“Aggressive” Marketing Tactics | Bathroom Break #112

0:07Welcome to a new special series called The Bathroom Break. That extra 10 minutes you either have to listen to marketing tips or use the bathroom or both. But I don't recommend both, but that's your choice. This collab is going to be super fun. We have Daniel Murray from the Marketing Millennials and me, Jay Schwetelson, from the Do This Not That podcast and subjectline.com. each episode in the series. We are going to go over quick tips about different marketing topics. And if you want to be in the bathroom, fine, just don't tell us about it. Thanks for checking it out. We are back with another bathroom break.

0:42I'm here with the best-selling author, Jay Shredelson. I'm excited to chat, but you know, what's really funny that I've always been wondering about you and because i saw a post lately is like you will go on a trip and you don't want to do a massage but you'll go and like hang out with bees like can you explain why you would go with bees and not do something relaxing on your time off yeah so our time off i'm at this hotel right now and uh whenever i go to like on vacation whatever i always ask what are the weirdest experiences that the hotel has going on because i really don't i feel so i hate massages I think they're so overrated.

1:20I can't relax. And so like at this hotel, they're like, we have a bee experience where we have a beehive dude and you can go out there and learn about like bees and making honey. And so I put on like this hazmat suit. And the reason I did it is my wife, anytime a bee is near me, like a wasp, I'm at dinner table, I freak out and I start like trying to swat it. And she sits there still and she's like, you got to be still. And I'm like, I'll do this bee experience. Maybe I'll get over it. so um i put on this hazmat suit and we were around 50 000 bees and it was wild the wildest part was the dude i was with who was like the bee dude keeper whatever his name is he had nothing on like no gear none and he was just like in it and all i kept saying to him was you are wild you're out of your mind and he's like i love this bee this is my favorite bee and i love this bee i'm dude i blew my mind so do you do anything like that no first of all i'm allergic to bees and second of all i'm thinking as you were talking i felt like my skin start crawling of bees all over no i don't ari is not very adventurous when it comes to adventure we've done some adventure stuff like in australia we did like luge thing down a mountain which was really cool and then we did like a bungee thing but we haven't done stuff like that for a while like bees i would not be near bees um first thing i asked the guy who helped us i go have you seen the movie beekeeper with jason stratham and he's like no that's it i've seen that movie it's it's good it's good yeah it's like every other movie he does but yeah it's great exactly it's always a fair question Well, talking about aggressive things you've been doing lately, because you talk about some aggressive marketing.

3:11I see you do some aggressive marketing where you double. I keep getting double emails from you every single day. So can you explain why you're doing that? Yeah. So there's an aggressive marketing tactic that everybody listening is going to be like, there's no way I could do that. I'm in a regulated industry or my brand wouldn't like that. But I am telling you, let's talk about email specifically. I am telling you everybody out there should test doing two email sends in one day to your database, promoting your offer. What do I mean by that? And I'll give you some stats to back it up. And we do this all the time with our clients.

3:45So let's say you have a webinar, right? And it's 24 hours until your webinar. In the morning, you send out an email to your database saying, you know, 24 hours until the webinar. And then at 4 p.m., you send out another email to the database that says only 80 spots left. Or on the consumer side, you send out an email in the morning that says 24 hours left in our sale. And then at 5 p.m., you send out an email that says almost sold out. When you do two email sends in the same day where one is getting urgency going and the other one is like super urgent, we actually see conversion rates and sign-up rates go up over 35%.

4:24You're like, well, that's too much. We're going to get opt-outs. We're going to get whatever. Who cares? You get a handful of opt-outs of 35 % boosting conversions just by building up that urgency. So we're doing this a lot. And it works incredibly well. The other thing we've also been testing is not just like a 9 a.m. send and like 3 p.m. send, but a 9 a.m. send and like a 7 p.m. send. So two cents, one day, consumer, B2B, nonprofit, it is crushing it. What is your take on that maneuver? I think it depends on like the tactic. And I think like if you're trying to get something to show up, I honestly think that I don't understand.

4:59And I've been thinking about this a lot lately, like why events don't collect text message. because I feel like when you're going to, especially in person, because when you're going to, you're at an event or going somewhere, like it's hard to always check your email. So like sending a text and an email that this is happening, like 15 minutes till the event or like something like that. I think that when you're trying to get someone to show up, you have to create some sort of psychological urgency to do that. But also I think we talk about this all this time about email sends. I think that's really relevant to that person who wants to send.

5:37Like, for me, I might forget that that event's ever happening and that extra bump is telling me, or I didn't see the morning send, so I might see the evening send. But I do get the argument of people saying, this person will opt out of your list, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. But it's better to have, like, the right people at your event and get those people off the list. I totally agree with you. I think people get just so scared about removes. And when they get removes, they're kind of nasty, right? Like we sent out a boatload of emails for our event that we had two weeks ago. And some of the removes were like aggressive.

6:14Like you send out way too many emails, blah, blah, blah, blah. And I know at any organization, all of a sudden you're going to feel like, oh no, we are sending out too many emails. No, there's a small pocket of people who are too sensitive and that's great. Leave them over there. But for the lion's share of your database, you need to take a more aggressive posture. You think people care. They're not seeing your emails. They don't remember your emails at all. You know, I learned something actually last night. I was out to dinner with our mutual friend, Sean Holiday, okay? And my book just released yesterday.

6:51And I've been putting this on social everywhere. I've been emailing at my database so hard saying, my book's coming out, my book's coming out, My book's been out. And I thought every single person that is in my database was aware of this. How could they not be? Because I'm torturing my database. And so we're at dinner last night and we were talking about whatever. He goes, what do you got going on? I go, my book came out today. He was like, what? Really? And the dude follows everything I do. And he's like, I had no idea. And it was such a reinforcement for me to realize people are not paying attention to what you think they're paying attention to.

7:25and you just need to constantly be reiterating and saying it again and again and again. And it's also like, I think people underestimate the same message over and over. That's the problem. I think that you need to be able to say the same message over and over. It's when you do too many different messages is where you would go. But I give you have something, you could say the same thing over and over to get in someone's head that this is happening. You have to stay top of mind with these things and people have so much going on through the day um like jay goes to be like when he's doing bee things he's not thinking about your virtual event that's happening in two hours um he's thinking about like i'm trying to survive like this bee experience because i'm scared of bees so i learned a long time that you got to get over your ego that like people are not paying attention to you as much as you as a company as a creator as whatever so put out as much content as you can, that's relevant to your audience.

8:24If it's not relevant, then stop doing it. Yeah. I live by the credo, when in doubt, send them out. I also live by the credo, when in doubt, opt them out because get rid of haters, but keep pushing because I don't care how conservative or boring your industry is. That's the way to do it. Back to the original thing. So do you do anything like, I mean, you grew up in Africa. We've talked about that. That's real daniel moved when he was seven are you doing anything in nature that's like weird like now that you live in florida do you like go and like you know smell iguanas on the weekend or something no not at all i did go i the the most adventurous thing is i was in chicago like a week ago and i took my son to the aquarium and they like the aquarium is really cool but they have like amazon on fish and stuff and so that's like the extent i'm going near like big animals and there was like sharks and i'm not going in the wild the wild to do things i'll go in south africa you go on like game drives where it's like what you call safari and you go like right next to like lions and but that's like you're with someone who's a professional and it's not like you're staying in a tent in the middle of nowhere where there's a snake can bite you and i don't want that around.

9:41So let me ask you a question though. In your house, if there's like a cockroach that you see or a big wasp and Ari's like, oh my God, there's a cockroach wasp. Is she the killer of that? Or does she call you in? No, she's a killer. I'm not coming there. I'm not going near it. I hate bugs. I'm not going near it. Do you call her to kill it? Ari, get in here. You're killing this. She's not scared of that stuff. She'll go in there. She'll come and kill. She's scared of, she's not scared of little things, but she's deathly afraid of cats. Like deathly. Like if If I see, she sees a cat, she jumps in my arms.

10:12Like she would not be one. Oh, it runs. Like no cat. Dude, you grew up in Africa and you ask your wife to kill a bug in your house? Oh, yeah. I hate bugs. I hate them so much. I hate them. That is the craziest thing I've ever heard. Oh, my God. She has no fear when it comes to bugs. I'm like, I get the feeling of when I see a bug, it starts crawling all over me. And I don't like that feeling. Wow. Everybody leave a bug emoji. Do you kill the bugs? That's a question. Do you kill the bugs? You know what's so funny? I usually don't, but then I came back from the bee experience, and my daughter, you know, some of those, and then my daughter had, there was a bug near her, and she's like, Dad, there's a wasp right here.

10:54And I felt so ready for this moment because I just got back from the bee thing, and I killed it in, like, one second. And I was like, dude, I'm like, I think it's a difference when you're protecting your, like. Yeah, that's true. If there's a bug near my son, I'm going for it. but if there's a bug in the room and nobody else is near I'm not touching that bug wow you're such a real like wow you're really taking one for the team but I'm not like scared of like bigger like I'm not like if like a iguana was near me I'm not scared of it you're so tough you're like the Chuck Norris of South Florida you're probably so tough another great episode of the bathroom break make sure to leave Daniel a review and I don't know find other stuff with bees and we'll see you at the next one.

11:42Daniel, come on, man. I got to get back to work. Get out of there. All right. While he's still in there, this is Jay. Check out my podcast, Do This, Not That for marketers. Each week we share really quick tips on stuff that can improve your marketing and hope you give it a try. Oh, here's Daniel. He's finally out. Back from my bathroom break. This is Daniel. Go follow the Mark and Millie podcast, but also tune into this series. It's once a week, the bathroom break. We talk about marketing tips that we just spew out. And it could be anything from email, subject line to any marketing tips in the world.

12:15We'll talk about it. Just give us a shout on LinkedIn and tell us what you want to hear. Peace out. Later.