MI Rewind: Developing Irrational Self-Belief and Top Tips for Success w/ Evan Carmichael

22:27That would actually do better than my 10 rules for success from Kanye West because people would love to see that. I just don't want to put that out. Like that's not helpful for me. So a lot of it is a reflection of what do I want to learn most right now and how much content is out there. So I love learning from Kanye. He was the first top 10 that we did. There's not a lot of great new content out that I can leverage or use. I love learning from Steve Jobs, but there is no new content coming out from Steve Jobs. I also love learning from Tony Robbins, who was a guest on my show on the weekend, and Gary Vee and Tom Bilyeu.

22:59And a lot of these people now, I only studied years ago, and now I can text them, which is pretty cool. You start to build up your name, I guess. I mean, it's been 13 years or whatever now in the industry. So it's been a great privilege to study these people and then be able to call, at least some of them, your friends. I'm not texting Tony Robbins, but I can text Tom Bilyeu and Brendan Burchard and some of those guys. Now, when I look at your website, I see all of these things going on. You've wrote a number of books. You post YouTube videos every single day. I'm curious, as someone that's been on this journey for many years and you've done many, many things, and it feels like you have a lot lot of stuff going on.

23:37What does your typical day look like? I struggled a lot with this, Clay. And my solution, which thankfully we came to, was I do different things on different days. Not only am I doing a lot of things, which is great and fulfilling. I think as entrepreneurs, we like having a lot on our plate. We don't just do one thing. And I have 37 people on my team. So that also helps me get a lot done that it's not just me doing everything. Otherwise, it wouldn't happen. Different things on different days. I struggle with switching between different tasks. I mean, everybody struggles with it, but I think I extra struggle with it.

24:10So for me to go from doing a live stream to writing my book, to figuring out investment strategies, to whatever, just too much switching costs. So I do different days, different things. So we're recording this on a Thursday. Thursday is my public facing day. Just before this, I was going live on my YouTube channel. That's how you said in the pre-show, hey, I was just watching you live on the YouTube channel. Great. I was there. now I'm here. I'm going to do something else later. I had a bunch of stuff before and it's the same energy. So I'm not thinking about my YouTube channel. I'm not thinking about making new content.

24:40I'm not thinking about my next book. I'm not thinking about my investing strategies. I'm not thinking about NFTs or Bitcoin or anything. All I'm thinking about is my extrovert hat on and I'm spreading the message today. And it's all day just doing lives and going on people's shows. Monday is my mentoring day where all I do is focus on my team. Mentor my team. We got 37 people. they matter, they need to grow. The growth of my company is much more about how well they do versus how well I do at this point. So I'm mentoring my company. Tuesday is YouTube day. I'm filming videos all day long, just content, content, content.

25:11Wednesday's project day, whatever project I want to work on, Thursday public facing day. Friday is my CEO day. Saturday is my fun day. Sunday is family admin day, and then repeat. So it allows me to get a lot more productive and also happier and not lose so much time in between different projects. So I think being able to chunk your time out like that based off energy makes a big difference. I really like that. Do you ever feel burnt out or do you have a cutoff on when you'll stop working or do you adjust with maybe how you're feeling? I'm curious how you approach that too as an entrepreneur. Yeah.

25:47People ask me about burnout because we've done 12 ,000 videos. Not all of them are public. you know, that's over 13 years. I don't see work-life balance. It's just life. You know, like, is this work? It's not work for me. Maybe it's work for you. I don't know, but it's not work for me. Like, this is fun. I see clay in here. This is going to be fun. Like this conversation is giving me more energy than it's taking. I'm an introvert. I'm shy by nature. So when I start my day on a Thursday doing interviews and stuff, my first one is probably the worst. And then the energy I brought here is from my YouTube live stream.

26:17And then I'm going to take clay energy and poured into the next person. And I have more energy than I had at the beginning because of this, because of you. So this is just all life. This isn't work. And so I think you burn out from doing too much of the stuff that you don't like. If I had to do accounting all day long, I would burn out in three days. I'd be out. Tap, I'm out. I'd be burnt out. But doing this, I love. And all those different things on different days, all of those things fill me up for those days. And stepping into my schedule should feel exhausting and crazy. But this is my life.

26:48I love it. And me stepping into Clay's life should be terrible for me. Like, oh my God, I don't want to do that. I don't want to research guests and talk investing all day long. And they're like, what are you talking about? That's the best stuff ever. Carmichael, let's go. So I think you burn out from doing too much of the stuff that you don't enjoy. And I've always just pivoted my business to do things that I enjoy. I got it. I really like that as well. Another question I had related to your content, I think many people can get stuck consuming it and not actually doing anything or taking action.

27:18And you alluded to this earlier, how successful people, they recognize a problem and they take action on it and they stay persistent and stay consistent with it. What advice do you have for people that feel stuck and are really just consuming information and not really doing anything about it? One, recognize yourself for even having that awareness. That's awesome. That's a great place to know where you're stuck. Most people feel stuck and have no idea why. So to know that you're just watching content and you're not doing anything about it is already great awareness. So instead of beating yourself up for it, I'm like pat myself on the back.

27:52Hey, congratulations. Figuring out what your blind spot is, is the hardest part of the game. So you've already done it. Two, whenever you catch yourself thinking like that, now what's the action we can go off and take? So you know you're thinking like that. You're still likely going to think about it and not ever catch it. But when you do catch it, what are you going to do? You got to go do something. So the fact that you've caught it right now means what's an idea that you've got? What's something that you want to do, whether it's entrepreneurship or YouTube or investing or whatever? What is the thing?

28:18And then using that as leverage to go off and actually create the thing that's in your mind. And then three, I would say the more that you stay in it, you will naturally get pulled towards it. It's just a question of timing. If somebody is listening to Clay, how many episodes have you done, Clay? I've recorded 20 to 30 interviews. I do the Millennial Investing Show that's released twice a week. And then Robert does the Real Estate 101 podcast. That's released once a week. Cool. So if you listen to Clay twice a week, and you're just listening and you're passive, and you're folding your laundry or mowing the lawn or something, you got something going on in the background.

28:51But if you're listening every week, twice a week, it may not be the pace that you want, but Clay will pull you towards doing something. You will get to the point where you get so frustrated that you haven't done anything. Or for whatever reason, even though you've heard Clay say the same thing 48 times before, the 49th, the way he said it, just hit you and now you're ready to go off and do it. So don't judge yourself so harshly. I think we're way too hard on ourselves and we should be our own worst critic, but we're not enough of our own cheerleader as well. So you can't be harder because you don't cheer yourself on enough.

29:25So even if you've caught that you're stuck, amazing. If you keep listening to Clay or keep listening to me or keep watching my videos or whatever the thing is that you're stuck consuming, it will eventually pull you to where you need to go. It's just, are you happy with that timeline? And if not, then you can make it faster. On the YouTube live we did just before, people were like, how are you so knowledgeable? Like, well, I've consumed a whole bunch of content. I watch my own stuff and we use it. And every time Clay brings on a guest, he learns something that maybe makes him a little smarter to ask a different question to the next guest.

29:53Or maybe he applies something to his life or his investing. Same thing for you guys. You're listening, you're watching. You pick up a strategy or an idea from one of the guests and you go do something with it. So don't feel like a failure and feel like you suck, that you're only listening and you're only watching and never do anything with it, you're on the path and you're ahead of most people. It may not be fast enough for you and you can ramp up that timeline if you really want to. It's doable, but you're still on the path and walking a journey and Clay will take you to the promised land if you keep listening.

30:22I love the super positive attitude you bring in literally every single one of your videos. It's really a part of your brand that I really like. I mean, it's not a brand, right? It's like, it's me. And this is one of the things I struggled the most with when I, where did believe come from? Believe is my brand. Well, it came from me not liking the tagline on my website. And I thought, oh, my tagline sucks. I need to fix my tagline. This is terrible. And the more I looked at it, the more I realized, oh, it's not even the tagline that my business is all about. It's me that I'm bringing to my business.

30:55So then it becomes, who am I that I'm then bringing to my company? And that's where belief came from. And I hope I'm congruent. If ever I show up on a podcast and it's like, hey, man, you're pretty negative. Oh man, really? I didn't mean to be. I wonder what I was drinking or who I was talking to before or something. Because my intention, at least, I may not always live up to it, but the intention is to spread more belief in every opportunity that I can. I took a look at your book, Built to Serve as well, which you released, I believe, last year. And you're a big believer in finding your purpose and living that out.

31:30What would you tell someone that knows they aren't where they want to be in life, but they really aren't sure what their purpose is? And somebody out on the internet like Evan Carmichael is telling them to start living out their purpose. Well, you're never where you want to be in life. I mean, that's good. I'm not where I want to be. Clay is not where he wants to be. We always want to have something that we're shooting towards. There's a great phrase, I forget who said it, but there's a saying that's, beyond the mountain, there's more mountains. I really like it. Yeah. Because we think about climbing to get to the top of the mountain, but the goal is not to get to the top of the mountain.

32:04The goal is to climb forever because there's always something that we're learning. No matter how much you know about investing, there's always something new that you can learn about investing. And that's the juice of life, right? If you hit a goal and you don't know where you're going next, you're now going into depression. We want to always feel like we're growing and learning and getting better and improving and taking the next step up. If you feel like you're not where you want to be, congratulations, you're human. That's good. Everybody wants that. If you felt totally comfortable and never growing, you'd end up completely hating your life.

32:32Humans need growth. Hopefully, you don't think I'm yelling at you to go find your purpose. If you feel like you're capable of more and you're struggling to figure out what your purpose is, then understand again that your purpose comes from your pain. Like whatever you think back to the lowest moment in your life, when you felt the most worthless as a human being, whatever that was, doesn't mean you were suicidal or something, but when did you feel the lowest and you've got out of it? You've done things, right? Like right now, your life is an impossibility. If you look at your life, Clay, what you're doing right now, you're on this, you're interviewing guests on this podcast.

33:02Think about Clay five years ago. It's like, this is impossible what you're doing now. It's like, there's no way you're going to be here. There's no way this is going to be happening for you. and yet you've done it. You're an impossibility to younger you. And so there's lots of younger yous out there who also feel like it's impossible. And your story, your message, whatever you did to get out of the hole you're in is teachable. And they'll listen to you in a way that they won't listen to Evan Carmichael or Ray Dalio or Oprah Winfrey or whoever, right? They'll listen to you because you are exactly like them.

33:31And that's the ultimate, we are built to serve. We love it. It'd be great to hold the door for somebody or buy the cup of coffee for somebody behind you in line, awesome. But when you can see somebody who basically is younger you and you see their eyes light up that, oh my gosh, this life is actually possible. I could do that instead of staying stuck here. That's the best thing of all time. And we all have that. And no matter how low you are, you were worse before. And so being able to help those people, I think is the way through. Let's take a quick break and hear from today's sponsors. Hey, it's Sean O'Malley, just popping in with a quick message.

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37:17That's theinvestorspodcast.com slash tip-finance. All right, back to the show. That's one of my favorite things about being a host is that it puts me out there and allows me the opportunity to teach others. People reach out to me with specific questions about investing or ask me to bring on a guest that they would like to learn more from. It's just a really unique position to be in. And I really enjoy helping people out as much as I can. First off, everybody loves helping people, right? It's baked into us. So I think humans are good. I think we're naturally good. So why is there so much negativity and somebody's coming to your podcast, leaving a nasty comment or on a YouTube video if they're good?

38:01Well, I think hurt people hurt people. I think they're just really hurt. I think people are in a lot of pain. And if you're honest with yourself when you were in a lot of pain and struggling with something, were you always your best self? Were you always so kind and nice and helping people with their finances and guiding it? It's like, no, you're probably not that you are necessarily that rude, but looking back, there's lots of moments, me too, that was not best Evan right there because I was in pain. So most people, they're just in a ton of pain, but everybody wants to serve. Everybody wants to do good.

38:30But then diving deeper into that, why you love it so much isn't just because it's a big problem for everybody. That's a nice macro thing. Is it a problem for America? Of course, but so is lots of other stuff. Why are you not solving global warming or pollution or malaria? There's lots of stuff that you could be solving. There's something that happened to you that you realized how important finances were in your life that when you realize that, you're like, oh my gosh, why didn't I learn this before? How come we didn't learn this in school? I can do this. I need to go tell the world about this stuff.

39:00So yes, it's a big problem, but it's a problem that's meaningful and personal to you. And we all have something similar. I love investing. I bought my first stock at 12 or 13. I thought I wanted to be an investment banker and stock broker and all this stuff. Realized it wasn't the path for me. So know enough about the world, but that's not my passion, like financial education. My passion is helping entrepreneurs believe in themselves more. And so when you figure out that thing that's personal to you, there's so many great causes, but Clay does not care about saving a chimpanzee as much as he does about teaching financial education.

39:29That's great. There's nothing wrong with that. We all have our own thing that we should care about. That's funny you mentioned that you enjoyed learning about investing earlier on in life. I went back and watched one of your Warren Buffett videos in inspiration for this interview. And YouTube showed me that I had already watched one of your Warren Buffett videos that was published back in 2015, seven years ago. It's just crazy how the world kind of loops back on itself sometimes. How back in 2015, I got inspiration from one of your videos about Warren Buffett learned how he became this giant investment mogul.

40:03And now we're speaking today, it's just a crazy world. That's cool, man. Thank you for sharing that. Yeah. It's funny how those things go. And a lot of it is just staying in the game long enough and great things start to happen. For most of us, just like compounding interest, we quit too soon on things. And when you can compound it, it's going to have just a much bigger impact. So that's awesome. I mean, for me, I cared a lot about investing. I wanted to make money. I didn't know how to do it. I asked my parents, they said, go be a banker because bankers make money, right? So it's like, it's not really the greatest advice, I guess.

40:35How do I make a lot of money? What stocks do I buy? I had this little stock competition when I was in maybe high school, I don't remember. And I asked my parents, okay, what stocks do I buy? They go buy the banks, the big four Canadian banks, Royal Bank and TD Bank. And like, okay, cool. They didn't really outperform our win, but that was my entry into that world. I really loved it. I thought I wanted to be a financial advisor, investment broker or something. Anyway, my path took a different turn, but pretty familiar with the world. I'm super curious. As an entrepreneur with a rapidly growing business, you're hiring people, you're figuring out ways to expand the business.

41:08How do you think about investing? Do you have your own portfolio? Are you focused on your own businesses? Do you invest in other businesses? What does that look like for you? Yeah, that'd be interesting, especially for this audience, because I'm probably coming from a different perspective. I tell the people around me, so accountants, lawyers, life insurance people, et cetera, that my heart is in my business and my head is in my wallet. So I will take more risks in my business. I care deeply about what I do. It's something I need to wake up and feel like today's going to matter in my business.

41:40But for my financial side, I go, I don't care, whatever makes sense. I'm not emotional. I need to go buy this stock because it's going to take off. I've also gravitated towards a much, and maybe your perspective could be helpful in this. I was doing some numbers and I bought companies that I like, believed in the owners. So I bought in Facebook, I bought Amazon, I still hold those. And then I bought ETFs, XIC, I'm Canadian. So that's our big XIC, BlackRock. I was doing some numbers and I was comparing it to real estate where people go, you leverage your real estate to then buy a home and you make money off the whole upside while paying really low interest rates.

42:15Why not do that in the stock market? I would never leverage against Facebook. I'm just too risk adverse for that. I mean, people do all the time. You take margin, great. That just feels way too risky for me. But to leverage the market, to leverage the ETF, like leverage the entire Canadian stock market or the entire Dow Jones or whatever, I would bet on that if you have a long enough horizon, right? Like if I don't need the money in the next three years. So I'm actually shifting my strategy to sell out of every individual stock because I think I'll make more money leveraging the index than I will whatever upside Facebook or Amazon gives me with zero risk.

42:49Over a five-year period, what's the risk? 10-year period, 15 years, there's zero risk. It's going to go up. And unless it's just completely different compared to historical numbers. And a lot of the financial advisors are like, well, that's way too risky to go into debt. We do it all the time for real estate. I think the big thing to really think about with that is to ensure that you're not going to get a margin call. If you're getting close to a margin call, I would be sure that you're earning enough money or you have enough money on the side that you can put into your portfolio to ensure that you aren't going to be forced to sell your stocks during a major correction.

43:22Because during a correction, when stocks are down, that's the worst time to sell stocks. Historically, any correction has been a major buying opportunity. That would be the biggest concern I can think of, just ensure that a margin call is not going to be happening to you. And I think working with a reputable broker that communicates how they work, the margin system is also important. Sure. But you can account for that. Don't go up against the max. I don't know what the limits are in the US. We have 70%. It's probably higher for you guys in how much you can go. So if I do 40%, for me to ever get a margin call, you could design it so that the market would have to drop 20 % a year for three years in a row to ever get a margin call, which has never happened.

44:05right? You can design it for that. I'm a risk adverse guy. My head is in my wallet. That feels like the safest thing of all time and just smart. If interest rates are low enough, right? I mean, if the interest payments are higher, then that's a different story if interest rates go up, but in our current environment. Anyway, so these are the conversations that I'm having. I'm about to do a major life insurance policy. I want to take out the money to then invest into ETFs and then leverage against ETFs. So there aren't any trends that you're looking at? You aren't investing in Google to get behind the YouTube trend or anything else.

44:38No, not enough. Historically, it's bet on the person. You may not love Jeff Bezos or Mark Zuckerberg, but I would bet on them. And I would bet on them more than I would bet on a company. People ask me about Tesla and Elon Musk. He's done super well. I would not bet on Elon Musk. As an entrepreneur, I would. In my money, I wouldn't. I think it's too... And he's done super well. So it's proven me wrong, but too much of a loose cannon for me to put my significant, you know, putting significant worth into that. But I think it's actually much less risky with a much higher upside. A part of you're going like penny stocks or something, then your massive speculation or NFTs or something, I don't know how much you get into that side of things on the show.

45:18But I think it's actually much less risky with similar or more upside to just leverage the market than to unleverage, to not leverage, go after individual stocks. I think Warren Buffett would be shaking his head right now. I love the conversation. Show me the calculations. You can design a portfolio where you never get a margin call. Assume minus 20 % in the markets for three years in a row. Assume that, which has never happened, right? I mean, at least in Canada, it's never happened. Great. You can design your portfolio that X percent on margin, you would never get a margin call. So where's the risk?

45:52versus buying a single stock, like Facebook, which I own, or Meta, that then tanks and one day or Zuck dies or something and the whole thing goes away. Those are real risks. I hate debt, dude. I have zero debt. I have, I guess, real estate debt, but in my business, zero debt. So I don't like this strategy. It makes me anxious, but I don't understand that I see zero risk. I get where you're coming from, for sure. I mean, especially with the higher inflation we have, if inflation persists, then that is a definitely winning scenario, assuming inflation doesn't end up hurting the stock market. Well, and if you take out a loan to buy more of the index as an investment through an investment company, you can write off the interest.

46:32You're getting tax deductions too to do it. So you said the quote, your heart's in your business, but your head's in your wallet. What do you mean by the head in your wallet piece? Does that mean you're just maximizing the amount of dollars that you have, maximizing the returns you can get. What do you mean by that? Yeah. Basically, it's like, I'm safe with my investments, which then my accountants always say, well, why would you want to go into debt? Because it's safe. This just makes sense. You're going to make a lot more money doing it. And the market's never dropped 20 % a year for three years.

47:03And when I say this more, this came up a lot in the discussion with life insurance and taking out debt against the life insurance. Real estate is what a lot of people will put their money into. do. I'm not a fan of real estate, just in general. I don't like it. But if it makes sense, I'll do it. Show me how it's better. If I'm all in, I don't want to manage it. I don't want to have to pick a property. I want to manage it. I don't want to find tenants. I don't want to do any work. If I buy the index, I'm doing zero work. So I want it to be as hands-off as just buying an index. And I don't care about liquidity.

47:32I'm going to hold forever. Buy, borrow, die. So just hold forever and then borrow against it. So I don't care about liquidity. That's a knock against real estate, right? You can't get out of the house as easily as you can just sell the index, fine. But if somebody came and showed me, and I put this to my financial team too, like show me if real estate is better. And even though I personally am not a fan, I would much rather own XIC. I'd much rather own the index. I'd much rather own Amazon. Like it's a much better store than I just own the born ETF and I leverage it and there it goes, right? But I don't need to get my excitement from the stock market.

48:04I don't get my purpose from my investments. And to be able to say that but I backed this company and I knew I get enough of that in my company. That's what I do day to day. So the bank stuff, the wallet stuff, the investment stuff, it has to work. Now I want to know what Warren Buffett would say about my leverage, the index. I am curious. You've been running the channel now for call it 13 years. What's next for Evan Carmichael? I'm here on the show, man. Let's do it. This is what's happening. I don't have a three-year plan or 10-year plan. I think if you have a 10-year plan for yourself, you're thinking small.

48:40I think from a financial side, you might be able to, right? For the numbers and that side and say, okay, if I save X amount and keep investing and compound, historically, it's going to be around this. I think that's smart financial planning. But again, that's like head stuff where your life is heart stuff. If you, Clay, tried to design your life five years ago, you wouldn't have said you'd be here. So why do you think you know where you're going to be in the next five years, right? You don't. Not if you're growing, not if you're learning, not if you're getting better and improving and investing in yourself.

49:08And so it's not that it's wrong to have a five-year plan. You have to be willing to jump off. If I'm making my life insurance deal, that's until I'm 100. That's crazy. I'm not thinking until I'm 100, but you can, and that makes sense, and it's logical and practical, and you should. But your life is hard. You need to be doing work that you enjoy and you love and is purposeful and is filling you and you feel meaningful every day. Seeing numbers go up in your bank account will not give you meaning every day. So that's what you can't plan for. So what's next for Evan Carmichael? Have you said on the investment side, okay, well, here, I got my life insurance, hopefully leverage the market.

49:44Clay is going to tell me why Warren Buffett thinks it's a dumb idea and I might adjust. Great. That's the plan. Life and business, heart, I have no idea. I'm here. This is what I'm doing, doing this show. And the willingness to say yes to the next thing, because I'm not trapped by what I said I was going to do in my three-year plan three years ago. But it's got to be big. It's got to be towards the mission. I want to solve the world's biggest problem. That doesn't change. I want people to believe in themselves more. That will never change. So the next thing I do, maybe it's not YouTube anymore.

50:13At some point, YouTube's been a great run. But if Clay and I are doing this in 10 years, we're going to be in each other's living rooms or something. We're going to be in our VR headset, a hologram world or whatever. So it's not being so attached. If my X-year goal was to have X number of subscribers on YouTube, I think that's a silly goal because three years in, maybe I'm supposed to be jumping off of YouTube and starting a company with clay, changing the world in VR. Yeah. You're always ready to hop on that next opportunity and continue to adapt to continue to fulfill that mission. But that's terrible financial planning, right?

50:46Oh, Bitcoin's here. So let me just put all my money in Bitcoin, right? You have to know trends and you have to have a solid plan. If you're looking at this as your life, you need this money for the rest of your life, you're creating the plan for yourself, then you have to have more long-term forecasting. And you can do that to a high degree in the finance world. You can't do it in entrepreneurship and life. Evan, before I let you go, I wanted to give you a chance to give a handoff to our audience so they know where they can go to get connected with you. Where can they go to find you? I'm Evan Carmichael, pretty much anywhere.

51:21We talk a lot about my YouTube channel, so that's probably the easiest spot. Go watch the 2015 Warren Buffett investment advice video that helped Clay get started on his journey. That's probably a good one. Maybe we'll link that up in the show notes. Yeah. I mean, I'm on every platform, basically, Evan Carmichael. Awesome. Thank you so much, Evan. I really appreciate it. And it was a great time chatting with you. Appreciate you, man. Take care. All right, everybody. I hope you enjoyed today's episode. Please go ahead and follow us on your favorite podcast app so you can get these episodes delivered automatically.

51:53And if you haven't already done so, be sure to check out our website, theinvestorspodcast.com. There you'll find all of our episodes, some educational resources we have, as well as some tools you can use as an investor. And with that, we'll see you again next time.

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