White Sands: Addiction Recovery Redefined

0:00You're about to make a trade. Which you do you listen to? Is it get optioning those options? Or let's do a little research. Learn more at finra.org slash trade smart. What do you like most about working with White Sands? I think the company culture, I think, empower their employees. OK. It's a well-oiled machine. You know, they have systems in place for certain things that other places don't have. and it's just a great setup and there's great structure. And most of the therapists here have been here for an extended tenure, which says a lot. Lindsay Henry is the VP of clinical services at White Sands, and she's phenomenal at what she does, you know, has a grasp on everything that happens here.

0:42And all of her therapists are tenured by at least five, six, seven, somewhere here, 11 years. Once you have someone here that knows the program, knows how things work, you know, clients get better experiences at that point. I think that's your guy's secret sauce. Everybody's been amazing. Everybody's welcoming. And, you know, I wasn't expecting it. That's pretty much how it's like for the patients to come in, right? They're met with love, letting them know, hey, listen, you're not alone. You know, there is help. And, you know, just kind of grab our hand in a sense. Let us take you through this journey.

1:15What's up, everybody? I got a special one for you today. I'm here on site at White Sands Treatment Center in Fort Myers, Florida. They are our powered by sponsors. So I just want to say thank you again, White Sands, for one heck of a partnership. and collaboration. We're out there helping people get better, helping people get healthy and living better lives. So today I have with me someone that I go way back with, Steven Sundquist, man. So good to see you. Welcome to the show. Appreciate you having me on, man. We finally did it. Dude. I mean, we've talked about it, man. We've talked about it at Ignauseum and finally we found a way.

1:47And so for the viewers, man, you want to work with someone, you want to do some cool stuff, wait for the right moment. Cause if you're paying attention, it'll sneak up and bite you right in the ass and here we are, man. It's cool, dude. I love it. So it's, uh, you know, every now and again, I get to, you know, have conversations, you know, with people that I go way back with. And it's always fun, man, because the energy is different. Right. So, you know, where I was in 2008 or nine, right. I mean, shit, dude, I was living with my mom there. I lost everything prior to the mortgage meltdown. You know, you were dating my sister and that's how we met.

2:20And here we are. So, dude, we had an amazing tour of the facility, you know, prior to us sitting down here today and shooting this episode. What I found most amazing, right? You're driving by on Colonial Road, you see this big building, White Sands Treatment Center. And it's like you see, you know, this building that we're in. I'm like, oh, OK, like that's all it is. but what this place actually is there's nine model homes back there that you can't even see from the street it's like these individuals that get to come to this treatment center um and and recover and heal and get healthy they're living an actual you know life where they can make coffee in their in their house they have a bedroom they can do their laundry in there there's a full-scale cafeteria right over here to my right you walk through those doors is a badass gym that they can go move their body.

3:13So they're working on their mental, spiritual, right. And physical health. I mean, this place is amazing, man. Yeah. It's, um, you know, it's definitely a top option I'd say based on my experience of what I've seen, you know, working in this space after finding myself through recovery, you know, and it's a, it's a safe place. Everybody really cares here and they go the extra mile and the clinical is above average. I'll tell you that, man. Um, you know, there's a, there's a lot of great things white sands has to offer the community for sure. You know, I walked in here, man. And you know, a lot of times when you walk in a place and you got cameras showing up, people kind of look at you sideways, like, who the hell is this guy?

3:49And what are we doing here? Everybody here, I gotta tell you, man, from everybody here on site with Mark, you know, you, Mike, and then even, you know, Casey over there on the other coast, man, I wish she was able to be here today. I was really looking forward to meeting her soon girl you better get your butt over here um but but everybody's been amazing everybody's welcoming and you know i wasn't expecting it yeah and that's that's pretty much how it's like for the patients to come in right they're met with love from the the embrace at the doors you know letting them know hey listen you're not alone you know there is help and you know just kind of grab our hand in a sense let us let us take you through this journey you know and just trust one person if it's one person what do you like most about working with white sands man I think the company culture, I think they empower their employees.

4:38And that's really important to someone like me. But I just think it's a well-oiled machine. They have systems in place for certain things that other places don't have. And it's just a great setup and there's great structure. And there's activities for people to do. They have choices, right? It's not like you have to go here. You know, there's certain groups where they have the ability to pick which ones they want to do based on what they're going through. I think it's really cool. And, you know, I'm going to come back to another point in that, that I want to make. But what I, what I'm digging about this place is that, you know, you talk about structure, but we're also talking about an actual lifestyle because I, and you know, I've never been in recovery and I'm grateful for that.

5:25Right. I've, I've, I've, I've done some messing up in my life. But it never turned into, you know, an addiction or, you know, a long extended lifestyle type situation. But when people think of in-treatment centers, they think of hospital-y environments, sterile environment, you know, someone shoving pills down your throat, being mean to you. But what I've seen here is, and I alluded to it at the beginning of the episode, man, they have community time where they can get out there in a, you know, like a gazebo and sit around in a circle and have some conversation. They can, they all eat in the cafeteria at the same time.

5:59Then they go out and play cornhole and connect for get a lift in, but also not disconnect from their families and have their device time when it's, when it's approved to FaceTime their family and stay connected with the outside as much as possible. I think it's important for people to know that about this place. Yeah. I mean, you know, it's, it's kind of like a thing where, you know, we don't, we don't want to completely disconnect you from your, your lifestyle and your family and friends, but, you know, also having just that fine line with a boundary of, you know, are you applying yourself here for the day?

6:32If you did great, you know, here's your reward in a sense. I think it's great. You know, I didn't have that when I was in treatment and I definitely could have benefited from it. I think. Yeah. So let's talk about that if you don't mind. Like, okay, so I don't remember what year was. I remember you opening up to me about it. I mean, I think it was several years ago. Years run together for me now, dude. I don't even, sometimes I don't even know what freaking month it is. 2017. Okay. So not, not too long ago. Right. What was the deal, man? Oh, man, it stems back to high school for me. You know, I was a great baseball player like yourself and had a lot of potential to play at the next level and had a freak accident happen on the mound.

7:08And that was my introduction of pain pills, took them as prescribed. And essentially, when I healed from my surgery, my arm wasn't nearly as strong. So I only knew myself as Steven, the baseball player. I didn't know who I was without sports, you know, so it was kind of like an identity crisis thing. And I spent the next seven, eight years, you know, searching for that high that I never found, you know, and obviously a lot of hurt, a lot of consequences along the way. And it's just, you know, a lot of, a lot of athletes go through a similar process. I've, I've experienced, you know, with working with others today, you know, it's just, you know, some people, some people, you know, find their calling in a sense in life.

7:47And, and, you know, I feel like, you know, anybody that goes through this process will, will have the same calling in a sense. And that's just to, you know, pay it forward, you know, help the next person in line. That's just what I've done. I've found a great career and, you know, helping people now. And it's just, it's something that found me, you know, based on my experience. You don't find that that often. And we're going to take a quick break to hear from our Powered By sponsor. We're proud to announce a partnership between White Sands Treatment Centers and the Determined Society. With multiple locations across Florida, White Sands provides luxury, top-rated addiction treatment.

8:21from medical detox and inpatient care to outpatient support and long-term aftercare. Their resort-style campuses, expert clinicians, and holistic programs create real, lasting recovery. Together, we're committed to bringing hope, resources, and healing to those who need it most. White Sands Treatment Centers. I think that when you are put in the path where you finally listen to the higher power of going in your path of where you're supposed to be, you fall into it, right? Like I fell into this. It was an accident. Now it's on purpose, right? But, you know, I was really bad at it for a very long time.

9:03And, you know, with you, you know, getting the healing and the treatment that you needed put you on this path to be involved in this amazing treatment center here at White Sands, you know, I want to go back to your experience in treatment. And here's why. because I want the listeners and the viewers to understand the difference because you alluded to it, right? I wish I would have had something like this in my recovery. So what does that look like on the other side of it? Yeah, sure. So, you know, for me, Baton Rouge, Louisiana is where I got sober. Did you know that? I didn't know that. St. Christopher's addiction wellness.

9:37How do you get sober in Baton Rouge, bro? It's our connection now, man. Come on, man. But yeah, I just feel like, you know, obviously over a period of time, like things can become mundane. I just looked at it for what it was, right? I was like, you know, because I had been in treatment a couple of times, I'm, you know, I'm not like a one, one time wonder, you know, I had to fall on my face a couple of times to really feel it. But I feel like, you know, it gets mundane and repetitive. And, you know, you miss your family and friends. And I feel like, you know, like, yeah, I was able to make calls through the therapist's office, you know, like once a week.

10:11But, you know, sometimes it's just nice to check in, you know, just let, let someone know where you're at, you know, someone that knows you for where you've been, you know, so I love the concept here of, you know, how things are done. And obviously, you know, after a certain period of time, you know, the clients are viewed here as guests, you know, because their day's done is kind of what Mike was talking about. I just think that's important for them to feel that, you know, because they feel that sense of responsibility to do the right thing, you know, and you're given a leash in a sense, you know, it's like, you know, show us that you want this, you know, And those are the people that typically get it.

10:46And I just, for me, right, it was just, I came down to a point where I was just like, all right, am I gonna allow this stuff to consume me or am I gonna put an effort to put the action forth of just getting better and not ever having to go back into one of these places again? That's just really what it got to for me, just being sick and tired of being sick and tired, getting the same result every time, wondering why, in a sense. But I realized I never really put forth the effort to be disciplined with my recovery, to be disciplined with other things in life, you know? So that's, uh, that's really where it is for me today.

11:20It's pretty awesome. Cause I can, I can look back and I remember seeing on Facebook and LinkedIn, all of a sudden, you know, you're having new spots, you're doing amazing things, talking about your recovery. I'm like, damn, man, this is brave, you know, in your healing and in your treatment, was Was there any training on kind of how to reintroduce yourself to society and be open and vulnerable about your experience? Yeah, I think it just came down to just walking through that fear and just freeing myself from whatever I thought I was holding back, you know, and that was kind of like the aha moment for me when I shared about some stuff that had been like, kind of swept under the rug over the years, you know, and just voicing that and seeing the feedback from other people that were in the group at the time, like, damn, like, thanks for sharing that, man.

12:10and you helped me so much. It's just like, something clicked for me in that moment, you know? And I was like, wow, okay. I see the importance of the power of my voice and me sharing my truth. You know, it's just touching so many lives. So that's been a constant theme for, you know, most of my sobriety. That's good, man. I'd imagine, you know, white sands is the same thing, right? They, they really prepare people to go out there and feel comfortable and not a for the past. Cause I think, I mean, look, man, let's be honest. Like, you know, we had an off camera conversation just about life situations and how a lot of times people hold you hostage who you were at that time.

12:44How is it for people, you know, coming out of white sands and even for yourself, reintroducing yourself back into society and people have that label on you, right? Or might, you know, cause, cause for me, dude, I didn't know that. I didn't know that about you. Like it wasn't like an overall, like arguing, like this dude is, you know, addicted to, uh, you know, medication, right. It wasn't in my circle. Like I didn't, I had no idea, but my, my long windy question is, is actually pretty simple. I'm just having a hard time getting to the point, which a lot of times I do, right. I ramble, but, but it's like the people that come out, right.

13:22And they feel like this new lease on life and they get back into the same circle potentially. And the people on the outside hold their past against them. That can't be good for them. No, I think it just comes down to, right, you re-evaluating, you know, what's important in your life like I had to do. And I still do it like every year, right? It's like a thing that's just become naturally. It's like, you know, if it's not serving you, unfortunately, it's not really as important in your life as it once was. And that goes for friend groups and places to hang out and just things change, you know, and it just comes down to what is adding to your recovery.

13:58You know, if someone's, you know, talking negatively about you all the time and they're probably not the best for you to have in your life. You know, so my friends groups changed over the years, obviously, you know, I'm not finding myself hanging out in bars anymore and things like that, but it's just, you know, things change. So, uh, you know, here, you know, is there, is there with some of the treatments here and then even, I mean, there's outpatient therapy. So I want to be clear, this is just not an inpatient facility where you come to detox for 10 days. You can become a guest here for 30 days and there's outpatient stuff.

14:30There's family counseling, right? There's a bunch of different things. Do you, do you guys prepare them for the potential, like, Hey, this, this is like, this could be imminent that you're changing friend groups and you're going to have to leave people behind. Yeah. There's, um, constant redirection with that, you know, preparing for discharge. Obviously there's a whole process that we do before someone is ready to discharge. We're going to make sure that they have resources lined up for them to have that support and accountability. But yeah, man, it's a, it's, it's something that's always being addressed, you know, and it gets brought up in groups too.

15:04They'll have process groups where everyone will give feedback around, you know, the things that, you know, they're talking about like that. I think it's important, right? Because when you're in treatment and you're healing to have that open conversation about going back out there and the adjustments that you may have to make in your life, I think it's really cool for people, especially here i mean you know and again we got a lot of video of this place man i can see this place as people hanging out you know when it's wreck time being like you know what i'm really scared about this when i leave here and it could be this conversation that one person's vulnerability you know about their fears opens up everybody else to talk about it and then all of a sudden become like a community and support group that when they do get reintroduced back into their normal lives, they're able to call on each other, man, and go over these things.

15:59Yeah. That was probably one of the most beneficial times, right? Just conversing with the community and conversing with the support staff, like we were talking about out there. Those were some of the best conversations I had in treatment. And eventually it's cool to see where the other clients or guests, you know, they're, they're able to hold another client accountable, you know, for, for where they're at. And that's the, that's the coolest part about this whole thing. Well, the thing that I really love too, about this place is not just the bells and whistles, man. It's the people that work here.

16:34I, again, I alluded to it earlier, but most people in here that work here have gone through it. Now, everybody always says, what do I do in this world? Like who am I most equipped to help? And the answer always is you're equipped to help and support the person you once were. Exactly. Yeah. I mean, that's a mission here. You know, like you, you can't lead people from their hell, you know, out of their personal hell or their personal jail, unless you've been through it. Cause you don't have, you don't have any sympathy. Like I couldn't, I couldn't do it. Not because I wouldn't want to, but like, I don't have the reference.

17:15I don't have the experience in this. Yeah. Those are, those are the things that I love to touch on, man. And, and, and talk about on, you know, platforms and stages like that vulnerability piece, man. Like if, if I didn't tell somebody, they probably wouldn't know I had been through that today. You know, whereas, you know, I can literally bring up the exact emotions, the exact feelings of how it feels to be stuck in that place and a slave to a substance, you know, and it's just, that's the relatability factor that sometimes can help people get through those early phases because I know that I couldn't have done it if someone else hadn't came to me and said, Hey, listen, I've been through this, you know, just, I'm going to take you through this, you know, just trust me, you know?

17:57Well, I'm interested because I've, like I said before, I've never been, you know, addicted to a substance to where it has a stranglehold on me. what goes on psychologically when you're in the middle of it, you know, you need to stop because it's potentially going to ruin your life or lose your life. And then, you know, still go and like, okay, well last one, right. This is my last one. I would imagine there's a lot of that, but psychologically, what, what do you go through during that? Just, uh, it's, it's like a never ending rat race, man. You know, you, you can have the best intentions one day and wake up, say, you know what, I'm not going to do it today.

18:30And then, you know, an hour or two later goes by and some, something happens, right. Um, out of our control, like most things are in life. And, you know, that's, uh, then it restarts the insanity in your head where you can't get that obsession out of your head until you put one in your body. And, and, you know, that, that is the stuff that people want to hear, right. Of just like how to break through that, you know, and typically, you know, there's never a good time that's, you know, you're going to align that says, you know, today's the day I'm going to go get help. It never happened like that for me.

19:02But, you know, I can tell you if you're, if you're in that place, you're feeling stuck, there is a better way out. And there are people like us that are willing to help at any given moment, but it's, it's just, uh, it's an insane cycle, man. It's just, you know, you, you, you, you can try to trick yourself any which way on, okay, I'm going to use just on the weekends or I'm going to use only on Friday or, you know, and it, it'll never, it'll never, you'll never, you'll never get out of it like that. You know, it's, it's, it's crazy to me because, you know, now it's different. And what I mean by that is I want everybody to hang on here.

19:37One pill can literally kill you now. A hundred percent. So, you know, back in 17, you know, granted you're probably getting prescribed or whatever, but you know, people getting, you know, these pills on the streets, it can literally kill them. Story for you. two years ago in in july two years it was two years in july my former first baseman at canterbury evan ames uh had an injury at chipotle junior college where he dislocated his elbow and he was in a lot of pain and in my humble opinion he rushed back he should not have played that that same year and he did he did okay um but you know he came home for the summer right had his 20th birthday or something like that in June.

20:20And, you know, he was going through a lot of and his prescription ran out and he went down to San Carlos, you know, Fort Myers got one and, uh, there was, there was six pills in there and he took a quarter of one. He died. And I just, Oh, it was definitely fentanyl. Oh, one, one billion percent was fentanyl. So, you know, all to say, you know, and again, there was, they, they found what was in there, and there was only a quarter of a pill missing. He wasn't abusing it. An addict would have taken one or two. He took a quarter of it and he had a dirty pill. And it's something that I feel like it needs some major awareness because it could be one time.

21:03There's kids, there's kids that are in college that are under so much stress, like I just need some Adderall. So they go buy Adderall and it kills them because it's laced with a deadly dose of fentanyl. So this is a big problem in our country. How do you think that, I mean, I don't want to get political, but I know there's different things going on in Texas. We're trying to keep fitting a lot of the country and everything like that. But man, in my day, or your day, if we were doing something like that, there was no such thing. Yeah, they're counterfeiting Xanax pills. I've even heard of it being laced in some marijuana for, you know, some, some, some of the, you know, adolescents to get ahold of, man, it's, it's terrible.

21:52But yeah, the, there's, there's so many counterfeit pills all over the place. I've lost so many people to, you know, that stuff too, man. It's just, it's insane. But yeah, there, there's gotta be something that, that can be done to prevent that. And it is political. I mean, it is political, right? But I mean, fuck it. Let's go there. It's like, why are we not? It's just like school shootings, right? Not just like it, but it's like, we're talking about two things that are very deadly, right? I want Navy SEALs or retired veterans at every entrance of every school on the roofs. Like you see someone come on, it's like, boom, you're done.

22:25Like why risk the life, right? Same thing with Fennel. We know it's killing people, but we're not doing anything about it. Or we may be, I mean, but it's, it takes a while to get it out, right? I think now current administration is doing very focused on it. Much more, yeah. Very focused on it, right? But dude, it is a scary thing, man. And to your point about marijuana, I was having this conversation with my wife one day. I'm like, when we were kids, if we decided to do something stupid, you know, out behind the portables or whatever, or, you know, with your buddies at a party, which was never what I did, right?

23:02And I was always hitting in the garage until my hands bled. So that was my excuse not to go out and do stupid shit. It's like, no, I just got to get better. So I'm not doing that. But now you do something stupid like that, you could die. And so it begs the question, right? Like that substance is readily available out on the street, but also in dispensaries. It's almost like I would I would rather it, you know, like a 21, 21 year old kid when he's 21 to walk into a dispensary and get it and not die. But I know we're not here promoting the legalization of marijuana. But my point is. It it it could save them from getting a dirty dose or a dirty dime sack.

23:45Is that what they call it? It's like playing Russian roulette in a sense out there with the drug dealers on the street, man. You don't know what you're going to get. I mean, I know they got like these fentanyl testing kits. but how many are they accurate i don't know i mean who knows i never used one so i don't know wow man i don't think it was even a thing back then was it uh fentanyl was was slowly making its way towards the end of 2017 for me there was uh there's a couple of times where i feel like there was some stuff that i had that was pressed for sure wow man wow it's scary yeah it is it's carry.

24:17Yeah. To be honest with you, I mean, I'll be real when I'm in that place, like I didn't care about living or dying, you know, it was just about getting the next one. That's how crazy this is. Go on that because it's, you, you just get to this place where you're just, you lose all control and you need that fix to, to feel like you can survive, you know? And it's just, you just don't care, you know? And like, obviously like if I would have been real, I really didn't want to die at the time, but you know, it's just like the emotions and just how dead you feel inside, you know, just, I didn't care at a time.

24:51Like, you know, yeah. It's kind of like, I'm going to do this. And if that's my fate, that's my fate. And then I'm out of pain. Right. Yeah. Yeah. Does that ever cross your mind? Yeah, it did. But I always played it forward. Right. And thought of like my family or, you know, my daughter now, you know, like that's a, that's a whole nother ball game, you know, but that, that would be a, that would be tragic you know and i never wanted to leave my family with that thank god it never happened but you know yeah yeah it's heavy man you know what i mean because i don't know what it's like you know like i know i know at a very small scale like i think truly there was a food addiction but not the same yeah yeah not the same but i can also relate to i just need that cookie And then I'd eat that cookie and then I would have more and more and more and I would binge.