Weekend Edition: Inside Sheffield Wednesday's crisis & who's next? - The Sports Agents

0:02This is a Global Player original podcast. As the Championship kicks off this weekend, Sheffield Wednesday players and staff are still waiting to be paid. The club is in a desperate position. There's a transfer ban in place and the North Stand has been closed at Hillsborough. All summer long, families haven't known when the money's coming in. Some season ticket holders don't know if they've got a seat. But at the moment, the owner, Dave von Chancery, isn't selling. Our guest today is Chris Powell. He's just left his role as assistant coach at Sheffield Wednesday. He'll tell us what it's really been like for the people on the inside and the fans.

0:39And of course, it's not just Sheffield Wednesday, Morecambe on the brink as well in the National League. Reading almost went under, very famously did in 2019. How much worse can it get before a sale happens? And with PSR and the new independent regulator coming into force very soon, How on earth do we keep finding ourselves here? Welcome to The Sports Agents.

1:16Hello, just me this week. It's the start of the Championship this weekend. Sheffield Wednesday are in trouble. More on them shortly. Remember to send in your questions. We're going to do a Premier League Q &A next week ahead of the new season. The Sports Agents at Global.com on our socials or on our fancy new Google form in the episode description. Later, I'll be taking you through the best bits of this week's show. Catch up with all our episodes of The Sports Agents on YouTube, Global Player, or wherever you get your podcasts. Hit subscribe or follow and please rate and review. Up next then, the recently departed assistant coach of Sheffield Wednesday, Chris Powell, who will give us a behind-the-scenes look on the crisis.

2:00Chris, thank you very much for talking to us. How difficult individually and how difficult collectively have the past few months been? well to be honest chappers i've got to start off by saying i've just left a wonderful football club in many ways i've said it to many people that it's the most functional dysfunctional football club i've ever been at ever the support and what the football club means to the community I didn't realise until I joined just 20 months ago. But particularly the last few months, maybe from about March, when that was the first time players and staff hadn't been paid, you just felt a little bit uneasy with what the future might entail.

2:53But we carried on. The players, to be fair to them, got through the season, finished mid-table. We could have. We had a real critical time in January where maybe a little bit of investment or just, you know, I'm talking about investment when there's no money, but we just needed a player or two to really enhance where we were. I think we were eighth or ninth at that time. Didn't happen. And then I believe the relationship really broke down between Danny and the owner. And then it all pointed towards a sort of part of the ways. I think what's still coming out now, I haven't been into the training ground for a number of weeks, is the lack of clarity and communication at the time.

3:40And to be honest, Mark, there's no one to speak to. There's no board of directors. There hasn't been a CEO there for a number of years. There's no, as it is these days, a sporting director. There's none of that, Chris. There's no kind of executive level between head coach and owner and chair. No. So the club, we brought in a consultant for head of recruitment, really, really good guy who helps out Danny and the coaching staff really well. But the actual, there's no board of directors. So the club is run by the owner, Chan Ziri. There's a consultant who's sort of his link and club secondary. that's it that's it so if there was a month and there were several months of of not getting paid yeah who who do you ring no one there's no one to to ring there's no one to speak to now it all falls on the shoulders of maybe the club secretary that that's very difficult for her she's very good and hr i mean basically people would get an email saying uh we know times are hard and it's very difficult we're trying to resolve the situation but that's it mark i haven't and also chris and also chris that that club secretary will have their own issues with not being paid i'm guessing well i would guess the sake but yeah um we eventually got paid a few days into April but then it was really when it happened in May and then June that then you actually realise that there's something serious going on he's been there 10 years and the lack of communication so going back to that the players then as you can imagine they just want some answers to a few questions and I suppose what they're looking at is who do we speak to but then And normally, and I've been a player many years ago, you would head to the manager who would then, I've been in it myself many years ago as a manager, didn't get paid when I was at Southend.

5:53And of course, then it was on me to speak to the owner and chief exec, but Sheffield Windsor, you have no one. And the owner, if he speaks to anyone, other than the two or four mentioned, he would speak to the manager or the captain, Barry Bannon. Maybe Liam Palmer, who's been captain, been there since he was seven. He's now in his 30s. He's a one-club man for sport. But he wouldn't speak to anyone else. I never spoke to him in 20 months. Not once. Whether that's culturally, whether that's just his way of working, I don't know, to be honest. But it's just very difficult. And you've got to imagine the young men are not sure where to turn to.

6:37And it's been a stress for them. And even though my contract was over at the end of June, I popped in on the first day of pre-season with a number of other staff members just to lend some support. There wasn't much we could do, but I said to them, we haven't spoken to anyone, so come the 1st of July, we're walking away. So it's been a very stressful time for those players, for the support staff at that football club, brilliant people who embrace me from day one but you feel helpless because you want you want to help them mark you know but yeah we can do there's not much you can do are you fearful for the club i am but i truly believe it won't get to that stage i believe a club of their stature will be able to attract some sort of investment.

7:33I'm led to believe there has been some people trying to acquire the club, but I don't know where that gets to. I believe the EFL have made a statement recently about they've made contact with advisors of Canjiri to almost force a sale through a la Reading in that sort of style. So I'm fearful when I see players leave because obviously when you're not paid two months in a row, then you can hand in your notice. We've seen that with Josh Windass, Michael Smith. I believe you may see that again in a week or two that another player or players will do the same thing. They're fearful for their futures because they're not sure exactly what the future actually holds for the club.

8:24so they made a statement last week with the Burnley game but I know the players that are there they will play in the game against Leicester they will turn up for sure because they feel they have to they have to make a stand that actually we're still going to play for the club and we'll see what the future holds The Sports Agents Paying for college doesn't have to be complicated With Earnest private student loans, there are no surprises, just low rates and zero fees. Check your eligibility at earnest.com slash go. Loans made by Finwise Bank, member FBIC, and are subject to credit approval. Terms apply.

9:07The Sports Agents. With Gabby Logan and Mark Chapman. I mean, you mentioned the Reading situation. I mean, Reading, the fear, I would imagine, if you're a Sheffield Wednesday fan, is that Reading went to the brink several times, didn't they? And constantly had points deductions and wages not being paid. And it took the very final, very, very final chance, probably, to get that club sold. I mean, I was going to ask you, but you haven't talked to him, so you will have no idea, really. The reports are that he's willing to sell, but offers haven't been accepted, have they? No. But no one knows, Mark.

9:52This is, I suppose, the real upsetting part of all this is that actually it's the not knowing. It's the not knowing. Not knowing if we're going to get paid, not knowing if it's going to be sold, not knowing if we can fulfil a fixture. It's the not knowing for the players, staff and the supporters because they turn up in the droves, Mark. I mean, I'd be amazed if Sunday's game is not sold out. Yeah. But maybe because it's an away game, they feel that they can all go. I'd dread to film what the atmosphere would be like the first home game with the North stand apparently possibly being closed. Yeah.

10:32Because it makes a noise, the fans there. That stand, just to give people an indication. so that north stand is an enforced closure because of its we are told because of its structural integrity fans have bought season tickets in that stand yeah but they haven't been told what's going to happen to their seat so there are fans in the dark there it's it's over 9 000 capacity stand so that's an important stand you know if you just bring it down to football and support it's important for the players and the club. I mean, that place will seethe with anger, I am guessing, at the first home match. And also confusion.

11:14Yeah, I mean, I can't speak for them all, Mark, but what I do know from my time there, it is an important stand. It's very vociferous. They make themselves heard, especially at kickoff, but during the game as well. So they've partied with their hard-earned money to watch their team. but where they're going to sit. And you can imagine, Mark, a lot of people sit in the same seats for years. They sat with their dad, their parents, their granddad, other family members and friends, and now they're going to move. But to where? Obviously, they're trying to do that now. I'm sure they are. I'm not sure who's leading that, but they're doing that.

11:54But it's just a real bizarre situation. And the lack of investment now over the 10 years, initially, I know he definitely spent money. They got in the playoff final and got in the playoffs very early on. But then I suppose when the team went down, when actually they should have stayed up, Darren Moore did a great job. But because the stadium was sold in the wrong tax year, financial year, and he sold it to himself, they had a points deduction, which invariably brought them down. But Darren Moore, again, got them back up. Yeah. Two weeks later, he's gone. now that in itself will tell you well the manager has brought you up surely he's got the club and the team and the support is exactly where they should be he leaves and you know then the decline and the lack of investment into the training ground into the stadium obviously with the north stands but countless issues the lack of plan or vision really then has got the club to where it is now it's it's so so disappointing and i'm not even a supporter of 30 40 years we've both been around the block a few times in speak for yourself yeah are are you and you mentioned south end there and we've mentioned reading morecambe are on the brink in the national league at the moment yeah spoken about sheffield wednesday I recall the Shrewsbury owner last year under a lot of pressure saying football clubs can't be owned by local businessmen or business women anymore.

13:39I know Chancery isn't local in that sense. And yet we're told PSR is meant to be making, the Premier League is meant to make everybody financially responsible. It's meant to be an independent regulator, fit and proper persons, all of that. I can't work out whether we should be surprised that this situation doesn't happen more or whether we should be furious that this situation happens at all. Maybe it's both. I don't know. It's a good point, Mark, because I think we know football in itself is quite a unique business in how it's run, how it's supported. It shouldn't be supported by one person and you're relying on that person.

14:21I don't believe. Because as is happening now, the minute they say, I'm bored of this, or I'm not prepared to put any more money into it, and I'm in debt, and I'm borrowing from Peter to pay Paul, it just shouldn't happen. But we've accepted it. We have. Over the years, we have. Because of maybe the riches that could be earned, especially coming out of the Championship to the Premier League. and people may scoff at what Wrexham have done and what Birmingham are doing. I live in the Midlands, so I see it all the time. But both clubs have actually had a plan and they've been hurt at the start. Wrexham missed out on the playoffs initially.

15:08Birmingham got relegated. Yeah. Whether it's commercial like Wrexham, Birmingham have a billionaire owner. We're going to invest in the team. We're going to invest into the community. into the structure of the stadium. So actually, when you see it, I think you buy in. I really do, Mark. I think the people of Birmingham would have been sceptical originally, but then actually, when they're seeing all these changes, they're actually seeing that someone is doing something for them. I think football has eaten itself a lot in respect of people come in, they flash the cash, they pass their test, and I know that the test has changed somewhat in the last 10 years.

15:51There's now a regulator, but they really need to start banging heads now. They really need, because we can't keep having every year. And Mark, let's be frank. It's Sheffield Wednesday and Morecambe now. It quite easily could be another championship, League One, League Two club in six months' time. For me, it's a tipping point. It has to be. We've seen it too often with Bolton, with Reading. we've seen it too often with Wigan it shouldn't happen it just shouldn't happen and we have to cut our cloth accordingly but what happens is when you're allowed to spend when you have PSR when people get around it when they sell hotels to themselves or or do whatever they have to do to get around it you may not invest in the community you may not be from there but actually I mentioned Birmingham and Wrexham and I know everyone you know that there'll be people that don't like what they're doing.

16:44But actually, they've gone, we need to buy into what this area means to the people, what this football club means. Chanziri hasn't done that at Sheffield, but that's quite clear. I shouldn't give him credit, Chanziri, but I think, because he likes to win. I mean, we didn't even touch the sides on him. He likes to win in anything he does. He doesn't sell players. He keeps them to the end of the contract and they walk away. He was holding out for money for Danny. yeah he was offered money didn't take it but i think in his head he's thinking well the leicester job has gone now which danny was linked to yeah the millers were job but danny was linked to all these clubs but he didn't speak to him i think he now thinks well now he's gone he hasn't got anywhere to go so i've won that's the way you would think um oh it's bizarre mark really bizarre well, you know, instead of actually you could get a million pounds from a German club, I'll keep him because I want more.

17:46And then eventually he lets him go for free. That's the danger in actually trying to buy the club from him. Because whatever they offer, oh, it can be more. Well, it could have been more if you hadn't run it like that. And I think that's going to be the same with Morecambe. And until they get into a situation where they can virtually force people to sell clubs, that's the power they need. He'd go, look, you're a bit like they did with Reading, but it's all about their ego, isn't it? Yeah, it is. He always feels that when he agrees a price and you say, I'm happy, he thinks, well, actually, it should have been a bit more.

18:23We had a player last year, could have sold to Wrexham, I won't say who it is, and he scored a goal. He doubled the price. So we told Wrexham, look, he's going to cost this. And they said, okay, we're thinking about it, we'll get back to you. and then he said, oh, no, we're double the price. And we're like, why? Well, he scored a goal. He's worth more. Bizarre. Really bizarre. There's a lot of talk of people coming in, but I think dealing with him is the hardest thing. Yeah. Chris, not the greatest circumstances to chat, but it's lovely to see you. Hopefully see you soon. Take care. No problem.

18:59Anytime.

19:07Buy a new car? I'll be moving in. Let's get started. Sorry, I think there's been a mistake. I bought it from Carvana. You what? Yeah, great price. I even have seven days to love it or return it. So there's no... No, no buyer's remorse. More like buyer's rejoice? I guess I'll let myself out. Congratulations. I mean it. Buyer's rejoice. Buy your car today on Carvana. Limitations and exclusions may apply. See our seven-day return policy at Carvana.com. the sports agents with gabby logan and mark chapman so that wraps up this week on the pod uh this is what else we've had on uh we talk cricket test matches and the hundred with david lloyd and the guardians barney ronnet the hundred as a format is not going to last it is an incredible act of arrogance to try and reinvent how it's going to work and let's be honest it was a commercial punt it's like first idea on the back of an envelope.

20:03You don't go with the first idea. The ECB did. And they've never got over failing to monetize T20. You know, inventing something like that and then watching the IPL grow and become this instrument of power has always tortured the ECB. The idea was that this would be a piece of IP that would be distinct and would be so good that the rest of the world would want to roll it out, would go to the Olympics, would be played in New Zealand and Australia and other countries eventually that's not happened i can only surmise that with particularly the indian owners to get it broadcast back into india the hundred will go it'll be a t20 franchise competition and so we will have fallen into line with the rest of the cricketing world and then the next thing on the horizon will be a champions league of t20 franchise but then you think well who's going to play for who because he plays for them, but I also play for them and I play for them.

20:58And that's a confusion to me. We looked at the Alexander Isak transfer saga with the Athletics' George Culkin. In terms of Alexander Isak, if you're talking about what he could command at Newcastle in terms of wages, again, they just couldn't put up the kind of money that a team like Liverpool could put up. And of course, that's a big problem when you've got really good players who are looking around and thinking, well... Mo Salah is my peer here, or Erling Haaland is my peer here, or we've won a trophy, we're in the Champions League, so we should be getting paid that amount of money. In an ideal world, Newcastle wanted to keep him.

21:34They wanted to sign him to a new contract. I think that moment passed a while ago. Newcastle say they value him at£150 million. They don't want to lose him, but what they can't do is lose him without having somebody in the door that at least comes some way to compensating what they would lose. And we examined football's billion-pound lawsuit that could change the transfer market with Dolph Suchar, who's leading that lawsuit, with the Justice for Players Foundation. We have calculated that there are more or less 100 ,000 players involved in this claim, and they were harmed because their negotiation position due to the FIFA rules were infringed.

22:23Over a period of 2002, when these rules were in place, till the end of 24, when the European court declared them null and void. So during that 20-year period of time, 100 ,000 players have suffered damages because of their diminishing negotiation position. and we have made an economic model which says that approximately 8 % of their income over that period of time that they were active as football player is damaged because of the fact that they had not a sufficient position in the negotiations with the clubs. I mean, if you have 100 ,000 players, all 8 % around underpaid, that's a multi-billion pound claim I'm guessing that's correct yeah that's correct the sports agents if you're enjoying the episode on the news agents feed just search for the sports agents to listen to this week's episodes in full youtube global player or wherever you get your pods for that get your questions in for our premier league q a as well that's next week you can do that on our socials on email the sports agents at global.com or on our google form in the episode description gabby's going to be delighted when she gets back and knows i've set up google forms new episodes every tuesday thursday and friday the sports agents with gabby logan and mark chapman