If You’re Waiting for “The Right Time”, You’ll Stay Broke

13:26Ken Coleman:I'll walk through that door 100 times out of 100. Right. But behavior is a language she has told you repeatedly through her actions. I don't care what you have to say. This is my life. I'm going to live it. By the way, can I have$12 ,000? Yeah, for sure. For sure. I think she wanted out of it originally. And now it's just a mixed bag of emotions. My mother was kind of a victim of abuse as a child, and I don't think she's ever really coped with that fully. And you diagnosing her or internet diagnosing her, you putting things on her, like none of that helps. All right, all right. I get you. The greatest gift you could give her is you and your wife live such peaceful, financially responsible, safe lives.

14:13Ken Coleman:And not safe in the, you don't take risks in adventure, but safe like y 'all are a home base for each other. that is going to be a your mom may say i want what y 'all have and probably she won't and i'm

14:28Dr. John Delony:going to ask a question of john lee on your behalf okay uh john i i'm i'm wondering if he doesn't need to shift from help mode worry mode and it's understandable he's a good man of course he's a good i'd be worried about my mom but i wonder if he doesn't now need to move to grieving mode and just accept the reality.

14:48Ken Coleman:Yeah, there is a, all of the internet diagnostics, all of the, she's got this and she's struggling with this and she needs to do this. All of that is, may have some drops of truth in it, but that's a way for you to distract yourself from grief. Yeah. This stinks. Right. My mom is in a bad situation. She's been in a bad situation for a long, long time. And she's been an adult for a long, long time. And she's continued in some of these patterns, and now she's got a big, huge mess, and she refuses my help. That's heartbreaking, and I'm going to spend some time being sad. Yeah.

15:22Dr. John Delony:Gotcha. And, Lee, on the backside of that is what can I do? I can pray for her if I think that's a thing. I can love her. That's a thing. And I can advise her, as John said, if she comes and asks for advice. Other than that, my friend, there's nothing you can do. And that's why I asked John that question, because it's going to get you to the mental and emotional place that you need to be to where this doesn't drive you bananas. Is that fair? 100%.

15:51Ken Coleman:I think grief is simply the gap between what you wanted and what actually is reality, truth. Right, right. And, man, spend some time in that gap. And it's heartbreaking. We don't have good cultural models for just being sad, just being heartbroken, being in deep grief for a while. And then we're going to go do the next right thing for us and our family tree.

16:12Dr. John Delony:Let's go to Scott now in Fort Worth, Texas. Scott, how can we help?

16:17Ken Coleman:Thanks for taking my call. I guess a pretty quick question. I have a rental property. It's my last piece of debt. Planning on selling it in about a year and a half. And I'm trying to decide if it's wiser to pay it off or maybe if I have that money to pay it off, take it and invest it and just kind of pay the mortgage until I'm ready to sell it, which is probably about next summer, basically the summer of 2027. Why don't you just sell it now? I have tenants in it, and I thought maybe I'd honor the lease I have for them. And they have about a year and six months with us. Can you still sell it? I mean, man, if somebody's trying to buy a rental property, how cool would it be for them to buy a place with a lease of a year already signed up?

16:54Ken Coleman:That's good. That's what I thought. I mentioned it to the real estate agent. They told me that usually investors, usually looking for a really good deal, tend to sell the property for less in value. But I don't know if that's accurate. That's just kind of what they're going for.

17:06Dr. John Delony:Give us some real numbers really fast. What would you stand to make on it?

17:12Ken Coleman:I probably have$100 ,000 in equity in it. It's$125 ,000 payoff, and I have a CD coming mature within the next month that would cover that.

17:21Dr. John Delony:And it's your only debt?

17:23Ken Coleman:It's my only debt. Why do you want to sell it? Are you tired of being a landlord? We just had a lot of life changes, and I just, you know, focus has changed and just not, I don't know, Just maybe waiting for an older home for something to happen and having to dump more money into it. I figure now, maybe within the next year or two, it'll be a good time for us to sell.

17:42Dr. John Delony:Based on what little bit I know, I would lean that direction. But I'm a guy that I kind of go big in momentum when I feel like life is changing, different season. I don't know if this fits. I just do it. But I think there's a case that I think John is leaning into here to go, do I hold on to it, given your financial position? What would you do with the windfall that you would make? What are you thinking?

18:05Ken Coleman:with 100 ,000 I thought I combined I mean I have two teenage kids that are fixing possibly to go to school and looking to kind of invest in them a little bit with a portion of it they realize that we're not paying completely for school and so it's something that we partially use for them and maybe partially used a few things to do for our primary home and then whatever's left just making sure maybe a little traditional IRA or something like that

18:29Dr. John Delony:when would you pay the house off if you were not to sell it what's your payoff date

18:35Ken Coleman:if i wasn't to sell it that's right my payoff date um would be probably by the end of this month

18:42Dr. John Delony:to pay it off i don't think you're understanding what i'm asking i'm sorry yeah he's about to have a cd mature oh the cd that's right you know what that's right so you would pay it off what do you

18:50Ken Coleman:think john this is interesting scott basically i have an emergency fund that covers about here's what i would i would get a second opinion i would go to ramsysolutions.com and check out the real estate pros in your area. And this isn't a sales pitch. This is exactly what I would do if I'm in your situation. I would call a real estate pro and say, hey, here's my situation. I'm of the opinion that when your spirit leaves something, your body needs to leave it too. You already want to sell this house. I would sell your house in the next 30 or 60 days and either have a hard conversation with your tenants or sell it to somebody who will honor their year lease.

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20:57Dr. John Delony:Brandon is up next in San Antonio, Texas. Brandon, how can we help you? Hi, how are you gentlemen doing today? Good. How are you, sir? I'm very blessed.

21:07Ken Coleman:Thank you for taking my call. I just had a brief question for you guys. I recently transferred over here to San Antonio. I'm a U.S. Army nurse. And throughout my career, I've had multiple conversations about finances with other soldiers. And some good, some have been bad. But when people ask me about what I follow and what I do, I always point them to Ramsey Solutions. And there's this consistent negative mindset among a lot of soldiers that I've met regarding Ramsey Solutions. And the primary reason has always been how Ramsey Solutions views debt as evil. And so, you know, the military promotes a lot of things that put you into debt.

21:48Ken Coleman:The government travel charge card. They try to get you on the AMX Platinum card. They tell you about all the different loans and mortgages you can get being a service member. And I guess my question is, how, as the average Joe, can I talk to my fellow soldiers about why putting yourself in debt is wrong, regardless of how sweet the deal looks?

22:13Ken Coleman:Man, your heart is awesome, brother.

22:19Ken Coleman:Very good, my friend. Ken, what do you think, Ken?

22:24Dr. John Delony:Well, the reason I'm – there's an old phrase is when the student is ready, the teacher appears. Yeah. And I don't want to simplify it to that, but that was my first response. And John said this in a call earlier today talking to this guy about his mom. How do I advise my mom? And I thought what John said is great, and I'll borrow it. I think the best thing you can do for your fellow soldiers is actually live with financial peace. and in a way that is humble. You're not walking around talking about how much you have in your emergency fund and stuff like that, but just live it. There's an old phrase in the church world, which makes me roll my eyes, but it's applicable here, John, and I think it's lifestyle evangelism.

23:09Dr. John Delony:In other words, just live in such a way that people go, hey, you know what? When we talk about all this, you never say anything, and you kind of have some peace on your face. what's your deal and then you go oh well so i just don't believe in debt i don't borrow money and here's why i think that's probably best in the barracks sorry for the alliteration but i i think that's i really do i think that's there uh because institutionally you're right you describe what's happening they're up against that uh if someone does say i want to know more and they're having a hard time with the debt is bad thing, I think you have to reframe it.

23:52Dr. John Delony:And there's a simple little construct that I like to use, and that is define the problem, reveal the solution, give the reason for the solution. And so the problem is not debt when you talk to somebody who thinks debt is normal. The problem is the emotion and the stress and the lack of margin and all the other things, right? So you can personalize the problem by asking them, how stressed out are you? What does your debt do to you? Like ask questions. I like to be an asker, not a teller. That's what hit me first. All in the framework of live it and then be able to explain it well.

24:30Ken Coleman:John, what are your thoughts? Brandon, so in 2008 or nine, I hung out with a bunch of super nerds, okay? And there was this new thing that came out called the ketogenic diet. And bro, I turned in to the most annoying diet zealot you could ever imagine. Keto man! I ruined, I ruined, oh gosh, can't you? Brandon, I ruined every dinner party. No matter where we were, I somehow shifted the conversation to, let me give you my thoughts on a high fat, no carb diet. Okay? I mean, dude, I was obsessive.

25:12Ken Coleman:and instead of convincing people, people stopped wanting to hang around me because they were like, whatever this guy's selling, he's so annoying about it. I don't want that in my life. And now I have a new rule and I've had to develop this rule since I took this new job, but it served me well in my relationships outside of work. And that is I only answer questions that I'm asked. and like Ken said I like my life to speak the like speak for me first and so I want people to come up I could walk into every dinner I'm working on a marriage project right now I could walk into every dinner and be like you know what would fix y 'all's marriage would fix your marriage and they would all be like get dude get away from me but if I make sure I'd put in the work every day to have the best marriage possible and my wife does too then people are like dude what are y 'all doing?

26:06Ken Coleman:How are y 'all, how do y 'all still like each other after this many years? Right? And I, here's the thing, Ken nailed it. You're not going to solve an emotional answer with a data point. You just not. Let me look at our country for God's sakes. Right? I mean, you can be like, Hey, here's the temperature. And people are like, no, it's not. Here's the color of the sky. Traitor. No, you're not. You know what I mean? Like you're not on our side anymore. And so everything is emotion. And so I love Ken's like, bro, do you have peace? Because I drive an old car instead of a jacked up Jeep that I borrowed for$50 ,000 and it's depreciating every second I own it.

26:49Ken Coleman:I just have an old pickup truck, dude. And I don't mind if it gets dense. I laugh in the shopping cart. I mean, the shopping parking lot when somebody dings it. Like I have peace. You don't have that. That's why I don't borrow money, man. And if you want to do the nerd stuff and go down depreciation schedules and all that, you can do that, but that's almost always not the issue.

27:13Dr. John Delony:But hey, thanks for your service and thanks for your heart. John nailed it. You're just a great American all the way around. And by the way, you'll have the opportunity to speak into people's lives, but you've got to earn that. And John nailed that. We've got to be careful not to be evangelists when they're like, I don't even want to go to church.

27:30Ken Coleman:The two words I have found when people ask me, and they're being serious, and they're not trying to just mess with me because they know where I work, like, hey, for real, for real. Like, you really don't have a credit card. And the two words that I have found resonate with people are when I say, I solve for peace, not for arbitrage. And I call it a sleep tax. I paid off my 3.2 % mortgage or whatever it was because I could have invested it. I could have tried to make the gap. I could have done all that because I put my head on my pillow every night knowing nobody can take my house away. I paid a sleep tax.

28:07Ken Coleman:And the other word is freedom. Nobody owns my family. No bank, no car dealership, no nothing. So the words peace and the words freedom, those two words seem to resonate when people are actually asking, why do you avoid debt? That's good.

28:22Dr. John Delony:Let's go to Mark now. Mark is in Minneapolis. How can we help?

28:27Ken Coleman:Yes.

28:27Dr. John Delony:I'm wondering if I – I know you strongly recommend term life insurance, and we're on baby step seven, and I just want to know if it's necessary. Yeah, let's run through the numbers real quick. How old are you? 51. Okay, and what's your net worth? 300. Okay. And do you have any term life right now? No, and we don't have any debt. Okay, yeah, you definitely need term. So the reason I was asking you those questions is because sometimes people are self-insured in Baby Step 7. And the way to kind of react to this is, okay, if you were to die today, would your family be okay financially?

29:15Ken Coleman:Well, they would still have to work, but...

29:18Dr. John Delony:Well, what would they have? What would they have? Upon your death, what would they have? They would have 300. Right. And who's they? How old? Who are they? Just my wife. Okay. Is she working now? Yes. Okay. And so the house is paid for, so all the things. So, I mean, I personally would want more, you know. I mean, we have a basic fundamental. It's 10x your income, right? Uh-huh. And so what's your income? 50 ,000 so 500 ,000 i mean here's what i would do i'd call our friends at zander insurance yes you need term i think you need 100 yes you do you don't have enough um and and so at a minimum your 500 ,000 policy so that your wife would get that upon your death i think that's a minimum but call our friends at zander zander.com uh and get their recommendation get get a quote you won't believe how affordable it is, Mark.

30:16Dr. John Delony:And the return on this is low cost and big time peace. John, give you a final word on this.

30:22Ken Coleman:Yeah, dude, you definitely, definitely need it. I want my wife when I die to get to decide what she wants to do next, not have to go do it there. That's right.

30:47Dr. John Delony:Finally, mortgage rates have dropped. And you know what that means? People who have been sitting on the sidelines are about to jump back in to the housing market. So if you've been waiting to buy, this could be your window. But you've got to be prepared and do it the Ramsey way. You need to contact Churchill Mortgage. Their Home Buyer Edge program gives you peace of mind in a wild market. You can cap your rate for 90 days. So if rates go up, you're protected. If rates go down, Churchill will drop yours automatically. And get this, Churchill will even back your offer with a$10 ,000 seller guarantee.

31:22Dr. John Delony:So if your loan falls through due to financing, the seller still gets paid. That's how confident Churchill is. Plus, when you shop as a Churchill certified home buyer, it's stronger than pre-approval. It makes you look like a cash buyer, which makes your offer rise to the top. So don't let this moment pass you by. Get ready now. Go to churchillmortgage.com to get started today. That's churchillmortgage.com. This is a paid advertisement. Homebuyer Edge and Seller Guarantee are available for qualifying borrowers and select loan types only,

31:53Ken Coleman:and not available in all states or locations. NMLS ID 1591. NMLSconsumeraccess.org. Equal housing lender.

32:17Dr. John Delony:It's the most awful time of the year, folks. It's tax season. That's right. Christmas is gone. That's the most wonderful time of the year, John. Mine are done, baby. Good. Done submitted. Good for you. Well, for those of you that haven't done it yet, if you want to get some free checklists and guides that will help you file, go to RamseySolutions.com slash taxes. RamseySolutions.com slash taxes. Pretty simple stuff there. If you have a simple situation, that'll help you. Donna is up next in St. Louis. Donna, how can we help?

32:48Ken Coleman:Hi, nice to talk to you both. I have a question about retirement.

32:52Dr. John Delony:Okay.

32:53Ken Coleman:So I think we're headed in the right direction. We're doing pretty well. But I was wondering why you recommend 15 % to be saved off your gross income.

33:03Dr. John Delony:Aha. Okay, tell us where you are in the moment. What's your situation?

33:06Ken Coleman:Sure. Sure, 47. and my husband's 54. He is completely disabled, so he won't be working from today into retirement. And then I currently, we have$748 ,000 in retirement,$75 ,000 in savings. Our house is paid for no debt whatsoever. And then I'm kind of lazy. I saved 20 % to cover his income from disability and mine together in my employee sponsored 401k. Okay.

33:37Dr. John Delony:You think that's lazy?

33:39Ken Coleman:It's lazy that I don't open up other accounts. I do just put the money in. I don't ever see the money and have it taken out each paycheck for both of us.

33:48Dr. John Delony:I don't think that's lazy. I think you're incredibly disciplined. So what's at the root of this question? I understood your question, but what's the question behind why do I need to save 15 % when you're already saving 20 %?

34:02Ken Coleman:I'm very bad at spending money.

34:04Dr. John Delony:Okay.

34:05Ken Coleman:So it's good to have bumpers in place so that I can plan accordingly and know where to spend that and know when I retire that I'll have about this much money and I can take out about this much. I'm just wondering the logic of the 15 % so I have bumpers, so to speak.

34:24Dr. John Delony:Well, again, I appreciate that, but I'm not hearing somebody who loves to spend so much and you're self-aware and you're kind of beating yourself up a little bit. but you've done a darn good job. Oh, no, no, no.

34:37Ken Coleman:I don't like to spend. I'm horrible at spending.

34:40Dr. John Delony:Oh, I misunderstood. You won't spend any money.

34:44Ken Coleman:I get great pleasure with money in my bank than I would a new pair of shoes or a new car.

34:48Dr. John Delony:I misunderstood. All right, I'm going to bring in the good doctor over here who's been pursing his lips, furrowing his brow. I think you're awesome, Donna. I do, too. Oh, thank you. Why 15 %? I mean, you can answer that.

35:01Ken Coleman:15 % is a number that will get most people to a comfortable retirement that does not take away the ability to live and enjoy their life while they have it. So if you retire, if you put away 7%, 10 % every month, you're going to find yourself not taking advantage of the full capacity of compound growth over time. And again, you are thinking about future you. so when there comes a day and your care of your husband's going to go up it's going to become more difficult and more time consuming you have put in a good amount of money that's going to keep you all comfortable and safe there when you're no longer able to work and conversely if you save 50 % of your income every day you're going to end up with a ton of money and you're going to sit there at 70 on your front porch and realize oh my knees don't work I can't go skiing now I can't I can't do the things that I could have done when I was younger so 15 % gives you a number that is it's a stretch for some people for you it sounds like it's not enough for you I do 20 just to cover my husband's disability so it's a whole gross but I just get pleasure from saving are you saving out of a out of out of a scarcity mindset, out of a compulsion, or you have a husband with unique needs right now, and so you just see, you know what, this makes me feel safer today.

36:37Ken Coleman:I have no problem not doing X, Y, or Z because I really want to make sure we're good on the back end. I would say some of both. I wouldn't call it a compulsion to save, but I definitely know that he's a little older than me. He is disabled. It's going to cost a little bit, and I don't have children, so I want to make sure I have things in place that I can be taken care of. And I always say taken care of well, but they also, you know, they get to enjoy themselves as well while they're taking care of me.

37:07Dr. John Delony:What is your income?

37:09Ken Coleman:Sure. Our gross income is$135 ,000.

37:12Dr. John Delony:How much of that is you?

37:14Ken Coleman:He makes about$28 ,000.

37:17Dr. John Delony:Yeah. So after all expenses paid and everything, how much margin do you have at the end of most months?

37:25Ken Coleman:i can live on a shoestring i know that no card payment so we if we had to we could live on his

37:32Dr. John Delony:disability no no but you didn't answer my question you didn't answer my question i i want a real number i'm not holding you to it i'm going somewhere with this on an average month how much extra cash do you have at your disposal because you know where i'm going not what you

37:47Ken Coleman:can do that's right i've done backpacking hunts out in the middle of the woods in the wilderness for days. I can do that. How much cash? That's not sustainable.

37:55Dr. John Delony:How much cash do you have left over?

37:59Ken Coleman:So I would say between three and$4 ,000, depending if my critters get in a scuffle or something.

38:05Dr. John Delony:Okay. I get it. And the reason I'm asking is John said something that made me ask that question. And I think whether you keep it to 20%, not going to argue about that, or you drop it to 15, John just said something I think is really smart. You need to take some of that, let's call it$3 ,000, and do something fun. Just live.

38:30Ken Coleman:You're an incredible wife. I know it is. Why? Because you don't think you're worth it. Is that what it is? I'm sorry, what did you say? You don't think you're worth it. I never think things are worth the cost, if that makes sense. I'm like, eh, I could stay at home. It doesn't make a difference. We are getting a new bathroom, so I am. Oh, come on. That's where you go, number one, number two. Like, what brings you joy? Women like a bathroom, Renna. What is fun? I like walking my dog and hanging outside. Bad answer.

39:01Dr. John Delony:Come on. Bad answer. I know. No, no, no, no. Let me ask it this way.

39:04Ken Coleman:Sure.

39:05Dr. John Delony:What is something you have thought about doing recently, and you went to your default answer you just shared with all of us, which is, I don't think it's worth spending money on that. Give me a real answer.

39:18Ken Coleman:for myself i don't but my husband he always wants to get you know a new this or new that i'm like yeah we don't need it all right here's john's reading your mail no i'm not letting off the

39:27Dr. John Delony:hook okay john's reading your mail i think she's copping out by saying i don't think it's worth it i think you're on to something dig a little bit yeah i know he is you have so does the audience

39:39Ken Coleman:by the way they're shaking their head in the lobby listen donna um i can only i could talk to you for an hour. We don't have that kind of time. I want you to tattoo what I'm about to tell you right in the middle of your soul, okay? You're worth laughter. You're worth having fun. You have a very hard life. You're taking care of somebody as a primary caregiver, and you work in a job where you make six figures. That is not a punishment that you, quote unquote, deserve. that is a role you have nobly and honorably stepped into and we celebrate you and you're worth laughter you're worth joy you're worth having fun even if you roll your eyes and think that wasn't worth that money and so your homework assignment is where's a place you want to go visit where is a place that you want to take two of your girlfriends or your sister or your husband or that we want to go.

40:41Ken Coleman:And it's going to be obnoxious, and it's going to be expensive, and we are going to have a story to tell on our front porch one day when we're rocking in our rocking chairs. Do you hear what I'm saying? Yeah, I have one in mind, but I say I'm not dying until I see Fiji. What is it? What is it? Say it. Rip it. Rip it. I'm not dying until I see Fiji. Fiji? I can't die until I see Fiji.

41:02Dr. John Delony:But you have$3 ,000 in margin every month, and you're in great financial shape. How old are you? Save up, like John said. What's the cost of a trip to Fiji? Run the numbers on it and save up a little bit, but book the trip as soon as you get it. I think you need to crawl before you walk. Donna, when was the last time you did an entire spa day at a really high-end spa?

41:30Ken Coleman:I don't do things like that. I know. You do today. You book it.

41:34Dr. John Delony:You book it today.

41:35Ken Coleman:It's going to change your life, by the way. Don't go to Fiji when you're seven and you can't go snorkeling and you can't run on the beach. Go when you're 40 freaking seven. You can afford it and you've worked hard.

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43:30Dr. John Delony:welcome back to the ramsey show in the fairwinds credit union studio the phone number to jump in today is 888-825-5225 tori is up next in dallas texas tori how can we help hey there um so i'm

43:46Ken Coleman:is calling for some advice. So me and my husband bought a house in early 2024. We were both working, everything was going great. And then come 2025, we both lost our jobs within about three months of each other. We honestly had no savings. We didn't realize how much cost goes into buying a house and all the things we would need to purchase for our house. So we completely ran through all of our savings doing that. When we lost both of our jobs, we had, you know, the house payment, we have bills, and then we also had purchased jet skis a few months before this happened. So we had that monthly payment along with the car insurance and his truck note.

44:39Ken Coleman:So we ended up, you know, essentially living off of our credit cards. The mortgage company, I tried to get our mortgage lowered. I was getting unemployment at the time. He was not eligible for unemployment. This helped a little bit, but we did fall behind on the mortgage. I asked them for a lower mortgage. They made us enter a forbearance before they lowered everything, so we did that. and now I'm working again. He is currently not working just because we do have a one and a half year old. So we would have to put her in daycare, which would basically be my entire paycheck. And he is planning to leave for the military.

45:24Ken Coleman:We just don't know when. So right now we sold his truck to get rid of that and the insurance payment. But even with doing that, we're still not making ends meet. The credit cards are getting way past due. And we also have to pay back what was past due on the house. So I don't even know where to start with everything or how to catch up.

45:48Dr. John Delony:Well, first things first, we got to fix the income situation. And I'm hearing really good logical excuses, but they're excuses. Okay. We've got a one and a half year old, so my husband can't work. Daycare is too expensive. I get it. And by the way, that's all real. I'm not minimizing it, But I'm hearing logical reasons as to why we aren't working like crazy, because we have an income problem. So let's get specific about that first, and then we'll dive into how do we climb out of this. Did you replace your income, or are you making less, are you making more? What is your income situation today versus where it was before you lost the job?

46:27Ken Coleman:So I'm making the same amount that I was making before.

46:31Dr. John Delony:Which is how much?

46:33Ken Coleman:I bring in probably about$2 ,500 a month.

46:36Dr. John Delony:Doing what?

46:38Ken Coleman:So I actually work, I do billing.

46:43Dr. John Delony:For just a small business or big corporation?

46:46Ken Coleman:For a small business, medical.

46:48Dr. John Delony:Okay. And what did your husband do and what was he making?

46:53Ken Coleman:So he was a manager for logistics and he was making more than me, probably about$3 ,000. Okay.

47:01Dr. John Delony:Okay. So neither one of you were in high-paying jobs, and yet we were buying toys. I just want to call that out. Do you understand what I'm saying? Yes. Okay. And give us more on this military thing. That was just as fuzzy as it could be. What do we know?

47:19Ken Coleman:So he's enlisted in the military. We do have to wait to find out when he goes too basic. It's sort of a waiting game with him.

47:30Dr. John Delony:Do we have a range? Range?

47:32Ken Coleman:I'm sorry, what was up?

47:34Dr. John Delony:Do we have a range? In other words, what branch is he in?

47:38Ken Coleman:So he's going into the Army.

47:39Dr. John Delony:Going to the Army. And so the Army hasn't told him it might be three months, it might be six months. Is it just open-ended? We have no idea. Sit by the phone?

47:47Ken Coleman:Yeah, as of right now, it's basically sit and wait.

47:52Dr. John Delony:Okay. And we have no one that can watch your child that is not a professional daycare situation?

47:58Ken Coleman:No. So she actually used to stay with a family member who decided to go back to work.

48:03Dr. John Delony:Okay. And could he work on the hours when you're at home?

48:08Ken Coleman:Yes. So he has been doing part-time delivery. No, no, no.

48:14Dr. John Delony:No, the max amount of money. If he can make$20 an hour scooping something in a warehouse somewhere, that's what he does until the army calls him. Three jobs. Three jobs. If he's watching the baby during the day, then you don't see him at night. He doesn't sleep. He works on the weekends. I mean, this is the kind of level of intensity I want you to understand you need. You need income. And can I tell you something? You need to be figuring out in the days ahead. I love that you got back to where you were, but you aren't making enough either. Yes. Okay. John, you want to walk through the debt situation and how they get out of it?

48:53Ken Coleman:I mean, y 'all are in a position now where y 'all have, like, you have to choose reality. Reality is y 'all are broke. And this is a scary, scary place to find yourself, especially with a one and a half year old, especially with a husband who's about to be gone for who knows how long and who knows where. And if you're not honest, if you don't choose reality about how this is emotionally taxing you, how y 'all have no peace, y 'all have no freedom in your home, you're not going to have the emotional, to use Ken's word, juice. You're not going to have the emotional energy to go do what has to be done in this moment.

49:26Ken Coleman:And what has to be done right now is both of y 'all have to work maniacally to climb out of this thing. Sell everything you have. Sell the jet skis. And if you're upside down on the jet skis, which you probably are because those are insane depreciating assets, then save up the gap and sell them and go pay those stupid things off. So I actually did let them – I did let them take the jet skis. they went to auction and they sold them probably about$10 ,000,$11 ,000. Good gosh. That's why we don't let things go to auction.

50:01Dr. John Delony:Are you guys on a budget at all?

50:04Ken Coleman:So I have my paycheck. No, the answer is no. Just tell me. What's your total debt load? If you had to write a check today and would clear you and your husband back to zero, what would that number be? um probably about 15 000 including what is what was in the forbearance on my house

50:28Dr. John Delony:that's the best news i've heard on this phone call such a manageable problem if you go crazy working and selling everything and you got to get on a budget now we're going to give you every dollar okay so in a minute i'm going to put you on hold and we're going to get you in every dollar for our gift, you have got to start knowing where every dollar is going. Because right now, to John's point, you're broke. You have no wiggle room at all. But you guys have got to go make some money.

50:59Ken Coleman:And 15 grand is a very overcomable problem. I agree. Okay. I am getting a good amount back on my income taxes.

51:07Dr. John Delony:How much?

51:09Ken Coleman:A little over 10 ,000.

51:11Dr. John Delony:Okay, great. So$1 ,000 goes immediately. Baby Step 1. Are you familiar with the Baby Steps? Yes. Okay, Baby Step 1,$1 ,000. Done. Then we take$9 ,000. Every penny. And put it... Every penny. That's right. And now we're down to$6 ,000 of debt.

51:27Ken Coleman:Which he should be able to clear with three jobs in 30 freaking days.

51:32Dr. John Delony:Now, with a budget, you just got a raise. You take all that debt, and what am I paying minimum per month? We just got that in a raise because we are budgeting now.

51:41Ken Coleman:And I want you to tell him, with all the compassion in your heart, that Ken and I called out his fatherhood and his husbandry. He needs to get off his butt and go take care of his freaking family today.

51:56Dr. John Delony:For the record, since he's going into the Army, it was just John that said that. Just John. I'm just over here.

52:03Ken Coleman:He needs to serve your family as much as he's about to go serve this country.

52:20Dr. John Delony:Dave, we got a lot of calls on this show where life happens. One day someone's healthy, they're working, providing for their family, and then a curveball hits. You know, we hear it all the time. A car accident, a cancer diagnosis, a heart attack, and suddenly everything changes. Yeah, and that's why you've always said that having term life insurance from Xander is essential because it protects your family if the worst happens. Yeah, that's right. You need 10 to 12 times your income in coverage. No gimmicks, no whole life junk, just straightforward term life protection. But there's another piece that people often overlook, and that's long-term disability insurance.

52:59Dr. John Delony:Yeah, it's important to understand the difference between them. Life insurance steps in when you die. Disability insurance steps in while you're alive but can't work. So it replaces a large part of your income so the bills still get paid while you get back on your feet. Now, if your employer gives you free disability insurance, great, take it. If it's discounted there at a better price, take it. But if not, Xander can help you find the right plan. Whether you're single or married, it's not optional. If you're going to be out of work for a while, then you need to make sure the money's still showing up.

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54:10Dr. John Delony:All right, let's go to Des Moines, Iowa. Becca is joining us there. Becca, how can we help?

54:16Ken Coleman:So my daughter is going on a trip in June for my cousin's daughter's Make-A-Wish trip. And we were thinking it would be nice to go as a family with myself, my boyfriend, and my two-year-old. and just do it all together. And it would be roughly$5 ,000 at the max for us three to go since my daughter is already paid for. Okay. So I was just wondering if it would be worth it to go or not.

54:56Dr. John Delony:Well, tell us the reason that you're asking us. There's another part of the story. Why are you questioning whether or not this is a no-brainer?

55:04Ken Coleman:Well, I stay home, so I don't have a study. income. We are going to use the money that we got back from our taxes to do it. So we don't always just have that money, but we're working on it.

55:18Dr. John Delony:Do you have debt?

55:20Ken Coleman:The only debt we have is my car.

55:22Dr. John Delony:How much?

55:24Ken Coleman:10.

55:25Dr. John Delony:How much are you getting back from taxes?

55:29Ken Coleman:He's getting 4 ,000 and I'm getting 4 ,000. So 8 ,000 altogether. And then tell me about your daughter. She's nine. We've never been on vacation, none of us. She's going to go regardless if we go, but I just thought it would be nice to go as a family. Whose Make-A-Wish trip is it? It's my cousin's daughter. She's had cancer and is in recovery, so they're doing that.

56:02Dr. John Delony:No, you shouldn't go.

56:08Okay.

56:11Dr. John Delony:I'm watching. The reason I let the awkward silence is because there's a lady out in the lobby who's looking at me like I have no heart, like there's a lump of coal in my chest. And I appreciate that. And I understand. I think I know where her emotions coming from. And I think I know where John's emotions coming from. And I understand the make a wish thing is that's a really big deal. Maybe I should ask what the severity of the situation is. But I just have a feel from you, the way you're wording all of this. that this isn't as big as maybe it sounds. And so in that case, you guys, I hate that you've never gone on a vacation, but you guys don't have a lot of income.

56:51Dr. John Delony:You're not working. I think for that reason, that tax refund is going to go a long way to getting out of that car payment. What's your car payment every month? um it's 150 every two weeks yeah so 300 a month okay so what would 300 a month mean to your

57:13Ken Coleman:every month income um i do i do photography on the side but it's not so what i asked you

57:23Dr. John Delony:what would a 300 a month insertion into your monthly budget mean to you guys

57:32Dr. John Delony:not much i don't think maybe that should be your water bill and part of your light bill right yeah that's not the answer i was expecting from someone who told me that you know uh what is your husband's

57:43Ken Coleman:income he makes 58 a year that's not a lot of money and you're not making any money so for that

57:51Dr. John Delony:reason i'm taking a hard line i love that your daughter gets to go with her cousin but do you need to go with the two-year-old to the tune of 5 ,000, given you guys are broke. And if the audience doesn't like it, I just don't think it's a good move. John, disagree with me. I have no problem, by the way.

58:12Ken Coleman:No, I... This isn't sitting right in your spirit. I want to hear why it's not. Yeah, that's the other thing. I just, I'm always worried about money. Always. Whether we have it or we don't. Well, because you don't have it. Yeah, your worry is justified. Yeah. And so whenever I'm worried or whenever I'm anxious about something, I want to first ask, is my body right? And in this case, you and your, is it your boyfriend, you said? Yeah. And how many kids do you have? I have two. We have one together. Okay, and how old are they? My daughter is nine and my son is two. Okay. Can I be real, real direct with you since we have a short time?

59:02Yeah.

59:03Ken Coleman:You as the live-in girlfriend are in a very precarious position right now, especially with no income. And you feel that, right? Yeah. Okay. Your body's right. and so if you told me i have a super stable situation i have earning potential i'm married in a long-term marriage and we are anchored in and this niece that i've got cousins that i know really well i've got cousins that i don't know at all this niece is like a daughter to me then in that situation i would say dude go just go yeah i'm not getting that sense i'm getting a sense of I am in a very fragile position as the girlfriend of the chief breadwinner.

59:55Ken Coleman:I don't have a lot of, I don't have equal power at the table in my romantic relationship. I'm taking care of these kids. Our money situation is very, very fragile and I'm just sick and tired of it. And I'm going to express my sick and tired by not going to get a job, not demanding that, hey, we need to get married and we need to make this thing official so that we can both anchor into this thing together. I'm going to take that out by taking the trip I just deserve. Yeah. And you're going to come back from a$5 ,000 trip exhausted. Your kids are going to be cooked. They're going to have fun because it's freaking Disney, but you're going to come back and you're going to have taken 8 ,000 of those dollars.

1:00:37Ken Coleman:And you know, as well as I do that spending his tax return is going to come at a cost. You know that. And you're going to come back having spent... I think... Go ahead. Go ahead. I think our relationship is pretty good. We don't consider, oh, this is my money and this is your money. All of our money is together.

1:00:56Dr. John Delony:Well, you don't have any, number one. And number two, you guys aren't married.

1:01:00Ken Coleman:Again, it's a fragile position. Let me put it this way. If he decides he doesn't want to be your boyfriend anymore today, what happens?

1:01:09Dr. John Delony:I don't know.

1:01:09Ken Coleman:Okay.

1:01:10Dr. John Delony:Exactly.

1:01:11Ken Coleman:There we go. So I am heartbroken with you, and I'm siding with Ken on this one. Because I feel like you're about to go spend five grand you don't have because you're just sick and tired of being stuck in a position that you have a lot of autonomy to actually change. But that change is going to disrupt the rhythm of your relationship. It's going to disrupt the rhythm in your home. It's going to disrupt a lot of stuff. But on the other side of that disruption is potentially a whole lot of peace.

1:01:43Dr. John Delony:And I want to dovetail off of that, Becca. Here's what I would prescribe for you is that you let the sadness and some anger over not being able to do this trip fuel you. And why don't you guys get married and let's commit and let's pay this debt off really fast because you can. and let's get$300 extra a month going and let's keep walking the baby steps out and get an emergency fund. And let's be patient and wait five years and take both kids to Disney. Because I'm going to tell you something right now. The little one is how old? Two. Two. Can I tell you something? Taking a two-year-old to Disney is like hanging out on the seventh level of hell.

1:02:28Dr. John Delony:It's like setting money on fire. By the way, everybody in the lobby agrees with me. you're going to think you're doing something great and you're going to go I wish I had paid the car off and saved myself the stress of dragging a two-year-old around the happiest place on earth the irony of that is just rich so you know this is a little bit of let me say no to something that would be good so I can say yes to the best scenario for my life going forward and you are really close to being debt-free. Let's get boyfriend into a husband. Let's get husband a better job. And then we go to Disney and we don't feel it.

1:03:09Dr. John Delony:And that way, when you're miserable, you just spend a little bit more money on ice cream and then it all regulates.

1:03:14Ken Coleman:I know that's not the answer you wanted, Becca, but that's just your brother's kid and John being honest with you today.

1:03:28Thank you.

1:03:57you

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1:05:19Dr. John Delony:Buying or selling your home is a big, big money deal. You know that. There's a lot of clickbait junk out there, a lot of slop that can confuse you, and it's hard to know what's really going on. So we're here to make the latest trends easy to understand. Mortgage rates moving up and down a little bit, right? Home prices dipped a little bit below$400 ,000 last month. To learn more about the housing market trends and to get free tools to help you buy or sell with confidence, go to RamseySolutions.com slash market. That's RamseySolutions.com slash market. Mark is up in Columbus, Ohio now. Mark, how can we help?

1:05:55Ken Coleman:Hey, Ken and John. Thanks for taking my call. It's an honor to talk to you guys.

1:05:58Dr. John Delony:You too.

1:05:59Ken Coleman:I was laid off of my job after nearly 30 years at the same company not too long ago, where I was making about$190K. Now my wife and I have kind of a different point of view of whether I can get another job doing whatever I want, just don't care what it makes, or whether I need to make more money because the deal is I'm only 53 and I won't be able to touch our retirement stuff for another six and a half years. And so we need to figure out what the next steps for us are. So our net worth is 3.5 million. And we have about 699K in non-retirement accounts. And my wife is convinced that I don't need to work to make a bunch of money.

1:06:43Ken Coleman:And I'm kind of the one that worries about this stuff and so i need to figure out if i can do something for fun no matter what it makes or whether i need to go find another job making about 190k or so for the next six years okay a couple quick questions what were you doing i was working at a big tech company education tech company i was doing a user interface design user experience design okay how would you describe yourself as

1:07:04Dr. John Delony:a professional uh user experience designer okay ux okay um okay so next i want to know because you're the guy that's in the weeds on the money. You're the guy that's worried. Your wife seems to feel really good about it. How much money, let's forget what we're doing, how much money, if I could just hand it to you, I said, all right, Mark, you're going to make this for as many years as you feel comfortable, how much money would be enough? And I'm talking gross salary.

1:07:34Ken Coleman:Well, we have different views, my wife and I, but I didn't ask what her view is. I want to know what $50 ,000 a year, just enough to cover some of the expenses that it would be okay.

1:07:47Dr. John Delony:Okay. And is she very in tune with what you guys have? You guys do the numbers together. She's not just saying this from some emotional point of view? No, she's very in tune. Well, is she right or is she wrong? Well, history will tell you that she's generally right on these kind of things. Well, no, wait a second. Is that husband code because that's what we're all supposed to say? Or is that a fact? She really does have a good grasp of the numbers.

1:08:15Ken Coleman:No, she really does have a good grasp of the numbers.

1:08:17Dr. John Delony:All right. I'm going to actually bring in my colleague here because after my quick little line of questioning and your validation of your wife's, A, knowledge of your financial situation, and B, she's got a good track record of giving good financial advice. John, I think this is a lot of fear.

1:08:35Ken Coleman:Yeah. Okay. So give me something you are anxious about that has nothing to do with money. oh gosh my girl's future okay keep going give me two more um my health long term i'm in good health right now but i've just seen too many people go downhill give me another thing and i said not this but just running out of money just not having enough okay so this is the pot recognizing the kettle here okay so i'm talking to you forget like that there's millions of people listening to us, just it's you and me sitting down having nachos, okay? Okay. Almost every time somebody approaches me with a desperate either or decision, that is a sign that they struggle with anxiety in other places in their life.

1:09:24Ken Coleman:You have boxed yourself into a do something for fun where I just don't make anything and we all starve to death because the apocalypse is going to come hit us at any time. never mind the fact that I'm a multi multi-millionaire that my health is good that my wife loves me enough to stay connected to me and to challenge me when appropriate I am going to forecast a future potential problem I'm going to drag it into the present and not even try to solve it I'm going to worry about it right or the other solution you've given yourself is I need to go find something that I don't love I don't care about that's going to drive me crazy but I'm going to make 190 grand.

1:10:04Ken Coleman:And you've boxed yourself into an either or, and you spend most of your day toggling back and forth. That toggling, the nerd word is rumination. You're just spinning up stories and trying to solve them and tell yourself why you can or can't, why you should and why you shouldn't. And rumination never solves anything. It just makes us feel like we're exerting energy towards a problem. It keeps us busy, but we never go anywhere. And so what I want you to challenge you on is this. A, I'm going to send you a copy of Building a Non-Anxious Life, okay? And this is the assumption that what if your anxiety is right?

1:10:40Ken Coleman:What if the things you worry about is right? And let me be super clear. All of the money could go away. It could. You have set your family up in a position that you are hedged against that happening better than almost anybody Ken and I will talk to in the next two months. You're a multimillionaire in your early 50s. Your health is really dang good. You take care of yourself. You're a good steward of your body. Could you have a heart attack tomorrow? Yep. But you've done the work to put yourself in a position to where that's statistically unlikely. And I could keep going on and on, but I'm going to give you that book because I want you to work through it.

1:11:16Ken Coleman:The second thing I want you to do is I want you to reverse engineer. the day you quote unquote retire, what do you want that day to feel like?

1:11:29I just want it to be confident and relief, relaxing.

1:11:34Ken Coleman:Okay. That is not going to be found in a data point because you have data points and they're not solving that problem for you. That's right. It's going to be solved in a life built well on the way. And it's going to be built with you going towards something. Why not consider doing something that you love and that makes 80 grand, 110 grand. Yeah.

1:11:54Dr. John Delony:How many months have you been laid off? Well, just over five. Okay. I'm getting paid through June, basically. That's what I was wondering. So I'm going to throw something out. I actually want John's opinion on this. You and I have talked about this before. I would love for you to try your wife's plan for three months. months so when june when that last severance check cashes whatever that next month is so you don't have any income so maybe it's july who knows but i want you to go three months without any income three months i know and and john may disagree with me let me play this out your wife is tuned in uh go 60 days i don't care it's not a magical formula i'm dropping here but go enough time where you're able to actually see what life is like with your wife's suggestion and do everything that John said, but force yourself to go, I'm going to take at least three months or two months and I'm not going to have any income.

1:13:00Dr. John Delony:And let's just see how we do.

1:13:02Ken Coleman:What is life like? I'm going to add another thing to it. I want you to spend those two months, because here's the other thing I think you're missing. Ken and I have talked about this at length over the years. getting laid off, your body experiences that as a death. That's right. The loss, the grief attached to that loss is significant because somebody somewhere in a room said, I don't want you or need you here anymore. And that hurts, man. Right? Yeah. And it's existential. Who am I without this title? Who am I when I'm not this job, when I'm not in this role? Who am I going to be now? And is this going to, could this happen again?

1:13:40Ken Coleman:The answer is yes. and you start spinning up stories and you get stuck. So in addition to pressure testing, is my wife right? Also, I want you to begin to fill your day up with things that bring you purpose. Who are you going to help? So that's you not just sitting at home, scanning the internet, watching news or scrolling on your phone. That is you committing to, I'm going to volunteer for three different organizations in my community. I'm going to take a class to get this other certification. You know what? I hate coding. I hate it. I'm going to say it out loud. I hate coding. I'm going to go fill in the blank and begin finding, doing, not thinking about doing things, action or emotions often follow action.

1:14:22Ken Coleman:Go do some things that bring you value and bring you purpose. And man, you're going to come out of this on the other side with a clear path to move forward.

1:14:39Thank you.

1:15:24Dr. John Delony:today's question of the day is brought to you by why refi if defaulted private student loans are wrecking your budget it's time to deal with them and why refi will help you refinance defaulted private student loans with a low fixed rate payment based on your ability to pay. So that allows you to stick to a budget and work the plan. Go to yrefy.com slash Ramsey. That's Y-R-E-F-Y.com slash Ramsey. It may not be available in all states.

1:15:49Ken Coleman:All right. Today's question comes from Chase in Indiana. Oh, man, this starts out. I mean, he doesn't mess around. I don't want to do it, but I'm about to divorce my wife due to financial infidelity. We have amazing kids, and she is my rock, but she has a major spending problem. This is the second time she has gone into debt and kept me in the dark until the creditors come calling. I'm devastated and want to take the easy way out. But even if we get separated, she would still need financial help. I am 45 and she is 48. Can you give me some guidance on how to help her re-engineer her mind about money and finance so she can be the amazing wife I know she can be.

1:16:34Ken Coleman:Oh, boy.

1:16:36Dr. John Delony:Except it's not about her mind. Yeah.

1:16:40Ken Coleman:Man. What do you think, Ken?

1:16:42Dr. John Delony:Well, this is your lane.

1:16:43Ken Coleman:Yeah.

1:16:44Dr. John Delony:Yeah, but you got a lot of wisdom, man. I'm just playing one on TV at the moment. You got a lot of wisdom. uh i'm gonna say with everything in my being fight the urge to divorce her uh i would just fight until there is absolutely no way you can fight i don't think divorce is the answer i think she's got some deep emotional problems and i think she needs some therapy she needs her husband to sit with her and all of that so i would tell him um financial infidelity I get it. But with the kids, I just, I've read too much about divorce. I know enough to get me in trouble. And I know enough to say that it's just never an option until it's the only option.

1:17:30Ken Coleman:Yeah. And Chase, I mean, this has rocked your world and totally understand. You're looking at two husbands right here. If this happened a second time, I mean, it's devastating, right? But I want you to begin to be very honest. She is not your rock. And when you keep saying she's this and she's this, but also this, it becomes destabilizing in your own mind. So I want you to be honest about, I don't trust my wife. and my wife has not shown that she is willing to delay gratification to deal with some of the demons that are haunting her that she's choosing to try to keep at bay with spending or with hiding or with secrets or whatever.

1:18:16Ken Coleman:And so we're going to be very honest about our place in this marriage. We're going to choose reality when it comes to our marriage. What is the state of things? The state of things is if we're really, really on almost never as somebody, quote unquote, a rock in every facet, except they just go into crippling debt, creditors called, and they hide it from us, and they lie about it. That's almost never the case. Very, very rarely. Occasionally it is, but almost never it is. So we're going to be honest about the state of things, and you're going to sit down with her, and you're going to give her a roadmap to what reestablishing trust would look like.

1:18:52Ken Coleman:And you're going to be honest about the precariousness of your situation, and so for a season, I would and can push back on this I would say I am going to open a checking account that is just for us and the kids I am going to ask you to to freeze your credit account and give me the code to it so that you cannot borrow money I am going to ask that because this is the only way I'm going to feel safe for the next 30 60 90 days and then we're going to revisit it and I'm going to ask that you go see somebody because you clearly are struggling with things way under the surface and like this isn't about re-engineering her mind about money and finance this is that is just the that's the blinking red light over the problem the problem is much deeper and we're going to get to the root of where else is she not being fully honest with you where else is she not allowing herself to be seen and known where else are you not a safe place for her to land and so she feels like she has to kind of work around you because you have your own opinions and your own judgments etc we're going to peel this thing all the way back to the bedrock here and we're going going to be honest about the state of our marriage, and then we're going to choose, and both of you have to be in on this, we're going to rebuild this thing brick by brick to this thing that we want it to be.

1:20:03Ken Coleman:And the beauty of it is, if y 'all have both chosen, or one of y 'all has chosen to blow the thing up, you both can choose to rebuild it. It's the same choice, just on the different side of the ledger here. But if you try to solve this with financial, with numbers, with spending habits, that's not the issue here yet. You'll get there, But that's not the problem here. It's much deeper than that.

1:20:25Dr. John Delony:Yeah. Appreciate the question, man. We're rooting for you. Let's go now back to the phones. Andrew's joining us in Jackson, Mississippi. Andrew, how can we help?

1:20:34Ken Coleman:Hey, how's it going, gentlemen? Basically, got some car debt, got some student loan debt. Not really unexpected baby on the way, but we just got pregnant a lot sooner than I expected. and just curious if I sell a truck that I have, get a beater and start pouring it into the student loan debt or just pay off the truck because it's newer.

1:20:58Dr. John Delony:When's the baby due?

1:21:00Ken Coleman:Baby is due. So we're 12 weeks, baby's due around end of September.

1:21:05Dr. John Delony:Okay. End of September. How much debt do you have? Walk us through the debt.

1:21:09Ken Coleman:50 grand in car loan, a hundred grand in student loan, and then we have our house.

1:21:14Dr. John Delony:Okay. So we'll take the house off the table right now. Are you familiar with our baby steps?

1:21:19Ken Coleman:Somewhat.

1:21:20Dr. John Delony:Okay. So, uh, the 50 grand in the car, what's the car? What is it? It's a truck. And what's it worth if you were to private sell today?

1:21:27Ken Coleman:Uh, probably 60.

1:21:30Dr. John Delony:Yes. Yes. We sell that truck immediately.

1:21:33Ken Coleman:We sell it yesterday. Immediately. Even if I can pay it off in two more months. Yeah.

1:21:37Dr. John Delony:What do you make? Two more months. Whoa. You buried the lead.

1:21:40Ken Coleman:What do you make? So we pull in about 220 after taxes.

1:21:46Dr. John Delony:Okay. Well, that would have been nice to know. Yeah. Lead with that next time.

1:21:49Ken Coleman:Hey, we're rich and we're having a baby and I'm terrified.

1:21:52Dr. John Delony:Lead with that next time. Yeah. Pay off the truck in two months. Yeah.

1:21:56Ken Coleman:Okay.

1:21:57Dr. John Delony:And then that leaves the 100K in student loans. Is that right?

1:22:01Ken Coleman:That's right. Yeah.

1:22:03Dr. John Delony:That one's going to take longer. And so, you know, we tell people it's okay to pause Baby Step 2, which is paying off debt, smallest to largest, to save up money. You know, we're going to get in stork mode, right? We stock cash just to make sure. And by the way, what we're doing here is we want to look at what our deductible is, right? And we want to make sure we got plenty of cash, that we don't have any surprises, and that we plan as well as we can for baby, right? And then once baby's here, then it's that massive income knocking off the student loan, all right? So that's baby's two.

1:22:39Ken Coleman:The income reduces after baby because my wife is, you know, she'll get her her little bit for baby leave. And she says she'll start working again after X amount of months. The way you just said that. Yeah, you don't believe her. No, she's going to stay home with baby and she's going to be like, yeah, I'm good. How much do you owe in your house? Two fifty. OK, so what if she if she leaves the workforce for good, what's that going to reduce your household income? Um, it's going to go down to about 185. Yeah.

1:23:14Dr. John Delony:And what, what needs to happen for you to make more money?

1:23:18Ken Coleman:Um, I'm actually working on getting a raise. Um, so that's, that's in the works.

1:23:23Dr. John Delony:What would that take you to?

1:23:25Ken Coleman:Um, it could take us back up to what we're making before.

1:23:29Dr. John Delony:Great. So the answer is, um, uh, you don't have to sell the truck, but what worries me is that you get off this call and then you talk yourself into keeping the truck. Um, so part of me wants to go sell it, take your medicine, uh, you know, and buy a$10 ,000 truck, you know, but you don't have to.

1:23:47Ken Coleman:I want to sell it, but the wife is like, it's a good truck. It's newer. It's got a great warranty. She's the one trying to keep it.

1:23:53Dr. John Delony:What do you think now, John?

1:23:54Ken Coleman:I'm like, I'll, I'll, I don't care. Give me a point to grow up. She's right. And you're right. Okay. So the, the bigger issue to me is y 'all make 220 after taxes. Y 'all have nine months. Yes. And your house payment's only a$250 ,000 house? Yeah. Okay. Maybe I owe a little less. We've been living in it for about a year now. This is going to sound crazy. This is going to sound nuts. Is there any possible way y 'all could squeeze out and just live on$100 ,000 this year since you have no other expenses? Absolutely, yeah. Of course you could. You could live off$75 ,000. If y 'all will just suck it up for one calendar year, you will pay off your student loans and the dumb truck.

1:24:38Dr. John Delony:And for that reason, I'd sell the truck. Yeah, I would too. I'd buy a$10 ,000 truck, and you're going to save all this cash that you would be putting towards the$50 ,000. I want to hold that cash and put it to the loan. Yeah, pay your student loans off in June. Tell your wife, hey, babe, appreciate it, love you, but I don't need to drive this truck. That's what I would do. And then save up and buy a truck after the baby's born.

1:25:21Dr. John Delony:Welcome back to the Ramsey Show in the Fairwinds Credit Union studio. Alongside John Deloney, I'm Ken Coleman. Thrilled that you're with us. The phone number is 888-825-5225. Kate is up now in Oklahoma City. Kate, how can we help?

1:25:38Ken Coleman:Hi, guys. I would just like to know how I should go about a conversation with my dad, asking him to get another job, because he's been asking me and my brother for money for, like, bills and groceries.

1:25:50Dr. John Delony:What? How long has this been going on?

1:25:54Ken Coleman:Oh, years. I mean... How old is he? He is 62. Okay.

1:26:03Dr. John Delony:And is he on his own?

1:26:06Ken Coleman:no my mom is still around she was a caretaker for my grandma but she recently passed away so she is unemployed right now okay and how much money are we talking about in how many years

1:26:19Dr. John Delony:uh well let me let me ask i'm sorry let me ask it differently on the average ask how much money is he asking you and your brother for at a time

1:26:29Ken Coleman:um it really varies anywhere from like 20 bucks to a couple thousand okay i just am trying to get

1:26:37Dr. John Delony:a range for you know how big of a problem he's got going on and and uh you said years how many years

1:26:44Ken Coleman:yeah so um we had a family business for a long time and we would work i've been working since I was like nine, so kind of since then, so like 10 years.

1:26:56Dr. John Delony:He's been asking you and your brother for money for 10 years to help pay his bills. Yes. And you've been giving it to him the entire time.

1:27:04Ken Coleman:Yes.

1:27:05Dr. John Delony:All right. All right. I got to bring in the good doctor here. I set the table, and now you get to clean it. Wow. We got some deep-seated issues going on here, John.

1:27:15Ken Coleman:You asked for two things, and you can only control one of them, okay?

1:27:22Dr. John Delony:Okay.

1:27:23Ken Coleman:And so the only thing you can control here is no thank you. Or thanks for asking, I'm not in a position to give right now. Okay. Or if you're ready to draw a forever boundary, I'm not going to be able to give you, or I'm going to choose not to give you money anymore. And the more honest you can be there, the better.

1:27:48Dr. John Delony:Do you still work in the family business with him?

1:27:53Ken Coleman:No. We had to sell it. He's in quite a bit of debt, so we had to. Gotcha. Okay. You can't recommend he get a new job because he doesn't think he needs one because he doesn't. He has two kids that he's been leeching off of for years. He's going to have to come to that on his own. Yeah. I just want to tell you, as a dad of a daughter sitting next to another dad of another daughter, I want to tell you I'm sorry. Because no dad should put his daughter in this position. Yeah, thank you. You've been carrying him for a long time, and that was never your job.

1:28:32Dr. John Delony:What's going to happen when you do what John tells you to do? How's dad going to react?

1:28:36Ken Coleman:I can tell you he's going to react like a child, right? Yeah, I don't know exactly. He definitely asks more from my brother. Is your brother fed up with this too? He's definitely more lenient on it. He's kind of like, well, mom and dad need money, so I'm going to give it to him.

1:28:57Dr. John Delony:And see, John, that's another dynamic because we're giving Kate this advice. Kate's calling us. Yeah. But if brother's going to continue to help, this is never going to get any better. So even more so, Kate, do you do what John tells you to do?

1:29:09Ken Coleman:And you're going to be isolated even more.

1:29:12Dr. John Delony:Mm-hmm. Yeah. And the reason I'm bringing that up with John next to me is because I think you need to be prepared for dad. You said you don't know what he's going to do. He's not going to react in a good way. and now he's going to put more pressure on your brother and brother may come to you and go, what are you doing? I guess, John, I want her to be prepared for the worst case scenario so that we protect Kate.

1:29:34Ken Coleman:I mean, I think Kate's going to have to make some choices about, do you have community? Do you have people you can count on? Do you have someone you can talk to? Because this is going to be an isolating, rocky storm to weather. I'm actually moving out in April. Good. And the faster you can establish yourself on your own two feet somewhere else where you've got some more autonomy, then this will definitely reduce. Okay. But it will be incredibly uncomfortable, disheartening, heartbreaking. And so I'll say it this way. If it takes you giving him money to preserve the relationship, the relationship you want to be there does not exist.

1:30:21Yeah.

1:30:22Ken Coleman:It's a predatory relationship. You owe me. I'm your dad. I think I keep giving them money because I am just so bad they don't have money for bills, and I don't want them to, you know. Okay, I want to walk you through something that I learned from my buddy Becky Kennedy. She's a psychologist in New York, okay? Okay. I would have told you in the past, like, you're feeling guilty, right? And she changed the way I think about guilt. she said guilt is a good feeling that your body experiences when you violate your own values. Right? Guilt is not the feeling you get when you do something that is in alignment with your values and somebody else is uncomfortable or mad or pissed off at what you just did, and you try to grab their feelings and manage them for them.

1:31:18and so is it a violation of your values to take care of yourself to make sure you're on your own two feet and to stop funding your dad's behavior yeah no i i definitely need to i'm i'm definitely

1:31:36Ken Coleman:ready to move out okay so when he comes at you full storm when your brother comes at you full storm, make a commitment to yourself. And by the way, you don't just declare this like Michael Scott, like, I declare bankrupt. This is hard and it's painful and it takes years, okay? But make the commitment to yourself. I am not going to try to manage y 'all's anger, your frustration, your demands, your coercion. I'm not going to try to manage that. I'm going to be in control of me and I'm going to be compassionate, respectful, honorable. I'm going to always tell the truth. I'm going to be a person of integrity and I'm going to do what I can do.

1:32:12Ken Coleman:And in this season, I don't have that kind of money to continue to support you in that way. Okay. Okay. And that's hard, and that's – like Ken's right, man. That is painful, painful.

1:32:25Dr. John Delony:Where's mom at in this whole deal? Yeah, where's she?

1:32:29Ken Coleman:So my mom – so I'm actually moving, and the job I have now, she's going to take it over. But it's not going to be for a month.

1:32:38Dr. John Delony:What is she going to make?

1:32:41Ken Coleman:um 20 after taxes it's going to be about 600 a week okay and is does mom where's mom at with

1:32:50Dr. John Delony:the way dad is putting the pressure on you and your brother is mom just this silent who just lets him do whatever i mean what's the deal she um she definitely feels really bad about

1:33:02Ken Coleman:it she she cries to me a lot about it and because she's in a really tough position i know she is

1:33:10Dr. John Delony:and because we have such limited time i'm digging here john what can she do to encourage mom to try

1:33:17Ken Coleman:to step in here i i again i don't know that she can get mom to do anything i agree she can say hey mom i just want to let you know um as i'm moving out here i need to establish my finances is my emergency fund. I need to pay off my debts that I have and I need to establish myself. And so I am not going to continue to give you all money for the next season. And I know that's going to make dad mad. You and I have talked and I know this whole thing has always made you uncomfortable anyway. I just want you to know I'm going to have this conversation with dad when he calls and maybe your mom will say, bless you for having the strength that I wasn't able to exert over the years because I've been in this other pressure cooker, or maybe she'll get mad at you too.

1:33:56Ken Coleman:Who knows? Who knows? But I would have that level of candor and that level of directness and make that as short as possible.

1:34:10Ken Coleman:When people hear my story of paying off debt, they say things like, dang, that must've been so hard. I could never do that.

1:34:17Dr. John Delony:And I tell them, sure you can. It's a short-term sacrifice for a long-term gain. But do you know what's really hard? Working your whole life and never having anything to show for it. Never having the long-term gain. just feeling broke and stressed and maxed all the time.

1:34:32Ken Coleman:And sadly, that's the hard that most people choose. Listen, you're capable of transforming your situation and living a life of freedom, but you need the right tools to do it, like our Every Dollar Budget app. In minutes, it'll build you a step-by-step plan that's tailored to your money situation. And every day, it finds ways you can free up extra money in your budget so you can get rid of your debt and actually build wealth.

1:34:56Dr. John Delony:So make the choice today. Short-term sacrifice, long-term gain. Choose the tool to help you get it done fast. Download the EveryDollar app and start for free today.

1:35:20Dr. John Delony:All right, so we get a lot of questions, a lot of calls where we're inevitably saying, you need more income, right? Yes, every dollar and getting control of your money, knowing where it's going is huge. But most of the time, if you're struggling, it's not just your expenses, it is also your income. And the reality is, is that we've had a very popular article. It's called 14 Best Work-From-Home Jobs You Can Apply For Today. And this is all about increasing your income, right? I need more. I'm in gazelle intensity, and I got to bring some more money in. And again, I'm not going to read this word for word.

1:36:00Dr. John Delony:You can click the link in the show notes to get this, but you're looking at things like virtual assistant is on the list, right? A tutor, customer service, where again, I'm working at home, which means you can wear those sweats, you know? Hey, and you got a laptop, whatever, graphic design, accounting, bookkeeper, teaching, video editing, things of that nature. That's just a few of the list. And again, go to the show notes and get it. This is a very popular article at RamseySolutions.com, 14 best work from home jobs you can apply for today. So the point is, is that where there's a will, there's a way.

1:36:39Dr. John Delony:And we're actually giving you a list of some very specific things to be looking at that don't require a lot of ramp up time, but can provide real money so that you can get out of debt. So go check it out. Link in the show notes. Josh is up next in Jackson, Mississippi. Josh, how can we help?

1:37:00Ken Coleman:Hey, man. I was just wondering. I'm getting married at a month. Congrats. And I'm just, thank you. Super excited about it. Really excited to not have to pay for this wedding anymore. And just basically me and my fiance, we have what y 'all would call bad debt, about$12 ,000 in credit cards. And most of that went towards paying for the wedding, and then we mostly cash floated. I don't have a car note. My fiancée has, I think,$20 ,000 left on her car and completed baby step one so far. Just trying to figure out, A, how to navigate the marriage finances and just overall building something with that.

1:37:54Ken Coleman:And then my fiance wants to move, like we want to move to Alabama and she wants to open a nutrition tea business.

1:38:07Dr. John Delony:A nutrition what?

1:38:09Ken Coleman:Tea, like the fit teas.

1:38:12Dr. John Delony:Okay. Yeah. Okay. I think it's a horrible idea. And let me explain. Not necessarily the business prospect. So I'm having a little bit of fun. I want to do a little misdirection. It's not that her business idea, I don't know anything about fitness tea. Okay. What I am saying is a bad idea is for us to get married and we're going to start a business when we're trying to start a life. I got some red flags. Now, if you can give me some facts as to why it might be a great idea.

1:38:50Ken Coleman:I think it's not a good idea for other reasons, but go ahead. Oh, great. No, add it real quick. Hold on. I want to get John's take.

1:38:57Dr. John Delony:Give me your take on why it's a bad idea.

1:38:59Ken Coleman:Here's why. Brother, you are painting a picture of two people in a month who are about to anchor into concrete together and say, till death does us part. And y 'all are not aligned on how y 'all spend money, how y 'all earn money, the commitment it takes when she's trying to get a business off the ground, how you're going to carry the load at home. This is going to be a 90-10 marriage for a while. And that's awesome in seasons when y 'all are both in on that and how y 'all are going to come out of it. Y 'all have to get your values aligned ASAP.

1:39:33Dr. John Delony:Which is, by the way, what I was saying. You're trying to start a life. and the first year of marriage is the hardest year in my opinion because you're taking two individual lives environments that you're bringing in and john said it way better than me i'm in complete agreement but that's why this is a bad idea not her actual business idea so here's what

1:39:52Ken Coleman:this looks like in in real time brother this is y 'all sitting down and saying as a married couple how do we value work how do we like what are our values around how we're going to spend money How are we going to save money? Is one of y 'all's core values together? We will never be owned by a bank, by a car dealership, by a government entity when it comes to debt. Cool. We're going to anchor into that one. And that's going to decide how quickly y 'all pay off your debts. That's going to decide how small your wedding is relative to how big y 'all actually wanted it to be. It's going to decide, okay, we're going to start this tea business, but we're going to wait three years because we're going to start it with cash.

1:40:33Ken Coleman:We're not going to start it with an SBA loan and put that on top of the car payments, on top of the student loans, top of the credit cards, just as we're getting out of our marriage. You get what I'm saying? Yeah, no, and we had a conversation about that. She has friends that have opened these businesses before, and they all have taken out SBA loans. We kind of had a hard conversation about it. I told her that we would need to, if it was even a possibility, to cash flow that business. There's no point in taking it out.

1:41:09Dr. John Delony:But down the line. So what she needs to hear from you is, I think this is a fun thing, but let's, as we're engaged, and I want John to add to this or edit what I'm about to say, but the way I would approach this, because I am in no way saying that you say to her what I said to you. Okay, I want to be clear. But I do think you have to say, I think we should discuss big things in our marriage that we think are down the line. Let her throw out some things. Kids. Or we want to live part-time in Costa Rica for one year. Whatever these big, fun things are that I think is great for engaged couples to talk through.

1:41:47Dr. John Delony:But if we could get that to that list of that's down the line and try to encourage her that, I don't know that's the best move. We're about ready to get married. We're going to move somewhere else, John. And so I want to set him up for a win here because I don't want her to hear no. I'd rather her hear, I don't think that this is the best time. So not yet.

1:42:09Ken Coleman:Well, and it's just the way you get around it is not get around it, but the way you go right through it is let's talk first principles first. who are we are we going to be a couple that borrows money and that's when you tell her i don't feel safe when i when i owe somebody money and i'm uncomfortable and she might say let me tell you the truth in my house like this may be a shocker for ramsey fans a mortgage keeps i can't sleep if i have if i owe somebody money it drives me insane literally

1:42:40Dr. John Delony:i've tracked my sleep it makes me crazy you sure it's not the gummy bears it's that too okay it But my wife, dude, a mortgage doesn't bother her at all.

1:42:51Ken Coleman:Not even a little bit. But on this issue, it's such a big deal to me that she says, I love him more than I love my little pet project or that I love my little whatever. And so I'm all in with him, but let's make a plan. You get what I'm saying? And she is into gardening. She's got these big, elaborate, amazing gardens. I'm not. I'm not a gardener. but I love the fact that she loves this stuff so much. And so I'm like, Hey, how can we make this thing happen? How can I support you? How can I go build fencing for you? And so that's what I'm talking about. Go to first principles. Who are we going to be when it comes to sex?

1:43:29Ken Coleman:Who is it? Who are we going to be when it comes to money? When we have a discussion, a debate, a disagreement on how many kids we want to have, how, who are we going to be in that disagreement? You get what I'm saying? And that's my fear for you guys is, has she ever run a business before? uh no okay has she ever hired employees no has she ever navigated building leases no okay that is an extraordinary amount of pressure to drop on a brand new marriage

1:43:58Dr. John Delony:that's already underwater financially by the way she needs to go work she needs to go work for somebody that's in that space and get a free education on how to run a business like that

1:44:07Ken Coleman:She has. Okay, well then, take notes. The person who is sponsoring her, you have to get sponsored to this company to do it. Is it AA? I think it's pyramids. Oh, it sounds like a pyramid. Yeah, it kind of does.

1:44:25Dr. John Delony:Yeah, I think we have hopefully given you the why and the how here on how to do this.

1:44:33Ken Coleman:Like Ken said, I want to reiterate what he said because it was very wise. if you go at her and you say we're not doing this business this is dumb boom World War 3 because y 'all are going to be fighting proxy wars and you're not going to deal with the real issues the real issues are you using I statements I feel, I'm scared of I'm uncomfortable with will you join me in this discomfort that's how you move forward not with you statements but with I statements

1:45:09Dr. John Delony:Hey, guys. Dave Ramsey here. Every day on this show, we help people work through real money problems and figure out what to do next. Now, you can get that same kind of help anytime with Ask Ramsey. Ask your money question and get answers built on Ramsey principles we use on the show. Whether you're making a decision or just want something explained, Ask Ramsey is here to help. It's fast, simple, and free to use. Go to RamseySolutions.com and try Ask Ramsey today. That's RamseySolutions.com.

1:46:00Dr. John Delony:all right this is always fun when we get a baby steps millionaire who calls in to share their story and right now we've got amy who's on the line in indianapolis amy congratulations on being a baby step millionaire. Oh, thanks, John and Ken. I appreciate that. Well, let's get the numbers here. What is your net worth? 1.6. 1.6. That's not shabby. Give us the mix. Not too bad.

1:46:26Ken Coleman:I'm like about$900 ,000 in mutual funds, about$100 ,000 in IRA, about$500 ,000 in my house, a couple of cars, and some money in the bank.

1:46:35Dr. John Delony:I love that. Did you use an investment pro to help you on this journey?

1:46:42Ken Coleman:You know, actually, I did not. Well, I kind of did. I had a friend who was really, really good with money, so he kind of guided me. But now that I'm actually there, my house is paid off, I intend to go that route in the future. That's fantastic. Help me build more wealth.

1:46:56Dr. John Delony:Now, I don't normally ask a lady her age, but this is part of the story. So if you'll forgive me, how old are you? You sound 26, but I'm out here right now.

1:47:05Ken Coleman:I'm double nickels.

1:47:08Dr. John Delony:55. I've not heard that one before, but I'm quick. I am quick over here. You are. Okay, 55. All right. And give us a range of your income, the lowest income you've ever made, and then give us the most amount of income.

1:47:24Ken Coleman:The lowest was$12 ,500, and that was 38 years ago, and I doubled that salary the first year on commission. Nice. You can do the math there. And then my top salary is$114. So not bad, but not huge. What do you do? I am a systems trainer for an insurance company.

1:47:41Dr. John Delony:Nice. And have you been in insurance your entire career or is it something you moved into later? Okay. Gotcha. Yeah. 38 years. Did you get a degree, college degree?

1:47:51Ken Coleman:You know, I did get a degree. However, I didn't do it until I was 44.

1:47:55Dr. John Delony:Wow.

1:47:55Ken Coleman:Um, work decided, decided, I decided that I wanted it for me work. So they pay for as long as I maintain a certain GPA. So I did it for me. It did not increase my salary. It didn't change my job. I just did it because I didn't do it when I was younger. And I felt like, not that you have to have a degree, but for me, I didn't do well in high school. And I always thought I was a little not there in the brain. So I thought, you know what? I'm going to just try it for myself just to prove to myself that I can do it. Me. And I did.

1:48:24Dr. John Delony:Amy, you just described how I feel on a regular basis. I say to myself, I don't think I'm there in the brain.

1:48:30Ken Coleman:Yeah. It happens to me on a regular basis. That's why I went to grad school so long. It's because I was trying to prove to my high school self, like, yeah, I'm with you. I'm tracking. I'm proud of you. That's awesome. Good for you. Thank you.

1:48:43Dr. John Delony:Okay. Let's talk about when it clicked for you. when did it click for you that a you should make this pursuit uh and what was the key to getting where you are today two-part question all right part one was i remember this very clearly i was

1:49:02Ken Coleman:29 years old i bought my first house i had that didn't make a lot of money i made enough to buy the house but you know therefore and i thought you know what i am paying all this money on these credit cards and it's dumb. So I said, never, no more. So I created a plan. It really happened to be the Dave Ramsey plan. I just didn't know Dave Ramsey at the time. Right. But I put all my credit cards on a spreadsheet in some other, whatever system I would use Dave Ramsey today. And, you know, they told me pretty much his plan. So I did it, got out of debt and said, never, ever again.

1:49:37Dr. John Delony:Wow. So what is the key to, I imagine there are a lot of young ladies listening to this and maybe they're early in their career, not making a ton of money. What would you say to them if you could have coffee with them to get to where you are today? What do they need to do?

1:49:53Ken Coleman:You got to be smart with your money. For me, it was I had to have goals. I planned them out and I had to stick to them. Discipline. I couldn't buy the shoes. I couldn't buy the comforters. You know, I couldn't buy the things that made you feel better because I looked at the spreadsheet and went, yes. And then when I went to pay my house off, the current house I have now, I put a pad of paper on my refrigerator and I had the balance. And every time I made a payment and an extra payment, I wrote it on there. So every day when I opened my refrigerator, I was like, I'm that much closer.

1:50:24Dr. John Delony:Wow.

1:50:25Ken Coleman:And then I just did it.

1:50:26Dr. John Delony:I love it. And you mentioned car or did I hear you say cars earlier? I have two cars. Tell us about those, you millionaire.

1:50:34Ken Coleman:Yeah, I got a 19 Subaru and a 2007 Chevy Silverado. so nothing fancy Subaru runs on oat milk and granola that's awesome I love it I did buy the Chevy Silverado New that was probably dumb but I did and the Subaru was a company car and when they got rid of my company car I said I kind of like this car so I just paid cash for it

1:50:55Dr. John Delony:yeah 2019 it's a great car

1:50:58Ken Coleman:it's a fantastic car

1:50:59Dr. John Delony:well we really really appreciate you Amy this is it's always fun for us to hear from Baby Steps Millionaires. You've done it. You gave some great advice. So thanks for being with us. Love that. Let's go to Edgar, who's in our backyard of Nashville, Tennessee. Edgar, how can we help?

1:51:19Ken Coleman:Yeah, what's going on, you guys?

1:51:21Dr. John Delony:What's up? How we doing? Just trying to help America, Edgar, and you're up next.

1:51:26Ken Coleman:All right. Well, thank you guys for having me. I was looking to see if you guys have any advice on what I should do right now with my financial situation that I've got going on and everything. All right, set us up. What is it? What's going on? All right, I work as a janitor in elementary school, and I work at a McDonald's as well. I get paid$14 an hour weekly at the elementary school, and I get paid$13 exactly at the McDonald's, but it's biweekly pay. So I make about$1 ,600,$1 ,700 a month. I have$900 left in debt. I took out a payday advance, and I owe$350 on that, and I owe my mom about$550.

1:52:24Ken Coleman:And then I'm trying to know what I should do because I got a really good job offer to boost my annual income from$12 ,000 to$80 ,000 to$100 ,000. Okay, why are we talking about that? Yeah, do that job.

1:52:42Dr. John Delony:What's the status of that?

1:52:45Ken Coleman:I'd be helping people set up money for retirement accounts and investing and everything.

1:52:53Dr. John Delony:No, no, no. I appreciate that. But what is the status of taking that job and starting that job?

1:53:00Ken Coleman:Oh, I have to pay about$400 for the—I have to pay$200 to finish getting my license, and then I have to pay the classes and everything.

1:53:11Dr. John Delony:So I'd be fined in$400.

1:53:13Ken Coleman:Well, is this$80 ,000 to$100 ,000? Is this like, we're going to give you the leads, and if you just close them, is this like a fancy Tupperware sales thing? So there's going to be somebody who promotes it, and then there's going to be me who will take the call, and I'll be like, if you want to put$500 a month in here, I'll set you up for that right now. Oh, okay. All right, hold the plug. Yeah, it feels sketchy to me, bro.

1:53:37Dr. John Delony:I was going to tell you, I thought you were talking about you were going to get into a money management where it's actual real, like a smart investor pro. Yeah. And they kind of seed you your first year or two until you bring in the accounts. What I'm hearing sounds really shady.

1:53:52Ken Coleman:Yeah, it's a marketing thing. Don't do this.

1:53:53Dr. John Delony:Don't do that. So let's talk about how we bring –

1:53:56Ken Coleman:No, no, no, no. You're going to find yourself out a whole bunch of money for this coursework. You're going to keep having to pay courses. You're not going to get the clients that you think you're going to.

1:54:04Dr. John Delony:No one's going to say yes to this because John and I sniffed sketch on this in one sentence when you described the work. So no one's going to buy that from you. We have limited time with you. Number one, you need to be on every dollar and you don't have any money. So I'm going to give you every dollar because you need to begin with just a little bit amount of money you've got. You need to get a budget. Now, the good news is you're almost out of debt. But you need to be working a much better paying job. How old are you?

1:54:32Ken Coleman:I just turned 20 recently.

1:54:34Dr. John Delony:Okay, great news. It's awesome, man. You go work at a big box store, a Home Depot, a Lowe's, a Walmart. Let's go find something that's in that$20 an hour range. Maybe he's got some benefits. I don't care if you're working at a coffee shop that pays well. You've got to get on your feet. The good news is you have very little debt. The bad news is you have no money either, and I'm not sure you know how to manage money. So what I want you to do is hold on the line, and let's get you in every dollar. This is way more than a budgeting app. It's like having John and I in your phone coaching. It's got coaching in there.

1:55:08Dr. John Delony:It's not just getting you started on a budget, which you need to do. And I also want to give you total money makeover so you can see the long-term picture of how the baby steps play out for a young man like you to where you're a multimillionaire.

1:55:21Ken Coleman:And you're not afraid of hard work, which I love. You just got to have the right plan.

1:55:37So

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1:56:35Dr. John Delony:Our scripture of the day is Proverbs 28, 19. whoever works his land will have plenty of bread but he who follows worthless pursuits will have plenty of poverty and our quote of the day from henry ford thinking is the hardest work there is which is probably the reason why so few engage in it by the way i want to point out that that's a great example of back in the day you could insult somebody and they never even knew it and that's that's one of those things right you can see henry ford he was he was throwing some sarcasm out but you read it in today's context and it sounds like this deep quote when what he's really saying is is uh there are a bunch of morons out there because nobody knows how to think but

1:57:20Ken Coleman:now all of our leaders talk like elementary school kids and they're like you're dumb you're dummy and you're right you don't have you don't have elevated right elevated dialogue leads to some

1:57:31Dr. John Delony:benefits and one is insulting somebody right to their face and they have no idea what you've just done it's really fun hey that should that's a bit too that is i like it uh will is up in toronto ontario will how can we help you hi how's it going good what's going on today

1:57:49Ken Coleman:i have a christian values question related to lending money at interest um so personally i have a fair bit of money in private lending i'm lending out and i've um i felt really good about it until recently, actually this morning in particular, I was reading Ezekiel chapter 18, which appears to state that lending out interest, especially to a brother in the faith, is an abomination to God. And there was, yeah, I was just wondering, is there something in this understanding, or should we as Christians not be lending out interest?

1:58:24Dr. John Delony:Read that verse one more time. It's slower so that I can hear. I want to make sure I heard it correctly.

1:58:30Ken Coleman:Sure, there's kind of a group of five verses if you'd like me to read.

1:58:34Dr. John Delony:No, no, no, no, I'm sorry, we don't need a Bible study. I want to make sure I heard what you said. Did you say that there's a scripture verse or multiple times in Ezekiel, it says to lend money to a Christian brother is an abomination. Did I hear that right? Essentially, yeah. Well, if you take the Bible as the literal word of God, and I think you probably do, then you don't need my opinion on it. I think there's not a lot of error in that sentence. If it's an abomination, you know, again, I'm not a theologian, and I'm also not going to ever publicly interpret Scripture. But, you know, Dave quotes Scripture all the time with, the borrower is slave to the lender.

1:59:13Dr. John Delony:You've got a pretty strong statement in Ezekiel about an abomination. So what do you think?

1:59:20Ken Coleman:Well, and see, that's the thing, is I have my opinions, which I can read out. There's some nuances to it. I was more curious if you guys had ever imposed that question before. I've searched up Dave Ramsey in relation to this question. I can't see him saying anything publicly on it. I can't actually see anyone saying anything publicly on it. Well, actually, I would— I just addressed that. Yeah, Dave speaks to it. We all do. And here's the deal. I don't loan money to friends.

1:59:45Dr. John Delony:Yeah, we always tell people never to do it. But you framed it—so I want to go back. You framed it. You said, as a Christian, and you're coming at us with that, and you cited Scripture. Yeah. And so this is one of those situations where you answered your own question, in my opinion. That's what I'm getting at. Like, you said, as a Christian, what should I do? And you said, well, here's what Scripture says. So I think you answered your own question. So your opinion is not what you asked. But, to John's point, we always tell people never lend any money to anybody.

2:00:20Ken Coleman:Yeah, if you want to help your friends out, help them out. If you want to help your family out, help them out.

2:00:26Ken Coleman:Okay. I was wondering, from a Christian values perspective, should a Christian lend money? Let's say he doesn't know the man. Let's say he doesn't know the woman. Whomever it is to whom he's lending.

2:00:42Ken Coleman:And if you guys have never looked into this, that's totally fine. No, no, we have.

2:00:46Dr. John Delony:You don't have us on a technicality. So I'll say this one more time. Scripture says the borrower is slave to the lender. And then Ezekiel's got the Christian context between Christians. But then there's the other thing, which is, should you ever put someone at your service, put them in financial slavery? I think we all know the answer to that. But we also know that I think you think it's okay. And I do know this about humans. They're going to do what they want to do. but you called us and you answered your own question on the first one and john answered your caveat so thanks for listening josh is up next harrisburg is where he is josh how can we

2:01:26Ken Coleman:help hi i just have a question about like a job change kind of situation that i've got going on you called the best guy in america ken coleman to answer that question when i heard him on the show

2:01:38Dr. John Delony:i was like man that's perfect well jeez the pressure right now is unbearable but i'll do what I can. What's going on?

2:01:46Ken Coleman:So I currently work as a mechanic at a local shop. The money's not bad. The people I work for are absolutely fantastic, and it's a guaranteed job.

2:01:55Dr. John Delony:How much money?

2:01:56Ken Coleman:No matter really what my situation. What do you make? They pay me$22 an hour.

2:01:59Dr. John Delony:Okay, $22 an hour, and we like the people. What's the other one?

2:02:03Ken Coleman:So my other one, I have two other options. There is another local shop that is offering$25 an hour, but it would be less hours per week. I currently work 50. They work 40. And then my third one is in the maintenance department of a big corporation where they would start at 22 and then after about three months move to upwards of 27. Okay.

2:02:26Dr. John Delony:Which way are you leaning? And let's, let's, so we're on the same page. One is, number one is where you are 22 an hour and you really like the people. Two is 25 an hour, but less hours. Three is big corporate with more money. Which one are you leaning to before you called?

2:02:45Ken Coleman:The bigger place, just because room for advancement. The second local shop that is offering me this job, I feel like I'd be in the same situation that I am now, where there's not a lot of room for advancement, and I'm going to plateau.

2:02:58Dr. John Delony:Number three with an asterisk is my vote. I want John to weigh in, too. Number three with the asterisk for me is I want to do some homework. I want to see what customer reviews are of this place. And since it's big corporate, they'll be online. I want to ask around who has worked there. Do I know anybody that's ever had their job, I mean, their car serviced there? How do they treat customers? Because how they treat their customers is how they're going to treat the people that work for them. So let's just make sure that it's not this awful environment. And if it's not an awful environment and they treat people with a modicum of respect and they've got a good reputation, Yeah, I'd go 27 an hour with room to grow.

2:03:37Dr. John Delony:That would be for me. I want to bring John in too, though. I have an unhealthy built-in bias, which is I want to add value to a smaller company that I trust.

2:03:52Ken Coleman:Let me put it this way. I have a bias against people running to corporate because it feels safe, especially initially. It also can get very unsafe real fast if Q4 numbers aren't going to make it and they've got to lay off half the department and whatever department they need to pick to make their final number for the year.

2:04:10Dr. John Delony:You can always go back to the local place.

2:04:12Ken Coleman:That's true. That's true.

2:04:13Dr. John Delony:But what's your vote, one, two, or three? I think I know. I think I hear you saying number one, stay.

2:04:18Ken Coleman:My vote is go where you trust the leadership, period.

2:04:22Dr. John Delony:Right.

2:04:22Ken Coleman:And my kind of second question of that is the applications for the starter three-month apprenticeship type deal at the corporate place don't come out for another month or so. And I just got an email from shop number two where it's like, hey, can we call you about this? And I just, I want to know, especially it's not guaranteed. And I have two basically guaranteed options. I'm just not, I want to know exactly what like a wise. Nothing's guaranteed. Nothing is. But let's back out of this for a second. You're desperately scared that you're going to make the wrong choice. I want to flip the whole situation around on you.

2:05:05Ken Coleman:You have three offers and one of those came today. They're knocking on the door to get you. If you pick wrong, you walk into a situation that you feel good about and it sucks. Trust me. Put your name back out on the market and you'll get picked up the following week. You're too talented.

2:05:21Dr. John Delony:You're in a good industry. People need good mechanics. And that's why, again, I appreciate John's point of view, but I want you to have upward mobility. We humans crave progress.

2:05:33Ken Coleman:Yeah.

2:05:34Dr. John Delony:And sometimes we just crave the opportunity for progress. And again, that's why I'm taking the corporate thing. I think it positions you well for something else. And that's the question we don't have time to get to, but I'm going to challenge you with this. Where do you want to be 15, 20 years from now with this mechanical skill? And does the corporate job position you to get there? I think you've got to look at everything, but don't overthink it. You know what I mean? Young guy, I'm going to take the money as long as I'm not treated like a jerk. Hey, remember this, folks. There's ultimately only one way to financial peace, and that's to walk daily with the Prince of Peace, Christ Jesus.

2:06:24Thank you.