Quit Blaming Your Past And Take Control Of Your Money

28:38If you're not in that camp, because I'm not minimizing it, but those of us who don't draw a paycheck from the federal government, it's hard to find evidence that it's been shut down. Yeah. Yeah. True. True. Craig's in San Antonio. Hi, Craig. How are you? I'm doing great. Thanks for taking my call. Sure. How can we help? Well, I have two inherited retirement accounts. I've had them for about two years now. All my research and discussions with the financial institutions that they're with show that I have to withdraw the money in 10 years and that it's basically a taxable event every time. And I'm trying to figure out how to minimize the tax hit on this.

29:23I was hoping there'd be something easy like converting it to an IRA of my own or maybe putting it in my daughter's 529. But as far as I can tell, it's just all taxable the whole way. You have gotten correct information, sir. Okay. The only thing that could have been done is if it was converted to a Roth before the person died. Right. It's a traditional. And it's a traditional. That's why you're under the Biden Secure Act, passed under Joe Biden, and the Secure Act calls for it to be liquidated within 10 years. And so, I mean, you could take out a tenth a year and maybe not have a tax bracket creep.

30:02What's it invested in? It's about two-thirds in a growth fund stock, and the rest of it is in a bond fund and then an S &P 500 fund. How much is in there? About 550. Okay. That's a lot. Well, it's a blessing to get that. It's sad it's all taxable, but it is. And so who left it to you, your dad or mom or somebody? My father, yes. So you're really not paying your taxes. You're paying the taxes that he had never paid yet. Right. That's all it is. So that money's never been taxed because it was put in pre-tax, and it's grown without tax on it until you withdraw it. and you get the benefit of withdrawing it.

30:49So what I would do is run some numbers with your SmartVestor Pro. Go to RamseySolutions.com and click on SmartVestor and find a SmartVestor Pro in your area. Sit down and go, okay, I want to get this into good mutual funds and I want a withdrawal system. Do I need to do it over 10 years or can I just do it all at once and get it over with? What's the difference if I do that? It's probably not a lot, but it is all ordinary income. So it'll just depend on the bracket creep.

31:43Dave, we got a lot of calls on this show where life happens. One day someone's healthy, they're working, providing for their family, and then a curveball hits. You know, we hear it all the time. A car accident, a cancer diagnosis, a heart attack, and suddenly everything changes. Yeah, and that's why you've always said that having term life insurance from Xander is essential because it protects your family if the worst happens. Yeah, that's right. You need 10 to 12 times your income in coverage. No gimmicks, no whole life junk, just straightforward term life protection. But there's another piece that people often overlook, and that's long-term disability insurance.

32:23Yeah, it's important to understand the difference between them. Life insurance steps in when you die. Disability insurance steps in while you're alive but can't work. So it replaces a large part of your income so the bills still get paid while you get back on your feet. Now, if your employer gives you free disability insurance, great, take it. If it's discounted there at a better price, take it. But if not, Xander can help you find the right plan. Whether you're single or married, it's not optional. If you're going to be out of work for a while, then you need to make sure the money's still showing up.

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33:38Our question of the day is brought to you by Y-Refi. If other lenders won't help with defaulted private student loans, Y-Refi might be right for you. They offer fixed-rate solutions that fit real life. Find out more at YRefi.com slash Ramsey. That's the letter Y-R-E-F-Y dot com slash Ramsey. Not available in all states. Today's question comes from Tanner in South Carolina. My wife of seven years and I disagree on how my business should be run. I own a photography and videography company that I've had for 10 years. I've built this business from the ground up, and it's my baby. My wife believes that it's our business now that we are married and that she should be able to make decisions on whether I can book a certain job or not or how I communicate with my customers.

34:25She's also having an opinion on how much I charge my customers and how I process the final product. I'm glad to work with her on a number of jobs that I book, which impacts our time together. But I draw the line on how I run my business day to day. Am I wrong for wanting to run the business I built my way? I'm sorry. I had to get through that without laughing. No, you're not wrong. And it was very hard for me to get through that, Dave. No, you're not wrong. Wanting to run the business you built. Now, obviously, your wife, she has an opinion. I think she's entitled to her opinion. but that doesn't mean that her opinion should sway the way you run the business if you guys didn't enter into this business together again a say on your personal finances and all that 100 but in this situation uh i don't know why i'm laughing i feel bad for you this is a tough situation sounds like she's a handful yeah this is tricky uh really tricky yeah no here's how you can parse it out this will help you there's a lot of really good data and academic teaching on small business one of the fathers or grandfathers of that space is a guy named john ward who wrote a little book called family business in the little book he has a venn diagram with three circles owner family and worker or team member and they overlap the three circles a Venn diagram, a classic Venn diagram, right?

36:00And so someone can be an owner, someone can be a family member, someone can be a team member, and someone can be all three or two of those things. You are all three. She is not. She's one of the owners, and she's a family member, but she is not a team member, okay? Now, here's how that works. In other words, She speaks into the business as a spouse because she doesn't work there, which is not operational control. Now, if you're a wise man from a standpoint of running a business and from a standpoint of being married, you will listen to her counsel and sometimes take it. Proverbs 31 says, who can find a virtuous wife for her worth is far above rubies.

36:56The heart of her husband safely trusts her, and he will have no lack of gain. Sharon Ramsey has some opinions about things that we do at Ramsey, but she does not tell us where to order copier paper, and she does not develop marketing strategy, and she does not enter her discussion into pricing unless I ask her about pricing on, oh, we're getting ready to take the price up on these books because everybody else has. oh yeah well we probably ought to do that but that's my wife speaking into my business it is not a member of the team that is down here working every day speaking into the operations she has gotten confused she has taken more ground than she has been given okay so unless she comes down there and gets on the payroll and becomes the ceo or the coo or something else, at that point she would be all three things, and she would be rightly speaking into the day-to-day operations of the business.

38:01But otherwise, she's just your spouse talking to her spouse and saying, hey, if I were you, here's how I would do it. And I think this is wise. But I think she's gotten confused about her place on this. It's not a woman's place. It's a man's place. Either one. It could be a – roles could be reversed. You should talk to your husband. ladies if you're running a business and get their input on some things but they don't need to come down there and talk about which customers we take or so forth unless you ask them i mean if i'm having a customer that's high maintenance or kind of got a you know problem or something i may discuss that with my wife and she may go well i wouldn't put up with that crap and i go you know what that's kind of what i was thinking i'm not gonna put up with it either okay and uh but but that's different then you're an idiot for running the business the way you've run it for 10 years and i'm going to come in here and show you how to do it although i don't actually work there and i really don't even know what the flip i'm talking about which is the way this chick sounds yeah out of control i wish i knew more i wish this was a phone call what i would be attempting to do is find an area where she's super excited in the business and give her more input there uh maybe some a little bit more control there as long as it's not affecting the day-to-day no i wouldn't well i know you i know you wouldn't i'm saying i try to find it i didn't say i'd absolutely ask her input as my spouse and i want to trust the input of my virtuous wife well therefore i will have no lack of gain but part of being virtuous is not acting this way right but she's given input on everything i know he laid out the entire business she's given input on yeah exactly i mean product design pricing which customers to take what's scheduled to run that's ops control that's a coo that's not spousal control and unless you work there you shouldn't be speaking into that yeah and you shouldn't assume that you're speaking i think a marriage therapist might be in order on this oh yeah i think yeah yeah i think you're probably right about that we won't disagree on that one If you're a business owner or a leader and you've got a question about running a business, including family business, as you can tell, I've got lots of opinions and I'm right.

40:13You can join us on the Entree Leadership podcast that I do where I take calls from small business people about business questions. 844-944-1070 or go to EntreeLeadership.com slash ask and fill out the form. We'll call and make you a caller on the Entree podcast. By the way, that particular question, if that were a real call with both of them, with you, that'd be absolute YouTube gold. It would melt the Internet. Well, I've done plenty of them with family business, I can tell you. I've had some really interesting ones over the years. Jared is in New York City. Hi, Jared. How are you? Hey, how's it going?

40:52Better than I deserve. What's up? So thanks for taking my call. So some last couple weeks have been a little bit of a whirlwind. So my wife is pregnant early on in pregnancy. So super excited about that. 14 weeks along. Where it's been a bit of a whirlwind is they found something that as long as more tests to come, but, you know, God willing, everything else is OK. It's something that when the baby's born may need some surgery. Now we're is expected to need some surgery. Now, nothing more than routine, again, as long as everything else is okay. So I am grappling with that, of course, on the mental side of things.

41:36But yeah, so my wife and I are currently going through baby step two. So there's a financial question on how to plan. I was thinking like setting up a sinking fund for kind of approximations of what it could potentially be while still paying off debt. But, you know, just kind of not sure even where to start. We tell folks when they're having a baby to push pause and don't work on the baby steps and pile up cash. And when baby and mama come home, we pay the bills. And what's left, we push play again and apply it to your debt snowball. So I want you to stop right now and just pile how big a pile of cash can you make?

42:18You can't make it one too big because you're going to put it all on debt if you don't use it on the baby. Right. In just a few, I mean, and now about seven months, right? About. Yeah. A little less. Yeah. And so six months, whatever. I mean, so for six months, we're going to pile cash. Baby and mama come home. We pay whatever bills the insurance does not pay because you've got copay and you've got deductibles to meet, right? Mm-hmm. And then whatever's left after the baby and mommy are home safe and sound, and then you're ready to go. And you just push play again, and you apply it right down through there.

42:55Takes your breath away, Ken. Oh, you'll make it. Kids are expensive. Just deal with it, but you'll make it. I promise. Man, nothing scares you more than a baby. It's the truth.

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44:49welcome back to the ramsey show in the fair winds credit union studio i'm dave ramsey your host ken coleman ramsey personality best-selling author and host of front row seat a big hit on ramsey network he's my co-host today liz is in nashville hi liz how are you hi dave i'm good how are you better than we deserve what's up um i was calling because with me and my husband combined we have a debt of 562 000 um that includes our mortgage but besides the mortgage most of that is his um we're following your baby stuff and we've been following it all year but it doesn't seem like we're getting anywhere and if anything right now we're back at the same amount that we had at the beginning of the year um i i didn't i just don't know what to do i don't i don't know what to do anymore i'm sorry how could you get back into debt i'm when you're getting out of debt i'm confused exactly yeah well we've had situations with our cars come up and then he he loves to use his credit cards for anything that comes up so okay so we're going into credit card debt while we're trying to get out of debt so he's not really trying to get out of debt he's running business as usual and you're trying to get out of debt.

46:09Yeah yeah I mean I have$11 ,000 of that that is mine but even even myself right now I I think I can't seem to get out of it and I'm basically. So you said$562 ,000 how much of that is mortgage? $500 ,000 is mortgage. Okay what's the$62 ,000? um so 11 000 is mine and then there's not a mine you're married the 11 000 on what it's basically just credit cards okay so you have 11 000 on credit cards what else is out there out of the 62 it's all credit cards we only have 62 000 in credit card debt yeah i'm sorry You don't have a car payment? That's true. Just one car payment. We have$1 ,000 left on it.

47:00Okay, you owe$1 ,000 on a car. And what do you owe on your student loans? We have no student loans. I paid off my college. Okay, so you basically have$62 ,000 in credit card,$61 ,000 in credit card debt. And what's your household income? I make$82 ,000 and he makes$80 ,000. Okay, so$162 ,000 with a$500 ,000 mortgage. And how long ago were you zero credit cards debt? Well, I was at zero credit cards last year. He's always had credit cards. How long have you been married? We've been married for five years now. Okay. So when you're married, it's all ours. you understand me okay so you were never at zero because he's always had credit cards because we have had credit cards because you are married to mr credit card yes okay so you've been married five years and we have always had credit card debt uh how much credit card debt did he come into the marriage with?

48:13I think at that point it was around maybe$70 ,000. So it's maintained for about the last five years about the same? Yes. Okay. So in his past he overspent, which is what the credit card came from. But we're just going to – Okay. Okay. So how old are you guys? uh he's 41 and i'm 30 okay all right well i this is not a um a systems problem this is a person problem it's a behavior problem okay so your system of getting out of debt is not going to work until both of you decide you're going to get out of debt he has not decided that And so you have a marriage issue to sit down and talk to your husband and say, I want to get on the same page.

49:09I want us to get out of debt. And you can't tell me you want to get out of debt unless you put all the credit cards on the table and cut them up right now. Yeah, we actually did that this weekend. Two quick questions. Give me quick answers here. How long have you been trying to do the baby steps? since the beginning of this year okay and then do you guys have separate finances i'm guessing you do the way you're talking yeah yes we do and then and then one other one i i forgot does he use the credit card as just all of his expenses and he's under the guise i'm going to pay it off at the end of the month but he never does is that what's going on he's running everything through it he was yeah not anymore okay what how why did he agree to cut them all up last weekend i i think it's because you know he's 41 and i'm just i'm disappointed i mean i just i can't take it anymore you know um i have never had debt and i've even racked up 11 000 okay wait a minute stop a minute okay i get all that but he cut up the credit cards last weekend and then you called me and said he keeps going into credit card debt but it sounds like this guy turned the corner last weekend said i'm getting out of debt i cut them all up i'm confused about what you're upset about i guess because i didn't i thought the number was lower than what it is so that's what you knew that last weekend yeah but i'm at a point where i don't i don't know what to do i can't pay off what we what we owe i Yes, you can.

50:53You make$162 ,000. You only need$62 ,000 to pay all this off. So you live on$100 ,000 and you are debt-free in one year. Voila. It's fairly easy. It's$5 ,000 a month and you are debt-free in one year. The two of you sit down and do a budget together, combine your stinking finances, and get on the same page and go, we're going to put$5 ,000 a month on this debt because you cut up the credit cards and I'm over this. I can't sleep. I'm terrified. I'm done with all this irresponsibility. And you are too. thank you for cutting up the credit cards let's get on this and lock arms and let's attack this thing and be done that's how you do it yeah you make enough money to pay this off in one year easy that's right if you can't live on a hundred thousand dollars in nashville something's wrong with you well i don't i've tried i've tried and it doesn't it just doesn't add up with daycare with everything it just doesn't add up what's your house payment no i know what your house payment is yes you you have not done a budget because the math you're giving me is just not factual okay you don't you can pay daycare and eat and pay your house payment out of a hundred thousand dollars that's eight thousand dollars a month quit your 401k if you're getting a refund reset your w-2s and quit getting a tax refund cash out whatever save money you've got in savings chop up the credit cards and attack this so i there's something uh liz your your hopelessness is not logical unless you believe he's really not going to stop in which case you need to go see a marriage counselor but if he is if he's acting like i'm talking about and he goes yeah we're going to live on beans and rice rice and beans we're going to stop the 401ks we're not going on any vacations we're going to sell so much stuff the kids are afraid they're next.

52:46We're getting extra jobs. We're going to live on a written budget. The two of us are agreeing together. I just cut up the credit cards. Boom. 5 ,000 bucks a month goes on this. That's$60 ,000 a year. That leaves me a hundred thousand to live on. Shut up and do it. That's what it takes right there. You just got to go do this now. And, but you can't, you can't live in the past and be going, well, I get back to any, I don't care what, while we call it matters is the next 12 months game on baby. Super Bowl. Put the ball in the end zone. Let's go.

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55:05Nicole is in New York. Hi, Nicole. How are you? Good, how are you? Better than I deserve. What's up? My fiance and I are trying to plan our honeymoon, and we're trying to figure out how much money we think is appropriate to spend. We're looking for guidance. When are you getting married? Next August. Awesome. Good for you. Yeah, very good. So where are you wanting to go? So we're looking to go to Italy for around 10 or 11 days. Wow, very nice. So what's the budget on that? What's that going to cost? So it's looking like around$25 ,000, but we are open to adjusting things. Oh, wow. Depending on what you say.

55:45Oh, wow. A whole lot of pressure, Dave. Yeah. This is the honeymoon now. This is the honeymoon, and it's Italy. There's a lot of good stuff happening here. Yeah. And my mouth's kind of watering right now, actually, I'm just saying. But all right, so I assume you're going to have$25 ,000 in cash to do this with. You're not going in debt. Yeah, yeah, yeah. And what do you make and what does he make a year? I make around$200 ,000 and he makes around$300 ,000 a year. Okay. Sounds like you can afford it. Yeah. Enjoy yourself, kids. Really? Wow. I mean, do you have like$10 million in debt or something?

56:27We have no debt. No debt? Yeah. How old are you two high-income earners? 29. Wow, you're killing it. Is there some information you're holding back from us? No, we're just very frugal. You must be. Wow. So, I mean, you kind of know if you make a half million dollars a year and you're 29 years old that you can do 25K. You already knew that, right? Well, you never know, but yes. It just seems like sticker shock that you would spend that much. Is that what you're experiencing? it seems like a lot of sticker shock. That's a lot of money. Why don't you pay attention to what you're doing with that$25 ,000?

57:10Because that's a pretty nice honeymoon. It's not like you're staying at the Red Roof Inn in Italy. All right. Well. I mean, this is a nice experience, yes? Yes. It's going to be awesome. All right, then. I mean, savor this. This is your honeymoon. You're right. You're right. You guys are right. Here's how Sharon and I know we're overspending. We look at two things. One is what percentage of our world is this amount of money, meaning our net worth, our income. Okay. And this is a small percentage of your income. Yeah. If you took$25 ,000 and threw it out the window and watch the people on the street below run around like crazy, it would not ruin your life.

57:58Yeah. And so spending it on something much more fun than that, it was not going to ruin your life. So if you told me you make$50 ,000 a year and you're going to spend$25 ,000, now we're going to have a long discussion about how dumb that is. Right? Even though it's a wonderful trip, you can't afford it. It doesn't make sense. But you have another zero on that decimal, so you're in good shape. the second thing we measure against is we're always if we give pause this gave you pause it made you stop and think it was like a speed bump it slowed you down anytime that happens I that means I need to slow down and check my generosity factor and my is my generosity still really high yeah and am I doing a good job with helping others with the money God has blessed me with And if so, then this is a very minor amount of money, and you pass both of those tests, you should go to Italy.

58:56I'll give you another possibility. They haven't been making this kind of money that long. It's new to them. And so it takes a little while to build the emotional muscle to spend more money on something. She said that they're both very frugal, and I'm looking at Rachel's book over there, Know Yourself, Know Your Money, And she brilliantly lays out money styles and what affects that. So without doing too much digging, we know that they come from a background where maybe they didn't come from a lot of money and they've been successful. Maybe there's some scarcity going on. But all good reasons in this case because they're very, very frugal and they're going, hey, is this crazy?

59:35Yeah, but what it also underscores is an emotional maturity because there's zero entitlement. Correct. We did not have Bradzilla on the phone going, I want to go to Italy. It was none of that, right? There was none of that Bradzilla stuff. This is more like, I've dreamed of this my whole life. Oh, well, shut up, Barbie. You know, seriously. How about you have the money before being grown and be a grown up? But this lady here, she's an incredible grown up. Yeah, absolutely. I mean, there's no entitlement. None of that. It was the opposite of that. Yep. Very concerned and thoughtful and careful and wise and all of that.

1:00:12Very well done, kiddo. Proud of you. Enjoy it. Tim is in New York. Hi, Tim. How are you? Hey, Dave. Good. How are you? Better than I deserve. How can I help? So I have a question. My brother and I own a home together. We have a very good interest rate, and we have a very cheap mortgage. I'm going to be looking to move out and buy another home with my girlfriend sometime next year. Don't do that. Basically wondering. Okay. No, please don't buy a house with somebody you're not married to. Okay. You're going to get yourself up a creek, bud. Seriously. If you ever want to buy a house with her, you need to marry her first.

1:00:52Okay, fair enough. Yeah, because here's the thing. Something happens, you're now in partnership with her mother. Sure Yeah Or she just decides she's going to take off and you can't find her and you get to pay the payments. And you can't sell it because you can't find your partner. And in this case, it is a literal partner, not a relational partner. So, yeah, no, please don't buy a house. Now, if you want to buy a house and she lives with you, that's your decision on how you have a roommate. But the legal and financial entanglements when people shack up and start buying stuff together and sharing too much stuff, you really get all twisted up, and it's very, very, very difficult to undo.

1:01:40It's difficult enough when you use divorce to do it, but, man, we've taken some wicked, ugly situations on this show of people who bought a house or bought a car with their shacked-up boyfriend or girlfriend, and then they can't find them, or they die, and now I'm partners with my, well, she's not my mother, in law because she never was in law but i don't know who this chick is it's my girlfriend's mother oh my god this is a really nightmarish scenario and we run into that kind of stuff all the time tim and it's just we see all the times it didn't work which is like most of the time yeah you just don't want to end up in a real life jerry springer episode you know nobody's gonna bail you out that makes for great tv it's not fun to live through entertaining call on the ramsey show but you don't want to be one of those you don't be one of the wise people who said no i'm not gonna do that and We're getting those calls, I feel like, consistently over the last six months where they're not married and they're trying to untangle it.

1:02:39It's a nightmare. And, well, I mean, you can't find them or they don't talk to you. And, you know, how do you get out of this? You have to sue in court to disband a general partnership with no partnership documents. And it's very, very expensive to get the circuit court to give you relief and force the sale of this. and force the other party to come in and sign the deed. Oh, my gosh, it's a mess. And by the way, I'll tee you up on this one, too, because I'm seeing this is happening. We're seeing data where more and more young people, because they're reading too many headlines, too many TikToks, that they'll never be able to afford a home.

1:03:19Now we're talking platonic relationships. Three or four women or three or four dudes will go in and buy a house, split it three ways, and think that they're getting ahead. And that's as goofy as I've ever seen. And that's happening on a regular basis now. Yeah, anything with two to four heads is a monster. Yeah. Yeah, this is a bad plan. Any ship that won't sail is a partnership. So all of these things come into play, right? So no, we don't do that. You buy houses with people you're married to, that's it. In your case, you did it with your brother. You're all probably going to get out of that one alive, it sounds like, Tim.

1:03:53So that's good. But, yeah, I would not purchase. I would rent if you're going to live together. And I don't recommend doing either of those. But if you're going to do it from a financial and legal entanglement standpoint, and then after you're married, decide what to buy. And so let's keep these things in the right order, the right forced ranking.

1:04:29Thank you.

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1:06:21In the lobby of Ramsey Solutions on the debt-free stage, Matthew and Ann are with us. Hey guys, how are you? Good, and you? Better than I deserve. Welcome. Where do y 'all live? We're actually from Knoxville, Tennessee. Very cool. Well, welcome to Nashville. And how much debt have you two paid off? We paid off$350 ,000. Wow. And how long did that take? It took us eight years. Good for you. And your range of income during that eight years? We went from about$52 ,000 to about$92 ,000. Very good. What do y 'all do for a living? So I started out as a teacher for about 13 years and have moved into construction.

1:06:56Mm-hmm. and i just went back to teaching fourth grade oh fun good for you well done you guys so 350 over eight years i'm guessing you guys paid off your house yes sir look at that some weirdos way to go guys no house payment wow what's the house worth the house is worth i think about 420 or 450 very good and how much have you guys built in your retirement mistakes we have about 200 000 i believe Awesome. So you're on your way to Baby Steps Millionaires, and you're not that old. How old are you? We're actually both 35 years old. Oh, wow. Wow. So you're going to be millionaires by the time you're 40 and have a paid-for house by the time you're 35.

1:07:37Y 'all are weird. Yes. I love it. I'm so proud of you. Way to go, guys. Way to go. All right. So you've got to tell us what made you decide to take on the debt plus get rid of the house. A lot of it was when we got married, we went to a financial peace university with our church. And after that, we were just determined we need to pay off our house as soon as we can. Very cool. What church do you go to? We're at Calvary Knoxville now. Yeah, good. Originally from California, but now here in Tennessee. Okay. So you got married in California. Yes, sir. Okay. So what church was that that you took the class?

1:08:13We took that. It was Clovis EB Free. Ah, okay. Cool. Very cool. Well, way to go, guys. I love it. So how long have you been married? We've been married for seven years. No. Eight years. Eight years. Eight years. Okay. So from the time you got married, you were just game on. It was for sure. I mean, for her, it was just having that peace of mind. And for me, I got to kind of start nerding out on spreadsheets. I like it. I like it. Way to go. Very cool. What was the hardest part of this journey for you guys? Was there a struggle and how did you get through it? Honestly, I think for us, we've always had that goal of, okay, the house is going to come.

1:08:49And so we were just blessed moving across the state that I could say across the country. And just kind of the focus was the house. I mean, I think the first time never really got bonuses as a teacher. So when the bonus came from the new work that I'm at, I was like, oh, I can go buy something. Instead, it's like, OK, no, we've got to keep the goal in mind and instead just pay off the house. And then from there, we can actually have a lot more fun. Yeah. Yeah. Because you can do anything you want now. Yep. I mean, you're sitting here making ninety two grand and killing it and no payments in the world.

1:09:18How does it feel to not have a house payment? I don't know if it's fully hit yet. I mean, we paid it off last month, and so the first item in the budget item is with every dollar. It still says that mortgage on there, so I'm just excited to delete that line. And then from there, just kind of see how what we were paying for the house is actually going stuff like to our kids' colleges or just even having a little bit more fun. Yeah, absolutely. So what's the first big thing you're going to do to celebrate? First big thing is upgrading my wife's car. It's a little old, and she needs to be driving style.

1:09:45Good, good. I like this man. Good plan. Good plan. So what are you going to buy her? What are you guys going to buy her? Not that you buy her, but yeah. Sorry. She wants a Toyota RAV4. Oh, perfect. Okay. That'll be great. Okay. And what's the hoopty you're getting rid of, the old one? A 2010 Toyota Camry. It only has about 170 ,000 miles. Oh, we have squeezed the juice out of that puppy. Well, for a Camry, that's only a third of its life. It's got a lot more left. You can't get rid of them. They just keep going. and going and going way to go you guys i'm so proud of you who was bragging on you who was cheering you on oh fans families we actually have some friends here that i got to because they're in the nashville area got to come out and just celebrate with us today oh that's fun very good anybody tell you you were crazy while you're doing this oh i hear it all the time because we actually pay we had to pay off we had to buy another car from me to get around town and when we told everybody we paid for cash they're like why i mean just can buy what do you want and i'll go buy something nicer and it's like no this gets me what i need to do and we had our goals and we wanted just to kind of continue to live free now and the goal is i don't have a stinking payment hello yes man that's sweet sweet you can do anything you want to do man i'm proud of y 'all you're gonna have so much money it's gonna be ridiculous you're are you the first ones in your families to be that be like this i don't know for sure i think i mean my parents and her parents are but i don't know compared to the siblings that i don't necessarily for sure know I know credit cards were probably weird in that sense that we don't have credit cards.

1:11:17Right. Okay, cool, cool. One of the things I want to ask, because I've coached a lot of teachers over the years who wanted to get out and they didn't think they could because they hadn't done anything else. Just real briefly, I think it would be helpful to some people. How did you make the transition from teaching to construction? I think, honestly, it's your proximity process. I mean, teaching is definitely a calling. and I felt for a long time that that calling was teaching until I was like, okay, God laid something on my heart. And I just had a buddy of mine say, hey, this fits what you're looking for.

1:11:48This is just kind of the criteria because I'm a math teacher and a lot of what I do now is data analysis and said, hey, take a look at this. And we just trusted God and made the leap. Wow. So the transferable skill here was math teacher, move over into analytics and the data side of construction. Correct. And it's kind of nice not to be just teaching the same thing over every day, every year, so it makes it even more fun. Yeah, absolutely. Good for you. Absolutely. And you brought the kiddos to celebrate with you? Yes. We did. All right, bring them up. Let's see their names and ages. We have Miss Nola Bell.

1:12:20She's six. All right, she's beautiful. And then Nash was just three. All right, big Nash, here we go. Those babies don't even understand how much their parents have completely changed their family tree. You guys are incredible. We're so proud of you. Very, very well done. All right, Matthew and Ann, Nola and Nash, Knoxville, Tennessee,$350 ,000 paid off in eight years, making 52 to 92. Count it down. Let's hear a debt-free scream. Ready? Three, two, one. We're debt-free. Yeah.

1:13:03I love it. I love it. I love it. I love it. Well done, you guys. Very well done. Well, Ken, we do know from the largest study of millionaires ever done by Ramsey Research that's in the white papers in the back of the Baby Steps Millionaires bestselling book that the number one career choice of millionaires is engineer, number two is accountant, number three is teacher. Yes. And so we hear all the time from people that don't believe that. But, you know, when you use data, we don't care if you believe it or not. I mean, if you don't believe in the law of gravity, try jumping off a building. You'll find the sidewalk.

1:13:45I mean, facts are facts, and that's a fact. And what we've discovered is that teachers are process-driven, particularly a math teacher that does data analysis are process-driven, and they were both dialed in. And for eight years, they've made the steps, walked carefully, and paid off the house and had a life while they were paying off their house. Exactly right. The American dream is alive and well, young couples. Listen, watch the story. They started on it the minute they got married. So they didn't accumulate other debt. They just came right into this thing, and they said, we're going to do this.

1:14:19And they walked it out. Now they're very young. And, man, you want to talk about prosperity. it really is now in their future and this is mr spreadsheet over here has already run the numbers on his compound interest is going to be he's already he's already sitting on six or seven hundred thousand net worth at 35 and so that puts him in the tens of millions in his retirement years in net worth and so he's going to be in such they're going to be in such great shape they've done such a good job and um you know mama's over driving a hoopty camry yeah we got to get her upgraded to a better Toyota there.

1:14:55And so very good. Yeah. Very good. But worth every second of the sacrifices. They just steady as she goes, and they were just monotonous about it. And now they're going to live like nobody else. And that's how this works. So really fun. If every young couple would take this model, Dave, instead of getting more and more debt and trying to keep up with everybody else and live the life their parents lived, this is the way. Yeah. You need to take Instagram and put a bullet in it. It's difficult to keep up with other people's highlight reels. Yeah. If you're trying to keep up with other people, you're not going to win.

1:15:32Yeah. It's pretty simple.

1:15:51Thank you.

1:16:29Ann is with us in Minneapolis. Hi, Ann. How are you? Better than I deserve. How are you? Just the same. How can I help? So my husband and I have been married eight years, and we just had our first baby in December. We're on baby step four. We have no debt other than our mortgage, and we have a good emergency fund saved up. We both work salaried jobs right now. I make more than my husband in my field, so my salary is$135K with a 20 % annual bonus and significant career growth potential to climb the ladder. But my husband's is around$100K, and we've found there's more of a salary ceiling with his CPA career.

1:17:12It's going to be difficult for him to significantly increase salary over the next five years. You said he's a CPA? He is a CPA, yes. And he only makes$100 ,000? Yeah. And he has a career cap? Why does he have a career cap? He's under market already. He is, but that's after job hopping, like three jobs in the last five years. It's hard to find, maybe it's just Minnesota, but at CPA firms, anything more than$100 ,000 is what we've found.

1:17:47Well, I was waiting on you. Here's what I would say. That's because you're looking at one pool, and that's your traditional CPA firms. But with his skill set plus his experience as a CPA, he has all kinds of upward mobility in the corporate world because of that actual skill set and experience. But if he's locked in on these firms in a certain type of work that he's doing and have a little bit of an idea of what you're talking about, then he is cap. He's still underpaid. Yeah. But the point is, is he's not limited for his growth. We're talking about a lot of C-suiters in the United States that came through the CPA ranks.

1:18:26Yeah. Yeah. But what's your question? You've kind of given us the financial picture and what you think the professional outlook is. Yeah. So we recognize that we both can't continue to work full time because our daughter isn't in daycare. And right now I juggle full time work remote with her at home. But that won't last forever as she takes less naps and is up more during the day. And I really want to be a present mom. So right now, benefits are the most challenging for us because my husband's work at a small firm has a very expensive health insurance plan with a limited network. And I get really good benefits because I'm in the med tech industry.

1:19:04So good insurance is important. I have chronic health issues. We need to support ongoing care and medications. So basically, I don't want to work forever and I want to be able to be a stay at home mom. But we feel like financially and health insurance wise, it may make the most sense for me to work and my husband to go down to part time. At least we can until we can get through having another baby and I can get benefits and maternity leave for my second pregnancy. but my fear is that if I continue to work, it's going to turn into more of a long-term thing because my career will continue to grow and it'll probably never make financial sense for me to stop working because I can just make a lot more money.

1:19:40So we're also conservative Christians and there's the factor that the man is supposed to be head of the household, which typically looks like the stereotype of the wife as a full-time stay-at-home mom and the husband's the provider. So how do we balance the need for benefits and the higher financial value with our long-term strategy wanting me to be at home with our kids, and what would you recommend? You work on his career. Yeah. Because his career path sucks. Yeah. So what if he's not very motivated? I think he'd be motivated after listening to you. Yeah, I mean, I'm ready to go. I think he could go.

1:20:16Yeah, I mean, you got this dialed in. You know exactly what you want and how to get there. I will tell you, I have taken this call a lot from ladies, And I've talked to a lot of men who cite motivation as a factor. And I can tell you this. He doesn't lack motivation. He lacks clarity. I don't think this is a lazy guy. No, no, no. He's not. Right. So what you're seeing as it looks like he's not motivated, it presents that way. But what's going on is he doesn't know what his options are. He doesn't see clarity in the future. meaning I'd like to go here and I know how to get there. In other words, I know what mountain I want to climb and I know what I have to do to learn how to climb it.

1:21:00That's what he's lacking. And I can tell you that if you solve that and help him solve it, then you can do what Dave is saying and he begins to see a path forward because you have to honor this desire to be a stay-at-home mom. You don't have to do it right away, but we've got a clear path to doing that. You told us what you want. That's it. You want to be there. but you've got to make it make sense. And the way it makes sense is if he gets in a career path that has good quality insurance because you've got chronic health care and obviously will cover maternity for a second baby and those kinds of things.

1:21:35And he has some upward mobility, upward trajectory with his income and a ladder to climb and be about the business of climbing it. So hang on the line. Here's what I want to do. This is my gift and this will help. I'm going to give him the book, Find the Work You're Wired to Do. It has an assessment in it. It's called the Get Clear Career Assessment. Have him take it, and it's going to spit out a lot of great, easy-to-understand information. I won't unpack it here on the call. But that's going to help him with where he can go and how he can get there. He reads the book after he takes the assessment, and I'll walk him step-by-step what to do.

1:22:11That's going to really, really help. I'm also going to give him a copy of my book, The Proximity Principle, which is his next step of homework, where he begins to get out there and connect with people in the places that he wants to end up professionally. And if that happens, just like the baby steps, he will find something and you guys will be able to make this plan for your life happen. But it's not by osmosis. It is through intentionality and it can be done. Yeah, and so... He should be in the 250, 300 range soon. Yeah, yeah. Your analysis is based on the current set of facts and the third option is create a new set of facts.

1:22:56Charity is in Tulsa, Oklahoma. Hi, Charity. How are you? Good. How are you, Dave? Better than I deserve. What's up? So my car broke down in traffic yesterday. It turns out it needs about$5 ,700 worth of work. Who said? Say that again? Who told you that? The mechanic shop. At the dealership? Not at the dealership. It was just a mechanic shop that we went to. Okay. What's wrong with the car?

1:23:29I think they said the rack and pinion, the control arm bushing. Basically, a lot of the front end needs a lot of work. A rack and pinion does not collapse in traffic. no i thought it was they did say the steering pump was part of it as well um so it got to a point where i was trying to uh turn it got really hard to turn okay that that that your your power steering went out okay that causes collapse in traffic and then they found everything else they could find wrong with the car there's been wrong with the car for the last year and a half and added it onto the ticket correct yeah so bull crap um so it is about a 10 year old car it's completely paid off um it's had some class action lawsuit things again put a steering pump on it steering pump it's not 5700 okay so that's kind of what i was interested in was just um you know The car, when it's running, it's worth$2 ,000 to$3 ,000.

1:24:34And, I mean, we're on baby step three. I mean, we have an emergency fund. Our goal is$20 ,000. We have$13 ,000 in our emergency fund so far. What's your household income? About$105 ,000. Okay. As soon as you get your emergency fund done, I want you to start working on saving up for a car and move up in car because this car is a piece of crap. I agree with you. Yes. But right now, you don't have the money to replace it, do you? Well, let me add that we do have$7 ,000 in a brokerage non-retirement account. Why is that not in your emergency fund? Well, that's what we were going to call and ask is should that be...

1:25:15Should already have been in your emergency fund. Now, if that's in your emergency fund, how much is in the emergency fund? $13K. Okay. And your goal is what? Our goal is$20K. We haven't had a lot of margin in our budget just due to plumbing and household maintenance things. And power steering pumps going out. Okay. Yeah. Yeah, I'm going to move the brokerage into your emergency fund, finish your emergency fund. I'm going to upgrade the car. In the meantime, you've got to fix the power steering pump because you've got to get the thing operating. But you don't spend$5 ,700 on a$2 ,000 car. That's a mechanic that you don't need to do business with that even suggested that.

1:25:54That's asinine.

1:26:15Many of you listen to The Ramsey Show because you're sick and tired of getting nowhere with your money. You work too hard to live paycheck to paycheck with no money in the bank. But here's the deal. Just listening to the show won't change that. If you want different results, you have to do something different. We've helped millions of people save money, ditch debt, and build wealth. And you can too. But you've got to have a game plan, and that begins with our Get Started Assessment. Go to RamseySolutions.com slash start now, take the free quiz, and get your free step-by-step action plan. If you've had it with money stress and are ready to take control of your money for good, go to RamseySolutions.com slash start now.

1:27:20Welcome back to the Ramsey Show in the Fairwinds Credit Union Studios. I'm Dave Ramsey. Ken Coleman, Ramsey personality, number one bestselling author and host of Front Row Seat, is my co-host today. Open phones at 888-825-5225. Rob is in Los Angeles. Hey, Rob, how are you? I'm doing great, Dave. How are you guys? Better than I deserve. What's up? That's awesome. I am 48 years old, married with two kids, and unfortunately have been diagnosed with stage 4 cancer. I've been fighting the disease for a couple of years now, and through that fight I exhausted my 401k, and basically my family has been surviving off of my disability income of$2 ,800 a month.

1:28:16We don't have any assets on a house or anything like that. And on Sunday, Dave, I had a miracle happen. I won$100 ,000 on an NFL fantasy football contest. And I am freaking out and have no idea what to do because I'm sick. So all the traditional steps that one would take to improve their lives, I just had a loss for words. Wow. I'm wondering what you would do.

1:29:00Well, I've never been there, so I'm not positive. What a challenging situation. I think the first thing that popped into my head is don't lose it all trying to replicate it. Okay. In other words, don't put$100 ,000 back into sports betting. I know that. You probably got your one miracle. I don't think I'd stretch God on this, okay? Yeah. So, yeah, I mean, because that temptation's got to be there a little bit. like, hey, now I've got this thing figured out. No, you don't. Like you said, you called it a miracle. It's luck. It's whatever. And it's a provision for your family. But for God's sakes, don't use it to create more betting.

1:29:52Okay? Is that fair? Yes. Yes, absolutely. That's the first thing that pops into my mind. And I don't know that, I mean, 100 ,000 is a lot more than you had, and it's a good thing. it's certainly not enough to sustain a family of three, a wife and two kids, if you're in heaven, right? Correct. So it does help, though. It's wonderful. I'm glad you got it. So how do we make that work? You guys have got your household budget currently set up on the disability? You're living on 28? It's difficult. Oh, I would imagine. A gig job. So she's, you know, if she brings in$100 a day, we're lucky. So basically we're allowing Peter to pay Paul.

1:30:43What's her job? What is her job? She delivers groceries, a gig app, you know, like a DoorDash type thing. Where is her family and your family? um i i just have uh my dad is throwing one left and her family is all here with us so she has that support when something does happen to me okay uh i've never heard you at a loss for words well i i'm trying to think of um i'm gonna speak plainly Okay. Can I have permission to do that? Absolutely. What's she going to do for a living to raise two children when you're gone? I've tried to have that conversation with her.

1:31:38It never turned out how I like. I don't think she knows. Yeah. And I think she is putting it off. Well, and she's afraid if she says it out loud that it's going to happen. Yes. I mean, I understand. We all process this thing differently.

1:32:03So, yeah, what I would use the$100 ,000 for is to cause her to get trained or certified in whatever it is she's going to do to raise these two kids, assuming your doctors are correct yeah there they are okay you see what i'm saying so i mean if you spent twenty five thousand dollars and she got a certification in x y or z that allowed her to make seventy or eighty thousand dollars a year to be a widowed mom of two that's the that's an incredibly good use of that money as far as i'm concerned yeah i but i don't hear dave say that she's got to go to college. We're not saying that. We're saying we're going to find something very practical, does not take very long to get qualified.

1:32:50It does not cost a ton, but it allows her to make a very decent living to be able to take care of her and the kiddos. Yeah. I'm okay. Let me give you another example. I would include college as a possibility. If it, yes. Yeah. So like, for instance, has she got a four-year degree um no and and we're 50 so i telling her to go back to college i don't think that she okay i don't want to tell her to do anything i want her to be able to have enough income to feed her kids and live that's all i wanted to do but the uh um for her sake i'm trying to help her what puts you on the spot because you know her better than us and we we can't talk to her what should she what would you have her do knowing her the way you know her

1:33:37I would have her get something like a hairdressing license or something like that to where she could maybe start something on her own or go rent a chair, but at least she would make more than minimum wage with something like that. Of course, yeah. You need to make more than minimum wage in L.A. Is she intrigued by that, ever talked about that kind of work? um when we first got together i i'd actually offered to do that and you know we were so young that she didn't take me up on my offer and you know yeah well again i think dave's right i would set that aside with her and say hey here are a couple options let her do some research you got to force this conversation and then say all right we're going to put some money aside that would more than take care of the qualification process for you.

1:34:26But if she took$30 ,000 or$40 ,000 to live on and spent$60 ,000 during one year to get this thing that allows her to make$70 ,000 or$80 ,000 or whatever the rest of her life, that's providing for her and for the kids. And I can't think of anything that's going to be a better investment that's going to that's going to even come close to that kind of a return other than education certification that allows an income to be created, right? Yeah. Yeah. I think that's your provision to me is to set up a sustainable provision. And, uh, it's hard to talk about cause it's, you know, you don't, it's, it's, um, man, it's painful.

1:35:15Uh, what y 'all are going through is horrible. I'm so sorry. But but not talking about it's probably not a plan. And so her not addressing the issue is not going to make you get well. You're going to get well, independent of whether she addresses the issue. I'm not ill, but we plan my death every year in detail. If something happens to Dave this year, how does the remaining parties survive? And we go into it in detail. And that's an act of love. and that's it.

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1:36:48Investing may seem complicated or confusing, but it doesn't have to be. The Ramsey Investing and Retirement Hub is packed with interactive tools, resources that can help you get informed and not intimidated. Check it out at RamseySolutions.com slash retire, or click the link in the description if you're listening on YouTube or podcast. Umberto is with us in Oklahoma City. Hey, Umberto, what's up? so i am finishing up nursing anesthesia school in about nine months um unfortunately haven't been able to work the last two and a half years did you say you're finishing nurse anesthetist school yes sir very good that's in school okay great um so i'm going to have a lot of loans about up to like 275 000 coming out wow but you ought to be making 300 right yeah 250 300 yeah Yeah.

1:37:40Okay. And you used to make what? What are you making now? Nothing? Nothing now. I was making about$100K as a nurse, just working a lot of overtime. Okay. So what are you going to do? Live on nothing and pay it off in two years? That's some of my plan, but also planning to get engaged, get married. That doesn't cost much. Um, no, it doesn't. It really doesn't. Um, but wanting to do, I mean, not the most extravagant wedding I can afford, of course, but at least something that's nice. Um, I'm just curious on, um, if it would, if the best thing to do is just to live off nothing and peanuts and just pay off as much as I can, as fast as I can.

1:38:29Yeah, absolutely. Okay. I talked to my financial advisor as well, and he didn't make it seem that way that I should pay it off as soon as I can. Then get a new financial advisor. Gotcha. And yet you called Dave because even you didn't think that sounded right. Yeah, well, I had a buddy who just kept, what's it called, hammering me about it. And I was like, well, I'll just call and see what I can learn. Oh, so you got a really good friend. So your friend's better than your financial advisor. Yeah, that's good. So here's the thing, dude. The highest – you have engaged in a ridiculous amount of debt and have gotten an awesome degree and career choice.

1:39:13Okay? So, so far it's worked out. But there's – other than NFL players, there's nobody dumber with money than doctors. They're perpetually stupid with money. Don't be a stupid doctor with money, okay? You're making serious doctor money. Use it to straighten up the mess that you've made and go become wealthy. If you keep the student rolling around like you think it's a pet so your financial advisor can get you to start investing so he can start getting commissions because you didn't fire him, then that's just straight up dumb. Man, can you know how much money you're going to have if you have no debt and$300 ,000 income and learn to live on less than that?

1:39:54You're going to be a multi-bazillionaire. but not if you screw around with this you'll just be another doctor my whole life i've just kind of been always like keep the minimum and just uh and just make as much as i can and save up as much as i can yeah that way i can do whatever i want beans and rice rice and beans yeah hey set a five 25 grand i don't care for for a wedding i don't mind what does she make she's actually finishing school too in what uh nurse anesthesia oh okay guess where we met okay and um yeah and so she's gonna be making the same kind of does she got the same mess yeah she'll have the same mess oh geez so we're gonna have a six hundred thousand dollar income and five hundred thousand dollars worth of loans right yep okay so live like you make a hundred grand and get yourself a$25 ,000 wedding and you guys tear the hair.

1:40:58Please just go to the Ramsey Solutions website and put in what will happen after you're done with all this and you make$600 ,000 and you put$200 ,000 in investments a year. How fast you will be worth$20 million will blow your freaking mind. But go ahead and be done with this in like a year and a half. Yeah, that sounds amazing. Yeah, sit on a beanbag. Don't eat out. Tell your broke friends who have all these opinions, not the good friend. We have established you have one good friend. Fire your financial advisor. Live on beans and rice, rice and beans, and be completely free in making$600 ,000 two years from now.

1:41:41Dude, you're going to have so much. You're going to be able to do anything you want to do. But if you screw around and keep this around, I'm going to pay it off on a 10-year plan. And I'm going to kill you because you will have wasted so much money. You understand? Yeah. Dude, you got – this is amazing where you can be. But please, God, the number of times I've talked to people in your world that are 10 years later and they're still looking at those student loans like they're a pet. They're keeping them around. Well, I think we need to feed it a little bit just to keep it alive. Oh, my God. It's just your – no, please, please, please.

1:42:20The great news is you've got an incredible income potential. The horrible news is you've got to dig out of a mess before you get to have the benefit of it. No new beamers. No new houses. No new, new, new, new, new, new, nothing. Nothing, honey. Clean up the mess. And, dude, they're going to have so much money, Ken. I get so excited. Oh, I was going to say, I don't think you were passionate enough with that. I think you should have been a little clearer about what you mean. Sometimes you're a little fuzzy, Dave, with these collars. Also, I do like the carrying on of the rice and beans into the bean bag.

1:42:58I also like that touch. Oh, that's a good handoff there. I thought that was nice. I like that. You don't need a bunch of furniture. Just get you. You know, you're one of the few around here that's old enough to actually remember what a bean bag chair is. I do. And I still have a couple. We got both. No, you don't. True story. They're called, it's actually got a corduroy cover on it, but it is a bean bag for both my boys. And I love them. I'll sit on them sometimes and watch football. Very comfortable. And then you admitted it. Yeah. What would have been worse if I said I had a water bed? You remember those?

1:43:29We've got a whole generation that has no idea there was actually a water bed. There was actually a bed and you put water in it. You, like, floated around. It was so obnoxious. Glad those went away on the ash heap of history.

1:43:44Yeah. Yeah. So, hey, man, you just, Humberto, you got such a, your future's so bright, you got to wear shades, man. I mean, seriously, it's incredible. But you really knew you needed to decide to do this the right way, and that's super fast. Well, you're addressing something that isn't just the medical community. You got people who come out of school, good degrees, and they're going to get good jobs because of said degrees. And they've been living on nothing, and now they're going to make a really nice salary. And Dave, the temptation, you know, is so strong to live on some of that money as opposed to not live on it.

1:44:19That's the challenge. Number one mistake. 22-year-old just graduated from college, gets the new job, the big girl job, the big boy job. Number one mistake they make. New car. Yep. Because they've been driving their high school hoopty all the way through college. and uh i i'm now i'm i'm now i've got a license and a letter after my name and now i need to spend some money that i don't have and go buy a car i can't afford and uh yeah so it's like they exhale and it sounds like bmw yeah exactly right yeah three more letters to add to all those fancy degrees yeah it's true it's exactly right so yeah don't don't do that get your mess cleaned up before you start buying cars and houses and uh then you can you can have the life you want i mean it's incredible what you'll be able to do absolutely incredible so very cool stuff guys very cool and on behalf of all patients in in the world we would like to have not stressed out doctors and nurse anesthetists taking care of us you're so stressed out because of your bills you know we don't need you stressed out it's already a tough job you know i have personally witnessed a couple of epidurals and i do not want those being done by a stressed out person great point yikes get that away from me yeah

1:45:59Thank you.

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1:47:40When John O 'Leary was nine years old, he suffered burns. Over 100 % of his body was given a 1 % chance to live, and he shares his expertise on overcoming adversity and how to live inspired with tens of thousands of people, hundreds of events a year. He's spoken with us several times. We've become good friends over the years, promoted the book that became a national bestseller called On Fire. His story is breathtaking and amazing, and the only thing that's better than his story is the guy himself. And so honored to have you with us, my friend. Congratulations on all your success. Dave Ramsey, I am grateful to be your friend.

1:48:24Out of everything you said, that's what I'm most grateful for. And I realized, man, this isn't my success. This is God's hand in everything I've done, including the mess ups along the way. And there are many. Some we track, some we bury, but God's grace has carried us forward. So I get a call and I get these calls occasionally from friends that have done some kind of movie or some kind of film. hey, come, we've got the early release for the people that can help us promote it on their shows and stuff. Come over and watch it. And generally when I go, I'm like, oh, God. And I got a call from John, hey, you've got to come see the movie on my life called Soul on Fire.

1:49:03I went, I had to get there just a little bit late because I got tied up in a thing here at the office. And when I got there, I sat there and cried and cried and cried and cried. And I know the whole story. It wasn't like I didn't know what was coming. I knew every turning point, every milestone in the story. And I'm still, it was so well written and so well acted. I was blown away. It's an incredible movie. Well, what makes it, I think, even more incredible is it begins with the words, a true story. And it is. And you and I were talking right before we started the show. But it's recorded in St.

1:49:39Louis where I was raised. The home scenes are recorded in my mom and dad's house. The hospital scenes are recorded in the hospital where I was treated. The place where I met my future wife was recorded exactly where she and I met. And the place where she and I married is recorded in the church where we married. The girl playing my wife in the film walks down that aisle wearing the dress she wore. So for us, it's not only an emotional, true story. They did such a phenomenal job of where they filmed and how they outfitted these characters. And the lady that played your wife nailed it. I mean, because your wife is special.

1:50:15We all know that. But she's a hero in the story. I mean, she's incredible. Well, my favorite part about the film is when you look at the movie poster, it's not a picture of Joel Courtney playing John O 'Leary with his arms up celebrating his greatness. They actually spun him around so you see his backside. And it's a mosaic of all the individuals who were the hands and feet of Jesus who were part of this kid's survival from fire to 100 % of his body. Should not have survived that. But in some regards, the more miraculous story is embracing the scars, embracing your life and recognizing even in the midst of agony, you can be used for good.

1:50:50You overcame, John, unimaginable burns, the mental, the physical, the emotional struggle. Unbelievable. And I know there are a lot of people that are tuned in today that are feeling like their future is unimaginable. They cannot figure out how they're going to get out of bone crushing debt. I think few people could speak to them the way you can. Having overcome what you have overcome, what would you say to that person who feels like they'll never get out of this debt? They're behind. They're never going to be able to live the life that they desire. Right. Me too. And I lived that way not just when I was a kid in the hospital.

1:51:26I think recovering, Ken, from physical injuries is far easier than the emotional ones. So once I came home, like that alone is miraculous, but I buried the light and I kept it buried for 20 years. My life changed in the back row of a church service. My arms were crossed. I was wiped out from the night before. We won't go into the details of that, but I'd been out too late. My life was just sideways, man, but I made it in. And the pastor was talking about the gift of talents. And he went through the five and the two and the one, and then he came to me, like when the light goes on you. And he said, and for those who feel as if you have no hope and no talent, and that might be the person you're speaking to there.

1:52:04He said, listen to me, your life is a precious, priceless gift. You got one job now. It is to say yes to being used for good. And I didn't even know what that meant, but I wrote it down as a 28-year-old, went to work the next day, doing construction at the time, in debt, struggling, wiped out. And I got a call from a little girl who said, Mr. John, will you speak at my school? and that simple yes to this girl to speak to three Girl Scouts, to not even be paid a box of Samoas for the effort. Like we weren't killing it, man. We were not crushing debt. This wasn't helping anything, but it was setting us on a path.

1:52:42And in that room, a Rotarian came up and said, that was awesome. Speak at my Rotary Club. They don't pay. They barely feed you. But I went. And then in their Kiwanis, and then in their church service, and then a prison group, and this awkward, introverted nobody. Just kept saying yes. And it has led now over 20 years to being back on the Dave Ramsey show, to having two bestselling books, to being debt free. And now to have this film called Soul on Fire rolling into theaters around the country and around the world. That's not my work. It's God's hand and a answer of yes, when the opportunity knocks.

1:53:18the movie is soul on fire it's in theaters october the 10th go and see it i will give you my personal guarantee that you will be glad you took the time and the little bit of money out of your pocket you will walk away inspired and ready to go a soul on fire and john is has definitely personified that since i've known him so um what do you hope viewers walk away from this film with I'm gonna answer that in a long-winded way. So my hero's my dad. You and I have talked about this before. And my favorite scene in the film is in the church when we get married. You know, surprise guys, like I survived the fire.

1:53:58It's gonna be okay. I don't know why Ramsey was crying. I'm living right next to him in the seat. Like he should be aware the kid's gonna survive and have a good life. Later on, I get married. And they shot this with the girl walking down the aisle wearing my wife's actual wedding dress. it's Dolly left Dave. So they go to the left and then you see this man rise in the second row. It's not John Corbett, who's the actor who portrays my dad. In the second row, it's the guy he's portraying. That's my dad. And so my dad rises, which he can't do. He had Parkinson's disease, had it for 30 years before he passed away.

1:54:33And when Sean McNamara, the director yelled the word action, my heroic dad stands up. And every time I see my dad in this film and I just, I lose it. It's an incredible moment. But back in May, I took my dad to the film and I thought I'd have him for years, decades probably. And he held my hand the entire time. And when your dad holds your hand for that long, it's an hour and 40 minutes for your dad to hold your hand. But at the end of it, I said, dad, what do you think about your film? And my dad whispered back to me because he had no voice, what a gift. And what he was reviewing was not the film Soul on Fire.

1:55:13He had Parkinson's. He'd broken every bone in his body, most of them twice. He was financially struggling. He was been through two house fires, almost lost one of his kids in one of them. And yet at the end of the life, man, he was able to look up at his son and say, what a gift. So I hope people dance out of that theater saying, what a gift. This story isn't my life we celebrate, man, it's yours. It doesn't make it easy, but God is working in this moment in your life and your best is yet to come. That is a gift. That is. That's exactly right. That's exactly how it works. And after he saw that, he's passed away now, right?

1:55:48Passed away on May 30th. Wow. Amazing. The movie, my friend, John O 'Leary's Life Story. And you will leave with a gift. Soul on Fire. It is in theaters beginning October the 10th. The book is on fire. And if you ever have the opportunity to see John speak, you should. He's spoken on our stages many times. We've shared the stage many times on different things, and he's a world-class communicator, as you can already tell. So, again, nine years old, suffered burns over 100 % of his body, given a 1 % chance to live. But pain and hardships bring the greatest learning lessons, and he'll show you how that works.

1:56:26I can promise you. You'll come away going, oh, okay, I got no problems. Love you, John. Thanks for being with us, brother. I love you, Dave. Love you, Ken. Congratulations. Soul on fire. in theaters October 10th.

1:57:08Thank you.

1:57:45Our scripture of the day, Isaiah 45-2, I will go before you and level the mountains. I will break down gates of bronze and cut through bars of iron. Ella Fitzgerald said, it isn't where you come from that matters. It matters where you're going. Absolutely true. All right. Here's the top questions people have about online wills. How do I know if I need a trust or if my estate is too complicated for a will? Well, if your estate is worth less than a million dollars, getting an online will is probably a great option for you. And actually, if it's worth more than a million dollars, it's probably still a great option.

1:58:24Super complicated is what really matters. It's not the size of it necessarily. What do I need to start my online will? Well, who do you want to get your stuff? Who do you want to take control of your minor kids? And who do you want to make decisions if you're incapacitated? That's a couple of the things they're going to ask, so be ready for them. Is an online will legally valid? Well, of course. Silly. RamseySolutions.com slash willsquiz to find out if an online will is right for you. Aaron is with us in Indianapolis. Hi, Aaron. How are you? Good. How are you, Dave? Better than I deserve. What's up?

1:58:59Nothing much, Dave. So I want to be brief and to the point here. I'm a big fan of your podcast, and I've listened in recently as I've been traveling a lot. And right now I'm in a bit of a situation. My dad passed away earlier this year, and he left back pension money from he was a union worker for my mom as a beneficiary. so I'm calling on behalf of my mom, and she is trying to find out what to do with that money that was left behind. How much is it? It's$126 ,000. Okay. Go to RamseySolutions.com and click on SmartFester Pro. Find someone in your area that has the heart of a teacher that we have vetted, and let them sit down with your mom and tell your mom what her choices are.

1:59:44She needs to roll it into some good growth stock mutual funds into an IRA. Yes. So we were presented with a fixed index annuity. Absolutely not. Horrible. No, no. Horrible. Who presented that? Someone who worked with my mom to help her build her trust right after this happened with my mom. So I immediately was kind of skeptical. I had heard what you had said about it. So I wanted to make sure I was making the right decision. Help your mom build a trust. Why does your mother need a trust? She has property as well. Yeah, but that doesn't mean you need a trust.

2:00:32Yeah, that's what we were advised. By the person who sells trusts? No, no, by a different person who recommended us to the person How much property does your mother have? She has three different rental properties and then the current house. How old is she? She is 51. Okay. I personally would not put any of that in a trust. It's a complete overkill, and it's a complete pain in the butt to operate rental properties in a trust. Because of the operational aspects of writing checks to fix the heat and air and everything else, all got to go through the trust. It's a pain in the butt. they should just be in LLCs.

2:01:16There's no benefit to them being in the trust. So I think this is somebody that sells trust or doesn't know what the flip they're doing, one of the two. So, no, I wouldn't do that. But anyway, and I wouldn't do the other either. So, so far, I don't like any of the people that have given you all advice. I don't like any of the advice they've been giving you. So, yeah, I would get with a SmartVestor Pro and do a rollover on the pension, and I would not put the houses in a trust. I'd put them in LLCs. and there's just no point in it. It doesn't do anything. So, yeah. I like it when you tell them, I don't like any of those people.

2:01:51And that's that. Charles is in Topeka, Kansas. Hey, Charles, what's up? Hey, I just got a question. So I recently purchased my second home, and I was able to buy it in cash, and we paid off all our other debts this year. Doesn't that feel great? It does. I'm sleeping good. I'll tell you that coffee takes good every morning. I bet you are. I'm proud of you, man. Way to go. What's your net worth?

2:02:20Oh, probably around, you know,$600 ,000 or$700 ,000. Good for you. Way to go, man. With my house and all the cars. Good for you. But, yeah, so after child care, all my bills, groceries, that kind of stuff, I have about$2 ,000 left over. and I want to know how much monthly I should throw into, like, retirement or, you know, custodial accounts for the kids because I, you know, kind of want to do some dumb stuff and go on vacations and do things like that. Oh, that's not dumb. You've earned it. You should go do those things. Yeah. So you've just got to lay it out and parse it out and go, okay, there's three things I can do with money at Baby Step 7.

2:02:59I can have fun with it, and I should. I can be generous with it, and I should. And I can invest it, and I should. But as far as kids' custodian accounts, how old are the kiddos? Six months and two and a half. Okay. Yeah, I mean, you could put some in there. I wouldn't overload it too much. If you want to put some in a 529 instead and be thinking about college, that's fine, or education of some kind. Trade school also qualifies for 529s. So whatever they're going to do, they're going to need some training post high school. and I'll be preparing for that, but you don't have to go hog wild on that.

2:03:36And you should be putting at least 15%. You should have been before you paid off the house, 15 % of your household income going into retirement accounts. But at this stage, you ought to be doing more than that. We were trying, but we were in a house that we probably shouldn't have been, but I bought a fixer-upper and it all worked out in the end. Okay, so you got that behind you, so now you can put at least that away. But you ought to be putting a minimum of 15. But at Baby Step 7, I'd like to see you be doing more than 15 % of your income into retirement and be doing something towards the kids' college and something towards fun.

2:04:08And there ought to be room in this budget to do all that. And just sit down with your SmartVestor Pro and lay out your game plan on how we're going to invest, what we're going to invest in, and lay out your Roth IRAs, load them up. Load up the Roth 401ks at work if you've got them and so forth. And then you'll look up in just a few years and it'll be millions and millions of dollars. It's kind of amazing how quickly it grows, how fast this life goes, for that matter. Yeah. You know, for folks that are listening, watching, we have a lot of new folks coming all the time. This is a great call. As Dave's giving that advice, you have to understand the baby steps are not a suggestion.

2:04:44This is a tried and true plan. And you refer to it privately, you know, in our building, in our meetings, that it's a clear path developed over time. as you walk through with people in real life money situations. And I'm telling you, the fundamental truth about the baby steps, Dave, is that it creates massive financial and personal and relationship momentum. It just does. It does. And because you're setting yourself free. Yeah. You're working like crazy and you're actually getting traction. So many people with money feel like a rat in a wheel. Yeah. They feel out of control. They're reactive instead of proactive.

2:05:25And when you get the other side of all of that, guys, it really turns things around in every area of your life. You know, Stephen Covey all those years ago had that book, and it's still on the bestseller list. I look up Total Money Makeovers on there. Seven Habits of Highly Effective People is on there. Number one habit of highly effective people, they are proactive. They happen to things. Yes. Not everything happens to them. So if you're in a situation and you don't like where you are, happen to it. What is it we're going to do? What kind of dynamite are we going to throw in the middle of this?

2:05:58Pull the pin on the grenade. Light up the room, baby. Let's go. Something's got to change here. And if you keep doing the same thing over and over again, expect a different result. That's the definition of insanity. That's what the 12-steppers tell us. And so, you know, I can't seem to break the cycle. Well, break the cycle then. Yeah. It's genius how we know, we talk to people all the time, how hard it is for many people just to get through baby step one, which is to get$1 ,000. And when you're broke, you know how hard that is. But there's something about that. It propels you beautifully into baby step two.

2:06:29It's a tiny little confidence builder. It is. And it's hard sometimes. And you get through that hardship. Guess what happens? Your shoulders come back a little bit. You feel a sense of what Dave just talked about, self-control. You did something that you didn't think was going to be possible. And that's the magic of these baby steps. Work the baby steps. Not out of order. one through seven. Yeah. One is before two, is before three, is before four. That's how that works. And so don't call me up and ask me to change them, okay? It'll be better for you and me both if you don't do that. That puts this hour of the Ramsey Show in the books.

2:07:05We'll be back with you before you know it. In the meantime, remember, there's ultimately only one way to financial peace, and that's to walk daily with the Prince of Peace, Christ Jesus.

2:07:21I love you