MI350: Building a Self-Publishing Empire w/ Nick Di Fabio

24:14I'm a big fan of a guy named Kevin Kelly, who was an editor of Wired magazine. And he explained it, the way he thought of it was like, it's like having an intern do the writing for you, but you wouldn't have your intern, you wouldn't put that out as the final product, right? You still need to have the boss come in and edit it and clean it up and not use the intern's work as your own. That's very well said. Yeah. Kevin Kelly's from that 1 ,000 True Fans. I think I I remember reading that essay on time, which is really good. That's really well said. Yeah, I agree with that 100%. Let's get into that a little bit.

24:48Now that we're talking about Kevin Kelly and 1 ,000 True Fans, talk a little bit about what that is for people that aren't familiar with it. And then does that same concept and idea apply to publishing? Yeah. So this idea of 1 ,000 True Fans is born from the fact that you don't need to be... Not everyone needs to buy your services or product. You can have, relatively speaking, the world is huge. And to have 1 ,000 people that appreciate what you do goes a long way because there's word of mouth and so many benefits from having that core group. It certainly applies to publishing for sure. I think the idea is that when you launch these books, you want to make the most of those first few readers, whether it's 100 people, 1 ,000 people or more.

25:34because you know that if there's a positive experience there, it will absolutely lead to them telling people that they know about your book or having the book available at their house or that sort of thing for other people to see. So in my opinion, it can definitely apply. And the other way it applies too is one of the cool things you can do in this space is build email lists, right? So you can build email lists for a group of people that are going to be basically looking for your book every time there's a new release on that topic. So that's a really cool opportunity as well. Let's get into that a little bit more about the marketing side of it.

26:06For somebody that doesn't have a huge social media following, maybe they're an introvert, actually, and they just don't spend much time on Twitter or whatever, Instagram or wherever people are promoting stuff these days. How would you recommend that they actually market their book, promote it, get the word out there? I've interviewed several authors. In fact, I'm interviewing one tomorrow. And they go on this massive publicity spree prior to the book launch, doing podcasts, doing all the Twitter stuff and really just pushing. And this is traditional publishing, but really pushing to get the word out about their book.

26:40Because if it doesn't... What they were saying was like, if it doesn't hit pretty quickly, it disappears. So it doesn't matter if it's the best book in the world. If it doesn't gain traction pretty early on in the traditional publishing world, it just drops off the radar. Yeah, absolutely. You have about 30 to 60 days to really maximize that new launch honeymoon phase. So the best way to answer this question is I learned this in 2020 when the world was shutting down there a little bit. In March, 2020, my wife just gave birth to our second child and I was like, okay, this is not looking good. The kids are home, they're newborn.

27:15So I was like, let me just 80-20 my launch plan. 80-20, right? All I did was focused on reviews and Amazon ads. That was it. That was it. And it worked. The book did very well. So I was like, huh, that was interesting. Let me do that again. Sure enough, that worked as well. So Amazon, as we always, is a review-based platform. So the reviews show relevancy. If you could show relevancy, plus you have Amazon ads that back up the relevancy, people buying your book, that is a formula for success. You can certainly, if you have your own personal brand behind you, you can definitely do this book tour, Twitter thing.

27:52But from my experience, you don't have to. You don't have to. You can go out there and leverage, in my opinion, reviews, Amazon ads. If you have some sort of email list, even better, friends, family, and with the option of going all out if you choose. But I'm a big believer in doing the 80-20 approach. And to me, those two things are really what can drive tons of sales and visibility to your book. You mentioned the 80-20. Are you familiar with Richard Koch, I think is the guy's name, C-O-C-H. He's written a lot about the 80-20 principle. The Star Principle is one of his books that is really fantastic.

28:24Had some great interviews on the Tim Ferriss podcast. I do like his books. I've gotten to see them on my bookshelf right now. I'm looking at the 80-20 principle was a good one. Definitely have to learn about him through Tim Ferriss. And yeah, that approach I think is really critical because I think anytime you're doing something, you can do so many things. You can do so many different things, right? And that's what I was doing when I first started. It was a scattershot approach, a bunch of different niches, a bunch of different high content, low content, medium content books. Let me do X launch plan and then Y launch plan.

28:55But I think once you have done that phase, like, okay, let me just slow down here. What are the literally three to five things that matter? Okay, let me relentlessly focus on those three to five things. And inevitably, those always lead to results. I wanted to hear a little bit about what the startup costs are for somebody. So I'm just getting started. I want to write my first book. I'm going to outsource most of it. What can I expect to spend to get it to the point where it's on Amazon and ready to be distributed? So this is very niche dependent. This is very niche dependent. So for instance, let's say you want to write a children's book, right?

29:33Children's book, children's fiction, for instance, that does quite well. You're looking at illustrations, looking at the content piece, and then the marketing side of it. So I always tell people, budget anywhere from 500 bucks to two grand in that space. For the most part, that's a really good starting range. If you really want to outsource all of it, probably more in the probably two to three K range for outsourcing at all. And that includes the cover, the content, perhaps even the editing, formatting, that sort of thing. And so that's kind of the approximate investment. And if you want, you can go all out.

30:03I know some people will create these sort of massive, what I call them home run books that have maybe a hundred thousand words, these authority-based books that are going to be a little more expensive than that, but those can also make three, four or 500 bucks plus a day. So those can be at home runs. I heard you mentioned the importance of having a quick win when people are just getting started. What do you mean by that? What is a quick win? What does a quick win book look like? Yeah. Quick wins, I think are important. I think are very important for people to get that dopamine hit and continue on doing things.

30:35So quick wins, examples of quick win books could be books that have repetitive content inside. So maybe someone in my program published a book on Yahtzee score sheets. And they did the title, the subtitle, they got the cover all done by someone on Fiverr. And they were basically launched within about two or three weeks. Is that book going to make you a lot of money? No, but you're going to learn the process and maybe still make 10, 20 bucks a day off of that. Another example of a quick win book is let's say you want to go into a niche like investing, right? So it's a pretty big topic. You have this real estate investing, crypto investing, all sorts of different types of investing.

31:13Maybe book number one in that series is intro to investing. Maybe a short 10 ,000 word book to just get used to the process, get a book up there, published, and then boom, go from there. And then once you have the book, you mentioned different ways you can produce it. There's Audible, which is becoming really popular. Do you produce it in many different formats once it's finished? Huge fan of that. Huge fan of that. I think that's really one of the advantages of publishing is you're creating these assets. So you have the ebook, paperback, hardcover, sometimes spiral bound, audio version. And I'm a huge fan of translations, Amazon Germany, France, Spain, Italy, huge markets, other markets are growing.

31:59So the way I tell people is to take that original idea you had and then go as many possible formats as possible and then as wide as possible. And outside Amazon is a good option too. I also heard you mention about creating bonus content for a book. What is bonus content? What does that look like? Yeah, bonus content is there to sort of help people. It makes your book a no-brainer to buy. So bonus content examples could be things like workbooks that go with your book that make it more actionable. Bonus content should be bonus audio that is sort of included with the book. Things that, for instance, people do cookbooks and they may have meal plans to go with the book.

32:40So I'm a big believer in just enhancing the value of your book. You become unstoppable, in my opinion, and hard to compete with if you have all the fundamentals place that we mentioned earlier, plus these enticing bonuses, that's an excellent formula for success. So you have written... How many books at this point? How many books have you produced at this point? Oh, I've published well over 250. And you've had over a million dollars in revenue? Yes. That's awesome. As you are going about your day-to-day life, I'm just curious how you structure your day-to-day. Are you continually working on a book, producing a new book?

33:19Or do you kind of have stuff, is 250 enough at this point that you can kind of rest and sit back and allow the royalties to kick in? Or talk to me a little bit about how your days are structured. Yeah, for sure. So I should preface this by saying as well that those 250, a lot of them were done during my scattershot phase. So speaking of the 80-20 rule, that definitely applies to this. So for the most part, the book creation process itself, how I approach it is through a checklist. Have you ever heard of a Kanban board? I'm going to say that right. It's this sort of philosophy from agile productivity.

33:52And you just, you have essentially these columns and then tasks underneath each column. So for instance, in the book creation phase, you know, you might have, you know, choose niche, create title, create subtitle, and then outsource the content. And then the book launch phase, you might have those tasks that led to the book launch. So I've basically created a process, a checklist, a system that I follow for every book. I follow for every book. So what I like to do is like to batch things up at this point. I like to usually go into one category, one niche, create three to five books in that space so I can leverage the power of having a catalog.

34:26And that's typically how I do it. In terms of how I structure my day, for the most part, my main focus right now is on the education piece, helping the members of the program do well. So I typically have my days filled with a couple days a week for calls. And the rest of the time, I'm doing some deep work, creating Cal Newport for that. On things to just improve the program, to learn more, to just create something special. If you want to exit, how do you exit? You create this business. Are there exits in the publishing business? And what is that like? Yeah, this was a surprise to me. So I kind of fell into this.

35:03So I sold one pen name for$71 ,000. And what happened with that was the process basically looks like this. You create a series of books, ideally. No one is going to want to buy just one book that's doing well. They're going to want to see multiple books. Essentially, if you can have a revenue stream of royalties in the say$2 ,000 a month range, even higher is better, of course, but minimum$2 ,000 a month for the better part of 12 months, you have an asset that can be sold. There's multiple sites out there. Empire Flippers is pretty much the gold standard as far as I'm concerned. Flippa as well as the old school one in there.

35:36And the process looks like you have a business. So you have your accounting in place, You have your spreadsheet on your income, your expenses. And then you basically post your listing on one of these sites, on these web broker sites. And you attract people that are looking to buy the publishing business. And the reason why they're attracted to them, I found out, is because one, the margins are pretty good. I tell people, if you're not doing 60 % margins in publishing, something is going wrong. Something is off. And also too, it's this idea of, as mentioned earlier, having these multiple assets out there that are making you money 24-7 is an attractive idea for investors.

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39:11Between the screener and Legend Investment Portfolios to reference, I've gotten a ton of ideas from TIP Finance. What are you waiting for? Take the next step in your investment journey today with the right tools at your fingertips. Grab your device and type into your browser, theinvestorspodcast.com slash tip-finance to get started. That's theinvestorspodcast.com slash tip-finance. All right, back to the show. So you did an exit and it was what, 71 ,000? You sold the, and it was a series of books? it was yes it was a short series of books that had been doing well for the better part of i think it was 18 months or so and yeah it was just i had someone come actually i got a cold email i had a cold email from someone saying look i'm looking to buy these businesses and i was like kind of confused i was like buy the publishers what do you mean so kind of went from there in terms of the process yeah so that was interesting and is that kind of a business plan going forward for you like do you expect to do that to replicate that keep doing it if you can yes definitely so So I think, and this actually comes from Tim Ferriss too, is this idea of even if you don't want to sell your business, you should still build it with the intention of selling it.

40:23So it becomes an actual business versus something that takes over your life. So I tell everyone that you should approach it like that, right? So yeah, my vision right now is to build my current business to exit for quite a bit more than 71K. Actually, funny story for you. Someone in my mastermind group, he was in the fiction space. he sold his business to a California real estate investor who had no experience with publishing, almost seven figures. And it was interesting. I was like, just, I was like shocked. I was like, that's crazy. But this investor liked the numbers, liked the fact that they had a good system in place for creating books and it was pretty hands-off.

40:57And yeah, so that was definitely eye-opening. I wanted to get into a little bit. We talked earlier, I've got a company that does cost segregation studies. You mentioned a real estate investor. This is a study that's done for real estate investors to allow them to increase their cash flow, save on taxes. And I wanted to get your thoughts on creating a cost segregation book. It's a very specialized niche. Even most... A lot of accountants don't even know much about it. A lot of real estate investors just don't know much about it. My partners and I are thinking like, well, maybe this idea of a book as a business card makes some sense.

41:34So can you talk to me a little bit about that, how I would go about it and just some general thoughts you have on that? That's cool, by the way. That's a really cool topic to be honest. I definitely shouldn't. I think the process for you would look like getting just kind of clear on what the purpose of the book is. And it sounds to me like it's just to get out there. Would you say it's to sort of build authority or generate leads or kind of both? Yeah, I would say both. Build authority and generate leads. Yeah. There's something about a book that I find that anyone that's written a book, it's like you put them a little on a pedestal.

42:05Yeah, absolutely. Absolutely. Yeah. So it definitely is that first step you have covered, right? Getting clear on what the goal of the book is. And then pretty much the same process applies, really focus on the fundamentals with having a beautiful cover, really outlining an excellent book, including those parts of the book that establish you as an authority. I'd also consider incorporating perhaps some sort of landing page or some way to capture emails so you can leverage that. You can put that right at the beginning of the book, perhaps a bonus, perhaps some sort of bonus, maybe a seven-day guide or a 30-day guide.

42:36I have some more ideas for you once I know more about your business. And then just following sort of a plan to launch your book, get it out there in front of tons of people. And then not only that, but also being able to sort of maintain that ranking. And in my worldview, your book should do that. So build authority, generate leads, and also make you some passive income. Heck, why not, right? Yeah, if you can. I mean, I think we would almost view it as we've got like an info pitch deck basically that explains what cost segregation is, but it'd be awesome to be able to hand somebody a physical book and say, this explains it really more in depth than our pitch deck does.

43:13But yeah, that would be our thought would be just to give it to people to if they want to go further down to understand what it is because it's, you know, taxes, generally people's eyes gloss over, but it's one of our biggest expenses. So it really pays to understand it. So we thought being able to hand them a physical book would be a great way to educate people and build authority, like you said. Yeah, absolutely. The cool thing for you is with that info pitch deck, you can definitely hand that off to a ghostwriter and have them use that as a resource to help create the book. And also too, I think one of the things that we didn't touch on yet, which I want to talk about, is there's this opportunity on Amazon.

43:48Everyone's on Amazon looking for books. But a real cool opportunity as well is to go beyond Amazon. So independent bookstores, colleges, libraries, universities, that's a really cool opportunity too. So you can take this idea of your authority book and not only be on Amazon, but be beyond Amazon, beyond the bookstores of some independent bookstore in Vancouver, Canada, or Rastrom, for instance, which is a cool thing. Yeah, that actually was my next question. was, is Amazon the only game in town? Or are there other avenues to explore for people that once they have their book, is it just on Amazon?

44:22Or do you seek out other platforms to sell it on? Yeah, there definitely are other platforms. Amazon is, of course, the big dog on the block. But then there's other platforms as well you can publish on. PublishDrive, IngramSpark, for instance, where you can get your books, as mentioned, physically in other places. Barnes & Noble, huge opportunity. What you'll find, I find with those places, is that independent bookstores, they are not going to go to amazon.com to buy their books. They're going to go to the wholesaling websites. So in your case, let's say, for instance, you publish this book on Amazon, ideally to number one new release, ideally to number one bestseller, which comes with a lot of authority as well.

45:02And then what you want to do is it's a matter of converting the files to these other platforms so you can have this worldwide distribution. I wanted to talk just about future trends. Where do you see the whole world of self-publishing going? What do you see unfolding? Definitely growth. I think for me, I think books are definitely a recession-proof space. People are always going to want to read books, especially having these physical books. That's always going to be something that people are going to crave. The trend that I'm really bullish on for books is, as you mentioned, the business card book.

45:36I think that's a really good strategy to have in place. And the other massive trend I'm seeing is translations. There are voracious readers in a lot of different countries that crave these high quality books, that are happy to buy them, and also to multiple formats. I'm not sure if you've ever done this, but maybe it's just me. I'm a little quirky, but I'll buy the ebook. And if I really like it, I'll buy the paperback version. And in some cases, if I really like it, I'll buy the audio version. So that is something that is available for people once they get into, as I mentioned, Amazon, Germany, France, Italy, Spain.

46:08that translation piece is something that I think is really going to grow as we go into the future. Is the quality of self-published books as high as it is as traditional publishing? I remember years ago, I did NaNoWriMo, which is like a national novel writing month, and thought about looking into publishing this really crappy novel that I wrote. And I studied a little bit about publishing. And the knock at that time, this was several years ago, was that self-published books or just like the quality is just not that good. So how does the quality compare to traditional publishing today? Pretty good, pretty close, pretty close.

46:45I think that Amazon's print on demand has come a long way. So one of the cool features of self-publishing is you don't actually have to carry any inventory, which is really cool. Here's a little hot tip. Here's a little hot tip is one of the opportunities is out there as well as, especially as your book starts to do well, you can start to explore doing things like doing physical products, versions of your books. What I mean by that is Amazon FBA, for instance. So what you can do is you can start to even take your book quality to the next level and start to pre-order some of your books from places, FBA suppliers, essentially, to have that version as well.

47:18So I'm sorry, what is FBA? It's fulfilled by Amazon. So if you go to Amazon.com, you'll see people have FBA toys and all sorts of things, basically. So FBA is another option for you where you're pre-ordering your book as maybe a traditional publishing house, make sure that the quality is even to that next level, but this time you are carrying some inventory. However, having said that though, honestly, the quality of the self-published books is, I mean, you can do matte, glossy, standard color, high quality, premium color. There's lots of options for you when it comes to publishing these books that it can be quite impressive.

47:56I wanted to hear a little bit about your academy, Publishing Profits Academy. How did that get started? Did you just have people start reaching out to you? I interviewed a guy that did a totally real estate investing and people started just reaching out to him. He was like taking calls all the time and it was the same calls over and over. So finally he created a masterclass. So I wanted to hear a little bit about your experience that with creating your academy. So it was kind of born out of, I was happy to publish for a long time on my own and had this idea of building public. You hear that quite a bit, building public.

48:28And what kind of spurred it for me was I actually helped someone close to me build a publishing business and they were, they need some help with some things. So I helped them. And I really enjoyed that. It was like, it was like rewarding to help them. That plus coupled with some things on YouTube. I've seen some people on YouTube talk about, in my opinion, some false information about folks on this low content journals and log books. And if you publish thousands of them, you know, my math is bad here, but thousands of them at a dollar per, you make a thousand bucks a month sort of thing, whatever.

48:56And I'm vehemently against that approach. I think quality is the path to go. So I started creating content on Twitter and people kind of flocked to it. They're flocking to it. And I was like, well, this is kind of cool. And my wife was like, well, just go with it. Just kind of go with it. People are interested in this topic. So then I was like, well, let me see if I can maybe just sort of build sort of lessons around how I've approached publishing, taking that sort of 80-20 approach and kind of make it no fluff. And yeah, here we are now, over a hundred members later, everyone from 80 years old to 19 years old and growing rapidly and really enjoyable.

49:31I'm really, it's really rewarding having people come to you, publish book, see that excitement. It's really cool. That is cool. And I've heard a lot of great reviews about the Academy. I wanted to hear a little bit about like how it's structured. Do you have like individual calls with you? What's the cost? I just, I'm very curious, actually for my own self, like if I do this cost segregation book, maybe this is the way to go is just have you walk me through the step-by-step? Yeah. So it's funny. I'm new to this whole sort of education space. So I'm learning as I go. But the way I structure right now is that there is a sort of...

50:06So you get access to everything right away, number one. So there's no drip feed. So you can access everything right away. There is a program checklist to follow. So it keeps you kind of on track. And so how I do it is there's a... The biggest... There's sort of welcome call. There's a niche review call, which we go into and it's 45 minutes an hour where we not only go through your niche, but we also kind of do a deep dive and okay, how now do we go about trading this book? So I'm a big believer on these calls to give some clear direct action steps. Like what are the two to three things, three to five things we need to do some concrete tasks.

50:40I call them tasty tasks because you look at them, they're so easy to do. So then from there, It's access to me through weekly calls. Oftentimes I offer DM support. There's a community as well. So I'm very active in there with making sure people get their questions answered. I oftentimes share things. I'm still an active publisher. I think it's important to be an active publisher if you're going to be able to teach these things. So the cost ranges. I mean, programs range usually around that$3 ,000 range for about 12-month access, plus all those pieces I mentioned. And then it ranges from there depending upon how much support you want.

51:13there's even some cases where people are like, Nick, I've got more money than time. So can you help me do a done for you option? So I have that as well. So it ranges. That's cool. And I imagine being a writer, publisher is a pretty solitary journey. I imagine doing the coaching gets you interacting with more people. I know for myself, doing the podcast, I have the interviews, but a lot of it is very solitary. So I imagine And doing the teaching fulfills some level of, I don't know, just human interaction that we all need. You know, that's been one of the huge benefits of this. Because as you say, it was, you know, I generally have a busy life with two kids and being married and such.

51:56But work-wise, though, it definitely is very solitary. And adding this piece to the mix of having these calls with people from all over the world, I'm enjoying it. I'm really enjoying it. It definitely adds another sort of layer to life, which has definitely been awesome. I wanted to hear, I'm looking at all those books behind you. I wanted to, and you're a book lover, I'm a book lover. I just wanted to get into just some books that have made a huge impact on you lately. Or not even lately, just books that have changed the course and direction of your life, maybe. Yeah, man. There's been so many.

52:30I think the one book that comes to mind right off the hop is The 50th Law, Robert Greene. And I remember listening to that book. Those are my 6pm to 6am days. I come back home, sleep from like 7 to noon, like maybe four or five hours of sleep. And I grab my headphones and go for a walk in downtown Vancouver, listening to that book. And this book was just the Robert Greene's voice, this idea about death, this idea about opportunities, and just 50 Cent Story was just so inspiring. So that book really pushed me towards leaving that sort of comfy job because it was a salary-based job to go out on my own.

53:09Have you read his other books too? I mean, the 48 Laws of Power was like what, 50 Cent? And a lot of those guys read to make it in the hip hop world, right? I think it was actually banned at one point in prisons. Yes. 48 Laws of Power, 33 Strategies of War. He's got so many good books. Mastery is also good. Yeah, definitely a big fan of Robert Bean, definitely a big influence. And then related to the 50th Law book was On the Shortness of Life by Seneca, out this book right here. So once every few months, I'll actually read that. I'll go to a coffee shop or something. I'll reread that story for the essay.

53:42It just really puts things in perspective from daily tasks that we all have to do, fill up our time. And then in terms of... I'll give you two more books that have been a practical one. The other one I forgot was The Slow Productivity. That's probably the most recent one that's had the biggest impact on me. Just this idea of really honing in on your missions and projects, limiting them, and also how to approach productivity on a practical level. And so I think that those are a good selection of books. There's definitely a few others that have impacted me for sure. Built to Sell, John Warlow was a really good one too.

54:17That book was really easy to read. And this idea of that mentality of putting yourself in a position to have this asset, you know, you create this asset to sell it should you choose, I think is a really good approach. So yeah. You did a great thread that I saw this morning on a book by Napoleon Hill called Outwitting the Devil that I wanted to touch on. It goes into what a common question on the podcast is, what holds people back from pursuing something like this? And I would say, I want to talk about that thread a little bit. So tell me a little bit about the book. Napoleon Hill was the guy that wrote Think and Grow Rich, for those that don't know.

54:54But talk a little bit about Outwitting the devil and then a little more go into depth about that thread that you wrote because it had a lot of value to it yeah so basically this book was considered too controversial right when i first came out right and so it was not available until i believe 2011 if i got the dates correct and it you know it has these pieces to it right you know like the way napoleon hill writes you know about defining the devil basically the devil within right procrastination and it talks about just making the most of the time that you have here. And it's a very clever book, the way it's written, the dialogue.

55:29And so for me, that book was really helpful just with those fundamentals, right? Procrastination, fear, all those things that we all experience at one point or another. I mean, heck, I still do. There's still perhaps moves I should be making in my business that They kind of scare me, but that's actually, I think a good sign. So I just, I, yeah, that book was really monumental and just kind of, you know, kind of really builds upon the whole idea of think and grow rich and then sort of maybe more of that, more of that sort of holding yourself back aspect, getting over that piece. I listened to it years ago.

56:04I came across it on YouTube, I think, and it was on there and I listened to it. In the end, like what are some of the steps to outwit the devil? And the devil is like, you know, like your own negative self-talk and limiting self-beliefs in a lot of ways, right? So it's having that face, avoiding procrastination, understanding your purpose is really key as well. I think that's really one of the keys as well. And I think at the end of the day, there's this, Napoleon will talk to this a lot, the subconscious mind piece, right? Really understanding that is an asset for you. That's an asset you can use.

56:38And I think that's something that, in my opinion, if you can be aware of those things and then work to make progress in those areas, that can make you unstoppable. Nick, this has been a lot of fun. I really appreciate you sharing all of this. Is there anything that we didn't touch on that you wanted to discuss at all? One last thing, because I know sometimes people, when they think about doing new things, get bogged down a little bit. I think the one thing I want to touch base on briefly is just productivity. And what I have found, one of the things I found to work is this idea of limiting your missions, right?

57:08So maybe professionally, two, three things max, and then limiting your projects than a game changer. One to three projects at a time. Because products have overhead, right? So if you can limit your projects to one to three, and when that project lands on your desk, do all you can to either complete it or bring it to a natural stopping point. That is an excellent formula for, I think, being productive and also enjoying what you do and not being overwhelmed. I like that a lot. I'm interviewing Scott Young tomorrow, and he teams up with Cal Newport that you mentioned on a couple online classes. And one is on the power of focus, I believe, productivity, things like that.

57:47And I was listening to one of their interviews and same thing. They said, you really can only do one, maybe two missions at the most. Cal is a professor and an author. He said, that is about the most you can do. And then Scott has this idea of a project-based life, which is pick your projects and just crank them out and don't stop until you're finished. I think it's a really good concept and a good way to think about life, almost like a portfolio kind of life that develops over time. So for our listeners that want to find out more about you, learn about your academy, what's the best way for them to do that?

58:25A couple of ways. Number one is I'm very active on Twitter currently. So Nick DeFabio on Twitter. Number two, I check out publishing publishingprofits.io. publishingprofits.io is the site. It's going under some upgrades right now, but those are the two best places to sort of check things out and kind of go from there. Cool. Nick, I really appreciate your time today. My pleasure, Patrick. Absolute pleasure to meet you and take care. Okay, folks, that's all I had for today's episode. I hope you enjoyed the show and I'll see you back here real soon. Thank you for listening to TIP. Make sure to follow Millennial Investing on your favorite podcast app and never miss out on our episodes.

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