Alix Earle vs Alex Cooper: the tea is in the balance sheets.

0:01Coming up in today's episode, Spotify's new feature could reveal that your favourite artist is actually AI. Alex Earle. We think she may be one of the smartest content creators in the world right now. She's kind of creating her own VC model where she's investing in private companies and so many other celebrities are doing the same thing. So we're going to talk about how they're all making a lot of money.

0:25Vic: A few of our favourite things are going to get more expensive. Chocolate, coffee. and it's all because of a weather pattern called El Nino, which we spoke about a while ago and we're speaking about it again and how it's going to impact the wallet. This is The Curve Weekly where we read the finance news so you don't have to. I'm Vic Harris, a finance professional who's had a career making money for other people. And I'm Sophie Hallwright, ex-TV radio producer who was sick and tired of not understanding how to grow wealth or understand the economy, so we started this podcast. But before we dive into today's headlines, a word from our sponsor.

0:56Vic: This episode of The Curve Weekly is made possible by Pathfinder KiwiSaver Plan, helping you invest alongside your values. Pathfinder's one mindful money, best ethical investing provider for five years running, so we've teamed up with them to bring you the ethical hotline. Got questions about the ethics of an investment or unsure where you draw the line? Submit your questions via the link in the podcast show notes and thank you so much to Pathfinder for making this episode of The Curve Weekly possible. Pathfinder Asset Management Limited is the issuer of the Pathfinder KiwiSaver Plan. A product disclosure statement is available at pathfinder.kiwi.

1:26Vic, I've got a bone to pick with you. Actually, the whole team has a bone to pick with you. You have officially gone to the dark side and we're not... Literally like the dark side. Yeah. What is this hideous laptop?

1:37Vic: It's called a ThinkPad. It's so that I can put Microsoft Outlook, Office, I can run all of that. Because for context, okay. When Vic first, when we first started the curve, Vic was working in funds management and she had, And I want to say it was almost like a touchscreen computer. Microsoft Surface. Yeah, you kept touching the screen. I was like, oh, my God. And then made you make the switch to Apple. To Apple. And you were really on board with that. I remember being like, oh, my gosh, what is this? It's like learning how to use a computer all over again. And now – But you loved Apple, right?

2:16Vic: Yes. You came to the creative side. She had her chic little Apple MacBook, and now there's this hideous thing. Now I've gone back to the secure side, Sophie, because we are managing money. I'm just like – it's so ugly. There's a tiny little red dot in the middle of your keypad that looks almost like a – it's like a textured thing. Is that – That can be the mouse, or you can use the pad. There's a little clitoris on the keyboard that you can finger in it. It's not. Anyway, look, it's really sad to see you go. you've left all of us behind and she's gone to something more but no it's because the security that we need yes is insurmountable and it has like i even go to use some things and i was like sorry contact your it department i'm like oh who's our it department we've got a new it department we do do you know what i would say is because we're dealing with client we're dealing with money and there's so much data we've got ids we've got like so it's like we have to be so incredibly secure and Microsoft is more secure than Google.

3:22I messaged for it the other day and I was like, why can't I see your calendar anymore? Because I can't book appointments with you because I can't see when you're free. She's like, sorry, move to Microsoft. Move to Outlook. How dare you? But no, it makes sense. We're very grown up these days. We can't have someone hacking the computer that's investing in all this money.

3:43Vic: So, yeah, and if I lose my iPad, everything gets wiped, everything, it's really, like, Yeah. Quite fun. Cool IT. I remember back in the day when I worked in my old job and I lost, I left my iPad in an Uber and I was so scared to tell work. So I chased it around Sydney for about four hours. How do you chase in Uber? Because I could see my iPad on my phone and we worked, like, all our meeting notes, like, everything was on this iPad and I was like, oh, dear gosh. and so I was chasing around Sydney and then I it pulled up the Uber pulled up sorry it was a taxi in those days and it pulled up in a taxi rank and I knocked on the window and I was like I was like you've got my iPad and he's like no I don't and I was like yes you do and I was like maybe I'm wrong I went back and I checked on my phone I was like and then I saw that taxi pull away from the taxi rank so I knew it was that one and I went and I jumped in with these other people in there and it stopped at the lights and I was like give me my ipad and he opened the um I went like rummaging and opened the he'd hidden it yeah and the what do you call the dove box thing yeah and I was like could you have a detective I know that's a real Sherlock yeah it was but then work was like Vic straight away you tell us and I was like sorry because I went back to work I was like great story for you guys but I found it and like my manager was like no no the second you lose it You call us and you're at, you know.

5:07Vic: So, yeah, very, very secure, yes. But I kind of like it. I feel like a bit of a geek again. Yeah, yeah, back to a root. And, you know, just supporting Microsoft, which has done fantastically well, actually. So someone messaged us the other day saying that. I did. Oh, yeah. Where was that? I messaged you saying, it was like, take that, Soph. Did you? And it was like Microsoft has its biggest day and adds 400 billion to its year. Was it 17 % or something? Yeah, it was up. I love that I'm like, someone messaged. Someone actually did also message, being like, guys, guys, I can't believe you're not reporting on Microsoft.

5:45I know. Yes. But, you know, week one, really, of the fund. Update us. How many of the Curve community have invested? A lot.

5:55Vic: We've had so many. We've had about 300 people, which is absolutely wild. How fun. We broke the system. we yeah so we've got like a fund administrator who like manages all the app because we we don't deal with any money it's very like we have to hand it off to someone else who's very secure to make those yeah anyway in terms of the actual movements though not the decisions sorry we do decisions but we have to ask like hey can you buy microsoft can you sell microsoft like all of that so um that there's like i guess a middleman middle yeah middle woman middle woman uh and And anyway, they got to work on Monday and were like, oh, my gosh.

6:32Vic: Oh, my gosh. And it was like all hands on deck. So, yeah, very excited. Everyone broke the system. Yes. Stunning work. Stunning work. We will do a proper fund update ASAP because we need to hear, you know, how's it going? How much money's invested? So we'll definitely be doing that in the next couple of weeks. But for everyone who has already supported the Curve Fund, thank you so much. It is very bloody exciting to see all of us investing together. Yeah, it's pretty amazing. Are you in the red or the green this week? I am. Oh, oh my God. I'm actually in the green. Literally. I'm in the green.

7:07I'm wearing a green dress. Yes. So I sold my bike that my ex-boyfriend gave me two years ago and it's just been sitting there. It's like giving away your engagement ring or something. Yeah. Yeah. Sold it. Got it. Money back. I hope it's not listening. 190 pounds. Yeah. Yeah. Oh, the thing is it was a very nice chic bike. Emily, our producer loved it, but I just felt like it was going to get stolen and I also don't have strong enough thighs to bike on it. So anyway, finally sold it. Feel very happy about that. And also, um, I sold something else. Ah, yeah. I ordered this dress that looked so bad on me and it was just cause I didn't have big enough boobs.

7:43It was like really saggy on that front bit. And I was like, damn, I love this dress. Um, but then I just sold it onto someone who wanted it, looked great. So I sort of feel like I've got an extra 220 pounds this month, right before payday. Nice. So I'm feeling, I'm actually, I went swimming yesterday. I've decided to take up swimming. And I went, bought goggles, a new cap and earplugs, 40 pounds. And I thought, don't worry about it. I've sold my bike. We have an image of Sussie swimming and her goggles. Oh, my God. She brought it in. It's so funny. It's the most ugly look anyone could ever have, for sure.

8:18And afterwards, for two hours, you have these, like, goggle rings around your eyes. It's not cute.

8:22Vic: I mean, you should be like, I'm just for summer. Yeah, no, I'm just swimming. I'm so fat. I smell the kilometre. Yeah, nice. Sorry, quite good. Yeah. Are you in the red or green? I'm in the red. Little Miso had to get her teeth cleaned yesterday. Does she have a nicer smelling breath now? Yeah, and she's got no plaque on her teeth. But it cost me 360 pounds. Are you joking? It's better than a teeth extraction. Can't you just clean her teeth every week? Yeah. Miso, come show me your teeth. Because it's like so easy. I tried that. You try, like you have a finger toothbrush. like there's so many ways like she just it's they're looking good yeah they do look good yeah um but she i didn't realize i dropped her off and they were like yep so i was like how long does it take like 45 minutes i was like sweet i bought my laptop i was like sweet and they were like but yeah so we'll just call you um this evening when she's done i was like sorry they're like oh we have to put her under general anesthetic and i was like what and then i was like this whole thing i was like i can't make her so she was fully asleep for a teeth bite yeah Yeah, the vets, they don't really want to be cleaning big dogs' teeth.

9:25They're no messes. Also, I guess it's like in terms of staying still, like if someone else is cleaning their teeth, I think I find that early on. Yeah. And then you think of a dog, you'd be like, not good. Yeah. Anyway, yeah. The vet's like so, so lovely. She is so lovely. And I was like, oh. But anyway, everyone loves her. She's so cute. Yeah. I really want you to go away again so I can look after her. She had a great time. Yeah. Just so you know. I know she can't tell you, but she did have a great time. Now, there's been some very good news stories this week, everyone. Yes.

9:59Vic: Let's start with Spotify. Okay, great. So Spotify has come out and said that it's going to put an AI little badge on all the artists in Spotify that are AI artists that aren't actual artists. Great. Yeah. because there has been an absolute backlash of people being like, I don't know if this is an AI artist or an actual artist. And it got me thinking. I was sitting there going, I mean, unless an artist has toured and I have like visibly seen them on stage, there's a lot of artists, not a lot, but there's some artists that I listen to that I don't know if they're AI or not. I also have terrible taste in music.

10:37So I would be listening to an AI artist and be like, this is a banger. This is amazing. I would have not a clue.

10:42Vic: So Spotify said from next month it's going to do this and it's pulled 75 million AI tracks off the platform last year alone out of 100 million. So like if you think of that, that's nearly the same size as an entire legitimate catalog is like this AI spam. Anyway, you'll now be able to see if it's an AI. And Spotify will also drop it out of your kind of personal recommendations. so it's trying to promote actual artists because it knows that if it doesn't strike the right balance and artists leave the platform it's a pretty quick death spiral of okay well then listeners leave the platform so it's like do you know what i mean they have to find the right balance yes it's cheaper for them to have ai artists on there because they don't have to pay anyone they don't have to pay royalties they don't have to pay don't they don't have to pay like why would they not have to then why would anyone even create an ai track well it wouldn't be as much as like yeah but it would definitely be i would definitely be cheaper than having actual artists on there and you can like track and be like okay this this everyone's listening to this ai track let's put more of that out so you know like i just think it's i don't know i think it would be a bad look and what if i just trying to find that right balance there's also a lot of regulatory pressure there's a lot of regulation coming out a lot of like ai policies and acts that are like, okay, you need to disclose this.

12:07Vic: Because, yeah, like with commercials and anything in the creative space, it's like people just want to know. But even with Claude, there's some watermark coming out where you'll be able to tell if someone's copied and pasted an email straight from Claude. For like university papers and stuff, yeah. But also like I love that. I think that we shouldn't be shaming people for using AI for things. But I also agree, like the transparency and knowing is really helpful. But I think it's going to become more and more common. There's going to be, you know, there's the reputational damage that you have to be careful of.

12:39Vic: And I think that's what Spotify is trying to kind of front foot is that, you know, look, we're doing this. So it's very clear from a listener point of view, from an artist point of view, like what is, what's not. Like if you want to go and listen to AI artists, cool, you can. If you don't, you don't. You know, like all of that. They're trying to be quite PC and like cater for everyone, look after the artists while also giving listeners the chance to listen to AI if they want to. Yes. Yeah, exactly. this all came out the same week that Spotify reported its financial result which has got like over 300 million subscribers now so it's like can you give context like how much has that grown or like how big is that, is that good?

13:13sorry to sound dumb but like 300 million I actually can't even remember if that's like a lot, that is a lot

13:18Vic: it's now generating close to 6 billion US dollars which is like it's just a behemoth so it's growing, it had good results basically. Universal Music which actually owns a chunk of Spotify so they didn't have a good result. Well their result was all boosted off Spotify's growth. So everyone was like hang on a second Spotify put through a price rise and to be honest that was most of Spotify's growth. What is that they just basically made subscriptions more expensive? Yeah I mean and that's Just to notify people to say it's going up and you can cancel if you want to imagine sending that email to 300 million people.

13:58Who's cancelling?

13:59Vic: But, like, you do so much modeling on, like, okay, we're going to increase it by a dollar. So that's$300 million. If 10 % churn, it's worth it. You know, like, you're kind of, yeah. But imagine that, putting it out, and then just, like, more people cancelling. But this is the thing. If you're so, like, it would probably take a big price rise for me to cancel my Spotify. I can't deal with the ads in between. No, neither. But then, weirdly, I'm still doing no paid YouTube premium. Do you pay for YouTube? No. yeah it's so annoying yeah all day i'm like listening to ads i'm like what am i doing but companies that have such deep like price flexibility like that it's quite a genius business model because it's like apple with their uh data with their cloud storage hi we oh yeah where am i gonna put it or hey it's gone up it's like who has not i don't want to lose all my memories no you know like preying on the emotive side so quite clever yeah i reckon i have about 16 apple payments coming out a month i'm just like oh god um so yes there's an interesting thing though so universal owns a stake of spotify and it's been selling down that stake and it's sold about 500 million dollars so far and it's got all the stake in spotify yeah and why on earth would you sell down in that isn't that like probably the most valuable thing they own i mean it depends if they can get a better return for that amount of money so if spotify doesn't do well then the return on the investment's not doing well spotify the last five years has done so well hasn't not recently no well the share price is yeah in terms of the share price so you're constantly looking at like where is the best return on that money is it having it in spotify is it if we invest in another part of our business so anyway but um there is some of that money so they've been selling down and taylor swift actually organized this back in 2018 was that um part of that sell down of that money has to go to the artists oh she's genius and it can't be so when you when you sign up to a record label like universe music you you they might um they might they invest in you and then you've kind of got this this loan that you have to pay back until you generate royalties you So they put all this upfront investment in.

16:18Vic: It might be like a couple hundred grand or half a million or whatever. Think of it like a book deal. You get an advance. Totally, an advance, yeah. And then as the royalties come in, it starts paying down that advance. And she's like, when you sell down your stake in Spotify and that money goes to the artist, it is not to go to paying down their loan to you. It has to be an outright payment to the artist. So she coined this whole thing. Oh, I love her. Quite incredible. that's kind of an aside but don't they then have to pay it down anyway so wouldn't it make sense yeah but it's almost like you can get the artist can get the cash in the hand effectively yeah you know it's like if i had this loan like my mortgage and yeah i could be like maybe i'll put half there but the other half won't go spend anyway it was just like quite interesting that when they do sell down part of that goes to the artists that's amazing and this whole thing that she and i was just like gosh she's great she's my favorite yeah we also have some news out with alex earl yes i'm she is i cannot deal how much she posts like really how much is she posting it's like i want to say like 10 10 posts a day no it's insane on tiktok yeah i'm like how does she have that much time because she has that many people in her team but she's supposed to do the voiceovers she's supposed to film which you're like i'm just kind of i mean it's it's this she would work so hard i So hard.

17:41This is what I'm quite glad about with these types of stories and what we're basically talking about is that she's being a really clever businesswoman with what she's doing with her business and we'll explain exactly how it's working. But I like that someone like her where in the past people would look at her content, what she even looks like, just assume like content. Actually what she's doing is unbelievably clever and going to make her so much money. So much money.

18:09Vic: like I know people would look at her and go you're just an influencer you're just dancing around in a bikini in Europe and you're just like having you know like posting about it and getting drunk like she's the one laughing in the corner totally I'm like I would that sounds like quite iconic to be doing that and making money off it like yeah anyway she has got 14 million TikTok followers and she's quietly kind of building her own like she's her own little venture capital firm. So she started to invest in companies. Now, the first one, which we may remember. Before we go into what she's invested in, let's just explain a venture capital firm.

18:49So VCs are like businesses that invest in companies that are very early stage and also have quite high growth potential. So often they'll invest quite a lot of money in these ideas that sound kind of outrageous. And the idea is that only one of them probably will pay off or become the unicorn and be super super successful and that's the business model it's super high risk quite big investment and then you know so businesses it's often tech businesses it's

19:15Vic: usually companies yes that are like they they might it might be an idea they might not have any revenue yet they're very very early stage and they um these vc firms will invest yeah in maybe like 10 20 30 different companies because you know the the success rate of startups is so low So it's like the success rate's like 90 % of them fail kind of thing. So you've got to kind of cast the net wide. Cast the net wide. And I guess the kind of the evolution is that VCs, they kind of go first into businesses. Then private equity would probably come in and they'd go second once the business is a bit more mature or got a bit more traction.

19:53Vic: Then you become a public company, for example. And that's when like a fund by the curve fund would invest. So it's like there's evolutions in different stages. And before a VC invests, you may have also done angel investing. Yes, or friends and family or like something like that. Yeah. So she is, because she's got such big reach and she must be asked to promote different brands all the time because of her reach, she has decided, you know what, I'm actually going to invest money into some of these businesses because I know when I post about it, it's going to go off. People are going to buy it. Revenue is going to go up.

20:28Vic: Profit is going to go up. So why not get a bit of skin in the game? Question, is she putting money in or is it in exchange for marketing that she gets equity? Don't know. Every deal would be structured differently. I think her posts and feed are half a million. Yeah. So if she was to promote something six, ten times in a year, that is millions and millions of marketing budget. I wouldn't be surprised if a lot of what she's doing is actually just like an exchange. I mean, who knows? Yeah. We obviously wouldn't have access to know that. But I would say she's probably clever enough to know. I would rather not take a fee up front and potentially have millions and millions of dollars if this business sells.

21:11Yeah, it's probably a combination of both.

21:13Vic: It's probably like, okay, look, we need a$2 million investment, the company. The company, we need a$2 million investment. You know, can you, you know,$1 million of that we can get in, you know, an equity exchange kind of thing for you to post or I don't know how it would be structured. but you're right it's like if you can value what it is to post something then you can value what it would be if you actually got equity in that business a lot of these good businesses probably need the money at the same time yeah so it's smart from the business point of view to go to someone that might have money but also a reach you know you kind of get double whammy uh but the first one she did was poppy and that oh my god yeah that sold to pepsico for two billion dollars so even if she had 1 % equity in that that's still massive she is genius oh my god that's so cool I had no idea she was invested in that yeah I wonder if was she one of the main people that's drinking it early yeah it must have been why it gained so much traction and smart from them like there's I was trying to find stats around uh like return on investment from uh content creator marketing and what I've found is that every dollar that's spent, and I guess it depends on which creator, right, and which person, sorry, which creator does the marketing, but it earns roughly about five to six times that in sales.

22:36Vic: If you paid Alex Earl half a million to a post, then it's getting three million in sales. Obviously massively depends on the person. Totally. But even if it was a smaller influencer and you were like, cool, we're going to pay 10 grand, you know the expectation is that that's going to bring a 30 grand of sales yeah i i so is the is the floor you should be doing three times what we invest in terms of return on their investment as a marketing like it's anything anything over one you know like if you're spending 10 grand and you're getting back 11 grand that's a no-brainer right you know it should always be um greater than greater than one in terms of your but then you might have something over here that's that's generating a higher return on investment what's kind of crazy to think is like let's just say that she a post was 500 worth 500 000 so half a million think how many poppy drinks would need to be sold yeah i mean they're like three three pounds 350 dollars or whatever you know they're not exactly expensive yeah the units that one post would have to shift and also to be able to track the data of like did that equal this would be so hard yeah she has invested in symbiotica which is a uh like vitamin squeezy supplement like pouch thing um and she said she's been using it for years and what i was gathering with all of these things that she's invested in it's like prebiotic soda for poppy it's energy drinks it's the supplement brand it's all in health and wellness space yeah And I just think she is nailing so many different growth areas here from like, well, sorry, the companies are, you've got, you're in the health and wellness, you're in the creative economy, you know, like it's just.

24:15But I think that's a really good point. If you look at someone's value or what they can add or them as a little VC model if they were doing this, there are some industries that are booming and there's some that are not. And it's really hard to make money in some industries. so the fact that she's placed herself so well in this huge trend that is people wanting to live longer be healthier even her real actives her like skincare brand is all about like health and wellness yeah she's absolutely now yeah can we talk about this new investment she's made symbiotica because it's a really interesting brand and could be another big buyout like poppy soda

24:53Vic: Yeah, so it has made$150 million in US dollars in sales last year. And it raised$25 million in January this year. And the other people that have invested is The Weeknd, Zac Efron, Jonas Brothers. So they've got a pretty good lineup. And they're in about 3 ,000 stores. So look, I wouldn't say this is kind of venture capital because it's quite well advanced, like when we were talking about before. But it is, yeah, she's joining a cap table that has got some big names on there with also some really big reach. I think what's quite interesting about this whole thing is people are, I think, investing in businesses and ownership is becoming way more mainstream and spoken about.

25:43The fact that the weekend Zac Efron and the Jonas Brothers have invested, lol the Jonas Brothers, but like the fact that they are investing in these private companies, I don't know if it's that we all of a sudden just know about it and we're starting to talk about it more or if it's just becoming more normal that people realize to make real long-term wealth investing in companies like this is the way to go. 100%.

26:06Vic: And I think it's also like, you know, you're only going to be a singer or an actor for so long. It's almost like future-proofing. Whether you're a big sports person or an artist, if you've got your time in the sun now and you have the money, try and diversify the way that you can make future wealth. And that's like anyone, right? If you've got – put money aside and invest it so that then you do have that diversification so that you are growing wealth while you're kind of earning a salary or a wage. But we can all be doing this in a smaller scale. And we should be doing this. If there's a brand that you love, can you invest in it?

26:45Vic: Can you be a promoter of it in a much smaller scale than 14 million TikTok followers? But you can be out there talking to your friends, being like, I love this drink and I love this. You're being a little salesperson as well. And you're benefiting from it. And also when you buy the product, it's actually kind of part of that's going back into your pocket if you're an investor. You can be Alex Earl. You can be Alex Earl. That's what I did with Almighty. I freaking love Almighty. Me too. Yeah. Love Almighty. And now I don't feel as guilty when I drink it like all day every day. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

27:18Vic: You know, it's like, yeah, you feel less guilty. But it's also the same when you buy shares in like public companies. It doesn't have to be private companies. You can do it in public companies. Like if you buy Apple shares and you go buy an iPhone, you know, that money's kind of coming back into your wallet in a roundabout way. Not you. Not me. Not books of the world. No, but, you know, my shares of Microsoft are now paying off. I think we should do an episode or another story another time about the creator economy because there is so much money being made in this space. And it's so interesting to see how many famous cap tables there are.

27:53I was even looking at Bill Gates' daughter's company. And you look at the people that have invested. It's like Kim Kardashian. Like, you know, it's crazy. And I do think that that loop between celebrities and business is becoming so much more blurred. Blurred? What is going on with my mouth? It's a really interesting space. I'd love to look at that more. But should we quickly talk about Alex Cooper and how much money her media business is making?

28:19Vic: So as I was researching for Alex Earle, Alex Cooper came out and announced that her media company Unwell has hit a$500 million valuation. So this means that they've had private equity investments. So when you have a private company, it's not – like when you're public, your shares are traded every single day. So the value of your business, you can tell what it is every single day. Whereas when you're a private company, you only know the value when there is a transaction or someone values it or you get an external investor or you sell a part or like something like that. So for example, with us, when we raised capital two years ago, we had a valuation that was struck.

28:57And that valuation is technically still its value because it hasn't been – we haven't raised again. No one's invested again. So even though the value can increase or decrease, it's really the only yardstick you have to value a company.

29:12Vic: And it's only when there's a transaction. And there's a transaction every single day when you're a public company, but there's not when you're private. So they've had an investment from a private equity company, Silver Lake, and then another media, entertainment, sports investment firm that's put money in. And so it's valued the business at$500 million. That's so much money. Yeah. They've bootstrapped it till then and self-funded it, and it's been profitable since day one. And they've never needed outside money to survive. and they've now taken it to kind of accelerate and fund acquisitions. Their audience is also 90 % female, 72 % between the age of 18 to 35, and they've got about 100 million followers across their platforms.

30:00Vic: And Alex Cooper said that 70 million women engage with the brand every month. That's insane. And I think this, it just shows the, I think also the value people are putting on the woman's economy, not just the creator economy. Like there is, like women are a real asset class now and Unwell has such a reach to women in particular. I also wonder if it's worth just talking about the revenue because people might be listening thinking, how on earth is a media company worth 500 million? And I know that that's a question a lot of people think when it comes to media, like how does it make money? Because everyone would just assume that it's sponsorships.

30:45But it's not. This business has diversified so enormously. Yeah. So let's just quickly give an overarching view of how this business has been valued so high. So she has her podcast, obviously, which is on SiriusXM, which pays them$30 million a year to be on that platform. Which basically means you can only access her podcast there. So they're paid for exclusivity. Yeah.

31:08Vic: And that's on top of her$125 million personal deal. She's got TV and film. So she's got her Netflix series. She's got live events, which over 150 ,000 people attended. She's got a creative ad agency, consumer products. There's so many different revenue streams. It's creating worlds around brands. And that's definitely what we're seeing in general across the board. people are monetizing a brand as an entire ecosystem it's not just yeah like what you hear or see on her social media on her podcast there's so many things that surround that brand that she makes money from yeah and I think this is like I was like I wonder how gutted you'd be seeing Alex Earl be like so incredibly successful but is she more what's more valuable right now Alex Earl as her sort of little venture capital or Alex Cooper and$500 million.

32:03I feel like Alex Cooper is, it's so hard to tell.

32:06Vic: I reckon Alex Cooper would be more diversified, but I think Alex Earl would be worth more. But she's an individual. She hasn't got like a, like Alex Cooper has created a media company. Alex Cooper, God, it's annoying their names, but Alex, but Alex Cooper probably would have much, much, much higher outgoings, right? and that's why she now has taken external capital whereas it feels to me like alex earl would be probably a tighter operation with higher oh they're just so different i think any yardstick on how much alex earl's worth like is there any way of knowing i guess because a lot of her investments are private yeah and um what would be individual what would be as a company like what like yeah i feel like there'd be so much in that but yeah i think i think probably alex earl would be marginally more successful god it's so crazy but anyway yeah go the gals go the alexes go the alexes i just want i'm desperate for a documentary on what happened someone tell me while they fell out i want to know the team yeah simply massively want to know imagine if they're actually secretly friends and totally in business together and they come out and they're like kidding we got you all but like alex cooper you did it to sophia and now you've done it like watch Shout out, girl.

33:20Vic: Oh, yeah. I want a Sophia Alex Earle podcast. Sorry. We're like really encouraging the drama. Oh, the drama. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Oh, gosh. Coming up after the break, we're talking about why it is absolutely brown and terrifying. So effing hot here. Yes. It's not looking good. It's not looking good for global warming. It's not looking good. I mean. We're going to talk about the weather. Fuck. It sounds boring, doesn't it? No. El Nino making a comeback. That was one of our most listened to podcasts for the Curve Weekly. Yeah. I told you I can make anything great. Yeah. Weather. I can make weather chat.

33:55Do not. You want to hear the weather chat, guys. Stick around. Storm is coming. But first, we've got a quick word from today's sponsor. I invest so much more now, but I still don't feel great about profiting from companies that I don't believe in. You know, weapons. I just, I personally do not want to be making money from conflict.

34:13Vic: But what about weapons companies that supply like both sides of the conflict? Pretty confusing, right? I know. it's so confusing and I feel like I'm not alone in that yeah I mean 80 % of New Zealand investors don't want weapons in their KiwiSaver yet Mindful Money reports that over 400 million dollars is still invested in weapons manufacturers which is why choosing the right provider matters like Pathfinder KiwiSaver Plan which aims to avoid profiting from conflict they've been recognised as weapons free by Mindful Money and written loads of blogs on this topic even covering their position on Gaza which a lot of people have avoided so if you want to check out our podcast show notes to learn more and thanks so much to Pathfinder for making this episode of The Curve Weekly possible.

34:53Pathfinder Asset Management Limited is the issuer of the Pathfinder KiwiSaver plan. A product disclosure statement is available at pathfinder.kiwi.

35:00Vic: I went to Hyde Park in the weekend. It's a good story. Yeah I was like you know what I'm gonna give me so a run around I'm back in London I'm gonna go to Hyde Park go for a walk. I got there and I was gobsmacked. there was no grass like i have a photo which we will post oh we'll put on the screen now if you're not watching have a quick look it honestly looks like i can't even explain it's like barren like is there grass it's just brown or is it like it just looks like dirt wow that's really sad and it was actually one thing i noticed when i got back to london from new zealand being away for a month was how ungreen there's just no greenery it's all brown so every We're in a drought over here and you're not allowed to use hoses.

35:46There's hose bands. Everyone's gardens, I mean, not that that's the issue, but yeah, you look everywhere and the grass is completely dead. It's sad because that's also one of the things that makes summer so beautiful is when all of the trees are flourishing and the grass is so bright and green and it just is so, it's desert-y. It's scary. It's outrageously fucking hot as well. This heat wave, it's no longer heat wave. It's just permanently hot. Yeah. I just get like knee sweats like under behind my knee I'm it's really weird like it's boiling here today it is 36 degrees and people might be like oh that's not actually that bad but

36:21Vic: in London if you know when it's like oh it's 12 degrees but it feels like eight this is 36 but it feels like 46 it's so freaking hot so anyway for the reason we're talking about this is actually surprisingly not to complain about it being hot there is something going on that we need to discuss that's important. There's two things. So firstly, there's the overarching global warming, which we're going to park for a second. But something we mentioned a few months ago was this El Nino. And it's a weather pattern. It's on track to be the strongest El Nino period since the 1950s. And it's already hitting really crop-sensitive commodities.

37:04Vic: So your wheat, your coffee, everything that's grown, essentially. And what I mean by a strong El Nino is that it's scientists' way of classifying how intense this warm episode is that we're feeling right now. And it's based on how much it is more warmer than normal. But it means huge droughts in some regions and heavy rains in others and extremities. So you couple that with what the underlying trend is of global warming. and we've just like imagine having a coffee plantation right now and being like oh my goodness I used to have this really great consistent weather pattern and it was like really great for my crops and I grew my crops like because of this weather pattern and this is why this region does so well for whatever it is coffee and now you wake up and you've got drought You've got thunderstorms.

38:04Vic: You've got tornadoes. You've got, honestly, just trying to run a business like that and have consistent supply for the rest of the world. It would be so stressful. Totally. And also, there's certain regions that are coffee-producing regions, for example, because the elements are so perfect. It's like wine countries. Think about the place in the south of France. All the places. Sheep in New Zealand. Oh, shit, guys. The lamb. Everything's going to have to be relocated. but it's actually quite a big deal. Yes, yeah. And it's exactly the same with manufacturing. If the labour and the expertise is cheaper in one region and it's conducive to making that product the best and the cheapest and the quickest, let's do it there.

38:47It's the same. It's such a good example. But for so long, the weather has been, although it's not consistent in that way, it kind of is because you can guess all of these things about how hot it will get in peak summer, how cold it will get in winter, and you plan your entire business in the way that you produce whatever the crop is around that. If all of those environmental factors change, the business either could just totally not work. Maybe what you produce isn't a high enough quality. It's a really good way of explaining it. It's the same with producing anything. You pick it based on cost, on output, all those things.

39:27Vic: And as soon as something in that mix changes, like tariffs, for example, now make it more expensive to do it there. Let's move it here. So same with coffee, for example. Okay, now this isn't actually the best environment. We need to move it. But like that's livelihoods. That's cost. That means, you know, there might be not better places to move it. And therefore you kind of have to put up with the volatility of the weather. Imagine if coffee stops getting produced because there's actually just nowhere for it to be made. Well, the price of the Arabica bean that goes into coffee, as one type of coffee, is up 30 % since June.

40:03Vic: And cocoa, which is in chocolate, is up 60%. So, you know, and also sugar, palm oil, like there's so many commodities that are going to be impacted by this. And yes, we're talking about El Nino, which is kind of like a short-term impact. But there is a long-term underlying impact as well. So we're kind of getting a double whammy. You know, it's like a double wave when you're riding a wave and then you get hit by another wave. You know, and you're woo. It's almost like when there's a rip and two waves get joined together. No, no, when you're on one, you know, and then you go down onto the next one.

40:37Vic: Yeah, on the boogie board. Yeah, yeah, yeah. There's a lot of velocity, a lot of backward force getting you onto the wave fast. We're riding the global warming one. Oh, no. And then we hit the onino one. That's actually such a good. I'd love to make a video out of that. It's like with little labels. It was like, this is the global warming wave. Oh, and here's the old Nina wave. It's so funny. Shit. But there are two things that I don't really want to get more expensive. My flat white and my chocolate. And in New Zealand and Australia, we have some of the highest spend per person on coffee in the world.

41:09So. It's because it's the best. I know. Yeah. The coffee here is absolute bollocks. Totally. I like go and hunt out Australia and New Zealand coffee brands to go and.

41:19Vic: It's terrible. so before when we parked the global warming piece I think we should bring it out again and just quickly touch on what this is going to be doing for the economy and why it's something worth talking about because I feel like we've parked the global warming train for a while and people and I don't know why this is happening but there's a real global trend of people almost putting it in a box and not thinking about it and look it was things like Trump making it not a priority in terms of you know he wound back Like he like got the US wasn't part of the whole near zero movement to get to near zero carbon like he just he was like it's Trump's fault.

41:56Vic: Yeah. But also I'm never getting into America. I can just I don't know. But personally, I feel a really strong sense right now of like, holy shit, something needs to change. And I don't like just like even like the last the last kind of six months, I think I've been like this is no longer something that's like we can't do and take action of ourselves and I don't know maybe it is because I'm literally sweltering and I feel like the globe is warming no I think that's what it is but like it's almost too late now do you know what I mean like it's not sorry it's not too late but it's like that's why people were screaming from the rooftops years ago and now we're in this position where we people are actually living and breathing and seeing the not only the discomfort but like the the disruption the frustration people dying because of extreme weather you know cold and hot so I don't know it's I think it's I don't think you're alone in this I spoke to someone at a drinks the other week and they said the same thing they were like I know it's so nice and it's been hot but I'm so scared yeah it's almost like it's not until it slaps you in the face that you're like oh yeah okay this is an actual problem and maybe had a really good point yeah 10 years ago and no one listened to yeah and maybe it is now there's a younger generation that is more educated and they can feel they're going to feel it and the effects of it you know whereas before it was an older generation they're not going to be on this planet much longer you know it's like it's not our problem kind of thing but I think like what we can do is you know backing the right businesses the businesses that are actually focused on making this a priority uh we that's in terms of your investment it's also backing the right leaders so politically like you know when we when we go through elections or when your country goes through an election you know are you voting for leaders that are making this a priority because it does trickle down because if you've got a government that makes it a priority then they enforce the companies to make it a priority which well what's happening right now in america is such a good example the last like three years two years have been really bad in terms of unwinding all the work that's been done and to say that a lot of that is to Trump is accurate so realizing that I think and and knowing how much a vote can impact the future of the world the economy people's quality of life everything like trying your best to be a conscious consumer but also where is your KiwiSaver where is your pension where is your ISA like all of that can really really help in terms of moving the needle as well one of our sponsors for the Curve Weekly our sponsor for this episode is Pathfinder and their entire ethos is about investing ethically and making sure that your money is going to companies that aren't having a negative impact on the planet, on people, on animals.

44:52So if you want to learn more about where your KiwiSaver is and look at that, then we'll put a link to Pathfinder in the podcast show notes. Yeah, that's just for New Zealanders. I do feel a little bit like putting the onus on the consumer is hard when people are struggling so much financially. Like the cost of living is beyond. And so just say, you know, make decisions and to be able to use your money in a way that's in line with your values. It's such a privilege. I find it really hard and I'm not even in a dire situation.

45:21Vic: And that's why the conversation has died for the last few years because we've had inflation at, you know, sometimes 7%, 8%, 10%. It's actually quite tone deaf to be like, hey, pay for the more expensive eco-friendly packaging when we're in a cost of living crisis. because people, and I noticed it even myself, I'm like, gosh, I know I should be buying this, which is slightly more expensive, but it's better for the planet. But I can't afford it right now. I need to purchase it. You know, like, and you feel guilty. Yeah, you're right. It comes to investing. It comes to like where your retirement money is.

45:52There are other ways that you can care for the planet or at least make a decision that makes you feel better.

45:57Vic: And also voting for leaders and people. I think that's the biggest thing. Because they're the ones that will then channel the money into companies that are making those products to make them cheaper so that we can purchase them. Yeah, yeah, it's investing. It's investing, it's money. Money is power and money makes change. Yeah. It's getting really scary. Yes. We've had a community question come through that we're going to play right now. Thank you so much to everyone that is sending voice notes through to the Herve Hotline. It's so fun. We've moved it a little bit. Feel free to bring... We swapped seats.

46:26Yeah, yeah, yeah. I kind of liked it. Hi, I'm super excited about this new fund that you guys have started. I have been really enjoying the podcast and it's really helping me with my financial literacy and I've actually started having some very, I guess, grown-up conversations with my partner about our finances after listening to Sophie's podcast the other day. My question is what are the key things that we actually really need to be aligned on for success going forward. And then my other question that I have, unrelated to that, is I don't get paid very much, so I do my best to regularly invest little bits into my Sharesies account, and that's been going really well, and I want to know to get the minimum$500 to invest with you guys, would it be smart for me to just save my money or to just pull the 500 out of my existing shares and invest with your fund?

47:37Oh, so many questions. Oh,

47:44great question. So, yeah, so fun hearing people's voices. I love it. Okay, there's quite a bit to unpack there. Yes. Do you want to start with the investing question? Yeah, we can't tell you what to do, but the Curve Fund is a great place for lots of money. We think that's really right.

48:01Vic: No, look, we will hopefully be on Shares Ease very soon as well. So you could either keep it there and invest through Shares Ease or you take money out and invest directly. Yes, we have a$500 minimum, which is one of the lowest in the industry, but we still need$500. And that's New Zealand dollars, by the way. New Zealand dollars. Yeah, just leave it in Shares Ease for now and you'll be able to find the Curve Fund on there very shortly. And then you don't have to put$500 in because you're on sharesies, their rules apply. And so you can put their minimum, which I think is like kind of like a dollar or something.

48:36Vic: But yeah, you can also do a little bit in the kit fund and you can do a little bit in your other companies and sharesies. So yeah, you'll be able to buy us just like a company or like a stock on sharesies. And the fees are exactly the same. Yeah, sorry. You don't pay any. It's not cheaper to do it on sharesies or with us. It's exactly the same. On the relationship piece, so we've talked a lot about this recently. There was an episode that I did with Emma Louise Boynton, and we spoke about The Stranger's Book, you know, about burdens. Anyway, and then we did do a list of questions to ask your partner.

49:13I think that this is something we should do in more detail, like almost get like a start to finish. How do you get on the same financial page as someone? What are the questions to ask?

49:21Vic: You and your boyfriend, here we go. But that's what I mean. I need this too. Like I feel like there's so many things to think about. Because whether you're wanting to talk about a prenup, whether you actually just want to get aligned on spending, there is a lot that I think you need to cover with your partner. And I'm so guilty of not having done all of it. Yes. I agree. And it's not this, I don't think you want to sit down and be like, we've got to have six hours of talking about money. But you could just like slowly chip away at them. Yeah. Ugh, yeah. Sorry if that's not super helpful. But I will put that on my list of important things to do.

49:53because I think there's a lot of people that would find that really helpful. So I've got a holiday coming up. There is something relevant here, I promise. I have to book a rental car. And I'm already feeling a little bit stressed about the financial hangover post-holiday. And it made me think this is a really good time to let you know we've just put out our most recent IOU episode with Hannah Kumakis, actually who's now Hannah Hart. And that was one of the things we spoke about. But how can you end what is meant to be a very relaxing fun time without coming back and being absolutely terrified or sick with anxiety about how much you spent on holiday?

50:29So if you would like to listen to that episode, it came out on Friday. We'll link it in the podcast show notes. It's called The Holiday Hangover That No One Talks About. The split wise feeling.

50:39Vic: You're like, has everyone put theirs in? I'm like, I don't want to look. I don't want to look. No one put any more in. I can't afford the split wise. Yeah. No, it's not good. Okay. Have a great week, everyone. We'll see you on Wednesday. Do you say? Stay safe out there. Don't do anything I wouldn't. Use an umbrella if you're in the heat. It's actually really a way to stay not fainty. Umbrella for sun I never thought would be me. Yeah, sunscreen. But yes, thanks so much for listening. See ya. See ya. Thank you so much for listening to The Curve Weekly. Make sure you hit subscribe or follow wherever you're listening so you're always up to date with the latest finance and investing news.

51:12And feel free to leave a comment to let us know what you thought about this episode because we would love your feedback. we've got new Curve Weekly episodes for you to listen to every Monday but until then listen to Erasing the Curve these are our in-depth podcast episodes where we chat about

51:25Vic: all things money we're also around all week on socials if you're hungry for more Curve content and all the links are in this podcast show notes we hope you have a great week and we'll catch you for the next episode of the Curve Weekly on Monday

51:43okay quickly the curve was created to empower and educate you about investing but we are not

51:47Vic: financial advisors our platform exists for educational purposes only and it doesn't provide personalized investing advice for your individual needs and should not be relied upon to make an investment or financial decision and always remember to do your own research before making any investment or financial decision. We're here for any knowledge and support you need, but the final call is always yours. And thanks for being here. You got this. Yeah, we know you got this.