Jana Kramer | How Adversity Builds Determination and Discipline

33:06Yeah. You know, I just said no to a movie last night and I woke up this morning and I've been so emotional about it. Cause I'm like, it's so hard. Cause I'm like, you know, I love what I do. I love being an actress and I didn't want to go away for a month to the Dominican Republic and miss a whole baseball season, a whole softball season. But I'm like, ugh, you know, like this is the hardest thing because, again, I love acting and I love being a mom. And I love being a mom. So I'm like, I don't want to miss the summers. Like how many summers do you get with your kids? And then it's done. 18. Yeah.

33:42And then they're all. And my years are, you know, going. Yeah. So shorter and shorter. So I'm just like, I don't want to be away for a month. Yeah. Yeah, that's, you know, it's so funny because there was conversations about me going on tour and doing some public speaking. I was like, well, do I get to go home? Like, oh, yeah, you can go home. I'm like, OK, because, you know, I have children. I have a wife. Like, I don't there's no way in hell I could be gone for two straight months. Yeah. Like I would be the worst public speaker on the planet by week freaking two, dude. Like I am a cup is empty.

34:15Yeah. My tribe's not here. Like I'm uncomfortable. This is not good for me emotionally. You know, I do want to share with the audience because, you know, you said, you know, I'm, you know, I passed up this movie. I didn't want to go to the Dominican Republic, you know, for a month and miss baseball season. Like I need the, I need the audience to know that's the type of person you truly are. And I'm going to bring it that point home right here. When we started talking about two weeks ago, I was like, hey, you know, are you going to be around the next couple of weeks? and you said, no, you tell them what you said.

34:49Do you remember? It was Derby Day. Well, I was supposed to go to Los Angeles for the iHeart Awards and take a other couple of meetings. And I realized that the flight wasn't going to get me home in time to catch my daughter's Derby Day. So I said, Jolie, hey, sorry, mommy's not going to be able to see your Derby Day. And she was just like, oh, okay, no, it's fine. And because of what I do and the work that I do, I'm like, I have to be very intentional all the things that I say yes to and the things that I because they know like when I go it's like mommy has to go like mommy needs to go film this movie and and work because I love what I do I think it's really important for them to see that too but you also have to say no to things that like and I just was like derby day is more important than going to LA so that's my whole point yeah that's badass like that that I respect you know um there was a red carpet event last weekend in Miami and I did the same thing yeah you know Getty was gonna be there it was like I've never had a Getty image Miami's fun too like dude I'm just some dude like I've never had a Getty image like I gotta go to this thing gotta get a Getty gotta gotta get a Getty gotta get a Getty but you know I said to my good friend Matt who's my publicist I said hey man would you be totally pissed off at me if I didn't go he's like yeah I want you there I'm like but no for real for real yeah like no like no bullshit like he's like no what's up i'm like i feel like i need to be home with my family you know i was in new york this week you know nashville next week my wife's behind the camera you can't see her smoke show hey baby smoke show and she speaks oh yeah different language so i know that's my favorite and i'm like oh she gets mad at you just go well that's the thing though like if she's mad at me i prefer to her to speak to me in spanish because it's a turn-on yeah if she speaks to me in english i'm like oh no i know you're pissed i don't like these words yeah say some things that I don't understand completely and I'm good yeah but I just said you know I'm I'm this is a good opportunity there's some massive people in the room you know it was at the one hotel in Miami red carpet everything and I was just like no good for you I need to be home I need to be home and we had a pretty good weekend good it was good it was good good and I didn't I didn't regret my decision good see yeah that's great and I woke up slightly regretting my decision this morning uh but I do think that there is I've worked really hard and it's nice to get to a place where I can say no to things but it's hard to say no to things because I still have a very I have a scarcity mindset too money but at the same time there is an amount that I would be okay with leaving my kids for a little bit it just is like what's your number I'm not gonna say it but I'm just but like if they you know it does because i'm like if it's not worth it to me to leave i i'm gonna choose the baseball season no 100 but my manager was like well then you maybe you should like shouldn't be an actor you know i'm like that that's some bullshit i'm sorry it really really made me upset that right because i'm like i am an actor i left i've many i can give you many situations where i've taken zero dollars to move the needle where i've left vacations to go film like so no like yeah that's not a fair that's not a fair comment that's not fair comment but you know it's tough it is tough you know I've I've had a couple publicists and my first publicist um you know kind of said some things like that to me before like you need to get out more you you know you know you got to understand like your kids are gonna have to miss you I'm like no they don't yeah no they don't because I know where this is going and I know there's not a lot of real conversations on podcasts and I know one day when everybody's done with the misdirection and done with the rage bait, the click bait.

38:24They're going to come right here. And then I'll be able to afford to fly them wherever I want with me. They're a part of it. I never wanted this thing to be, you know, separate from my family. And a lot of men, when they travel, they like that time away. You know, sometimes I do like the time away though. And that's because I like to watch things that I want to watch. When I'm with my wife, I have to watch like romper room bullshit. Love is blind. I love love is blind. I do too. Oh my God, I love that show. My husband hated it in the beginning, and then I forced him to sit down and watch it with me one day.

38:55And he was just like, so we want to watch the next episode? Yeah. We're on Age of Attraction right now, and I love it. And it's so funny because I've become really good friends with people that are on that show. Yeah. Like Clay Gravesandy and Shane. I've got that on the face, probably. Yeah. So Clay is from season six. Okay. And Shane is, I believe, season two. Okay. I started watching later. Oh, yes. The beginning seasons are the best. Okay. Yeah, now they're like kind of get, you know, I don't know. This last one was decent. I didn't finish it. I liked the last one. Yeah, I didn't finish it.

39:23But the one before last was an absolute train wreck. That was tough. Train wreck to watch. I'm like, come on. Yeah. Come on. You know, it's like, but yeah, so that's the only reason why I love to travel alone sometimes. I get that. But I love when they're with me. You know, I love when they get to experience it. Yeah. And most of the time I bring the kids with me. Like they were just up there in Cleveland with me. I was shooting a film, but it was just the Dominicans farther away. Yeah. It's harder travel. yeah like if this was in the states i'd have been like yeah let's do it yeah you know absolutely but so that's the thing it was a logistics thing it was a geography thing it wasn't i'm not an actor right i know but you just throw that one in there yeah you know um what was your so like how i mean like that right there though from your like representation that's hard yeah you know because that's a test moment because i'm sure every bit of you wanted to like i'm very reactive yeah me too.

40:17But what I've learned, and this is, again, I'm going to just say thank you to my husband for this one. He's really helped me not be reactive in the moment. He's like, take the night, write it out. And that's the thing. I always write everything out. It's something that my therapist always said, write it out, but don't send it. So I write everything out in my notes. And then the next day I'll redraft it a little less emotional. But I did write something back this morning and I said, I don't appreciate the comment of not saying maybe I shouldn't be an actor. So there's many things that I've done to prove that, you know, I'm doing what I want to be doing and I work really hard.

40:55I said, logistically, this just wasn't it for me. And I'm mom first. And if we're not aligned in that, then maybe we're not their best fit. I love it. You know, when people make comments like that, it's not about you. Yeah. Well, they're very much in the like, you should be so grateful. No one's getting offers. And, you know, they like to keep and I get it. They want quantity like work begets work. And I believe that so much and it's great again logistically i just in my gut was like i think i'll be very unhappy being there that long yeah you probably would be yeah you know and again it's like you know to the to the managers and stuff like that's a paycheck yeah it's a paycheck for me too though that's the thing i'm bummed too you know i want to be working that's the thing like i would love to work i just yeah that was tough it's it's interesting because it's like it's an a little harder for my mama heart when it's an ocean.

41:47I totally get that. Like I, I couldn't do it. I'd be like, all right, like, um, you're taking a month off of work. And my husband can't do that. You know, like my kids can't do that either. How could I call my ex-husband and be like, Hey, can the kids, um, take off all their baseball season? Like you'd be like, no. And I don't want them to either. That's not fair. Yeah. No, it's so funny because, um, you know, Chris by there says like, you need to move to Nashville. Yes, you do. My family dynamic. I can't. Oh, right because you know yes you know what I'm saying and so it's like do I want to live in Nashville because Jackie said yesterday she goes I would live here it's so great I'm like it's so great can you convince your ex to move here maybe yeah maybe I don't know Jackie get on it she likes you better than me um but no I usually is the case no it's all we're all we're all cool but you know I for me like Nashville is a mini hub it is there's a lot of people here you know and it's centrally ish located you know i can get to new york you know i can get to california my daughter's like she's like it's not centrally located she's making noises she's like i want to move to nashville she's got the cowgirl hat on she's coey bought it for her he brought it in for her i didn't bring a gift i didn't know she was gonna be no no it's okay no it wasn't a prerequisite it no just um you know the koei red i ran into her music about two years ago okay and it's very um you know she's from my area in san francisco bay oh okay and it's you know she grew up writing hooks for rappers so she has a lot of pop and hip-hop in her country and when i found her on instagram i played it for my wife and played it for me so me has been obsessed for like two years How awesome.

43:31Yeah, so, you know, so that's why. So they've talked before. They've done FaceTimes and things like that. I love that. But we will welcome you with arms wide open. Yeah, no, absolutely. No, it's just great to be here and have this conversation with you. You know, you mentioned your husband helping you with things. Like Jackie's done that for me because I sense that you and I are a lot alike. Like, we look very polished, very kind. I think we can be a little bit of a monster when you come at us. So my thing is I am a Sagittarius. What's your sign? I'm a Scorpio. You're a Scorpio. Okay. So it's not that I'm stubborn, but I am stubborn.

44:19Like there's... She's arguing with herself, ladies and gentlemen. Yes. um but I also I I'm at a point too where I almost like I demand respect now like I have been so disrespected for so many years that I I want respect from people so when I feel disrespected that is when I get puffy you know because I'm just like no like I I've I don't deserve that like I know what I deserve and I don't deserve that uh but I my first initial reaction is always like I get, cause I, I know every opportunity that I've, a lot of the opportunities, I won't say every, but I've got them for myself. Like it's, you know, when I meet a producer, I'm like, all right, what's our next project?

45:02Like I'm a, I'm Michigan. I'm grit. I was raised with nothing. My mom had three jobs. Like I didn't come from money. I, you know, was the sole provider for a very long time with my kids. I pay my ex-husband child support, you know, like I have to work I have to support the family and so for me it's um when I either feel disrespected I will get a little but I I'm just I'm my therapist calls me scrappy she's like you're very scrappy like you're gonna get stuff done um but yeah I can be really emotional at first which is why he's helped me just be like don't be reactive don't send that right now because I would just straight up be like how could you say that yeah you know that's so rude and which is also a decent question and it's not incorrect that it was disrespectful, but like, are you going to get what you want out of it?

45:49No, not at all. That's the whole thing. It's like, you don't ever get that. And then you don't, he always said this too. He's like, you don't look as powerful when you come from that point of view. He's like, if you want to be respected and be powerful, don't come from that angle. Take a beat, compose yourself. And he's a coach. So he's all about like composing yourself. And like, you know, sometimes he doesn't do it either. The best way he's Scottish, like, you know, he's also human fiery to human. But no, he's been really helpful with me to just lock it up. And a lot of times I lately what I've been doing is just going really inward and and really trying to say, OK, what what I've closed the door to something will open somewhere else.

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47:51Yeah. I mean, I agree with you, you know, and, and, you know, everything that you're saying about your husband, my wife has done for me because I would so quick to respond to everything and respond with emotion. But having a spouse that can literally coach you through things and help you grow is super important yeah you know it always confuses me it's like you know when you said that you're always having to defend yourself it's like why at this point do you even have to do that I'm an outsider and I can clearly see that you proved yourself yeah like like that that is something like do you think that's gonna continue to happen I don't know you know what's it gonna take my buddy you know Kellen Lutz he's he's a really great actor he was in um I mean so many things but he uh we were talking this morning and he goes you know he goes I've gotten to a place where my response is it's a pass and then my agent manager will respond with a bunch of stuff and he goes and he'll just say I understand but it's still a pass he goes you don't have to over explain yourself in your gut decision because you know as a mom as an actor what your answer is and you don't have to explain it so I was like I I love that.

49:01You know, I'm like, yeah, why did I send this? You know, it wasn't super emotional, but it was longer than it needed to be. Yeah. Why can't it just be? But I am so much a people pleaser as well. That's it. And I'm so much of a yes person to say yes to everything that I'm still learning to trust myself in going, no, my gut says no. And I understand what you're saying, but it's a pass. Yeah. And being like firm and committed in that decision. I really struggle in that piece. Like, and I'm wanting to like learn how to just stand firm and be like okay that was my answer and that's that I admire that and that's where I'm striving to as well even to say no yeah like saying no to last Saturday was very hard for me yes yeah totally because like I don't know who I would meet that room yep I don't know what could have come from it totally and I now the same thing I'm like what if that I could have done another movie with this other producer director the movie I just said no to you know yeah but it's like it's not our job it's not our job to worry about those things you know you can only do the best you can with the information that you have in front of you yeah and I think that's an interesting point for the audience because I think we're all searching for the next thing everybody's going through adversity everybody's probably scared in the world we live in right now you know like there's some things happening that I'm like am I am I in a movie like what's going on but like the the the most important thing is that you are there now like wherever you're at be there and it's very hard to be present yeah it's very hard especially for creators because our minds always going like what's next what can I do you know who can I contact yeah to bridge that gap for another project but I think what I'm starting to learn and I hope it sticks is not everything is going to be the next big thing right and if I have to pass on something it's okay Yeah.

50:51You know, if it if it raises my excitement level, I'm all in. Yeah. Like coming here. Right. You know, you were the first one I talked to and I'm like, oh, wait a second. I know. Coey here. I mean, there's so many people here. I know Phil Moore here. And so I'm like, all right, we'll do we'll do, you know, two hours one day, two hours the next day. And I got excited about it and nothing else mattered. it was a full-on yes for me even the the fact that i had to leave my two biggest kids because they can't miss school the grades are with their grade they're in and they have extracurriculars and then it was like even to the point where if if mia and jackie couldn't come i'm still going does that make sense yeah so one of my theories and this is something that my husband again brought up to me last night he goes this is what you say all the time and i knew what he was going to say and i say this to my friends if it's not a hell yes it's a hell no dude my my live by that motto so my friend pat sickens he's also a partner in my company because if it's not a hell yes then it's a no yeah and this was a hell yes yeah having this conversation with you with you is a hell yes for me and i appreciate knowing that about you because that makes me feel like well damn yeah well our time is valuable too and your time is valuable everyone's time is valuable and i think that's too where you know my biggest thing is trusting and this is what my husband said he's like listen if you want to go he said we will support you we'll bring the kids for a week if we can you know like we will do what we can to support you if you think this is the right move he goes what does your gut say and I think that's something where again not trusting myself for so long it's like not listening to that first gut instinct and I'm like well my first gut instinct was no not to do it and it's like to lean into that and to trust yourself I think that is like the biggest takeaway because you're I do think you have that innate ability to go okay let me gut check this let me see how I really feel about this and lean into that that's interesting for the audience because I think what you said probably resonated with them and it resonated with me too because for the longest time I didn't trust myself yeah you know but what are some things that you did to kind of shift that paradigm to be like no I can't trust myself were there activities exercises that you did I mean there's so many like a lot of things was the this is kind of silly but like one of my biggest things that worked for me in my healing trauma was I was at this retreat center and I, um, I carried a bunch of rocks and on the rocks.

53:20So it was like, I deserve abuse. I'm not enough. I'm stupid. Any, any negative thing that I believed about myself, we put it on the rocks and I'd put it in his backpack. And then I hiked two miles to this river and I carried the weight of all the negative beliefs on my back. And it was like this quiet walk. And when I got to the river, she was just like, I want you to take the rocks out. I want you to throw the rocks that don't serve you anymore. And I want you to call out the negative, the positive of what it is. And so I went through most of them. And she's like, if you want to hold on to a few rocks, you can.

53:54She's like, if you're ready to let them go, you don't have to let them go. The one that I had the hardest time throwing was that I didn't deserve abuse. And eventually I ended up throwing it. But I say all that is because that was the start of me going the positive thoughts. Like, no, I am smart. I do make good decisions. I am a good mom. I have to make hard choices sometimes, but I know I'm going to do the right thing. And I know it's such a silly concept, but when you speak positive into yourself, and it's going to just quiet all the negatives. So I don't think, sometimes I don't make the best choices, but, you know, I like to go, because we're human, right?

54:33We can't all do it perfect. Yeah, that's boring. Yeah, yeah, yeah. And of course, I have thoughts. Sometimes the negative ones will creep back in. But most of the time, I've been working so hard on being more positive and just being confident in who I am and the decisions that I'm making. I'm in my 40s now. I feel more confident in certain things. You're in your 40s? I'm 42. Really? Wow. So yeah, I think that has been one of the best things. And then just, again, going back to just trusting yourself and how you feel and gut checks. and I love therapy. Yeah, you know, I think, you know, the exercise you did with the rocks, I think those things, I know they work.

55:11Yeah. But you have to commit to it. Yeah. You know, because, you know, the thing that I imagine when some people listen to it, they're like, oh, they roll their eyes. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Of course, I've burned papers. Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah. Write a letter and burn it. What the hell is that going to do? Yeah. Nothing with that attitude. Yeah. But if you really connect to the exercise and you're like, okay, I'm going to write this all out. I'm going to feel the emotion of what it is I'm riding on this rock. Yeah. And then I'm going to feel the emotion of pulling out of my backpack because I don't have to carry this shit anymore.

55:38Yeah. And I walked back, by the way, two miles with a lighter backpack and I didn't feel the weight. That must have been nice. That was great. I was like, how does this feel? I really like this. Like, wow, it's like starting to get cramps in my traps. I don't feel that way anymore. But when you commit to something, you know, like you did, even the one like I deserved the abuse, like holding onto that rock and not wanting to throw it back in that, and throw it in that water, working through the fact that you did not, in fact, deserve it and finally releasing it. That's what makes things so effective.

56:08Not just, all right, cool. Yeah, thanks. That'll never work. Yeah. Right. But, but that's, that's a good exercise, you know, and I, and I hope the audience like listen to that, whatever they choose, right. If they want to write a letter out to someone who's, you know, abused them or. I had a funeral service basically in therapy for my, for my ex, my ex, like my last marriage. You know what I mean? Like I had to, I had to literally write a eulogy, like my therapist. It was so silly, but it was so great because it was a death, you know, and things like that help you heal and move on. That's crazy.

56:42So you guys heard that. I know it's so silly. Like some of the things I would tell my friends, they'd be like, okay, that's a little weird, but I'm like, and it worked. You know, it's funny because like, I think it applies in a lot of different areas. Right. So there was, I think about three years ago i was going through a really hard time when i was building the show you know i was super out of shape and you know we weren't making any money we couldn't couldn't monetize this thing they couldn't figure it out yeah and i was just you know we were really struggling and you know i had this conversation with a buddy of mine and i recently had him back on my show what i didn't know is he was taking notes the whole time we were talking right and he pulled out his little pad on my show what we did like maybe a month and a half ago and we did this exercise this visualization exercise and he's like who are you what do you see where are you at what are you wearing and I'm like I'm wearing tight black pants tight black shirt you know red and black uh uh red and black nikes you know like with white accents and you know i'm vascular i'm in shape and he goes what are you wearing right now i was wearing the exact outfit it's like now look at your vascularity you created your reality three years ago right now how can you say you're not winning wow and so like that's the thing right like when you commit to something and you go through the action with intention doesn't matter what it is therapy building something like yo it's gonna work it may not work if you put your yeah the all your energy and effort and love into it like put your back into it girl you gotta put your back into it you gotta you gotta do those things and so like when people say therapy doesn't work it's because you're not putting into it yeah you're expecting to go or you don't have the right therapist i've also had not yeah great therapist too it takes a couple times like don't get discouraged if the first one you don't connect with like that's okay how did you find the right therapist for you and everything that you're going oh she was such a godsend um i was having really bad anxiety uh it was when i was in my last marriage and my friend just um said you know you should really go to do emdr and i didn't really know much about emdr but she is an emdr specialist and um and then i was just like can you be my therapist too like she's incredible so yeah i've always wanted you haven't done that yet oh emdr it's great it's really really really great yeah i i've really wanted to um because there's still some things you know like my reaction sometimes yeah like they would do what you spoke about with your face like they would um walk you through that and then maybe that would help your the intensity so it's all about like lessening the intensity of how that moment trigger trauma yeah you feel so it might help with that you know yeah what i also really want to dig into is like and my wife says this to me all the time is like we had it we had a little bit of a conversation friday and by conversation i mean like it was it was a little intense yeah sometimes i say things and react certain ways and i don't understand that i'm doing it right like i don't understand my tone i know yeah i'm like no i just said this were you in our couples therapy yesterday was i Was I there?

1:00:00Yeah. Maybe. I think it's a guy thing too, though. Is it? I don't think men understand their tone. Again, my husband's Scottish. So that's already pretty tough. Like he's harsh. Yeah. You know, it sounds angrier than he's intending it to be. But I do feel like you guys can be a bit defensive when women just want to have a conversation or be heard. Hey, quiet down back there. Am I right about that? Sometimes we don't want you to fix it. We don't want you to, you know, it's really about hearing us. I think that's, yeah, we have that issue at times as well where I'm like, I just need you to not come back either with a fix or a defense.

1:00:39Someone help me over here. Someone help me. He's drowning all by himself. Is that about accurate? No, it is, you know, and Chris is just watching me get beat up over here. But, no, I think that, you know, the thing is, is that sometimes I feel the way it comes out when I'm approached with it. I was like, can you say it differently? but then I hear, well, if I say it like that, you still have this reaction. So maybe it is a guy thing. Maybe, maybe we are just, you know, maybe it's like, we feel shamed when our women are like saying, yo, this is what's wrong. This is wrong. Like, you know, this is what's going on right now.

1:01:13I think we have to also deliver it in a way where it's not like I've learned in therapy too, how to deliver it where my husband doesn't feel that hopefully he wouldn't take it as defensive. of like, hey, when you brought this up the other day, it really made me feel frustrated. And so I'm just, would love some clarity around it. If they get defensive, that's then your fault in it, I guess. But you should then go, okay, our therapist is always like, you guys are not the enemy. So take a beat and go, okay, she's not trying to hurt me. She's not trying to say I'm doing something wrong. What is she wanting me to hear right now?

1:01:52And to lean in to be like, okay, Can you explain that a little bit more so I can understand how I could have done that better? Or, you know, like having the conversation instead of just being like, what do you mean? You know, or like dismissing it or being defensive or trying to. No, that's the thing, though. It's so hard. It's so hard. Of course it is. It's so hard. Yeah. I just want to chill. I just want to like. But our therapists say the best relationships are the ones that can have arguments, but repair. Yeah. And that's where it's like, if you can repair well, your marriage will be well, basically.

1:02:25Yeah, I think, and I don't know what her thought is, but I feel like, you know, and she won't get on camera. She's so beautiful. I know. Good job. Thank you. Winning. Not saying, like, you couldn't, but I'm just saying that she's really winning. Oh, trust me, I've heard that too. How'd you pull that one off? It's just stunning. You look at her cheekbones. My gosh. I know. Tell me about it. Come here, girl. Come here. Mamacita. Mamacita. About all I know. Poppy. But, you know, I forgot where I was going with this. See, I love the side chatter. Like, that's what I love about what we do here. You know, it's not put together.

1:03:04We're just, we're a mess. After Friday night. Yes. Your fight. Did you repair? I feel that I. Did you repair well? Because that is. In my opinion, yes. Did he repair well? okay good so the night of no stubborn as an asshole like i was like no but but what could you have done better in that moment of being the asshole did you think of her as the enemy did you yeah i did um i was she being the enemy no i misinterpreted something so that would have been a good moment to then ask for clarity right so that you didn't go straight to your i reacted buddy i know why men men men men men men men great show good show i missed that show good show damn so funny so funny okay so no i think you know when i misinterpreted something my perception was something was said said then I went harder and doubled down on that word and it was it was not good it was not good but like you know we we argued and then eventually like we get back on track and we like walk through things and then I'd misinterpret something she would say and I and then she would misinterpret something I would say then we go backwards but at the end of the night it was I'm sure there was that residue of something happened but it was also like nothing happened and since then I've been more aware of like maybe my reaction in this certain situation needs to get better and I feel like I've tried to be more patient since then I don't know I just feel more at peace like yeah like okay like hopefully that was the conversation that needed to happen so I can be there for her more like and and not be this super reactionary person i'm not perfect i'm gonna have no times where i backslide nobody like i'm yeah there's gonna be times yeah but it's like overall i feel like i've been less of what she would call frustrated or annoyed towards her yeah well i also think that's an inventory check that like we have to do on ourselves in those moments like when i react a way that i don't want to react i always go or if he does i'm like did he have a stressful day today did he lose a client did he gain like is he is this is he you know what is going on in his world because i i think we don't we let those things come into our yeah arguments sure sure like frustrations over career yep or whatnot it's like for sure you know like i know if like when i was in my head the other day like if he would have came out may have been like what what like i would have been more yeah probably like i'm doing something right now you know it's like but that's not his fault i'm in my own head i'm not explaining that i'm dealing with something that's i'm struggling with do you realize how hard that is like oh it's so it's it's vulnerability and it's the toughest thing to to to feel that just marriage in general is like you have two separate human beings that also live separate lives like for work and stuff and then she has her day he has his day and then you come home at the end of the day and everybody's brought back together and it it could be very contentious right throw kids on top of it then throw three kids on top of it sports sports and all of it dinner two-year-old exes yes like external factors that could you know i mean good god man i think we're killing life here we're work that's a lot that's a lot but i mean the the fact of the matter is is yeah you just show up you do the best you can and hopefully you can admit when you're wrong and you know fix things and but no i just the the dynamics is is just like the communication aspect of life in general but especially in a marriage i think a lot of people really struggle with it i know i do um again because no one's perfect but being open to maybe the fact that you know the other person doesn't have to be right and you don't have to be right but you can seek to understand that's always my thing i'm like you will never understand like you might not ever understand and i might not ever understand you but i'm one i want to listen and try to understand yeah i i don't i might not think it's right but i can yeah and i just want that same thing back.

1:07:39I think there's a 0 % possibility that men will understand women completely and women will understand men completely. Now, you may have seen the buzz, but let me give you the inside scoop. Babe Ruth, Barry Bonds, Ken Griffey Jr., Mark McGuire, all the greats. What do they have in common? They have collectibles and they're being sold on whatnot right now. And it brought me back to my childhood. Knowing that I can get my hands on something cool like that really gives me hope. So if you're selling online or out of a storefront, full-time or as a side hustle, you already know the challenges. You're hoping for people to find your listing or waiting for them to walk in.

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1:08:51Search whatnot, W-H-A-T-N-O-T in the app store, download, and you can start selling right away. Oh, of course. There's no shot. We were wired way too differently. You just have to understand where someone's coming from. Perspective, right? Yeah. And I think it's, again, like making sure that you're not the enemy. She's not your enemy. He's not my enemy. Are we in a counseling session? I know. Are we? Seriously. And repair. It's all about repair. So how do you feel? How did that make you feel? I know. No, I love these types of conversations because they evolve, right? So I think about this whole conversation.

1:09:29It's like, we started here, then it evolves into this. And it's all for the simple fact that someone on the other side needed to hear that. And it's really cool that way. That's what I love about art. It's like, obviously, even what you do, you're doing it. You're in a role, and it's serving a purpose. Because I think there's a lot of people out there that watch movies differently. I watch movies completely differently than I used to. what can I learn? How does this fit into my platform? Is there a shot I can even talk to this person? And what can it serve my audience? Can you get Jason Sudeikis on for shrinking?

1:10:11Do you want shrinking? Oh no. What happened? The most genius show. I'm obsessed with it. I cry, laugh. Like it is literally my favorite show. You need to get him on. Which one? Okay. So sometimes I know faces, but I don't know names. He's the, not Harrison Ford, obviously. The other, the other. That's Jason Segel. Oh, Segel. Sorry. I said today. Yes, Jesus. Jason Segel. You need to get Jason Segel on the show. I would lose my mind. My publicist met. Harrison Ford. Matt Uriel. Or I think that's his name. He's the. He's Brian in the show. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. And apparently he said yes. Oh my gosh.

1:10:54please tell him I'm like the largest fan of that show. Dude, I love that show. I saw it. Harrison Ford is amazing. Isn't he? Segal is amazing. Jesus. I was like, wait a second. I'm having a hard time here. Yeah. That's a great show. It's so, and that's what I'm talking about. Like those kind of shows. Like I watch TV now because I'm like, okay, that show makes me laugh. It makes me cry. It makes me, has the therapy aspect in it. I'm learning something. I'm reflecting. Like that is my favorite. I looked at Jackie one night and I'm like, I don't, I'm literally about to lose my shit. I'm going to cry.

1:11:24I'm going to cry. I'm going to cry. Because it's so, again. So good. We can go all the way back to One Tree Hill. It's the same thing. These bad things happen. And like we're literally watching real people acting out these situations that people go through. Yeah. And it can help because you know, like, damn, other people are struggling with this stuff. Yeah. But no, that show is really good. it's so good have you seen platonic yet no i'd like it yeah you like it it's funny okay it has um i'm usually not a comedy girl i usually like the dramas and the like the thrillers yeah but it's my bestie i i am like all about twist my brain as hard as you possibly can oh for sure like mob land like all of those like ozark i'm obsessed with all of them genius show so good Genius show.

1:12:21That's the kind of show I would love to be on. My whole thing is I want to be on a TV show. That is my dream goal. I want to be back on a show. Yeah. That'd be great to see. Thanks. That'd be really great to see. But yeah, like Friends and Neighbors. I love that kind of like, it has a little comedy in it. But yeah. Go watch Platonic. Okay. It's a comedy, but it's Seth Rogen. I like Seth Rogen. And Rose. Burn. No? Burn? From Bridesmaids. Love. Yes. She's awesome. She's fantastic. Incredible. Incredible show. I feel like that's the only comedy I could do. Well, maybe. I mean, she's incredible. I'm not like a slapstick kind of.

1:12:56I could never do. Jackie's not here. I don't ever audition for comedy. No. I'm just not like. I don't know. Well, I don't think it. I don't think it would. Rose Byrne has like a dryness to her that I would love. She's good. To play. She's really good. I couldn't see you in a comedy. Yeah. I'm just. Yeah. I think I have too much. You're funny because I'm with you in person. You have a good sense of humor. I'm not saying you're a deadbeat. I'm just saying I don't know I don't know if the world's ready to see you in a comedy yeah no I want to I want to do more yeah you want to do more I need it to connect yeah yeah that's the thing like it's that is also like acting is such therapy for me too in a way yeah like it helps me that's awesome I mean these conversations too for me like when I have conversations with people like you and then other guests like there's things that I work through real time and the thing that I love about podcasting, you have a podcast, the Wind Down podcast.

1:13:45Yeah, it's been eight years. Oh, really? Yeah. Wow. Yeah. I thought I'd been going a long time. Yeah, eight years. So I get it. Like in the beginning, it's like, you know, you weren't making money. And then afterwards, you're like, oh, okay. But then a lot of people have podcasts. And so it's, you know, the fluctuations with it is interesting. Oh, the podcast industry. Yeah. So fun, isn't it? It is. It's difficult. I mean, I've thought about quitting the podcast many times just because it's a lot of times things are taken out of context and then it's just a headline and that makes me really frustrated when it's out of context and then sometimes too I say things that I'm like crap I should have added I shouldn't have said it like that it's already out and then it's oh well oh well let it eat girl let it eat yeah nothing I really say turns into a headline because I'm not a name yet but I'm sure at one point I say something I have to be very careful because you know and i'm still careful now because yeah people like to go back in time yes they do listen they he's doing so good she's killing it let me fuck her up yeah let me find a way yeah shoe drop you did this in 1995 i was 13 yeah no i was like probably 15 anyway i digress but like that's the thing it's like you you know and and try not to beat yourself up about that though because oh no No, no, I just, I do, like, there's been things where I'm like, oh, I should not have said it like that.

1:15:08Because I do hold myself to, I don't like to be prejudged. Like, you can have your opinion after we meet and hang out and talk or whatever. But I don't like it's someone who just prejudges someone. And sometimes I've done that in the past. And I'm like, I just went against what I believe. Your only flaw as a friend is you haven't followed me back on Instagram. Oh, shoot, have I not? Your husband does. We're besties. We're besties, me and your husband on Instagram. I will do it as soon as I leave. Yeah, damn right. I'm so sorry. Unbelievable. I go, I'm so bad with that. I need to get better. It's hard.

1:15:38Like, do you? I try to stay off as much as I can, but I do go in my DMs because they're kinder than DMs. Yeah, they are. Yeah. I don't get a lot of hate in DMs. Like, it's really nice. Yeah, the DMs are usually like 99.9 % are sweet. Yet. I don't get it yet. I'm sure at one point. Oh, yeah. And I just straight up, I'll block. Oh, yeah. I don't deal with it in block. Yeah, yeah, yeah. You don't like me? Someone said something earlier today, and I honestly can't remember where it was, but I was just like, block. Do you know where people are really mean? Oh, I don't even want to bring up the website.

1:16:10YouTube and X. Oh, yeah. I was thinking of another site. What were you thinking? I don't even want to say it because I don't even want to give them energy. Okay. Off camera, I want to know, though, if that's fair. I was on Piers Morgan one time. Yes, you were. Okay. And after the first time. How was he? Is he great? I liked him. Yeah. He's cool. Yeah. But the panelists. So then also it was on with Tommy Lauren. Okay. Which we've become friendly. Great. I was on her show. Me and her husband have connected. Okay. You know. But there's just, it was about the show Adolescence. Oh, okay. What were your thoughts?

1:16:46It was a great show. Okay. But it was also very heartbreaking because there's, you know, they talked about the manosphere. And how. So sad. It's, it's wacko. Yeah. But I got torched. Why? I got taught, I was called a covert feminist and because I allow my wife out of the house to work. I'm sorry. No, no, no, I'll repeat it. Yeah, exactly. Covert feminist because my wife should be at home homeschooling my children and I should be out making the money. Can you like that? But again, that's the genre of that actual episode. would bring those people in right and so i got torched on why though torched someone said oh also sean french i love seeing my wife get down by another guy because that's what she because i said i'm glad she works because that's what she wants to do yeah i mean can you believe that it's so people that's harsh yeah i was like dude i don't know if i could do this again like and i have you know best friends who who do stay home and you know they they homeschool their and but and that's great too like I think it's all wonderful and yeah but I just wish people would hold those judgments and comments to themselves well I mean again we I don't know if they were bots I don't know I don't I don't know yeah but I mean I know actual people would retweeted and like just torched me and they were you've made it people I made it you know so I was like oh my god what do I do and then my former publicist just welcome to fame I'm like oh yeah you can keep this shit yeah I'm sensitive like I'm a real human yeah um but like you know those those people are always going to come out it's the only time I ever experienced that this isn't fun like this is not okay like this is very hard for me to deal with yeah it was it was really hard for me to deal with too I mean I've got you know some haters and uh I used to always want a hundred percent approval right yeah and I just know now that that's will never happen and I have to be okay with that and I am now yeah no that's good because but I would kill myself they think they think I'm to this so let me act now like this on my socials or they think I'm being this way okay so let me let me be this and I'm like how about I just be myself but it's hard because I'm like I want them I want them to understand I want them to like me I want them to course yeah we all have this tendency to want to be liked right but like one of the things that I like about you and you know I was telling my wife about like I was like dude I want to be friends with her because she's so real you know like that don't let these idiots you know well no it became like exhausting and I was just like this is I'm gonna I'm gonna mess up I'm gonna say things I don't because I remember one thing went really public and I was horrified by it and I call I don't have a publicist because I'm again too cheap with it but she's you know because she's there they're so expensive I love I love her but you know I didn't really have anything going on at the time too and I was like all right I don't really need one but I said oh my gosh so I need to make some apologies.

1:19:52She's like, just don't say anything. Let it go away. Let it eat. But I'm like, but they're going to think that I'm, she's like, they will be on another story by tomorrow. Yep. And they were, but it still kills me inside that people might have a perception because I said something, you know, and I'm like, yeah. Well, it's so funny because I'm pretty tied into everything because my job is to understand what's going on out there in the industry, what's the commentary. I don't even know what you're talking about. Oh, okay. It was a couple years ago. Yep. Don't, don't even know. Okay, great don't even know a couple years ago that's like a decade i know but it still eats me because it's not who i am do you know what i mean yeah i do like and that it still bothers me to this day yeah because i'm like that is not my like soul and my heart and like i you know i that's not who i am yeah but and i think we all messed up and i think okay i really learned from that and yeah i did a i did a dm to the person they never i don't think they ever saw it nor responded but that's fine I at least did it privately.

1:20:47You did it privately. You did it for you. And I was like, I am so sorry. I am so sorry. See, it takes a big person. You know? Anyways. We're friends, though. I will follow back when we are officially friends. And I like your wife. She's awesome. Yeah, my wife's great. My wife's great. I wish we were staying alone. Does she have a nosebleed? Aw, little monkey. Sweet thing. Aw. Are you okay? My daughter has a nosebleed, guys. She's behind camera. I love you, baby. Aw. um you guys have to come back and come over or come to the lake i would love to i would love to i'm here until tomorrow um but no we'll come back yeah absolutely um i was i think i'm going to be back up within a couple months great so definitely take you up on that offer do the lake house there's a there's we got to wind down here but but I see what you did there.

1:21:36Wow. There's one thing that struck me in our interview that I connected with the movie, and I want to talk about it. Okay, go for it. And I didn't go back to it until this time because it just wasn't the time flow of conversation. Okay. But your son's song, your seven-year-old, you sang in the hospital in that movie when your baby had passed. Yep.

1:22:07I pay attention you sure do I pay attention that's a good one yeah and you know what's so funny is I started singing that actually post that movie because I have lost babies before and so that that scene also was very you know uh hard and um so there's a song that um I won't take credit for my ex-husband actually uh came up with a song the song we sing the kids uh every night or mostly every night and uh when they were babies every single night and then i started singing that song after that one and it just was like a full circle wow moment with that's really cool yeah are you still singing too i mean like for fun okay yeah okay cool yeah cool wow i i mean thank you for being comfortable and showing your emotion oh you're like oh don't worry i'm locking it up right now.

1:22:56Lock it up. I love it. Well, thank you so much for coming on. I look forward to our friendship and meeting your family and, you know, kicking it at the lake house. But I'm also looking forward to it. I'll be there since I'm not filming anymore, apparently. I'm not an actor anymore. She's not an actor anymore. She doesn't want to work. I know, I do want to work. I know. I still want to miss baseball. You're going to work. I'm going to work. You're going to work. Like, you'll be in something. You're going to be in a TV show. We're going to manifest a TV show. Can we manifest that? yes. I want to know.

1:23:28What do you want to manifest? Getting Jason Segel on the show. Harrison Ford. Well, no, that'd be all great. Like, you know, guests on the show would be great. But for me, what it's really about is I do want TV. Yeah, okay. I've always wanted TV. Like a podcast TV? Like, what are you thinking? Are we an actor too? I don't know. I don't know. Everybody says, like, you need to be on TV. yeah so i think for me like how it may start and the way we see it starting is me hosting yeah like like a show and i don't know what it looks like but i also want to do meaningful things so i think you know acting in in some show i think i would love to do that even if it's just my own show and we're we're we're streaming this type of stuff like whatever it is i'm open to it but well don't forget the little people on your way up don't forget me when you get that tv show let's that i'm in like hey there's this no name in florida he's never acted but you have to need his wife i mean i mean oh she won't do it she won't do it she won't do it so you'd have to you'd have to settle for me okay yeah she she won't even come on camera done deal i know i think having an episode with her would be like oh i think that would be like your most downloaded episode i would listen to it i think it would tomorrow yeah yeah i mean i think that it would help people yeah you know but hey i mean if you're not into helping people in their life then you know you don't have to do it it's fine she's helping your daughter with a bloodiness i know seriously that's selfish it's that's just her it's her daughter you have to do it i'm just no no but no again thank you no thank you so much i appreciate you um like i said this but i'll say it again thank you for thinking of me and sure uh having me on i really appreciate it i know your time is valuable and so i do appreciate it well no you're valuable you're a valuable time it's too jesus is this an awkward like that's an awkward moment that's a blooper people that's what they call that take that put that in the outtakes no your time's valuable too and um i just appreciate you being so down to earth and you know again it's like you know reach out to you as someone who's a fan and has watched you in a lot of things and respected your work and now we're friends it's kind of crazy i can't follow back dude follow back yo hashtag that shit so gotta get a getty yeah i gotta get a getty one day one day maybe for our tv show yeah oh there you go full circle out in the universe now let's just work hard and see if it happens but uh so everybody thank you for listening and watching please go watch the movie gaslit by my husband and you will not be disappointed.

1:26:08You know, there's some moments in there that could be really triggering, but it's also real life and it's a true story. And so check out Jana Kramer and that. And if you haven't watched One Tree Hill, go back and watch those things too, because those are awesome. It'll take you about a year, but go for it. It'd take us like two weeks. We get after it. We don't stop when we're tired. We stop when we're done. But anyway, guys, thank you so much for listening. Share the show with somebody you know, love and trust, especially with someone who's gone through some of the things that we talked about today with either emotional or physical abuse, be there for them, share this with them because they aren't alone.

1:26:44And until next time, guys, stay determined.