The Hardest Geezer: What It REALLY Takes To Run Across Africa | Russ Cook | #76

0:00Russ Cook, welcome to the pod. Thank you, mate. Thanks for having me. Also known as Hardest Geezer. Hardest Geezer. Let's go. Obviously, you are an adventurer. I feel like that's what you are. I'd say so, yeah. Yeah. We could say, you know, ultra runner. Obviously, you've done some massive feats. For the people that may not have heard of you, which I think it's very, very few. Please, could you just explain who you are? Of course, yeah, mate. All right, so what I'm mostly known for is being the first person to run length of Africa. I've also done lots of endurance or adventure type challenges throughout the years.

0:39So I ran home from Asia. Just casually? Yeah. Buried myself alive for a week. Pulled a car for a marathon, broke the world record at the time. Climbed lots of mountains. Loads of silly things. We've ran across Iceland together with the rep boys, ran across New Zealand. So I like to get after it. I like to push myself and experience this wonderful blessing of life that we appear in. The craziest thing is like you started this way before like it was a trendy thing on social media. Yeah, yeah. I've been at it for a while, bro. What was the first thing you ever did? the first the first big like endurance challenge I did was the Asia to London run uh so yeah that was 2019 and that was I didn't even really have socials at the time I got Instagram just before and sort of chucked photos online as I was doing it just to show the boys back home like you know this is what I'm up to tonight in in Turkey or I'm in Bulgaria or whatever and uh and and the more I did that it started to gain a little bit of traction and I started realizing that there might actually be something in this social media thing um if I can continue sort of in that world and maybe like there's a world where this could be my job for example one day so I kind of could that's that was the start that was the origin of it all and uh the Asia to London yeah trip what was the kind of like set up what was the support was it self-supported yeah yeah how'd you got about it totally self-supported so how I came up with it all was that I'd I'd been I'd just got into running back home and it had been quite revolutionary for me because I'd had I'd had a tough few years and I'd got into running did a half marathon then a full marathon and I was really starting to build sort of some self-confidence and belief and I was building some good habits and discipline and it got me thinking about life and what I want to do with my life and what I would what I could achieve if I really put my mind to it.

2:47And I'd been working for a while just cleaning, a lot like scrubbing floors and we cleaned like nightclubs and pubs and council buildings and toilets. Is that what you started? Was that your first job? It wasn't my first job, but it was what I was doing at the time. I was about 20, I think, 20, 21-ish, something like this. And I had this feeling like there's got to be a bit more to it than this for me. so yeah I just quit all of it decided that I was gonna just buy one way tickets and just go around the world for as long as I could until I ran out of money sort of thing went to Kenya because I'd heard there's a load of good runners there and I wanted to go and meet them and stuff and it was there I met this Italian guy had been cycling around the world for six years and I just thought it was gangster just thought it was sick as and uh that speaking to him made me realize that actually there is no like one conventional way to live life like there it's there for the taking and I can kind of make of it whatever I choose to and it really inspired me to go I'm gonna go and meet the people I'm gonna travel to the places that no one travels and I'm gonna get stuck in and basically the rule book that I thought existed I'm just gonna rip that up and I'm gonna just I'm gonna fuck around and find out um and yeah then I just bought a one-way ticket to Istanbul got a camelback and filled it with like I had a hammock because it was the lightest thing that you could sleep in power bank bar of soap toothbrush toothpaste that's pretty much it change of clothes warm change of clothes and then yeah I just got to Istanbul and just ran a marathon every day counting the woods and eventually I got home 66 days later that's that's insane so completely self-supported what were you doing for food so most of the time on that trip my food came a lot from petrol stations petrol stations i could charge my phone and um so i so i'd i'd normally see a petrol station a day and then i'd just stop in there and diet was pretty trash to be honest it was like mostly peanuts like peanuts and ice cream i'd eat a lot of that together or separately all in mate all ends up in the same place eventually anyway so yeah um what's your favorite flavor of ice cream oh cookie dough probably cookie dough yeah come on um so yeah that was that was that trip you know it was it was petrol stations it was like knocking on people's doors at the end of the evening um getting water sometimes they'd give me food um just roll into the tiniest little villages in like serbia bulgaria and just see what people have got and just eat whatever they've got what would you say like you'd knock on the door and just uh like agua or whatever the language was for water just like i'd ask for you know so you just literally rock up would you would you offer money for it or would you like no not really no i just kind of say like oh i'm like i'm running to london like i'm really thirsty have you like would would i be able to get some water please like google translator or something and then often like especially in Eastern Europe when I got to Western Europe people didn't really like that kind of behaviour too much you can imagine like in doing that in the UK people would be a bit like yeah that's what I was about to say what would you do if someone knocked on your door and was like mate can I have some water well I go yes sure but like it's a bit weird yeah yeah yeah do you know what I mean it'd be a little bit awkward yeah in Western Europe there was definitely that energy was more like I was looking a bit they were like who is this guy is he like homeless guys what is he like druggy or something like this yeah you think like what's the ulterior motives like yeah like are they trying to rob us or something like that they got is it got another guy with him going around the back or whatever i don't know you're just trying to distract me in eastern europe it was like pretty fun they were like pretty all right with it yeah yeah they were just like happy and grateful that he was doing it they were just like yeah sure you need some war no like mostly i mean obviously there's exceptions here and there's a few rogue characters and stuff but on the whole eastern europe was sweet for that kind of thing did you ever bump into any trouble oh yeah quite a few mate yeah quite a fair bit on that one actually um trouble I mean the big one of the biggest ones we had um I was in Hungary just before halfway through the trip I was really knackered actually it'd been like there'd been a heat wave for a few days leading up to this and I made it to this town or city in Hungary and I went right I found there's a campsite in the town i'm going to go to the campsite and might get like a good shower and things tonight so i i decided i'm gonna have a little walk there after i've eaten this food what started walking there and then this lady pops up and um starts walking next to me she's trying to chat to me she's not broken english and and hungarian and i'm kind of trying to get her to go away but she's really sticking to me like a like a rash mate and we get to the campsite and then i said to the people that own the campsite i just want to put my hammock up in these trees and they were like nah like not basically like not you not tonight sort of thing you're like we're full and they were clearly not full and i was like what's going on here like why won't they let me in and what i realized basically this woman was a prostitute and she just because she was hanging around me they thought i was trying to bring a prostitute into the campsite and they were just like oh no not you lad so then i went through the whole rigmarole of them but by the time that by the time I finally gave up on trying to get into the campsite it was dark it was like getting pretty late and this woman was still hanging around with me and I was just saying to her like listen go away basically like get out of here and she's like trying to drag me into bushes she's trying like she's saying like sucky sucky like we're going into the bush and all of this stuff and I'm like getting photos of me and my friends up and being like oh this is my girlfriend like no no no no no and eventually she gave up but then she realized oh she gave up she was like right you owe me money for wasting my time and i was like listen darling you've wasted your own time like um i was never giving you any money i don't know you're following a dead lead and then she um she got the blower i've what i worked at she was basically trying she was calling a pimp her pimp and at that point i was like oh i'm back in trouble here like i'm in the middle of nowhere in hungary like got this brass that's like fuming at me she's like shouting like all this stuff at me so i just i've darted um and they couldn't catch me and then eventually i ended up sleeping and under a like a motorway side bank with my hammock got like three hours broke asleep my phone was dead i was like myself all night i was gonna get caught by these pimps in hungary and then i woke up the next day and i stumbled into a public bathroom like all the mirrors smashed and i looked at myself in the mirror and i was like this is the hardest thing i'd ever done at this point i was like 30 marathons in i was absolutely butchered and i remember like looking at myself in the mirror and being like this is what like this is what you came for like this is what you signed up for this is the adventure you wanted here like here you go and then i fit i ran i was like right i really had to grit through the marathon that next day it was like i was in real dire straits but the end of it i made it to this petrol station got there the geezer the petrol station was unreal gave me a couple of beers had a couple beers with him had a shower and looked at got my phone charged looked at a map and i just made it halfway and i was i remember starting the mission being like if i can make it to halfway then i'm out of like eastern europe i'll be in western europe it'll be a bit more familiar like i know i can do it from here um and that was like a big sort of landmark journey to overcome that sort of like first bit of and then I ended up making it what were the biggest difference between uh Eastern Europe and Western Europe for you uh so like Western Europe's I mean still but even more so at the time like is more developed so things like just getting hold of like food and like even accommodation if you wanted like hotel uh better roads um better signal um more people so it's familiar it's just more familiar whereas eastern europe was a little bit especially for me at the time was a little bit more culturally different like it was um just more slightly more communal communal lifestyle um people would be out and about a bit more slow paced but also friendlier definitely friendlier um just more rural yeah less developed no no i'm intrigued uh and then uh was there any point in that trip where he was like i'm done nah do you know what i was so determined man and i kind of have been throughout a lot of the big projects like that like that when when something sort of crush crosses that threshold of meaning for me but at the time you know now i kind of talk about it as like this you know one of these adventures that I've done but at the time that meant so it meant so so much to me it was like it was more than just like a run across a continent it was it was like proving to myself that I'm worthy like I felt like I'd let myself down for a number of years leading into that and that was almost like my chance to prove to myself but also to other people back home and people that knew me that like I was a capable person I was a competent person I had potential to do good things so it was I was so I can't even explain to you how determined I was I was like I will die for the game you know that kind of energy and so there was nothing really I feel like that could have stopped me there I was like so intent on making it you really would have had to like get an axe and chop my legs off to like even make me consider stopping you know do you think that's ever left you that kind of like like you say obviously you with every challenge that you've done like your intention is to finish yeah but because you had so much riding on that one yeah you think it was almost like easier i mean 100 um i think that for for me what i've sort of learned about myself as i've got older is that i'm actually not naturally the most disciplined person i would even look at you or like we spoke about alpha things i'm like wow i really admire your boys just discipline in the day-to-day of just like you will get this you like i bet alf hasn't missed a session for years you know i mean i'm just like i know that you boys are just turning up and doing doing the work day and day out whereas for me it's more something has to cross like a threshold of meaning for me to be once i'm really bought in like if i'm bought in it's on like i'm in but if i'm not then like if i'm honest with myself i'm like i'm not i'm not at the level and it's like when they say about uh if a relationship's bad then it's like tolerable but if it's really bad that's when like you you actually make the changes so i think it's almost like you with the it needs to be that extreme yeah because i've seen it i've seen it in iceland with you like you are the fucking real deal like you're exactly what you say you are like yeah but i feel like the challenge just needs to be big enough is that what you yeah it just needs to it needs to mean something to me and i can't fake it like that's the difficult thing even um you know with with something that's probably been a little bit of a struggle like first world problems since africa for me is that like that thing meant so much to me that is it's tough to to replicate how much that meant to be of anything else now and i'm almost in a in a bit i've got a bit more comfortable in life in general, which kind of eats away that little dog inside you.

14:31And it does take a lot of discipline to just keep going and going and going and going. Have you found that with your, because as you've become more successful, then I imagine like, for me, for example, I couldn't even afford rent pre-Africa. I couldn't, I'd walk into Tesco and I'd be buying all the reduced shit because I couldn't afford to eat real food. And like now, like, it's not like I'm like Charlie Big Potatoes with loads of money or anything. But I'm more comfortable now. I can pay my rent and I can do a few bits and pieces and it's all right. So like this doesn't feel like there's as much on the line as there used to be.

15:08But like, well, yeah, what's your experience there? No, it's actually really interesting you say that because I remember I was laughing about it the other day with a friend that I used to work with. Yeah. And I remember like being an apprentice. And now when I go to fill up my car, I just fill it up. yeah yeah yeah but I remember filling it up five pound at a time because like that's all I could afford yeah and then I'd go use that five pound and then like try and get five pound from somewhere else just because I was skint yeah um and like when it's so funny how like you go from that to then um like being able to to like afford everything and like you say you do get comfortable um that being said I don't think it's not like you're after crazy amounts of money it's like uh enough to eat nice food yeah and i mean that's essentially what i'm not saying like i'm not i'm not i'm not it's not it's not like it around yeah no i was i was like i remember like taking them on our first date and literally in the queue to get drinks like checking my like overdraft because i'm like shit i don't know if i've got i don't know if i've got this i might have to have a tap water but like now it's just like yeah little things like that i wouldn't i wouldn't do which we're so grateful for um i think one thing that i've learned from actually george heaton yeah is that um he always he always says like saying he's got way more money than both of us yeah but he's like he's like the the devil's on your tail or something like this or like and he wakes up even to now and he's do you know what i mean he's got way more money than us but he wakes up every now and he is relentless yeah and so is mike like money is not affected to them one bit they work if not harder now yeah and it's just because they they love the game and they they love the the they have such a passion so i just looked at that and think what can i get be so passionate about like they are with clothing yeah yeah and for me that's that's trying to optimize like become the best athlete that i can be and then inspire people along the way so like that's my mission and all like because i've got that mission like that's i just wake up and that's all i think about i don't think about the money i don't think about anything else yeah i like so so yeah uh yeah i think the only i've probably gone soft with sleep and shit like that like if i don't get a good night's sleep then like i'm like oh like i'm i'm struggling or whatever you could just say that it's actually you've just understood how important it is more because it is just actually crazy important but let's say like you you're doing that first ever run and yeah you're sleeping like like say under a motorway bridge or whatever it is and then like now even even the challenges we were saying like the challenges have become more luxurious maybe you're doing a challenge and you've got someone with a with an rv yeah next year and you've got a support crew and whatever and it's like that's still pretty comfortable like it's on it's completely different from when you first started out or whatever yeah um so yeah things do change and you do get more comfortable but yeah, what about Africa?

18:14Obviously, I don't want to go through like too much because I know you've spoken on it on a lot of podcasts and stuff like that. But what was your best experiences and worst? Best and worst. God, that's a hell of a thing to try and unpack there. I'd say the best experiences were,

18:43well I think that there was so many moments where you're kind of relying on kindness of people that you don't necessarily expect or want and that those were always like amazing moments when you'd like roll into a village like I remember in Nigeria rolling into a village we'd had quite a lot of trouble in Nigeria with people just trying to hustle money out of us and like sort of these wannabe gangsters on the side of the road that you're always a bit you're going back and forth with a lot and then we roll into a village in the middle of the night and chief comes puts a crate of beer down we have a good chat with him and it and those kind of moments will just they'll just sort of release the pressure out of the cooker a little bit when you're going through it every day like 50k 50k 50k you're worried about this you're worried about that and then it's just it might only be 20 minutes but you'll just sort of go so moments like that i was really appreciative for um also just like the opportunity to be and see places that i would never have i had no business like i'm going ever and um and for me one of the biggest takeaways was like the the sense of community and a lot of the this kind of a theme for africa a lot of a lot of the villages in the towns they would really live they would do life together a lot which i took a lot of inspiration from because in in the UK I love the UK there's so many great things but we do live much more individual lives like we won't know our neighbours so well oh mate it's crazy like you I always say London going out for a run or whatever if you say good morning to someone like they're looking like you're a freak yeah they'll slap you fuck you talking good morning mate fuck off you know what I mean like it's that guy said hello to me fucking prick but like in like in the amount of times I'd run through like a village in Africa and all the kids in the village would be out playing together.

20:43All of like the mums in the village would be out doing something together. All the bloat, like people lived in community a lot more. And I've always felt this is something that I would love to do like here more is like live in a community. It's quite hard to construct because culturally, which is so, it's such an alien thing. But I just think it's such, it's a better way to live, I think. Yeah, of course. You're happier together, aren't you? Like, I always think this, wherever you travel in the world, as long as you've got good people with you, it's great. Yeah, yeah. Like, we went to Iceland.

21:19How sick was that trip, though? Do you know what I mean? It was sick. It was class. But remember just, like, looking around and just thinking there is nothing here. Yeah, yeah. Like, it's pretty dull on your own. Yeah, yeah. Oh, 100%. But then when I look at that trip, I just think that was, how many was it? Seven of us running? Yeah, yeah. Seven of us, right? Where I'm looking around, I'm going, these lot are mad dogs. Like, you know, these lot are actually so about it. And yeah, we haven't slept for a couple of days. Like, yeah, I'm pretty cooked and like all the rest of it. But like, we're all about it together right now.

21:55And like, for me, that just feels like, those are some of the most meaningful times in my life where I feel that energy of all of you lot where I'm like, I'm just loving this right now. Yeah, it's insane. I think then things are almost better than the solo adventures. 100%. It's not even close, I think. And like you say, we can reminisce on that. Even the Iceland trip, how sick was it? I reckon it was like 3 a.m. Mate, so good. Alien stories, just unpacking everyone's childhoods and everything, it was sick. Yeah, it was, and I think I had like so much respect for each person in the room that it was like, I honestly can't wait to hear about what is this person, like what George is going to tell me about his alien theory or something.

22:43But I'm like, I'm actually really want to hear what he's got to say though. it was so funny when it we was actually running faster because we wanted to get back in the rv so we could talk about the stories because again the seven of us running so we'd run maybe like a couple of k each and then we'd switch so you'd probably have like say like 10 minutes on and then half an hour off or whatever it was and we'd be all wanting to run as fast as possible just so we could get back into the truck yeah chat about shit and like listen to each other stories i was saying to george if george is listening like george we need to do that again but what we do this time is we go across like somewhere like a desert or something or like a jungle and and we get seven of us but we have no support and we just we just raw dog it ourselves how would you do that would you would you have like a car or anything or would you all like move at the same time we all just move at the same speed i'll move at the same speed or like you know you have one person scouting up head and then everyone catches up or whatever but all on foot all on foot we're carrying everything.

23:43Yeah, carry it all. We're all on foot. We bring cameras, we carry the cameras, take it in turns. Yeah. Bro. That would be sick. It would be sick. Everyone's going to steal our ideas now. Maybe, but no one could do it like us. We'd smash it. No, I think it would be sick, like you say. Yeah. And I think that's like the purest form, like you mentioned. Like, I feel like people have got too comfortable with these, these ultra endurance tasks. Yeah. Like, it's cool. Like, I am so impressed by, especially, I see like, I don't know if you follow like Backyards much, but I've seen Backyards going insane at the moment.

24:18And I'm seeing like Donnie's smashing out like five days in front. And I'm like, this is unbelievable. Like what people are getting out of their body performance-wise at ultra distance is absolutely, it's a spectacle, mate. But also like, I love seeing the other side of it where it's like, just give someone a mad constraint. like they don't you know they've got to supply themselves they've got to get their own food they've got a source they've got to interact with locals and get through something i'm like that i love that as well like that's a bit of that's a bit of the raw energy in there where would you want to cross there's loads of places i think would would work pretty well um tasmania i could see that being a vibe um it's like maybe like alaska somewhere in alaska would be pretty cool a bit a bit more like uh who's the outdoor boys have you seen him yeah on youtube yeah a few brown bears but yeah we'd need him to teach us how to make a fucking yeah we could get someone to come and teach us a few bits and pieces like patagonia that'd be sick yeah it does look sick patagonia um we could we could time it so we ended in like a nice little city so we could have a little blowout at the end as well well we said that we'd do brazil didn't we we did we did say that start in the amazon finishing finish rio whatever yeah i don't know but uh yeah be a cool party that would be sick yeah um what was the worst experience in africa like what was the was there anything we had a couple of rough ones in there lad did anything like give you like i'm obviously not ptsd but you know what i mean like you still think about till today joe i've done a pretty good job probably in the last year of of letting a few of those things go because there definitely was some things that rattled me pretty hard um there was like the there's a time in congo where i separated from the crew and then sort of like like held hostage until until they came we we could arrange a situation for them to come back and exchange some money get out of that um you know that was tough drc is a mad gaffe um we were robbed at gunpoint obviously angola that was not ideal pissing blood a couple of times also not great um but yeah mate do you know what it's because it's been a couple of years now I've like they definitely lived with me like quite intensely for a while like I would even like wake up in the night sometimes I'd be running along in like the woods and I'd get little moments where I'd be like oh I'm not um I'm not like totally confident in my ability for my mind to control this.

26:52Like, it feels like it's getting me a bit. But I do feel like in the last probably year I've probably parked them. You got more looking back on the trip in rose-tinted glasses? Yeah, more so in it and just like understanding like the bad thing happened but it's not, it's over now. Like, it's, that was a previous part of my life and it's not, it doesn't need to affect me anymore if you know what I mean. How have you found that? Because a lot of people, like you say, know you from running across Africa, but that, that isn't rust. You know what I mean? That's just, that's just one part and the one thing that you've done.

27:29Like people look at you as that, maybe, maybe still refer back to that and like, as if that's the only other thing that you've ever done. But like you say, you've done so many things. Yeah. And now you're going about normal life. Have you, have you struggled with that? Have you? No, do you know what? It, it's definitely something that I was conscious about. And, and if anyone that was like wanting to do these big kind of adventures or have like a big career in anything it's something i always recommend is to like uh to place your identity in multiple different boxes so for me like i understand that most people know me as like the running africa or like the mad guy that does the adventures and stuff and like i do recognize that that is a genuine part of me like i do exist there but also like I'm a partner to my missus I'm a dad like we're running an adventure company so I'm I'm a business guy like I have relate I have my identity is spread out of multiple different things so for me I understand that this probably is the most interesting thing to most people but you know there's a lot of other things going on and if that part of my life isn't going so great then it's fine because I've got all of these other things or that's not going so great and we've got all of these other things.

28:43I find if you, if you have your identity places, like I am the adventure guy, the moment that I may be not on a big adventure, I'm not in Africa, I'm not in a project, whatever, then it's like, who even am I anymore? But like, I'm a dad, I'm a this, I'm a that. So it's fine. I think you've done really well to, let's say, separate them things and like, you come, you seem happy. Yeah, man, I am actually like, but like, even like having a baby, for example, it's been like a mad one for me. like that's made me so just going home like i'll go home after this and just i'll see a little popular i'll go hello and she'll give me a little smile that's that's unreal do you know what i mean yeah how is dad life oh i'm like i was saying to you guys at the start like i'm i i love being a dad honestly best best thing i've ever done the only thing and i can't even i shouldn't even really say this on a podcast because if em's listening to this you'll laugh because she's the one that's doing most of the nights, but like the sleep, sleep has been a bit hard.

29:41It's just when you're trying to run and you got, you're trying to use your brain the next day and you haven't slept properly. It gets a bit like, whoa, living off the cafe at the moment. But yeah, mate, being, all the cliches that people say about becoming a dad or becoming a parent, like, that's how I feel. Like, it's life changing stuff. Yeah. Yeah, that's it. No, that's insane. And with, Africa yeah a lot of people like whenever say oh like because I see you quite often yeah so I'm like oh I'm going meeting Russ or whatever and they go what Hardis Giza and then if they don't know you they go do you reckon he did it really yeah and yeah and that kind of upsets me because I've spoke to you for hours and hours and hours and either Russ you are the best storyteller I've ever met or you fucking did it yeah and like yeah it's it's absolutely crazy that people people still think to this day that like oh you potentially faked it or you didn't do it or whatever the only thing i have to say to people is like honestly ask yourself what evidence could you have expected me to put out there that i haven't put out you've got you can look at every single run every single one is on Strava um uploaded through my Garmin watch like with maps the lot heart rate anything you want it's all there it's I've got thousands of witnesses across the concert like with hundreds of hours of footage I'm I'm honestly I'm quite fine with people if they want to think that because I'm just like there's an overwhelming amount of evidence out there that I did and I couldn't have I couldn't have gathered any more evidence I don't think reasonably you couldn't have expected me to go over anymore so if you choose to believe that I voted like fine I guess yeah it's it yeah it's insane but uh other other people that have done like outrageous things like you obviously you know people question yeah whether it's William Good running across Australia whether it's Ross Edgley swimming around Great Britain like you know Not everyone seems to be kind of like questioning these things, but like I've been with you.

32:01Again, with Will Gouge, like I know he fucking did it. Like it's crazy. I think Gouge seems like he had a lot, to be fair, where it was like people question. And I'm like, what are you? But part of me with that, I'm like, you lot are just jealous because Gouge is like six free and like stacked and looks great. and you lot are just nibbling because he's going to pinch your misses if you're not careful. Yeah, it's crazy. Even we probably think that right now, to be fair. Probably like, you think Will's like, good looking from afar, like when you see him on Instagram and then you meet him in person and he's just like, fuck's sake.

32:36Yeah, fuck's sake. He's even better than what he is on Instagram. Yeah. Like even smoother, even better looking, like taller. He's a smooth guy to be fair. Yeah, he is. And he's a life and soul of a party as well. He is, yeah. It's pretty cool. Yeah. Do you know what made me realise that even more is when we was in Iceland and Giza's like 60 hours deep and like just had a mad little blow up with his, whatever was going on with his back or whatever. And then he's just sinking tinnies and I'm going, wow, he's actually about it. Mate, it's crazy. He was literally having a fit on the floor because his back was going into the soil.

33:11He had Siggy's on the go too, didn't he? Yeah, it's crazy. Fair. Actually fair. yeah he won't mind us saying this now but uh i think like a week before or two weeks before he had like a massive uh moped crash yeah yeah in italy yeah and it was in dl a bit at the time yeah yeah yeah so he couldn't say anything i think because he was running australia i think generally australian marathon sydney marathon should say uh but but yeah it like he was literally so broken but he still came out and still ran it yeah like i say you did exactly the same like i I don't know, you did more than your first year with that Iceland trip.

33:44And it's just, and I don't even think you'd been running that much at the time. I'd finished New Zealand a bit ago, but I was a bit injured off the back of that. No, I'd sort of, I'd got back into training, yeah. But the fact that like, do you know what I mean? You can just rock up and it's like unquestionably, it's unquestionable whether you did it or not. You definitely fucking did it. Yeah. What do you think about Guji's next one? He's doing this American project. I think it's Will down to a T. Private Jet Company. He's a smooth guy. I think it's just cool as fuck. I think that's him. Yeah, I love it.

34:22But guess what? He's been training so hard with it. He's been doing altitude training. Were you out there? Have you been out in there? No, Colorado. No, he's been living with Robbie Ballinger. Yeah, yeah. Also a great guy and stuff like that. And he's a savage in his own right. I think he did one of the first ever speed projects. Yeah, yeah. No, he raced a Tesla, I think. I followed Robbie for a while. He's a bit of an OG in the game, isn't he? 300 miles in one goal. Basically, outran a Tesla. Yeah. Which is mad. Guzzi's got 50 miles, 24 days. Yeah. He's getting the record for the States. Yeah.

34:56It's going to be a logistical nightmare, to be fair. I don't know. I just saw the other day that he's advertised a run club in every state as well, which hopefully he's not doing. Or maybe it's a long part with his run or whatever. I don't know. but the man has got some energy. Yeah. That's what he's doing as well. But yeah, no, I think he'll, it's going to be like a tight deadline. It's going to be tough, but I think, I think he'll smash it. He's actually starting in Hawaii as well. So he's starting, which you forget that that's part of America, don't you? But yeah. Would you ever be in the mixer for a, for a big sort of project, like multi-day project like that?

35:29Or are you purely on, on the High Rocks game now? For the foreseeable, purely on the High Rocks game. Yeah. But there's nothing more than, I love more than like, the team element like you mentioned anything with a team like i'm down because i think they're the things that you remember for life yeah and i think i probably want to do something like potentially you did where it was kind of just get from one place to another yeah yeah uh more like the the asia to um to london where it's kind of like you you just self-supported and you just basically do whatever you need to and it's not kind of like documented or anything yeah just go and do it i think the big question people are going to be wondering is what's next or okay um so my next my next big goal is to try and get into team gb for 24 hour running which I set that goal at the start of the year thinking it was going to be like really hard but probably not quite appreciating how hard.

36:39So I've got a bit of a multi-stage plan and the first step was like, right, I need to get faster so that I'm just more efficient at slower paces. So I was like, right, we'll set the 235 marathon. I was going for that in London. the reality is that I basically just didn't have the fitness to get it done. I didn't have a great day, but still wasn't at it. And got 246.59. It was so hot as well. I don't even think it was that hot. I honestly can't even, I wouldn't even really want to make an excuse for myself, being totally honest. I just didn't have the fitness. Didn't, I mean, I trained hard. I just don't think I necessarily trained smart.

37:27And I also just think I was a little bit naive and thinking I could get there faster than I actually could. So after that, I then had Poppy and trained for an Ironman over the summer. We had a few little projects with Hardest Adventures doing mountains and things. So I was like a little bit occupied doing that. And then after the Ironman, I was like, right, we're going to lock back in. And now I'm going for the 235 again in March next year. So I'm basically just going to be in the background, really training for that. I've also just, as is the way with my life, I've got a bunch of other little madnesses on the way.

38:04I'm going to Antarctica to run an ultramarathon in a few weeks. No way. Yeah. I'm going to every space camp in two weeks, I think, a week and a half to do that. So, I mean, I really want to push these performance goals, but I also love having the experience of going to Antarctica, the opportunity to do that. we're taking five people up to Everest Base Camp. I love doing these things as well. So I'm basically just trying to get the most out I can performance-wise, but I'm still an adventurous guy. So I'm still doing my adventures as well. Yeah, of course. Sometimes it's hard to turn down these things, right?

38:41And why would you want to turn them down? 100%. I think for me, I'm looking at this sort of this Team GB 24-hour goal now is like okay this is like serious like physical performance i'm actually going to have to probably over a number of years like start chipping away at it rather than something that i can just turn up and just like blast and get into so what's the qualifying standard for that 254k in 24 hours what's that what's the average pace uh five i think it's about 5 20 or 5 30 k's but continuous four hours yeah so it's like it's um yeah it's gonna be very very hard and i think if i if i can get to that then i'd be so buzzing myself because i think if i'm honest i'm not i'm not i'm not a great athlete i'm not i'm definitely not the best i'm i'm i'm a bit more of a sort of enduring guy like i put me in mad situations and i'll you know i'll figure my way through them but from that physical performance point of view i think that's what the challenge really is for me here is like how good can i really get at that over over a number of years if i really apply myself so that's exciting to me to try and do that um but yeah along the way i'll definitely be doing you know i've got a few ideas with a few other big runs across a few countries and maybe there's a few other things i can do in that world too but yeah the overarching goal now is like right let's try and get the performance up yeah how do you uh how do you feel about a lot of people using your work as inspiration should we say you know there's a lot of people running across places now yeah um do you think it's a cool thing do you think it's like saturated now do you think like a bit of both but i've ruled I think like, listen, like when we spoke at the start, like one of the big things that I've always wanted to do is try and inspire people to get moving, get out there, but also just like take on the adventure of their life.

40:47And I think that it looks different for all of us. We all have different things going for us. If someone thinks that they want to run a continent too, like, hey, go and have at it. But it doesn't necessarily, I'll take as much pleasure in someone coming up to me and saying like, like, oh, what's your Africa journey? And I decided that I was, you know, I was going to quit this job I hated. And I went into this and I'm really giving it a go, man. I'm really trying. I'd be like, that's sick. Just as much as someone said, like, oh, I saw your journey and now I'm going to run across whatever country.

41:16Like, it's, yeah, it's just about whatever. I want people to find what is meant for them, not necessarily just copying other people, you know. Yeah, that's a good message. Like, I feel like as well, I don't know about you, but you get endless energy when you really, really, truly find your passion. Yeah, exactly. And the thing is, is that it just does look different for everyone. So I'm pretty aware that it's not going to be running concerts for most people. And I wouldn't want it to be, mate. Like, it's dangerous. It's like, it's grueling. You spend a lot of time away from people you love. It's not going to be for everyone.

41:57But the underlying message of like, listen, we got eight years, 90 years. go and have at it, mate. Life is actually, what I find with people is that I chat to, and I'm like, sometimes people just sleepwalking into a life that they didn't even want or ask for, but they've just passively kind of accepted that this is how life is for them. And I'm like, listen, bruv, it doesn't have to be like, maybe that's how you want it and that's fine, but it doesn't have to. If you want to go and do something, you might try it and fail, and fall in your ass and look right and empty a million times. But you can keep going, keep going, keep going.

42:36Like that's what I'll just go and have it. Do you know what I mean? Yeah. And failure is normally not as bad as what you actually think. Nah, it gets built up in it in your head. It's crazy. And I still do it now, bro. But the amount of horrid failures that, you know, even this year I'm like 235 marathon, failed that. like all of these things that I was like oh I'm gonna try and do this gonna try and do that and it just it doesn't life doesn't work out that way sometimes but like the only real failure is just giving up like before before you really wanted to you know I remember watching the the London Marathon uh watching you and I remember seeing the post that you put on after yeah yeah and then the amount of love people give you yeah they were like buzzing that you attempted something that was your comfort zone and even though you didn't achieve it that time around like you I think you said in your post like you know you're gonna get it one day you're gonna get it yeah and then I will I will definitely get there I mean that's what I'm like give me more time like you know but people love that shit because at the end of the day most people fail first time around that's the reality of life like none of us are just out here smashing it A star first time and maybe some people are maybe on Instagram it looks like that a bit yeah maybe Gucci is yeah but like the reality for life for us when when you're not spectacular at things you just have to you have to keep trying mate and you know learn the lessons and go again and maybe you'll fail again but then you can go again and eventually we'll get there you know yeah outside of kind of like running yeah what are you interested in what do you enjoy doing oh what am I interested in god nothing that exciting bro I like, actually, this is well boring, but I quite like following politics.

44:28Follow politics. I've been getting into my economics a bit more recently as well. I know that sounds like banter, but it's actually not. Quite enjoy consuming that kind of content. Yeah. Is that like on, is it Instagram? Is it Twitter? YouTube, I see. Yeah. You've not gone down the conspiracy theory route yet? Not really. I have done a little bit, but for me, a lot. I think that category has become such a category that people are just making up nonsense in there. Yeah, yeah. What about you? No, just podcasts like that. That's where I get my attention. What sort of podcast do you listen to the most?

45:11I love Joe Rogan. Yeah. Only one there's interesting guests on, but yeah, it's great. Who else? I listen to Have A Word a little bit if I want something that's like a little bit more light hearted Have A Word who does that one? It's like a Scouse comedy podcast Right right It's just nonsense basically Yeah yeah I'm sure they'll love that review No no it's great Hopefully I get what you mean like an easy listening one where you're like I can sort of turn my brain off and just One of them ones They're needed bro They're actually needed Because then you've got on the other side if I want to learn something maybe humour maybe modern wisdom but sometimes you've got to be in the right mindset for them yeah because sometimes like when you've had a tough day or whatever and you're out on a run you just need someone that is light-hearted yeah no i hear that yeah doing any more self-development yeah i'm done with this health development today i'm monging i'm monging today yeah exactly exactly i think that's that's needed and it needs to be preached that like you know high performance aren't just self-development all the time like yeah that you you can just watch some shit netflix and yeah chill out and do whatever the fuck you want soak it in it's like it's like the recovery version of like when you're running you can't just run hard sessions for 24 hours a day because you'll fuck yourself up you need to have your recovery yeah what podcast do you listen to do you know what i i don't listen to podcasts anywhere near as much as i used to you know i was big on joe joe rogan back in the day and and diario ceo and modern wisdom were like probably the three that i'd listen to the most peter crouchy would be my one that i'd um would be sort of my turn off turn off one he did one with his missus I don't know if he still does it but that was actually quite funny as well I think Emily listens to that one oh really yeah my missus listens she was the one that put me on to that and we listened to it together it was quite funny but yeah I'll be honest I haven't been listening to that many podcasts of late yeah I don't know what about Netflix Netflix yeah not loads we'll do a few of the the crime ones or like someone's murdered we watched one the other day it was a shocker man this this woman murdered a pregnant lady because she'd lied about being pregnant it's all this i don't know if you've seen this one oh what which one's that what's that called this woman pretended to be pregnant she lied to all of her friends and family and her boyfriend about being pregnant and then she eventually realized nine months in this like she was due to give birth and everyone which she was telling everyone she but she wasn't pregnant so she murdered her friend who actually was pregnant took the baby out of her her womb and then was driving along the motorway and just pretended that she'd had a miscarriage and then they got her into the support and was like what is going on here then they found this woman had been murdered that it was pregnant and they just put two and two together and realized this woman was absolutely off red mad maddest doc i've seen in a while that one that's insane there's some mad people out there isn't there yeah I mean that is kind of it's a horrible story obviously but I do feel like Netflix is flooding the system with that kind of cause it's just so outrageous that you just can't I feel like I'm I feel like I'm stupid for falling into the trap of watching stuff like that but you know it happens doesn't it yeah but yeah mad gaffe yeah Americans obviously was it in America that one yeah I feel like their TVs they do it different out there bro yeah yeah to be fair i think english crime documentaries and stuff like that everyone's loving them at the moment yeah yeah um it's normally women though do you not find normally women love like a murder case or yeah i think those ones do seem to be doing the rounds don't they maybe it's because they're more popular with women yeah i don't know maybe it's a bit more of an unusual story because men are generally more violent than we so if it's a woman it's like what what's going on there

49:09we've derailed we've derailed put the train back on the tracks Jakey put the train back on the tracks so obviously you've got the main goal of completing what is it 254k in 24 hours yeah well the main goal when do you think you're like the main goal is to represent Team GB at the 24 hour world championships have you got like a year in mind so they do one every two years 2027 is the next one I don't think that was the original one I was like I want to try and make 22.7 if I'm honest with myself I don't think my performance is going to be there in time well do you reckon you could do if like say six weeks time you're going to attempt it how many K's do you reckon you could run I think I'd maybe be in that 220 to 240 range right now okay so you're not far off not far but I think every bit at that level is going to cost a lot you know yeah of course when you're actually working out like it's basically just over 10k every hour on the hour yeah which is it's insane when you think about it like yeah even even running say if you average five minute games or whatever yeah you've got ten minutes to spare yes or less than that yeah it's oh mate it's gonna be a hard game um but it's great it's good it's good who do you look up to as your own models god um now John I don't I try not to really have too many like role models like that because we're all human, we're all flawed.

50:39There's people that I admire for certain different aspects in life. Like I would honestly look at like you and Alf and a few of the rep boys where I'd go like, I really admire a lot of you boys in terms of like your discipline, like with you, like how you're diversifying and got your attention on so many different things, but you're still staying really strong on your performance. Alf I'd be like similar kind of thing where he's like so focused and so dedicated to his work George I'd look at and like from a business point of view it's like mental that those boys have smashed at and they've been working at it for so long so there's I take little bits from everyone but there's no one where I'm like oh he's amazing love him so much I want to just be like him you know yeah we're all different man like this yeah yeah no I find it interesting what about like other aspects of your life say who do you look up to from like a maybe like a social point of view or like i don't know light-hearted positive mindset and stuff like even like like um my partner's brother-in-law like mark his name is i'm like he's a great dad like great husband i'd look at someone like him and be like really respect got a lot of respect for him um yeah i mean there's so many different areas of life in there it's like for me now i'm a dad i'm like really i want to be in like i want to be the best dad like that's one of the there's not many better things i could do in my life and then do that um so i'm looking more like okay how do i communicate how do i you know hit people with the the soft and the hard and the the standard but also the the safety as well so it's like it's all these different things that uh i'd look at um yeah what about you uh very similar i think i think that approach is the the best approach like having different role models for different areas of your life yeah um and i'm exactly the same like someone like you know discipline probably look at george um like even even like i've been inspired by you today just by you saying like you can change your life completely yeah just having the confidence to, you know, you're not restrained by anything.

52:59Like, you know, if you work a nine to five, you don't have to work that nine to five. You could do something else. I mean, it comes across like, it's almost like memeable at this point where like people will sort of take the piss almost out of that viewpoint. I do really understand it, but like, I do find when I'm chatting to people day to day that the bottleneck for a lot of people is confidence. It is just having the boldness to accept that you might fail. Like, you know, if you want this life outcome, you're going to have to accept there's a good chance that you'll fail at that. But if you can be bold enough and courageous enough, then I just, I want people to believe in themselves more, you know?

53:48can you fail if you never give up on it though it depends what you say obviously if you say I'm going to be the world record holder in the 100 meter sprint it's never happening never happening for any of us but if you say I genuinely want to do this, this is a passion of mine and I want to make this my work I think you can we're in an age where you can make almost anything your work yeah yeah I'm and I guess it's it's all for me I'm I balance that trying to balance those two things of like I want to inspire people to make them to make them feel like they believe that anything they can make anything their work but also that's not an entirely true statement because not everyone can make what they want to make their work their work not everyone can not everyone has the bit of the ability to i guess so it's like it's trying to balance those yeah you know just being grateful for what you got yeah yeah yeah um talk to me about the adventure company yeah i'm really yeah we've been going on that for we just we just had a year anniversary actually heist adventures um so mate yeah it's been going really well actually what's the whole kind of like set up like so the the goal of the company really is we want to help facilitate take people on the adventure of their life basically what everything i've been speaking about today um is what the company is set up to do we take people's on people on adventures all over the world um we help give them that confidence to make them believe that they actually you know they can achieve more and they could do more than they thought they could before um so we do some of the trips we're running at the moment we do Kilimanjaro, Everest Base Camp, Machu Picchu.

55:38We're doing a bunch of marathon series soon. So I'm doing the first one. We're taking a group out when I do Barcelona. We'll have a whole marathon package around that. And then, yeah, a few times a year, we also put on completely free adventures as well, which is what I'm doing in a week or two, is I'm taking five people out to Everest Base Camp with a higher cup to Everest completely for free. And these are generally more focused towards people that wouldn't really be able to facilitate it otherwise because the reality is these adventures cost a load of money and sometimes it's really not achievable for everyone.

56:13But we want to try and give those opportunities out as much as we can. So as we're going to business, we're trying to make those opportunities more available too. So yeah, man, I wouldn't want to work in another industry. It's a sick place to be. Like just there's constantly stories of people that are like going and running their first marathons, this first time going abroad and they're climbing Kilimanjaro. And we're trying to, you know, instill that belief in people and show them some of the beauty and wonders of this world. So it's all good stuff. And I've got some really good people working on it.

56:45Alex, my business partner, is smashing it and making it commercially sound and commercially viable, which is obviously, like, critical for any business to run long term. So, yeah, really good people, really smart people involved. And I think it's going places, bro. happy days so if someone wanted to like like the idea of that and wants to do they just literally sign up with you yeah website hardest adventure.com or the instagram page you can find out all the information on like all the different adventures that we're running and come and get involved man we'd yeah we'd love to have we'd love to have you girls and boys what uh what's like the the end point of that like is it like a crazy adventure that you obviously may not be able to facilitate to take right now but like you want to take people on um so i think for me like i don't necessarily think of adventure as like the craziest thing that we could take people on it's more just adventures like relative for everyone and i think that you know there's a difference between the level of safety that i'd risk for myself and the level of safety that i'd risk for other people like we wouldn't i would never like set up trips that are going to really put people at like life.

57:58I mean, obviously you climb Kilimanjaro, there's risks to all of this stuff, but we're more, I'm definitely more focused on making sure that all the system is in place that it's safe for everyone else rather than with me, I'm more loose of it. Do you ever get any crazy requests?

58:16What, to take people on a madness? Either take people on a madness or like people have suggested you need to go and do this. More the second one. People are less willing to die, I've found. People don't really want to die, so they won't really ask me to take them on, like, real-life-threatening stuff. But, I mean, the most dangerous big project that I've sort of discussed and people have spoken to me about is the pole-to-pole one. How would you even start that? So you start in Antarctica at the southern pole. You cross to the edge of the peninsula over about, I think it's 2 ,000 miles of Antarctica with snow.

58:55Then you get there, then you've got this thing called the Drake's Passage in the way, which is about 500 miles of the world's most dangerous ocean. Real choppy, if you see some videos of that, it's madness, that one. And how would you, would it be like rowing a boat or something? Yeah, so I've looked at a few options. I initially looked at swimming. No one's ever swam it before. It looks somewhat close to impossible. I wouldn't say it's definitely impossible. I think if there was some heated wetsuit technology and some big boats and you had a good weather window, then it might, it could be game on.

59:28I've also just done an Ironman, realized I'm really bad at swimming. So I think for me, it's probably something that is probably off the cards. But rowing has been done by a team before. So I'm like, maybe you could row it solo. That would be gangster as well. Then you get to the most Southern tip. You don't get seasick, right? Oh, no, I do actually. We'll figure that out. We'll figure that out, bro. Then you get to the most Southern tip of South America and you run up there through Patagonia, through the Andes, through the Amazon. Then you get to a place in Colombia and Panama called, what did we have?

1:00:09Darien's Gap, which is like a really hostile jungle. They do a lot of drug trafficking and people trafficking through there, run by gangs mostly. There's no roads through there. You just purely just go through the jungle. so that would be quite a choppy bit there and then you're obviously up into mexico usa up into canada and then in the winter it freezes over so you've got the north pole just freezes over to canada so then you could go directly on foot from canada to the north pole you do have a few polar bears and grizzly bears on the way that top bit though so that would make it pretty sketchy too so but i've scoped out the project it's a couple year project at least marathon a day for a couple of years um the main issue for me now is that I'm a dad you're gonna take poppy with you so um I think it could be it could be like an end of career job like I'm 29 I'm like you know I could I could wait until the kids get a bit older and maybe if things lined up with the family and then was happy with it all and the kids maybe like were really into it and they wanted to come out for bits and pieces of it that were a bit more safe and we make we could make it work on that front than it then it could be on I'd be pretty reluctant to say that I'd be tackling it within like any sort of like close proximity time frame just because I don't want to miss out on my kids life like being a dad is more important to me than achieving any kind of adventure now so um yeah that's probably not the bit I should say for my career I should say no no no I'm definitely gonna do it but I think that's just the reality if this is truth of it it's just like I want to be a good dad more than more than i want to achieve anything left in the adventure world yeah priorities but never say never right never say never definitely never say never and there i could definitely see a world in maybe like a decade where the kids were a bit older everyone was on it and we'd scoped out enough that i could make it like decently safe and it was like it was the last one the last big project i don't think anyone else is going to do it anytime soon i i don't know maybe i would love to see someone do it that would actually be the ideal if someone else does it before so that i can just rid myself of it and be like it's been done no need to do it but um i don't i've got a feeling that's not what it's gonna yeah no one's gonna do it and and just think just because of how cost yeah cost i think cost is how much do you reckon it costs for something like that because again like how much did the if you don't mind me asking like yeah the africa trip like how much did it cost like in the end um i think it was i can't remember what the final sort of number was i think it was close to about 250 300k which is about which probably about six times what i initially thought it would cost but yeah it cost so much more money these things just you mate it's mad how much these things end up costing yeah not well even plane tickets nowadays yeah and like you say when you've got a team with you or whatever people's wages is always you want to pay people like proper wages and it's just going to cost a load of money yeah yeah of course of course but um yeah yeah thank you for today no worries appreciate you having me I think we'll we'll catch up soon yeah yeah whenever that'll be you're a busy man yeah yeah we'll be crossing paths at some rep event soon maybe we'll just do another fucking challenge yeah and we'll get a live podcast on the go we need to mate George if George's watching George come on let's get it going brother i want to know she's gonna watch this yeah yeah some jungle some jungle some desert feel like yeah i think brazil jungle range jungle rep clothing be sick jungle everything anything else that you could do we could yeah yeah or an arctic one that could be sick yeah we've just released politech it's coming out soon it's sick i've got some of it yeah sick really good gear there we go good right plug in there for the boys as well come on thank you no Bye-bye.