SPECIAL REPORT: Has America’s fentanyl crisis landed in the UK?

15 Aug 2025 · 38 min · 14 chapters

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In short

The episode is a special report on whether America’s fentanyl crisis has reached the UK, using Las Vegas accounts and London/Camden clinical evidence. It claims fentanyl (and newer synthetic opioids like nitazenes) is driving overdoses, that many users don’t know what they’re taking because drugs are cut and mis-sold, and that UK services are already seeing spikes. Examples include Las Vegas “flood tunnels” where people live and use fentanyl and crystal meth; a 37-year-old man (Giuseppe’s brother) who died after fentanyl was mixed into cocaine; and Camden’s CGL clinic reporting 31 non-fatal overdoses in a week in March due to nitazenes.

Guests

Giuseppe Mandel (Las Vegas guide; former opioid addict), Tim (former tunnel resident; uses fentanyl and meth), Michelle George (Track B syringe service director), Molly Howden (CGL Camden cluster lead nurse), Vicky Markovich (Change Grow Live executive director), and Alistair (UK opioid user; homeless history; later clean, relapsed).

Written by AI. May contain mistakes. Listen to the episode to check what was said.

Chapters

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The Impact of Fentanyl in America

2:39 to 4:25

Discussion on the devastating effects of fentanyl on American society.

“Welcome to this special episode of The News Agents.”

Giuseppe's Story: From Addiction to Recovery

4:25 to 7:25

Giuseppe shares his personal journey through addiction and recovery.

“Late 40s, ripped, sturdy, tight shirt, pensive brow, big garish glasses, thick set jewellery.”

Living on the Streets: The Reality of Addiction

7:25 to 8:08

An exploration of the harsh realities faced by those living on the streets.

“the damage was done and it often left people who would become addicts with nothing to replace the thing to which they had become addicted pushing many to elicit drug taking with all that goes with it.”

Life Underground: The Tunnels of Vegas

8:08 to 11:24

A look into the underground tunnels where many addicts live in Las Vegas.

“Many addicts live in the city's flood tunnels.”

The Daily Life of Tunnel Residents

11:24 to 14:00

Insights into the daily lives of those living in the tunnels beneath Las Vegas.

“As we emerged from that tunnel, we were approached by someone who had lived there.”

Personal Experiences with Fentanyl

14:00 to 15:50

Listeners will hear firsthand accounts of individuals using fentanyl and their perceptions of its effects.

“You seem reasonably with it, I would say.”

The Impact of Fentanyl on Families

15:50 to 18:10

The discussion highlights the tragic consequences of fentanyl, including stories of overdose and loss.

“And not homeless, upstanding member of society, ran three methadone and suboxone clinics.”

The Growing Drug Crisis in the UK

18:10 to 20:27

An overview of the rising drug problems in the UK, particularly with synthetic opioids affecting youth.

“Well it's gone from being a minimal problem in 2019 to now being an epidemic out here.”

Fentanyl's Detection in the UK

20:40 to 21:55

Insights into how synthetic opioids are being detected in the UK and their implications.

“So we're a long way now from the west coast of America where so much of this epidemic is centered.”

The Risks of Synthetic Opioids

21:55 to 24:55

Exploration of the risks associated with synthetic opioids and the challenges in awareness among users.

“The majority of people aren't aware that they're purchasing the synthetic opiates and that tends to mean that they're trying to buy heroin but then they might end up using a synthetic opiate.”
Show all 14 chapters

The Future of Drug Use in the UK

24:55 to 28:04

Discussion on how the drug crisis may evolve in the UK and the potential for increased challenges.

“My name is Vicky Markovich and I'm an executive director for Change Go Live.”

Experiences of Fentanyl Use in the UK

28:04 to 31:28

Learn about the personal experiences and implications of fentanyl use from a former user.

“One leading drugs charity has warned that this is probably the biggest public health crisis for people who use drugs in the UK since the AIDS crisis in the 1980s.”

The Severity of the Fentanyl Crisis

31:28 to 33:48

Understand the grave implications of fentanyl as a public health crisis and its growing presence in the UK.

“of new people, especially through the services in the last couple of years that you would never have seen in services before.”

The Severity of the Fentanyl Crisis

36:02 to 36:15

Understand the grave implications of fentanyl as a public health crisis and its growing presence in the UK.

“we believe the best care starts with a real conversation with someone who understands the science and your unique health so stay curious ask questions but when it's time to make decisions make them with a doctor.”
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Transcript

Automatic transcript. May contain errors.

0:00Bite into a stacked sandwich made with Hero Bread. And the only thing you'll think is delicious. You won't think it has up to 19 grams protein, 11 to 32 grams of fiber, or just 0 to 5 grams net carbs. But it does. Hero Bread. No compromises. Just loaves, buns, tortillas, bagels, and noodles packed with flavor. Right now, get 10 % off at Hero.co with code IHEART. That's H-E-R-O dot C-O, code IHEART. All figures per serving of Hero Bread. See Nutrition Facts on Hero.co. This is a Global Player original podcast. The opioid crisis is a very American disease. Once you've found the right doctor and have told him or her about your pain, don't be afraid to take what they give you.

0:47Often, it will be an opioid medication. For 20 years, fentanyl, a painkiller, hundreds of times stronger than heroin, has gripped American life. it has claimed at least three quarters of a million American lives. It's shaped politics.

1:08With the opioid crisis or the drug epidemic we've had throughout the country, it's affected almost all of us. It was cocaine. You know, that was the drug of choice. Then heroin and meth made a comeback. And now it's fentanyl, it's Zizeline, it's carfentanil. Synthetic drugs are now the number one killer of Americans aged 18 to 45. It has led to the death of 70 ,000 Americans because of fentanyl. If the Bronx was its own state, it would have the second highest amount of opioid deaths in the United States. Fentanyl is the single largest cause of death among young Americans. So many millions of Americans hooked on opiates, hooked on painkillers.

1:52killers. No part of our society, not young or old, rich or poor, urban or rural, has been spared this plague, drug addiction, and this horrible, horrible situation that's taken place with opioids. It is a failure of politics, a failure of medicine, a failure of law, a darkness which is enveloped state after state and place after place. It shows no signs of stopping. It shows no sign of slowing. But if you think that this plague is something which happens over there, far away, think again. The opioid crisis is coming to the UK. In fact, it's already here. Welcome to this special episode of The News Agents.

2:46The newsagents Now Vegas is huge Yeah, huge Right, everybody thinks it's just the Strip No, it's really But this is like, you even got it into the rich areas Really? Yeah So whenever you see somebody panhandling There's generally a huge encampment somewhere around there What do you mean panhandling? Panhandling, like asking for money Oh, I see. Las Vegas is a city of lights. But those lights avert our gaze to the realities beneath. It is like so much of the American West, a city where fentanyl is everywhere. Fentanyl, originally a prescription painkiller, it has come to be routinely consumed by large parts of the local population in American cities before, in turn, consuming them.

3:38If you've ever been to any city on the Pacific coast, you know what I mean. Lost souls, ghosts, lighting up, injecting into any vein that's still left, wandering mindlessly from street to street, wandering from car to car, asking for money, any money, for the next hit, sometimes not moving at all, staring into space with whatever is left of their own being and consciousness. It is a dystopian sight. In this, the wealthiest, most advanced nation on earth. The land of the free, the home of those who crave. Because fennel's so cheap, you can get it for... The blues go for a dollar to two dollars a pill, which is, they call blue...

4:22Two dollars a pill? Yeah, yeah, yeah. Two dollars a pill is so cheap. Yeah. Sometimes a dollar a pill. That voice you heard is Giuseppe. He's our guide to Vegas. and Giuseppe is so Vegas. And I mean that in every way. Late 40s, ripped, sturdy, tight shirt, pensive brow, big garish glasses, thick set jewellery. And yet his movement, everything about him is so controlled, tightly bound, as if he were dreading something. He helps those who are addicted to the drug because he was once the same. His story, his descent into addiction, into opioids consuming his life is in some ways the story of American life in the 21st century.

5:07The story of accident and contingency and of heartbreak. How did you end up out here? What was your story with it? I got injured, back injury, and then started on tramadol, and then Loratab, then Percocet, then Oxycodone, all prescribed from a doctor. So it was all medical prescription, which is how this happens to a lot of Americans, right? This is a thing that maybe, particularly we Brits, because we don't really have the same experience. This actually comes from a doctor, ultimately. The opioid epidemic came from all from a doctor, yeah. Oxycontin and oxycodone. Painkillers. Painkillers. And then you got addicted to those.

5:39And then if anybody doesn't know what being sick is, you know, your body withdraws. And it's like having the flu times a thousand, plus you can't sleep. And it's three days of brutal hell. So now you're just trying to get well every day. Yeah, you heard that right. So many people have ended up as drug addicts, on the streets, dead, lives destroyed, at the hands, fundamentally, of their doctors.

6:06Once you've found the right doctor and have told him or her about your pain, don't be afraid to take what they give you. Often, it will be an opioid medication. Some patients may be afraid of taking opioids because they're perceived as too strong or addictive. But that is far from actual fact. Less than 1 % of patients taking opioids actually become addicted. And any drowsiness that might occur when you start to take the medication will soon wear off in most patients. That was an ad from a pharmaceutical company from the late 90s, actively encouraging people to seek out opioids from their doctor and telling them that there would be no consequences.

6:55This was commonplace in the late 90s, with pharmaceutical companies heavily marketing opioid painkillers assuring doctors they were not addictive when used for pain. Prescriptions surged, addiction followed. Suddenly, whole communities, especially in small town rural America, which had largely been untouched by drugs before, seemed like they were being swallowed up huge spikes in overdoses deaths half dead people just lying on the streets that pushed the state and federal governments to tighten up prescription and regulation but by then the damage was done and it often left people who would become addicts with nothing to replace the thing to which they had become addicted pushing many to elicit drug taking with all that goes with it.

7:43So you ended up on the streets? I did. And what was that like day to day? What's it like living on the streets day to day? Oh, it's hell. You're just existing. You know, just one day blurs into the next, blurs into the next. You can't, you got no friends out here. And you got acquaintances, but they're only as good as what you can give them. And you know, you got to watch your stuff all the time. I mean, it's, it's rough. In Vegas, it isn't even living on the streets, but beneath them, away from the heat and the light and the eyes of the city above. Many addicts live in the city's flood tunnels.

8:16So Giuseppe, just tell us what these are. So there's one of the entrance flood tunnels in the city. They're all over the city. And so if you notice like the cuts in the gates. Yeah. Right here and right here. So then people go out there and they'll live under there, kind of hide out under there. So people who are addicted? is yeah drugs mostly yeah i just hide in the tunnels i don't know about hide but live live yeah you see how hot it is you know it's nice and cool down there yeah but man dark i mean secluded way of living nice way of living i mean it was not my thing yeah but i would go and pick up dope in there would you oh yeah it's not dangerous in there of course so this is basically it's a very long set of tunnels feet you know really really dark you only have to go in what like 20 paces before it's absolutely pitch black step step a little bit ahead of me and it's so far back and it's pitch black i can't see so these are the tunnels all underneath all underneath las vegas where hundreds and hundreds of homeless people addicts live on a regular basis and this is where people live people live in here in this pitch black they got lights lanterns you know flashlights bring batteries down for them water i mean and they just live to stay outside out of the heat feel much cooler it is and just get high down here get high you know work twiddle on your things depends on the drugs that you're on if you see all right here i mean that looks like it was all washed out right there that one goes down there this one goes for about probably another mile down that way and over because people can get washed out down here because they are used for floods oh yeah well look see everything comes right here so if it just rains a little bit they get washed out you're right and people drown yeah I have to say just happy like it is I mean it's pretty scary it was I mean I guess you're not thinking about there's more scarier things than living down here and surviving when you're just trying to get by every day well like being dope sick At least here you can kind of relax and kind of, you know, use away your problems.

10:32And you just sit down here, lie down here, get high, forget the world upstairs exists. Yeah, yeah. I mean, some of the other tunnels, they're huge. According to Tim, I guess they're going to start to clear out some of these tunnels, what they've been doing. And that's more for their safety, I think. And it's such like a, I mean, just have it, it's such a, I mean, what a contrast with the city above, right? Like the city of lights, like Sin City. The light. The city under the city. The luminescence, the thrills of all the people who flood in here every single day and week and year. And then in the other city, in a world that these people would never know about, there are people literally living, usually high.

11:11The world's just forgotten about. Yeah. Underneath the tunnels, and then any time you see a big wall by the highways, those are sound walls. In between there, there's all huge encampments as well. That's depressing, isn't it? I mean, I was out there, so yeah, it's depressing. You're just existing day to day. As we emerged from that tunnel, we were approached by someone who had lived there. His name was Tim. Were you living in there not long ago, Tim? Yeah, I was. How long were you living down there for? Off and on for the last two and a half years. Two and a half years? Yeah. Living in the tunnels?

11:43Yeah. Underneath Las Vegas? Absolutely. What's life like down there? Well, for me, it's normal anymore, you know. It's normal. Sounds crazy, you know. Some people have dogs they've got to feed every day and, you know, all that kind of stuff. I guess there's certain aspects that are somewhat normal, but it's really not, you know. So what is life like? It's normal, I know, but what... Just describe, yeah, what's the average day in the tunnels? Well, usually you just stay down there to do your drugs or whatever and sleep. And then when you get up, time to go out and do what you do to earn money. You know, so it's basically just a place to stay that's out of sight.

12:33Must be scary, right? Not really. Not even at first? No. If it wasn't for me, I don't know if it's that way for everyone. You know, some people think the tunnels are haunted and that sort of thing. You know, you do hear some strange noises, you know. How many people are normally down there with you in a typical tunnel? Uh, there was probably 20 of us in a group maybe about a year ago. And is there much like interaction between people? Oh yeah, absolutely. Yeah. The, uh, people, it's almost like having a neighbor that you go borrow sugar from, you know? Like, you know, except it tends to be a lot more drug related, you know?

13:12Like, you got a couple bucks I could borrow to, you know, only got X amount, you know, to pick up drugs. I need two more bucks to get to the next weight increment, you know. Or, I don't know, we need a dollar for a soda, you know. What sort of drugs are we talking, fentanyl? Fentanyl and crystal meth. Do you use those drugs? I do. Still now? Yeah. How regularly do you use them? Every day. Every day? Every day, yeah. Fentanyl most of all? Yeah, yeah. How often do you take it? Um, as often as possible, really. But usually every 12 hours, maybe. Every 12 hours? Yeah. And what effect does it have on your body?

14:00Are you able to walk, to talk? Yeah, like I smoked maybe an hour ago. So you're on it right now? Yeah, yeah. You seem reasonably with it, I would say. Yeah, yeah. Some people, I don't know how some people are different than me, but there's a few people out here that get, It's like they're possessed almost. It's crazy to see. I don't understand it. Will you take it again today? Yeah. In how long? Probably a couple of hours. A couple of hours' time? Yeah. Does it scare you, the potential effects? Because we know how lethal it is, how many people are dying from it. No, it seems as if once you build up a tolerance to it, that you seem to be pretty good because nobody's fallen out in our group in a long time.

14:48Would you like to stop taking it? Absolutely. You'd like to? You'd like to get clean from it? Yeah. Yep. And what stops you? That is a good question. See, that would be probably scarier than these tunnels, you know, honestly. What's stopping taking it? Right. You know, I've been using drugs for shit probably 20 years. You know, it'd be a big change in my life, you know. You can't imagine it? Well, I can imagine it, but, you know, the idea of it is scary, I suppose. You know? What's also very scary is that sometimes, often, people don't even know they're taking opioids. Dealers now mix them with more conventional drugs to make them more potent.

15:44Giuseppe's brother certainly had no idea. How old was he? When he died, 37. God, young. And not homeless, upstanding member of society, ran three methadone and suboxone clinics. Wow. Out in the Bay Area. He just got some cocaine one night, it had fentanyl in it, and that was it. Really? So he just... Wow. So he didn't even... Again, he didn't even realise he was taking it. It was just... He did not know he was taking it. No, no. No, no, he did not know he was taking it. The bill was still rolled in his hand. Well, it was instant. It shut his heart down. Yeah. My God. So my name is Michelle George and I work for Track B, which is the syringe service in Las Vegas.

16:24How big is Las Vegas' drug problem, would you say? Is it getting worse? It's worse. So in 2022, we lost 616 lives to overdose. This year we're looking at 796. 458 of those are due to fentanyl overdose. Due to fentanyl specifically? Fentanyl, yes. And why do you think that's getting worse, the fentanyl in particular? because all the drugs are cut with it. So on top of our syringe services, we are able to offer on-site drug testing so clients can bring in their works, they can bring in their supply, anything that has drug residue on it. We're able to test it in our storefront to see what's kind of in it.

17:08Like we can tell them if it's fentanyl, xylazine, and then we send that out to a lab and then it comes back and it tells everything that was in that drug. It's all hands on deck. It requires a community. It's our everyday people. That's the problem that I always face. We assume that it's our unhoused that have the problem. No, it's affecting our children because they're taking pills that they're buying off of Snapchat. Snapchat. Snapchat. What's the other one? WhatsApp. Instagram. So they're able to buy these drugs. They're not testing them. They're bringing them to school. So it starts from our kids all the way up to our elders.

17:47So the kids are taking fencing? Yes. How young are we talking? About three years ago, we had a junior high where a little girl brought five pills to school. Two of the five kids that took the pills overdosed and died. And three of them didn't take the pills. They put them in their pocket. So we're seeing it all the way down. How old would that be? 11, 12. 11? 11, 12 years old. from fentanyl at the age of 11 because they're buying it on snapchat yep and they're not that's horrifying it's terrible and i have kids i raise my kids out here and i have to tell them all the time like don't even don't take anything anybody gets so dealers are selling to kids absolutely absolutely there's no age money is money right so there's no remorse like hey let me not sell to this part nope it goes out to everyone how quickly can this take hold would you say if it isn't controlled or if authorities kind of lose track of it before we get started, how quickly can it take hold?

18:43Well it's gone from being a minimal problem in 2019 to now being an epidemic out here. So in five years? Five years. If you think kids being dealt fentanyl on snapchat is scary then get this. So that's a recovery high school so if you're trying to get sober and you're a kid in high school it's fully under the school district you can go there and specialize two kids struggling with alcohol and drugs. So it's a high school, a secondary school? High school. Specifically for? Alcohol and drugs. Kids who are addicts? Uh-huh, yeah. Whole school? Whole school. It's pretty amazing. And they've got outstanding results with it.

19:20And how young are the kids? So freshmen to seniors. So how old is that? 13 to 18. You might have some that are in there that are 19. 13, as young as 13? Mm-hmm.

19:36750 ,000 Americans are estimated to have died in this epidemic. That's depressing enough. What's disturbing for us is that maybe this isn't just an American story after all. This is a story which might be coming for Britain. Stay with us.

20:03your social media feed delivers plenty of advice but it doesn't know you it doesn't ask questions it doesn't give physical exams or order tests doctors do at the american medical association we believe the best care starts with a real conversation with someone who understands the science and your unique health. So stay curious, ask questions, but when it's time to make decisions, make them with a doctor. Learn more at amahealthvshype.org. That's amahealthvshype.org. This is The News Agents.

20:40So we're a long way now from the west coast of America where so much of this epidemic is centered. We're in Camden in North London. It's just off the main high street, tucked away behind a Turkish restaurant, a drugs treatment center. And we've come because we've heard that recently centers like this in London and elsewhere in the country as well, literally in the last 12 months or so, have started to notice something very disturbing. Fentanyl, and more specifically, nitazines, the family of synthetic opioids, chemically different to fentanyl, but maybe three, four, five times stronger than fentanyl and 250 times stronger than heroin, well, they've started to be detected in the UK.

21:26I'm Molly Howden. I'm the cluster lead nurse at CGL Camden. Opiate-related problems. It's something we hear about in the US a lot. Fentanyl, obviously, has become a huge problem over there. How big a problem in terms of the substance abuse with relation to those substances, is that in the UK? I think it's become a bigger issue within the last year or two, especially here. The synthetic opiates, there seems to be more of those coming in now. That's something you've noticed here? Yeah. The majority of people aren't aware that they're purchasing the synthetic opiates and that tends to mean that they're trying to buy heroin but then they might end up using a synthetic opiate.

22:07So people think that they're buying heroin, something they're familiar with. Yeah. So there's mitazines, xylozines, fentanyl, all different types of synthetic opiates. The majority of people are aiming to buy heroin. Some people actively seek out the synthetic opiates because generally they're a lot stronger than heroin. But on mass really overall, I think people are aiming to buy heroin and are unaware that they've got synthetic opiates in them. It can be up to 100 times stronger than heroin, but then the next time it could be 200 times stronger. So it's really difficult for us to advise people how much stronger it is.

22:49They were never made for human consumption. Obviously there's fentanyl, which is used in hospitals and like general opiates but these netizens are have been reintroduced after they were found too strong for for people to take and are only illicit the effects on the body are presumably profound yeah and it makes the danger of overdose presumably much more profound the people have overdosed on netizens what they thought was heroin and they might have a quite high tolerance to opiates they've been taking heroin for 20 years and they'll they'll overdose once on netizens because it's so much stronger we had a period of time in march where there was 31 non-fatal overdoses in camden in a week because of netizens so just in camden just in camden one week yeah all the drugs were tested and they all had netizens in them or netizen compounds in them Because of that, we had to sort of change the way that we were delivering our service.

23:51So we opened at the weekend. We went to, you know, went to do outreach. We contacted like over 300 people that hadn't been contacted recently. And it's obviously not just happening here. It's happening in other boroughs and all over the country. You've talked about a time frame of a year, two years. You talk about March and it seems to be getting worse. Does anyone have any idea as to why suddenly this is becoming a bigger problem so quickly? It's probably cost, it's probably much cheaper. Unfortunately, drugs that are being sold as other things as well, nobody really knows. So even party drugs like MDMA have been found to have netizens in for people that don't have a tolerance whatsoever that might take netizens accidentally.

24:36But it's hard to say. I think it's generally just a cost thing and it's much cheaper. These netizens are terrifying. They're coming in from China mainly. They're completely deadly, even in trace amounts. People don't know they're on them. And it seems like dealers are literally experimenting to see how much they can put in. My name is Vicky Markovich and I'm an executive director for Change Go Live. and Change Grow Live is the largest of the third sector providers of drug and alcohol services, treatment services in the UK. Is the worry that this is just the beginning of something? I mean, presumably, obviously this is a murky world, right?

25:21The gangs, criminals, there must be advantage for them in so doing and therefore that this could grow as a problem, this could become more and more common. It's the tip of the iceberg. Well, there's an advantage to them in some ways that it's cheaper But it's a disadvantage if you're killing the people who are bringing you the income. So when there was a big spike a number about 18 months ago and then things sort of settled down a little bit, the kind of intelligence that we have and that we've kind of garnered is that the drug dealing networks and the gangs that are creating these drugs are testing out how much netazine you would use that wouldn't necessarily kill somebody but would give you a similar effect to heroin or any other kind of drug.

26:02A live experiment. Yeah, so it's almost like live experiments. Now, it's not brand new, it is emerging. We are very concerned as a drug treatment sector about the impact on the people who use drugs. As the levels, I suppose, become balanced, this could become the norm. It could become the drugs that are available on the street. So we as a sector need to really think about what kind of treatment are we offering? How quickly can we get people in? How can we almost be more successful at engaging people than the drug dealers so that they're getting the drugs that they want from the drug treatment services so that they're safe and they're not putting themselves at harm?

26:40Because I suppose that the risk that you're describing is that right now, this has been quite nascent. And as you say, one of the very unfortunate effects, obviously morally, but also commercially for these people is that they've been killing their customers. But if they were to get a kind of, for want of a better expression, a Goldilocks kind of level, which provides the hit that people want, whilst not killing them, that you do get a fentanyl type crisis in the UK, that you get something, in fact, could be worse, because as you say, it is worse. As it stands and the numbers are increasing. So we know as a society, there are lots of people out there that are using opioids, heroin as one of the opioids that people are using.

27:17And really what we want to do is get those people into treatment. We know that drug use is a reality. It's a reality of society. It goes on every single day. and by kind of almost, I suppose, de-stigmatising that people use drugs, trying to encourage people to access help, ensuring that they're able to access treatment easily, quickly, in a way that isn't, you know, increasing stigma, is really the only success story that we have. At least 400 people have died in the UK from overdoses involving litigines over the 18 months to January of this year. Authorities, the police, they're just waking up to the scale of the threat they now pose.

27:56They can be, remember, four to five times stronger than fentanyl and up to 250 times as potent as heroin. One leading drugs charity has warned that this is probably the biggest public health crisis for people who use drugs in the UK since the AIDS crisis in the 1980s. Alistair, who we met at the clinic, has already lived it. So you were homeless for six years? Yeah, I'm still homeless now in temporary housing, just in different hostels, but I was street homeless when I first came to the agencies. And how long have you been street homeless on the streets for? Roughly five, six years. I had a major problem, about 21, with heroin and cocaine injecting, and I sort of did a prison sentence seven years for a robbery, so it got pretty serious.

28:43I stopped working and then became institutionalised from the prison. Have you ever been or were you aware of the increasing use of opioid drugs? Yeah, definitely. Yeah, yeah. I stopped and had an abstinent time for about two and a half years. And in that time, the fentanyl got really strong. Quite a lot of people used it, as opposed to no one was really aware of it at one point. So you're using fentanyl? We were all, everybody used it. Yeah. And at the end of the time, before I had an abstinent phase, a lot of people were overdosing on it. It's one of the things that overdosed a lot of people.

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29:14Can you just describe what they're like? What is fentanyl like? Overwhelming. Yeah, it lasts for a while and it's got a long acting half-life. So it keeps you comfortable for quite some time. It's definitely stronger than heroin, but a lot more pronounced. If you have different drugs with it, they're more profound, you know? And how do you get hold of it? Many different ways. Most obviously not great. The fentanyl that we were getting in London was more street fentanyl. Right. Yeah, through dealers and stuff. But before that, when we were really bad at it, it was pharmaceutical, great. so it gets you physically you want it and mentally you definitely want it a lot more noticeable than the other drugs in terms of trying to come off it was even harder than yeah and then after you've been off it for so long too you get a lot of cravings where you wouldn't really for the other stuff and how long were you on it do you reckon oh altogether i'm not too sure but roughly with fentanyl that was about a three-year period three years in between taking heroin and cocaine and injections and and how often would you be taking it during that three-year period do you reckon At that time, as much as possible, multiple times a day, but definitely every day.

30:16Yeah, so it was serious. It's quite accessible. When we started using the street fentanyl, it was maybe once every three or four days or whenever it was available. But then at a time, it became very available. I think that a lot of people think that fentanyl, I mean, it's become a big crisis in the US, but people don't think they're associated with the UK. Oh, it's been an epidemic here, definitely. Yeah. being on the grassroots level seeing it on the street at one point i'm not sure about now but it definitely was up to a few years ago and you knew a lot of other people who were on it yeah i had a i knew a trend that where if someone overdosed on it and either passed away or was seriously ill and other addicts knew about it everyone would want to find it the person's house that uh had it so they could get the strong stuff i was included so we were more intrigued to find out who had the stuff that nearly killed someone so we could get that so when you heard someone had OD'd on it, the reaction was, how can we get some of that stuff?

31:12Yeah, and that was like a common spread thing. At the time, I remember being quite shocked how so many of us were, you know, initiated to want to do that. It sounds like it was a real, real problem. It was, it still is. I mean, I see a lot of people still in the midst of it, and a lot of new people, especially through the services in the last couple of years that you would never have seen in services before. From my experience, a lot of the people I still see now, you know, that's their main drug of choice. It's weird, isn't it? Because it feels like it's relatively hidden. Yeah. We don't talk about it.

31:44No, it feels hidden. It feels like even the media hides it. Not, you know, to any great extent, it just feels like it's maybe not picked up on. It's not here now. When I thought I was reasonably informed about this stuff, and I would have, because I'm so sort of attuned to some of the stuff that's happening in the US, I would have thought, oh, if it was in Britain in any serious way, I'm sure I would have heard about it what you're describing is something where it's not maybe everywhere but it was readily available it was intense and on the estates at a grassroots level at some point here that can't you know statistics won't deny that from the ambulance service and the amount of overdoses and everything else criminal criminal justice statistics but it was definitely here and still has a prominent place in the drugs market so you're not taking anything in now no no i'm clean now i relapsed i had a relapse six and a half weeks ago all right and i was in hospital roughly for two and a half weeks for three operations.

32:34Gosh. Yeah, and that's after being abstinent for a couple of years. It's hard to explain. Yeah. Yeah, I was trying to overdose, so I'd not be here. That was the idea. So you just wanted to? Yeah. So I haven't woke up and got back into the drugs. I was lost for about a week. I'm glad that you're still with us. Thank you, me too. Yeah.

32:55We have a very serious drug problem in this country. the use of illegal drugs is of a scale that is very hard to believe. There's no such thing as dabbling in drugs. These are serious offences. We're seeing a lot of problems caused by these 300 ,000 problem drugs users. The war on drugs that the Conservatives and the Labour governments have been pursuing for 50 odd years has been shown time and again not to work. People say, oh, the war on drugs has failed. When it comes to County Line's drug dealers, I don't think that the war on drugs has even begun. We are the drugs market of Europe, and I think the police and our country has lost control of that drugs market.

33:39Obviously, fentanyl is starting to arrive in the UK. That's what we've been discussing over the last two days. Should we be worried about that? How worried should we be? We should be terrified. Terrified? This is the number one cause of death for adults 18 to 45 in America. Number one. Not COVID, not cancer. Not car accidents, not gun violence. It's fentanyl poisoning or fentanyl overdoses. Number one cause of death, and it spreads like the plague. I mean, it's horrible. Like you said, you talk to some of the homeless guys like Tim and stuff, right? They got a little bit of a tolerance to it. Where you should be terrified is the people that don't have a tolerance to it.

34:14And they're not going to be homeless. They're going to be your brothers, your sisters, your parents. You'd be surprised how many people I help get sober. Doctors, lawyers, attorneys. And those are the ones that it's going to kill, like my brother. where he got it recreational, got a little bit of cocaine, there was fentanyl in it, and that was it. It must have been so hard to deal with. The last text I got was, I'm proud of you, you're finally doing it, you're taking your kids to Disneyland, and I had just got two years sober. And that was the last text I got from him. And then I got the call the next day that he had passed.

34:47So it was a shock to everybody. You must have taken a great deal of strength on your part not to relapse with that happening. I turned my pain into purpose. You know, I figured, okay, he's helped thousands of people when he died, before he died. Now he can help even more after his death. And so, you know, we use his death as purpose to, if one takes one death to save thousands, then that's what we turned it into. That's how we survive it every day.

35:22We all have routines. I'm Jabron, and with diabetes, mine was finger sticks. Sometimes, I skip them because it hurt. The Freestyle Libre 3CGM changed that. It gives me glucose insights without finger sticks. Learn more at freestyllibre.us. Finger sticks are required if your glucose alarms and readings do not match symptoms, or when you see check blood glucose symbol for the first 12 hours. The views expressed should not be used for medical diagnosis or treatment as a substitute for professional medical advice. Individual circumstances may vary. For prescription only. Safety info found at freestyllibre.us.

35:51your social media feed delivers plenty of advice but it doesn't know you it doesn't ask questions it doesn't give physical exams or order tests doctors do at the american medical association we believe the best care starts with a real conversation with someone who understands the science and your unique health so stay curious ask questions but when it's time to make decisions make them with a doctor. Learn more at amahealthvshype.org. That's amahealthvshype.org. This is The News Agents. Right, we're packing up to leave the West Coast. And as you can probably tell, I have found all of this pretty chilling.

36:35Fundamentally, this, for me, is a political story. It certainly is in its origins. That initial failure of regulation of the state, the government letting so many people down. It is political in its effects. Trump claims the left has been too soft on drugs and has let this happen. He runs against the cities in that way. And look, there's a bit of truth to it. He's certainly benefited from it. It's a geopolitical story, given China's production of the stuff. It's an economic story. It's about all those things which can lead to addiction, homelessness, trauma, the rest. But most of all, it is a human story and an almost countless set of human tragedies.

37:12I cannot tell you how scary the opioid crisis is. It is not like any other drug, fentanyl or the opioids that come with it. It hollows people. It hollows people out physically, their faces, their bodies, their minds. It has hollowed American life. And I think we in Europe, we've been inured from this stuff because we didn't have an opioid crisis because we control our medicines better. And if you don't travel here, you don't really see it or you're only sort of dimly aware of it. But believe me, you do not want to see it. and these new Nyssenes are even darker. They are so powerful. They're so easy to make and the danger is that they take hold before we even realize it.

37:51And if that happens, take it from Las Vegas. It'll already be too late. That is it from me and the team here. Our sincere thanks to Giuseppe Mandel, Change, Grow, Live and Urban Alchemy who have all helped us enormously with the production of this episode. There is a full film documentary version which will be out sued as well with extra content and material from San Francisco, where I am right now, in so many ways, ground zero of this crisis. So do keep an eye out for that. This episode was produced by Rory Simon. Our editor is Tom Hughes. We'll be back in London with normal service on Monday.

38:24For now, from all of us in San Francisco, have a lovely weekend.

38:31I'm Andy Hughes, host of The Crime Agents. And on this week's episode, we're looking at football hooliganism. How do they operate in the modern world? And you'll hear what happened when I infiltrated a violent firm. Here's a short clip. I came out the ground and then it was just utter chaos. And the police were charging and the fans were charging. And then there was a police horse just spinning round, looked really distressed. And I thought, what's happening here? And then I looked and I saw a guy in a Newcastle shirt with a Newcastle scarf around his face, squaring up to the horse and he punched the police horse i was like what is going on i really want to know that the police horse punched him back well yeah well it wasn't a police officer punched him back actually so i got with the new batch lads and then they started just hurling bottles so what they did is that they went near to a pub and there was one of these recycling bins they just emptied the bin and hundreds of glass bottles just went across the road and they all just picked these up and just started hurling them.

39:37Obviously I didn't. I was just kind of on the edge, just pretending to be a hard lad, which of course I'm not. And then I just found myself in the middle of just utter chaos and I thought, I'm in big trouble here. To find out what happened next, you can listen to The Crime Agents with me, Andy Hughes, and my co-host, Neil Basu. And that's on Global Player or wherever you get your podcasts. Or you can watch it on YouTube. This is a Global Player original podcast. A Mem marvelous

From the publisher

From coast to coast, America’s towns and cities have been besieged by an opioid epidemic, a crisis which has wrought misery and wielded political consequence.

Deep in the Nevada desert, Las Vegas - a city renowned for its seedy underbelly, has some 1,500 people living in its 600 miles of flash flood tunnels - many addicted to fentanyl. Lewis meets some of the tunnels’ residents to find out how this years-long epidemic is still wreaking havoc and claiming lives.

Despite being insulated from the crisis for so long, British treatment services are sounding the alarm bell. Nitazenes, a family of extremely powerful synthetic opioids, are spiking the drug market with dealers carrying out dangerous experiments on their clients causing overdose after overdose on the streets of Britain.

Has the opioid epidemic, once thought of as a uniquely American problem, now landed in the UK?

The News Agents is brought to you by HSBC UK - https://www.hsbc.co.uk/

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