Kerri Walsh Jennings on Growing the Game of Volleyball

0:00Join Bloomberg for the Canadian Finance Conference, proudly sponsored by National Bank of Canada Capital Markets on September 29th in New York. Hear from influential corporate and government leaders as they discuss the strategies shaping Canada's economic future. Connect with senior decision makers, gain actionable insights and be part of the conversations driving business forward. Register at BloombergLive.com slash Canadian Finance. That's BloombergLive.com slash Canadian Finance.

0:32Bloomberg Audio Studios, podcasts, radio, news.

0:42Welcome back to The Deal. I'm Jason Kelly. And coming up on this episode, Carrie Walsh Jennings. Alex and I got a chance to sit down with the iconic beach volleyball player that we all cheered on for many years as she won a lot of championships, three gold medals at the Olympics and three world championship gold medals. And now she's on to a different phase. She's the founding owner and co-general manager of a new franchise in major league volleyball out there in Northern California where she grew up and went to school at Stanford University. This is a league and really a sport that is on the rise in a very big way.

1:20It's one of the most popular global sports, especially for women. And there are big ambitions for this pro league in the United States. They're leaning into a lot of popularity at the college level and hoping that translates into big business. A fascinating conversation with Kerry Walsh Jennings coming up.

1:49Welcome back to The Deal. I'm Jason Kelly alongside Alex Rodriguez. guys so excited to have with us carrie walsh jennings she officially is the founding owner and co-general manager of major league volleyball's norcal team but really she's an icon alex i mean this is someone who we have seen play the game of volleyball at the absolute highest level won a couple gold medals you know she's just like no big deal just you know bringing home the gold for the usa uh carrie really good to have you with us oh thank you for having me you know i still i I still want more even though I retired. I want more gold medals.

2:23That's possible. I think that's where this franchise comes in. I can get a lot of gold there. Well, exactly. Well, and it's interesting because we're going to get into this idea. And Alex and I talk about this a lot. You know, this notion of how you do sort of scratch that itch when you have this entire life and career ahead of you. So let's start there. Like, how do you go from being at the literal top of your game to deciding to getting into the business of your sport? How does that happen? It wasn't a decision. It was something that happened naturally. You know, I think after you've been in your sport, your career for 20 years, I think you opportunities come up and a little rumbling start to happen from the inside.

3:06You're like, oh, I'm curious about that. I'm curious about that. And for me, near the end of my career, I really had it in me where I just I want to be aligned with and involved with people who are bringing my sport to the next level. And our sport is so successful in so many ways. And I would say the only part we're lacking, which, you know, we're solving real time today and these days is just on the pro side of the game, whether that's beach or indoor. And so for me, a natural progression once I retired was to go and focus on the pro side of the sport, you know. And thankfully, I'm a big relationships person.

3:40And as you know, when you're building great things and when you're building teams and looking to create something new or build upon something that's kicking butt, the people you know and the relationships you have are the ones that help you make the magic happen. And so for me, having been in the sport for over 30 years, I know a lot of people. No door has ever been shut to me. And now I just need the courage to keep knocking on doors and say, hey, what do you think about this? I want to learn from you and you want to come along for the ride. Walk us through the state of pro volleyball at this point, because, you know, we see the sport.

4:10We know who you are because you literally brought gold home numerous times and other medals to the United States. We also, you know, as people who follow the business of sports, see there's this interest in the pro game. But like, give us the landscape. Describe to us like what this looks like at this moment. Well, the pro landscape is emerging. Emerging, I call us an emerging pro league, pro sports, you know, enterprise. Right now, there's two pro opportunities here in America. One is Major League Volleyball, which I am aligned with. And the other one is League One Volleyball. And so I think the beautiful thing about that is that there's two pro leagues.

4:48We have a ton of talent from NCAA and globally who want to play here in America. And now we have two pro leagues. I think the hard thing about that is that the brands, the media partners, the fans are like, wait, we're confused. Who do we align with? How do we build and grow? You know, we don't want to choose a winner too early because we don't know who's going to win in this battle. So that's the pro landscape. But if you kind of look at the volleyball ecosystem as a whole, volleyball is kicking ass. On the youth side, not recreationally, which I want to bring rec volleyball into the mainstream because it deserves to be there.

5:21But club volleyball is ginormous, boys and girls. NCAA volleyball, as you guys know, is a phenomenon these days. Huge. Wild. And so if you look at those markers, we have an endless feeder system of excellent talent and we have media attention. We have brands already looking at our sport, but they're just focused right now, largely at the NCAA level and the youth level. And so we need to take all that fandom, all that vested interest, and we need to build our own rituals, our own excellence at the pro level. So people will say, what's going on Friday night? I'm going to an MLV game. You know, we just don't have that quite yet.

6:00Kerry, when you think about you said the word emerging, I want to kind of double click on that, because for an emerging league to have 800 million people playing volleyball around the world is a ginormous number. Just to give us some context, you know, I was the Michael Milken conference recently, and I learned that you have soccer is number one with over four billion fans. Cricket is number two with three something. NBA is third with two billion. And then MLB Baseball's at$500 million. So volleyball's in a good place. I would assume that if you have two NFLs, two MLBs, and two NBAs, it'll be very challenging.

6:35So how do you solve for that? And is there a world where you guys can funnel into one league and try to make it rain collectively? Yeah, I mean, for sure. You know, I think right now, since there are two leagues and we are distinct, we're individual, we have different, I think, assets and headwinds for sure to work through. Drew, my job at MLV and certainly within my franchise is to build the best product in the market and let capitalism, let the fair market decide which is the better product. We have plenty of talent. You know, all the things we need to run the league successfully at a very high level are there.

7:08I think the marketplace is where there's not room for two. However, we're going to compete. Like competition brings out the best in me. You know, God bless the other side. I don't hate them. They're there to help me focus. They're bringing opportunity. And so in my opinion, eventually, you know, it'll be like the ABA, NBA. We're going to figure out a merger because I believe that will be best for the sport. But the time is not right now. And so right now we focus on ourselves and we focus on the athletes that we have in our league who are incredible. And we really do want to take all that beautiful fandom, all that market space and valuation from NCAA and bring that into our league.

7:44Because, I mean, it took NCAA D1 volleyball 30 years to get to where they are now. Right. You know, so it's going to take us some time to establish ourselves as a pro league. But to your point, Alex, we have this groundswell. We have 800 million people globally who play. We're a top five sport in the world. You know, so if we can convert 1 % of them, we'll be doing good. But it just it doesn't happen overnight, unfortunately, especially in America. You know, there's so much noise. There's so much going on. There's so many choices. That's one of the best things about America. But for an emerging sports league, it could be frustrating because we want that now.

8:18But we have to build. We're building for lasting, enduring excellence, not just short term. We're the flashiest thing right now. We are building a foundation for generations. And it's interesting to carry to think about. And I know Alex has is going to bring in some of his experience with the WNBA. But one of the things that I am fascinated by when you think about the growth of the W is being able to translate that real fandom and real talent at the college level into the pro game. You know, I came up through a big East school, so I watched like UConn and the juggernaut that that was and, you know, LSU and Tennessee and, you know, all of the groundswell, to use your word, that was coming up through the college game.

9:06What's the mechanism by which you take that talent and take those players and make them pro stars? The thing that changed my life as an Olympic athlete was being on TV every single weekend. Yeah. Right on the way to the Olympics. And then once you get that spotlight and the application of the Olympics, then you win. That's like a perfect storm. And so for us, since NCAA is awesome, right, we need to kind of recreate that at the pro level. And in my opinion, you know, it's like chicken or the egg. We need a great product that does well on TV and that brings the fans in consistently. And that takes time.

9:43It just takes time. Like, you know, a couple of years ago, Volleyball Day in Nebraska, 92 ,000 plus people, right, in Memorial Stadium. The sport just played in Wrigley Field. They played at Dallas Cowboy Football Stadium. Like, we have spectacle down. How do we convert the love of the game and the 43 ,000 people that showed up at Cowboy Stadium? How do we get them to come to league games every single weekend? And if they're not there, you know, in person, how do we get them to tune in? We don't have consistent media partners yet. We're working on that. To me, that is an antidote to all of this kind of fracturedness.

10:18Like we need to be consistent. We need to be findable. Then we need to tell the stories. We need to have the most compelling product on the market. We need rivalries. Like I want to hate the MLV LA team. Like I'm a San Francisco Giants girl. Like screw the Dodgers. I love hating the Dodgers. You know, we need things like this in our school. They're very hateable. Let's be honest. Come on. You know, you only hate the great ones. Unfortunately, I'll say that out loud, but it's fun. Alex isn't familiar with that. He doesn't, he doesn't know what that's about. Yeah. I remember loving and hating Alex and all of his greatness.

10:49But you know what I'm saying? But those things take time because it cannot be manufactured. We need partners who say we see the value in you. Like the value in volleyball right now is undeniable. It's a no-brainer. Who's going to align with us so we can bridge the gap, the time, the funds between where we are now and where we're going, which to me will be a mainstream sport, you know, in the next five years. Well, Keri, the good news is you have the hardest part. You have the product, you have the popularity, you have this uber growth, and now the easy part is sell it, package it, and then find a partner.

11:22But I'd rather have it that way than the other way.

11:43laureates, market innovators, and legendary investors. Whether you own stocks, bonds, real estate, commodities, even crypto, these are discussions you absolutely need to hear. Subscribe to the Masters in Business podcast on Apple, Spotify, or anywhere you listen.

12:06Being a governor now for several years of a WNBA team with the Minnesota Lynx, I've watched for a long time from afar, and now I'm watching very up close, the steady growth over the last, call it 15, 20 years. But I've seen the fast growth and the explosion in enterprise value the last four years. I guess my question is, what do you have to do as a sport to engineer this kind of WNBA type moment? Well, we're doing it real time. You know, we have new leadership at the league. I chose MLB for many reasons, but primary of which is that I appreciate our league structure. We have an overarching league, league governance, league standards, akin to the MLB, NBA, NFL.

12:48And then within that, we have individually owned franchises. So the stronger each franchise in our national markets, which we as owners are incentivized to have the best product to build IP, to build fandom, to build community value, the stronger each of the 12 franchises are in 2027, the stronger the league will be, the stronger the media deal will be. So Alex, to your point, you know, mastery comes little by little every single day. Rome was not built in the day, you know? So I just think that we have to outlast these moments, keep focusing on right now, how can we keep aligning with the right people?

13:24How can we keep building the best product? And then all of a sudden that incremental growth will compound immediately. And we have, I mean, thank goodness for us. We do have the women's soccer league kicking ass. We do have the WNBA kicking ass. Like they're proving our point. They're proving our value. And then again, just to go back to NCAA, we have that proof point as well. And the youth proof point. So everything is being proven for us. We just need to now endure, which we're athletes, you know, we're entrepreneurs. We're good at enduring because we believe in our North store. So if we can endure in this gap and bridge ourselves from A, will get to Z in a heartbeat, but it's just, you know, the first kind of million is the hardest, right?

14:04And things go. So, you know, I'm, I'm inherently an optimist. I believe in the sport without a doubt. You cannot convince me that this is not major league volleyball will not be a success. However, it doesn't mean it's going to be easy and it's going to happen right now. You know, like I want the Caitlin Clark effect, wherever she shows up, people show up. Like our sport is incredible. You have a point per play. Like it's sexy. It's dynamic. It's graceful. It's finesse. It's everything in one. And the world doesn't know about it yet, you know, through the media's eyes. And once that happens, I feel like the veil will be lifted and watch out.

14:38Yeah. It's interesting, too, to think about. And I want to dig a little deeper on something you said, which is, you know, these individual franchises and the opportunity there. And And one of the things I find so compelling about what you're describing, and, you know, you talked about your own experience. You know, you were at Stanford, two-time champion, volleyball champion there. The Bay Area is this fascinating kind of sports region in a lot of ways. Help us understand how, as you're building this product and leaning into the idea of, you know, being a NorCal franchise, like, what does that mean?

15:20What are the elements you draw on in order to make this a distinct product for that area? Well, you know, kind of to Alex's earlier point, we have the product. Like, we've done the hard part. We have the fandom. We have the numbers. We have the popularity of our sport. We have that. And why I'm so bullish on MLV NorCal is that we're in the Bay Area, one of the most incredible markets in the world. To your point, Jason, one of the most incredible sporting markets in the entire world, not only for men's sports and collegiate sports, but for women's sports, you know, with Bay of C, with the Valkyries.

15:52And so our region knows what it's like to be all in with their teams. We need to give them something to buy into. Yeah. We need them to fall in love with the athletes and with who we represent as a franchise. Who is our, like, who are we playing for? What do we stand for? Why do we stand for these values? You know, I grew up in the 80s when the Niners kicked everyone's ass. Yeah. You know, and the misfit giants that won multiple World Series, like, I was surrounded by excellence. Stanford University, Santa Clara University, that shaped me. That informed me. And now that on top of all those amazing men's sports franchises, we do have the Valkyries that are selling out at Chase Center.

16:30incredible not out of pity not out of women's sports is having a moment but out of buy-in out of we are buying what you're selling because you're authentic we have to do that and I think the beautiful thing about the Valkyries is they stand on their own alongside the Warriors yeah yeah that's powerful I mean they they for sure get tailwinds they for sure get support they share a lot of resources but their season ticket holders are not Warriors fans right they're unique and individually owned. And I don't know how the Valkyries did that after year one. We're talking to them. We're learning from them.

17:05But I guess long story short, we just have work to do. Yeah. And we don't want to just be the barrier team. We want to be the women's pro volleyball team in Northern California, period. Yeah. Sacramento and Santa Cruz. You're proud of us. You show up for us. You tune in for us. And that's something, you know, I have a lot of friends and family. They're not going to pay the bills. We need more fans, you know? I mean, it's interesting. I've thought a lot about this and, you know, we sort of dived into this in a lot of different ways around the Bay Area. You know, Alan Waxman and Brandi Chastain have both been guests on the show.

17:38And I've looked a lot at NWSL and sort of how that franchise was built. You know, the Valkyries is a really interesting case study, I think. And Alex, I think you've looked at this as well. I mean, the not so secret weapon there is Jeff Smith, You know, who ran revenue at Angel City and made that, you know, one of the most successful women's sports teams on the planet, especially from a revenue perspective. And then basically took that playbook, adapted it to the Bay Area, which was her home already, took exactly what you said, sort of this support and then created her own thing. And what we've learned about the Bay Area, and Alex, I think you've seen this in Minnesota too, is that it's not just kind of emotionally viable, it's commercially viable.

18:25You know, like the people will show up and they will pay money, which sounds overly simplistic. But I mean, I think you've seen that in Minnesota, right? Yeah. And I mean, going back to the Valkyries, I mean, there has to be a record that in less than two seasons played, let's just say one point five seasons. The enterprise value has over surpassed already surpassed a billion dollars, which is incredible. Yeah. And we've seen it based on real revenue, real revenue and real multiples. And of course, Joe Lacob is a great leader. And but you can honestly say these are two parallel, very well respected organizations, regardless of each other.

19:02Are they more powerful together? Absolutely. But what an incredible market. You can actually say one of the top three markets in the country, in my opinion. Yeah. Sure. Which does that translate to the world? I mean, I love the area that we're in. Like just I mean, people go to the Bay Area to make the impossible happen, right, and to make dreams come true. And and there's a lot of evidence that that's the place you want to be. And so for us, as we build this franchise, you know, I mean, driving revenue, it's like everyone has money, but no one wants to give it to you. You know, like you have to prove yourself to a certain extent.

19:34You know, we're talking to the Visas and the Amex. And I have my co-founders along, you know, that I'm so proud to stand side by side with, Teresa Gao, one of the most kick-s***, you know, venture capitalists in the nation, in the world, and Vivek Ranadive, who owns the Kings. Yeah. Like, because of their wisdom, their IP, their lived experience, like, it just, I know we're going to get there. Yeah. Like, Teresa owns, you know, she's part of the Valkyries, part of the Warriors, part of BFC, part of the Buffalo Bills. And then Vivek is Vivek. Like, they know what it takes to be successful in pro sports.

20:07And what also gives me confidence, every day, Teresa's on the call for us. Yeah. Like, she's molding the clay. It's shocking. I didn't know that billionaires operated that way. You know, I thought like, we'll give you your money, you know, hire a great team. But she not only has hired an excellent leadership team with Heather Vaughn, our president, and just an incredible staff, but she literally is supporting the league level. She's literally supporting on our team weekly calls, which is amazing to me. And she knows it's going to take time, you know. So I wish I had this amazing answer. It's going to take A, B, and C.

20:41Once we check those boxes, it happens. That's not the way of the world. Yeah. So for me, the way I look at this is, to me, there's more power in alignment than there's power in numbers. And if we align with the right people, then we will execute on our vision. And once we execute on our vision, the rest of the cooperative components that exist in the marketplace, in the region, in women's sports, will come and support what we're building.

21:27We'll see you next time. Subscribe to the Bloomberg Businessweek Daily Podcast on Apple, Spotify, or anywhere you listen.

22:03And I think that, you know, it is important to choose partners like that. Alex obviously has himself is like that and also has partners like that as well. And, you know, these teams are hard. This is hard work. And, you know, and you're talking about managing lots of different stakeholders, right? No question. And when you have two franchises, it's double as hard. And it's also double the pleasure, right? They really benefit from each other. But yet they're two separate companies under one holding company. But as a player, and Kerry, I'm sure you can relate with this, I just miss the days of C-ball, hit-ball, because it seemed like it was so difficult to do, and of course it was difficult to hit a baseball.

22:42But now it's not just a season where then we get to go home with our families. The season is 365, 24-7, and you have off-season, you have development, you have the next season starting, you have drafts, and on and on and on. And while the business is fairly simple, you make money three ways, national and local TV, ticket sales and sponsors, sponsorship, it's something you have to stay on top of 24-7. Alex, shoot me. But I'm in it. I'm not going anywhere. But, you know, I thought I was busy before. I thought, you know, my life as a pro athlete was so dynamic. But it was seasonal, preseason, in-season, off-season.