Brand Beckham & Osaka's Jellyfish - has sport ever been so fashionable? - The Sports Agents

0:01This is a Global Player Original Podcast.

0:30NBA tunnel walks. Have we all grown up enough to appreciate athletes have other interests? And it doesn't mean they're going to get distracted. They can still focus on winning. I realize I'm a little strange because I don't really think I care. I want to do things that like create joy and happiness. And for me, obviously, I really love fashion and that when I was playing today, I just told myself, like, keep your head on the path. And like, If she beats you, then that's unfortunate. But hey, at least you're trending on Twitter. But how much money does Naomi Osaka, going viral as a jellyfish, make for brands and athletes?

1:10And should more sports be using fashion to grow the game? Welcome to The Sports Agents.

1:23The Sports Agents. with Gabby Logan and Mark Chapman. So you can tell that this is an episode without chappers because I've managed to get fashion onto the sports agent. I'm not saying it's not his number one topic, but I'm not sure he'd be as comfortable. I'm sure he's listening and picking up some tips. And this has all come off the back of Naomi Osaka's jellyfish outfit. So we have the athletics tennis correspondent, Charlie Eccleshare, and Maya Aquadri, who is football culture writer and head of brand at Versus with us in the studio. This is a big kind of fashion moment in terms of tennis and seeing Naomi's theatre walking on court with that umbrella.

2:05I didn't even know what it was at first. I had to kind of read about what she was doing and what she was representing. But it's not the first in tennis, is it, Charlie? And tennis has been a really interesting playground for fashion for decades, really. Yeah, and I mean, you think you go back all the way to, to Bjorn Borg in the 70s and the feeler outfits he wore. They sort of became iconic. And still are, by the way. If you walk down the street now in that outfit, you would be on point. Yeah, or John McEnroe's headband. I mean, those were kind of the sort of primitive first steps, I suppose. But then you had Fred Perry come out with his whole clothing line.

2:44Many tennis players have their own trainers, Stan Smith being one of them. But yeah, Osaka has definitely pushed boundaries. But then Sharapova was someone who liked to do that too. Serena Williams, Venus Williams. A lot of players now, both on the men's and women's side, kind of design their own clothes, have their own clothing lines. So yeah, those lines have been pretty blurred for a while between kind of fashion and tennis. And Anna Wintour, who was the former grand dam, which she still is the kind of grand dam of the whole group, but she was the American Vogue editor, was almost permanently in Roger Federer's box at Wimbledon and the big championships, wasn't she?

3:22And clearly appreciated his great fashion moments when he'd arrive on court. And I think tennis lends itself because of the theatre of it, you know, because you're walking out in front of all those people and getting that appreciation. They can take it in. that's exactly yeah and i think from a brand's perspective sport is like no other because you have the eyes you have the audience and as you mentioned gabby you have these unique bits of time where everything stands still and it's like a fashion walk i mean we saw it recently where a few fashion houses started to use the walkouts to use stuff like wash bags and that was very unprecedented in tennis and tennis has that ability because you're guaranteed that moment Brands can utilise that as free marketing for themselves.

4:07But I think what's really nice about Naomi is, Naomi's not new to this. Like she's done this before, but what I really liked was the subtle nod to the moment she had at the Australian Open before with the butterfly. It tells you that this isn't just fashion for the sake of fashion, it's storytelling. It's an expression of her own personal identity beyond her being this amazing tennis player. And when they do walk out, obviously not every tennis player wants that kind of attention, But that's the sports person bit I find really interesting, Charlie, because you're trying to deal with nerves and potential anxiety ahead of a big match.

4:41And actually what you're doing is bringing more attention on yourself, isn't it? And so other sports might kind of find. Imagine if, I don't know, if Leah Williamson, the head of the Women's Euros final, suddenly decided she was going to adopt some great costume. In a team, it doesn't work so much, does it? It has to be everybody doing it on a team. So again, the individual nature of tennis, you know, it means that you can be subtle if you want to just, you know, grab your watch at the end, your branded watch or your branded bag, or you can go full on with the costume. Yeah, it does. It still requires a level of nerve and self-confidence, I think, because, you know, we were talking about this the other day.

5:20And imagine if Naomi had lost, you know, then you've walked on and she's having to sort of, it was already quite funny that she's walking off the court kind of gathering, you know, all the sort of component parts to her costume. Imagine if you're doing that having just lost a first round match. Like, you know, think of, and this is why she's an elite level athlete, but think of, you know, the kind of meme potential and all of that sort of stuff. But, you know, these players don't. But yeah, I mean, or Roger Federer would walk out in those kind of monogrammed cardigans and blazers. And I think that did make him a bit of a target.

5:52Like you need, and he was, he was good enough, he was elegant enough, he was suave enough and crucially, you know, good enough and did enough winning that he was able to pull it off. But if you don't, then you're just a guy wearing a blazer with a sports kit and you look a bit weird. It's interesting, though, because I think in individual sports, you do see more of it. I mean, if you look at athletics, Usain Bolt was wearing gold shoes. Athletics lends itself really well. It lends itself really well. And of course, you do have those moments where it's individual walkouts. It's built up for the theatre.

6:20But in team sports, you do see a lot of it. I mean, the WNBA is a prime example. each team has a tunnel fit moment where some of the players that may be not up to it won't partake in it but someone like Angel Reese is dressed to the nines and I guess there's that old adagey of if you look the part you feel the part and a lot of people buy into the psychology of that That's what a lot of female athletes say when they're asked about you know they see the preparation Shakira Richardson talks about getting her hair and makeup done and feeling ready to race is about the preparation of her outfit and it's as much as a part as a warm-up really So and it's not in athletics, it's not unusual at all to see, you know, amazing nails, incredible hairdos and lots of makeup.

7:04And yet in other sports, it's much less visible that kind of and I think women's team sports perhaps is the area. I think about the England rugby team that played in the final just a couple of months ago and won the World Cup final. You're less likely to see individuals kind of putting their head above the parapet, maybe. Less likely, but I think there's definitely a sea of change coming. I think when you look at, for instance, the Lionesses, that is a team of individuals that we have seen so much attention and fan law towards. And now more than ever, we're recognizing and we're seeing brands recognize that the athlete is not just an athlete, they're a person that has their own individual interests and they're an individual brand.

7:46so someone like Chloe Kelly can now be seen at Borla League unveiling the T90s in a very fashionable way and then she might lend that to her next walker in a football match we're starting to see that brands are realizing that women's football is the perfect canvas for showcasing this because surprise surprise a lot of the fans do care about fashion as well so it's a really unique moment where when you see what Naomi did you expect it from Naomi now it's like where else are we going to start seeing moments like this and of course Naomi is a very massive example because it was very elaborate but what people are not also realizing is the person that interviewed her was in a lovely Adidas two-piece that's not something you typically always see fashion is popping up in loads of different components of sport and wild and ever and it's exciting to see and the brand relationships in tennis are interesting aren't they Charlie because you see players now not wanting necessarily to just be one of a number a big brand like Nike going to a smaller brand, being the big fish in that kind of pond, if you like, having some kind of input as well on the collection, what they're wearing, being very visible, not just, you know, not just in one day photo shoot and they're disappearing off into the distance.

8:57It's an add on to their kind of whole tennis persona. Yeah, totally. And I wrote about this in August when Jack Draper left Nike and he moved to a brand called Viori, who a lot of people might not have heard of in this country. It's kind of Southern Californian athleisure brand. But he talked about exactly that, Gabby, of wanting to be the guy for them. Francis Tiafoe moved to Lululemon for similar reasons. Taylor Fritz is with Hugo Boss. He's got that interest in fashion. Because Nike, they have a lot still of the biggest, biggest names. But obviously, they take up a lot of the oxygen. They get a lot of the personally branded individual outfits.

9:35Because you'll often see tennis players further down the pyramid, kind of wearing the same as what a few other players are wearing. And if you're someone like Jack Draper, who now is really up and coming, he wants to be the guy. And also, like you said, he wants to have a say in what he's wearing and that kind of thing, because it's so important for their individual brands, you know, and they want to be able to sell kind of replica kits almost, which I've always thought is a bit of a kind of untapped potential for the sport as a whole, but also for those individuals as brands. You know, if they could have...

10:06Yeah, because the replica football kit, obviously, is well known, well done. But in tennis, I'm thinking Nadal and his sleeveless tops. That was something that I think you suddenly started seeing guys and girls playing tennis in the park. Guys who really couldn't pull it off, yeah. I was going to say there are some that maybe should have gone for something that's slightly more orthodox. But listen, let's not judge. It's a safe space here. But obviously, he knew what he was doing, didn't he? He notoriously had some of the best arms in tennis. Yeah, and he had those, initially he had those three-quarter length shorts that he then got rid of and then went to a very short short.

10:40I think once he realised, oh, I can show off my legs as well as my arms. Why not? But yeah, you know, wouldn't it be great if Sina and Alcaraz had kind of colours that were synonymous with them or whatever so that at the stadium it kind of had that look and feel. But yeah, it's definitely becoming a big thing. I noticed Emma Raducano in her second round exit had a kind of cut out on the back of her outfit. And obviously in the other majors outside of Wimbledon, you can really go for it, can't you? But Wimbledon still with its all-white policy, you've got to be a little bit more creative. It might be a cardigan that you walk on with.

11:12I don't see Wimbledon changing that anytime soon. No, I would be very surprised if that changed anytime soon. The Sports Agents.

11:23The Sports Agents. With Gabby Logan and Mark Chapman.

11:30And for the brands, we know what the end game is. It's to sell more product, right? Yeah, I think for brands, it's a multitude of feelings. You want to sell more products, but ultimately, if you look at the fan, the fanatic of sport, it's a profile like no other, especially if you look at sports like Tennessee for following an individual player. You root for that player wherever you are informed about everything they do. So if you're able to get a joint affinity to that, it's leverage for yourself. there's a big movement in football at the moment where major fashion houses are striking deals with football clubs Tommy Hilfiger just did one with Liverpool Louis Vuitton did one with Real Madrid and if you look at Real Madrid's Instagram following that's a lot of people you're speaking to so that's very expensive product though for the average fan to get engaged by isn't it it is and that's where it becomes super interesting because typically your fan base isn't gonna always be able to afford high luxury products, but the storytelling behind it and the feeling does build an affinity.

12:34I mean, Naomi's piece that she wore, that's not going to be bought by anyone and it's something she desired with Robert. One, it's a very distinct piece. However... There'll be a distilled version, I assume. There'll be a distilled version that you can probably tap into and I think that's where brands get their leverage. Or it's like, well, you can't get this piece, but we're doing something over here that's still Nike, that you can still buy. And I think that's where brands are really tapping into because now more than ever, similar to American culture you might not be a fan of sports but you're a fan of the culture around it and the fashion culture in the last few years specifically has become such a big thing well how many people owned a pair of Air Jordans but you know never watched the great man play you know that that is probably the is that the best ever example of kind of sport and fashion in terms of a financial kind of benefit it's definitely up there I think I love the fact that because we're talking about fashion coming into sport but I love when sport in itself becomes fashion so the Jordans they became a lifestyle shoe even though they won on court we mentioned Stan Smith earlier if you were to go outside now people probably wearing Stan Smith's we've seen it recently with Adidas they've handball trainers that people are wearing and even if you think about football shirt Fridays which is a massive thing during the pandemic people now wear football jerseys as an item of clothing not just because they support a team so it works two ways fashion wants to tap into football but football's realizing that because of the cultural influence it can speak to fashion moments it can dictate fashion we're seeing now the return of bold colors in football kits some back to the 90s because that's where fashion is going so but to what you said yeah Jordan's probably the example you can't escape it and it's just people think of Jordan now more about fashion than they do as a piece of apparel within sport.

14:22At the Australian Open, I've been to Wimbledon many times, but I've never been to the Australian Open. At Wimbledon, people dress up, the crowd dress up, you know, they tend to kind of put on nice clothes, especially if they're in hospitality. At the Australian Open, it looks a bit more casual. Do people come dressed as tennis players, pretty much? I mean, do they look like sports people in the crowds? Or do you get that kind of sense of it being a day out and an occasion? It's definitely not smart like Wimbledon is, you know, Wimbledon. Yeah, you think of the classic attire as being sort of smart casual, I would say, for a lot of people.

14:52It's not like that. I mean, for a start, because of the climate, a lot of people are just in sort of shorts and t-shirt. Some people are in sort of fancy dress type things. But I mean, I think it's interesting, you know, even like the US Open, there are far more people who are wearing sort of sporty gear as if, you know, they hope that they might get picked up to go and play, you know, because there's just more of a kind of tennis playing culture. Somebody might drop out. Exactly. Yeah. you just never know whereas I don't think you get that at Wimbledon so much and I think that's reflected in what people wear it is more at Wimbledon the feel of just you're out there for a day out I mean and you do you get people in fancy dress here dressed up as John McEnroe or Bjorn Borg or whatever it is so it's it's all it's all kind of part of the fun and the theatre of it yeah and as a fan I like that each of the the four majors have the slams have their own identity in that respect, actually.

15:43Even New York, you see these, a friend of mine is a very kind of highfalutin finance woman in New York. And I spotted her in a box. Last year, I was watching a match on telly and she was being, you know, kind of entertained by some hospitality. And there are loads of hospitality boxes in New York, in Flushing Meadow, in the central courts with, you know, the kind of suited and booted people that you don't necessarily get in Wimbledon because people are in the middle of summer and they're wearing dresses and stuff. So I quite like the, you know, the difference of how people look at all the tournaments.

16:13And I think that identity that they all have is quite unique, isn't it, in a sporting sense? Well, New York's such a scene. Like the US Open is such a fashion scene. Like it really reflects it, you know, on the main court at night. And that's where you have, there's almost this kind of culture there for the big players, including Osaka, that you come out for your night session wearing something pretty special and eye-catching. because a lot of the people in the audience is going to be from that world. And even, you know... And the Met Gala's only a week after, isn't it? Exactly. So everybody's trying to get that invite.

16:46Exactly. It's a come and get me plea from all the players. And, you know, we still remember, you know, Federer had a kind of all black outfit that he wore in night sessions. I think it was the 2007 US Open. And then Djokovic wore a kind of similar thing this year, just gone. Like, it really is... It's something that's talked about, you know, that's anticipated. and Sharapova's Audrey Hepburn tribute dress, that's all part of the law as much as the winners from previous years. It's all part of it. I feel an exhibition at the V &A coming on anytime soon here. I mean, just even taking that trip down memory lane from a tennis perspective is interesting.

17:23You think about football as well, the iconic kind of Beckham outfits back in the 2000s that end up being a stick to beat somebody with if things go wrong don't they that's the risk that you're always going to take that if you if you do wear a sarong and then you miss a free kick or whatever you know you are you are putting yourself out there yeah it's it's the occupational hazard of being a professional athlete in the sense that because you are so loved and people know you for this thing often especially when it comes to fashion it's deemed that you're being distracted by the outer world when you're expressing yourself and I'm a firm believer that sometimes we need to look at professional athletes as human beings first and foremost and if expression allows them to be themselves then that's the way we need to go.

18:12Beckham definitely laid the path for so many people today he laid the path for your Hector Bellerin's he laid your path for your Jules Kundes and his influence probably knows no bounds in the sense that he was unapologetically himself whether it was his hairstyles whether it was what he wore and to be fair the people have probably benefited the most were the clubs that employed them because it was like well you have this very fashionable person we want to tap into him and we want to tap into the bigger brand but it goes back to the brand piece Naomi does that because she's building her brand David Beckham done it because he was building his brand and the athlete life span is it's not the longest one so why not invest in yourself in a way that doesn't just benefit you on the pitch or on the call it helps you post as well and I think we're going to see more and more players finding their voice whether it is expressing themselves in fashion or other things like social media so we're entering a very interesting time when it comes to player expression yeah music fashion and sport kind of combining in a way that they they really never have done before it's only going to get more accentuated I think as well because of the way kids consume their sport so um yeah it's uh it's fascinating times and i'm really enjoying it thanks so much for coming in my way charlie enjoy the rest of the australian who's going to win it i'm going to be really boring and go yannick sinner on the men's side and arena sabalenka on the women's cam nori sorry about that take care thank you so much next time chap is away i'm going to do another fashion episode so both come back if you will thank you the sports agents The Sports Agents with Gabby Logan and Mark Chapman

19:55So it's been another busy week on The Sports Agents. On Tuesday, we discussed whether managers like Oliver Glasner and clubs like Crystal Palace should accept their place in the football food chain with former Crystal Palace player Clinton Morrison and Dan Cook, better known from the HLTCO Palace fan channel. You know, a Mark Gay for£20 million is a fantastic deal for Manchester City, but he's got five months left in his contract and he's not going to sign a new one. And the manager has already told the hierarchy in October of 2025 that he's not going to be staying. So I'm not quite sure what Oliver Glasner expected the club to do.

20:29And then on Thursday, we discussed a new report which says that female coaches are twice as likely to be bullied. We had England netball head coach Jess Thurlby, former sprinter and Olympic coach at UK Athletics, Paula Dunn, and CEO of Women in Sport, Stephanie Hilborn. You said, you know, will female football coaches only really have made it if they're leading a male team? I think it's the wrong solution for the wrong problem. I think relative to their abilities, it doesn't, it shouldn't matter. And I think they're in line one of the biggest systemic issues, really, if that's what we're waiting for as a measure of success on ourselves as female coaches in a, you know, a cross-gender sport.

21:06Well, that's it for another week on The Sports Agents. If you've been listening to this on the News Agents feed, just search for The Sports Agents to listen to those episodes in full on YouTube, Global Player, or wherever you get your podcasts. And remember to hit subscribe or follow. And you can keep getting in touch as well on email, thesportsagentsatglobal.com, on social media, or via the link in the show notes. And we'll have new episodes for you every Tuesday, Thursday, and Friday. Thanks for listening. The Sports Agents. With Gabby Logan and Mark Chapman.

21:38This has been a Global Player original production. Thank you.