The Power of Visualization: How Fighters Plan for Victory Feat. Michael Chandler

In short

Podcast Summary: The Ed Mylett Show - The Power of Visualization: How Fighters Plan for Victory Feat. Michael Chandler

Episode Overview In this episode of The Ed Mylett Show, host Ed Mylett brings together four elite minds in fighting and mental performance to explore the themes of preparation, resilience, and mindset in achieving success. Guests include Michael Chandler (UFC fighter), Mikey Garcia (world champion boxer), Tim Grover (legendary mindset coach), and David Goggins (author and former Navy SEAL). The episode highlights how visualization, accountability, and an obsessive drive are crucial to winning not just in sports but across all areas of life.

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Key Themes and Discussions

The Power of Visualization
Mikey Garcia's Insights:
Visualization goes beyond imagining success; it includes anticipating challenges (e.g., knockdowns, injuries) and planning responses.
This mental preparedness helps fighters stay calm and focused in high-pressure situations.

Michael Chandler's Approach:
Chandler discusses the importance of visualization in preparing for fights, including rehearsing enemy strategies and outcomes.
He emphasizes the mental aspects of handling media pressure and how to conserve mental energy leading up to a fight.

Handling Pressure and Competition
Tim Grover's Perspective:
Grover shares the difference between athletes who merely compete versus those who win consistently.
He argues that true winners are often driven by an obsessive focus that can be misinterpreted as a flaw.

David Goggins' Philosophy:
Goggins discusses overcoming self-imposed limits and the necessity of confronting one's past to unleash potential.
He emphasizes resilience and the need to push beyond pain and discomfort to achieve greatness.

The Role of Obsession and Accountability
Obsession as a Key to Success:
The guests agree that a relentless focus on goals is crucial for sustained success.
Obsession is portrayed as a driving force that compels individuals to work harder and longer than others.

Accountability:
The importance of holding oneself accountable is underscored throughout the discussion.
Each guest shares personal experiences where accountability has played a role in their success and resilience.

Application Beyond Fighting
Broader Implications:
The lessons shared by the fighters and coaches extend beyond the ring or field; they apply to business, personal development, and overcoming life's challenges.
Emphasis is put on the idea that winning is a mindset that can be cultivated, regardless of the domain.

Key Takeaways
Preparation and Visualization:
Think strategically about both success and challenges; visualize overcoming obstacles.

Mental Toughness:
Embrace discomfort and the pain of hard work as part of the journey to success.

Obsession and Focus:
A healthy obsession with your goals is necessary for extraordinary achievement.

Relentless Accountability:
Hold yourself accountable to ensure you stay on track with your aspirations.

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Conclusion This episode not only provides insights into the minds of elite fighters but also serves as a motivational guide for listeners seeking to enhance their own performance in various aspects of life. The discussions around visualization, preparation, and accountability offer practical steps for anyone looking to overcome obstacles and achieve success. The overarching message reinforces the idea that winning is not solely reserved for the talented, but rather for those who are relentless in their pursuit of excellence.

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Call to Action

Reflect on how you can apply the principles of visualization and accountability in your life.
Consider what "one more" means in your daily routine and how you can incorporate that mindset to achieve your goals.

Feedback What part of this episode resonated with you the most? Share your thoughts and insights in the comments!

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This summary captures the essence of the episode while providing key insights and takeaways for listeners to implement in their own journeys toward success.

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Transcript

Automatic transcript. May contain errors.

0:28So, hey, guys, listen, we're all trying to get more productive. $10 ,000 worth of courses that are in there that come with the app. Also, some of the top influencers in the world are all posting content in there on a regular basis, like having the Avengers of personal development and business in one app. And I'm honored that he asked me to be a part of it as well and contribute on a weekly basis, and I do. So go over there and get signed up. You're going to get a free tuition-free voucher to go to an event with Brendan and myself and a bunch of other influencers as well. So you get a free event out of it also.

0:53So go to growthday.com forward slash ed. That's growthday.com forward slash ed.

1:04This episode brought to you by Progressive Insurance. Do you ever find yourself playing the budgeting game? Shifting a little money here, a little there, and hoping it all works out? Well, with the Name Your Price tool from Progressive, you can get a better budgeter and potentially lower your insurance bill too. You tell Progressive what you want to pay for car insurance and they'll help find you options within your budget. Try it today at Progressive.com. Progressive Casualty Insurance Company and Affiliates. Price and coverage match limited by state law. Not available in all states.

1:45This is the Ed Milet Show. Hey everyone, welcome to my weekend special. I hope you enjoy the show. Be sure to follow the Ed Milet Show on Apple and Spotify. Links are in the show notes. You'll never miss an episode that way. The young man I'm going to introduce to you is, he's like a second son to me. I'm honored when he calls me dad. He's one of the greatest fighters in the world, in the UFC, but he's really one of the greatest people that I've ever met. I love him dearly. He's a good man. The great Michael Chandler. Michael, welcome to the show. What's up, dad, man? And thank you for the kind intro.

2:24You are the man. Oh, here's my surprise for you, Mr. Chandler. I have my really, really good friend joining us today, everybody and Michael. This is Mikey Garcia, who is a four-time, he's a boxing champion, four-division champion. Mikey, thanks for jumping in, brother. Yeah, thank you. Thank you. And Michael, pleasure to meet you, brother. So, bro, I'm just curious, Mikey, if you're talking, you've had these huge fights. In fact, I've been at Texas Stadium with this dude in front of 50 ,000 people. I mean, he's had huge, huge fights. Is it different in a big fight, Mikey? Like anything you would say to Michael, you know, mentally, is there anything different when it's a huge high-profile fight as opposed to, you know, something that, no offense to any of great boxers, but some casino on the come up compared to, you know, a big arena, a Vegas fight or whatever, did that affect your mentality?

3:13Did you look at the fight differently or is it just another fight? Look, you've been in it, you know, your whole life. You know, I was in it since I was a little kid. So I always took each fight as a big fight because I knew, you know, winning one fight would lead to the next and move my career forward. So getting to the big arena, to the big stage, you know, you talked about, you know, AT &T Stadium, you know, in Texas, you know, and 50 ,000 people there. But to me, it was just another night. I worked my whole life to get there. And I think, you know, I was just excited to finally make it to that, you know, stage to the highest, you know, in my career.

3:55And what I did do a lot is I visualized that a lot. I visualized the fight. I visualized, you know, training. I visualized, you know, every scenario during the fight, winning or losing rounds, you know, overcoming challenges in the fight, a cut, a knockdown, whatever it could be. I would always visualize, you know, and that went for every fight, but especially on the big one, because I didn't want anything to be, you know, out of, you know, my norm to scare me or timid me in any way, you know. So for me, it was visualizing everything, the ring walk, you know, the introduction to the fight, just so that I could have that already in my head.

4:37when I experienced it, it wasn't as new. It was already there before. I had already logged it in. I've already seen myself in front of that kind of attendance, that kind of crowd. And I just felt comfortable. I felt normal. It felt like another day. The training obviously was harder. The training was more vigorous for the training camp and longer weeks and all that because I was fighting a bigger guy. I was fighting a bigger man in the ring on fight night. So I had to prepare a little differently. But mentally, I was, you know, strong. It was like a normal thing. Like, I just need to be here. I visualized every round.

5:17Even though the fight didn't go the way I originally wanted to, that was my first loss. But I walked out of that 100 % healthy, fine. We hung out the next day. We flew back together. We flew back together. You could tell. My mindset was sharp as ever. I was still, you know, confident. I was still having plans for the future and it didn't, it didn't send me back. You know, it wasn't ever like that. So that's, that's where I got. Let me ask you, by the way, does that sound familiar, Michael, about the visualization? By the way, all of you, this is a gift you're getting today that, you know, I didn't intend to give you publicly.

5:50And I don't know that I'll put all this out either, by the way, but to have two gladiators talk to one another like this about it. What's, and by the way, Mikey and I did fly back after that fight together. there and i was like just struck by how calm he was like sorry bro we're gonna another one we're gonna do this we're gonna do that but mikey what was interesting about what you just said and michael i'll let you ask mikey anything you want to that's why i brought him here today but mikey you would actually visualize negatives too you're okay with visiting i lost around or whatever i'm interested in that um you think that was an okay thing because i do as well might as well i mean you're gonna lose a round you're gonna get hit something bad's gonna happen to avoid thinking about it, to me, seems sort of silly.

6:32Why not become familiar with it so you can respond? Is that why you would do it? Yes, it's just so that you don't get nervous or panic if something does happen during the fight. It better be well-prepared for any scenario, including a knockdown or a cut, something of that nature. But no matter what I envisioned or I visualized, I always came out the winner. I would always visualize myself winning at the end of the night. whether it was I lost a couple rounds or it was a tough fight. I got dropped in one of the rounds, but I got up and I know how to react and I know how to continue with the remainder of rounds and always winning at the end of the night.

7:12In other instances, different fights, I did get dropped on two separate occasions, but I knew what to do. I knew how to react. I had already planned how to even get up from a knockdown. I didn't want to get up in any way that would make the referee think that I was hurt and stop the fight. So I purposely figured how to position myself, how to take my time, how to take a knee first, and then slowly, gradually walk up and then walk a little bit towards the neutral corner, give my opponent more space, more space, so that when the fight resumed, I wasn't right in front of him. And he's attacking me.

7:51I give him more space. You know, so I would visualize that and prepare myself. I didn't do it in training camp where I would purposely go down and get up. No, but I would do it here, you know, training my mind to be able to react in those scenarios. If I got cut, I knew exactly to signal my corner, let them know that I was cut so they could prepare the medicine. So as soon as the end of the round was there, you know, the bell rang, I was already close to my corner. In fact, a lot of the rounds, I would walk close to my corner at the 10-second count. I'd walk close to my corner, so in case there was anything, they'd be the first ones to attend me, while my opponent still has to walk all the way across to his corner.

8:30Those are a few seconds extra that I will have that my opponent doesn't have. So I would practice all this. What I want everybody to get, whether you're an entrepreneur or you're an athlete, or I want Michael, too, for this, is the specificity of preparation. right the specific to think that you would actually and in michael's case it's not quite as easy if he's on the ground but the specific thing that you're actually edging towards your corner early to get those extra seconds of cuts now one thing you were great this is more like inside stuff for michael one of the things mikey was most well known for in boxing was his ability to go in with a game plan for the fight because his brother's the greatest trainer in the world and so they had a game plan for the fight but mid-fight mid-round begin to pick up on tendencies that he didn't see on film in other words react when things don't go the way he expected them to go Michael right but that was I think Mikey you correct me if I'm wrong I think that was actually your greatest strength in the ring was your ability to adapt to a dude whatever you saw that night first am I right about that and two any insight for him let's say he gets in there with Connor, right?

9:37He's got to have a game plan. We're not going to say what it is, but like most fights, you know, like Tyson says, everything can change when you get punched in the mouth or just Connor comes in there with something totally different, right? Connor's going to throw some things at him. He hasn't seen before. How were you, were you consciously thinking as you're going, or is it some depth perception thing you're using a feel thing? Like what would you do to read him? Look, I'm, I'm looking at my opponent, you know, I'm taking the first round or two rounds to study my opponent the way i study my opponent is i i feel his his speed i let him punch a few times to be able to time the the reaction you know time the the speed of the punches and and also timing his defense so i'll jab a couple times and see how fast he can either block or or dodge the punch so i can make my adjustments as the rounds go by second round i'm still feeling him out but Maybe by the third round, I already have a good idea of what to do.

10:36However, things can change. Like you just mentioned, things can change. So I prepared myself to be able to adapt. And as the rounds kept going, I'm also listening to the guy's breathing. I'm listening to the way his body, his posture. Are his hands still up high and has he still got the same intensity behind it? Or is he starting to slow down? Is he starting to wear out? Are we tying up? if we're hugging, if we're tying up, is he trying to let loose to continue fighting or is he just kind of trying to rest now? It's an eighth round. Maybe he's just resting a little bit, you know. So I'm paying attention to all that.

11:09And at the same time, I'm figuring out what I got to do to keep countering his, you know, fight, his game. If he's changing something, if he's still on it, if he's still trying to do something, okay, maybe I got to box a little bit more. Maybe I got to pressure. so all that training came from being in shape in the gym training hard in the gym all those weeks of training you know all that there's days in sparring sessions where i would box 12 rounds beautiful footwork beautiful speed counter punch for 12 rounds so that i knew i can do that for 12 rounds on fight night but then there was other days where i would switch it where i'd be fighting you know eight rounds solid forward pressure pressure in case i needed to do that on fight I know I'm capable of doing that as well.

11:56So training, I would do all that. I would do all that in training. A lot of people would say, well, some of that he's got time because there's 12 rounds. But there's a ton of guys in the UFC that are spending time reading. I think of Izzy. He does that. He's reading cadence. He's reading speed. He's reading pace. John Jones. St. Pierre did it. This is done in the UFC as well. They're pacing themselves in the round. These are just things for Michael as he's ready for the fight. that I want him to at least have the gift of in considering. And then just, you know, for back and forth, was there anything?

12:28And then Michael, I'll let you ask him something, anything, um, press wise that week, this is more of like an inside thing, but like big fights, there's more press, there's more demands on your time, particularly fight week. Right. And I mean, can you imagine McGregor Chandler, what the press demands will be that week? Did you, I mean, it's one of the biggest fights in the history of the sport. So, So anything you did to mentally stay a particular way or pace yourself or that you would think of in dealing with, just even press for the week of the fight? The press, the media is going to be tough.

13:04It's going to be rough. Everybody's going to be pulling you left and right. Everybody wants, you know, 10 minutes of your time. And you're obligated, you know, to some extent. You have to give, you know, press. You got to give the media some time. You got to give them interviews. It's part of promoting. It's part of being professional at that level. But what I used to do was any moments that I had free time, I'd go rest. I would always make sure I'd get enough rest. Even if it was only a 20, 30-minute little nap, even if you don't go to sleep, but just laying down, chilling, and resting your eyes for those 20, 30 minutes will help.

13:44At the end of the day, your number one goal is to perform and fight on Saturday night, on fight night. to the best of your capabilities. The media can wait a little bit. The media can be put to the side. You got to give them a little bit, but it's not all that matters. The number one thing is winning the fight. That's number one. So you got to give them some time. Yeah, it's part of promoting part of the business, part of marketing the fight. But every moment that I had, every hour, every 30 minutes that I had, I'd go take a break. I'd go take a nap because that would really, really help me continue my day and keep the energy.

14:17It's exhausting to be in front of media, repeating the same shit over and over and over and over. And you have to have the smile and the same energy. You're exerting a lot of energy over the days. You may not be working out as hard anymore because now it's chill week, it's lighter work. Until you've got to cut weight, you're kind of slowing down on the pace of the training. But the whole media, the whole press, it's exhausting. So take all the time that you have to rest your body. Like I said, at the end of the day, if you really don't feel like doing every single interview, you don't have to.

14:51You don't feel so good. I'm not doing that one. I'm only doing the ones that really, really matter because I'm contractually obligated. I'll do that. You know, the network or the main ones. After that, hey, I'm done. I'm resting because I want to win the fight. Yeah, these are all things, by the way, everybody, and let's just be clear. Michael's had tons of huge fights. Madison Square Garden. I mean, he's fought in the biggest arena in the world, just like Mikey has, right? He's done this. But everyone listening to this that's getting an inside peek of what top athletes in the world think about and talk about.

15:18Same thing comes in business. Sometimes you've got to say no to meetings because you've got a big close at the end of the week. You've got to be your best and peak at that moment, right? So these are all the same principles. Mikey, Michael, rather, all the big fights you've had, I just wanted to put someone almost the same sport but a little bit different to just have you think about it just from a little bit out of the box but still in the same box type thing. Both of you guys have had the biggest fights in the world. You've both won them. This fight, Michael, rather, is going up in weight a little bit per his own decision, so cutting won't be as bad.

15:53You went up in weight too, Mikey, four different times. Michael, anything you want to ask Mikey before I let him go so we can have the rest of the show and talk, but anything you want to ask him? Yeah, I mean, more than anything, I love the piggyback off of, you know, what you were saying about the visualization. I mean, just for the audience listening and even hearing it from a world-class guy like Mikey, who I have watched on TV so many times, knowing that before going into that fight during the visualization, it isn't all just about success. It's also about overcoming obstacles, right? Because who doesn't want to be able to see themselves knowing that, you know, you're going to be in the trenches taking grenades and you're going to be able to get through them and how you're going to react and respond and seeing yourself become victorious, even when there is a little bit of adversity, as well as, you know, we're not there yet to fight week yet.

16:45Next week I've got to go out to New York for a full day to do some press stuff. The press is about to start picking up. And I think for me, realizing that I have such a great crowd of witnesses, I've had big fights, but this is even bigger. So, therefore, it's even more of a conviction to show up with a smile on my face as much as I can, but also be selfish when I need to, to take a little bit of time and maybe say no to a couple of them where you're like, yeah, this one's not exactly, you know, one of the big ones, you know. But no, that insight of even just like thinking about and your highlights and the fights that I've seen you in and thinking about that man because you've always just been that man, that dominant guy out there, but then also hearing those little idiosyncrasies about the visualization and all the different things that you looked at and watched and played inside of your head, even leading into those fights.

17:40And they weren't always positive, but they always ended with your hand getting raised. Mikey, I got to tell you, man, I'm really grateful you did this today, bro. Like, you know, you didn't need to do it immediately, Michael, just so you know. Immediately I asked Mikey, he's like, yep, I got you. He was in New York. He's like, I got it. I'll make it happen. I had to change the time on him. He's like, no problem, bro. And the other thing everybody should know, and I talk about this, Michael, all the time, Mikey saved his money. Mikey saved his money. All you athletes listening. And that's why he's real casual on a T-shirt.

18:08And me and Chandler are still working right now. Chandler saved his money too. But Mikey saved his money. And he's a young, wealthy man. Bunch of real estate. He's done really, really well for himself. So I love you, brother. Thank you for jumping in. I appreciate it. I'll text you when we're done here. Let me know. Thanks, Ed. And I want to wish you the very best, Michael. You know, we know how gangster you are. We know you're such a badass you are. You got this. I mean, you've been training your whole life for this. there's nothing more that we got to give you much more tips on fighting. You've done it.

18:39You just got to go in there and take care of business, brother. I wish you the very best. I'll be checking it out. Thank you so much, man. I appreciate you, man. I'm going to have Ed connect us. I'll do it today. I'll connect you when we're done. You're the man, Mikey. I appreciate you, brother. We'll go get some dinner after your fight. Hey, what did you say? Julio's? Where do you want to take? We're going to go to Javier's but you're going to win this fight. You're going to win a fight and you're going to buy us dinner. so that's what i got that i got you guys all right brother take care mikey thank you all right how cool was that bro was that cool it's so cool man absolute warrior i mean that was the thing too obviously phenomenal technician phenomenal at boxing but also just a warrior man like it's and obviously like you said different sports but they're the same it's it's hand-to-hand combat whether it's wrestling boxing kickboxing these hand-to-hand combat competitions man yep And one of the things that you all should know that, you know, kind of inside baseball stuff that Mikey and I work on and that Michael and I work on is visualization.

19:36A lot of you ask about that, but it's like really detailed stuff and it's okay to visit failure. It's okay to visit a down cycle. And in fact, I think it's really important because then you can program yourself out of it. So anyway, I just wanted to have you visit with him for a minute and have the audience listen to the two of you.

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21:15I got him right there. That's Goggins, everyone. number one requested guest you don't know this for my show the last two years is you really yeah yeah really honored this is a gentleman who completed Navy SEAL training Army Ranger training Air Force TAC P training I believe he's the only person in history to do that sir this is a guy did three hell weeks 60 plus ultra marathons well run with broken bones for 30 miles to get into one of the mega ultra marathons and a lot of people calling him the toughest man alive but i'm excited because i get to call on my friend now i've enjoyed this conversation so much and i think you guys are going to join the on-camera one so this is goggins everybody i appreciate you having me man thank you thank you start a little bit with like how you grew up because i think that's part of the story well um my dad so i grew up in buffalo new york my my dad really helped create this i'm not giving him credit yeah like oh he was a great dad like clap my hands for his ass he helped create this because he was just that he was a devil you know he was a guy that had to be very insecure very beat down something had to happen to him when he was younger because the the way he treated me my brother my mom was just horrible so he would beat us my mom my brother my me and i'm not talking about like oh you got in trouble something to give you whipping when he would he was a drunk okay so whenever he woke up man he woke up drinking went to bed drinking and that's just how it was and he get drunk he just got violent so my mom caught my dad cheating we got home about four o 'clock in the morning so i'm about seven eight years old and i hear some ruckus outside my room as i'm getting ready to bed down for the night and my mom and dad are outside my room because there's a staircase right there and my dad is smacking the hell out of my mom and knocks her almost unconscious where she's kind of out of it.

23:11You know, she's kind of loopy. She falls down. He grabs her by her hair and drives her downstairs by her hair. And so at this age, I'm starting thinking, man, you know, what the fuck should I do, man? Like, you know, I'm scared, but then something in me is saying, you got to go and do something. Oh my gosh. But I'm scared to death of this guy because he's been beating the shit out of me since I can remember. And I mean, like, laying me out for nothing. and I'm sitting thinking man okay man like I what am I gonna do so my brother he and I were very different when my brother would see the fighting he would go to this room and hide I didn't do that I always stuck around so this time I stuck around I decided to help her out so I go on the stairs and I jump on his back and literally he tells my mom you're raising a gangster as she's like on the floor and he's almost smiling almost like proud but that smile went to a frown pretty quick and he beat the living hell out of me and he beat me literally from my neck down to my ankles like black and blue so the next morning um i was gonna go to school half today my mom woke up and she pulled the covers back and what she saw was how bruised i was and so when she pulled the covers back and saw a bruise that was, I'll never forget looking at her face because she used to write letters for me, you know, for me and my brother to miss PE because we were so bruised up from getting beaten.

24:37So, you know, hey, he's sick or whatever. And so, you know, she was lying a lot for my dad. So this particular day, she didn't write a letter. But when I laid in the bed and looked at my mom, she pulled the covers back. I'll never forget looking at her face and her face is tattooed in my brain and why i say that um this past year i got the vfw award for americanism award and if you google david goggins vfw award i'm in front of 5 000 veterans and i'm getting this amazing award john mccain got it and i'm up here thinking man i'm up here getting this award this is amazing it's for giving back and also having a great military career and i could give this six minute long speech and I'm up there man I'm talking and I'm thinking I'm thinking people who help me out I get to my mom she's sitting back you know she's sitting right here on stage but behind me and I haven't cried in 30 years I can't even picture it haven't cried in 30 years I don't do that and I turn around and say and I want to thank my mom for um not picking me up when I was knocked down but teaching me how to get up because she never picked me up ever because her circumstances sucked.

25:46So anyway, I look back and I said that and when I got done, I didn't even get a chance to say it. I looked at her eyes and my head went right back to her face when she saw me bruised up. And that fucked me up. And for 58 seconds, look at the video and you'll see me, my head's down and I'm sobbing. Wow. And I'm in front of 5 ,000 vets and the guy who was hosting the thing had to come up to me and put his hand on my back. And I was just destroyed, overcome with emotion. And then 58 seconds go by and I get up and I deliver this speech. And so I tell you that because my life tattooed me. And so when I came from Buffalo, I was eight years old.

26:36I didn't have one learning disability. I had several. But I hid all this shit. I never talked about my dad being crazy or I couldn't read. I couldn't write. I get held back in my second grade. So now we move. My mom now finds the courage to move to the small town called Brazilian. Was that beating the catalyst that made you leave? That was a catalyst. And that's probably why you flash back to that second. Okay, I got you. So basically that next morning. So this will happen that that beating happened and maybe two days later My mom's in the living room while my dad's in the kitchen talking to one of his girls my mom walks in the kitchen with me and my brother sitting in our you know standard locations at the table my dad at the head of the table me my brother's side of the table and there's a phone behind my dad he always talked on the phone smoking cigarette drinking his scotch and he's talking to one of his girls on the phone and my mom walks in and this is where she was at mentally she walked in looked at me my brother and she said you guys can come or you guys can stay but i'm getting the fuck out of here oh god and so she was broke like she was just broken and i got my shit and i packed i was gone quick my brother was kind of like what should i do so long story short he ends up coming with us to brazilianna but he didn't want to come we had car trouble it's all in the book he had car trouble all kind of shit happened but we finally get to brazilianna let me jump in real quick first off when he says the book everybody i've read a lot of books my favorite thing about you obviously there's this things we're going to get into in a little bit here that are just remarkable about you that you've achieved actually i don't think are remarkable about you i think you found remarkable spaces in your own mind that other people could also find right but i think it's remarkable you found them given these circumstances well said but but the book that he's referring to guys is can't hurt me and when you read this book everybody i'm telling you these stories like he's telling them now they jump like I read the whole book in one day wow and the reason is is because I was so fascinated with you in the first place but it's a it's I think it's almost like a documentary into what can build somebody like you but it like for me people that are listening to this especially you young people that listen to it and I know some of the language is strong but I just want y 'all to understand something no matter what you're going through right now whether you're seven years old or 77 years old those things don't define you this man what you're about to hear is incredible what he's turned himself into from a dad who was in those conditions to I think your mom was great right but you've sort of said mom wasn't ever again completely herself after those situations right then he goes into school has a learning disabilities behind because he wasn't going to school kind of starts just lying and cheating to get his way through school stuttered stutter stuttered stuttered bad like my my elementary years I stuttered so bad I had these white splotches all over my skin I had patches of hair falling out of my head out of Like stress?

29:27Stressed. I was so stressed out from my childhood. And then now I'm in this situation where I'm like, God, man, I'm dumb. I'm not smart. And now I'm like this black kid amongst all these white people. And it just made me feel just fucked up. And my mom was working three jobs. We lived in a$7 a month place. She was never home. And I was like, but I didn't want to put my troubles on my mom. before that my soon-to-be stepdad got murdered one incident that really shocked my mind was it was christmas so picture everything i talked about this is my seventh grade year we're about to go out for um you know so school so so so christmas breaks about to happen and so here we are we had elementary to junior high that rode our bus and we pull up in front of the junior high school and the bus lets out but not yet this kid who missed the bus he missed the bus because he had some cookies for the bus driver he goes over and i tell a story because this story it me up so bad and this this kid mom brought him to school and i see them pull up i'm in the back of the bus and i'm in the very back right by the back wheel facing the parking lot the parking lot is probably 20 feet wide and 15 buses are lined up and we all open the bus doors the same time we all get out so the kid i see him the mom yells over you forgot something he obviously forgot the cookies he goes back gets the cookies i look forward the bus moves forward maybe this much next thing i know i'm hearing this lady screaming top of her lungs pulling like at her hair this is just yanking at her hair this screaming bloody murder and i'm looking over the same lady that called a little board like what the hell and she's looking down under my tire and so i see these things on my window and i don't know what they were but they were like little splots so you know how the old bus school you know the buses have little things you push and you pull window down i pushed me i looked down looking at her and her face her eyes are looking right down underneath my tire and i'm like what the hell is she looking at so i looked down and this kid's head was this flat.

31:39And his eyes were bugged out of his head. And I tell you that story because a year, almost exactly a year later, the same exact time frame, the day after Christmas, my mom soon to be stepped, my mom soon to be stepped there got murdered. Oh my God. So that, I tried to bury that. And now my eighth grade year, he gets murdered. And so what happens, I had to bring you back here to set the tone for what happened here. I want to understand what the hell you just said. You're telling me in the seventh grade you watched a young man get run over by the bus? I didn't see it. I saw the after effects. You saw the after of his, oh my.

32:16And so what I did, so I got off the bus, and this is what curiosity does to you. This is the dumbest thing I've ever done in my life. I'm walking now, so I have to go to the principal's office because I was like witness to this shit. So I'm in the principal's office sitting there, and the one thing I did was I looked under the bus. So I see this, and I look under the bus as I'm walking to the principal's office, and I see these little kids' shoes. I'm telling you this because this shit is about PTSD. So I already had it from my childhood. Now I'm in seventh grade, and I see these little kids' shoes, like this big.

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32:51He was an elementary kid. Just twisted in. And I'm just like, what the fuck? And then nearly a year later, the day after Christmas, a year later, my soon-to-be stepdad gets murdered. And I tell you that because I slept on my floor for probably, I don't know, four months to six months. Why? I was afraid to sleep in my bed for some reason. Don't know why. Some psychological fucking, like, but I'm painting this picture for you to let you know where I was at. Yeah. So, one time in my Spanish class, we had all of our notebooks that stayed in the class. So obviously your name's on it. You go get your notebook for a class.

33:38And I always sat back in the back of every class, man, because I just want to be, just don't look at me, don't call on me. I don't know shit. I opened my notebook up to the first page and on it was a noose, like a little hangman noose. With me hanging from it was the same thing, nigga, we're going to kill you. This is in the 90s. This is the 90s. In 1995, the KKK marched in the 4th of July parade in Brazil, Indiana. Now, they weren't allowed to march like actually in the parade. They were allowed to march 100 or 200 feet behind it. My mom didn't know how bad my grades were. She never saw one report card.

34:15I hid everything from her and she didn't even ask. She was so bogged down with life. And so I got away with a lot of shit because her mind was occupied. so it made me honestly a weaker person so I scammed life my mom helped me scam life for a while but this time I couldn't scam life I went the second time took the ASVAB test failed it again and a week later she got a letter in the mail from my high school and I'm a junior in high school and it later says pretty much your son's gonna flunk out he's missed 25 % of school because she was always gone so I didn't go to school he's gonna miss school and sorry or he's gonna flunk out so I was exposed once again my mom goes well she read the letter to me she put my bed and her best advice was guess what you're gonna flunk out of school that was it in the conversation so this is when i developed my accountability mirror and this is awesome i i look in the mirror and at this time i didn't want to be the black kid in school there's like five or six of us in school and like 1700 kids something like that and I made up a character to kind of like draw attention from color okay and so what I did was I started to design haircuts and one haircut I had was the old man and I shaved my head up here just like this you did this I did this and I would keep the hair on the side like an old man has and one time I shaved my whole head and had a reverse part so I had hair up here and it kind zigzag so i did things to be this cool crazy kind of like creative kid you know like crisscross came out this time i had my pants sagging but backwards so my so my back pockets here i had toothbrush i was crazy man but i was a crazy cool kid in school so i look in the fucking mirror i see this letter i'm i'm i'm fucked up and i'm like you know what man no one's coming to help me yeah i remember back to what my principal said i went to the principal when they wrote that shit in my car and in my notebook and the best advice he can give me god help his soul was this they're ignorant they spelled nigger niger god and so that's but honestly i talked to the guy as i wrote my book and i have nothing wrong with principal freeman he he actually i actually interviewed him for the book and he was happy interview he was he's good man what the you You can tell some black, you're a white guy in white society.

36:47We can tell me. You can shut down the fucking school and have a fucking damn. So I started talking to myself this way in this mirror. What the fuck is principal? Because at that time, this is the best you can fucking do, Principal Freeman? That was my mind then. But in this mirror, it wasn't my mom. It wasn't Principal Freeman. It wasn't my dad. It was me. Because wasn't nobody coming back to fucking help David Goggins. That was my mindset now. and so with my non-spelling ass I started getting these sticky notes and writing you're fucked up and my mom wakes up like what what is wrong with you I go man I'm I have to change because I can't stay here I can't I look at myself in the mirror and I was defeated I go look at myself I'm like who am I so I'm defeated in this mirror I'm like okay I'm changing I said mom can we please get a tutor so we can only afford$15 a week for a tutor so I have four hours a month four hours a month i had a fourth grade reading level man four hours a month for six months that's all i had so this tutor did one thing for me very big um once i can remember her damn name but basically she saw that i was slow very slow and couldn't retain shit and i think she was joking she was you're gonna have to write down everything a thousand times for you remember this.

38:08I took it as okay. Literally. Roger that. Okay. So I literally went to the store and I bought these spiral notebooks and I started literally writing down let's say it's a math equation. The same fucking math equation. Over and over and over and over again when it came to a paragraph comprehension I couldn't read the fucking paragraph and then remember it. So we had like I think 25 or 30 paragraph comprehension things. I had to write down the whole fucking thing. Like a whole paragraph and you don't have much time to take the fucking test. But that's how I learned. So how I learned the Navy Dive Man, it was like a thousand pages Navy Dive Man.

38:49I got it a year in advance. Oh my gosh. And wrote the book out probably 14 times. Like the Boyle's Law, Child's Law, Gay Lusack's Law, Dalton's Law, all these laws, but over and over, the whole manual. So it's not like, so now I've done it so many times I can go back in my mind and say, okay, page 71 was Boyle's Law. And I can go back in this. And I'm looking at it right now. And I remember writing it down so many times that it takes me to say, okay, I got it. And I can write it down almost verbatim. Wow. How I, so that's how I learned even to the day. But the work ethic, I had to, people think I became this guy from running.

39:31Yeah. No, I became this guy from fucking studying. I started studying for hours. What might take you an hour to learn? Take me two days. Wow. So that's where in this, at the table, at the table. And my best friend, Johnny remembers me like god you're like you just changed something happened i got obsessed so i take the test i score high i get in the air force and that's when i'm like man i'm gonna be a prayer rescueman and this is when i realized man i teach myself how to swim i taught myself how to swim but this and i realized man that i'm negative buoyant as hell and there's a lot of things so what gets people in special operations it's the water not swimming but the water confidence when they're like taking your air from you and your underwater panic i realized i was very uncomfortable so long story short i was there for six weeks i was uh moving on pretty well second in my class and i was getting through all the water confidence but barely but i wanted to quit every fucking night i didn't go to sleep every night just just paranoid the next day of getting back in that pool.

40:39So six months go by, we had this medical examination and they draw my blood and they said, you have sickle cell. Sickle cell is a blood disease that some African-Americans have. Basically, you know, if something happens in a stressful situations, stroke, heart attack, sudden death. This happened to a few African-Americans in the military. So they pulled me from training saying, you can't do this job. And when you live a very stressed out life, like I was living yep that's your norm mm-hmm so not sleeping being scared that was my norm mm-hmm I wasn't gonna quit but when they pull you out of training with you and now I'm fucking comfortable so now I'm seeing my class of 24 guys it was like 150 now it's 24 guys and they're in the pool and I'm on the side of the pool I'm not in the water now I'm seeing what I was doing I'm see these guys struggling panicking in the water like wanting to quit I'm like fuck that wow i'm not going so now i'm comfortable and i'm able to see now i'm not going back so now my big dream being a pararescueman i'm now seeing that do this i'm like i want to get out of the air force wow i don't even want to be in the fucking military so this is what i'm saying so i'm hoping now that this sickle cell thing is going to get me kicked out of the military because i'm like okay i don't go back in the fucking i'm done so i'm not getting happy because now I'm like, I won't quit.

42:01They're going to medically drop me from the course. This is great. I can keep my head up. I'll learn how to read. I'll learn how to write. I passed the ASVAB test, but I'm fixing everything on the surface. I'm not going into the fucking dungeon. So the doc calls up. I go back to the doctor's. I'm like skipping down there thinking, I'm getting out of here, man. Medically discharged. He goes, man, you know what? You were doing good in your class and we don't really know. We don't know how you got this far with this, whatever. So guess what we're going to do? We're going to put you back in the training.

42:34I'm like, fuck. So I'm thinking now, I only have about a couple, two and a half weeks left of training. I missed a week, a week and some change. I go, you know what? Great, man. I have to suck this up, man. I can do this. So I'm trying to motivate myself all the way back to my CEO, my command officer, Sergeant Lumberg. I get to Sergeant Lumberg. Sergeant Lumberg looks at me and says, God, man, that's great. You're back in the training. You got to start from day one. because I'm at critical parts of training. I can't miss that many days. And I'm like, but I was a great liar. And I wouldn't look at a hardcore man and tell him that I just fucking quit.

43:10So I looked at him and said, hey, you know what? Sorry, man, this sickle cell thing, man, the doc was talking about sudden death, stroke, heart attack. I didn't give a fuck about sickle cell, but I didn't know anything about it. I knew I was struggling. I knew I had some health issues, but I just thought because I was killing myself, and what I was doing. And he said, you know what, you're right, man. I wouldn't want to do that either. So he gave me a medical out of pararescue. And he said, when we figure this out more, we'll have you come back. I wouldn't ever go back. I'm like, I'm never getting back in the fucking water again, but I was able to leave on a medical.

43:47But I quit. You quit. Why do you quit? Why do you tell this story? I have to. Because everybody thinks I'm the world's toughest motherfucker ever lived. and I might be somewhere about that now but that's where I was and I tell the story because if I just talk about I broke the pull-up record I I did all these fucking races I went through seal train I went through I was in three hell weeks ranger school if I talk about all the badassery like we like doing social fucking media and I don't tell you that I was a fucked up kid and I was scared of shit and i was depressed and insecure and in all this shit what good am i for anybody right i'm a superhero i'm a liar i'm that now but i wasn't born that yeah i had to make myself into this shit it's amazing to me that this you know you won't accept it this way but like this military icon but not really like a social icon too like when people aspire to be tough and mentally tough i mean there are ufc fighters that when they win fights now quote you in their post-conference interviews you i don't even know if you know that or not but like i'll watch it they're like goggins says you know seriously you know so that guy kind of bullshits his way out of the military right like that's that's staggering and then that guy if you don't mind me jumping ahead a little bit then that guy ends up kind of living in an apartment gains a ton of weight gets up to almost 300 pounds killing cockroaches as an exterminator this is just crazy where we're gonna go right now so and then what we're gonna go after that's even more bananas but go ahead jump back so what's funny though though so i i get out of pararescue so i go to a job called tac p just real quick about that it's a great fucking job and the best job is the military but i'm all poopy past now i'm not a pararescueman so i'm thinking tac p some weak ass motherfuckers right tac p right del Toro is one of the best fucking jobs in the world but my mind once again has me shackled now I'm thinking I'm not a pararescueman so I'm like you know I'm tag P was a great job I had great friends in it and I did it pretty well but I could have been so much better my mind was once again hijacking me so i get out and but from from the time from 1994 to 1999 or 1998 i go from 175 pounds to 297 not much education four and a half years in the military i start spraying for cockroaches and uh making a thousand dollars a month and i only had an 810 apartment so i'm scrounging dude Yeah.

46:30And so my life is hard. And, but fuck it. I'm spraying for cockroach from 11 o 'clock at night at seven o 'clock in the morning. And that's my life. But once again, man, you can't lie to yourself. I can lie to you and I can lie to everybody else. And I was great at it. But buddy, every fucking day in that dirty mirror, that accountability mirror was no more. Fuck that accountability mirror. That's just fucking shave my head and go to work. But I saw my reflection every day, but I really didn't know how fat I was. I didn't really want to look at myself but I was haunted these demons were in my head every day man you ain't shit man you wear this fucking uniform you get in your fucking Ecolab truck you go spray for cockroaches you fucking go in the kitchens you eat your fucking brownies and shit in the back kitchen you make shakes and shit while you're in there man I was like fuck man so I come home and I'll never forget it I used to spray down steak and shake my last stop at about 6.30 at night or 6.30 in the morning I spray down steak and shake and they had this big large shake they they gave me a special cup and they just dumped the chocolate milkshake in there and i go across the street to 7-eleven i had a 45 minute commute home and i would be and i'll go over to 7-eleven and get these chocolate donuts like the mini hostess donuts and i was popping them like tic tacs dude you know it was like i'd eat it i just pop it boom this is me driving listening to the radio popping them like tic tacs drinking the shake so there's so by the time I got home that box of donuts was gone my mom lived about two miles down the road because she moved to Annapolis Indiana now so what would happen is this so I would eat that and my routine was this shit you not my breakfast was not that my that was my snack for my 45 so now my mom and this is no fucking shit my breakfast you know those fucking Pillsbury sitting in rolls yeah you got the five you got the eight yeah i had the eight so you had the eight she baked that and then it was seven to eight scrambled eggs hard and half a pound of bacon well done and i would chase that down with fruity pebbles two bowls or fruit something sugary that was my breakfast after the donuts and the shake so this day though i get home call my mom up on the phone she goes you want your staple I'm like hell yeah I'm a fucking state you know that's how I talked my mom you know me my mom came with some fucked up shit yeah whoo man why you cuss so much cuz my life wasn't easy sure something considered is sugarcoat right so my mom cusses at me because but we have a great relationship okay great come over and so at this time my routine was to come home turn the TV on listen to the TV like blaring cuz like like literally I have this big living room in my shower was like back down the hallway.

49:20So I turn the TV on and like blur the TV and kind of like listen to it a little bit as I showered. I'm hearing Navy SEAL. Heard about him, knew about him, but now I want to come out and see what the fuck I'm talking about. Cause I heard world's toughest. So I come out and watch this documentary. I come out, I basically, I have my towel and I have my shake down on the counter. I have this little fucking TV and it's huge, huge living room. So I'm looking at the TV and I'm leaning forward and I'm watching this shit and it pretty much goes through first phase second phase and third phase but they concentrate on Hell Week but all I saw was the Pacific Ocean right water again dude I saw nothing but water more water than pararescue and these guys are like going from this big class to this it shows them quitting and I see nothing but this jackhammer guys it's not bubbles and this rolling around sugar cookies in out of the surf and carry these boats and laws i'm like that that shit looks evil but guys as they quit i saw like their soul leaving their bodies almost on screen because this look came over them and i imagined i remember myself back in pair rescue training i bet that's how i looked in front of that fucking sergeant lumber and i bet he could see in my eyes that i was basically quitting he knew i was quitting he just gave me a medical i'm a fucking knew it as a man looking at another man you know when the man's done and i'm like so i i i thought about something i said i said motherfucker knew i was quitting dude he just didn't he saved me and didn't want to tell me i was he knew it because i can look at somebody now it's okay dude you're good but i know you're quitting it ain't your fucking knee or your back or whatever you're quitting he saw that in me and i said motherfucker man so now I'm watching these guys go through training and it goes down to 22 guys are left and it was amazing how it ended because these words I don't know them exactly but I in my book exactly and this command officers at graduation and these 22 guys graduate but seal training and his command officers is dressed whites he's up there some old skinny fucking commander fucking but you could tell he's been through the shit salty looking motherfucker and he's looking hard and this and his speech was amazing he goes we live in a society where mediocrity is often rewarded and he looked down at the 22 men and he says something about basically you all detest mediocrity and he goes on to talk about this mediocrity and shit and i just sat back and i said god man i just want to be like these motherfuckers i want to feed because now i was projecting myself in those chairs i want to how can how do y 'all feel like right now i want to feel like you do you you 22 men i want to feel like that man i said i'm tired of feeling the way i feel every day i'm tired of how i feel tired of lying to myself lying to people and it's being some piece of shit and i always knew in the back of my mind i could be something special yes but i knew the work it was going to take was going to kill me.

52:28I was afraid of that. I was afraid of the brutality in the suffering I was going to have to endure. But I knew, I knew I could do something. But I'm like, I ain't trying to do that kind of work, man. I'm just not trying to do this. I chose the path of the easy, of least resistance. So now my ideas, it became so haunting and daunting on me, myself, I said I'm done. I'm fucking done. And I thought I fixed myself in the accountability mirror when my mom put the letter down on the bed. Yeah. Nah. So now at this point I actually drive back to Buffalo, New York to see my dad. Haven't seen him in years.

53:10I've not heard this part. And no one knows about this. I didn't put this in the book even. So before I start this journey to be Navy see him i go back to see my dad because i realize now i gotta fix some i'm blaming everything i gotta go back you know how a lot of times you're like if you're a runner your your your right knee may hurt but it's not your right knee that hurts it's really your left hip yes but we're concentrating on the right knee i'm concentrating on all my but i need to go back to the root of the problem which is my dad i gotta face the demon i gotta go back and see what made him so fucked up to make me so fucked up why am i fucked up so i go back and i and i go back in as a as an older man now i'm in my 20s i'm not a kid anymore and i want to see this man and face him as a as a as a grown man but still as a kid in my head i was still a kid but i was a grown man as as my age i went back and i realized he was the same man that he was still the same still the same and i talked to him he was still nuts and um but i had to go back and face that one more time but to face it in a different way how'd you do it different i looked at him in a way we never said sorry to one another and he went off about my mom and my grandparents and all kind of shit but i looked at him in a way that i realized now why you fucked us up i had to almost be him to realize it's okay brother it's okay because I realized that somewhere in your fucking life something fucked you up and you didn't deal with it and so you put that shit on me my mom and everybody around you I'm gonna deal with my shit so even though you gave me all this shit you you gave me a satchel of shit that I didn't deserve and now I'm all fucked up and people think I'm a fucking liar and I'm all fucked up you gave me this you created this fucking nightmare of Goggins I'm gonna fix it though so now I get it I look at it this is what I'm saying in my head my favorite thing you've ever said right now and I love all of it but that's my favorite thing I've never heard that I'm gonna fix it now so I almost take it I take all this shit it's mine I'm gonna fix all this shit but I know to fix shit people wanna find peace immediately and this is where people don't like me I don't believe that shit you ain't gonna find it through fucking yoga and all this other bullshit I stretch out a lot and I believe in yoga, all this shit's great, but you ain't gonna find it in some fucking room.

55:39You're gonna find peace from going to war with yourself because we all got shit. We all got shit. People look at me, the reason why my story resonates with people, because I don't hide. I'll tell you exactly who the fuck I am. I will admit to it, people are great at hiding. So they wanna just find peace. No, you gotta take your shit, fix whatever's fucked up in you, don't just shove it under a rug, fix it, and then you'll find some peace later.

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57:31That was a great conversation. read the book, right? Did you ever work with a guy, don't say who, I know you wouldn't, but did you ever work with someone as physically gifted as either one of the two of them that just lacked these things and so as a result we don't know who they are? Numerous. Really? As physically gifted? Even more. Wow. Even more. They were by far not my most physically gifted athletes. I work with athletes that were jumped higher than MJ, who ran faster, who had better footwork than Kobe, but Michael Jordan and Kobe Bryant were not the two most physically gifted athletes you've worked with no whoa okay and then so when you would work with these guys and you'd be pushing them in training there was a different resistance or fatigue or how was it different you know what and how many times have you had people come up to you and says I'll do anything to get where you're at right all the time or I'll do anything to work for you until you until you tell them what your definition of anything is.

58:27Your definition of anything is different than my definition of anything. I'll have an athlete, it's very simple. When I first start with them, when I was training numerous, I said, what time's the first workout? I'd say 3.30. I'd be like, okay. It's 3.30 a.m. A.m. I wouldn't tell them a.m. or p.m. I'd tell them 3.30. Okay. So we're, myself, my staff, we're sitting at waiting because you know winning doesn't sleep and it doesn't understand why you why you do that's awesome so nothing then we come back at we go that they roll in the gym about 3 3 30 like what are you doing here they're like you said 3 30 no no I said you got the wrong time and I said when does a new day start and they look at him he goes no i said no the new day starts at 12 midnight that's right that's a new day all right what are you waiting for and even if you tell them hey mj did this kobe did this if they don't have it they don't have it they don't have it you think it's a lack of obsession like you said you've referenced a couple times like sleep at night your bed doesn't sleep and all that one of the things that i'll be honest there's a lot in the book that hit me and you guys go get the book winning Tim Grover real simple get it anywhere books are sold but there's this part of the book man it like it almost made me cry audibly reading it but I did get water in my eyes and I'm gonna get water even explaining it to you where you're talking about being asleep and that you get these visitors at night and I know those visitors very very well I have them too it's attached to my obsessions and I don't think I don't think the average person who wants to really win understands the extent and degree of obsession required.

1:00:18They don't. So can you elaborate on that visitors that you get at night? Everybody thinks obsession is a bad word. It's not. I love to use the people I, you're a great example. Ed, why? Why keep going? Look at the house. not only this house the other house and the other house and the plane and if people pay very close attention to what was just said probably about 20 minutes ago what did you say i don't consider my i don't know if i consider myself a winner that's obsession that's obsession and i love to use your plane story as an example You went from a very nice-sized plane to even a bigger plane, but it's still not your 747.

1:01:12That's right. That's true. It's not your 747. Yeah. All right. That's an obsession. That's a healthy obsession. That's what gets you out of bed. That's what allows you to, when you get out of bed, when all the skeletons are lined up next to you and telling you, you can't do this. You're not able to do this. You're not able to do this. You get up every single morning and you shake their hands and give them a hug and say, Yep. What do you got for me tonight? Exactly. I got you. Because you're a part of me. You're a part of me. And people put some, it's funny, winners bring all of them wherever they go.

1:01:55And most individuals, the best part of them, the thing that allows them to win, the thing that allows them to be obsessive, the thing that allows them not to care what other people think, the things that allow them to deal with hatred, the things that keep them going when nothing else will, they keep in their closets. The best part of them, they keep in there because they're worried, what are people going to think about me if I let those things out? don't I always say this all right no everyone says I'm afraid to become that person yeah you should be more afraid not to become that person be afraid not to become that person you you're a big thing about this you know meet uh I want to what at the end of the journey yeah you know I want to meet my better half and say hey what did you leave behind or was like, hey, this is the person.

1:02:58Shake hands with them. Shake hands with them.

1:03:03If you can't become that person, you're never going to be able to shake that person's hand. Yeah, I'd much rather, I live in more fear of, I live in way more fear of not becoming that person than I am about not trying to be him. Big time. But I do have, I want to stay on this for a minute. I get these visitors at night too that you get. so I don't want people to think that winning is all like rosy and glory and beautiful it's nothing it's it's really not and I'm not even you have to know this here's the real never said this on the show you have to really know these truths so that you can actually decide you still want to win yes right because what does come with becoming this way now at 50 and you're 56 or 56 you look great.

1:03:53I've had 50 years of having these visitors in my life. And they're not going away, Ed. They're not. That's what everybody wants to do. The people just want to sweep them under the rug. They want to keep them in the closet. They don't want to talk about them. That's what makes you successful. That's what makes you that's what makes you special. That's what makes you different. And what do we say? Different scares people. Winners and winning scares people and they don't want to win because of that. They're trying to win. They're trying to balance. They're trying to fit in. What do winners do? Very few of them have balance in their life.

1:04:32Maybe after they become successful, they try to balance a little bit more. All right. There is no balance early. They don't care what other people think. They're extremely obsessive. They know it. And they don't mind telling you that they're chasing the next win because that's what fuels them. But when you people come to you and say, you've had enough, you know, why? Slow down, slow down, unwind. I don't know about you. I do know about you. I should say that. we are at our most uncomfortable when people tell us to unwind we like to be wound up we like that that's like a part of that we have our we have our unique ways of unwinding we don't need anybody to tell us to unwind my favorite way of unwinding is having some tequila with a buddy of mine who's another winner and talking about doing more winning right i was on andy's show and i said winning is more fun than fun is fun i remember that and i just really believe that like actually what I like.

1:05:39Like, I like the pursuit of winning. I like that I sincerely don't feel that way about myself because I'm scared if I did. Like, I'm scared of these visitors that I have are my fears, my worries, my hopes, my thoughts, my skeletons. Yeah. You know, they take all those forms. They take all those forms and you don't know what form they're going to take that night. And you know what? They're going to sit at you with the table. They're all, they're not going to, I put this in a book. When you travel, those skeletons are traveling with you on the plane. They're my constant companion. All the time. And if you notice, everyone looks at you and you fly on that plane alone.

1:06:24I have said, Ed's never been on that plane alone. It's true. It's true. He's never been on that plane alone. They're with me all the time. All the time. And you know what? When they look at his tequila bottles on the thing and they're finished, that's because they're drinking the best stuff also. True. I wonder who's drinking all that stuff, man. Stuff gets expensive. I just love this because this is the realest conversation I've ever had about winning, and it's the realest book about it. Like, it's, I don't, this isn't one of these Pollyanna things, like, it's not all rosy. No, there's a lot of it that sucks.

1:06:57And like, unless you want to sign up, and by the way, I don't know if you feel, I'm actually cool if you don't. Like, if you actually said, hey, I don't want all that stuff. I don't want to I mean I don't relate to you I'm not gonna hang out with you you're not my kind of people but I'd actually admire somebody who says I won't do these things that are in this book and I know I'm not gonna win rather than say I want to win and do none of the things that are in the book the people that can admit it they've already won hmm the people that said this ain't this ain't for me this ain't for me they're saying they know exactly who they are.

1:07:30I'm good. I'm good. If you, most people will settle for good. Most people will settle for okay. All right. Very few people will settle for great. Very few people will settle for unstoppable. Very few people will settle for winning. I break things down three different ways. So look at this and I didn't even put this in a book, but I want to share, I want to share this with you. You have individuals that compete. Everybody competes, you know, you play golf, you love golf. sure you know you go out and uh your golfing partner i don't know what's his real name your real name is kelly gwynn we call him richard cabesa yes dick cabesa is head in spanish everyone that's wondering what that's his name because half the people don't know that's what richard everybody knows him he's going to be signing autographs he goes down there people like i love you in my latin man can i get your he's had people take pictures with him it's awesome you know so and i'll get into it a little bit later about that but there's people that compete.

1:08:29Everybody knows how to compete at something. And for most people, when they compete, they want to just finish. That's their win. They just want to finish. Now to me, if you're that level person, is that finish going to lead to another win? It might be in something else. If you're going to run a marathon and you're not one of these top elite marathon runners, you're not going to win the marathon. right you're not gonna win but you have a mindset to say hey i'm gonna finish this marathon now is that when you finish that marathon what else is it setting you up for but there's people that go in there they're just happy they're just happy competing they're just happy finishing they're just happy to be in the race then you have people that win right once they win once yeah and how many individuals do you know and you probably don't well i shouldn't say this i said you know not associate with is a big difference that keep telling you about that win over and over again no matter how long it's been gosh factoid all right i got it man you were quarterback in high school yes i got it you got your master's so i got it i got all right then you have individuals that win at winning.

1:09:47That's really good. They win at winning. So they win over and over and over again. You think it's all it's cracked up to be? No. But we don't know any other way. Best answer of all time. We don't know any other way. Best answer of all time. We can't accept it any other way. We just can't. I wrote a best-selling book I didn't have to do another book you wrote a best-selling book you know you have another book coming out you don't you don't have to do any of this but if you didn't that would be more detrimental to you you don't know you don't know any other way And yeah, you just you just don't.

1:10:47Yeah. You think that, by the way, I'm loving this just so you know, because I know people that might be listening to this little bit dark, like welcome to winning. Like, that's why you see so many people. I watch Nick Saban after wins these national championships. He's gotten a little bit better out at the last couple of years. Yeah, just a little bit, like one percent better. You know what? Either his wife or somebody in his family. At least smile for the interview after, right? We can get back to work tonight. But you watch these prolific winners. So I did love to watch MJ celebrate that win in the evening that he won, right?

1:11:25Or, you know, the few times I saw Kobe actually celebrate the win. But I know the next day they're back to work. I watched a Saban. And, like, for years he'd win these national championships. And you could already see the grimace on his face for the next year in the postgame interview. In the postgame, yes. Right? And I think people look at it and go, well, then is he, and I think to your answer, you're right. People say, well, is he really enjoying this? Yes, and he knows no other way. So maybe it's not all, I wonder if you ask, is it all it's cracked up to be? I think some people might say, no, but it's all I know.

1:11:56It's all I know. And it's better than the alternative of living with losing the rest of my life or not trying. Yes. Right? There's a reason it's lonely at the top. and it's not because you want to be surrounded with other individuals that's not the part people when they talk about it's lonely at the top it's alone because nobody understands what's going on in here of what you went after you've just won what you went through and you're already thinking about the next you're already thinking about the next and people can't comprehend that And there's people whispering in your ear and they're saying, enjoy it.

1:12:40By the time they say enjoy it, you did enjoy it. Now you're already thinking. Yeah. Do you think it's that, I'm just thinking right now, I'm asking you this. Because you watched this and you've done it in your own life. Like you've had two careers. You've had a career where you helped, which you still do, where you help other people win. And then there became this point in your life where you became, you were individually winning as a speaker, as a coach, as a writer. It's an interesting thing to watch with you. You were the behind the scenes guy. Then you weren't the behind the scenes guy. Do you think that it's like a dopamine thing?

1:13:15Like when they win, like they're already, they have to get another one. Like it's an addiction. Do you think winning becomes an addiction? It is an addiction. And the only place where you can get that high again is the black market in your mind. It's the only place. Because you only know where that entrance is. You only know where that hit is. You only know what that drug is. And here's the crazy part about it. The next win has to be bigger. It has to be bigger. It has to be bigger. It has to constantly keep getting bigger and bigger and bigger. So true. It sounds like a sickness when you're listening to this, but I actually think it's beautiful.

1:13:53I actually think you were born to win and you learn over a lifetime how not to. As a child, don't do this. sit down, be a good boy, get in your place, do this. Then the world starts treating you. And I think you move further and further away from your own nature. I think we were born to win. We were born to do something great with our life. I really, I don't know, that's a saying to me. And I feel a sadness when I meet somebody who's accepted a life of not winning. By the way, I'm cool with it. It's okay. I'm not judging you. But as someone who wants to pursue that expression of myself or that I just wonder what I would be like you know if I could what it would be like what I would be like if I could get to the next level I'm fascinated with like I think the people that I really like enjoy they're curious people like I want the next experience I don't want to live in the previous experience like that guy was like hey you know I made a million dollars in 2009 and it was like in the mortgage boom or the crash or whatever I'm not really interested in living in those in those times you're not because it's always about it's always about what's next it's always about constantly staying in the range it's a constant about changing your mindset the language of winning for people that win is completely different than the language of winning from other individuals no you sit here and you talk to people and they describe the when i talk to all my athletes i said describe winning in one word to me and everybody would think about, you know, they would be like, it's happy.

1:15:26It's, you know, it's euphoric. It's all those things. And it is. But those constant winners, their answers were, it's unpolished. It's uncivilized. It's nasty. It's hard. It's dirty. It's unforgiving. And then Kobe comes up and says, it's everything. It's everything. And if you think about it, and very few people are genuine about this, and you know the ones that are, and you know the ones that aren't. How do you feel when somebody's really close to you and they win? It's an unbelievable feeling. Unbelievable feeling. How do you feel when you win? It's an unbelievable feeling, even though it's short-lived.

1:16:17How do you feel when your kids win? It's unbelievable. Yeah. All right. that feeling is everything it is everything that feeling is everything it's amazing you just said that i'm reading the book last night and i call my wife about halfway through the book because when you read your work you know even in the first book most you talk about in this book the most controversial part of the first book was the dark side yes you talk about it in this book and then when you're reading this you're like this winning thing's mean this winning thing's unforgiving this winning thing doesn't give a shit if you sleep this winning thing doesn't care right like you go through like she this is almost and I and if you're not careful guys you would think because this is truth it flies in the face everything you always hear but you would you would think that it's not something that you really want and the evidence of it I said to my wife last I said the evidence that you know winning is where you belong is how happy you are when you see your children doing it if you have children when your children win a spelling bee or get straight A's or hit a home run or win a golf tournament or do anything exceptional.

1:17:21The amount of joy you feel and pride when they win. I have a feeling that that's how God feels when he sees one of his children win. And I think this is something we all miss, that it is a grind. It is difficult. But if you ever wonder whether you belong winning and that's the path you should pursue, just ask yourself a question about your children, if you have them, or your parents or anybody that you love and care about. When they win, how do you feel for them? I literally said this last night. So I've heard you speak numerous times. And what people don't know about this, like when we're on the stage together at the same event, I'll stay just to hear you speak.

1:17:56Vice versa, as you know. You know, I will stay. The last time I heard you speak was at an event and you were talking about a golf tournament you were with with your son. With Max, yeah. With Max. It's an intense story. Yeah, it was just like. We went from playing golf to winning. Yes. That was the decision. Like to your point, like your book. And by the way, I've said this early in the interview, little words from people, a caring statement, a little bit of access to some information. And I've said this many times, just haven't said it to you, but like, I thank you because you know, I've had people say, oh, your son gets all your stuff.

1:18:30And yeah, he also has talked to Grover. He's also talked to Grover. And just so you guys know, I really truly believe that one of the reasons that my son is excelling is you and your information, little whispers, you get a little direct. message, a little text message, a little access to a call like you've done for my son. And I think that's the other thing that people don't know. Winners are generous. Extremely generous. You know why? Because they're truthful. They tell you how it is. It's not rainbows. It's not unicorns. It's not sprinkles. This is what it takes. This is what it takes. And other people, they'll tell they don't want to we talk about the stuff nobody else wants to talk about right does that make us bad people in many people's eyes it does but it also where the few people that are going to hold you accountable we're going to tell you the truth and where people are going to say you know what everybody else sugar-coated it these individuals told me exactly how it is that's what the book winning is about now i don't want people to think that it's all this thing if you read the last chapter of the book, it kind of ties everything in and it explains why winners go through this journey.

1:19:50Yep. Why they go through this journey. Because I have this thing, it's like everyone talks about it's the journey, it's journey, it's not the destination. Well, to me, why in the hell are you taking a journey if you don't know where the hell the destination is? What are you just aimlessly going to be running around? All right. Every time. When you get on your plane or you get in your car, you know exactly you're going from here to here. Now, you may have to take a detour to go somewhere else to do whatever you're doing. But you're like, this is where we're going. You had a post a couple of days ago.

1:20:23Man, it's nice to own a jet because all of a sudden I got to go wherever, wherever your destination was. Yeah. I'm fired up about today's show because we're getting right into what it takes to win. And that is this. Write this down. One more. One more. See, I accepted a long time ago. I wasn't the smartest, the best looking, the fast enough, with the best background, the most connections. I didn't have any of those things. What I could control was my work ethic. You've heard me speak many times about outworking everybody, but I think that just feels good when we hear it. But most people don't take it seriously.

1:20:58If you think that I have a little bit of success in my life, I can tell you what I attribute it to. Yes, self-confidence. Yes, mindset, visualization, goals. All the things I talk about all the time. Listening skills, influence, energy transfer, how to be happier, all of that stuff applies. When you get to winning, for me, it's come down to maxing out. And what maxing out means is you do one more at least than you think you're capable of. So when you're done, whatever you're doing, whether it's at the gym or phone calls or meetings or in sports, one more shot, one more throw, one more swing of the golf club or the baseball bat, the separator is for the winners, they do one more.

1:21:35I'm addicted to one more. And so I want your mantra going forward to be one more. What does that look like if we're working out? That means when we're in the gym and we say, I'm going to do five sets of 10, I'm crazy. Like I'm a psycho because I want to win. I want to be somebody. I want to separate. I want to compete. And the way I do that isn't with my giftedness because I wasn't born with a bunch of gifts. And I think gifts are crap. I think for the most part, gifted people struggle in life because things come easy to them. I like that things haven't come easy for me in my life. I like that I don't have natural talents in every area.

1:22:10And maybe you like that about you too. Maybe you've looked at yourself all your life and thought, man, I don't have that natural beauty or that natural talent or this gift for creativity or intellect or humor. I don't have any of those things. But what I got is I will outwork you. And so at the gym, one of the things I focus on, they say it's five sets of 10. When I'm at 10, I go one more, bam, 11. If I'm running on the treadmill and it's a 45 minute run, I never finish at 45. I always go one more minute, 46. If I'm at the office and I'm supposed to make 25 phone calls that day, when I'm at the end of the day, I always do one more.

1:22:46If I've got meetings, I always do one more. My mantra for three decades in business has been one more. Why? Because we get out of life what we think we deserve. And I'm the kind of guy that I know when you do 45 minutes on the treadmill and I do 46, I deserve to be fitter. I know that when I'm lifting weights and I watch you do five sets of 10 and every single time I do one more. When it's a set of five, I do six. When it's a set of eight, I do nine. When it's 45 on the treadmill, I do 46. When it's supposed to be 20 phone calls, I make 21. When it's supposed to be an eight hour workday, I work nine.

1:23:22Whatever it is, I always do one more. And what that does is it makes me eventually think I'm doing things other people aren't willing to do, so I should get things other people aren't going to get. And if you go to the root of the things I believe philosophically about winning, the people that win, the great athletes that I coach, when I watch the really gifted golfer and the one who actually wins, the gifted golfer, they do what they're supposed to do. You'd never know they weren't working hard. It's not like people don't work hard. Everybody works hard. That's a given now. But what's the separator to where you become the maxed out version of you?

1:23:57See, the gifted golfer, they hit their 100 balls because they're supposed to. But the not so gifted one that ends up winning, they hit 101 or 110 or 120. I watched them on the driving range and you can hear them say, one more, one more. What's the difference between Kobe Bryant and other gifted NBA players when he played? Or Michael Jordan when they played? Or right now, Kevin Durant, people tell me, or Steph Curry. They're constantly, when everyone else is done shooting in the gym, they say one more. Larry Bird was legendary for one more, one more. The people that would throw the passes to him, the ball guys in practice, he always wants more.

1:24:35He always wants more. The great hitters that I know, the Mike Trouts and MLB, they're gifted, but they just take a little more. They take that extra batting practice, that extra session. They're always doing extra. That's the separator. Like you can learn all this stuff. You can digest all the tactics and information that I give out. But if you're not willing to do one more, eventually there's a part of you that says, maybe, maybe I don't deserve it. I'm just doing what everybody else is doing. And that's not good enough. It's not even good enough to do more than everybody else. It's your maxed out level.

1:25:07It's one more of everything. And so whether that's a phone call, an email, a text, an appointment, One more time you tell your spouse you love them. One more time you go in and kiss your children goodnight. One more hug of somebody. One more phone call. One more everything. I want your theme to be one more. Have I said that enough times for you today? So what's that really look like in application? Well, the second thing it does for you is you actually do more reps of whatever it is you're doing. And when we do more repetitions, we get better. And when we do more repetitions, we're more productive.

1:25:38So number one is the psychology part. If you're someone who's always doing things other people aren't willing to do, you always max out, you always go to the next level, you convince yourself you deserve to win. You can take low self-esteem, low identity, low confidence and change it over time by building this habitual addiction to doing one more, this obsession of one more. All the greats do one more and all the average don't. It's not that the average don't work hard. It's not that the average at your company, it's not that they don't work hard. They probably work pretty hard. But do they always do extra?

1:26:12Do they always do one more? Do they always do 10 more if they need to? Do they always get after it? The other part of it, number two, is you just get better because of the reps. You're just doing more of something, you get better. You get stronger. You become a better phone caller when you make one more phone call every day. You become a better communicator when you do one more meeting every single day. You get better at coordination in your sport or at the gym by just doing more reps. Yes, you get better, so that's the second layer. But the third one is you stack the odds in your favor. See, for me, I want the odds that I'm going to win to increase.

1:26:47The larger numbers we play in life in every area, more is always better. People tell you more isn't always better and almost everything more is better, just so you know, and almost everything. People who tell you more isn't better in most things are lazy and they try to justify their own weakness. Don't let people who are justifying their own weakness convince you that you working hard, you doing more isn't the pathway to your success. People say, well, you got to work smarter, not harder. That's a lie because everybody who wins works smarter. The separator is who works harder. And by the way, we become smarter through working harder.

1:27:23All the new revelations, all the breakthroughs, all the new discoveries always come when you're doing one more. Always come through more repetitions. You find new ways, new strategies, new words, new keys by higher repetitions. So even if you believe working smarter is more important, you will become smarter by doing more. So if you work 300 days a year, let's just say, 300 days a year, that's 300 more phone calls every single year. Over five years, that's 1 ,500 more contacts. 1 ,500 more contacts. Just think about that just for a second. Over 30 years, that's 9 ,000 more contacts. What are the odds the person who makes 9 ,000 more contacts or even 300 more a year are going to win?

1:28:06You give me two average people that walk in a room, same ability, same skills, same backgrounds, same product. One of them makes 300 more contacts a year than the other one. Who's going to win? We know. How about over five years? One of them makes 1 ,500 more contacts over five years. Who's going to win? Over a lifetime, 30 years of work, one makes 9 ,000 more contacts. contacts, who's going to win? You stack the odds in your favor. Never mind the person who'd made the 9 ,000 more contacts is better. They've got more reps. They've got more confidence. They believe they deserve to win. They just have 9 ,000 more opportunities.

1:28:41How about a golfer? One of them makes 300 more swings a year, a year. And that's just one more swing a day, right? And over a year, over five years, 1 ,500 more, 9 ,000 over a lifetime. Who's more likely to win? So you pick anything you want. You begin to stack the odds in your favor. How about at the gym if every day you went one more minute in your cardio so it's supposed to be 45 you do 46 do you know what that starts to do to you you start knowing you're different you start knowing you obliterate standards you start knowing you can break through when you break through an artificial barrier like 45 minutes you do one more it sets a catalyst for your entire day it sets a syntax it sets a mindset for the rest of your life never mind the fact that if you do 300 more minutes which is 9 ,000 more over your lifetime who's gonna be more fit?

1:29:27So you begin to stack these things and your entire life changes. This is what I like to call compound pounding. Most people underestimate what time can do when backed up with massive activity. Right as I'm speaking to you, I'm looking out at the ocean right now and there's a massive rock formation and you can see the rivets and the rocks. And what caused those rivets in the rocks was compound pounding of the ocean hitting that rock over and over and over again, over and over, compound pounding against that rock. And over time, that ocean breaks the rock down, over time, where you can see the breakdown in a rock that water does hitting it.

1:30:08Think about that over time. Not one time when the water hits it, not two times, not five times. When you add up years and years and years of that water hitting the rock, it breaks it down. And that's like getting through to your dream. You have to be like that water hitting the rock I'm staring at right now that over time that compound pounding breaks down the barriers breaks down the obstacles breaks down anything in your way of getting to your dream. So I'm sold out on all the strategies and tactics that I teach you. But what I believe in completely is the power of compound pounding. And here's the crazy thing about most people.

1:30:44They will give up on their dream before the compounding has been allowed to kick in. so they'll work at it and they'll work at it and they'll work at it and they don't see the breakthrough but what they don't understand is that rock was getting ready to break if you just keep pounding against it but because most people don't see the evidence see if you watch that water hit that rock over one day you're gonna see no difference two days no difference five days no difference maybe even a year there's no difference maybe even five years but you have the compound pounding of every wave hitting that rock over and over again, there's an inevitability to the breakdown of the rock.

1:31:20That's true of your goals and dreams as well. There's an inevitability to success. It's not a matter of if, it's a matter of when, when we adopt one more, when we adopt compound pounding. Do you know the kind of confidence you begin to have when you just accept in your life that I am going to be relentless, I'm always going to do extra, and you accept the fact that all things break down over time. All the barriers will go away, all the obstacles will go away, everything in your way will go away if you keep after it over an extended period of time. Most people overestimate what they can do in a year.

1:31:57They do. They set up goals for a year and they overestimate where they're gonna get to and they dramatically underestimate what they can do in a decade. And the reason for that is most people don't understand the power of compound pounding. So I want you to accept today that you're gonna be be relentless, that you're going to keep coming, that you're like a dripping faucet. You're like those waves hitting the rock. Other people are going to get slowed down. Other people are going to take a break. Other people are going to flinch. Other people are going to cool it. Other people are going to believe they've made it, or maybe some people are going to believe they can't make it, but you're going to be relentless.

1:32:26You're going to be repetitious. You may not be the fastest. You may not be the smartest. You may not be the strongest. You may not be the most beautiful. You may not have the most articulate thoughts and ideas in the world, but what you got is compound pounding. What you got is one more. And when they get weak, you just keep company. When they flinch, you blow their doors off. That's how you win in life is you keep getting after it and keep getting it after it until the job gets done. So a lot of people can be excited for a day. They can be excited for a month. Some people can be excited for a year or two or three years, but the winners, they stay excited as long as it takes to get the job done.

1:33:00They keep after it until the job gets done. They never stop. They're always after it. And that's where their strength comes from. That's where their confidence comes from, is knowing their capacity to keep coming at you and that all your competition's going to get weak. They're going to get tired. They're going to surrender. They're going to give in. They're going to think they made it. They're going to take a break. They're going to cool it, and you just keep coming. It's just nature, just like the nature of the ocean against that rock. It's just nature that you run down your dream, that you knock down your dream.

1:33:30I want you to implement all the things that I teach on Max out, all the tactics, all the strategies, but more than anything, I want you to buy into the fact of an inevitability of you winning, that it's inevitable, that it might not be a year or two years or three years, but you're going to stay excited and you're going to keep doing one more until the job gets done. Today's message is very simple. You can win. You should win and you will win. I want you to feel this. You will win if you just keep coming. You keep getting after it. You keep doing one more. You can control this. You can't control all the exterior things in your life.

1:34:05People's attitudes, how they treat you, who cancels on you, who changes their mind, who hates on you, who lets you down. But you can control this. You can always go 46 instead of 45. You can always go 11 instead of 10. You can always make the next phone call. Always do one more meeting. Always do one more. Always, always, always. And I promise you, you will knock down that rock that's in between you and your dream and make them come true. Today's really simple. You're going to knock down whatever that rock is that's in between you and your dream. You're going to keep after. You're going to be relentless.

1:34:36You're not going to give in. You're going to be the person who stays excited until the entire job gets done, until that dream is real. And you know long-term, all these other people, they're going to flinch. They're going to get weak and you won't. You've adopted a max out mindset. And I want to remind you today to stay connected with me. I want you to win. Hope you can feel it today. I want to break it down to its most simple form, which is that you use nature to your advantage. You use the force of you, the force of effort, the force of sustained effort over an extended period of time to wear out the obstacles in front of you in your dream.

1:35:11I want you to feel the confidence that comes with it. I'm telling you, look at me, listen to me. You're going to do this. You're going to win if, and it's a big if, if you'll just adopted it ought to be written everywhere one more one more max out everywhere you can put it it's inevitable it's not if anymore it's just when this is the end mylin show

From the publisher

Winning isn’t just about talent—it’s about preparation, resilience, and an unshakable mindset. In this Mashup Episode, I bring together four elite minds—Michael Chandler, Mikey Garcia, Tim Grover, and David Goggins—to break down the mental playbook behind what it truly takes to succeed at the highest level.

You’ll hear Mikey Garcia, a world-champion boxer, reveal how visualization isn’t just about picturing success but also anticipating obstacles—like a knockdown or an injury—and planning how to respond without panic. Michael Chandler, one of the most relentless fighters in the UFC, shares his approach to balancing media pressure, preparation, and conserving mental energy in the days leading up to a monumental fight.

Legendary mindset coach Tim Grover, who trained Michael Jordan and Kobe Bryant, uncovers the difference between athletes who “compete” and those who win at winning—and why obsession isn’t a flaw, but a requirement. Finally, David Goggins brings his raw and unfiltered perspective on pushing past self-imposed limits, facing inner demons, and how confronting your past can set you free to pursue your greatest potential.

Key Takeaways:

- The power of specific visualization to anticipate and prepare for adversity.
- How elite performers handle the intense pressure of high-stakes moments.
- Why obsession and an unbalanced focus are often the real keys to sustained success.
- The role of relentless accountability in achieving the extraordinary.

This episode isn’t just about fighting—it’s about winning in every area of your life. These lessons apply whether you’re stepping into a ring, leading a team, or navigating life’s challenges. If you’re ready to uncover what separates the good from the great and apply these strategies to your own journey, you won’t want to miss this one.

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