James Kelly - #28

0:00James Kelly, welcome to the podcast. Mr. Jake Dearden, thank you for having me, mate. I appreciate it. You're actually here for quite a while. You've come over this side of the world, obviously originally from Australia, live in Australia, but you're over here for what, four weeks before World Champs? Yeah, I'm over living in Wigan for four weeks, mate. I've heard Wigan's the place to be up here in the northern part of England. So, yeah, I'm here for five weeks until High Rocks World Champ. So bunking down here at rep and training with yourself. So it's going to be a good time. Yeah, no, it's going to be good.

0:39For the people that may have heard of you, may not have heard of you, would you just be able to kind of sum yourself up? Sum myself up. Sum myself up. Um, yeah, I'm, I'm James Kelly from, um, as you can probably hear, Australia, um, Brisbane, uh, Queensland, Australia on the East coast. Um, I am 32 years of age and, uh, currently, uh, elite high rocks athlete. Um, and have been for, what's it been? Uh, four years. Uh, yeah, about four years now. So do you remember when we first met? Birmingham Birmingham might watch you but I didn't actually like meet you face to face I remember witnessing like seeing you race 2022 you raced that race as well but I think you was on at night and I just remembered I did the open in the day High Rocks Open and then I remember just watching you boys warm up and then you just went out like crazy, won the race when did we first meet though?

1:49So we actually first met the day before Manchester World Championships and you were 16th. You was the roll down. That's right. I remember with, yes, I remember with. My zone. With my zone. Yeah, I remember that. Yeah, that's right. That's right. Emma. And you were there with, you raced that year in your age group. No, no. I, this was when I was injured actually. So I had slipped two discs in my back. I'd done like the... Ten marathons in five days or something. And then did the high rock, slipped my disc. I was injured. But I remember obviously Manchester being our hometown, coming and watching.

2:32That's right. And the day before I was up to... Yeah, and I got to meet you. That's right. And I was just kind of like blown away because you was this, obviously a high rocks athlete, but you'd had this big broad base. Can you tell people about that? Like where, where did it all kind of like start? Um, yeah, well, I, I grew up playing, um, every sport under the sun. Um, I think back in Australia, um, we have a culture of kind of, um, trying, trying everything as a, as a kid. Um, you know, we, we swim, we run, we, uh, play tennis, we play cricket, we play football. and my childhood was just playing sport.

3:18To then go into like high school and I fell in love with AFL, which is the Australian Rules Football, as well as just, you know, long distance and cross-country running. And then after school, continued that and continued playing Aussie Rules Football for club and, you know, I ended up falling or I ended up finding High Rocks in 2022 and I was 27, I think, 28 years of age. And I can honestly say that if it wasn't for my upbringing and my history of just training and running and my aerobic base through my football training, I wouldn't have started in High Rocks the way I did. And, yeah, like here I am now pretty much full-time High Rocks elite athlete.

4:32At the top of the spot. Yeah, yeah, I guess so. Yeah. So, um, you know, and, and just on that, it's, it's interesting, like living in this whole high rocks world, because people want, people think, oh, you know, we want results overnight, but, you know, I, I put my results that I've gotten over the last two or three years, more so towards, um, you know, my 10, 15 years of, of, of playing footy, um training for footy long distance running cross country talk to us about what a typical week looks like like back in the day like generally teenage years because i've heard you talk about this on different podcasts and stuff like that but uh i found it pretty crazy um like what was the typical week look like when you was either at school yeah back um back when i was a kid or or you know um growing up during high school um my my typical like week or my typical weekend would be a Friday night cross-country kind of track meet, which would be, you know, an 8K to a 10K run.

5:39And then I'd wake up on Saturday morning and play a rugby union game for my school. And then continue on till Sunday and play an Aussie rules game on a Sunday. And I literally lived that um you know um all all year round or all all my childhood was was literally like that um every weekend and um yeah I I was just uh so in love with just the process of kind of competing every weekend like that um and then obviously after school I continued to um play play footy at a pretty high level um and during the during the off season in footy i'd i'd run a few marathons and half marathons and get stuck into the long distance stuff as well so um but yeah as as i just said like that's the reason um why i'm here today as a elite high rocks athlete it's not to do with the last two years of training it's actually to do with the 10-15 years of training i've done yeah building that like aerobic engine yeah exactly yes and you look at most people obviously there's quite a few young lads coming through in high rocks now that are breaking into the elite 15 but when you look at quite a lot of the elite 15 i'd probably say 10 out of 15 like they've had probably 10 to 15 years experience just building up this aerobic base in another sport yeah and then have come over to high rocks um and then kind of blossomed and found that sport, which is pretty crazy.

7:20But, yeah, I've always found it kind of like interesting, let's say. What's it like to – what's kind of like the culture like playing Aussie rules football? Yeah, yeah, good question.

7:33Very typical boyish kind of football kind of vibe. Is it similar to rugby? Very similar, man. And to be fair, Jake, you know, I loved playing footy all my life. I stepped out at the right time though. And the reason why I say that is if you played football and been around a footy club, it can be a very toxic kind of vortex, I call it, like environment where you're with the lads all the time, you know and and you play a game on the saturday um if it goes well you're pretty much out until 2 a.m in the morning like um having a go with the lads as well like having a few pints and and whatever and then um you kind of rinse and repeat that right and you rinse and repeat that until um you realize that you're in this vortex of just having a good time with the lads now I look at that now like and I don't regret anything um I don't regret it at all um but as I said I stepped out at the at the right time because um it was time for me to kind of um uh mature a little bit and kind of focus on um a little bit other um I guess just other prior like priorities in life and funnily enough, like, that's when I actually met Georgie about six months later after I gave up footy.

9:12Before this, you didn't know. Georgie, by the way, obviously, your partner. Georgie, yes, is my partner. Your fiancé. My fiancé, yes. Yeah. Correct, yeah. We're actually getting, yeah, I'm pretty sure you know this, we're getting married in August. It's going up. Yeah, it is. Quite fast. Yeah, yeah, yeah. So, no, I had no idea who Georgie was until, yeah, 2022. We met in 2022 and, yeah, here we are now getting married. That's crazy. That's crazy. So beforehand, let's say a little bit more of kind of like this laddish vibe, I assume, playing. If it's anything to do, like, obviously you hear about, like, you know, rugby changing room stories and stuff like that.

9:56I guess it's the same. It's exactly the same. Yeah. And I mean, there's a part of me sometimes even like when I'm training for Hirox and most of it is all by myself. I do miss that camaraderie that I used to get with being a part of a team and just throwing chat with the lads. I absolutely love that. But as I said, the timing of it was perfect to step away. Yeah. yeah yeah so moving on from that like you you you stopped doing Aussie rules football was high rocks like did you already have a high rocks lined up or did you literally say that I'm stopping this I have nothing in the the line line up next or was you still like into some other fitness yeah so I finished the footy season in um in August and um to to be completely honest I was following Hunter on social media and on YouTube.

10:58And he was obviously like full into High Rocks and it kind of caught my eye. I was like, what's this High Rocks race? And looked it up and I looked at a race in, I think it was October 2022, which was Birmingham. And I just booked a one-way ticket and said, you know what, I'm just going to have a crack at this high rocks race. I kind of looked at it on paper and went, I'm sure I'm going to be okay at it and went over and did my first high rocks in 2022 in Birmingham. So, you know, I hate saying this, but kudos to Hunter for being the one to kind of, I guess like back then as well, he was really good for the sport to really elevate it with his platform.

11:56And if it wasn't for him, I don't know, I probably may have not have found it until now, you know. So, yeah, that was what, that's four years ago now. Yeah, it's crazy. I have the same respect for Hunter. I think he's done amazing things for the sport. Yeah. And like you said, without him, I don't think High Rocks would be at the point it is today because of the charisma, the kind of ego and the kind of bullish mentality that Hunter has. Like, yes, it can rub some people up the wrong way, but I think as a whole, that kind of personality is needed in sport. Sure, yeah, yeah, yeah. He's kind of like the Conor McGregor of high rocks, you know, and it's kind of, it's been like that from the start, which fair play, you know, he's not copying anyone.

12:49He's authentic to himself. And I love that about him as well. But yeah, it's incredible. And I think without him, like you say, the hyrocs would definitely not be as big. It's funny though, Jake, sorry, but I don't want to sound too harsh here, but Hunter's taught me a lot. He's taught me a lot of things that, um I there's there's a lot that I don't that I've uh taken from him that I don't want to be like as well of course yeah you know and and that's that's a chrism towards him 100 % and I'm the first to say that and and and I'm not afraid to say that anymore because I think a lot of people are too scared to say that but um yeah he uh taught me a lot back in the day 2022 2022 2023 but um he's taught me a lot of things that i don't want to do as well you know yeah i think that's fair um i say um the experiences i've had uh i i understand why people can get kind of like riled up by him but after kind of like meeting him spending time with him like Like for me personally, like whenever I see him in person, like he genuinely wants the best for me.

14:13He's always giving me advice. And like when he gives advice, like he kind of, you know if someone means it or not. Like when I speak to you and we talk, I know that you mean the stuff that you mean and you're saying it out the goodness of your heart. Whereas some people might just be saying it and you know, it might be right. It might be wrong, whatever. But every time I've took advice from Hunter, I've run with it and it's paid off. It's worked. And I think, yeah, like I say, he's actually quite a role model for myself, but I can see why people would also get kind of like riled up with the stuff like that.

14:53Because he has got that, he's got a big personality. Yeah. And he has to show that. And look, we don't want to talk too much about Hunter, but for him, you know, I know for a fact that he'd be hating it, that he's not the golden child anymore. And no offence, but that's the truth because he hasn't won an elite race in, what, two, three years. And, you know, people like Alex, Tim are probably getting a lot more, you know. I'd put yourself in that bracket as well. Yeah, sure. To be fair, like I can't put myself in that bracket this season and that's my honest kind of opinion on how I've gone this season.

15:45But anyway, yeah, like Hunter's his own man. And as I said also, like I give him credit for being himself as well. But, yeah, there's a lot of other fish in the sea, let's just say. Amazing. So after, like you say, you lined up, you went to Birmingham. Yep. How did that go? Yeah, well, better than I expected. I ended up, look, I think back then I was the first pro athlete to go sub 60 on debut. so I did a 59-53 but back then right I didn't really know what that meant as well I remember like seeing I think back then Hunter had the world record at maybe 57 or 56 maybe so I knew what he was doing but then that 59-53 early on in the season got me into the elite 15 rankings but ended up actually being placed 16th by the end of the season.

17:00So I was one spot out of the Elite 15 for the World Champs in 2023. When was that? 2023. I remember meeting you and you was a little bit devastated. Obviously, you were like, I'm banking on tomorrow, potentially someone pulling out or something, and I'm ready to go. and I just I don't know if you had that feeling but I kind of knew that you was going to get in even like without even like you were so like determined yeah and obviously had you'd flown from Australia to Manchester even though you were 16th was that the case or was you already in the world yeah I was um by this time I was kind of putting all my eggs in one basket and that was high rocks like I was I was in love with it as much as I am now and um I flew over because um even though I was ranked 16th I was still going to race in my age group on the Saturday morning so uh the story unfolds where I just rocked up to watch the elite 15 race that Friday night and actually Mintra Tilly who used to be the head of sport, now Matt Locke is but Mintra still has the screenshot of my text message.

18:23That Friday morning I texted her saying, Hi Mintra, just to let you know I'll be on site if anyone ends up pulling out. so I still remember sending that because I was just so I was just you know I was here I was ready to go and um you know unfortunately and and I say that because I have full respect to Tim Varnish um unfortunately um you know it was it was probably 15 minutes before the race like um 20 15 minutes before before the race I went to the bathroom and I turned around and um I saw Tim him crying on the ground with his father. And in that moment, I had this thought of, oh, my God, if I act right now, they potentially could get me to race.

19:25And, yeah, sure, like I was devastated for Tim, but I was more than eager to try to make sure that I could get into that race. So I ended up finding Christian, finding Mintra, confirming Tim was out, confirming that Tim was not going to start and then Christian gave me the go-ahead. So I ended up... So on 15 minutes notice. Yeah, on 15 minutes notice. You were in race. and made it was the best preparation I could have had because I didn't have time to think. I had no time to think. I didn't necessarily know what the course was and whatnot. And funnily enough, it was a big moment for me because it was my first proper Elite 15 race.

20:26and yeah, I love telling that story because it's kind of one of the biggest, I don't know, like reasons why I'm here today because of I think understanding that you've got to be resilient enough to take opportunities in this sport. You've got to take risks. You've got to go for things and I had a decision it was a complete decision and and I'm not saying others would have wouldn't have taken the decision but in that moment seeing Tim on the ground upset I completely could have just been like oh okay like I'll just wait and next minute not the gun would have gone off but I actually acted on it and and got into that race so and how did you do in that race I ended up coming eighth I ended up coming eighth so um best i don't know like best outcome that i could have yeah that's it that's insane for you know like you say 15 minutes before not starting and not being on that start list to then get into the start line and racing within 15 minutes notice and then coming eighth like that's Well, but it, it also kind of, um, uh, is an example of, of like, even high rocks now, um, the ranking system doesn't necessarily reflect, um, all the time.

21:58Sorry, I should state all the time. It doesn't all the time reflect the outcomes of races or, or, or positioning of, of athletes. and on that night I was the eighth place, you know, and I was meant to be 16th ranked, right? So all I'm saying there is like we've seen that time and time again since. Like I still remember I think one of the examples is Paleo one year or I think the year after in 2023 got a roll down and he was 30th place and got a roll down and ended up coming, I think, fourth in that Elite 15 race. So, you know, I'm just stating like there's so many examples in the sport where people get opportunities and we all know like you've got to take your opportunities in the sport because if you don't, you're silly.

22:58um paleo was 30th and ended up um ended up fourth in elite 15 race so do you think that has a carryover to any other sport as well and kind of the the element of not having the pressure build up not having time to think about something it kind of is a bit of a superpower for you on that start line or do you think you would prefer time to think about it and know exactly that you're going to be there and like no surprises if that makes sense? It's an interesting question, Jake. I think it depends on the individual athlete. I know for myself that I've had moments in time where I have thrived off being one of the favorites and really kind of been very confident by knowing and understanding that I'm meant to win and really excelled with that.

24:09I don't want to use pressure because that is not that's not pressure to me it's just fact expectation as we say the expectation of you winning you kind of thrive off there's well there's been cases where um i have thrived there's been cases where you know um as an example like not having pressure or not having any any expectation um is the best thing and i think i think for a lot of athletes i think that's that's probably where a lot of athletes lie i think a lot of athletes in especially in our sport now like understanding how it works i think not having expectation is when um a lot of athletes can get the most out of themselves um but hey like it it really depends on the individual and how they're wired and also, you know,

25:10where their expectation is coming from as well. I think that's a big thing because what I mean by that is, is it coming from internally or externally, you know? What do you deal better with, internal expectation or someone else thinking? JK must win this race does that make you feel better or worse well here's a here's a statement for you right that I I think about a lot and I've thought about it even a lot more this year

25:52I try to think and I say try because I'm only human as much as anyone I try to think I don't can I swear on this podcast do whatever you want I don't give two fucks about what other people think of me now note right I try to think like that that's hard to do all the time because we're only human we somewhat want to feel as if people rooting for us and think that we're good or have the expectation on us. And sometimes it gets to us. But at the end of the day, I try to live by, I don't give a fuck about others' expectations. The only expectation that I want to live up to is my own because, and I don't want to sound too deep here or it's never too deep in Irox to be completely honest, but I'm the only one that truly cares about my performance.

27:19Georgie, my fiancé, is close behind, probably very close by the way. She cares about how I go as much as myself, but I'm the only one that actually truly cares. Everyone else said it like, you know, yourself being one of my good mates now and vice versa. I truly care about how you go. You know, Jess Petro, one of my athletes, one of my best mates. Yeah, like I've got my sponsors who really care about like how I go. But when it comes down to it, my internal being is more, I've got more care factor than all of you guys put together. Well, everyone else can care, but at the end of the day, they're not living with it.

28:10They're not living with your thoughts. And after a race, if you've done well, if you've done bad, they're not carrying around all the things that you might be, you might have had a bad race and you're like, fuck i could have done this better i could have done that better like at the end of the day like the people around you they just care about if you're okay exactly like i i doubt georgie after a bad race i doubt she actually cares about how what position you came in that race only the only thing that she cares about probably is how you're feeling and how we get you back to feeling happy yeah and you becoming yourself again yeah because you've all been like after races it's sometimes it's traumatizing when you when you do truly like embarrass yourself or how you think that you've done and you embarrass yourself uh it's a pretty hard place to come out of yeah yeah and you know what though jake like the the interesting thing about that is you know i've i've had that moment of after a race feeling embarrassed you know as an example and and uh i'm sure you have as well to some degree but here's here's the underlining factor of that is is that no one else actually sees it that way like like no one and that's where i'm coming from like no one apart from you felt feels embarrassed for you for that race or or with me in the race and and and you You know, and just to give you even more context, after the race in Melbourne, which was what, the second major of the year where I ended up placing 12th and for myself was a very low point or not low point, just my lowest placement in an Elite 15 race, I felt horrible out there.

30:14I was embarrassed and stuff. Since then I've had to work on a lot of mental things with respect to like my purpose and why I'm actually truly doing this because that race and, you know, the weeks after, I really questioned what I was doing for a while. um you know what's crazy about that race so you came 12th but i was in that race as well and i remember running around and i remember looking when i got to the rower i remember looking to the right of me and it's in order so everyone's the right of me was behind me and i think i was sat about 10th position and i saw you came in and i think you was either 14th i think you might have been last or you might have been just like one one but you you was last and i was all i was thinking was i hope jk is okay uh obviously there's something up like this isn't a reflection of his fitness like i know how fit james is and i was just wondering like like i hope he's okay and then the fact that you finished from that position maybe it was last maybe second to last the the fact that you still fought until the end when you're not feeling your fitness you're not feeling yourself like yourself at all and something's clearly kind of like up and the way that you fought at the end and i remember looking back like after we'd finish and looking you at you taking over people on the wall balls i was like james has got that dog in him okay no no matter what he won't give up and yeah i i've i genuinely was like impressed whereas like it's crazy i was impressed and you was embarrassed with yourself like that that's how the different perspectives kind of yeah absolutely and then it's funny just talking about that because do you remember what happened the following morning?

32:10I messaged you, which was the Saturday morning after the solo race. I messaged you because I woke up feeling horrible about myself and thinking to myself, oh, my God, how am I going to do doubles with Jake tonight? I don't want to let him down. And I ended up, you know, messaging you saying, hey, let's catch up because I really wanted to talk to you and we went for a walk, we had a coffee and went for a walk. And I still, I actually still remember what you said to me. And at the time, like when you said it to me, I was like, kind of like, fuck you. Because it kind of like, but it was so true. It's like, I was pretty much telling you that I was like, Hey, like, I don't know if I, I don't know if I should race tonight.

32:59I felt horrible last night. I don't want to let you down. you you turned to me and said well whether whatever happens tonight if we race um you can't probably feel any worse than right now you said you said that to me and but like ruthless but dude it was the best thing to say because it's the it was the complete truth it was like well you're right like and from that moment on it was probably like 8 a.m in the morning that moment on I was like well throw all the expectations out the window for our doubles that night um I didn't it's not as if I'm saying I didn't care but it was just like yeah I'm just gonna freaking rip this with Jake tonight and look what happened we ended up we ended up winning and winning by a long way.

33:52So just, yeah, just going back to that whole expectation and the internal dialogue or that kind of inner drive, it's funny the word expectation because once you try to kind of delete it or don't necessarily think that you do have any expectation, it's it it's amazing how um performance can be kind of uh driven by that yeah so it is a crazy story and like you say it's uh it was insane that like literally the next day you're having a bad race the next day you you was on fire and there was like i remember even like watching the live stream back and they were like what's happened to james like literally like he's on fire you you you you held me up that night for sure yeah it was good it was uh it was one to remember definitely but um so obviously i want to take it back a little bit so um from kind of like birmingham uh and then world champs uh in manchester 2023 world champs right correct yeah yeah you then at this time you were self-coached right i was yeah yeah can you just explain like what you've been doing over the the last kind of couple of years and i'm not saying it's all down to like the the changing of coaching or anything like that but like what has made you come from hitting eighth which is an incredible achievement um in the 2023 world champs to then doing amazing and having an amazing 24 and 25 because the last two years like like you say you've been on fire you've been the favorite at races majors and things like that you've you know yeah yeah well the the first thing that i'll say is like i decided to uh yeah, I decided to dilute my ego a little bit.

36:03And what I mean by that is I thought I had the answers as my own coach. I thought my way or the highway. What was your way at the time? Like what was like a typical training week? Was there anything that you was kind of thinking like, do you not train hard as fuck all the time? It was pretty much that, man. It was pretty much just like I need to run fast. I need to do a lot of intensity. And back then, which was obviously the 2024 season, like the start of the 2024 season, I didn't have the knowledge and understanding of what we were actually training for. I had a couple of like poor performances in the first couple of majors of that season to then go, okay, I need to change something or I'm going to continue to get these results.

37:02So that's what I'm saying. I really needed to look at myself in the mirror and go, okay, if I want to be one of the best in the sport, I need to change something. Dilute the ego, right? So I still remember watching and starting to chat to Lauren Weeks every time I saw her at races. And to be fair, she was such a role model to me. She didn't know this, but I just loved the way, one, she raced, but more so how she carried herself as an athlete at these big races. She's the most humble human being out there. She's amazing. She says hello to everyone. like she'll make an effort to come over and say hello to you.

37:53She's so authentic, so real and such a beast though. Yeah. And I remember after I think it was the second major of the year and I didn't do well. I can't remember what I came or time or whatever, but I remember messaging her that night after the race and pretty much bluntly saying, hey, look, congratulations because she won. Is there any chance we can have a chat about potentially coaching? because I knew she was a coach herself. I had no idea who Anthony Perissini was. And Lauren kindly messaged me back and said, look, I'm flying back out. Let's jump on a call. I'd love you to meet my husband, Anthony.

38:38So long story short, we jumped on a call and had a great chat with Lauren and Anthony. And Lauren was very, very honest and open about she thought from her perspective that Anthony was a better suit, was better suited to coach me. And that was two and a half years ago. And here I am now, like, with, you know, having a few seasons of kind of going from, like, on the cusp athlete, you know, to, I guess, you know, one of the favorites of majors and winning a couple of majors now and podiuming a few times. And I always say that I wouldn't be the High Rocks athlete right now, like 100 % if it wasn't for Anthony.

39:41And he's given me not necessarily just the program and the coaching, but it's the understanding and the knowledge of what we're actually training for. he's so sound with the science and specific programming and he's done wonders for me as a coach myself as well and he knows that and yeah the journey continues with him for sure. That's incredible and it's like obviously you have a podcast with him yourself. Yeah. I've been watched like literally almost every episode yeah huge listeners so if you're into high rocks definitely and you're a little bit of a geek because it is pretty geeky what you talk about obviously you talk about every week you talk about like what you guys have been up to and then you're on to kind of like the sciencey stuff and how to get better and it's all about how to get better so yeah if you're interested I'd definitely give that a watch to be fair um but um no it's it's incredible and for my experience having a coach as well it's just someone to kind of like bounce ideas off as well yeah it's this thing where i i guarantee you don't do exactly what your coach says you he might send across the the program for the week yeah and then you'll have a conversation about it and you might be like ah maybe we'll do this maybe we won't do this or whatever yeah going off kind of like your feel or whatever is that kind of like how it works pretty much yeah yeah like and and anthony and i talk every day um the biggest thing that i'll say is that i i trust him and i think from an athlete coach relationship like trust is trust is the main thing um once trust is gone it's really hard to get back as well.

41:48Um, I trust that he is so bought into myself as an athlete, um, because he knows my, myself and my fitness and what I need, um, to be one of the, one of the top of the sport that, um, that, um, you know, I, I, I cherish everything that he, he does deliver to me. and he's not just a coach to me. We talk all things now. We're really good friends and, yeah, that relationship to me is golden and, yeah, as I said, if it wasn't for him, I wouldn't be here right now. Well, yeah, I wouldn't be here right now. Maybe I would. Maybe we would still be mates. I'm not sure. you're saying that our friendship is based on anthony yeah based on anthony yeah well anthony is a great guy like he's so clued up and like i i definitely see why you like after that first initial call with lauren and anthony like you chose him because he is so to the point he's so accurate with everything with all his training like i've obviously um had a brief look over kind of like your training programs then it's all it's so thought out and it's so so like to the point um i think for for kind of like an online coach he's probably genuinely probably one of the best in the world yeah and considering he's got you to a position obviously like you say you built up this crazy fitness you're obviously talented and you know you stuff yourself but for him to be able to help you and get you to being one of the best in the world from a computer screen as well yeah obviously you meet up majors and stuff like that like i find that like really um really impressive to be fair so so shout out i want to i want you to tell me a little bit more about australia what's kind of like the the vibe like out there and like how is it what everyone kind of what you see is that everyone into fitness is it yeah i've i've got a pet kangaroo and i write i ride him to the gym and yeah yeah yeah do you ever have fights no has anyone shown you that video i bet you guys show that video so much like that punch in the kangaroo oh yeah yeah i've seen that one no um oh i'm so sorry about uh not remembering their names but the french double doubles team the high rocks team oh yeah yeah yeah i can't remember their names but they're fast i i still remember like i still remember being the guy with the ponytail yeah i'm so sorry boys if you listen to this i still remember like and i think it was hamburg and i asked them after the race are you coming to melbourne they're like yeah yeah yeah we'll be there and i as i kind of normally do just kind of take the piss and start joking because I knew they didn't uh hadn't been to Australia before and started saying all this stuff about yeah you can ride your kangaroo to to the race and all this stuff and they were just like I yeah yeah um because I I think a lot of people who don't have haven't come to Australia actually think we're like like in the outback and and and we We actually, you know, kangaroos, fucking snakes, like crocodiles everywhere and whatnot.

45:20But it's not like that. It's not like that. Well, there's places like that. But I live in this place called the Sunshine Coast, which is one hour north of Brisbane, which is one of the main cities. along the East Coast, beaches, sunny pretty much all year round. Australia culture, man, like, you know, and the fitness scene, which obviously is kind of my life. It's very community and group based. We have a lot of group training and it's fantastic because like our weather allows us to pretty much train outside all year round. Like as I said to you this week, like we're here in Bolton, what is it, in May, and it's freezing cold to me.

46:24This is so much colder than what our winters are. Yeah, just to reference, outside it's about six degrees and it's been nonstop raining. Yeah, it's crazy. Since you got here. And this is your spring or autumn or almost summer? Normally it's like a heat wave this time of year. But due to our weather, I think it allows a lot of people to really invest in their fitness and not just fitness but just health as well. Do you think that makes better athletes? I think it can. I think it can help. I think it allows a lot of natural, what's the right word? I don't want to say motivation. Motivation can be a little bit more natural.

47:17You don't need as much of it. Correct. I'm assuming in your winters here, mate, it'd be so hard to get out for a run. It is so funny because I was actually having a conversation with you before. Like I find living here is one of the easiest places to kind of lock in and train. Because there's fuck all else to do. Like literally there's no beaches that I can go chill on. There's no beach. There's no parties. There's no nothing. Like all I can do is train, work, and sit at home and watch Netflix. Yeah. Which sitting at home and watching Netflix. You don't do, do you? I don't really do that much.

48:00Maybe I'll watch one episode every two days or something like that. Or, you know, sit there for an hour with my girlfriend after our dinner. But that's not a bad thing, really. Because, like you say, it's lying horizontal. So for training and being an athlete, that's actually a pretty good downtime. So there's no distractions where, I don't know, you see people like living in dubai or going to move to dubai and like there's so many distractions you can literally have everything there's the best weather you could go out on a boat you could do this you could do that and yeah for me like as sad as this sounds they are all distractions from what really matters and that is training yeah when you're an athlete yeah i i do i do understand that and get that quite a bit back home in Australia.

48:50Well, my next question would be like you've mentioned there that there's a huge like group training scene. And whenever I see you training, you like to train on your own, right? Yeah. So you don't really kind of get involved with any of the big groups or anything like that? Like I don't train with a big group at all, no. um I'm uh I'm a part of the the yard uh gym which uh I love being a part of the the yards community but I I don't necessarily train with the members of of the yard because I I don't know like I've learned over I guess not necessarily just high rocks but I think somewhat to a degree I get the most out of my training when it's me versus me.

49:44And yes, like there's times and places where I think I should probably act on training with others for maybe a little bit more motivation, maybe a little bit more accountability, maybe a little bit more of a push. And I put my hand up and understand that. But for years and years on end, before High Rocks, I was training all by myself and I just love it. Like there's nothing else I can say about it. I do love it. It's nice as well because you can be selfish. And I think when you get to your level, you know your strengths, you know your weaknesses, you have your own training program and you can't just add in junk volume.

50:33and unfortunately like going training with other people one you've got to negotiate the session if you're actually doing the same session because again they have different weaknesses they have different strengths yeah and if you're negotiating then there's going to be some element of junk volume so it's kind of a trade-off you've either got the extra motivation and the extra push from training with people or yeah but the the kind of uh cost to that is you're adding in junk volume stuff that you might not need to do more of yeah um so it's a hard one i think there's a part there's a part of me that i don't i don't think about a lot because i don't want this to be the case but i think subconsciously it's more of a control thing right it's more you know i like to be in control so um it's easier just to train by myself because then it's i i'm in control of the whole day, the whole training session, like when I start, when I finish, when I break, when I, you know what I mean?

51:37So I do think it's like a, um, a bit of a, um, a control thing more, more, more than the actual, you know, actually the, the dynamics of actually training someone. But, yeah, so, yeah, like I find it quite therapeutic more than anything. I find it somewhat, I don't know, you know, like it's kind of my outlet to have like to have the gym space all by myself. um but yeah going back to australia man like yeah group training obviously the weather helps um you obviously know a handful of us already like you do understand that the australian culture and and i guess our personality and and our our kind of like way of kind of um socializing is a lot of playful banter um and that's what um that's what i love and i i think like i i think to some extent that's what the brits are like as well right like you guys have a have a good time kind of like taking the piss as well and yeah definitely i think uh yeah brits love to have a crack yeah and sometimes like you say it can be seen as oh you're just shooting someone else down but like it's funny if you can take it and you've got to be able to give it but like you say you've got to be able to take it as well you've got to be able to take it yeah exactly man and you know what that kind of reminds me like i as much as like i'm the first to take what i'm doing personally as an an elite athlete as an elite well as an elite athlete i take everything as serious as i can But also I've learned, hey, like, like life's too short to take yourself so seriously.

53:39And I see it all the time. Like people take themselves way too seriously these days. Yeah. No. Sorry, that sounds critical, but it's just like, let's have a laugh. Let's take the piss out of you as much as you can take the piss out of me. And guess what? Like if I'm taking the piss out of you, I better be able to receive it as well. You know, that's what I love about the Brits. I don't know. Some of the Americans are funny because I think some of the Americans don't know how to take it. I don't know. Shots fired. Not all the Americans, not all the Americans. But, yeah, it's the way of the Australian life, right?

54:24like um just kind of having having fun and uh like i say that's what life's about like we could do this full being an athlete being you know at the top level of high rocks we could do it one way where we're taking everything serious our training is monotonous we're not we're bunkering down we're not speaking to anyone else and we're just like locking in or you could do the exact same thing but speak to people have a laugh with people experience places train with other people like other elite athletes or whatever and connect and still get the same results but just have a better time doing it yeah for sure and like i think as a group as well we've got to kind of make that choice not just like it's all right you making the choice but then you need someone else to make the choice otherwise like everyone's just separate but i do like the the high rocks kind of culture especially within the elite 15 i think it is getting more and more um people are actually wanting to chat more and people are becoming friends and they're creating friendships with other athletes that yes they're going to war with when it's race day and yes you might not speak to people as much in the warm-up right before because you're going against them and it's ready to go but outside of that why can we not all be friends why can we not go for a drink after or food after whatever you like to do and just like experience this together where it's not like serious all the time yeah for sure but you're right like come three two one go when the gun goes off um we all we all want to um beat each other and and compete against each other and whatnot but um but that's actually something that i've really enjoyed this year compared to um a lot of previous years is um I think a lot of us are getting along a lot better than before.

56:15And I don't know why. I think it's just because we're all getting to know each other more. Yeah. No, definitely. And like I say, especially I think it's harder when you're starting to make a living off it. You're kind of thinking, oh, there's only so much food to go about and these people are taking food off my table and so on. And like you can look at it like that. but yeah at the end of the day like high rocks is this is that how you're growing sport i don't look at it like that at all i try and help as many people as possible because i know that that's so true actually because you've helped me a lot mate so well my my main aim would be for everyone who is a professional in high rocks and is in the elite 15 at least to be able to make a full time living off high rocks i i don't think that anyone in that elite 15 deserves to have to not to have to go to work because obviously they can choose to go to work and stuff like that but like if they want the opportunity to be a professional athlete uh i want to try and help them do that like why would i not because that's just going to make the sport better make the sport more more professional and it's going to make competition even better and yeah do you know you could look at the competition like oh if everyone else is getting better then i might be pushed out but at the end of the day like you might deserve to be pushed out like you've got to keep up as well and we like it's kind of good when we see all these records getting broken like we should be looking at it as like this is a good thing not like oh everyone's getting so so fast and it's hard to look at like sometimes when you're in it yeah but at the end of the day like that's your competition and that's what's going to make you better yeah yeah it's interesting bringing this up mate because um and i don't know like most of the let's just say the people that you've you've had on this podcast um but the viewers might not know you um as much as i do but um it's something about you that i really um respect and that is like you go out of your way to help people um and i don't know if like a lot of people know that um what you just said is like that's actually the honest truth you you actually care about um the elite athletes to the point where you would do a lot for them to make a good living.

58:38And all I'm saying here is like I'm kind of going off on a tangent here, but I think a lot of people see what you do and respect it wholeheartedly but don't understand who Jake really is. and um you know just an example um like you got me groceries like as soon as i got um off the plane the other day and you didn't have to do that and and there's there's that's just an easy example but um um oh i'm i'm i'm being the the interviewer right now because i'm gonna ask you a question by the way where do you get that from where where do you get the you you genuinely care like genuinely care about people like where where does that come from i think if you look at it like from like a selfish point of view like you can either do it or not do it yeah if you like you help people then not only am i hopefully improving the life of someone else or like making them happy but that makes me happy like happiness is like contagious and i remember being a personal trainer and going back to a personal being a personal trainer and basically as someone who's doing face-to-face coaching yeah you've got to be in a good mood you're paid to be in a good mood and to make the person that you're in front of they have to leave every session in a good mood as well sure but i remember starting that and i was probably pretty miserable before being a pt but being forced to be in a good mood it's like if i force you to smile right now you'll smile but is it but like psychologically you'll then be in a better mood like i feel like you can like force yourself into a better mood and i know this is a weird way of looking at it but like if i can help someone else out it makes me feel better yeah and then we're all happier yeah yeah but as well like what uh goes around comes around like i'm a believer in that believer in like karma and stuff like that like if you um if you help someone out then hopefully when you're in need then it's going to come back and uh that's not me saying anything groundbreaking like i've just taken that from other people and the people that i look up to i try and surround myself with people that i like that yeah um and fortunately i have some very good people in my life that i like that and they've done exactly the same for me and they've helped me when they didn't need to help me and they've pulled me out of a bad situation or helped me.

1:01:19And yeah, if you can do that to someone else or help someone, then why not? Because there's so much like it's bullshit that, you know, competition. There's enough for everyone. If that makes sense, like there is, especially in the world of like a growing sport like Irox. It's not like if, you know, I, if you get a contract, then I'm not going to get a contract or if, you know, exactly the same. Like, yeah, you get what I'm trying to say. But no, like I say, I just want you to be happy. As well, like you're coming over here, you're coming to Wigan, like, or Bolton. Yeah, Wigan, Bolton. Like I say, it's a pretty cool place, but it's raining at the moment.

1:02:05It's pretty miserable at the moment. If I can try and improve your day and make it easier for you or when you're coming over here like you've got to be a good host i think that's as well like it's cool to be a good host yeah kind of get a buzz out of that and that's selfish as well oh you can say it's so it's really not but um but um that's no i bet i bet you you're exactly the same when people come to australia like you like to show them around you like to yeah like give them the best experience yep um but but yeah no that's interesting let's let's move on to uh Obviously, the big event, the finale of this year, you got your place the other week, the other month.

1:02:48Would you say a month? In Phoenix. Oh, you got it in Phoenix, yeah. So you got it in Phoenix. It's because you won. Brisbane. Brisbane. So you got your place in Phoenix, then you won Brisbane, and now we're leading up to the world champs. You're in for the solos and the doubles. so back-to-back races. How are you feeling for it? Really good. Really good. How am I feeling for it? You know, it's – what is it? I think it's five weeks. It's five weeks tomorrow. How crazy is that? Yeah. Time flies. Yeah. Anyway, I'm feeling good, man. I'm feeling really good. you know

1:03:39And this is going to be my fourth, if we count the 2022 Elite 15 that I did end up racing in. This will be my fourth Elite 15 World Champs in a row.

1:03:57And everyone gets more exciting and I guess more competitive.

1:04:08more meaningful as well. I found a lot more meaning, meaning every year. And, um,

1:04:19even this one is interesting because, um,

1:04:27I haven't, I, I, I won Brisbane. I, I won the Brisbane APAC regional. but I haven't won a major this year. I'm not the favourite

1:04:46and fuck I love going into worlds not being the favourite

1:04:55but you know I'm four and a half, five weeks out still and there's a lot of work still to be done. There's a lot of work still to be done But also there's a lot of just a lot of things that just need to be put in place, recovery, making sure my head's good. And then whatever ends up happening on that Thursday night in Stockholm will happen. And then whatever happens on the Friday night with yourself will happen. You know, and that's what I'm, that's what I see it as.

1:05:40I'm speaking for yourself here, but I am out there personally to win the double crown.

1:05:50Like there's no other way to put it. I'm out there to win the double crown. um and if that doesn't happen am I going to be disappointed depends depends on my race and how it goes if I'm in the opportunity if I have the opportunity to win and then I don't I'll be disappointed if I'm not in the if I don't have the opportunity to win and I don't win I won't be disappointed if that makes sense like um so yeah man i'm feeling good and and and you know it's uh

1:06:32it's still so far away but so close as well yeah yeah that's uh that's a good summary to be fair I think five weeks out, ticking the boxes is kind of like the main things. Like you say, there's still work to be done. Session after session, you're just kind of like ticking these boxes off. You're just getting them done. There's nothing new that you're doing. You're doing everything that you know that works. And adding in the recovery and then on race day, it'll either be enough or it won't do you ever look at it like that like i always think about high rocks like how much do you think high rocks is pure fitness fitness and technique and then like on the day like that's like firing mindset like because a lot of people say to me all the time oh jake just just try harder oh no yeah yeah you look like you weren't trying and like you're surely you're like at the back or whatever surely you're going to get messages like that just try and I swear I had one after Hamburg a comment on the YouTube I remember and I love the comments on the YouTube because they're all anonymous so we get a lot of trolls on there but one was like yeah you weren't trying so you're saying that I'm going to a major I've put in all this training this 12 week block or whatever it was up until hamburg and on the day i just decided oh you know what today i'm not gonna try it's fun and i'm gonna just be 15th i'm gonna be the shittiest person there on purpose on purpose it's just fascinating people's perspective of what we're trying to do or what they think we're doing or not doing right yeah it's crazy but going back to what what you were saying um there's a lot of it that i have learned that it's such a um hard experiment and i i view it as an experiment now and what i mean by that is like my training block is like my training right now is the high like volume and intensity is the highest it's been all year you know i'm on this trajectory upwards um to try to peak for worlds um how do i explain this but like um peaking for worlds um i've got to be really careful that i don't overdo it because what we're doing right now what i'm doing right now and most elite athletes you're doing this right now man we're we're we're towing the line of over training over training slash under recovering same thing yeah we're towing that line man like and we should be because towing that line is how we bump our fitness.

1:09:38But, hey, it's a really fine line and it's really easy to go over and sometimes, sorry, going over, if you go over, it's so hard to get back. I've learnt this this year that sometimes it's actually better to ride one foot behind the line and just ride it a little bit behind and let's just say rock up to a race just as an example purpose, like 98 % fit, 98 % right rather than pushing it to 100 because if you push it over, if you get to 100, but you slightly go over and you're 101, that extra 1%, man, you're toast. Yeah, so much more detrimental. You're toast. You're not healthy. You're on the verge of being sick.

1:10:45You injury. Little niggles. Yeah, I completely agree as well. And being that 98%, what we're talking about there is the minimal things of everyone has that, kind of like thought anyone that's obsessed with training has the thought of like uh when you when you finish a day of training or whatever and you're like have i done enough yeah and there's something in your head saying oh just go out for a little bit longer go out for a another easy run do sit on the bike for 30 more minutes or whatever it is and it's that voice that you've got to shut off and you've just got to believe and trust within your training that you've done enough and at the end of the day it's probably not going to make a huge difference it might be you're at the track for example and on your training program there's eight intervals and you get to six intervals and you're feeling a little bit tired you doing them extra intervals are probably not going to do anything it could potentially be detrimental because you could get injured in them sure you could but you're doing six or eight like there's probably you've got the stimulus go home recover and then come back another day yeah and um quite a few people like who've had an experience have definitely taught me exactly the same and talk about the same like it is it's like i think alfie said like it's crazy how fit you can get off like being under that line under that line and actually just like not doing too much yeah for sure yeah but hey like Like we're running the risk or we're taking the risk and we have to.

1:12:23Like I'm taking the risk of riding that line or maybe slightly behind it, as I just said, because we have to. Well, like I wouldn't be here if I didn't want to take the risk of bumping my fitness up to a point where I have the opportunity to become world champ like we've got to take that risk yeah definitely definitely no i completely agree no it's interesting but i am i'm so happy that you're confident for worlds like i think that in itself is like one of the battles actually like building that confidence in your head where you truly believe you can win yeah i doubt there's ever been like a champion that has not believed they can physically win before actually going winning yeah you've got to kind of like see it and believe it before it actually happens yeah so that's sick that and from being your doubles partner as well like that that's what i want to hear as well absolutely man and it do you know if i said anything else uh do you know if you ask me like how am i feeling for worlds if i said anything else uh but i'm like i want to go out there and i want to try and win like i think you'd be pissed off yeah well no not pissed off but i'd be asking you questions right yeah really but but also man just on our doubles mate like there's a part of me that likes how we we haven't got as much attention as i don't want to say like as we should but um we've come we've come um third first and fourth in three majors that we competed in and uh not not any other team has done that this year i know alex and tim have won two um but that that's the only team that have um exceeded what we've done yeah and i mean you know i totally understand that there hasn't been a doubles race where every team has been on that start line, which is the most important because we all know that every race is different.

1:14:40But, man, you know, like that doubles race on Friday night is going to be an absolute ripper and there's going to be, you know, the teams of, let's be honest, Tim and Alex are going to be very hard to beat, Hunter and Jake are going to be very hard to beat but I have no doubt that we're going to be right there and remember even in Hamburg I still remember like we were fourth, fifth the whole race and I remember talking to you during the race being like we just need to be there, we just need to keep pushing we just need to be there because we all know a doubles race can change like that because of the nature of how fast it is and how sloppy it can get.

1:15:39And I'm not saying, hey, like that's going to be one of the reasons why we do well. But there are more penalties and like I think we're very good at, at the end of the day, like you can say, oh, I would have done this if I didn't get that penalty. but at the end of the day you got a penalty. Absolutely, man. And you should know better. As harsh as this sounds, you should know better not to get the penalty. We get a warning with every single thing before the penalty. Yeah, exactly. So you get a warning and then you just don't do it again. And sometimes it slowed our race down. I remember me getting a warning on the lunges in Hamburg, it was.

1:16:22And it slowed me right down. because I had to go slower. But at least we didn't get the penalty there and then not getting that penalty then got us third place. We actually qualified off that. So sometimes you've got to go slower and just take care and then at the end of the day like you say, I believe what you say if we're in and around that top three anything can happen. Anything can happen. That's why I'm excited about it. I feel like for me I love the solos and I definitely think the solos is more prestigious. If you're top five in the solos, you're fucking incredible in my eyes. The best athletes are in the solos, whereas the doubles, it is more tactical.

1:17:11It's a little bit more exciting. If you're not as fit, you can kind of hide a little bit between you and your partner as well. And there's just so much more to it. and I kind of find that exciting. So I think definitely the single is probably more prestigious but the doubles is more exciting. And I think that's from a viewer point of view as well. Yeah, I totally agree. It's definitely more exciting. If you could win any, hands down you'd be picking the solos. If you could, if you was like, you can only win one. Don't you as my doubles partner ask me that. Right, okay. I'm going to ask you. If you could win any, would it be the solos or would it be the doubles?

1:17:51Mate. don't lie to my face come on because i know what i think that's such a terrible question mate okay but i'll change the aspect i'll change the aspect anyone that's raced the doubles you know them guys that have only raced doubles and we're not talking about elite 15 we're just talking about in high rocks and they're like oh this is my doubles time and you go have you done a solos and they go no like the next thing is go do a fucking solos because you find out who you are find out who you are yeah you can't you can't hide you can't fucking like if you've not done solos and i don't care if it's open or pro or whatever you've you've not done high rocks properly because correct like correct man yeah you do find out who like i'll even call out john my coach he's only done doubles i'm like has he actually yeah i'm like go do a fucking solos and go like please show me that it's as easy as what you talk about yeah yeah yeah yeah no and absolutely correct absolutely correct it's but you can't yeah you can't compare them you literally can't compare them in answer the question if you if you could only win one well um

1:19:03it would definitely be doubles with you he's lying out his ass dude I know what I'd pick if I was in that solo line up like yeah no like double you know what doubles is sick and I love the doubles one because he suits me a little bit more I don't know if you could say I'm hiding behind my partner I could be just a hypocrite I begs that what I've said totally disagree Jake you don't suit doubles more you don't I don't know you don't maybe it's just I think I've always had strong doubles partners so that's benefited me turn it up man don't say that because i don't know i don't know but um i i disagree with that but be and but the first thing i'll say you can't you can't compare a doubles race and a solo race that they're just completely different races right um i don't think you have have even touched close to your potential as a solo athlete.

1:20:18I really don't. I think like there's a lot of athletes in the Elite 15 that have reached their absolute potential. You're not one of them. You're not one of them yet. Because you've seen me train in that gym. No, not at all, man. He shits at training. Not at all. No, no, but yeah, I kind of can agree with that because my strength numbers are nowhere near all the people's strength numbers. Yes, I've been working on my running, but like running under fatigue is a completely different ball game. And I feel like even just the stability aspect, the plyometric, the power, the stuff like that, like I'll go get tests and I'll hold my hands up.

1:21:03I'm the worst in the room when it comes to stuff like that. but i just see that as something that i can work on and something that i can get better if i went and did all these tests and i was the best person in the room and all these tests then i'd be fucked because my time's still shit if that makes sense like in comparison yeah sure you kind of want the best time yeah you can do off the worst kind of results within when you do all the separate testing yeah and then you have stuff to work on like say if if i turn around to you james and i say uh what's your weakness and you say i don't have any then and you might potentially you might not say on air whatever but you know your weaknesses but if you if you said and if you believed firmly believe that you had no weaknesses that would be a bit of a red flag you'd be like oh wow how the fuck are you going to improve like you need to improve and you're stronger everything like what yeah so i guarantee there'd be some athletes that would say i don't have any weaknesses i love it i love it when you go to uh an elite 15 like star on all the media the day before and you're like how you're feeling and every single person is feeling on top of the world and incredible everyone's had the best block of training ever feel the best ever before was the best they've ever done and then the day after the race oh i've been injured all my block and like i didn't have a good night's sleep i've been sick i've been that and it's funny and maybe they just it's kind of like a mental thing like kind of like fake it till you make it if you tell yourself and tell other people beforehand that you've had the best block even though you haven't had the best block you might wing it and get a good result i don't know i don't know how it is like i say it's probably down to the mental thing like say you feeling confident and you believe in i've just not conquered that yet i think the biggest uh i was gonna say ick yeah let's say ick ick do you know yeah yeah yeah like girls normally do it i think they oh yeah emily girls normally do it not like emily does like biggest gym or whatever so does georgie biggest gym biggest fireworks Yeah, what was George's X?

1:23:17No, wait, what are you trying to say that I can't say something about an X? No, no, I'm saying girls say it. Rubbish. If lads say it, okay, what's your biggest X? It's so true. I don't know why I said X, but I'm going to run with it, right? I reckon the biggest X is lads are talking about X. Well, I'm going to be one of them right now. Okay. Is just the pre, I was going to say post, the pre-race.

1:23:51Media? No. Talk? Pre-race. What's the word? Ritual? No. The chat? Pre-race chat? Comradery? No. I've totally. keep this on because this looks like I'm a loony tune it's 7pm it's my bedtime pre-race excuses sorry pre-race excuses the pre-race excuses okay and they have to put it on Instagram before they've raced yeah you see it all the time so go on give us an example not of a person but an example of one that you've seen without naming a person yeah shout out the person I have so many of them in my head it's just you know like um um i'm so uh i'm ready to race tomorrow night although i've had this like i've had this niggle injury i i got the flu last week and i've you know just those little things that are just like in preparation for if they don't do well yeah to be fair i got a lot of shit from that i think one of the races you haven't done one of them no someone called me out they were like uh i did a video uh i think it was glasgow high rocks and i went and competed at glasgow high rocks but it was two weeks before london which was the major like london was the last chance qualifier or whatever kind of like major and two weeks before and i called the video like a training race or something like that and i was like oh it was a training race and we'd said it like beforehand yeah and then someone commented saying if you didn't get this shit result would it still be a training race no but that's different yeah yeah bloody trolls right yeah but yeah no that's just curious what is uh what's george's biggest x x yeah we're talking high rocks are we talking gym training a lot george's biggest x man she's got a couple she's got a For people that don't know, George is amazing.

1:26:03At the moment, she's on a bit of a triathlon streak. She's a tri girl. So she's probably like finding everything that's wrong with High Rocks at the moment. Just like, oh, icky. Finding High Rocks a little bit icky at the moment. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Her and Jess Petro, Elite 15 athlete, they've spoken about how they find lads doing the farmer's carry just an ick i got described as like like a penguin waddling like a penguin the waddling like a penguin yeah yeah so apparently emily loves it though so in uh in cardiff you couldn't see the kettlebells what do you mean so they were covered up by the railings and they were on the far side so you couldn't see so all you could see was people waddling like that walking really slow that's probably unique I think I'm just going to call it out and I know a lot of brands I'll probably get dropped for this and I saw one on your leg a semi-permanent tattoo I think we should abolish I think we should get rid of semi-permanent tattoos I don't know I just think it's a bit weird that like lads we put tattoos on if you walk in that elite 15 room beforehand, everyone's got the t-shirt off and everyone's putting semi-permanent tattoos on each other.

1:27:28Let me get that on your back. Why don't you lie? One, because I think they're so annoying to get off afterwards. That's why? Dude, it's Thursday and I still have mine on. I don't try to get it off. Who was it? It was Hiddy. Hiddy had one on from the London last chance qualifier. For Warsaw. for Warsaw no one month later he still had it on his chest is that and I don't know if that's a little bit apologies to Hedy yeah apologies I don't know was that the race where he because he's got chest hair and he just shaved where he had to that's hilarious yeah so I think yeah I think it's just a little bit weird especially like I like to after a race day after or whatever like I normally go for like a deep tissue massage or something like that yeah and then you've got like this this tattoo that says Deirdre on the back of your back.

1:28:25It's just a bit weird, isn't it? Yeah, yeah. And they're like, what's that? I'm like, don't worry about it. You know why I want, my answer is I'd rather win doubles than singles. Okay, go on. Do you know why? Because of our bet. What's our bet? I think I know it, but I just want you to confirm on camera. we shook hands that we would have a beer together if we win worlds yeah i think it was not just a beer i think it was i had to go on a proper night out yeah and get leathered yeah because we've never had a drink together yeah we've never had a drink together um i've not i've not drank now for 18 months i don't think you have not had a single drop a drop wow good on you it sounds like it sounds like I was like heavily addicted before.

1:29:13I've never liked alcohol. Like I, but you've had, you've, you've been drunk. Yeah. Yeah. I, uh, every time I drink, I like binge drink. Yeah. Because I don't like the taste of it. So I just like, you just shots. Yeah. And then, you don't, you don't taste it after a couple of days. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. I think we're going to go out after Stockholm. Yeah. If we win in Stockholm, in Stockholm. Yeah. Yeah. With the girls or not with the girls? You can decide. Depends on what we'll do.

1:29:43if we win no yeah that was you were there that was a bet I think if if we win we win to the strip club right absolutely 100 % mate there we go there we go there we go thank you James I appreciate it thanks Jake yeah no it's been an honour and like I say I want you on more than this I think we're going to have some good chats obviously leading up to kind of like worlds and stuff like this but thank you for coming on. Thank you for coming to Bolton. Rainy Bolton in May when at home it's beautiful, you know, 25, 30 degrees, sun shining, and you've come over here at six degrees and raining. Really do appreciate it.

1:30:25Hopefully you leave here thinking, ah, that's not as bad. It's not. I've already thought that, mate. It's not as bad. I'm really thankful for Rep 247, 247 Rep. um uh i or i already feel at home here um thanks to you as well mate so yeah no i'm i'm excited for the next uh five weeks to rip in with you and yeah see what we can do in worlds yeah and i think that's just going to help us like let's say we've already trained together today but we're going to be training together we're going to be working on like things that hopefully will improve just like our chemistry that's it but yeah thank you chemistry