INTERVIEW: “Beast Mode Soccer” David Copeland Smith

15:36Millie:me um and i've always had this outlook as i don't ask people to tweet or repost stuff like pros because i feel like if you're good enough people talk about you it's been authentic hasn't it and genuine yeah and if you're really good people say good things and bad things about you and you're only really good when you know what you know when you're really good because people talk shit about you hey bestie we must have made it damn woo yeah

16:11Millie:millie's really made it the last couple of weeks

16:14Rach:hey me is still not gray though so you ain't won yet keep trying guys keep trying so if you're good

16:22Millie:enough people will talk so we had like pressy started to train with me all the time um bianca the D 'Astino, like all these good, good, good level pros. And all I was focused on was development. Like all I was focused on is being really, really good. So they kept coming back. Because you can train a player a couple of times. It doesn't mean anything. If they ain't coming back, you're not good enough. And then Kelly O 'Hara texts me. She's like, Dave, can I bring a couple of friends up tonight? And I'm like, oh, Kel, like it's a good level tonight. Because in the summer, we used to have a bunch of Prem players come over.

16:57Millie:because don't forget it's Robbie Williams' house and you guys know that there's that celebrity athlete crossover, right? Where everybody wants to be each other's friend. And I was kind of like, you know, the little peon because Rob would be like, oh, Dave, like, Sean Wright Phillips wants to come up. Here's his email, right? And I'm like, no worries. No worries, Sean Wright Phillips. I'll help you out, you know what I mean?

17:21Rach:Dave, did you have to group people together based on their ability? Is that something that when you did like more than one player? They have to be at the same level for the sessions.

17:29Millie:Just so everyone understands. Not all the time, but there'd be no massive gaps. So I'd have some college players training with them. And there wasn't massive gaps. But if it was levels, then yeah. Yeah. 100%. Because you don't want anyone bringing the house down. So Kel texted me and I was like, isn't there some Prem players coming up? They've got to be good because if they're not, they're on your team. And she's like, yeah, no worries. and it was Alex Morgan and Tobin Heath. And imagine Tobin Heath in small-sided, right? Like the woman, she was sick enough 11s, but small-sided, like untouchable.

18:11Millie:So we're playing and I'm like, I'm going to test Alex because this big thing was like a big cage, right? So I'm like, I'm going to test this girl against the fence. And I'm in good shape. I'm in good shape now. Don't talk bad on yourself, Dave. abs bro right so i go in on her on the fence and it was like hitting a brick wall i imagine it'd be like hitting millie right she's like oh ow and she's laughing and afterwards alex was like oh i just wanted to see how you were as a trainer like will you train me like we're getting ready for whatever it was the olympics and all of that and it really kicked off from that um and i've really try to keep the integrity of what I do as in the focus has never been social media the focus has been giving mad value to these players um and you know I think that the testament is you know I trained Alex from 2012 to the end of a career you know the testament is Rachel Daly from college Rach you're in a World Cup final you won the Euros can you imagine driving up Beverly Glen in my truck and us talking about you probably never playing for England because you'd piss people off can you imagine this

19:31David Copeland Smith:yeah I know Dave with the guards here he is

19:34Millie:I know I'm never I'm never going to mention names because that's not cool no but there was

19:41David Copeland Smith:a massive period of time where I was like I'm never going to get picked for England again there's no point even having it in my mind like you know this story Mills but But I did go through that. I was like, I'm never going to play for England, so there's no point. And I remember having conversations with you all the time, Dave, and being like, it's not even on my radar because what's the point? But still, I just wanted to be the best that I could be for whatever level I was at.

20:01Rach:Right, guys, I know that is juicy us, but we are just going to take a quick break and we'll be back very soon.

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20:42David Copeland Smith:Welcome back to the second part of interviewing David Copeland-Smith, also known as Beast Mode Soccer. We're going to dive into his career a little bit more. The way I met Dave, right, you'd appreciate this. So I'd gone to play in the Summer League. So, you know, I told you in America I was ineligible for my first season. I could come play. So I was like, I need to play in the Summer. So I went to LA, played in this Summer League team. and Dave showed up, right? Didn't know him, never met him. My first training session and I was like, well, what's he doing? Who's this? Who's this then?

21:17Millie:Who's this clown?

21:18David Copeland Smith:Pulls out a bag of tennis balls. Can you imagine my reaction? I went, what the fuck are they for? And he was like, juggle with them. And I was like, nah, not juggling with tennis balls. Obviously I did, but I was like, oh. And literally, like, we just slated each other the whole session and then we just became like, best mates and that was it like from then on from that day forward i just did like

21:39Millie:every day training with him my shout out tracy kevin's by the way yeah but what i like about

21:44David Copeland Smith:tracy in that situation was that she allowed you she saw what you were like that was probably like the beginning of when you were getting big it was great like i was i was on holiday in london

21:55Millie:and tracy dm'd me and was like hey i'm moving to la i want to talk to you about coaching and I was like, all right, I'm in Hammersmith, come meet me at Starbucks. And she did. And she's like, can you come in once a day or once a week? And that is how we met. How do you think that individual development is,

22:22David Copeland Smith:like how important do you think it is? Like an IDP? Oh, massively, 100%.

22:28Rach:But do you think it gets overlooked? Yeah, definitely. and I don't think... I think it's valued more in America than it is in England.

22:40David Copeland Smith:He's shouting at the dog.

22:42Rach:Dave, you can leave it on. We do this every episode. Leave it on our dogs. Don't worry. We've got our four dogs that go crazy all the time. Don't worry about it. Shout and do what you need to do. But yeah, I do think it's bigger. I think it's becoming... I think we're getting to that place in England where you see a lot of coaches, but I think back to Dave's point is I don't think you see a lot of that. A lot of it now is social media. That's how you see of it. Whereas actually I think when you look at Dave's situation, the proof's in the pudding. You see these players performing week in, week out on the world's biggest stages.

23:16Rach:You see them still developing no matter what age they're at. I think for me that is the beauty of his story and what he's achieved. I think a lot now, there's probably loads of good coaches out there doing one-to-ones but I think a lot like really drive social media and really yeah try and do it that way as opposed to like Dave said just the product work on the product and if they keep returning that's the key

23:37David Copeland Smith:do you know what I'm saying I don't think there's enough investment in the UK for that yet I don't know why but like you don't really have like in the women's game you don't really have like just a just an individual technical coach do you like they're all like I don't know why teams don't

23:50Rach:don't do that though where they bring in someone like Dave and then that's you work with people but within the club environment. Because I also think in England, it's harder to do things outside of your club than it is. You can't outsource someone, can you? You can't go to a trainer and then go and train with someone else. You have to have a conversation. You have to check, is it okay? Can I do this? If you're on a Christmas break, it's different, but you still have to okay it. You can't just go and do it. Whereas I feel like in America, if you're going to go better yourself, you can. Whereas I think in England, there's so many people to get through.

24:23Rach:It becomes a bit of a nightmare.

24:24Millie:there really it's exactly the same here but there's so much gatekeeping here so pro clubs over here have just started to get idp coaches but they employ their friends right they're employing coaches they're employing coaches not specialists so they'll be like oh yeah but this guy's got a ua for pro i'm like cool what's what have they done individually who have they trained let me It's a specific role, isn't it?

24:51Rach:And you can obviously explain that better than anyone.

24:53Millie:It is the most frustrating thing. Because I went to Mexico to do it. I went and worked for a club called Tigres Femenil. It means Tigers, women.

25:09Rach:Nice little accent there. Can you just say it one more time? Dave does actually speak Spanish.

25:14Millie:Sí, yo hablo español. Go on the boy. El equipo es boomer. But I went down to Mexico to do it and I loved it. And I got there and, you know, someone says to me, they're like, you're going to have a hard time here because it was one of the assistants. It's like, you're going to have a hard time here because the players won't listen. And I wasn't worried because I'm like, I don't care if you don't listen. If you don't want to improve, that's on you, isn't it? Yeah. And one of the first days I had, like, Jackie O 'Reilly, who is the most costly sign-in in the world at the moment, she went to Orlando and I had me official and all my days they were hungry man like Jackie no English and at the time my Spanish was awful yet we communicated enough where every day whether that it was an eight minute block or a 20 minute block at the beginning of the day she's like what are we doing today and i'm like all right today we're doing this boom boom boom and if it's done correctly it is amazing i wrote a massive thing on linkedin the other day no one's doing it correctly in the us and i'm probably putting myself in the firing line there by you know not mentioning clubs names but then no one's doing it correctly and they're so arrogant and it's probably the same in the uk They're so arrogant.

26:42Millie:They will not listen to me. I spoke to a TD the other day in an English team. And she thinks that the way the game's going is like the NFL and the NBA. Remember when Tom Brady started to bring his own people in? She thinks that's going to happen. She's like, the players are going to want to bring their own technical coaches in.

27:04David Copeland Smith:Well, I think that as a player, if you want to go to the next level, right, and you're willing to put like we're all willing to put in the hard yards you know what i mean like we're all willing to just do whatever it takes to be the best we can possibly be but a lot of our training sessions and you'll probably say the same you know like it's like think about when we were in england for example right it's very much tactical leading up to the games right so there's a lot of tactical training which yeah you 100 100 you need to do don't get me wrong there's elements of technical, but like, it's not individual specific, like you're not really going to reach your full potential in a week's worth of training, normal team training.

27:44David Copeland Smith:Like you have to do extra, you have to do the things that you, you want to work on. Like you, Mills, you might not be exposed to that much defending, let's say on a walkthrough or I don't know, like there'll be like, I always want to do finishing. I want to do, you know, Dave, like I want to hit different finishes. I want to, if I've missed a chance in a game, I want to work on that, that same chance over and over again.

28:04Rach:I don't think you're held back because it's like loading now. Oh, you only get 10 shots. Yes. And I'm like, but that's impossible. Like, what if I have 10 shit shots and I don't get the outcome that I need? Yeah, I need 10 good ones after that. And then rolling into the next. And I do think that is a big thing now. It's like loading and there's like a million different things. And nine times out of 10 training sessions are very specific to the team, the team needs, which like you said, rightly so, that's great. But if we improved every individual, how are you going to excel in your position? Like, my touch and pass is different to a striker's.

28:35Rach:Do you know what I mean?

28:36David Copeland Smith:I'm a huge advocate for, like, technical development. Like, I swear by it. A hundred percent.

28:42Rach:You have to train it to be better.

28:43Millie:Loading is hyper important, right? But what kind of irks me a little bit in that part of the coaching community is, like, be all and end all. And what they do not take into account is a player like Rachel and players like Alex, they needed extra work. Maybe not for the reps, but for the psychological aspect. Like Alex working with me two weeks before a camp, before a World Cup. Did those reps make a lot of difference? Probably not. But the fact that she knows that she's ready and she's taken a couple of thousand shots in the last two weeks, she is pissing confident. rachel daly fly me out to houston to do reps of a cross and a finish the psychological effect is way more than the tech the technical effect for that you know i've got video of me and rachel training and a week later she scores the exact same goal exactly when you put them clips up frightening yeah like but it's frightening and that's what we're missing and it's and it's always going to be me against them and it shouldn't we should collaborate and that's what i loved at tigres is the collaboration aspect and carmelina muscato was the head coach so she forced that collab on everyone she's like this is what's happening and it i think it just goes to show like football's still being gatekept right do you think that you'd ever come back to england to do

30:18David Copeland Smith:this role if the opportunity was there yeah one would you ever come back to england and two

30:24Rach:Two, would you work in a club environment?

30:27Millie:One, I would come back if Arsenal called.

30:31David Copeland Smith:Big Arsenal fan over there, Dave.

30:33Millie:And two, I would want to work in a club environment. What I'd love to do is work with the US, with the US Women's National Team squad, because I work with a bunch of them anyway. And I would love to go into camp and liaise with their clubs and, you know, their clubs have got IDP liaisal with them. Everybody's on the same page. Everybody's going toward the same direction with this kid. Like, let's take a Claire Hutton, for example, right? You know Claire?

31:08David Copeland Smith:She's a new one coming on the scenes, isn't she?

31:10Millie:She's good, though. Rach, I had Claire when she was 17. She'd come down. I was in New York doing a camp. I was in New York doing a camp. And she came down from Albany. First day I looked at her, I said, what's your plans? and she's like, I'm going to go to UNC. I'm like, no, you're not. You're going pro, mate. And I got on the phone to an agent and we got assigned. She's like you. Carries a ball everywhere with her. Still, and she's different. But imagine a player like Claire who's still young. I think she's 18 still, 19 maybe, right? And everybody's on the same pace. So Emma's like, Dave, this is what I want her to do.

31:48Millie:Then I call the club and be like, right, what do you guys need from her? right then you build out a huge idp where she's doing 10 12 minutes a day extra that compounds

31:57Rach:right that's an hour a week do you do on the idp dave do you because obviously me and rachel experience it more from like a a club idp and a lot of it some of it is given by coaches but a lot of it is driven by ourselves isn't it rachel like you fill in the boxes or do you when you're creating the IDP and you spoke to coaches, are you analysing that player and then are you saying, right, we're doing this, this, this?

32:22Millie:I get everybody's viewpoint, Millie, but my IDPs are driven by data, right, and fact. It's evidence-based IDPs. Because if I look at Rach, I might have an opinion, and Rach might have an opinion, and we could both be wrong, and the coach will have an opinion. Whereas, so I'll study, like my IDPs are psycho, honestly.

32:43David Copeland Smith:They are insane. I know players.

32:45Millie:I did one with Diego Luna, who's like a upstart for the US men's national team. I was in Portland working with him. And he went to the Nike people and they were like, this guy knows my game better than I do. And it's, it's put, but it's 20 hours of research, right? So I know what, what you need to work on with Rachel is always easy. Cause Rachel is actually very, very astute and she knows what she wants to work. The biggest problem with Rachel is that she was, her own worst enemy. Braves could score three goals and Tex would be going, oh shit today, I should have scored four.

33:19Rach:Dave, let me tell you, I have debriefs after every single training session, every single day, every single game. Best day, get Kettle on having a debrief. Also, she could have had the best game in the year and she'd be like, oh, I'm getting dropped next game, that's it, I'll be dropped, I'll be dropped.

33:33Millie:You're not. I'll misplace the pass in the 63rd.

33:36Rach:And I'll know exactly when it was, won't I? She will, she'll be getting it up, she'll have it 30 seconds later, She'll have the huddle clip She'll be like See, see Should have done this Why didn't I do this

33:45Millie:But I also think If you took that away from her She wouldn't be who she was No, of course not She wouldn't be who she was Go on then What was Rach's IDP?

33:53Rach:I'm intrigued now What did you analyse on her?

33:56Millie:I could bring it up I've got early IDP Mate IDPs are so good now Back in the day I used to have Do you remember when I used to Hand clip your games? Right? But Rach was actually easy because she's got such a big range so with rachel it was more about adding to her game than transforming her game right so rachel can score from 30 yards and she can score from six rachel can score with her head she can score with her left she can score with her right her movement is world class what do you work with it's made it's mostly reps of doing right where is she missing the most what zone of this of the field is she missing the most let's work there because you don't want to touch everything else.

34:40Millie:You just want to polish that. But can I add 5 % to Rachel's game? And if that 5 % is mental, can I add that?

34:50David Copeland Smith:We used to have fights all the time on the field though, didn't we? When you used to train me. I used to get so annoyed at you.

34:56Millie:She cried once.

34:57Rach:So Dave, what has been, what would you say has been the hardest challenge of like the career that you've had? Obviously being over in America, I know you've been there for 20 years now, but what has been the hardest challenge that you've faced that's a good question it getting people to take what i do seriously as a profession um because it's it's all i i feel like it's always

35:18Millie:me against the establishment you know it's like people are your friends when they're playing and then they get into coaching environments and they go through the establishment order and all of a sudden it's like oh it doesn't really work what you do i'm like but it worked for you But now you've been brainwashed again So I think that's Kind of coming to an end Because you know I've got a proven record But I would I would say that's been the biggest battle

35:49Rach:Well let's hope we keep changing People's perceptions because we value it As players and I think definitely The proof's in the pudding The players that you've worked with Played on the biggest stages and had the best The best stats, the best careers so hopefully people start listening and taking it seriously. I'd like to think we're definitely moving forward and if the players are saying it's needed then I think people would like to listen to that. And what has been the best moment for you looking back over all them years? What's the one moment where you stand out?

36:20Millie:There's a couple. I've got goosebumps thinking about Rachel if the Euros and then walking around with a cowboy hat. Cowboy hat. The relationship that we had just seeing her growth and then obviously Martin passing away and you battling back through that

36:41David Copeland Smith:Don't, I can't be doing that today Dave We need to go on to gratitude

36:46Millie:No, battling through that and then obviously the World Cup final I'm still a little bit flummoxed about not playing the second half but it's alright and then the other ones are obviously Alex you know because I've had Alex for 12 years and Alex is like Rach man she is loyal loyal she's like Georgia from Love Island I'm loyal a loyal mini babe right she's loyal and she's exactly the same as Rach she took me on the journey with her and she never forgot Alex took me to a Super Bowl you know just to thank me and seeing her lift the World Cup, seeing her with the Olympics. But, you know, I always describe Rach is like my sister.

37:38So seeing her come to fruition like that.

37:42Millie:And Tracy Kevin's always like, Dave, the one player you'll be known for is Rach because none of us expected it.

37:47Rach:Oh, I love you too's friendship. And honestly, for anyone that doesn't know Dave, get to know Dave. Go support his business. But also I think just the person that you are is incredible. And I know Bestie as well. She is a loyal person. and she definitely don't forget the ones that help her from the beginning but yeah yours too friendship is extremely special and I feel lucky that she has you as well so yeah we have a lot of love for our bestie don't we honestly

38:11Millie:I'm the lucky one she's a rock star

38:14Rach:she's a good egg isn't she she's not had a bad she's not had a bad career has she she's a national treasure not too bad

38:23David Copeland Smith:I don't like all my compliments ah okay Dave so just before we go yes first Because me and Millie do this thing on our podcast every time, right? It's like a closing thing. So the first thing is called block and delete, which is Millie's favourite thing. So it's basically like something that really pisses you off that you'd like to change. So like adverts on games. Like I'm playing a game on my phone and adverts come on. Go away.

38:49Millie:All right, play the$3.99.

38:50David Copeland Smith:That's what I said. Take it. I'm not saying I won't, but it just is irritating. so can you give us an example of something that annoys you on a daily basis or something that's

39:01Millie:annoyed you this week block and delete oh mate how long have you got no just one really nice

39:06Rach:just one really annoys me here he is he's off i love it when you're in the supermarket right

39:12Millie:you're in a supermarket and the aisle and someone turns their shopping cart trolley trolley someone trolley good correction but this way and then they're looking this way and they've I've blocked the whole thing. So what I do now is I take my phone and I walk by. I'm like, oh, some dickheads blocked the aisle again. And they look and I'm like, they look and I roll my eyes and push their trolley out of the way.

39:40Rach:Hey, that's the farmer in you, that. That's the farmer. Don't tolerate no bullshit.

39:46David Copeland Smith:I wasn't expecting that. But I love how quickly people can come up with these on the spot.

39:50Rach:Yeah, and straight away, oh, that really pisses me off.

39:53David Copeland Smith:Yeah, I love it. Okay, and then the next thing we do is called gratitude. It's salvage, blanchery. So we say something that we've been grateful for this week. So, for example, mine this week was my boiling hot tap so I can get instant cup of tea. Have you got one of those? Yeah, sick.

40:08Rach:Or it can be a person, like before we've said a person or anything this week where you're like, shit, that was really nice, that.

40:14Millie:You know, I'm grateful for Trader Joe's protein pancakes because they're pre-packaged and they're 20 grams of protein. But honestly, this is going to sound like a bit lame But I'm grateful for you guys Hey, there's no lame gratitude

40:29Rach:Let's just rewind Did you hear what you just said then? Thank you very much Did you hear what you just said then? Yes, I did But start again And this is not a lame gratitude It's a gratitude No matter how big or small it is That's what we're grateful for

40:41Millie:Yeah, I'm thankful for you guys For bringing me on here You know, the last time we were I mean, we could have done this at the wedding You know?

40:51Rach:Oh, I don't think it would have been acceptable. I don't think our camera read it. I think we'd have got blocked and deleted.

40:58Millie:Hey, I'm good. I don't drink.

41:00Rach:After a few, our mouths were a little bit too free. So I think we're sparing this.

41:04Millie:No, you guys were... How good was that wedding, by the way?

41:08Rach:Oh, Dave, we want to relive it. I feel like this has been the story of everybody.

41:13David Copeland Smith:We've had, so far, we've had Ellie Roebuck, Alicia, and now you. And obviously, all three were at the wedding. So it's like, it closes. By far the best wedding ever.

41:22Millie:Mate, it's the most fun I've had for ages, man.

41:24Rach:Remember when you forgot to bring your stuff and you were like, oh, were I meant to bring it with me? Yeah, yeah, you were.

41:31David Copeland Smith:Literally, 45 minutes before the ceremony is about to start, Dave's like, I've left my stuff at the hotel that I'm not going back to.

41:39Millie:I put it down to you guys' communication because Brooke was in the same boat and she's the smartest person that we know.

41:44David Copeland Smith:True. But you made it and everything was good.

41:47Millie:hey shout out to um someone else who gets a lot of hate is alicia layman oh nicest person in the

41:54David Copeland Smith:world mate honestly did you have you listened to our episode with her yeah it's so good and i love that we were able to like hear that side of her like here like yeah the struggles that she's gone

42:06Millie:through and she's literally the jet like literally nicest person in the world but there's so much hate

42:11Rach:around lately like people i'm literally like what are you doing in day-to-day life like i would love to have a picture just to sit there and do nothing. Like, it's crazy.

42:20Millie:COVID. COVID turned bored people brave. It really did. There's far too much hate at the minute.

42:26Rach:Yeah,

42:26Millie:like,

42:26Rach:why?

42:27Millie:I don't know. Honestly,

42:29Rach:you can't, if you breathe in the wrong direction, you're a terrible person. If you, like, people are quick to jump at anything you say, they immediately think you're a shitty person and, oh, she meant it like this and she said it like this and I'm like, you don't know anything about me as a person or anyone else for that matter, but honestly, the world...

42:48Millie:Millie Bright, let me tell you, Millie Bright is a national treasure. Oh, your post was really cute when you posted it. But it's true, Millie, I'm fed up with people trolling really successful people, people who have done shit that other people can only dream of.

43:07David Copeland Smith:I think that that's why we like to do what we do on the podcast and even bringing people in, like it's people that add value to it, like people that have a story or people that have been on a journey or people that get it and like kind of like-minded humans. And like for Alicia, for example, it was so nice to like give her that opportunity, that platform to just be who she was and like for people to see that. And I think that's really important.

43:31Millie:Mate, the fact that she could have done that podcast in four languages. I know.

43:35Rach:And even then people are like, ah, Swiss is not a thing. And like, yeah, like you understood the point. No, do you know what I'm saying? Anyway, we're here for it. Thanks for having our backs

43:45Millie:We didn't even get to talk about you spending time At Rod Stewart's house

43:49Rach:Hey listen love you'll be back on for another episode Because there's far too much to pack in one episode But just before we go Talking about success What is next for Dave? I have been investigating

44:02Millie:Going like working with a club again I would love to go down And work with Tigres again Or this team Bulmas in Mexico City Shout out Ultimate for me would be working with Emma because I think Emma's like really breathed a massive breath of fresh air into US soccer that was really American

44:21Rach:soccer really really

44:23Millie:yeah and you know continue to grow what I do be the anti social media person by actually posting exercises that help people instead of clickbait and you know live a happy and fruitful life love that

44:43Rach:Well Dave We wish you all the best Emma Hayes Eat your heart out Incredible human Get him on board Just don't help them improve Against England please Like I'm still rooting for my country Come on England That was hard

44:57Millie:2019 Thanks so much for coming on the pod

45:01Rach:We're definitely going to be Getting you back on Because it's far too much to unpack I need to know about Stuart And the parties So yeah Part two coming soon Of Dave And yeah What a lovely trio this is by the way Thank you for having me Yeah, I love it. My two besties.

45:14Millie:Yeah, this was so much fun. Thank you for having me. Whole lot of love.

45:17Rach:We'll be back soon, guys. Hope you enjoyed the episode. Yeah, BRB. Bye.