How AI is Changing the Fan Experience, with Jump’s Jordy Leiser

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0:42Welcome back to The Deal. I'm Jason Kelly alongside my partner, Alex Rodriguez. So Alex, we're both in New York, but because it's UN General Assembly Week, like we had dinner together last night, but getting together today, you can't move in this city. And so we're in different places. But, you know, how are you doing? Good, good, good. It's been a long time. It's been about 12 hours. Yeah, exactly. Exactly. So back together. And what a sports landscape we're experiencing right now. Obviously, the NFL has kicked off. They're doing, you know, big numbers as they always do. Let's talk a little hoop because the WNBA playoffs are set to kick off very soon.

1:20Coming off a huge week, Olivia Miles, the rookie who just won't quit. But tell us about what's going on with the Lynx. Well, I mean, in full transparency, we had communicated to our head coach, Cheryl Reeve, Hall of Fame coach, that is, that this year was going to be a gap year. Because we had, of course, Nafisha Khali, who started the year injured. And, you know, I was in New York just a few months ago drafting Olivia Miles. And, I mean, she's the gift that keeps on giving. Reminds me of Magic Johnson when he entered the league from Michigan State and landed in L.A. I mean, turned the whole city on fire.

1:57That's exactly what she's doing in Minneapolis. And in recent game, she just broke Kaitlin Clark's scoring record for a rookie, which is, you know, phenomenal. Yeah, unbelievable. And it really is one of the most compelling storylines of the season, certainly on the court. And all of a sudden, the Lynx, which is, you know, it ain't bragging if it's true, the most decorated team when it comes to championships, is all of a sudden in contention for another one, having a great season. So, you know, women's basketball obviously getting a boost as well in this country from winning FIBA, the world championship there.

2:35And so a lot of good tailwinds going into that. Speaking of playoffs, baseball. You predicted that the Yankees, you know, if the stars aligned in a very, very, very specific way, they might make a run. How are you feeling heading into playoff baseball? Well, obviously, the Yankees have a conundrum with Aaron Judge getting hurt. He missed 99 games. He comes for a handful of games back when he returns. And he re-injures, but not this time the ribcage. This time it's the upper calf, which, you know, has led others in the sport like Tatum and Halliburton into, you know, Achilles. So that's always a big, big concern, especially this late in the year and knowing that he's going to be 35 years old next spring training.

3:24Jason, this is the one year and I've watched every pitch of the World Series since 1985. This is the one year where it's wide open. Like if you were doing an NCAA bracket for baseball, it's an impossible one to win because the Dodgers obviously have the challenge of three in a row, which has been only done a couple of times. and the Yankees, I thought it was a very pivotal trade deadline for them because if you're in the American League, it's the worst it's ever been in you and I's lifetime. And you got an open invitation to the World Series. And the fact that they didn't do anything, I think, could hurt them.

3:59But it's going to be fun. And all the big markets are there, you know, from L.A., San Diego, Cubs, Boston, your Braves. Really, really exciting playoffs. I cannot wait to get started next week. And just one thing I want to put a button on it. One thing to really pay attention to because we can't ignore the elephant in the room is the CBA. Yeah. Which is the collective bargaining agreement between the players and the owners is up December 1st. There's a pretty good chance there's going to be a work stoppage. I'm not sure about how many games, but definitely be a work stoppage of some sort. Some people say you'll miss a month as much as two months.

4:36No more than that. So that's the worst case scenario. But in October, we may have one of the most consequential World Series we've ever seen because you may have a team in the Dodgers that makes about a billion one in revenue against the Tampa Berets who make, you know, less than a couple hundred million dollars. So there might be a delta of about a billion dollars. And isn't that the conversation we're talking about in the CBA for the next, call it three or four months? So something to watch. Yeah, for sure, something to watch. And obviously there's a lot going on around baseball and specifically the Dodgers and its ownership group.

5:14We're keeping a close eye on our colleagues at Bloomberg are keeping a close eye on those investigations as they relate to Mark Walter. Mark Walter obviously, you know, sold his stake in the Los Angeles Lakers just a few months ago. So a lot, lot, lot of storylines to keep track of. And I'm going to join you on L.A., not because I'm joining the Fox baseball broadcast, although, you know, I feel like I could contribute. You know, I mean, who knows? Who knows? You know, I've got the Braves are in. If the Braves are in, you should come on. So many thoughts, so many thoughts. But we are going to be together for Bloomberg Screen Time Conference, hosted by Lucas Shaw, our colleague out there.

5:54It's a huge thing every year. I mean, talk about the power brokers of L.A. They will all be there. We're going to do an interview on stage as part of that on October 1st with Nick Khan, the CEO of WWE. That's going to be amazing. He is, as you well know, an absolute character. WWE is on fire. Looking forward to seeing you out there. It'll be fun. It should be a lot of fun. And Nick Khan is a powerhouse. Yeah, totally. He's going to entertain us in the crowd to a great extent. That's for sure. All right. Coming up on this week's show, Jordan Leeser, a guy you know well, he's the co-founder and CEO of Jump.

6:32This is a next-gen analytics company that's doing a lot of super interesting stuff. So we get into the modern fan, technology, how it is really changing the entire experience in arenas and beyond. So coming up, Jordan Leeser.

7:02Welcome back to The Deal. I'm Jason Kelly alongside my partner, Alex Rodriguez, and really excited to have with us Jordy Leeser. He is the co-founder and CEO at Jump. So we should say at the Jump that this is a company you are obviously intimately involved in. Alex, you're a co-founder along with Mark Lurie and Jordy of this company. So let's start there. Disclaimer is abounding. How did this all come about, Jordi? Like, how does this meet cute happen among you and Mark Lurie and this guy sitting here next to me? Yeah, it was great. And thanks for having me. Great to be here and spend time with you guys.

7:39Obviously, Alex, great to see you, man. The story, as far as I recall, I mean, I love to hear Alex's tale of this as well. I've known Mark for almost 15 years. He's kind of been a big brother and mentor of mine for my entire professional career. and he and I were just jamming, talking about ideas as we always do. And one of the things he asked me is, hey, you know, like how much do you know about the sports world, the sports business, et cetera? I knew he was in the process at one point of trying to buy the Mets with Alex and he was just getting into it. And he said that he and Alex had been spending time thinking about, man, this technology is just, it's so antiquated.

8:10It's so old. It doesn't make a lot of sense. And if we do end up buying a team, we want to do things our way. We want to build the technology. And he said that he wrote up a few patents. And I said, oh, just, you know, like over dinner, he was like writing up a few patents. And he said, yeah, that's it. I'll send them to you. And I said, OK, I don't know how to read a patent or anything, but he sent them to me. And I was just reading about all the innovation that could be possible that he was dreaming up. And then I just kind of went to bed thinking about, man, this is not about ticketing or about the fan experience at the game.

8:40This is about the ecosystem before the event, during the event, after the event, the entire fan experience. And so I just sent him a note back kind of explaining my thoughts. And he just replied, said, hey, you got to meet Alex. Said, OK, and this is deep COVID times. And so I remember we hopped on the Zoom the next day, maybe, or the next couple of days. And it was a pleasure to meet Alex. And then like very quickly, 30 seconds in, the three of us were just, well, what if you could do this? And what if you could do that? And it was all just very, very pie in the sky at that point. You were part of the Alex Rodriguez Zoom carousel.

9:11You were like a Zoom fiend back in those days. So let's talk about sort of the broader landscape, Alex. What were you seeing as a sports owner at that point? Actually, at that point, you didn't even have a team. You were just thinking about it, right? What was that, Jordy? Is that correct? Yeah, it was sort of in the works. There were conversations with Glenn at that point, but nothing was solid. Yeah, so we were having conversations with the Timberwolves and the Lynx, But we knew there was an opportunity as we kind of dove really deep into the Mets deal. Right. Which I always say we were the second winners to Steve Cohen.

9:46Thank you, Stephen. And that created an opportunity here. But what we saw was this incredible, you know, fanfare around sports. But technology was probably a decade or two behind. So we just saw there's a tremendous amount of upside. Mark, obviously, being a tech guy, e-commerce guy, he was all excited about it. Jordy, who understands tech as well as anybody. and it all came together. And of course, I played the sport for a very long time and we thought it was an amazing opportunity. When the Timberwolves deal came about and the Lynx, we said, why don't we just dive in? Yeah, the original idea was to, Mark and Alex, I think we're at a game.

10:20The story was you guys saw some seats up close here in the front row, the second row. And you said, why can't I just pull up my phone, figure out what seats those are, hit the button and go buy into those seats at some dynamic price throughout the game. And so jump up to the second row. And that was sort of the impetus of like, man, this should all be dynamic. You should be able to do this during the game. And that was sort of the very first nugget. Take you even a step back. You know, Mark and I were kids that we came up from very modest beginnings and our parents didn't have a lot of money to sit behind home plate, for example.

10:50And we were the kids that were always in the upper deck. And we jammed out on these ideas. Like it was so frustrating as a 10, 11-year-old boy to look down and have all these empty seats behind home plate. Wouldn't it be great to create an instrument that you press a button and you can buy fans almost like Uber or Airbnb and bring that type of technology into buildings where you can serve the fans better and then the teams can have a direct relationship with the consumer, with the fans. And that was how we started Jump. Yeah. So I want to talk about fans in a few minutes, but but I want to stay with this idea of the antiquated sort of existing technology base or strategy or lack thereof.

11:32Jordy, like, why is that? Like, I mean, these are super dynamic, you know, and often run by very dynamic people, sports teams and leagues. Like, what's the disconnect? This goes back into the history and the legacy of how putting on an event actually started. And so 30, 40 years ago, the venues that we all know today were really kind of community assets, public assets. It was a stadium. It was an arena that served a sports team as a tenant. But it was also the circus and the concerts and the shows. And the team owner was typically just a tenant. They didn't own the building usually. They didn't own the real estate.

12:11And at that time, they just needed effectively a ticketing company to sell the tickets as an agency on behalf of whoever was playing in that venue. And so if you just think about the history of this, there was Ticketmaster was, you know, in the 70s and 80s became the dominant ticketing agency. And what an agency means is obviously they do something on behalf of somebody else. And so the sports teams, the circus, the concerts, they would engage a ticketing agency to then help them sell tickets. And that then became what we all know now and what has happened in the regulatory environment recently.

12:46That ultimately became what was then just ruled as a monopoly recently by the Department of Justice. That structure for many, many years, in fact, multiple decades, actually prevented the innovation that you would have seen everywhere else in the economy. And so what has happened is it wasn't due to lack of ideas or lack of effort or lack of ingenuity or desire by the owners. It was just a structural issue that, you know, no one was ever able to get funded and go big and then deliver the kind of experience that I think we're all accustomed to in every other industry. And so, Alex, as you and Mark are talking about the idea or sort of this idea, but sort of technology in general, like what's the vibe you're getting from fellow owners, not just in your league, but, you know, you guys have a wide network and obviously your experience in baseball.

13:33Like, what were they saying? Was there reluctance to engage new technology? Was it a reluctance to spend? Like, what was happening? It's an interesting question because, you know, Jordy, Mark, Lori and I were such great partners because we come at it from a little bit different angles. And to Jordy's point, if you go back 40 years and you look at the profile of owners of these 92 teams, you know, professional sports teams in America. The big four. The big four. They were basically, you know, your rich car dealership guy, your top real estate guy. It was run like a very much of family business and a little bit of a hobby.

14:06And most of these teams actually lost money. And it was a social duty that they were doing for the community. As you look in today, you have guys like Mark Stad from Dragoneer, who's been a partner of ours for a couple of years. You have, you know, Thrive with Josh Kushner. You have the greatest technology minds, plus the capital, plus the talent. that now they're saying there's an opportunity to basically take Silicon Valley and integrate them into these sports teams in the Big Four. And that's what we're seeing today. Yeah. It's interesting, too, because from where I sit, you know, you have these leagues that are, you know, kind of more than loose, sort of confederations of small companies, sort of, you know, maybe not so small companies.

14:51Some decisions get made on the team level or the franchise level. Some deals get made at the league level. If you think about, you know, the NCAA, it's schools and conferences. So how do you start to unpack how to get a deal done? Like, how do you go and take this to market? Well, Alex nailed it. The sea change in ownership, we're in the middle of it right now. I think we're transitioning from the old kind of real estate, industrial kind of tycoons who own these teams to, I think my prediction is that there's going to be, I mean, look at Vinod Khosla. I just bought the Seahawks right recently.

15:28And he's a legendary venture capitalist. I think if you look at the next five years, the next 10 years, all the owners that are going to come in and do a transaction and lead owners are going to be from the technology industry. And so the audience that we're speaking to at Jump, and I think Jump just represents, I would say, modern cutting edge, you know, for us, especially AI enabled, AI applied AI technology. The audience is very welcoming of this idea of, you know what, the way we've been doing it for the last 30 years, two years from now, three years from now, even six months from now, it shouldn't look like the last 30 years.

16:01And in the absence of someone like us coming along, you know, an object in motion will remain in motion in terms of the status quo. And so what we do is through great partners and great investors, folks like Alex and Mark Lurie and, of course, our other investors, their own investors, their LPs, they're all team owners themselves. And that's because the people who know our industry the best understand the pain the most. Those are the people who are behind us. And this is just almost in a self-serving way. They want to see innovation. they want to see the latest and greatest technologies come to, for many of them, hopefully their favorite business that they're a part of.

16:37Yeah. And so that's what we're trying to do.

17:06We'll be right back. or anywhere you listen. Five reasons, one simple way to stay on top of the news. Bloomberg News Now.

17:19All right. Well, not to diminish myself in front of you two, you know, legendary guys, but, you know, serial entrepreneur. Do not put me on anywhere near the plane of Alex. All right. But you're a Hall of Famer when it comes to business. Alex played some baseball for a little bit. But I come at this from a fan's perspective. It's like I love going to sports. You know, I love taking my kids to sporting events. It's super expensive, especially if you live in the New York area like I do. What does this look like to me? You know, how am I experiencing this? I know that this is, you know, really a B2B type company, business to business.

17:56But, like, how does it impact me as a fan? Sure. I mean, it is a B2B to C company. So the best comp that I like to think about in terms of the business world is Shopify. So Shopify is a technology company, software and AI that enables merchants to then deliver great experiences to end consumers in e-commerce. And so what does it look like for Jumps clients and to their fans? Well, of course, the Minnesota Timberwolves, the Minnesota Lynx are great examples today. You can go experience that for yourself. And basically what it is, you have a direct relationship with the club. You log in with your account with the Timberwolves.

18:34You download the app and get into the ticketing environment, get into the content, get into the promotions, get into the stories. Everything about that experience for the fan is tailored for you. Think of it as like my Timberwolves experience, Jordi's Timberwolves experience. Almost like when you go on Twitter or LinkedIn, that should feel like it's your feed. It's the things you care about. The legacy way that this works is that there's basically a ticketing silo. There might be a website silo. There might be a marketing landing page silo. There might be call this number for a group sales. All of that melts away.

19:11And you just have one system where the fan logs in with the club that they love and then do business with the club. By the way, add a hat to the shopping cart while you're buying your tickets or add a jersey. We're actually running that and doing that right now with the links as well. So it's just you don't have to bounce out to other sites. You don't have to have this disjointed experience in commerce. It's just a one true seamless direct-to-fan experience. And by the way, all of that unlocks what we didn't realize, Alex and I and Mark, Lori, when we were starting this business, the AI revolution that's now here.

19:43And so in order to tap all of the value of what AI is bringing us today, it all is fueled by one thing, which is data. And so the only way to have the data set that you need in order to deliver those great experiences is you have to go direct to the fan. And that's the huge opportunity. Yeah, Jordy. So one of the things about the big four here in the U.S. that's very challenging and also an opportunity, and especially with some of the legacy older ownerships that may not be as forward thinking as some of the owners that are coming in today, the barrier of entry is pretty challenging. What were some of the most difficult pain points for you to enter the space?

20:23Yeah, the biggest one by far is there's this huge chicken and egg problem in this industry. And Alex, you probably remember all these conversations you and I had about the Timberwolves and about the timing of the launch with Jump and the Timberwolves and the Lynx. And all of that was so important because in this industry, everyone wants to see the lighthouse customer. And in fact, just talking to the NBA today, I was talking to them about how did it go with the Timberwolves? Everyone wants to know, how does it go with that marquee customer? And how do you get a marquee customer without a case study of a marquee customer?

20:59So you have this huge circular problem where it's so hard to start this business, which is why I'm so grateful to have Mark and Alex as my partners in this business so that we can show now every club in the NBA and every club in the NHL and NFL and MLS and everywhere around the world that you can see that this actually delivers the impact that we've promised at NBA scale. And so that by far, as everyone said, it's, hey, it's too early. You know, I need to see it first with the Timberwolves and now we're running. All right. So you mentioned AI, which I would love to, as Alex would say, double click on that.

21:32And in the context of the sort of AI versus sports versus AI as part of sports, kind of wrestling match that we seem to be going through. How do you think about how sports and AI can coexist in a way that doesn't throw the proverbial baby out with the bathwater and lose the element that we all love about sports while using it for good? My favorite topic, as our shared friend Alexis Ohenian calls it, is sports is the ultimate anti-AI bet. And so at the same time that he's investing in the sports category itself, teams, clubs, leagues, et cetera, he's also investing heavily in the technology architecture to fuel those clubs and leagues and teams.

22:26And so the way that AI is going to participate in what is probably the most durable category in the history of the world, which is live sports and entertainment. I think that's pretty well understood, is unlocking the AI opportunity for the sports team itself as an organization. And we're doing this aggressively with the Timberwolves and the Lynx, but we're doing it with all of our other clients as well, where, I mean, in the last six months, it's just been an unbelievable influx of interest in what can AI do to help my fill-in-the-blank club? How do I become AI native? How do I transform the sports team operations, the business side and on the athlete and the player performance side using AI.

23:10And I think this reminds me of the early 2000s, mid 2000s, when actually when Mark was starting diapers.com and his career in e-commerce, people in retail and in business, they were talking about digital transformation. You remember this? They would bring in Accenture and they'd bring in McKinsey and they're like, we need to effort a digital transformation. And some CEOs and leaders were like, well, it's like an IT project and we'll set up a website or whatever. And then people like Mark, who was like, this changes everything. You know, Jeff Bezos, this changes everything. And so the people who see that AI is that, I mean, it's orders and orders of magnitude of the digital transformation.