for myself here kind of bought in on what this could be last year and I'm like trying to you know battle with my feelings about doing that again this year yeah i mean i was with you i think the last time i was on this show was with robert after week one and we spent time like fawning over what the raiders did to the patriots which is something that how funny is that super well yeah um but i think like that's still kind of the idea because we never saw like a fully healthy raiders team again especially with Brock Bowers like and I think like that's going to be the key here to get a healthy Bowers over the full season like that just kind of opens up everything else for this offense and we just didn't get that at an extended degree all last year so he was you know the playing in line a lot just kind of not as dynamic as a receiver as he was as a rookie so I think once you have that in place it's much easier to just kind of build around the rest of the roster which I think can be helpful and you know you talk about the the offensive line i mean outside of colton miller they can probably upgrade anywhere if they wanted to um and i think this this kubiak scheme now is going to be more helpful to protect the offensive line too in both pass protection and the run game with some of the play action concepts they're going to do uh we saw that what he did with seattle last year uh so i think and that is just something that didn't happen with this offense last year.

26:24There was no protection for that offensive line. So when something broke down, nothing worked. I think that was something I certainly missed with that offensive line last year. It's like I going into it, I think a lot of us knew talent wise, it was not great, but you were just hoping that like, OK, can they play just at the level of the 25th best offensive line? It will be good enough and they can get by. But I think a part of that that I miss is that, again, Chip Kelly's offense just did not tie things together well. It did not help the offensive line in really any way. And I think we have proof of concept that Clint Kubiak replacing a college coordinator can give that to your offensive line.

27:00He literally did it last year with Seattle and it won them a Super Bowl. And again, you know, it's not like the Seattle offensive line all of a sudden turned into the 90s Cowboys, but it went from a unit that was hamstringing the offense. They bring in Kubiak, they draft a guard in the first round and it takes them to like, I don't know, Seattle was what, like the 18th, 19th best offensive line, which isn't great. But when you've got a star receiver, your quarterback is playing on time and accurately, that is kind of enough to really allow things to open up. And so I actually I kind of buy that the floor is going to be raised.

27:32I don't I don't think they're going to be the 30th offensive line in the league that they were last year. I think they can get to if they keep the relative if they replace some of the guys are losing with like equal talent. They could be the 25th best offensive line, kind of like I was trying to sell last year. To me, the question is the ceiling and that's going to come down to like what types of players do they end up going after. I think with some of these other teams, you know, like the Cardinals, they can spend their top pick on a tackle and that's like a huge way to instantly boost your offensive line.

28:01The Raiders are in a trickier spot there where the first overall pick is pre-spent on the quarterback that is going to play behind this offensive line. And so then it's like, okay, do we start to try to do it with draft picks? Even that gets a little sticky because they'd spent multiple third round picks or mid round picks on guys last year that they wanted to develop who didn't play. So do you really want to over invest there? So then I think it's probably going to come down to, OK, they need to microwave this thing a little bit by probably going and spending on some interior players. There's a couple of centers actually in the free agent market that I think would make a lot of sense for them if they wanted to go get them.

28:34And then maybe you spend on a guard and that's enough to get you to the 20th best offensive line. And now you're kind of cooking with something. yeah and i think like it's it's so much easier to go from atrocious to okay which i think is just kind of what they they could shoot for especially when you do have uh the the cap space that they have if we end up with the max crosby trade where you're getting probably a pretty high pick maybe that's something where in either the you know the back part of the the first round or high second depending on whatever the return is for crosby that's a place where you can you know go offensive line too um and it's just like going back to just kind of what you said last year not only was the line bad just like the lack of detail in what they were doing it was just so discombobulated and the one thing we know that is going to come with Kubiak is is the attention to detail for the offensive line so when we looked at Seattle like again they weren't the greatest offensive line but everybody was in the right spot more or less it wasn't mental errors and like missed pass pro stuff it was just like sometimes your rookie guard who is good loses sometimes your backup center just loses like it was just stuff like that which like that's that's totally fine you can live with that and i think like that the the raiders didn't have that possibility last year because everything just blew up in the worst possible ways like if you just kind of look at the run game they were 31st in yards allowed before contact um and genti was hit within a within a yard of the line of scrimmage on 54.1 of his attempts which was the third highest rate among running backs with at least 100 carries so that derailed anything you could do there and i think with the kubiak run game you'll at least get a little more uh like margin for error there too so that'll help open some things up um i think you know wide receiver i still have a lot of questions about because you kind of threw some draft picks at you uh so trey tucker was on the field for 98 of their dropbacks which was the highest rate for any wide receiver in the league is that true yes that's insane uh yeah so you know trey tucker can be a useful piece you don't want him to be the useful piece that's the thing that's kind of where it was last year like tucker's like a nice player but when i see a guy like trey tucker i'm like that's what like taylor gabriel was supposed to be in like some of those old Janet, which is like a totally useful player and like a good guy to really accelerate things, cannot be your number one receiver in that way.

31:04And so I actually think that's an interesting point, though, one from the sense of like you just look at this roster and if it was any coaching staff, you would need to improve the receiving room a little bit. But I think what's interesting with Kubiak specifically is when he was with the Saints, they had really good receiver talent before they all got injured, obviously, with Chris Alave and Rashid Shahid. And then obviously last year with the Seahawks, a little bit more of just a top heavy unit, kind of just really having JSN as that guy, but he's always had like a one superstar receiver that he can kind of lean on a guy who is a vertical threat.

31:35And I think it's just I'm kind of interested to look at where he shifts the offense now that his clearly his best pass catching option is a tight end who is kind of a wide receiver. Like, I'm just curious what that looks like. Yeah. And that that's one of the fascinating things where it does shape how you then build out the rest of the receiver room, because, you know, Trey Tucker's a useful player i like dante thornton as you know a potential guy who can just six four and insanely fast um i think like that could be like a type of rasheed shaheed kind of field stretcher there but again not someone who's going to be your high volume like wide receiver one uh but i think so much of building this around brock bowers and then how you you build that out uh because you're going to probably want to put him in the slot that probably as much as you can uh you know do you get production out of michael mayer enough for this to be an actual like productive 12 personnel offense which they ran a whole bunch like on 33 percent of their snaps last year but it just it wasn't very good because when bowers wasn't completely healthy and you weren't getting enough from mayer for that to be something that you can completely lean on so i'm very interested to see how all these pieces, you know, fit into place.

32:48And I do. I've been a big Michael Mayer guy since like he came out of the draft. And so maybe this is just that. But I do think there is some element of it felt like the Raiders a little bit play that way last year because they had to, especially once they traded Jacoby Myers like that was just to get your best five on the field. That was the best way to do it. There's a chance that that's still true after this offseason. But I do think now, again, looking at the Kubiak offense, we have a lot more proof that a 12, even sometimes 13 personnel type of offense, like he's geared to make that type of stuff work.

33:19And so I am, I do think a lot of that is going to be good. Last thing with the Raiders, again, we know who the quarterback is going to be. Have you seen Fernando Mendoza at all? Have you, have you like started draft stuff? Have you watched him a little bit? Yeah. Yeah. A little bit. And I think that is something that makes the, the offensive line, I think a little less of a worry too because he's someone who's so good at playing on time like that like if that it was a thing that i like highlighted for fernando mendoza it's the way he plays on time and they can be accurate uh with that and i think that's going to be a huge piece in making the offensive line better potentially making some of these wide receivers better because you don't have to necessarily hope they win on their own i think schematically the those guys might be open and Mendoza is going to be able to hit them.

34:05So I think that is a place where everything is going to kind of work together, which is fun. I agree. Like if he can, because so much of why Sam Darnold worked last year and even in Minnesota is that within the first two and a half seconds of the play, if he knew what he was getting, the arm talent, the timing, like it just, it all really, really worked. If Mendoza can just be that, which I think he can be like, the more I've watched him, the more I've appreciated his arm. He's obviously really big. He does like his footwork and timing really is pretty sensational. Like he's just a guy who clearly is a professional.

34:36And so I like him a lot for that reasons. And so if he can do a lot of what Sam Darnold did there and just do 15 percent less of putting the ball in traffic at times, that's a pretty good way to jumpstart this offense. Like I can get excited about this again. Yeah, this isn't going to be a team that I projected, you know, somehow be, you know, the top 16 in DVOA. But I think it's going to be passable enough where it's not going to be one of this disaster rookie seasons that we've seen from a lot of, you know, former number one overall quarterbacks who just get put into something where there's there's nothing there.

35:10I think there's going to be enough schematic wise and personnel wise where I think this is, you know, OK, at least. And that's more than we can say for a lot of guys who went first overall. Yeah, that is a lot more than we can usually say for those guys. Turns out, you know, when you're picking first overall team usually sucks. All right. That is the end of tier two for us. Let's move into tier three, which I do think this is where it starts to become a little bit interesting. I personally only have one team in tier three. Where are you at with this with this kind of grouping? OK, yeah, I do, too.

35:39And I feel like it's the same one. I have Miami Dolphins. Yeah, Miami here all by themselves. Yeah, I also have them. I and I think what we'll end up talking about, at least between these two teams, this tier and the next year, obviously with the Browns and the jetsets who's left i think purely from a roster standpoint you could actually get me there on some of these teams being a little bit closer i just think the tier four stuff is a lot of like organizationally i don't trust them at all so i push them down uh because this this dolphins roster still does have some of its questions right yeah i mean that that's my my biggest question was like what are the dolphins trying to be because like once you get rid of Tua or however you do that whether it's probably not going to be a trade because I don't see anyone taking on that contract really quickly I do want to talk about that like with every time I've thought about Tua this offseason it's been like I think there's been a lot of like oh somebody will go after Tua and then I'm like well if thinking about the money that it would take to get Tua having to give up capital and stuff like that in almost every other case like I would rather just do like anything else like if I'm trading for a quarterback I'd rather try to go see if I can talk to the 49ers and get Mac Jones if I'm just like really thinking about the money I'd rather take the gamble on a Malik Willis or something like that like it just it it just feels like to me like he's in this weird middle ground of kind of expensive and gonna cost you a lot but not doesn't feel like as much of an answer as a guy like Kyler Murray would yeah uh on uh his $39 million is the base salary for 2026 already guaranteed.

37:21On March 13th,$3 million next year becomes guaranteed. So if you're trading him, which I think the Dolphins would probably like to do because that's the easiest path. Because even if they post June 1st him, they're still losing cap space this year. That's a tough pill to swallow for a team that is already cash-strapped. You know, they're not cutting Bradley Chubb right now because now they're still trying to figure out if a trade or a post-June first cut to open up the board cap space this year makes more sense. So my hesitation there with Miami is like, what do they want to be? Because when we get to like the next two teams, like neither one of them has a Jalen Waddell or Devon Achan, which is something that already is going to put some sort of production in place for what this offense can be.

38:14and I don't know how many like wide receiver running back combinations are going to be much better than that uh probably it's better than what we've the teams we've already talked about but then that's really it uh and then there's not a lot of room for improvement elsewhere so that that's where Miami just kind of comes in like its own little tier here that I that's exactly why I actually started with them a little bit higher because I was like man if you just look at who's going to be there I can really get myself excited about Devon HN and Jalen Waddle like those are two still really explosive players they're unique like field tilting guys and then I did as I look at it a little bit more it's like man they do just have a lot that they have to replace like their their entire offensive line room is it's kind of moving uh the two tackles will stay Patrick Paul uh on the left side Austin Jackson on the right side um Aaron Brewer is obviously going to be at center, Jonas Avene on the left side.

39:08But like all of their depth is gone. They probably need a new starting guard on the other side. Cole Strange is going to be gone. And so they've just got a lot of depth that they need to replace, which again, if the starting five is all healthy, that's good and great. But this is the NFL. Chances are a lot of those guys are going to miss time. And if they're going to end up relying on third and fourth round rookies or like super low end free agency guys to replace those guys, I think that that's going to be a little bit of an issue, especially because the offensive line is not it's not like you're going from great to OK depth like this would be like the offensive line is already kind of shaky, even if you like the upside.

39:44If they lose any of those guys for any amount of playing time, that's really going to hurt them. And then again, you mentioned them being cap strapped. Then it's hard to find like where are these offensive line guys going to come from? Like they probably can't afford to go sign one of the better backup guards or one of the better backup swing tackles or something like that because whatever money they do have, they probably need to spend it on the secondary, truthfully. And then they probably would then end up having to use some of those picks on the offensive line. So it is just like a kind of to your point of like what they want to be.

40:14It feels like this is a year where they've got to accept that they're not going to be that good and just need to make sure that the environment is like workable and doesn't nuke whoever is going to step in at quarterback for them. Yeah. And that also raises some of my concern of Bobby Sloick being the offensive coordinator. And so. How good or bad do you think that really is? Because I feel like he's not. Like terrible, I just don't know if he's that exciting. So my my biggest issue with Sloick when he was in Houston was kind of his lack of problem solving and troubleshooting. Like he clearly like has the Shanahan stuff down.

40:57Like he has the plays when they work, they, they were good. And we saw that in his first year when everyone was real excited about him. Then you kind of like dug into it a little more and it definitely showed in his second season where if there are some issues along the offensive line, there's not really that change up that helps counter or, you know, just overcome whatever those issues are. But I do wonder, it makes me feel a little better that he was already on this Miami staff last year. And you're with Mike McDaniel, who the only thing he did during his Miami tenure was troubleshoot and problem solve because there was always something going down the way they had to either, you know, fix the run game, uh, overcome the offensive line, uh, have some of the like H and out like in the flat where for that, like half a season, like that was their run game where it was just swing passes to to a-chan because they didn't have anything else so now that he kind of had that year where i guess he was around a little more kind of troubleshooting and figuring out how to kind of scheme up around some issues that might make me feel a little better uh but again like we're not going to be working with a ton what this miami offense was over the past couple years was so much top tier talent that kind of bailed you out of things if things gone wrong that's not really going to be the case anymore.

42:16I'm kind of with you. Like, that's a little bit how I see the Sloic thing like this. I think some of these other like Clint Kluviak going to the Raiders like that to me, I'm viewing as a positive. It should make things better with Sloic. I think it's very easy because I have the stuff with the Texans ended to view him as like an outright negative. And like, this is not going to be good for the Miami offense. I'm almost viewing him more as like an unknown. Like, I think that, again, there were some things that he did well in Houston. And then, like you said, he just struggled to problem solve, which I think if he was like a 45 year old offensive coordinator and like had been around a little bit, then I would start to have that as like a big concern.

42:53That was his first time really doing it. It was a really bad offensive line. I can understand how he maybe just felt a little bit overwhelmed and struggled to find ways to adapt in the moment. And so I think, again, him getting a little bit of time stepping away from actually calling the plays, getting to be around Mike McDaniel, who to your point, I think we think the hallmark of the Mike McDaniel offense is like, oh, it's speed, speed, speed. And it's all these little guys. But like the hallmark really of what he did is that he just like fixed shit constantly. Like there was always something, you know, in one of the cogs and he was able to pull it out and just fix something.

43:27And so I do think being around a mind like that could potentially help slow it. And I think, again, to that point, like Mike McDaniels, I know the run game hadn't always worked because of the offensive line talent, especially like in 2024. It was really, really bad. But I do think McDaniel always came up with really creative solutions for the run game and like just like how to move guys and all this stuff. And so I think it's slow. It can bring a little bit of that to his run game like that could help. So I'm I don't know if it'll work out, but I'm at least willing to view the slow thing as like an unknown rather than like, oh, my God, the Miami play calling is going to be 10 times worse or whatever.

44:02Yeah. Yeah. That's where I am, too. And then it just kind of comes down to I have no idea who the the quarterback like what. Like what is their avenue? Yeah. Yeah, like obviously the Malik Willis connection has been there because of all the Green Bay stuff. But I don't know, is that something Willis wants to maybe that's his one place to start and he does go there. But again, he might be the best quarterback available. And is Miami going to be a place that's going to be able to pay that price? And then if you don't get Malik Willis, I don't know. Well, honestly, though, it might be his best spot, because if we're thinking about it this way, like.

44:43Just talking about these teams that, you know, to us for sure need quarterbacks. Vikings is like maybe they would be the Willis team, but they feel more like they need to be like super serious and maybe potentially be the Kyler Murray team. Raiders, that's obviously already accounted for. Cardinals get interesting because I think you've sold me a little bit on the idea that maybe they just keep Kyler Murray, which I guess then opens up the Vikings. But it really does feel like of those top three teams, you know, maybe only one of those slots is open. There's a chance they get filled and the Dolphins are Willis's best chance to do something like that.

45:13And I actually do think there is an argument that like. The combination of Jalen Waddle, Devon A. Chan and Malik Willis, just from like a pure blazing speed perspective is like a pretty unique challenges for defenses to have to deal with that, like if you know, as the Miami, you're going to be in a weird spot where we're not going to get the best quarterback on the market. We're still going to have some of these flaws with our team building, and we're probably going to have to find some bullshit way to score 30 points a game because our defense is a little bit old and having some guys leave. Maybe Malik Willis does actually make a lot of sense being like the weird, just like kind of a curveball type of signing.

45:50Yeah, and then I think you kind of just study, you know, maybe like the 2024 starts from Malik Willis when he came in for Jordan Love, when Green Bay was doing all that weird stuff in the run game, where maybe you have like a Malik Washington playing the Jaden Reed role, where did super uh the jet guy who's also playing in the backfield and you just never knew who was getting the ball in the backfields uh and i think we saw that a little bit at times with miami um we just kind of with the h hand but and you know when tyree kale was going on you know some of the jet sweeps and things i think you do that and like maybe that's your way to again just kind of make up for what the offensive line deficiency might be i just have all that misdirection in the backfield and having a quarterback like Willis who can run, that might be the way to do it.

46:41100 percent. So maybe that's not like the sexiest, you know, five, six year outlook where everything works. But like for two or three years, can that work in the way that like some of the Kaepernick Niners teams worked or like to Rod Taylor when he was with Greg Roman in the Buffalo Bills? Like, can you get something akin to that? Like, I kind of think they could with what they have. And so the Dolphins are in this weird spot where they've got some high end talent. There's some reason for optimism but there's enough flaws in this that they just don't feel like they're quite as stable as a couple of the other teams and so that to me that is the tier break and then you have tier four we have the browns and the jets left dan did you actually end up ranking these teams at all or did you kind of just leave them in their own tier and just like it doesn't really matter they're at the bottom yeah so the way i kind of had it where i ranked all of these teams by a couple of different uh categories uh the browns and the jets ended up coming out exactly the same in like their their own.

47:35So you did this like systematically and the numbers spit out the same thing. That's really funny. Yeah. Yeah. That's really good. So I but did you when you're looking at them, even though they come out the same. So here's why I ask this. I do think if I'm looking at these two teams and I said this a little bit earlier, the reason I had both of these two down there is like organizationally, I just don't trust them for different reasons. But I will say if I look at the Jets roster right now. The roster's not that bad, like offensively, like they they do need some help with with receiver. They obviously need to add a couple of pieces.

48:10But like if Garrett Wilson can be healthy, I kind of like Mason Taylor at tight end. The offensive line, even though they're losing some of their guards, I think the tackle center tackle situation is pretty damn good. And so I kind of like some of the players for them. it just comes down to so much of like, I don't love the coaching staff. The Frank Reich hire feels like it's like five years too late. The whole coaching staff in general feels a little bit pre-fired. And then if we're talking about in terms of like, oh, well, it's a young quarterback and they'll, you know, you'll have a little bit of a runway here.

48:41I just don't know if I trust the Jets to like hire the right people the next time anyway. So I like, I just, it kind of, I kind of struggled with them in that sense. Yeah. That's pretty much exactly what I had in my notes. What's the plan? Everyone feels pre-fired. Frank Reich lasted 11 games with the Panthers. I certainly didn't remember that it was only 11 games. I didn't think that he got fired midway through his first season with the Panthers. After he got fired, he told the Charlotte Observer that he wasn't done with coaching, but quote, this is probably the final chapter in my NFL journey and now here he is as offensive coordinator of the jets um and i think like it it is concerning the panthers scored more than 20 points three times in his 11 games after their bye where you think you make some adjustments and get a little better they scored 15 the first game and didn't reach that again until he was fired um so like i i don't know what exactly is going to help a quarterback here um so garrett wilson last year led the team in receiving yards wasn't it only like 380 yards which makes sense because garrett wilson is a very good receiver he did not have a yard after week six

50:06that i don't know how you would like check that like on some sort of like of the statistical databases where it's like has it has a guy ever led his team in receiving after having not played after week six, but it feels like that can't have happened. He was injured. He came back to play in week 10, had three targets, but no receptions. So he did not put up a receiving yard after week six and led the team with 395 receiving yards. So there is a lot of questions here for just kind of what structurally this is going to be. Um, you know, having Garrett Wilson healthy is going to be great i've never been a big 80 mitchell guy um yeah i just i don't love fast receivers who don't know how to play receiver and i think like that's the thing about mitchell where the the the nuance of route running and things just aren't there and if you have a guy like justin fields or tyra taylor who's just gonna you know throw 20 yards because there's nothing else in the offense that works occasionally and that's kind of what we saw sometimes with mitchell last year after he got acquired by the jets but that's not something i'm going to be trusting in my offense for most of like uh you know mason taylor i i did like him coming out didn't really click in the first year but outside of you know the superhuman tight ends that we've seen like tight end is usually a position where it takes you know a year or two to to get caught up but then like I just don't know what else the Jets are doing, which is why I have them so much lower than than all these other teams and the rankings.

51:42And it just feels like even if I like some of what's going on here where, again, I think the young tackle duo is good. I think what they've got going on at center, like can be useful. I just when I look at the way like it just and they actually have like they have a decent amount of cap space. They have the seventy eight million dollars in cap space. they have obviously a ton of extra picks both this year and next year they've got an extra first this year an extra second they don't have a third but obviously you'd rather have all that stuff and then they'll have extra picks next year it's just like it feels like even with all of that being the case like it just does not feel like whoever plays quarterback for them this year is going to be set up for success it feels like this will be a conversation that will be fun to have next year when maybe they've spent some of those picks on young guys that we can get excited about and you know maybe we can talk about what they would be in ex-offensive coordinator who just got hired to be the head coach you know their offense and stuff like that but it just feels like for this year it's hard to get jazzed for it and I think another reason that is true is like they're they one they have to replace again some of the offensive linemen both of their guards are potentially going to be up John Mechie who's a backup receiver for them this is already a team that really cannot deal with losing wider receiver depth and he might be gone Brees Hall obviously a running back is is going to be up for free agency and then they've got a couple of guys on defense Quincy Williams is leaving Andre Sisco is potentially leaving like they do have a lot of stuff to replace so it just feels like they've got too much work for this to be a situation that year one right now this could be a good spot for either a veteran or a draft pick yeah and then the thing is like I I wouldn't even try to throw in a draft pick there because then you're kind of probably talking yourself into oh well he had nothing around him and let's give him another year feedback right so yeah so i mean it's probably going to be a new staff next year who isn't going to be tied but as we go into obviously like the the personality will be different than the quarterback we're going to talk about and on the next team um you know that's still a kind of a new coaching staff and we're still going to have that conversation somehow as bad as, you know, that look, that quarterback.

53:55So I think even going into a round two or three quarterback, if you are even talking yourself into one, that's a tough place to potentially put yourself for next year when you could be in position to get someone who could actually matter. So let's talk about that other team. The last team that we have here, the Cleveland Browns. This is the one I most feel like you really have to set the table for what this looks like. they the offensive line was not good last year I get that all five of them all five of the starters their deals are up including even backup guard Tevin Jenkins his deal is up so they again maybe it was not a great offensive line but when you are having to replace five guys that's a tough spot to be in when you're going to be potentially a fresh quarterback in this spot they're also you know David Njoku the tight end is going to be up for free agency this year and then you would think with all of that, all of those guys potentially coming off the books that they would have some money to deal with.

54:50And there's obviously always ways to move money around. But because the Watson deal is still on the board and they spent so many of these deals pushing money into void years, they are 20 million dollars over the cap right now. And again, they can toy with that a little bit, but that's not enough to like, man, you've got to replace the entire offensive line and you're already 20 million dollars in the hole. That's really, really tough. They do obviously have some some extra draft capital. They have the Jags first round pick this year but just from a pure roster building perspective and what they've got to do all the work they've got to do in terms of the floor this feels like by far the worst of all the situations that we've talked about so far yeah it just i this feels like the pre-stroud texans with lovey smith david coley on one year deals before uh you know shroud and domico ryans happens this this kind of feels like that because there's just i don't really know where they go i mean they you can restructure denzel ward to get like another 13 million dollars in cap space i would not touch watson's contract because you're only going to be pushing more money into future years where you gotta just let it go you're kind of hoping next year is the one where you can actually finally cut bait uh and you can just kind of where when you look at that contract that's the way it can happen next year is finally that year you can get that off the books and i don't want to be adding even more money into that so it's tough i mean you have harold fanon who's really fun um again jerry judy is one of those guys i've just never been super high on so maybe he can be okay in this offense just because there's not a lot else but then you're looking at cedric tillman Isaiah Bond and like that's that's it yeah and like again I actually really do like uh Harold Fanning like I think he's a really impressive player I Quinshot Judkins when he was healthy I thought was really really good but even that is like and I know that we've talked about some of these other teams that only have like two really good young players like the Raiders or um I mean mostly the Raiders obviously them having Brock Bowers and Ashton Gentey but they just even if I like Harold Fannin and Quinchot Judkins, Gentian Bowers are kind of like, it's a different tier of like, those are top 10 pick like caliber players.

57:09Those guys are superstars. And so I, I like Fannin and Judkins as like starters, potentially even like high quality starters. It's just not quite the same. And then when you add that on top of like, I literally do not know who is going to be in front of the quarterback. Like it's just, it puts you in a really difficult position. Yeah. And I mean, so I like, in coaching and scheme is like one of the things I rank these teams and I had Munkin fairly high in this because I do think he has done things very well what we saw in Baltimore the different places that he's been like we've seen him do multiple different offenses so I think there is going to be like a structure in place where it's okay but I also thought that about Kevin Stefanski last year and we just kind of saw if the quarterback isn't working and maybe that's the conversation we have now where sure centers was just not good i and like not only not good like one of the worst quarterbacks in the league just one by watching him two by efficiency uh so for them to potentially be just kind of going in just because he's there i think like the weird portions of the browns fan base is still acting like sanders was like a first round pick that's worth trying to develop.

58:26And that just wasn't the case on any level of what he put up last year. I mean, if anything, kind of what you were talking about just then with the pre-strout Texans is like, if there's any reason to play out the string a little bit with Sugar Sanders, it's that you believe that he can be just like the Davis Mills. It'll be fine for another year. We can get by. I think even that a little bit I struggle with because Davis Mills was not good, but there were at least like some flashes of like that looks like a really high quality backup, low end starter type. And I think even this year when he had to step in, he had a couple of moments like I just think the arm talent is a little bit better.

59:01He's a decent athlete every now and then. Like he can make some of those really high leverage tight window throws on occasion. Obviously not good enough to be like a serious starter in the NFL, but there were at least like enough where it was like, OK, this is not sinking the offense every time we have to go out there. I just didn't get enough of that sense last year with the Browns because like even a lot of some of what buoyed or Sanders's production is like Stefanski screen game was phenomenal, which which like maybe Monken can do some sort of, you know, BSing the offense a little bit to get some of that production.

59:31But I just with Sanders specifically, like as a quarterback, I think it would take two or three years more of development to like really get him in a spot where you could feel like this was going to be fine for a year. So I think that actually brings me to the question then of like, if it's not Sanders. And assuming it's not Watson, Todd Monken has talked a little bit like maybe he is willing to entertain that idea, which I think is obviously ridiculous at this stage. Who do you think they might like? What kind of bin would you want to be going after if you were the Browns in terms of quarterback?

1:00:01like that's yeah that ends up being the tough question maybe why sanders ends up being more of an option than you would think just because when the cap space too like i've i've heard i've heard malik willis but like again why if you're malik willis why would you want to go to cleveland yeah why are you signing where there's no offensive linemen yeah that's great yeah and that's the thing so i like it's not sexy but like tyler huntley is a free agent and like he's been a brown he worked under munkin like he's not awful and at least like that can give you some veteran uh you know competition that maybe you know with sanders is something you can entertain in you know training camp in the preseason but like i think it's going to be like that tier of quarterback and you got two pro bowl quarterbacks on your roster so you got that going yeah maybe they don't need one um like yeah if you have huntley but i feel like it's just going to kind of be that low level veteran who is just going to kind of get by and if Sanders beats him out then great I guess it's like found money if that happens yeah and like that I think too is like where they almost do have to to pick from that bin of like the low end um you know previous NFL guy who like maybe you just have him and Sanders and Gabriel like battle it out you kind of see what happens because I think the issue of like you know I guess in theory you could be like, well, maybe they'll draft Ty Simpson with the Jaguars pick in the 20 somethings, or maybe they'll take some other guy in the second.

1:01:31But it's like, do you really want a quarterback room that is all 23 years old? Like I just it does not does not feel like the right way to build a quarterback room either. And then again, even throwing in like at that point, then you would have what three top 100 picks at quarterback. And I guess you don't really give a shit if you've thrown that many resources at it, if one of them turns out good. But it just feels like you're really overspending to try to make that work. So I'm kind of with you. Like they probably are in a spot where whoever the fourth highest paid free agent quarterback of this cycle ends up being like they're probably a Cleveland Brown yeah like that I don't know is the best case scenario like Carson Wentz like oh my god that's that's not anybody's best case scenario don't even say that I mean like truthfully like if Kirk would want to do it like I actually think that's a decent spot for him but again I think if you're Kirk Cousins at this stage in your career, you probably don't want to go to a spot that is, again, has no offensive linemen, even if this might be the best chance for him to start.

1:02:31If you're Kirk Cousins at this point, like I would rather just like, where can I go be a good backup? And so that's probably it. So we're going to take our final quick break here and then we'll talk about a handful of teams that maybe don't necessarily need a quarterback right now, but they're going to be in the market and they're going to be thinking about it.

1:02:51okay so we have this final grouping of teams here that we don't know yet if they need a quarterback for a variety of reasons and so that's going to be the pittsburgh steelers we don't know if aaron rogers is going to stick around like there's just no and we can already make the argument like they should be looking for a quarterback anyway but it seems to what we've got right now that if he comes back he if he wants to play again he would play again for the steelers and so that's where they are. We have the Indianapolis Colts, who obviously a lot of the moves they made this past season, you know, with trading away first round picks and stuff, it suggests that they want to go all in with Daniel Jones, but he might not be fully healthy to start next season.

1:03:29And if they are potentially trading Anthony Richardson, that starts to conflict things a little bit about like, what does the quarterback room look like, especially for week one? And then another potential week one issue, we have the Atlanta Falcons, who kind of in a similar boat where We don't know if Michael Penix is really going to be ready for week one, but their backup quarterback, Kirk Cousins, probably not going to be around and will probably be playing for somebody else. So those are kind of the three teams that we got here. Let's start with the Steelers. How how do you view this situation if we are, again, removing Aaron Rodgers and we're just saying pluck X quarterback into there?

1:04:04How do you feel about this offense right now? i i mean it just it still feels kind of empty where it's i don't know like what the receiving core is going to be where it's dk metcalf and not much else which i think we kind of saw in the games where metcalf either you know wasn't playing or wasn't fully 100 percent um and then like the mike mccarthy of it all doesn't really do a lot for me and i know like mccarthy is fine and again but like it's not anything that's going to be like modernizing this offense where i think if it's not rogers where it's going to be helping another quarterback and i think we've seen now in mccarthy's last two stops as soon as he leaves the offense gets more modern and gets significantly better and i know last year with with dallas there was the george pickens of it all that that ended and made everything better but that it just looked better and more structured there was more motion it was like those things that brian schottenheimer actually talked about during his press conference that are usually just coach speak like actually happened and it just looked so much better and obviously the run game was better with the clayton adams um but i just don't know what mccarthy adds to this if it's not rogers and reuniting mccarthy and rogers doesn't make me very excited either.

1:05:28Which like, that has made me feel crazy, by the way. The fact that there's been a lot of like positive talk around like the reuniting. They loved each other. Yeah, sure, man. What are we talking about? Like it just, that clearly does not make a whole lot of sense to me. That just feels like, and maybe this is mean, but like potentially both of them at this point in their careers, it's like, this is the best we're going to get with each other. I think so, yeah. And that is like reuniting. And like, that's, if they want to play out that string and like kind of do that for the last time, I think that that's totally fine.

1:05:53And even from the Steelers perspective, Like unless they want to be the Malik Willis team, they might not have that many other good options other than just keeping it going with with Rogers for one more year. And so I think that that would totally be fine. But I'm kind of with you on the McCarthy thing. Like I think he can be not embarrassing for them, but also like I thought Arthur Smith did a fine job last year, given some of the restraints that a guy like Aaron Rogers puts on you and not really having all that many receiver receiver talent to work with. So this to me, unless they make some major additions, again, feels like a spot where you're really hoping the young offensive line can take another step and maybe that can supercharge you.

1:06:32But just from like a skill talent perspective, it just doesn't really feel like you have enough. But I will say this is a good enough spot that if you're like Kirk Cousins, this is a place that does interest me. Like if Aaron Rodgers were to retire, like that brand of quarterback, I do. I do actually think makes some sense. And like that feels like it's what the Steelers want to be, right? Like they could have used like after Mike Tomlin steps down, this could have been, I think what a lot of us said, this could be, this gives you the path to finally just kind of reset. you've been this okay to good team over tomlin's like entire tenure especially the back part where you make the playoffs but you lose in the first round having tomlin gone allowed you to potentially just kind of do that reset get younger not have to worry about trying to make the playoffs every year uh but by hiring mccarthy it kind of shows that's exactly what they want to be so a cousins does make a lot of sense.

1:07:29And that would probably be the caliber of player, the veteran who's going to be able to take advantage of what McCarthy wants to do and kind of be in that place. And I think that does make a lot of sense for what I think the path for the Steelers looks like right now. It wouldn't be how I would have gone about it with a blank slate this offseason, but based on where they are right now, I think that does make sense. The last thing I'll ask them about them to you, If they were the Ty Simpson team or whatever other top 100 quarterback, Garrett Usmeyer, whoever it's going to be. How do you feel about the viability of like a young quarterback playing in that offense?

1:08:09I mean, I think the offensive line is good enough that he's not going to die out there. I do think that matters. Yeah. And I think it's it's not a terrible situation. Right. And I think that is different than someone who would have been taken, you know, in the at the top of the draft. you're not going to be reaching for one of these guys even if you don't fully believe these guys are you know round one caliber players so if you do take one in the back part of the first round or on day two uh you know you are putting him in a in a spot where again you have mccarthy who's not going to bottom out this offense it's going to be fine it's going to be a professional offense that works you do have enough along the offensive line uh you're going to have a good enough run game that i think that's going to help and you have metcalf who is still a good enough receiver that he's going to help out a young quarterback if he's put in place too.

1:08:58Yeah, he's good enough that if you're Ty Simpson and you kind of just need an answer on a given play, you can just throw it at DK Metcalf and maybe he'll give me one. So yeah, I think, again, I would probably be trying to dig in like the Kirk Cousins type of market. But if they were to draft a guy, I don't think that they would be like set up for failure. They would at least have a chance. So let's move on to what feels like a much more complicated quarterback situation in the Indianapolis Colts. And it's complicated for a number of reasons now, right, where they kind of last year, you hit on Daniel Jones and it's kind of like, oh, we kind of think that we have a quarterback.

1:09:30And so they make these moves, obviously trading for Sauce Gardner, that kind of suggests like, OK, they want to kind of move forward with this. They're probably going to end up paying Daniel Jones. And I think some sort of deal on that front will get done. It's just complicated now by a guy who's already had a little bit of a checkered injury history. Now, obviously, coming off of broke his leg a little bit, obviously had the Achilles. He's going to be coming off of that, probably not going to be ready when it comes to week one. And then even whenever he comes back, I think what we even saw last year when he was a little bit banged up, the offense was just not the same when he was not 100 percent.

1:10:03And so I just like you wonder what that's going to start to look like. And then the other complicating factor of it is they obviously brought in Daniel Jones to beat competition and beat out Anthony Richardson. And Anthony Richardson was supposed to be their backup last year. He like pops his eye, which becomes like a crazy thing. And then now they are obviously kind of there's been a lot of rumors and a lot of talk that he is probably going to be a trade piece for maybe some of these other teams like the Cardinals and Vikings that are looking to take a chance. And so they are potentially in a spot where the quarterback one and two that was on their roster last year, Daniel Jones and Anthony Richardson, neither of them will be either on the team or ready for week one this year.

1:10:42What does that look like and how do they solve that? Do you have like a decent answer? so i have the least exciting answer possible and it's gardner minchu it's it's i i kind of get it like especially if you only think you have to get by for like six weeks which we already saw shane steichen do with minchu and they were a play away from making the playoffs that year right and i don't necessarily think minchu was good but there was enough of the steichen scheming things up that that it was passable enough and so i think because i think a jones deal is going to get done in some way um you're not going to want to shoot this isn't going to be a malik willis team right because you're not going to bring that in with daniel jones unless you're just fully moving on from from jones which i don't think they're going to do it just doesn't sound like everything coming out of indianapolis that they're going to move on from jones so it does sound like he'll be back probably on uh some type of extension so i think you're probably now looking at the the type of backup that's just going to get you through until when jones comes back and i feel like you bring in minshu already has uh already has experience inside that system he was okay to find uh when he had to take over and then maybe you have a training camp battle between minshu and Riley Leonard, who when he came in, like wasn't terrible.

1:12:07And I think the last thing about the Philip Rivers thing is that Riley Leonard was also hurt. So I think if, if Leonard didn't get hurt in his, when he came in, he would have been the starter throughout the rest of the season, but because they weren't sure if he was going to be able to play that next game, that's when they brought in Philip Rivers. So I do think there was enough there for Leonard that maybe you can have that training camp battle between Minshew and Leonard. And then they just kind of set the table, hold the place until Daniel Jones is healthy. I think that's a great shout because I think the Leonard thing works for a number of reasons.

1:12:40One, he wasn't that bad. Like he wasn't again, he wasn't great. But if you only need to get by for six to eight weeks, like he showed enough there, he's a good enough athlete. The arm is good enough that you can get by. And he had some of those flashes. The other thing is that if you are as the Colts, again, only trying to get by for potentially half the season, you want the offense to be as ready for Daniel Jones as it can possibly be. Riley Leonard is kind of like budget Daniel Jones. Like they are very similar just in terms of their build, the athletic profile, some of how they throw the football and like what are the types of throws that they like over the middle down the field.

1:13:14Like I actually think there is a lot of overlap there. So it really might be that the answer is we're sitting here being like, man, they're going to trade Anthony Richardson and Daniel Jones isn't going to be ready. What are they going to do? The answer might be nothing. It's like just sit there and just let Riley Leonard play. And so then to me, the question becomes like, what do they do to keep the offense intact around whatever the quarterback is going to be? Because obviously Alec Pierce is a free agent, maybe the best free agent on the market at any position this offseason if they don't bring him back.

1:13:42And then right tackle Braden Smith, his deal is also up and they've got to potentially think about what that's going to look like. So those to me are really now that you've brought up the Leonard thing, I think that's a great point. The question then is just how much of what made this offense special last year can they keep around the quarterback? I think I think there's a decent amount right I think obviously having uh Smith back is going to be big along the offensive line but if you can keep that intact I think like the the interesting thing for I think at least the start of the season was this the Daniel Jones offense was like a mix of the Gardner Minshew cult offense and like the Daniel Jones 2019 offense with the Giants when they had their their good playoff run and i think you can fit someone like riley leonard into that and not have him need to do too much you have a guy like tyler warren who's going to be able to just to be a safety net there you have a run game in jonathan taylor that i think if you look at what they were able to do in the first half of the season before jones just was kind of a net negative because he couldn't really move.

1:14:52I think you bring that. That's probably back on the table. I wouldn't be surprised if Alec Pierce is back, but they move on from Michael Pittman to make that happen. Which that's a great I think they should do that. And I think Pittman is a totally useful player. But Alec Pierce, I think sometimes when you get these like hot button, you know free agent uh guys who are going into free agency it's like okay well did they just get lucky one year or was it you know maybe their production was just like spiked because they had a bunch of touchdowns in the red zone or whatever that is alec pierce feels like a clearly ascending player like he's just a better much better player than he was two years ago his route tree is fuller he's a more nuanced guy like this just feels like that's the type of player that you want to keep around and i also think the small thing i would say to that too is like i think part of the magic with the Colts offense was they had a clear identity in terms of size.

1:15:47Tyler Warren is like a very burly guy. Alec Pierce is a big guy. Jonathan Taylor is well sized for running back. Their offensive line, especially guard to guard, is pretty big. Like they had an identity there. I would want to keep Pierce around so that you can kind of keep that going. Yeah. And financially, it makes sense to whether you cut or trade. Michael Pittman opens up 24 million in cap space, which would help. I want to bring Pierce back, have the extension for whatever Daniel Jones might be. So I think that just financially makes sense too in also making the receiving core make a little sense.

1:16:25Then it also opens up some, you talk about big guys, but it does open up more for Josh Downs, who I think is really good, but just kind of got lost in that offense because of all the other guys that were playing last year. So I think there are definitely ways to make up for the Pittman not being there, especially if you can bring Pierce back. So I think there's just skill position wise, like this is, there's still a lot to work with. I still like a lot of what Shane Steichen is going to do. It makes sense that they kept him as head coach. I think Steichen would have been a very popular head coach candidate if he had been let go, which was rumored at the end of last year.

1:17:02So I think there is still a lot to like here. And I think they just need some guy who's going to be able to just kind of hold the fort down until they figure out what's going on with Daniel Jones. And the more we sit here, Riley Leonard does make sense. Like we, they, they, the Colts feel so interesting, but I do think actually now that we've sat and talked about it, the answer probably is just Riley Leonard. So last team that we've got here, we can probably breeze through this one because it feels like their answer is a little bit simpler. The Atlanta Falcons, they're in a similar position where the quarterback wanted to on the roster last year, Kirk Cousins and Michael Penix, neither of them will probably be on the team or ready for this year.

1:17:36Like Kirk Cousins will probably be gone michael pennix potentially not ready but it also feels like there's really not going to be any amount of like moving on from michael pennix and this just feels like a team that will be comfortable getting by with whatever two million dollar free agent quarterback that they can sign for a little bit yeah it it does but i'm interested to know what like kevin stefanski feels about michael pennix because i i don't know what michael pennix has shown even when he's healthy that has really made you think yeah this is the guy we should probably be building around and building an entire offense around and then on the the part where he not only hasn't been healthy has the extensive injury history coming into the league i i wouldn't be necessarily surprised if this is the malik will see which we've put him on every team so far that we've talked about but if you do bring him in like that is i think giving up on on pennix but again i think that completely complicating this is a completely new regime that has no ties to panics or cousins um and i think that potentially could be and this is the closest team to bringing in a completely new quarterback to competing um you know i guess minnesota too but i think they're they're similar where there's so many pieces in place this is a good offensive line that i think is going to get better uh in this offense you have bishon robinson uh you have potentially kyle pitts if he comes back The franchise tag is not going to be expensive because he's a tight end.

1:19:10That already artificially lowers what his price would be. I know you're a big Drake London fan. I've been a big Drake London fan for a while. That is a good passing game that you can build off of. Finding a second receiver is probably not going to be quite as hard. This could potentially be something where they try to boost the quarterback and don't really wait on Penix. because I think you kind of want this to be in place, especially when you don't really have, you don't have the first round pick either. So you kind of want to be as good as possible right now. The Willis thing is interesting because it's like, what is their appetite for wanting to give up on Michael Penix where it's like, I, if they wanted to play it out for a year and like still give him another chance, I totally get it.

1:19:52At the same time, I'm kind of with you. I don't know what he's shown me yet that suggests like, we've got to give this guy another chance. He has to be the quarterback moving forward. I do think they are probably in a spot where they should probably bring in more legitimate competition. But the tier of a guy like Willis does feel like not competition so much as like you're done. Willis is the quarterback we're moving on, which I wouldn't hate. I just do wonder what their appetite for making an aggressive move like that is going to be. Yeah. And I think that's why they're a really fascinating team in this position, because we we just don't know.

1:20:25This is a completely new coaching staff, completely new front office after a while. So we don't know what direction they're going to want to go. And it's probably something we'll hear some rumors about in Indianapolis next week. We'll probably like if we were doing this show either during the week, next week or afterward, we probably have a little better idea of how they feel about Michael Penix. Although, you know, it'll be, you know, the rumors that we hear later because Stefanski is probably not going to say anything on his in his press conference. so they they're they're a fascinating team in that way really quickly the only thing in terms of these two obviously I'm not good the three teams we've talked about are the Steelers the Colts and the Atlanta Falcons Steelers I don't think rise to this level but I do think the Colts and the Falcons are both really really good roster still which we've kind of talked about if you were ex-quarterback if you were Malik Willis Kirk Cousins whoever it is which of these two teams would you want to play for right now I know the Colts were awesome last year but I I kind of think I'd rather be the quarterback of the Atlanta Falcons yeah I think I'm gonna be there too now that I'm looking at it where you have John Robinson you potentially Kyle Pitts Drake London is just like it's so easy to throw to that guy like just wherever he is like he's just gonna come down with it um and and this Stefanski offense which I think has historically made things easier for quarterbacks, where there's going to be a lot of under center play action.

1:21:58We're going to boot out and it's going to protect kind of everything still. So I do think the Falcons are interesting, especially in an NFC South that should again be wide open because there's really no good team in that division. That's the other small part of it too. Yeah, it's a little bit more wide open division. So if you're a veteran, like, oh, I can go make my money here. So that's that I think I'm with you. I'll probably kind of push it just barely, barely, barely to the Falcons. All right. I think I think that's where we're at. Did you have any like one or two last teams you wanted to hit or like that to me was kind of the bucket of teams that are super interesting to me?

1:22:35Yeah, yeah, I thought so, too. I don't really think there is any other. I think there are more interesting quarterbacks who might be coming out some of these like other teams. Like we didn't talk about a Spencer Rattler trade who might be, you know, it's someone who that's that's a failing on my part. I love him. Like who could be an option for for one of these teams? Like I think there are guys like that who could potentially be the answer for the teams we've already talked about. But I'd be surprised if there was some kind of surprise team that we're looking at who's trying to get another quarterback option.

1:23:09Yeah. Barring the Joe Burrow trades and stuff that some people are non Bengals fans are trying to get out there. That's that probably is it. All right. Well, that's it, Dan. Thank you so much for joining the show. Is there anything you want to, you know, pump before we get out of here? Anything you want to talk about to the people? Oh, yeah. You just follow me on Blue Sky, Dan Pizzuta. Anything I put out is going to be there. Had an offseason previews for every team at Yahoo Sports. You can watch that and yeah, anything else I put out is going to be over on Blue Sky. Awesome. Well, Dan, thank you for joining the show and everybody.

1:23:38Thank you for listening. And until next time, we'll see you then.

1:23:49We'll see you next time.