Oliver Dixon, the man looking after Emirates’ wine collection

0:13Hello and welcome to the Monaco Weekly. I'm Fernando Augusto Pacheco, and for today's episode, I speak with Oliver Dixon, the man who looks after Emirates' incredible wine collection. Since 2006, the airline has invested over a billion dollars into its wine program. Let's hear more from Oliver.

0:35Oliver Dixon, a pleasure to welcome you to Monaco Radio. First of all, I have to say, I'm mildly jealous of your job, But I wonder if you don't mind introducing yourself to our listeners, and then we can talk more about your amazing career and a little bit more about wine as well. I've been in this very envious job, as you call it, for around 15 years now, looking after all of the onboard wines for Emirates, which includes all the purchasing for the wines that will go onboard in the future as well as for today. That is a role that evolved, something I was doing in Dubai anyway, working for a group company, which is a wine distributor and retailer.

1:20So I'd already had an eight-year career with this company, MMI, before I started with Emirates. And that's kind of how I got into it. One thing that I was surprised reading a bit more about Emirates and their investment in drinks on board, the level of investment. I had no idea. Correct me about the numbers. Is it true that it's over a billion dollars since 2022? That's incredible. The billion dollars is from about sort of 15 years ago. If we look at the value of wines that go on board in a year, we're looking, if we look to the retail value, it'd be something in the region of 150 million pounds a year just on wine and champagne, which goes across all cabins.

2:09And champagne is a particular focus as well, right? Champagne is a big focus because it resonates with consumers. People know the big champagne house names and they're very familiar with them. And they associate those names to luxury brands. It's a big part and it's the first interaction with the wine program itself. So you get on board and you're offered a glass of champagne. And then after takeoff, the first thing that you might have a drink, you're having something vinous, then it would be quite possibly champagne. So champagne's the sort of the introduction to the wine programme. So it's quite important to get right.

2:48As a result of that, Emirates has got a partnership with the Moet Hennessy Company, which has brands Dom Perignon for first class, Moet de Chandon, Verve Clicquot for business class. And then also in premium economy, which is a very new cabin to Emirates, they use the exclusively the Chandon sparkling wines which is a winery in Australia also owned by the Moet Hennessy company and it's interesting this thing about champagne because even you know I'm talking from a personal experience when let's say if I want to upgrade to business the first thing I think about it and I'm not joking champagne because I know it will be offered you know so it is quite a big deal actually for an airline the type of drink that people are consuming right right exactly and because it says luxury doesn't and premium cabin experience is associated to luxury as well as comfort i mean the first thing you think about some people are wanting the luxury experience especially if they're on holiday some people are wanting the comfort you know if they're getting off at the other end and going on to do business and got quite a busy few days and at their destination.

4:00So it sort of depends for what reason you're traveling. But luxury is kind of at the forefront for a lot of people. The crew at Emirates, they also have kind of a wine tasting program and quite a lot of them did that. And I think there are plans to actually even expand this program as well, right? Yeah, I was looking around the new training facilities just a couple of weeks ago. It's incredibly impressive and a massive step up from where it was a couple of years ago, I had a session with the wine training team. So they have 11 full-time wine trainers at Emirates who've all been through WSET training, which is the Wines and Spirits Education Trust, which is a UK establishment.

4:43Takes people up to quite a good level of knowledge and understanding. They then built a program on three levels. So there's a course designed for the newcomers, the ab initios, so the new joiners, the Emirates. So the cabin crew have to go through that before they go on board. And then if they want to apply for business class, then they have to go through an upgrade version of the wine program. And then the same thing again for first class. So this is a relatively new part of the program, but it's being rolled out at quite a pace. And yes, it will result in most of the cabin crew having a very good understanding about the wines and champagnes that go on board, which is important if you consider how much Emirates is investing into the product itself, because it needs to be explained properly.

5:37One question that is quite interesting. Do you think what we drink on air has to necessarily be different than what we drink on land? If I may say, do you have to have a think about certain little changes? Yeah, I do. It's a question we ask ourselves a lot. And actually, at one point, we got the engineering crew together. And we said, there's a lot of talk about how the cabin pressure on an aeroplane is different to what you would experience being in your house, you know, 150 metres above sea level, for example. The conclusion that we came to after talking to them was that there's been so much advancement in technology, in engineering, and the cabins are now at a pressure that is equal to something like an alpine ski resort.

6:29so I ask you the question if you go skiing do you order different wines to what you would if you were planning a meal at your own house in any other evening not really you don't think well I'm going skiing I need to have a bottle of minuti rose preferably in a magnum and that's not the reason why people drink magnums of minuti in ski resorts it's it's more for show and for party so I don't think really the cabin pressure has a lot to do with it. What I do look for without fail every single time is a nice strong acidity in a wine and if it's got a strong acidity that wine is going to hold up in any environment so when a wine is too cold too warm it's been open a little bit too long whatever it might be is going to hold very well that's sort of good practice anyway for anyone but then to know that you have to sort of understand a little bit about wine and and how acidity sort of shows itself but yeah a strong acidity not a overtly acidic wine with bitterness and that's not what we're saying but something with good strong acidity is is very very helpful we discussed also champagne here but what about red or wine is there one that is a bit more popular and then you focus a bit more.

7:54You know, I'm suspicious to say because I'm a red guy through and through. But, you know, I wonder if there are any trends. You see the numbers keep changing. There is a slight preference towards a red wine. And I think the reason is because people start maybe with a glass of champagne and then the starter comes around and they have a bit of white wine. And as the main causes come out, which, you know, There are usually a couple of options that are more designed for red wine. Then people gravitate towards the reds. And it's more about sequence of service than it is popularity or preference. They want to go through the whole show and they want to enjoy the experience.

8:40And the experience comes in waves. So it starts with champagne, some nuts or some olives. And then you have a starter, which you might choose a seafood or something light. And then you have a choice. OK, you have a choice of chicken, fish and some meats and vegetarians. But there's at least a couple of dishes there that lend themselves towards reds. And people want to try that as well. And then, of course, there's the pork selection in business class as well. People try that generally with the cheese board or the dessert selection. and then if you're in first class then you have the option of having champagne, whites, reds, port and dessert wine.

9:20So you can try even more wines. Typically on a first class flight you'll have a choice of 10 different wine products including champagne. Oliver, there's a really interesting stat as well that I was reading that Emirates purchases more champagne than any other airline in the world. That's still a correct assumption, right? Definitely in value, yes. And where do you keep all the champagnes? You must have an amazing access to all of those kind of wines and champagne. Is it just in one base or in several places around the world as well? I think the champagne is relatively simple. We have a pretty robust forecast so we know what the consumption is giving on a monthly basis and order enough product to make sure that we have enough and we're never going to run out.

10:08And that comes into Dubai. Everything is shipped in temperature controlled containers by sea and stored in temperature controlled warehouses in Dubai. There are wines that we have to buy much before. So typically the Bordeaux program. And if you've traveled on Emirates, you'll notice that in business class and in first class, there is always a wine from Bordeaux. So names like Poyac, Saint-Julien, Saint-Estef, Pomerol, Saint-Emilion, these are the types of wines you'd find from Bordeaux. And those wines we have to buy very early. The 2022 vintage, we went to Bordeaux in April of 2023. We tasted a few hundred different wines, made a pre-selection.

10:56When the wines were released onto the market, which was a few weeks after that, we started buying those wines. Those wines at that stage are still in barrels. So we're taking a sort of a future view on when those wines, how good they'll be and when they'll be tasting well. And we're planning those wines to go on board starting from mid 2030s. And they'll go on board, some of the better wines will go on board mid 2040s. So we're thinking a minimum of 10 years ahead, up to around 20 years ahead of those wines. And then after two years, so around now, we're taking delivery of those wines, and we have to find space for them.

11:40For those we choose to warehouse in France. And then when, and as I said, we program them on board. And when they're ready, we ship them over to Dubai and start putting them on the planes. That's fantastic. I should do an interview with you in person and do maybe some tasting as well. Yeah, no, that would be good. And we can really sort of bring the program to life. But to give you an idea, there are 5 million bottles of wine in the cellars at the moment. 2.5 million of those so half of that stock is already 10 years old wow that's impressive that that shows the care that you guys do as well what's your drink of choice when you when you fly by the way i like that sequence of service so i start with a glass of champagne and then i'll have something from the white menu and then something from the red menu probably both and because of the the role i'm in i do tend to have a little bit of everything just to make sure that it is tasting as it should and that I understand how passengers are experiencing and enjoying.

12:42I find that quite an important part of the job. Thank you very much, Oliver Dixon there. I am Fernando Gusto Pacheco and the show was edited by Elliot Greenfield. Thank you for listening.