Terrible Germany crash out as Brazil fight back

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1:08Alan Shearer:Hello and welcome to The Rest is Football. The knockout stage is off and running. Lots of entertainment, penalty shootouts. Much to talk about with Alan and Micah. Also in the studio tonight, Millie Bright, Lioness and Emma Hayes. Now the US coach, of course, and Joe Cole. And don't forget, if you prefer to watch the show, You can get it on Netflix every day.

1:34Alan Shearer:Someone once said football is a simple game. 22 players chase a ball for 90 minutes and at the end, the Germans always win. What a fucking idiot. Welcome to The Rest is Football and what a day of football it's been. We'll get into that Germany result and all of today's games in a moment. But first, Millie, Emma, welcome to the show. Lovely to have you here. You two, of course, Joe. You guys all know each other so well. Up the Chelsea. Chelsea. Up the Chelsea. We're together. Safety in numbers. But you know even further. I know Emma from back in the day. We're from the same part of London. Her dad was a brilliant football man.

2:13Looked after all the young kids in the area. Get them out of trouble. Get them playing football. And he did a really, really good job for all my mates and me. He got you out of trouble. Got me out of trouble. Not the only person. I need a few people to help me with that. Keep me out of trouble.

2:26Alan Shearer:and you would have played for Emma for about 10 years? Yeah, just a short period. A few times, yeah. She got me out of trouble a few times. I think it's the other way around. Oh, really? You spill the tea? Late on. What's she like to play for? Demanding? Yeah, of course, but I feel like you have to be to be the calibre that she's at as a coach. I've always said, I said it when I first seen you, didn't I? Finally, my life coach is back. She's more than a manager, but yeah, to play under M was probably the best years of my career, to be honest. Millie, is it, you know, like, when you meet your manager, so you have a long period of time with a manager and they leave, and all of a sudden they're not your manager anymore.

3:04Even now, when I meet my old managers, I'm like, gaffer, boss. Yeah. It's hard, isn't it? It is, and I still feel like I'm a player. Yeah. I think I always will. That's literally my whole career. Chelsea is my career.

3:15Alan Shearer:Can I ask a really dumb question? Do you call M a boss or gaffer, like you said? No. I thought it was cringy as that. That's good. We've got to move on. Do you know what it is with managers? Whenever you meet them, Kaz. Yeah, I know. Because they've all got egos, don't they? Yeah. I know you meet them. All right. You might be 10 years after you've played a movie. All right, Gaffard. Yeah, they feel that. Yeah, it's a bit... Sorry. You know, to be honest with you, you know, you might see it like that. We just see, like, a lot of love for our players and being in your lives. We've watched you as young people.

3:49I always say this. Managers, we get older. Players stay the same age.

3:52Alan Shearer:I wish that were true. Yeah. Well, at least in terms of the turnovers of them, they're always young. Emma, tell me, Millie's a player. Winner, winner, chicken dinner. No, I mean, honestly, I've been through many experiences with Mill. We just had the ability to gut things out together. Even in moments where we couldn't even speak to each other, it was unspoken, our ability to be able to grind through games. What I didn't know about, I didn't realise you were a Spurs fan. Yeah, no, absolutely. I'm from a household of Spurs and Chelsea, so it was always a split loyalty thing. Not for me, and there I was in 1991 in that beautiful Wembley Stadium with my Tottenham tracksuit on.

4:44Stood behind the Gaza free kick.

4:46Alan Shearer:Oh, the semi-final of the FA Cup. Semi-final, thank you for filling that in. and it roofed in the top corner and I had my jacket tied around my tracksuit bottoms and I was like, yes! And that was it. Screamed at me, Arsenal fans, get her out of here! And I was whisked up the stairs, taken out of the section. I managed to come back round and yes, I did see the finale of the game. Well, I was going to say, I hope you saw the two important goals. And that contribution at the end. So thank you very much for those memories and getting a little kick in for Wembley from the Gooners. Yeah, OK. Well, one of the biggest shocks of the tournament so far was Paraguay sending Germany home on penalties after a 1-1 draw.

5:29Alan Shearer:Alan and Micah both worked on the match and I caught up with them straight after full time.

5:37Alan Shearer:Alan, Micah, great to see you in different parts of the world. Alan, you're in Boston because you were at the game earlier on where Germany went out against Paraguay. You were doing the game for the BBC in Salford. Micah, now I can see you're back in your garage, shall we call it. Well, I don't think any of us thought Germany were going to be a real threat in this tournament. But at the same time, Alan, I didn't think they'd go out in this round.

6:07Gary Lineker:Yeah, I watched them or did the game against Ecuador. And because there was no jeopardy for them, they'd already won the group. I was willing to give them a bit of a free pass, but I wasn't that impressed with their performance in that game. But I was expecting a little bit more this evening because you're now into the knockout rounds. But I have to tell you that that first half was as bad as a performance I've seen for a long, long time. They were weak. There was no energy. And every single one of them were hopeless. And I was expecting a lot more after the break. They changed it a little bit.

6:47Gary Lineker:They then started in the second half to put balls into the box very, very early, which sort of helped them. They got the goal through that with Wurz, the cross, and Havertz getting in front of the defender. And I thought, OK, they're going to go on and win the game. But no, I wasn't impressed with them at all. And I thought they were really, really poor. And they deserve to go out, actually.

7:08Alan Shearer:Yeah, Micah, that's now three tournaments on the trot, World Cup tournaments where they've not made it into the round of 16. What's gone wrong with German football? To be honest, I don't have the actual answer because if you look at the players, when you've got someone like Musiala, when you've got Wurtz, when you've got Havertz, who I said is a big game player, when you've got players like Rudiger and Tarr at the back, You think they're solid enough. Kimmich as well, right back and playing midfield. You're looking at it and thinking they should be doing a lot more. I think the decision to bring back Neuer has not gone down well in Germany.

7:58He's sort of passed his best. And I don't want to blame one person for a bad performance, but it didn't go down well in Germany. and then he had Nagelsmann getting all the pressure. He doesn't seem to know how to deal with it. And, yeah, if you look at the players, they've got enough quality, but they don't play as a team. It's really strange to see. And they're very reminiscent of England and the way England play in terms of they've got all this quality, but they play a little bit too slow, sort of square pegs in round holes. and you're watching them. And when the result went at full time after the penalty shootout, I was in disbelief as what I was watching.

8:47You're expecting these players to be able to break down Paraguay. Paraguay are a good side in terms of defending and have that really good spirit. But with the quality that Germany had on show, they should be doing a lot better than they did.

9:02Alan Shearer:Yeah, I think, I mean, USA beat them 4-1 in the opening game. So I don't think any of us really saw this coming. I would, a slight difference of opinion, I don't think they've got the quality across their squad that England have got at present or anywhere like the quality that Germany have had in the past. In fact, I don't know whether you know this, but in the press conference yesterday, Kai Havertz, one of the journalists did what English journalists do. They confronted him and said that, oh, by the way, did you know Gary Lineker has said that this is the worst German team he's ever seen. I think actually they probably agree now, but he did that.

9:43Alan Shearer:And I didn't actually say Germany were scheisser. But what I will say, Alan, I think they were very hard done to in terms of VAR overturn for the Targol. I mean, that was not a foul on Gill, was it? Orlando Gill.

10:03Gary Lineker:Never a foul, not for me Gary, I thought it was a really poor decision, the ref hadn't given it and he's been asked to go to the VAR and I thought because we've seen it a few times in this tournament that when they've gone to the screen they've actually stuck to their original decision and said no I'm happy with my decision and I was pretty confident that once he'd seen that on the screen then I would have thought he would have gone no there wasn't enough contact to make the keeper go down I mean the keeper's conned them there's no doubt about it he's felt the touch and he's thought I'm in trouble here, I better go down and he's bought the foul I mean it's worked for them absolutely but they were robbed I thought it was a really poor decision Yeah, I'd agree with that and when I talked about Germany being reminiscent of England I mean in terms of the way they play I believe England have got better players yeah for sure but in terms of the way they move the ball it's all a little bit too slow you're sort of relying on a set piece that it should have been a goal from Tarr I totally agree on that not enough contact on the goalkeeper for me but Germany do have quality players guys they really do maybe not as good as England but if you go through their starting XI Brown's as good as anyone young left back is really good obviously Rudiger what he's done in the game.

11:27Really good experience. Tarr's gone to Bayern Munich, been really successful. He's been one of the best defenders in the German league. And then you've got Kimmich, who I actually want him to play in centre-mid rather than right-back. You've got two exciting young players in Wurz and Musiala in there. Havertz always scores a goal. Sané let me down by his standards. I don't think we've seen the same Sané since City days, really. I mean, he was electric. But I was a little bit disappointed in what they showed on the night, and not just the night, throughout the tournament.

12:09Alan Shearer:Yeah. Alan was shaking his head throughout most of that.

12:14Gary Lineker:Yeah, I don't agree. I think they've got the quality in names and on paper, but they just didn't deliver. And you look at Sane, not a great season. And Dav they had to bring in to try and give them some oomph in and around the penalty area. Wirtz has had a terrible season at Liverpool. He hasn't performed again in this World Cup. So it's all right seeing they've got the quality, but the quality wasn't there. We've seen them put seven past Curacao. Well, that's all right, but when it really mattered, the quality wasn't there at all.

12:45Alan Shearer:I mean, it's a German team that's actually finally lost a World Cup penalty shootout. I mean, wow, what a shootout it was. I mean, we've said many times, particularly in this World Cup where there's so many games, I think they should go straight to penalties at the end of normal time because the players are going to be exhausted enough by the end of this anyway, particularly in the heat. I imagine it was really hot there in Boston, if it's anything like it is in New York today, and it's only up the road. But it was quite the penalty shootout. They probably should have gone straight to it and only perhaps have extra time for the final.

13:18Alan Shearer:That's my view.

13:19Gary Lineker:Yeah, yeah, I agree with that. I think it was a really, really poor game in terms of standards. But, I mean, it was a lesson in how to defend, how to be tight and compact, get everyone around the ball. But as much as it was a poor game, it was a great story at the end for Paraguay because they deserved it. They worked incredibly hard. They stuck together. They had to defend for their lives at times. And, I mean, it was an amazing story. It was, I mean, I thought they were going to blow it because of the two penalties that they'd missed. and I'm thinking, no, they can't miss three on the spin. But then the man of the match put the penalty in and that was a great story in itself.

13:57Alan Shearer:And the goalkeeper was pretty heroic as well, Orlando Gill. It was a very exciting finale, particularly for Paraguay. But Nagelsmann, I suspect, will be under severe pressure now. I wouldn't be at all surprised. I've got a little feeling that we might see Jurgen Klopp as the next... I don't know, it's just... Hasn't he just signed a new contract? Has he? Oh right, maybe it's a bad hunch then. Yeah, but so did Steve Clarke, didn't he? Yeah. So contracts don't mean that much, do they? I think in Germany, having worked with Thomas Hitzelsberger tonight and the feeling... I thought he was very good, by the way, Micah.

14:38I thought he was very good, Thomas. Yes, I thought it was excellent, give some really good insight and he was saying if they lose today, that's probably Nagelsmann done, you know, which is going to be interesting to see. I'm really worried where German sort of football is going from here. You could always rely on the Germans to be strong, to work hard, to have quality. And you just didn't see enough of that tonight. But I think you've got to look at the overall context, though. We've seen in this competition, it is very hard to break down a low block, isn't it? So as much as we're criticising Germany, we have to give Paraguay a lot of credit for the way they perform.

15:28Especially when you don't have the balls for large parts of the game and you've got to work and you've got to go up and back and you've got to be aggressive and organised. Yes, they've got a better look with a goal that should have been, but they fully deserve it. And not to throw it to England, but that worries me now going into DR Congo on Wednesday because teams are getting results playing that way. England certainly need, you know, an early goal in that game.

16:00Alan Shearer:OK, so thanks very much, Micah. Thanks, Alan. We'll let you both go now. Their reward, Paraguay's reward, is a next round tie against either France or Sweden. and I suspect it might be France, which might be a bit tough. I think France might work a way of beating low blocks. Cheers, guys. This episode is brought to you by Wise. It's only when you start moving money between currencies that you really think about the exchange rate, the fee, and what might be hidden away in the small print. Whether you're living abroad, paying someone overseas, or just trying to manage your money across borders, you want a fair exchange rate, an easy transfer, and no surprises along the way.

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17:21Alan Shearer:Excellent victory for Paraguay. Slightly fortuitous, I think, with one or two decisions, but regardless of that, I thought they defended to organise. I mean, you know what it's like to have to defend at times. I mean, very impressive, wasn't it? Yeah, definitely. I think that's been one of the things of the tournament, to be honest. I think, for me, I think some of the teams are getting overlooked and I think it's just expected that the top teams are just automatically going to win and I don't think that's the case and I think that's a lesson. Do you think it's levelled up a bit? 100 % and I think a lot of people see the top teams and they'll say oh Germany underperformed but is it that or is it that the rest of the world have developed, got better and I think they fully deserve the win to be honest the way they worked as a collective and that's the thing and I've learnt this under Emma you can have amazing individuals if you don't work as a team you don't work as a unit you're not going to win Do you know what coaching in this hemisphere There's CONCACAF, which is largely the Caribbean nations, then COMNABOL, which is Latin American nations, playing against them.

18:15I think sometimes we have, like, a Eurocentric attitude towards football, like the top nations there. And having competed against the likes of Paraguay and Brazil, these nations will fight to the death. It's exceptional.

18:31Alan Shearer:Paraguay, probably France. We expect France to beat Sweden. I mean they've got some firepower. Yes, tough but I mean brilliant effort from Paraguay. Yeah, brilliant effort from Paraguay. I mean I've played against South American players. South American players are my favourite players to play with and I hated playing against them because of that saying really they're aggressive. So it's surprising that us Europeans don't, you know, we sometimes we're going to turn up and turn them over. But I think the French would be too much for them guys. I think the only problem I get, I think the French, if the first time they play, say for instance, I don't think they're going to get massively tested, massively tested until they play against Spain or something like that.

19:12And I wonder whether Deschamps, because he's got so many options in the front line, I think if he puts another midfielder in, I think they'll be more suited. But they've got so many options. How can you leave out Dwayne, Barcalo, Mbappe, Dembele, Cherki? You've got to really leave two out of them. Do you think when they're playing against a team that is more than, you know, happy to be without the ball and sit low and have a block of five. Do you think that, much like it did in Senegal in that first 45 minutes, do you think that France has that way of breaking a team down if they don't have the transition spaces?

19:48Well, they've got Cherokee, haven't they? Who I think is the best in the country, in the world. Better than Guimarães, because I think he's up there right now for Brazil. Yeah, listen, I think they'll beat Paraguay, but you've got to take your out to the Paraguayans for beating the Germans. And I'm just happy the Germans are out. It's all right to say that, Gaz.

20:04Alan Shearer:They've got to beat Sweden first. The first big game today was Japan against Brazil. Obviously, having played two seasons in the J League, I have a strong affinity with Japan. And my son, producer Harry, was actually born there. Yeah, Brazil managed to turn that around. I was actually quite surprised that the Japanese have played with a relatively low block because they're very good at keeping the ball. But it's hard to do that over 100 metres away from the other guard. Let me ask you this question then. For a nation that has a 100-year manifesto, Ange told me about this this week, why do they play with such fear?

20:45Alan Shearer:That's a good question because the whole ethos in Japan and the whole way of thinking is the samurai warriors and we're really bold and brave. So what's missing then? I mean, the playing in the low block, They went 1-0 up. I know. And instantly stopped going player for player. Yeah. Went into a low defensive situation. What is it within their culture? Too humble, Em? I think it's humility because Japanese are very humble people, aren't they? And I think sometimes in football, the best teams have got a little bit of swagger about them. And I think if they would have been a bit more braver today, they could have stepped on to Brazil.