Harry Maguire on the facetime with Tuchel which ended his World Cup dream

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2:07Alan Shearer:Hello and welcome to The Rest is Football. On today's show, we've got Harry Maguire with us. And, well, let's say he was very open and honest about the situation of him being left out of the squad. I think you'll really enjoy it. We also talked about the football, of course, and an astonishing performance from Kate Verde. And don't forget, if you want to watch the show, just get us on Netflix.

2:34Alan Shearer:Alan Shearer and Joe Cole are here, and look who we've got joining us for the first time. He should, of course, be in Kansas City. We all think that. But he's not, sadly. He's here in New York with us. You've got to suffer us rather than the England squad. Are you OK, Harry? Have you got over it now? No, I'm very good. obviously a disappointment at the time but it's been a few weeks since then I've been awake, went to Barbados and found myself here now with you guys so I'm really excited for what's going on It's gone downhill fast No, this is the second best place I could be so no, actually We'll get into today's games in a moment but I just want a little chat first about it I mean, we all said, didn't we that we thought you should be in the squad genuinely not and that's probably the only nice comment you'll get from us Was it a surprise to you?

3:19No, it was a surprise at the time. I said straight away that it was a surprise. I was really disappointed. I thought I did enough to be in the squad and I thought I could have helped the lads out there. I thought I would have still had a part to play on the pitch and off the pitch as well. No, I was disappointed at the time, but the manager's made a decision and he's gone with his 26 and it's part of football and I'll move on quick from it.

3:47Alan Shearer:Can you tell us, did he break the news to you personally with a phone call, a text or did he not at all? No, he speaks to everyone to be fair. So he FaceTimes everyone. FaceTime? Yeah, it's quite an awkward call. So when he FaceTimed you, you must have thought, must be in the squad, sure. No, so I received a text around nine, ten o 'clock in the morning just saying, can I speak to you today at four o 'clock? but I think Cobby received the same text so it was like I think Luke as well maybe he received the same text as well so I think he's got I think he FaceTimes everybody it's quite a unique way to do it it makes it harder probably for himself to see our reactions and things like that but yeah it was a Can I ask you what he said and did he give you an explanation as to why?

4:38He really said that he can't really give me an excuse but I think he said that he's gone with the four lads that he got through the qualifying in the autumn, in the autumn camps where he felt like, I think it was, he felt like they did well during them six games but he did say that he can't really give me an excuse but listen, that's football. It was tough to take out. I did think I was going to be in the squad after the March camp and been selected in March camp for the first time under him and I felt like I did really well in both of the games and then went back to Manchester United and finished the season really, really strong.

5:09I thought I did enough to be in the squad, but like I said, he's made that decision, he's gone with the squad and it is a strong squad.

5:17Alan Shearer:What was your reaction when he told you? Yeah, I was shocked more than anything. Did you say anything to him? Yeah, we had a few words. Did you? Yeah. Look, I'm quite a big personality, I'm experienced. No, I think it was an honest conversation between us both. I was really disappointed. I wanted to go to the World Cup and play. I'm 33 now so 37 at the next World Cup it looks far away so I wanted to go not just play but like I told the manager I wasn't demanding to go and start the games I'd have been happy to play one minute as long as I was there with the lads so no it was disappointing

5:57Gary Lineker:What do you think of that way of doing it? Because you look at Brazil they actually do it live on television Oh, it's weird. I mean, yeah, but to be fair... By X Factor or something. No, but then no one knows. No. And everyone finds out at the same time. Pochettino, I listened to saying, well, I probably only... Why would I ring around everyone? I'm only doing that for myself in terms of what makes me feel better because why do they want to hear me telling them well, they're not in the squad, the bad news. So what's your thought of the process of... There's no way of getting bad news. No, because if you're first on the list, you're going to be, you know, first.

6:40Gary Lineker:But if you're the last, which I guess if he's ringing around so many people to tell him, sorry, mate, you're not in the squad. And if you're last and by that time, you're last. That news would have already broken because you can't keep a secret in today's world when there's something as important as that. So what's your thought on the process of him delivering the squad? Yeah, I definitely think I was one of the later ones in the squad. And I think that was the most disappointing thing for me because when I got told, I got told about, I think, 4 o 'clock that day. But did you have an indication before you got told off it?

7:14So something got released in the media about half an hour before that that my place is in doubt. Right. Did you see that? I seen that. And I was thinking... But two years before it happened again when it was the Euro squad because I got left out of that squad because I was injured from a calf, but it was still touch and go to whether or not I was going to get picked there. And then a couple of hours before we got told, then it got leaked out that I was going to miss it through a calf injury. So this one, again, that was the most frustrating thing. And then straight after the call, I knew straight away that all the media knew that I wasn't in the squad.

7:51And I was like, so that is like when you say, do you just tell people there and then? I think a lot of people found out. so I got told on a Thursday afternoon but I do think a lot of people I know a lot of people got told on the Wednesday so they're having to keep it a secret which is like massive news to find out that you're in a World Cup squad you want to tell your friends and your family and everyone involved so it is it's a strange way I don't know what the best way is I don't know whether you just don't call up people who aren't in the squad and the Brazil way it's interesting It's brutal as well, isn't it?

8:27Gary Lineker:If you're sat there with all your family, just using the João Pedro thing, with all his family, I mean, I guess it's a tough either way, whatever way you find out it's not nice. But when someone else is telling you then, it's not a good look, is it? No, I think it's football's a game of opinions, isn't it, at the end of the day. No matter what squad he would have picked, there would have been people who missed out where people would have said that they should be in the squad. So it is part and parcel of football and I was disappointed in myself I felt like I did enough, but it is what it is and I'll move on definitely.

9:00Gary Lineker:Harry, obviously you've been a massive player for England over the last decade. How long has it taken you to let it digest? I know you've had a bit of time since then and have you digested it? It's tough, you still see the boys when they're having a good time over in camp and loads of videos and I still speak to the lads in camp. I want them to do really well, they're all my friends. Who have you spoken to Harry? I've spoken to H, Harry Kane, Picks, Declan. I've spoken to a lot of them. I keep in touch with them throughout the season. So I wish them all the best. They're all top players. And I think we've got a great chance to win it.

9:38And when you've got a great chance to win it, you want to be involved even more. So it does hurt because I'm not deluded. I'm not sat here. I wouldn't be sat here if I didn't go to the March camp and I didn't get that little bit of feeling that I was going to be in the squad. I wouldn't be sat here saying that I deserve to be in the squad.

9:57Alan Shearer:Well, you are the highest scoring defender in English football history for the national team. And may I say, you've two World Cups that you have played in. You've excelled in them. You've been a really important part. And I found it very difficult to understand taking away that experience that you would have brought to the camp. Especially, Gail. Obviously, Jordan Henderson's in there for that reason.

10:22Gary Lineker:Jordan's been a great player like Harry as well. and you think so he obviously has a mindset Tom is where he's thinking we need that in the group and you know we're not as strong when it's not like the number 10 position where you've left Palmer and Foden there's so many players like central defence. I feared the worst

10:38Alan Shearer:for you a little bit because I had a meeting with I won't discuss what was said because it was off the record with Thomas Tuchel was there with Wayne Rooney and Jamie Carragher he invited us into breakfast and discussing he was quite open but he didn't say he wasn't going to pick you but he was waxing lyrical about Dan Byrne and I thought would you pick both those two players because there are obvious similarities but for me your experience of major tournaments and the fact that you've always turned up for England and not everyone does at international level you need a you know you need cojones grandes don't you for that sort of stuff.

11:19Alan Shearer:But anyway, you're not there. I'm not there. We wish you were.

11:24Gary Lineker:We can't give you the banks of Barbados, but we can give you some lovely rosé wine as well. Especially out of New York.

11:32Alan Shearer:Absolutely. Yeah, let's move on from the grilling to the football. And well, who would have thought that the biggest story of the tournament so far would have been a goalless draw? the extraordinary match between Spain and Cape Verde. It was down to the goalkeeper as well. Actually, they defended brilliantly, didn't they? Because Spain didn't have too many chances. I mean, but the hero was Josimo Vazenia, the goalkeeper. At the start of the day, he had 50 ,000 followers on Instagram. Do you know what he's got now? 4.1 million. If he has to buy a drink, you can Cape Verde ever get in. Exactly. I mean, I must say, I'm sure that's not the most rewarding thing that he's had today.

12:18Alan Shearer:But it is quite fun. Do you know what?

12:19Gary Lineker:I was doing a bit of work today and I was watching the game. And you know when the... He's 40, right? He's 40, yeah. And you see all the players now. They're so baby-faced. He looks like a 40-year-old. And I was going, goalies look about 50. They're going to struggle here. Then every five minutes... He just killed his day. I know. You want to hear what he said about you, by the way.

12:40Alan Shearer:And then every time I looked up at a bar, he's like, tipping one round the post. Yeah, incredible. And you just think to yourself, what a moment. Great story. Yeah, it was. When he was in tears at the end, I must admit, I got a little bit. I'm on old softy, I don't mind admitting that. But it was also, he was crying. You can see the pictures there on the screen. I thought it was beautiful. I mean, he was sad as well, because the reason apparently he was crying was that his grandparents had passed away not long ago and couldn't be there today, obviously. And his mother couldn't because of visa issues, which seems absurd and they couldn't get the money and they couldn't get it over in time so you can see wise and emotional but wow, what a story Do you know, it was not only him

13:24Gary Lineker:but for the team, for the squad, for the manager to go up against a team or a country with the might of Spain for what they've achieved and all those players in that I mean, there are many people's favourites to win the competition. So for those guys to go in and defend and fight and scrap and be as well organised as they were was just bloody amazing.

13:50Alan Shearer:There's actually something extraordinary. I know you were on the plane at the time, so you didn't see the game when we were here. You were flying here, Harry. But there's some extraordinary stats that I think you'll find quite extraordinary. Here, like 27 shots for Spain. So you expect that, six shots. Seven shots on target. Goalkeeper saved most of them. One shot on target was actually a header for Cape Verde near the end. He had a good chance and it was, you know, could have scored it. Imagine if it won. Possession, you'd expect that. 800 passes, 278. Just two big chances though. So it shows how well they defended against one.

14:25And this is the most remarkable thing for me.

14:30Alan Shearer:Since records began, no team has ever fouled on fewer occasions. One foul. This is a team that hasn't had the ball in the whole game. one foul in the whole match. So they weren't just kicking lumps out of Spain or anything. I mean, you can't kick lumps out of people now. I mean, I'm not sure there's a game you've played in your career, Harry, where you've not committed one foul. Yourself? Myself, yeah. I'm always there for one or two fouls. But no, that's incredible. But I think that's the beauty of the World Cup, really. Especially now there's more teams in it, that you get these teams who do get opportunities and they've proven on the biggest stage.

15:02I think I was speaking earlier, and the thing what I'm not sure about in the World Cup is three teams going through in each group. Or in most groups. In most groups. I think it's eight out of 12 now, isn't it? So I don't know. I think we should add more. I think we could add another 16 teams to the World Cup and have top two go through in each group.

15:23Gary Lineker:Infantino would love you. I'd be thinking about it. I do. Because she can go through in third place. I think now the group like Spain, if they drew today but they couldn't get the third spot, the next game is massive. You can't lose.

15:38Alan Shearer:What it does, for some of the smaller nations, there will be jeopardy, obviously. It's hard to imagine a big team not getting through, is what you say. Yeah, I think if you were sat here now as a Spain fan and you didn't have that third spot as a safety blanket, the next game is like, it's a knockout game.

15:57Gary Lineker:I wouldn't be too worried about Spain because their record in the last 15 World Cups, they've only won three of their opening game. so including when they won the World Cup in 2010

16:11Alan Shearer:they lost their opening game

16:12Gary Lineker:lost their opening game so I wouldn't be too concerned with that

16:15Alan Shearer:they've only won three out of the 12 matches at the World Cup since they won the trophy only won three matches

16:22Gary Lineker:only won three matches since the World Cup

16:25Alan Shearer:I mean they've got a better team now than perhaps they did in the middle period I want to talk also about as we've got centre half here the two central defenders I know you couldn't see the game because you were in the air But, I mean, fantastic, really. Roberto Lopez spent his entire career playing in Ireland. This is a brilliant story. I've seen this. Yeah, he's currently at Shamrock Rovers, and he got an invite to play for Cape Verde. But it was in Portuguese, the invitation. So he didn't reply for a year. Then they sent it in English, and he accepted. His dad's from Cape Verde. Ireland will be ringing him up now, a bit.