Pam Stepnick On The Truth About Kids On Social Media - Pressure, Comparison, & Feeling Like You're Losing Them

21:18Pam Stepnick:So you can go to Sam Edelman. Okay. And it's a classic ballet flat. It's called the Felicia Ballet Flat. And it's a bestseller. They have all different colors. So I got the black, but they also have like a French sand leather. And then they have like almost a silver. It's kind of chrome. But I'm into the black because I wear a lot of little cardigans when I podcast and I like to be comfortable and a ballet flat hits all the things. It's classic. It's chic. It's elevated. It keeps it simple. I can slide it on. This one has a little bow on it. It's adorable. You can celebrate with Sam because they have a shoe for every occasion designed for every step of the season from the aisle to the after party and beyond.

21:59Pam Stepnick:And for me, for the studio, they also have the hazel pump, which is precise and timeless. They have the alley ballet flat, which I've talked about before. I like this if you're just throwing something on to go to the office. It's a refined option for in-between moments. And then they also have tons of sandal options. Each pair defines a moment. Beyond footwear, Sam Edelman extends into complete expression of style, pieces that frame the look with intention and ease. For every entrance, every setting, every celebration, Sam Edelman has you covered. Definitely check out the Felicia Ballet Flat. I like the black, Like I said, the Alley Ballet Flat is really elegant, too.

22:38Pam Stepnick:Visit them at samedelman.com to explore everything you need for spring and get 15 % off with code SKINNY15. That's samedelman.com, code SKINNY15. You were the first wave of parents that basically experienced their children growing up on social platforms. And before, when we were talking off air, my parents did not have to experience that because Lauren and I did not get social media and smartphones until we got out of college. I was in a chat room, though, at 13, pretending to sext with guys as a joke with me and all my friends. I love this story. I wasn't actually, like, sexting. I was pretending, like, I was using my words as a blogger before I was a blogger.

23:19Pam Stepnick:We had, like, AOL chat rooms. Yeah, I'd be like, I'm so hot for you, Bob. Michael, what do you think about this? I was in those chat rooms, too. Maybe I was Bob. You were Bob. Okay. Yay. No, but I mean, we had Jonathan Haidt on this podcast who wrote The Anxious Generation, and we've been talking about this subject. And a lot of, I think, I empathize with parents of your generation who were the first wave, who didn't even realize what these tools were and what they were. He kind of maybe figured it out. We now have built businesses on these. And I think I resonate with Jake in the way where he's saying, keep them off social media because you learn what these tools are.

23:58Pam Stepnick:And sometimes Lauren and I will go and speak at schools and colleges. And what I always say to the students is like, are you using these things as a tool or as a blind consumer? And if you fall in the blind consumer lane, then you might want to think about that a little bit.

24:12The Bossticks Hosts:Cut your screen time down a little bit. Yeah, because a lot of the people

24:15Pam Stepnick:that we know that have made livings, they've learned how to really detach and use these for what they are, which is tools and connection points. But they're not sitting there mindlessly consuming all day long. And I think that's a really dangerous pit that people can fall into if they're not careful.

24:30The Bossticks Hosts:It really is. There's all this, you know, comparison is the thief of joy type thing going on. Like you can just lose yourself in thinking you're supposed to be this way, that way. I mean, we all can do it, even at my age. Like, oh my gosh, am I fit enough? Did I do my Pilates enough? Am I using the right makeup? Do I, you know, you can get into that and you have to, I love that you said that to the kids because if you use it as a tool, it's amazing. It's really amazing. But it also can be really, really detrimental.

25:03Pam Stepnick:You mentioned grades earlier about straight A's. I have to ask this. Are we really, are moving forward, do you think that we should focus on grades?

25:12The Bossticks Hosts:No.

25:12Pam Stepnick:I know. This is like, I have this inner dialogue with myself where like, I don't really feel that I'm that concerned about grades. Is that bad as a parent?

25:24The Bossticks Hosts:No, it's not bad. You want them to do their personal best. And we had this issue in our house. Logan, 4.7 student, loved school. Wow. Jake, class clown, could care less. Yeah. He didn't care. He was busy making jokes and videos, and the teachers criticized him. Why aren't you more like Logan? And he then took even a more negative view, right, towards school. He's lashed out against teachers even in the last few years. You know, like, uh-huh. And teachers still mention him in the school. I've been told. Mention Jake and Logan. So I go back to saying, have your child do what they can do best. Every child is different and everybody, every child is communicated with different.

26:13The Bossticks Hosts:I could say something to Logan that there's no way I could say that to Jake and it's even today or vice versa because they take things in more, they take things in very differently. Logan can take all the criticism in the world. Jake internalizes it a little bit more and it bothers him a little bit more. It's so funny. We have the same kind of children. I know exactly

26:37Pam Stepnick:what you're saying. You have to like almost make it more digestible for one child.

26:41The Bossticks Hosts:Right. I call it Jake speak and Logan speak. Yeah. And that's just how it is. And you have to learn to do that. And a lot of parents really don't. They treat all their kids the same. And, you know, again I'll go back to the grade thing their dad was insisting that Jay couldn't play football unless he got B's and I'm like he's really good at football he doesn't care about school and I was the same way I was a gymnast I could care less about school I wanted to do my gymnastics and have my boyfriends and my friends but so you can't put that restriction on every child and I think that the school the whole school subject is is a whole another beast honestly because it's it's like we're in a i don't know like we're being led around to do certain things that maybe a lot

27:32Pam Stepnick:of kids don't learn like that if you could homeschool knowing everything you know now and when jake and logan have kids have changed you know would you homeschool i don't know if i'm smart enough to homeschool not you yourself would if you were you right now today with

27:46The Bossticks Hosts:I would send Logan to school and Jake homeschool.

27:49Pam Stepnick:So you would curate it for each child?

27:52The Bossticks Hosts:I would.

27:53Pam Stepnick:Yeah. And I was terrible in school. I was kicked out of home school. Never seen worse. He's bad. Probably the same thing. Very bad. And I never cared about school.

28:02The Bossticks Hosts:Yep.

28:03Pam Stepnick:I was always social. I always was self-motivated. I've worked for myself as long as I can remember. Yep. But I was terrible in school. And I was, every teacher telling my parents, oh, this guy has a big problem. I'm never going to make my sister straight A's.

28:17The Bossticks Hosts:Right.

28:17Pam Stepnick:And so I always felt as a student, like a little bit lost because I was being told all the time that I was no good. Right. And I think that in that environment, when I look back, if I see that happen to one of my kids, I'm like, maybe it created some grit, but also was probably not great for the development.

28:36The Bossticks Hosts:It wasn't great for your development or your self-esteem because you might always question yourself. Am I good enough? Am I? Am I? am I but it does create a little bit of I'm going to prove them wrong yeah and that's kind of where the title comes from like when people say that Logan and Jake they both want to and Jake even more wants to prove that people are wrong and so it can create that a little bit but it's a it's a fine line I mean telling kids that you're not going to succeed and I just don't understand that concept. I understand positivity. And you have to, again, I go back to know how each of your child, each of your children has a heart to take in what you say to them.

29:19The Bossticks Hosts:You have to know how to do it.

29:21Pam Stepnick:As a family, you guys have obviously shared the divorce and obviously your very differing styles in raising the kids. Looking back, what would you change if you could change anything? And what would you tell parents now as it relates to raising their kids and thinking about different parenting styles?

29:43The Bossticks Hosts:Divorced or married, because there is a difference, I feel like. I feel like I would not change anything because look where we are, right? And again, I used my faith to say God has a plan for us all and he executes it. We just do our best. I think that as divorced parents, it would have been nice. And of course, no one likes controversy, but our divorce was very, very bad in those first formative years of the kids' development. They were like seven and nine. And I think that we could have done better if we had been a little bit more cohesive. We had the same goal for them, but we just handled it very different.

30:33The Bossticks Hosts:But somehow the alchemy of both of our parenting led to where we are. I don't think it's bad that one parent's different than the other. Like I'm the softie. I'm the pushover more. And Greg was more the grit and the you're a man and this is what you have to do. And, you know, he was much, much tougher on them. You know, he was more physical with them. He was more verbal with them. And while I don't love that, I think that it's okay if your parents have different styles. I think you have to work together as parents, though, and that's where the issue comes in. Because if the parents aren't seeing and getting along, that's a problem, and you have to put your kids first.

31:17Pam Stepnick:Why was it rough? And I know you talk about this in the book, but looking back, if you could tell the audience a little bit about why it was rough in those formative years.

31:25The Bossticks Hosts:because again i'm a pushover and very different and i'm a much different person today than i was back then and i let kind of greg just walk all over me and walk all over us and i finally had to like get away from him to develop my own best self put your oxygen on first yeah right so it's that that type of thing and i think that i i don't have any proof of this but i think by the age of 12 whatever your kids are kind of developing into is who their their core being is going to be and they're watching you you know your kids and young ages they're watching how you two interact with each other my daughter is a reporter there you go she's six she's a reporter i love that i

32:17Pam Stepnick:cannot get away with anything right she is literally i went to the bathroom the other day i didn't even tell you this and i was like on the phone going pee i love the reporter and i i opened

32:29The Bossticks Hosts:the door and the ear is to the door almost fell into the bathroom because she was leaning against the door and i said to my dad oh the reporter's at the door they are they are like it's crazy too

32:42Pam Stepnick:even like even the three-year-old they watch everything you do it's a lot of pressure no i I think it's a lot of pressure. It's a good point. And we are lucky enough to speak to people like yourself and others on this show where it's a reminder. And I think sometimes, and you see this with some kids, the kids reach a point of almost no return. It's like they're already set. By the time they're 15, 16, 17, like if they have these habits and these behaviors and these personalities, like it's going to be a really difficult change. But in these formative years, we talk about that a lot. Like even sometimes if we, you know, like any marriage, if you start bickering or getting into some shit with each other, like we'll look at each other and say, okay, we got to.

33:16Pam Stepnick:It's always your fault, though. Yeah. I mean, you want to also show healthy resolution with the kids, but it's something we think about a lot just because we're aware of it. And I think a lot of previous generations maybe just...

33:28The Bossticks Hosts:We weren't aware of it at all. We didn't have the internet to teach us a lot of this stuff either, right? So we didn't really know the kids were paying attention to that. And I think that brings me back to your other question, like the different households. When I got remarried to David, we've been married 21 years. he is the polar opposite of greg he's even opposite of me he's calm collected cool treats me like a queen and we so he we led by example he sounds dreamy he's dreamy yeah so we we tried to show them because greg is all we just led by example we didn't talk to you know your kids don't listen, by the way, after a certain age.

34:13The Bossticks Hosts:I'm learning that. Yeah. After a certain age, you're done. You can't. So you do your best. Like now your kids are in that age. You do your best to be your best parents at this age, for sure.

34:24Pam Stepnick:This is a great question to ask their mother. What is something that you think is misunderstood about each of them separately?

34:32The Bossticks Hosts:Recently, Jake has dispelled this myth because of Utah and the Olympics and his reaction and how much it was really portrayed in the news and the media and the outlets that he has a huge heart. And I do think that Utah has helped people understand that.

34:55Pam Stepnick:Because he got very emotional when she won.

34:57The Bossticks Hosts:Right. Plus, he treats her so sweet. And she puts that on her Instagram, too. And I think that's a myth. Like, he gets in the boxing ring and he's, like, you know, acting like an idiot and making, you know, his opponent mad and saying outrageous things. It's an act. It's a play. He is not like that when you meet him in person. He's lovely, adorable, huge heart, always wants to help other people. People don't understand that about him at all. Logan. Logan is a very strong, powerful personality. And I think what's out there in the world of him being scamming people and taking advantage and not doing the right things.

35:43The Bossticks Hosts:And I hate that word, but that's, that's what it is so far from the truth and it's aggravating. It's really probably one of the things that aggravates me the most about what's being out there in the world today. He is the far, everything he does, he does it with passion, wants it to be perfect. Every business you start is not going to be like perfect. People don't understand that. They hear one thing and then everyone jumps on the bandwagon because the negative is way more fun to get involved in online, right? With these people and people just build this up. Some of the myths about Prime, just not true.

36:19It's not full of red dye colors or whatever they're out there saying.

36:26The Bossticks Hosts:It's just those myths really get me because Logan has put his heart and soul behind certain things. And so that myth is so far from the truth.

36:35Pam Stepnick:Pam is going to tell you guys the truth over here.

36:38The Bossticks Hosts:I'm going to tell you the truth.

36:39Pam Stepnick:You know what's interesting, too, about them? To me, you would think that they would be womanizers because of all the fame and the riches that they have. And it seems to me that they're actually pretty monogamous.

36:49The Bossticks Hosts:Yes. So, yeah, I'm sure they went through their phases when I was not there. And, you know, but I was there a lot.

36:55Pam Stepnick:Sure, but it seems like they got it out of their system. They did. It's not like they're like going to be 50 and single and a womanizer. Right. They could be.

37:02The Bossticks Hosts:Yeah, but they could be. They have women probably throwing. All right. I don't want to make anybody mad, but but but and so do their females because they're also beautiful, you know, people.

37:13Pam Stepnick:Going to be some pretty grandkids.

37:14The Bossticks Hosts:Yes. Well, I have a very beautiful granddaughter, Esme. Yes, she's so darn cute. I can't. I'm starting to shake because I haven't seen her since Christmas. I'm like, oh. But between the Olympics and the book and traveling around, it's just been really hard. But having said that, they are. They want a wife, children, and a family. And that makes me so happy because they witnessed what can happen if a marriage doesn't work out. And I'm not saying everybody's is going to be perfect. Who knows what's going to happen? But they really, really want that deep down in their heart.

37:52Pam Stepnick:That's so interesting. Michael has been off air having an opinion on that. I think maybe. What's my opinion? Just you have talked about how, I don't know how to say this the right way. You respect monogamy. So here's the thing. Like I, and there's a lot of these things going viral lately where it's like, there's a lot of single men without children that reach older age giving a lot of advice to young people like self-optimization and sleep habits and financial literacy. And it's kind of like, you know, when all you have to think about is you, like, to be honest, it's not that hard. It's not. Like if all I had to do each day was wake up and like put a couple of coins in the bank and take care of my body and sleep good and maybe go on a date or two.

38:43Pam Stepnick:It sounds like a pretty easy life. I think the harder thing that I respect as I get older and build my own family and businesses, it's a much harder thing and I think much more rewarding to build a family, build a life, take care of, raise children. And so, listen, to each their own, but I think I respect when I see people that have had a lot of success kind of get their priorities right. Right. And it's like for your sons, I'm sure they could go and make a few extra dollars and they could get a few extra eyeballs. But I think a harder thing is to stay disciplined, settle down, build a family, build a life and like in statement.

39:22The Bossticks Hosts:monogamous they're disciplined they're resilient and they work harder than everyone else in the room and that's like an easy statement to say but they really really really do they are always always working and i think on the monogamy end it's probably not been easy but that's what they want they want that strong relationship and i'd love to say and i hope that that has come from me because i am not the you know tmi like i was not i monogamous two people my whole life oh so you heard it here first my body count is pretty low and i really think i'm sure your sons

40:02Pam Stepnick:are happy but that's the headline listen boys two body caliber mom that's pretty good yeah your sons are like yes one was dad one was new that's pretty good they do know this and i think i know

40:14The Bossticks Hosts:they like that i do i know i've heard them like talk about like yeah i don't know that girl oh she's that it's too much it's too much i can't i can't do it so i know that that's important logan didn't tell you to ask me that right no he did not towns and bond my body count is not one

40:31Pam Stepnick:i'm sorry to break it to you michael's why not only my body count yeah but it's under 10 right yeah that's pretty good i caught her early you did yeah she was the numbers were going to start like i don't know the numbers were starting to creep up so no no i was never i listen i like i fuck who you want i was never slutty ever there you go i was not a slutty there you have it i

40:50The Bossticks Hosts:kind of wish i was slutty i kind of wonder what i missed yeah i missed i missed the slut face yeah i was a little slutty for a period but good you know get it out get it out of your system no but

41:00Pam Stepnick:i guess what you know i think i think to your like it's i guess like to round it out it's as I grow and as I look to examples and of the examples I want my sons to look to is I want them to look to different men that potentially could have it all but choose to be disciplined and choose to be honorable and choose to it to to kind of live in a way that I think is not gluttonous yeah and because again like I think it's a much easier thing to just kind of slide into bitches DMs and get their dick sucked. No, I do the bitches. But I think sometimes,

41:36The Bossticks Hosts:it's really easy to do that, right?

41:38Pam Stepnick:I can say that in front of Logan and Jake's mom. Yes, you can say anything in front of me.

41:42The Bossticks Hosts:Trust me, they tell me everything.

41:43Pam Stepnick:There's a lot of men right now, I think taking advantage of young men, giving them messages that I think will lead the majority of those young men astray, right? Like a lot of the people kind of preaching, make all this fast money and be with all these women. And I was like, the majority of men, that's just not going to happen for, right? And one day you're going to look around and you're going to say, wait a minute, I'm 40, 50 years old and I haven't settled down and I don't have a family and I have wasted a lot of my life away.

42:08The Bossticks Hosts:Right. And you're by yourself. I can't even imagine being alone. I don't understand that at all. Good or bad, try to make something work. I mean, work towards it and having relationships. That's what life's all about. Yeah.

42:22Pam Stepnick:And not to mention, again, as you get older, it's so hard to just build a business, build a family, raise good kids. If every day you're with a different person, that kind of stress just seems...

42:37The Bossticks Hosts:Yeah, that's not good.

42:40Pam Stepnick:How has your son's discipline rubbed off on you as their mother?

42:45The Bossticks Hosts:Wow. That's the first time I've ever been asked that question. You know, it has helped me write my book because it was in vlog when I started vlogging. Jake is like, Mom, I think you'd be really funny. You should try it. I'm like, wow, I need to bust out of my playing tennis and, I don't know, cleaning the house. I need to do something grander. And so I did, and that helped me to develop something new that I would never step out of your comfort zone, take a risk. And that's how the book came about, too. Like, yeah, anyone could say, yeah, I should write a book. This is a great story. But to actually buckle down and do it, it took discipline.

43:30The Bossticks Hosts:And I watched them, and they amazed me. I mean, they really do. Sometimes I just sit back and I listen to them like on a podcast or at a business meeting talking at colleges. And I am like, wow, I'm so impressed. And it's not, I don't feel like it has anything to do with me. I was just seriously blessed with kids who have learned and taken it all in and processed it, processed it and made it into something. So I'm taking more risks. I don't know if that answered your question, but I'm stepping outside of my comfort zone. I've always been pretty disciplined. I mean, I'm a nurse. I went through schooling and, you know, stayed on track and wasn't a slut.

44:17The Bossticks Hosts:And, you know, I'm pretty disciplined. So I have that and it runs in our family, I guess. But seeing them take risks. So why not do it myself?

44:30Pam Stepnick:My dad better answer that question the same. My dad and my stepmom. Starbucks baristas know their communities. That's why every year Starbucks baristas can nominate local nonprofits to receive grants. With more than 16 ,000 grants awarded to local organizations so far. So how Starbucks supports communities is led by people in those communities. Because at Starbucks, making an impact together is just the start. Learn more at Starbucks.com slash partners. Are you someone that wants to have healthier hair, skin, nails, lean muscle, and a stronger metabolism? Well, I want that too, which is why I take Keon Aminos every single day.

45:07Pam Stepnick:I love Keon Aminos. We have had the founder of Keon on this podcast so many times. And here's the thing. This has become an everyday staple that we take every single day, no matter what. So many people talk about protein and fiber and all these things, but are you getting the essential amino acids that your body needs? Likely not, which is why we love talking about Keon. We think they are the best aminos on the market. They have all nine of the essential amino acids, and the formula is based on 30 years of peer-reviewed clinical research. There's so many players in this space, but this is the brand that we trust.

45:37Pam Stepnick:It's one scoop in water and done. I personally take three scoops a day. Every single time I work out, I put a scoop in my water with a little bit of creatine, and then throughout the day, I'm also enhancing my water with a couple more scoops. I love this because it keeps me full. It keeps my metabolism ignited. It helps me with easy daily protein support and, of course, faster recovery. So like I said, many people are talking about protein and they're talking about fiber and all these things, but you need to also get the essential amino acids. And we love taking the Keon product to do that. There's no caffeine or stimulant feel.

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46:33Pam Stepnick:So check them out. Go to getkeon.com slash skinny for 20 % off. That's getkeon.com slash skinny. Quick break to talk about function. I've been thinking a lot about inflammation lately, especially if I start to feel slow or have a bad night's sleep or just feel a little bit stressed after a tough training block. just noticing that my energy and focus can be off whenever I feel inflamed. And what surprised me is that inflammation can be something you don't feel until it's already doing damage. That's what makes testing so important. We all know that inflammation causes all sorts of problems in the body and you don't want to wait until it's too late.

47:04Pam Stepnick:Because here's what most people don't know. Chronic inflammation is one of the root drivers behind heart disease, metabolic dysfunction, and accelerated aging. And it's largely silent. You won't feel it until it has already begun building for years. Here's the three markers I pay most attention to. HSCRP, which is one of the most clinically validated early warning signals for systematic inflammation. Even small elevations matter. Glucose, which we've talked about on the show, and insulin because blood sugar, dysregulation, and inflammation fuel each other in a cycle most people never break. And vitamin D because low levels are consistently linked to higher inflammatory activity throughout the entire body.

47:39Pam Stepnick:And that's why I use function. It tracks 160 plus lab tests every year so I can actually see my inflammation markers, by metabolic health and dozens of other systems. And it doesn't just guess at them. If something is trending in the wrong direction, I want to know before it becomes a real problem. That's what owning your health actually looks like. We live in a time now where this technology exists and you can do so much to prevent problems in your body and with your overall health. So check them out. Check your health the way I do. 160 plus lab tests a year for$365 plus the ability to dive deeper into your results with functions, trusted connections to platforms you already use like ChatGPT and Claude.

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48:59Pam Stepnick:And so it's here. After a year and a half, it is live. The Eden Rock St. Bart's Times Skinny Confidential red ice roller. It's in their signature red. It has a gorgeous, like look at this, ah, silver roller. It's so beautiful. It's very summer. You know, I could see this in an ice bucket while you're on the beach, enjoying some rosé or a margarita goes right in the ice. And then we also launched mouth tape. So it's red too. So you're going to get those red lips, very summer-esque. And again, it's in the Eden Rock St. Bart's branding. And then we launched facial towels. Everything is limited edition.

49:39Pam Stepnick:It's very exclusive. Once it's gone, it's gone. And these facial towels are plastic-free. They don't have any formaldehyde in them. And they're so adorable to throw in your beach bag. I use them to wipe my kids' hands. I use them after an oil cleanse. This collection is so major. I'm so excited about it. And it's so fun to see the Skinny Confidential come to life in red. You can shop our collaboration at the link in the show notes or on shop skinnyconfidential.com. And if you're at the Eden Rock St. Bart's property, you can also shop at the Eden Rock St. Bart's boutique and the spa. Eden Rock St.

50:15Pam Stepnick:Bart's, wherever you are. What are the disciplines that you've seen from a micro level through them? Meaning like, are they waking up at a certain time? Like what are the little things that you see for our audience that are tangible that you can't believe they do?

50:29The Bossticks Hosts:well I think some of it is still the manifestation process oh I love this I know you're a big manifester I researched you let's talk about that big manifester I taught my dad taught me I taught them they've taken it to new heights and new levels and I think it's you know Jake gets up in the morning this one example when he's in Puerto Rico and he's you know honed in right camp for fighting or whatnot, whatever he's doing. But he goes outside, he looks up to the sky, stands real tall and erect. He looks up into the sun, he gets his vitamin D, starts doing some of his breath work, and then goes through that ritual of mindfulness, which I definitely have much harder time being the meditating you know and doing that type of thing sitting in red light therapy in his hyperbaric chamber and all that takes a lot of discipline and calmness in the breath work because jake is all has an anxiety issue he is he has a lot of anxiety which i can see why their lives they lead you know and logan is a little more carefree i think like right when he gets up but they do and that has changed since having a baby obviously you're getting up a lot earlier but it's spending time with his family and kind of that's just so wonderful to see but logan is constantly working which actually can be annoying when you're with him is on his phone taking care of this and that and this and that and these and those and doing this and that But he also can multitask, which amazes me.

52:11The Bossticks Hosts:I don't know how he does it. I don't know if it's a good thing, and he does it all well. So those are like two things, I hopefully answered your question, that kind of are like, wow, that's pretty impressive and pretty incredible.

52:28Pam Stepnick:What would Nina and Yuta, is that how you pronounce her name? Yuta. Yuta. Yes. Is that right? Yes. Okay. How would they describe you as a mother-in-law?

52:37The Bossticks Hosts:Fantastic. I'm lovely.

52:39Pam Stepnick:I could see that.

52:40The Bossticks Hosts:Your energy is really good. Aw, thanks. And I think they feel that way. I'm sure there's times when they've been mad at me about something who isn't going to be. But I think I'm very blessed with my kids are mama's boys. And I think the girls recognize that and they like that.

52:58Pam Stepnick:Play that clip for my daughter-in-law. There you go. Because how your boys treat their mom, how they're going to treat you, is really important.

53:10The Bossticks Hosts:If I would have looked at that before I married Greg, we might have had a different story. Not that I'm glad this didn't happen because it did. but if if your sons treat their moms well their mom well hopefully that the girls that they choose are going to like that and not be jealous of it and i do i don't insert myself if i'm asked i will but i am not that mom that's nagging over the boys and trying to get their attention away from the women. I am supportive of those relationships. And I think the girls appreciate that. That's a great question. I'd love to ask them.

53:52Pam Stepnick:Switching lanes a bit, you mentioned earlier that a lot of kids these days, they don't aspire to be engineers or pilots or fire. They aspire to be creators.

54:01The Bossticks Hosts:Yep. What is something after experiencing fame as a family and for your children that you would

54:08Pam Stepnick:caution people against? Maybe, you know, we glamorize that kind of attention, but some things that you guys have had to navigate as a family as the platforms have grown.

54:16The Bossticks Hosts:Well, it's definitely not all glamorous. There are so many wonderful sides to it, but there's also so many pitfalls and dangers out there. And I think I would prioritize, like I said before, and I'm going going to say it again because it's really important is the mental health aspect are you able to be consistent to be disciplined to be resilient and you as parents or anyone else's parents who who have kids that are talking like they want to do this I think it's up to the parents to look at that child and say yeah they have what it takes or you know what they don't and if they don't have what it takes.

54:59The Bossticks Hosts:You have to be very strategic in how you steer them away, like into something else. And I can't think of an example, maybe right now, but all right, you might not want to go on camera and start talking because people are going to make fun of your pimples or your funny hair or whatever. Well, maybe you say, you know, but you like music, let's try music as a outlet type thing and give them different options because mental health and faith, I think are really, really key and especially in today's world. So I would also ask them if they think they could see themselves doing it, any kind of thing, whether it's gaming or, you know, having a, having a podcast, can you see yourself doing that forever?

55:45Pam Stepnick:Yeah. Well, your sons have reached a level that it's not, it's not possible to turn it off now. Right. And we talk about this all the time. There's different, there's different levels where, you know, maybe you get a little bit of attention, but it's, it's not so much where if you like decided, Hey, this isn't for me, you could step back. But if you go too far with it, not in a bad way, but like, if you reach the level of your sons, if like, there's no turning back. So then the rest of your life, if you're out, you're being scrutinized. People are taking pictures. People are coming up to you. People are commenting on your family, on your, on your marriages, on your children.

56:16Pam Stepnick:There's no way around it. Right. And so I think about that a lot because for children, especially that maybe look to a platform like that and say, hey, that's for me. Like it comes with a cost. And to your point,

56:28The Bossticks Hosts:there's a lot of great things, but it's a cautionary tale for sure. And I think you just made me think of something as, as parents point that out, take someone like Jake or like Logan, or I don't know what other good examples there are, but I was going to say that, but I left it to you guys, but it's true. Look at all the scrutiny that they all get. Like we've been compared to that family in a different level like we're not the wealthy kardashians we're you guys are doing all right we're doing all right but it's look at that like show them the example and go just remember you know think about this as you get older is this what you want your privacy is gone it's out the window and and so greg and i have kind of decided to embrace that rather than hide from it.

57:16The Bossticks Hosts:A lot of parents of kids that are in the spotlight, no matter if it's an actor or musician, that you don't see them out there on social media. They're in hiding. We're more outgoing and we've decided to kind of embrace it. And I think part of that was the HBO show. We didn't really have a choice. We kind of had to go along with it. And I don't mean we were forced. We were like, we embraced it. We said, okay, they're already going to put, we're already out there. Let's just put it all out there. Let's be real transparent and show people that not everything is hunky-dory because it's not.

57:52Pam Stepnick:I think we live in a time now where fortunately the person has a bit more control, meaning like, you know, we talked to a lot of celebrities that maybe came up in the 80s and 90s on this show or before. And they were really at the mercy of a lot of publications and tabloids and they didn't really have a mouthpiece to answer. Now, I think a lot of people can't. Like you can get on your own podcast and answer. But there's that. But yeah, I look at a lot of some of those people, to your point, and I'm like, man, that's a lot. Can't go out anywhere without just being...

58:25The Bossticks Hosts:It's debilitating. Logan, I feel like, deals with it a little bit differently. I don't think... You know, they have security. Of course, you have to. Right? Jake can't go anywhere. Like, anywhere. They do love Puerto Rico for that, though, a bit, because it is a little bit more toned down. and people are a little calmer and where they live. Like a lot of people have a lot of things. And so they don't look at Jake and Logan as, but then they still kind of do, but they don't bug them about it. And they don't come up to them and constantly, you know, want to take pictures and this and that. Another thing about Jake and Logan is though, they truly adore their fans and they will always stop if they can and embrace the fans and take pictures.

59:08The Bossticks Hosts:They're never like some of those celebrities you see I've seen professional athletes just be awful to people. You know, like they're so much better. They don't come across as so much better than their fans.

59:20Pam Stepnick:Who was Shia LaBeouf just attacking the other day? Mike Piazza. Did you see that? There was a clip of him when he, because Shia LaBeouf just did this show. Okay. And he said Mike Piazza, he would go out to the stadium for like 90 different times trying to get Mike Piazza's autograph. He wouldn't give it to him. He wouldn't give it. It was going by. Yeah. No, and same, like on our platform, like if people that we meet, Like that's kind of the reason you want to do it. You want to connect with people. But I think you reach a certain point in security. You have people that are maybe bad actors that are coming for the wrong reasons.

59:50Pam Stepnick:And it's scary.

59:51The Bossticks Hosts:It is a little bit scary. And, you know, it hasn't happened. Knock on wood too little here and there. But most people who are yelling F the balls, if they actually see them in person, they're like, hey, can I get a pic? Hey, you know, or if you answer them back, yeah, that's right. And then they just laugh and they're in person. They're fans. Haters are actually really kind of fans in disguise in a way. It's a fine line. It's a very fine line.

1:00:21Pam Stepnick:Where is your relationship with your ex, Greg, now, today?

1:00:26The Bossticks Hosts:Great. I could call him right now and say, and he hasn't said a word about the book, nothing about any of the backlash out there over it. He hasn't said a word. I don't know if he's just trying to ignore it. Greg, let's get a selfie with you with the book. Yeah, let's do that. Well, I've wanted to, but I didn't know. I actually was going to give him a signed copy, but Logan's like, I don't know if that's the right time to do that. And I'm like, but I should. It's about him, too. So despite all the past, we can still come together. Recent couple of incidents. We've come together. We've been on the phone an hour, hour and a half.

1:01:02Pam Stepnick:Are we doing Thanksgiving together? Yes, we've done Thanksgiving together.

1:01:06The Bossticks Hosts:I mean, I think Paul American kind of, that's why. Softened it. But we are, is Nina, to her credit, was like, look, you have one grandkid, and if you both want to come to Christmas, both come to Christmas. I'm not doing Christmas over here and Christmas over there. It's about our grandkid, and I'm all for that. I think Greg has a little bit more trouble with that, but he's learning, and he's settling down, he's getting older, and I think he's realizing that he's going to have to cooperate if he wants to be cohesive. And I've always wanted that. My parents had a very nasty divorce, but at the end, we did all Christmases and birthdays together and their spouses liked each other and everybody ended up being friends.

1:01:52The Bossticks Hosts:And I think that's really important. And I do believe that we are very still much a family. I still consider Greg a family. I don't know what he does, but I promote that. So hopefully that just resonates and keeps resonating with him. We do still want the same thing for the boys.

1:02:15Pam Stepnick:You have two children together.

1:02:16The Bossticks Hosts:And we still worry about them the same way. Before you go, you have to tell us why you crossed off Paul. That was Logan's idea.

1:02:24Pam Stepnick:She crossed off Paul on the book.

1:02:26The Bossticks Hosts:That was definitely Logan's idea because it's funny.

1:02:28Pam Stepnick:Yeah, I think it is too. It's comical.

1:02:30The Bossticks Hosts:And just the whole thing is so creative and eye-catching that, you know, if you walked past a book and it was that on the shelf versus don't read the comments, which was what I was going to name it, you know, what are you going to do? You're going to look at that and pick it up and see what it's about. You know how I'm going to make you pose with me and Michael, right, after this? Even the finger? The exact same thing. Oh, the exact same way. I love that. Yeah.

1:02:58Pam Stepnick:Let's see which one I have to be. I have to be, I think I have to be Jake because of my good side. She wants to pick a side. Okay. That's good. Yeah. After writing the book, what do you hope the people, the main takeaways are for the book? What do you hope people get out of it?

1:03:12The Bossticks Hosts:I think I like the fact, I'll go back to my toolboxes about manifestation, about faith, about listening to your kids, not letting your fear get in the way, realizing that like success isn't final and failure isn't fatal. That's just so important. And I think taking care of yourself as individuals, as parents is really, really important. Like I know you guys are into fitness and take, you know, the supplements and skincare. And I love that. I mean, I'm so into that. Like, and I play tennis and do Pilates and I want I didn't put that as much in the book however if I do a sequel it's gonna it's gonna definitely come back up but I want people to take care of themselves and I want them to really our generation of kids yours and and coming up they need a lot of attention you would think not because of the the little box that everyone's they do they need a lot of attention and if you don't give it to them guess where they're going

1:04:16Pam Stepnick:to turn i've heard a parent say this the other day that when your kids become teenagers they'll like shut the door on your face and and you go to their room and you try to connect with them and they'll shut the door on your face and what the parent says well you have to keep coming back even though they shut the door shut the door shut the door you have to keep coming back

1:04:32The Bossticks Hosts:and and that kind of gets through to them absolutely and i and i again my kids never did that with me they were never disrespectful i will take the door off the wall that that is

1:04:46Pam Stepnick:what their dad they will not have a door if they do that you you can't let them do that that's just

1:04:50The Bossticks Hosts:disrespectful and you take the door off that's perfect you'll take the door off take the door

1:04:55Pam Stepnick:i don't love that aesthetic though but well it would be temporary because they're going to learn

1:05:00The Bossticks Hosts:and you can even make deals with maybe a curtain i'll i'll let you shut the door you know while you're getting dressed i'll let you but you're not going to get on your phone or the internet behind closed doors you know what are you sneaking around in there like my kids were I laughed at your podcast. We're talking about the food in the bed. Oh, yeah. Do you do food in the bed? No. Why? My kids weren't even allowed to bring a glass of water upstairs.

1:05:24Pam Stepnick:Butter toast every night in the bed. With crunchy salt. I'm wiping the bed. I laugh so hard. I love to eat in the bed. There's actually, what is a better pleasure than sitting in bed with a tray eating with your magazine and your show? See, I don't like that. We had a friend of ours.

1:05:40The Bossticks Hosts:I stand up to eat half the time.

1:05:42Pam Stepnick:Same. I think it's actually. Bad for your digestion. No, I actually think it's good for you. Yeah, I think it's good for you too. We had a friend the other day, I won't say who, but they sent us a picture of their bedroom and it's two big beds next to each other. So they're still co-sleeping. Same room, co-sleeping.

1:05:56The Bossticks Hosts:They can jump from bed to bed.

1:05:57Pam Stepnick:Yeah, and they have their own set of sheets and blankets. And I was like, maybe if you want to do that, then you can have your own crummy bed and I'll have the clean one. I'm fine. Just make sure it's a Halston mattress. I want the best mattress, creme de la creme. Don't put some shitty mattress next to it. Well, we'll figure it out. Yeah, so that could be a solution because I can't stand those. Where can everyone find you, Pam, to say hi, pimp yourself out? Where's your book available?

1:06:18The Bossticks Hosts:Pimp myself out. So currently it's on amazon.com. I also have a website, fthepalls.com. And it will also, it's my like landing page for the book and it will take you to Amazon. There's audio, which I don't promote. I mean, a lot of people gravitate towards audio. I didn't realize this. Yeah. Because I'm one of those people that picks up the book in the airport or the bookstore. I still love it, but it's on audio. It's on ebook and currently in Amazon. We'll see if I do bookstores. We're going to, I don't know.

1:06:48Pam Stepnick:Congratulations on your book, on your sons, on your granddaughter, on everything. You must feel so fulfilled.

1:06:55The Bossticks Hosts:I am very fulfilled. I'm very blessed. I'm very fortunate, full of gratitude, attitude with gratitude and positivity. And I'll stress that at the end of this is we all have to remain positive because we are in a crazy world.

1:07:11Pam Stepnick:Well thank you for making the trip We've got to thank Lucas Mack for setting this up Thank you Lucas Lucas you've got to come on yourself too